shepdawg
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 5831
Loc: Pennsylvania
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Seven shaky QB situations entering camp
July 20, 2007
And here I thought "7" was a lucky number. But this week has turned into a rough one for NFL quarterbacks who have No. 7 on their backs.
Falcons No. 7 Michael Vick obviously is in a heap of trouble, but the week's "other" big NFL news involved the Dolphins' release of Daunte Culpepper, who's making both Bucs new No. 7 Jeff Garcia and Jags old No. 7 Byron Leftwich a little nervous about their projected starting jobs. All reports had Culpepper as a favorite to sign with Jacksonville, and then yesterday, Culpepper had a meeting with Jon Gruden in Tampa.
We know two things for sure in the wake of Culpepper's release: Not one of the NFL's Florida teams knows for sure what to make of its quarterback situation, and Culpepper, a product of the University of Central Florida, doesn't seem to want to leave the Sunshine State.
With training camps getting ready to open across the league, a surprising 25 teams have a firm stance at quarterback. That means they either have an established clear-cut No. 1 or have a clear commitment to a new No. 1.
That leaves seven teams -- there's that unlucky number again -- with shaky footing inside the pocket. We just met four of them above. Then there's Oakland and Cleveland, trying to determine when they'll play first-round draft picks JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn. The other team, Kansas City, must choose between Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard after trading Trent Green -- to Miami, which help put this whole Culpepper thing in motion.
So from Atlanta with Vick to KC's possible pick, here's trying to make sense of these seven quarterback messes entering camp:
Falcons. Vick's legal problems have put both his and his team's near futures in doubt. Everyone's pointing to the fact that if Vick misses significant time, then the Falcons would need to start current No. 2 Joey Harrington. But what would that accomplish? At best, Harrington is a one-year stopgap for a struggling team while it either keeps desperately waiting on Vick to get his act together or drafts a franchise-type quarterback to move on without Vick next year.
If Vick needs to sit because of league- or team-imposed suspension, the Falcons instead should give D.J. Shockley a long look. The Georgia product has come along surprisingly well to stick with the team this long. With or without Vick, it's likely the Falcons have a lost season as they learn under new coach Bobby Petrino. So why not gamble to see if they have something good in Shockley?
Dolphins. I'm confused about the value of Trent Green. The Chiefs, who just went to the playoffs and had a chance to get there again, just dismissed one of the league's most consistent veteran quarterbacks. At the same time he was being trashed, Miami made no secret that it treasured his services, a good fit under new coach Cam Cameron. But the Dolphins don't have the look of a contender, and would be better off seeing more of either Cleo Lemon or rookie John Beck. Green is a good guy to have around because of his savvy and wisdom of playing quarterback, but coming off a concussion and at 37, it's doubtful he'll be around long enough to be part of the team's next upward swing.
For how much they wanted him, Green will be the Dolphins' starter come Week 1, but the team should also pay close attention to who has a better camp, Lemon or Beck. When the Dolphins are out of contention, which they will be by midseason, it's time to see what their youngsters can do. Beck has some special skills as a potential second-round steal, and the grizzled Green can play a big role in grooming the BYU product in the short term.
Buccaneers. Culpepper's visit is the latest attempt to feed Gruden's quarterback addiction. So much for the early declaration that Garcia would be the Bucs' starter, and this also indicates that Chris Simms is quite a way from returning to the field. Although it's been made pretty clear Jake Plummer has retired for good, you can bet the Bucs still have him on speed dial. Unless Culpepper signs, by default, Garcia is the Bucs' only healthy and viable option at the moment. As much as Gruden wants his choice of quarterback, he might not have one here.
Jaguars. Most highly drafted quarterbacks get about four years to get themselves settled as a solid NFL starter. Leftwich is on the brink of failing his audition, hampered by injuries and shaky coaching relationships. Backup David Garrard has had some success, but he can't do too much with his arm if the Jags' prolific running game isn't carrying the offense. At this point, neither can provide the consistent passing game the team needs to complement its fine rushing attack and great run defense.
The Jaguars have enough talent on the rest of the field to challenge for an AFC playoff berth, as they did just two seasons ago. But they really could use an injection of excitement, and this is the ideal time to take a chance on Culpepper, who can provide that with both his arm and his feet.
