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We just went into escrow on a house a month ago and got a pretty good deal on the price. I get the feeling that they didn't really want to go that low, but they didn't have any other buyers at the time so they took it.

However, since then, they have dragged their feet about getting any paperwork turned over to us. We finally got the majority of the contracts and such a few weeks after they agreed to the price, with the exception of one document the lender needed. We went ahead and paid for appraisals and inspections, but now we're to the point where we need this last document or we can't proceed. We've already threatened to pull out of the sale, but they don't seem to really care that much.

My question is, does the buyer have any recourse for a situation like this? We had to put up several thousand dollars in a deposit so we can't back out of the deal, but the seller seems like they can do whatever they want if they decide they don't want to sell after agreeing to it. We should get our deposit back because of the loan contingency, but we're still out the few hundred dollars we spent for inspections. Our realtor doesn't seem to think that we can do anything other than threaten to leave the deal. Is there anything else we can do?

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Yes, you have recourse. I'd like to know what 'document' is missing??

You may not want to hear this answer because it just might be easier to walk away financially emotionally.

But you sound like you absolutely could sue for a breach of contract.

How bad do you want this place?? if your heart is set on it well your only recourse is legal.

This of course depends on if they have signed said agreement to sell to you..i have went this course in the past where the buyer acted like your describing.

After getting a lawyer versed in property/contract law involved and sent them a letter of just how far us the buyer was willing to go to hold them to their agreement..they suddenly got motivated to get it done.

Like I said what 'document' are you referring to and how bad do you want the place..may change my advice to you.

Your realtor sounds like a real dipsh...Remember the realotor is for the seller's interest not the buyers.

Last edited by FBHO71; 11/25/15 10:21 AM.
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Ah yeah, that would make sense.

Our biggest issue is our current lease. We either get out of it now or we have to renew for a year. If we go the legal route, we could be homeless for awhile.

The "document" is a form that shows they can sign over the title. The house is in a trust and it's some sort of convoluted family situation on the sellers end, so it's been like pulling teeth trying to get things signed properly.

We aren't too emotionally attached to the home. I'm more emotionally attached to the hundreds of dollars we may of wasted paying for the inspections and appraisals. Is that something we can take to small claims court on a breach of contract? At this point, we'd spend more on the lawyer than what we'd get back in court.

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Originally Posted By: ExclDawg
Ah yeah, that would make sense.

Our biggest issue is our current lease. We either get out of it now or we have to renew for a year. If we go the legal route, we could be homeless for awhile.

The "document" is a form that shows they can sign over the title. The house is in a trust and it's some sort of convoluted family situation on the sellers end, so it's been like pulling teeth trying to get things signed properly.

We aren't too emotionally attached to the home. I'm more emotionally attached to the hundreds of dollars we may of wasted paying for the inspections and appraisals. Is that something we can take to small claims court on a breach of contract? At this point, we'd spend more on the lawyer than what we'd get back in court.


After I read what youve said I would walk away..Hundreds is a cheap learning experience..I'd look at it like youve spent a bit to learn a life lesson...doesnt make you feel better now but will when you need that knowledge for your next home purchase.

The people who live in the home may not even be able to get the document you need because someone who has control over the situation didnt want to sell or thought the selling price was low.

Maybe your landlord would do a month to month lease?? Either way I would walk away it sounds like trouble waiting to happen..and make them give escrow money back.

You could take it to court yourself..I did that OUNCE..don't recommend that unless u have a legal background.

It can get confusing listening to the legal jargon that won't be put into lamens terms for you..hence why i went the professional route the next time.

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Just for background knowledge..I've been involved in selling/buying land for lets just say more then a few years..It can go painless or turn into a nightmare fast.

I learned to walk away if the headache was to much or just sounded plain wrong to me..and I guess how much money was involved and could i make it worth the headache.

Excel from this old mans feeble eyes I would not walk but run away from this deal..and never look back or regret my decision.

Of course its just an opinion from someone youve never met so..take my advice with a grain of salt:)

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I asked my wife (15 years in Real Estate and 10 years in Mortgage loans)

Her view is to listen to what FBHO71 is saying.

As a person that's never been in real estate, I'd ask if it seems like a good idea to ask for cash to cover the loss or you will take legal action?

Does it make sense to do that?


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I'm not an expert on this at all. I've never sued anyone before either.

But what I have done and found to be successful, is what my lawyer called "A letter of intent".

It's a very inexpensive way to get your point across. Your lawyer sends a letter to the other party expressing your complaints and what you are requesting. And in that letter, it also expresses that if your demands are not met, you intend to sue them.