Raiders. They should start Russell right away over Andrew Walter and Josh McCown. In case you missed it, Here's why.
Browns. They shouldn't start Quinn right away over Derek Anderson and Charlie Frye. In case you missed it, here's why.
Chiefs. First of all, to make any quarterback feel comfortable in Kansas City, the team needs to re-sign Larry Johnson. After that's done, the Chiefs will be in the playoff hunt again -- Herman Edwards' coaching and an up-and-coming defense are two of the team's underrated strengths.
I've liked Croyle's poise from his days at Alabama, but I think he would really benefit from one more year of holding a clipboard. Damon Huard's 5-3 record as a starter and 98.0 passer rating were instrumental in getting Kansas City to the playoffs without Green, and while Green was great for Dick Vermeil, Huard played more like Edwards' type of calculated caretaker last season.
Looking at it that way, choosing to keep Huard, three years to the day younger than Green, was a good move. As a career backup, Huard also has much less mileage. So the team can afford to at least delay Croyle's crowning for a year -- or two. Choosing to start Huard will be the next good move for the Chiefs.
LINKY
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"When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less."
Paul Brown
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Damanshot
Legend
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 19026
Loc: Aurora, Ohio
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There we go with the Surprise contender in Derek Anderson garbage again... Geez, Why would anyone be surprised by that. He's got a rocket arm and nobody attacks QB's in Mini Camp and OTAs... so he's bound to look good there.. It's when the bullets start flying that he will most probably stumble.
(If you want to see what I'm talking about, you have to go to the link and scroll down to the Browns, there is another link there that says it all)
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Meet Bentley,,,
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BatDawg
All Pro
Reged: Oct 21 2006
Posts: 692
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To see the "here's why" part you would need to follow the link, then click another link on "here's why". To save some time, here is that portion of the article.
http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=226071
What do the Democrats, Republicans and the Browns all have in common? They all have shaky three-way races for a potential leader. But while the Clinton-Obama-Edwards and Giuliani-Romney-McCain triangles have next year to play out, Cleveland's football-loving constituency wants to know who'll get the nod at quarterback this fall.
What was expected to be a battle between 2007 first-round pick Brady Quinn and 2005 third-round pick Charlie Frye has a surprise sudden frontrunner after minicamp: Derek Anderson, who started three of the team's final four games last season. And his minicamp performance makes him the favorite to start the team's first game of this season.
So what's so special about Anderson, who went 0-3 with 7 INTs and only 3 TDs in his three career starts? A part of it comes from the way he played in relief against Kansas City in Week 13, showing great moxie with both his arm and his legs in leading the Browns to a home overtime victory. He also showed a good deep connection with go-to receiver Braylon Edwards, and being 6-6, 229 doesn't hurt the third-year QB, either.
Of course, a bigger part of it is the fact that Frye hasn't been very impressive in practices and Quinn is a rookie trying to learn his first NFL offense. Both looked out of sync in minicamp, setting the tone with early interceptions.
Frye is confident about his passing talents, but his inability to back them up on the field prompted the Browns to target and draft Quinn.
Quinn comes in with a big college name, Notre Dame pedigree and local flavor as a native of Dublin, Ohio. He also comes recommended by Browns coach Romeo Crennel's former Patriots colleague Charlie Weis, Quinn's coach at Notre Dame. For a hungry fan base looking for hope, Quinn represents just that. But it will be a while before he's ready to deliver.
Considering Frye's practice history and Quinn's potential for an extended holdout, Anderson is the best bet to come out of training camp on top of the depth chart. Browns fans, however, shouldn't read too much into who starts in Week 1. The team's chances of contending for the playoffs this season are microscopic -- that's the reality of playing in a tough AFC North with Baltimore, Cincinnati and Pittsburgh.
Because of that, sticking with one quarterback doesn't make sense. In a season where they aren't going anywhere, the Browns need to, at some point, evaluate both Frye and Quinn with '08 in mind. Quinn has time on his side and will be the bigger investment, likely making Frye the odd man out beyond '07.
Quinn won't -- and shouldn't -- start right away, but as the losses mount and when the team can only look ahead, he will -- and should -- play. It would be one thing if either Anderson or Frye were a seasoned veteran such as former Brown Trent Dilfer. But when there's no mentor for Quinn to learn behind, he is better off learning on the job.
Browns fans should focus on who finishes the season as the starter, because it's a lot more important than who "wins" the job out of camp. If things go right, Quinn will play for keeps in the second half of the season and make sure the team doesn't have a burning quarterback question next summer.
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Statistics are like a bikini; what they show is interesting, but what they hide is vital.
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DeisleDawg
Dawg Talker
Reged: Sep 17 2006
Posts: 2024
Loc: Canton,Ohio
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Quote:
there's that unlucky number again -- with shaky footing inside the pocket. We just met four of them above. Then there's Oakland and Cleveland, trying to determine when they'll play first-round draft picks JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn.
Imo...Cleveland isn`t trying to determine when they`ll play Quinn.......Hopefully they are determined to get the right schemes and situation in place....And use the best fit QB that will excell in the new offense......
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HotBYoungTurk
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 01 2006
Posts: 8672
Loc: Memphis, TN
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here's why? was that a joke?
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**The Dawgs are Taking Over the NFL**
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Damanshot
Legend
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 19026
Loc: Aurora, Ohio
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Yup, I think it was! 
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Meet Bentley,,,
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Rishuz
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 08 2006
Posts: 3564
Loc: Las Vegas
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DA developed a connection with go-to receiver Braylon Edwards...?
hmm...must have missed that last year when I went to my fridge to grab a beer...
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I give nightmares to those who compete...
Freddy Kruger walking on Rishuz street...
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HotBYoungTurk
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 01 2006
Posts: 8672
Loc: Memphis, TN
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yea.. i thought DA connected w/ Heiden the most..
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**The Dawgs are Taking Over the NFL**
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TheRunningGhost
All Pro
Reged: Sep 23 2006
Posts: 762
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LOL, what ever... If Quinn doesn't holdout, I say start him anyways.. The beating around the bush crap has to stop, and if he's here to play, he must play.. Anderson seemed good because at that time, we were pulling straws to see something differant, other then the loses,lol... We need to make a move up the ladder and get things moving in Berea, and a change.. And I think Quinn is the answer.. Quinn doesn't have a learning curve, and I think can be molded into a NFL QB faster then most think..
Flame me if you wish, but thats why we got him in the draft.. WE NEED A QB, simply said.. We need a leader in the huddle, someone that will punch you in the mouth, and Frye isn't the answer, and neither is DA.. I dont mean really punch, but someone that is vocal, someone that will grab the attention of the players, and lay down the law.. I hear DA is a butt-face, and really isn't liked anyways.. He's a " ME " type player, someone who shruggs at orders and thinks, OK, lets go and see what happens.. Frye just seems mousey, like a little boy being yellled at and runs with his head down, whinning, but continues to do the same thing over and over, even thought he was told to do differant.. He just doesn't seem to know how to man up, and take charge of the happenings on the field.. I think he gets kicked around alot.. Have we ever seen him get mad on the field? I mean really fired up!!!
The whole DA connection with Braylon thing, I mean the go-to receiver, LOL, hold on, LOL, ouch, my side hurts.. I think they mean go-to and talk about the missed chances at the end zone..
Look, the bottom line is this, we need a QB, and Frye and the 6-6 giant that has a connection with 1 player, that drops alot, isn't the right solution to get this boat moving in the right direction..
We start in 6 days, 3 hours and 35 minutes, and if DA and the Frye guy are really pulling for this job, then some-one around cleveland should see balls flying, because they both need alot of work..
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HotBYoungTurk
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 01 2006
Posts: 8672
Loc: Memphis, TN
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quick question... was Quinn drafted at the 3 spot? or 22 spot?
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**The Dawgs are Taking Over the NFL**
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dawgbreath01
1st String
Reged: Mar 02 2007
Posts: 386
Loc: Skip & Barb's Place, Oak Harbo...
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Quote:
The team's chances of contending for the playoffs this season are microscopic -- that's the reality of playing in a tough AFC North with Baltimore, Cincinnati and Pittsburgh.
The odds of the Browns winning the AFC NORTH are 25/1
Although not great, hardly microscopic.
When we beat the squealers in the home opener, the odds will change in a hurry.
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ddubia
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 3209
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Quote:
Frye just seems mousey, like a little boy being yellled at and runs with his head down, whinning, but continues to do the same thing over and over, even thought he was told to do differant.. He just doesn't seem to know how to man up, and take charge of the happenings on the field.. I think he gets kicked around alot..
What-in-the-hell are you talking about?
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Ammo
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 9469
Loc: Chesterland, OH
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Quote:
Quote:
Frye just seems mousey, like a little boy being yellled at and runs with his head down, whinning, but continues to do the same thing over and over, even thought he was told to do differant.. He just doesn't seem to know how to man up, and take charge of the happenings on the field.. I think he gets kicked around alot..
What-in-the-hell are you talking about?
I noticed this too, his demeanor is awful. It's more of an "aw schucks" demeanor, and he looks like he sulks around a lot.
It also says a lot about him when he listened to Edwards and Winslow in the huddle when they said "give me the damn ball." Notice how when Anderson played, everyone else seemed to get in on the act, but when #9 played, it was the Edwards and Winslow show unless the play was specifically designed for someone else? (like a fade to JJ)
So many think I just don't like the guy for BS reasons, I've just noticed a lot of things both tangible and intangible that have soured me on him.
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I officially need a new sig pic.
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Rishuz
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 08 2006
Posts: 3564
Loc: Las Vegas
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OK, gonna call the bs flag on you on this one.
RunningGhost's comments were nothing more than meandering spewed garbage that hardly made any sense.
What made it worse is that you quoted him to say you agree with it.
This is one time where I think you are letting your Frye bias cloud the picture and not being intelligent about your feelings on him.
Mark my words...in the event that Quinn doesn't start, you better hope Frye wins the starting job over Anderson. If Anderson starts, the Browns and RAC will be doomed...and us fans will have nothing good to look forward to on Sundays AGAIN.
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I give nightmares to those who compete...
Freddy Kruger walking on Rishuz street...
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Jester
Dawg Talker
Reged: Sep 17 2006
Posts: 1512
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The "here's why" article is a joke. The reason not to start Quinn is because this schmoe says not to with absolutely no reasoning. Try clicling on the link for the raiders "here's why" link. Same writer who says Russell should start so he can learn by doing. So rookie Qb Russull is better off learning by doing but rookie Qb Quinn is better off learning by watching. So which is it iyer? Seriously, the more I read from this guy the less respect I have for his opinion.
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TheRunningGhost
All Pro
Reged: Sep 23 2006
Posts: 762
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Quote:
OK, gonna call the bs flag on you on this one.
RunningGhost's comments were nothing more than meandering spewed garbage that hardly made any sense.
What made it worse is that you quoted him to say you agree with it.
This is one time where I think you are letting your Frye bias cloud the picture and not being intelligent about your feelings on him.
Mark my words...in the event that Quinn doesn't start, you better hope Frye wins the starting job over Anderson. If Anderson starts, the Browns and RAC will be doomed...and us fans will have nothing good to look forward to on Sundays AGAIN.
Are you Frye? How many games did you watch last year? What I said isn't garbage, it's the truth.. Frye has NO leadership skills what so ever, and just isn't vocal enough to make it in the NFL.. I dont care for neither of the guys, and neither will get above .500.. So what now? We need a QB.. I could have put it in other term for you to understand, but I might be kicked off the site again.. I bet your one of the " we should bring DC in for a work-out"... But I really feel you have some-sort of relationship with Mr. Frye, so you have your right to defend him.. Thats what friends are for, 
OR
You have absolutely no knowledge of football, and a terrible eye for talent.
And mark MY words, if Quinn starts, Frye wont be a Brown..
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Edited by TheRunningGhost (Sat Jul 21 2007 08:14 PM)
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Ammo
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 9469
Loc: Chesterland, OH
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Quote:
Quote:
OK, gonna call the bs flag on you on this one.
RunningGhost's comments were nothing more than meandering spewed garbage that hardly made any sense.
What made it worse is that you quoted him to say you agree with it.
This is one time where I think you are letting your Frye bias cloud the picture and not being intelligent about your feelings on him.
Mark my words...in the event that Quinn doesn't start, you better hope Frye wins the starting job over Anderson. If Anderson starts, the Browns and RAC will be doomed...and us fans will have nothing good to look forward to on Sundays AGAIN.
Are you Frye? How many games did you watch last year? What I said isn't garbage, it's the truth.. Frye has NO leadership skills what so ever, and just isn't vocal enough to make it in the NFL.. I dont care for neither of the guys, and neither will get above .500.. So what now? We need a QB.. I could have put it in other term for you to understand, but I might be kicked off the site again.. I bet your one of the " we should bring DC in for a work-out"... But I really feel you have some-sort of relationship with Mr. Frye, so you have your right to defend him.. Thats what friends are for,
OR
You have absolutely no knowledge of football, and a terrible eye for talent.
And mark MY words, if Quinn starts, Frye wont be a Brown..
I wouldn't take it THAT far. He does some good things. I do like his grit, but it doesn't make up for all the other areas in which he's lacking.
I do think the loser of the #9/Anderson competition will be traded, though. We can't keep 4 QB's and Dorsey ain't leaving.
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I officially need a new sig pic.
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TheRunningGhost
All Pro
Reged: Sep 23 2006
Posts: 762
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I'm not saying Frye is a DeDEDEE, he does some things good, like running out of the pocket. Not many guys can do that, and throw the ball.. But he is missing the BIG parts of the game... Look, I just dont think Frye or Anderson are the right guys for the job, plain and simple.. But seroiusly, his rights dont add up to the wrongs.. Which means he isn't doing all the right things to get the job done.. We will know soon enough, and I'm sure this debate will go on for another month.. So we will see.. There is the lid on the garbage can for ya.. I will be back in 5 weeks to tell you, " I told Ya So'
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TheRunningGhost
All Pro
Reged: Sep 23 2006
Posts: 762
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O yeah, and I do attend every camp, so I will have a first hand look, or should I say a "refresher" of what we have..
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crazyotto55
Dawg Talker
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 2690
Loc: Fremont, Ohio
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Getting into a QB debate with guys who are "sure" of anything at this point is fruitless. So talking to you or Ammo is akin to beating my head against the wall.....it only feels good when I stop. But I agree with Rish. The BS flag needs to thrown on anyone who declares that Anderson is the answer to any question regarding the Browns or that Quinn is gonna be worth a damn before the end of this season.
Take that for what it's worth. It's just an opinion from another football moron on this board....... 
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"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
Edited by crazyotto55 (Sat Jul 21 2007 09:12 PM)
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Rishuz
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 08 2006
Posts: 3564
Loc: Las Vegas
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I don't know Frye nor do I think he is the long-term answer at quarterback.
I sure as hell hope Quinn is the long-term answer, and I will be pulling for him to be.
However, at the end of THIS training camp, if it comes down to Frye or Anderson, I want Frye to be the starter. I like him better than Anderson and believe he will give us the best chance to win until Quinn is ready.
At the end of the day, we agree that neither are the long-term answer.
You may know more about football than me...you may not...either way I really don't care. Your post was more garbage than substance.
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I give nightmares to those who compete...
Freddy Kruger walking on Rishuz street...
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Pdawg
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 7899
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The lovefest with Anderson is simple. Most of the people writing about it weren't at mini camp and are just regurgitating the same crap they heard from a couple of sources. Anderson may possess all the physical traits you want in a QB but he is missing the biggest. The ability to get the ball to the reciever. He has never been accurate, nor will he ever be.
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Ammo
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 9469
Loc: Chesterland, OH
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Quote:
The lovefest with Anderson is simple. Most of the people writing about it weren't at mini camp and are just regurgitating the same crap they heard from a couple of sources. Anderson may possess all the physical traits you want in a QB but he is missing the biggest. The ability to get the ball to the reciever. He has never been accurate, nor will he ever be.
I know what I saw with my eyes.
He wasn't terribly accurate but neither was that other QB.
What he DID do was spread the ball around more. It wasn't the "Edwards and Winslow Show" like it was before.
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I officially need a new sig pic.
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HotBYoungTurk
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 01 2006
Posts: 8672
Loc: Memphis, TN
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Quote:
What he DID do was spread the ball around more. It wasn't the "Edwards and Winslow Show" like it was before.
I think Frye is a good QB... the fans wanting an all natural to just come in and take over and be the franchise QB RIGHT AWAY is just not going to happen... most QB's take a few years to get adjusted and become a true starter.. yes there are a few that lucked up and did their thing, but thats not what has happened here...
and I thought the fans wanted the guys who got paid to do their job and make things happen...
There were tons of people who said Winslow needs to be a key part of this teams offense... dont you have to throw it to him for him to be?
There were tons of people who said Edwards just needs to shut up and be the breakout WR he was drafted to be... dont you have to throw it to him for him to be?
Frye spreads the ball.. and with more time.. he will spread it even more... Jurevicious didnt get 500+ yards all b/c of Anderson...
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**The Dawgs are Taking Over the NFL**
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GMdawg
Legend
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 13248
Loc: ohio
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Quote:
OK, gonna call the bs flag on you on this one.
After further review the play stands as called. Ghost is penalized 15 yards for unsportsmanlike conduct.
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I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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TheRunningGhost
All Pro
Reged: Sep 23 2006
Posts: 762
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lol, ok,ok,ok, I'll take the penalty.. At least it wasn't holding,
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GMdawg
Legend
Reged: Sep 10 2006
Posts: 13248
Loc: ohio
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1st down and 25, we are all on the same team, so lets pull together and pick up the first down 
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I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Rishuz
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 08 2006
Posts: 3564
Loc: Las Vegas
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Quote:
Quote:
OK, gonna call the bs flag on you on this one.
After further review the play stands as called. Ghost is penalized 15 yards for unsportsmanlike conduct.
Actually, I was throwing the flag on Ammo - but the penalty was agreeing with Ghost...so yeah, what the hell...give it to Ghost...kind of like assists in hockey...haha...
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I give nightmares to those who compete...
Freddy Kruger walking on Rishuz street...
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HotBYoungTurk
Hall of Famer
Reged: Oct 01 2006
Posts: 8672
Loc: Memphis, TN
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as Corso would say it on NCAA...
*Beep* Beep* Beep*
Whats that noise your making?
Thats this offense moving backwardssssss
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**The Dawgs are Taking Over the NFL**
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Mensa
All Pro
Reged: Mar 30 2007
Posts: 607
Current High Scores in:
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Quote:
Notice how when Anderson played, everyone else seemed to get in on the act, but when #9 played, it was the Edwards and Winslow show unless the play was specifically designed for someone else? (like a fade to JJ)
Yeah, and spreading the ball around worked so well didn't it? 0-3 as a starter.
50.0% of Frye's completions went to 2 guys, K2 and Edwards
50.0% of Peyton Manning's completions went to 2 guys, Harrison and Wayne
54.3% of Carson Palmer's completions went to 2 guys, Johnson and Houshmandzadeh
44.4% of Drew Brees' completions went to 2 guys, Bush and Colston
20.5% of Anderson's completions went to K2 and Edwards.
You may have loved Anderson spreading the ball around and wish Frye was more like Anderson in his distribution. I'd prefer Frye to stay like Manning, Palmer and Brees and get the ball to our 2 best receiver's 50% of the time.
Seeing how the Browns offense averaged more ppg under Frye, had a higher team Passer Rating under Frye and actually won games under Frye. I think it's safe to assume that distributing the ball at a 50% rate to your 2 top receivers is a better way to win than the way Anderson did it at a 20% clip.
But that's just me, and stats are for losers right?
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lionchamp29
Rookie
Reged: Jul 19 2007
Posts: 78
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i love the brown but i have to say that i have a bad feeling about our team this year. I`m the opposite of every other year where i feel an upward swing. This might be a nasty one. I wanna be positive but...the qb thing is a problem.
Frye throws well for a quarter or 2 then it all goes to heck. Anderson moves the ball more yet makes mistakes also. Quinn is a rook so we are not there yet.
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ImpactPlaya
All Pro
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 571
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Mensa any scouting report that SI put out on Charlie Frye is irrelevant now...the only scouting report that matters on him is his current one that opposing team scouts compile for Sunday's game
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eotab
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 4983
Loc: L.I., NY
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Nice stats regarding Frye and pretty much what I saw as far as control of the game.
All these Power Rankings and ratings stating that we are the LOW of the LOW cause of our QB situation just don't get it.
They don't have a clue about OL.
They don't have a clue about stability and organization of the O.
Frye is a lot more formidable than anyone gives credit. I do understand that BQ will someday take over at QB maybe as soon as 08 but that doesn't lessen the ability of Frye to manage our offense and execute.
There is no doubt in my mind that we are the most improved offensive team out there...of course being 30-32 in many categories leaves only improvements to be made. But all these so called experts all they see is the same QB so we must suck. 
OL 60% new - Tucker back to norm and Fraley having the entire Off season to become the glue and a blocking scheme better to suit him.
RB - Lewis all the talk about him being washed up when on the contrary he's healthier than last season and mended 100%.
WR/TE - Edwards back from his injury 100% healthy.
KW2 - MicroFracture surgery to make him more sound mistakenly portrayed as additional woes to the knee instead.
Wilson - Humbled and a year under his belt...not playing made him hungry and a hard worker to be better.
JJ - still a leader and a weapon for mismatches.
Chud - bringing a unified and organized Offense to the table that all are on board and working together, Players and coaches alike.
These are all our improvements from last year. We have Depth that we never had before at all positions. Frye has an Offense to work. Last year his first as a starter and show me what 2nd year starter that looks like he's a Pro-Bowler they don't accept the fact that he was just a 2nd year player from a small school - they wouldn't know what improvements were if they smacked them in the face. (THEY = Media Bozo's)
Frye worked with a fractured Offense that had two factions working against each other. Two studs that didn't see training camp or Pre-Season as his main weapons. A RB that was simply A.W.O.L. an OL that was together for the first time in our First Game. A hard enough scenario for a 10 year Vet let alone a first time starter.
Yes, our QB situation is hard to imagine as sound by those who just don't get it.
We are the most improved team on the offensive side of the ball. I see no other team who made as many improvements or gained in maturity and health from young players on the cusp of Good to great things.
JMHO
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Holmgren, Heckert and Mangini - Now there's a beginning for a dynasty
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ImpactPlaya
All Pro
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 571
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Eotab, the Browns are certainally improved on offense.But when you are last in the NFL in points scored,where else do you have to go?You can the say the Patriots are really improved also with the additons of Moss,Welker, Stallworth and now Maroney being the every down back. The Broncos are improved. The 49ers will be better with a healthy Vernon Davis, Alex Smith getting more comfortable,etc
But heres what you are overlooking. The Browns offense is starting from square one again. Everyone is learning a new system. This offense will have to endure growing pains again. The offense is lacking continunity.
All the AFC North teams will be essentially picking off where they left off from 2006. The Ravens,Bengals, and Steelers have their QBS in place for 2007,right now. Doesn't that count for something?
The Browns are unsettled at QB. Which QB is the most intelligent to pick up Chudzinski's complex scheme?
I recall seeing this same "outlook" when Jeff Garcia was brought I don't recall who said it.....But I remember the quote.."everyone is gaga over the Steelers and Bengals offense,but forgetting about ours"
I expect the Browns offense to be improved in 2007,but I expect to see some growing pains and a heavy dose of Jamal Lewis.
The Browns offense still needs a RB to emerge behind Lewis and WR that strike fear in a defense vertically.
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Rabidfan
Dawg Talker
Reged: Sep 18 2006
Posts: 1555
Loc: FL, US
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I think the rest of our team can make our QB situation look better by doing their part, however, the QB also has to get the ball to the WR's and TE's. The biggest things that will help our QB is the OL and the running game. I believe the WR's and TE's will catch a good pass thrown to them.
Also, I think The Falcons have just landed in QB hell, maybe worse than we are? Yeah, you can say Harrington has experience but what has he done? Absolutely nothing. LOL Redman, injury prone, Shockley, now if they were smart, they would just go ahead and see what he has.
Now some could say why not do the same with Brady? Well, first off, looks like he is going to be a hold out, and we have somebody who can possibly get the job done, Frye (maybe Anderson) but more likely Frye. (Harrington has not shown any progress for the time he's been in the NFL.)
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dnadawg
Dawg Talker
Reged: Oct 08 2006
Posts: 1064
Loc: columbus ohio
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IMPACT...
i'm not speaking for EO, but what do you expect from a Browns board?...everyone in line with the reality that our O has as good of a chance at remaining awful as it does improving substantially?...of course not...the majority of fans are optimists in the offseason...
what i would volunteer as far as expectations on O is this...previous optimism was based upon what?...a skill player here and there?...this year, it's much more based upon the potential for an average-above average line...that on it's own makes expectations more reasonable, albeit still too high...and going hand in hand with the real improvement up front, there's the synergistic effect expected from the skill guys...meaning with a bad line, you'll never see the full potential/production from skill players...so improvement on that unit can help to raise the ceiling for WRs and RBs...
i agree with you that not all that is gonna happen to the fans' liking (i.e. growing pains)...but this year's expectations are at least closer to reasonable than in previous years...
if i were you, though, i'd be much more interested in what improvements the Bengals have made that are going to get you over the hump...the offense lost a few guys, but will probably be fine without them...are they gonna be better?...the defense's rise a few years ago was based around two guys that are not going to contribute (again) this season...you've got a much more hopeful secondary, but still young, and a front 7 that ranks down there with Cleveland's, which the experts deem as pretty weak...the bounce of the ball can affect a few games throughout the course of the season, but you're an 8-8/9-7 type of team again this year, with no obvious signs of leap-frogging NE, SD, and Indy, not to mention the expected AFCN logjam...
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Browns fans are born with it...
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ImpactPlaya
All Pro
Reged: Sep 11 2006
Posts: 571
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DNA I understand where Eotab is coming,truly....I've been having optimism for a Bengals defense that I hope one day would materialize in a strong consistant unit.....Marvin Lewis has started a new MLB every year since he arrived and I hope Ahmed Brooks will solidify that position......
The Bengals defense is alot alike the Browns offense. It has loads of talent it just needs continunity.
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TopDawg16
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 12 2006
Posts: 6591
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Impact. I don't think anyone expects this to be a great offense. I don't think anyone expects us to be a playoff team. What is and should be expected of us this year is improvement. I think it is realistic for us to win 7 or 8 games. We have improved quite a bit during the offseason. And, if you think about it... last year, we were in almost every game. We had a chance to win almost every game, until we fell apart late. With an improved offense, we should be able to keep some drives going late in the game, and keep our defense off the field a little, which should help prevent those late game collapses.
We are not a playoff team, but expecting 7 or 8 wins is definitely a realistic goal.
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Kentucky loves their Cousins!
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TopDawg16
Hall of Famer
Reged: Sep 12 2006
Posts: 6591
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Games we had a real chance to win:
Week 1- New Orleans: L, 14-19. Driving down the field for a game winning TD when BE lets a ball hit him in the chest. It gets picked off. We had a real shot at winning this game.
Week 3- Baltimore: L, 14-15. Lead all the way up until about 1 min left in the game. Definitely a game we should have won.
Week 5- Carolina: L, 12-20. I can't remember what exactly happened, but Northcutt cost us this game. I think a pass off his chest that got picked off for a TD. We had a real shot of winning this game though.
Week 9- San Diego: L, 25-32. Fell apart in the redzone all game on offense. A game we had a shot of winning.
Week 11- Pittsburgh: L, 20-24. Our defense fell apart late due to offense not being able to move the ball. A game we should have won.
Week 15- Baltimore: L, 17-27. We had alot of chances in this game. If I remember correctly, it was a 7 point game until Baltimore kicked a late FG to go up 10. A game we were definitely in, and could have won.
Week 17- Houston, L 6-14. We had given up by this time, but it was still a game we were in and had a chance of winning.
So, take those 7 games, and add that to the 4 games that we actually won, and we were in position to win 11 games last season. We are not as far away from being a competitive team as people think. We were competitive most of the time last year. Anything less than 7 wins this season is unacceptable, IMO.
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Kentucky loves their Cousins!
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Merth
All Pro
Reged: Jan 17 2007
Posts: 923
Loc: Central Ohio
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Quote:
I do think the loser of the #9/Anderson competition will be traded, though. We can't keep 4 QB's and Dorsey ain't leaving.
Ok, I will bite. In your opinion, why is Dorsey a lock to make the team?
the article mentions that 25 teams are set at QB. Next question, what team(s) would trade for Frye or Anderson?
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My son catching the game winning pass.
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