It sends the message of just how serious you are, yet stops short of actually filing any type of court actions. I've only had to do this twice in my life and both times, I'm sure after legal council by the opposing party, my reasonable requests were met.

Just an idea...


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Your real estate agent should have had a time frame included as part of the buying agreement that dictates when they have to leave the premises. I would fire any agent who didn't do so. I always have an escalator that starts charging them fees by the day for each day they fail to vacate. If they fail to act in good faith you have every right to sue them for costs and aggravation.

A letter of intent is good tool like Pit said. I would have a sincere talk with the sellers first though to see what is really holding them up first. Sometimes they are lazy, sometimes they are stuck, and sometimes they are just punks. There are times when a sincere conversation about how they are putting you in a bind can get them to move a bit faster. A letter of intent can just as often make you lose the property you wanted to get even if it gets you the money back. You will lose all the time you invested though.

So in short schedule a face to face talk with the sellers first. If that doesn't fix it then cut your losses and sue them.


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Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I'm not an expert on this at all. I've never sued anyone before either.

But what I have done and found to be successful, is what my lawyer called "A letter of intent".

It's a very inexpensive way to get your point across. Your lawyer sends a letter to the other party expressing your complaints and what you are requesting. And in that letter, it also expresses that if your demands are not met, you intend to sue them.

It sends the message of just how serious you are, yet stops short of actually filing any type of court actions. I've only had to do this twice in my life and both times, I'm sure after legal council by the opposing party, my reasonable requests were met.

Just an idea...


That's kind of what I was saying, let them know of your intent to take action. If that doesn't do it, then it's time to either file a suit or move on past it.


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Commercial Broker here...What does your contract say in terms of Seller default? Your recourse will depend on that. USUALLY you can sue for performance.

Talk to your current LL. See if they will give you an extra 30 days there. Most LL will take an established, rent-paying tenant over those that they don't know.

What is the one document they are missing?


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So got some word back today. It seems the hold up is not even the seller (allegedly). The seller has some sort of joint custody of the title through a trust and they need to get this other party to sign stuff through a lawyer. Their lawyer is the one that's being a stickler for everything and is filing to get some sort of tax id number for some sort of paperwork. They are the one holding everything up apparently. It seems that everything is submitted, they just need to wait for the government to finish processing this form.

The document we're missing is some sort of form that shows that they can sign for the title. We have a copy of their trust itself, which says that they have the authority, but I guess our lender is also being a stickler and wants some specific form. Once this lawyer gets the tax id number (or whatever it is), then the dominoes should fall and things will get done.

On top of that, our LL goes through a nazi-run property-management company. They won't allow us to go month-to-month, and our lease auto-renews if we don't give 30 day notice. We're pretty much sick of them anyway, so we turned in our notice today. We just don't know where we're moving to at this point, and hopefully we don't need to move more than once during the week of Christmas.

We've also submitted some sort of Notice to Perform to the Seller, but apparently, that seems nothing more than an idle threat to pull out of the deal.

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For temporary housing you can call around and often there are hotels or motels that will offer a one month lease for a great price and you can always put stuff in a storage unit until them.

Just make sure you spray for bugs at both places. Nix has a great spray to kill bedbugs and lice that you can safely use at the hotel and bayer makes a hellaciously good spray for the storage unit. Just spray it while INSIDE the storage unit after dark so you don't catch any flak for it. Although some storage units spray regularly themselves so check with them first.


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Originally Posted By: ExclDawg
So got some word back today. It seems the hold up is not even the seller (allegedly). The seller has some sort of joint custody of the title through a trust and they need to get this other party to sign stuff through a lawyer. Their lawyer is the one that's being a stickler for everything and is filing to get some sort of tax id number for some sort of paperwork. They are the one holding everything up apparently. It seems that everything is submitted, they just need to wait for the government to finish processing this form.

The document we're missing is some sort of form that shows that they can sign for the title. We have a copy of their trust itself, which says that they have the authority, but I guess our lender is also being a stickler and wants some specific form. Once this lawyer gets the tax id number (or whatever it is), then the dominoes should fall and things will get done.

On top of that, our LL goes through a nazi-run property-management company. They won't allow us to go month-to-month, and our lease auto-renews if we don't give 30 day notice. We're pretty much sick of them anyway, so we turned in our notice today. We just don't know where we're moving to at this point, and hopefully we don't need to move more than once during the week of Christmas.

We've also submitted some sort of Notice to Perform to the Seller, but apparently, that seems nothing more than an idle threat to pull out of the deal.


I logged back on because I don't know how i missed this post.

Of course its not the seller holding it up..its the trust. Having authority to sell doesnt mean they have control over the property. The trust has final say.

Their lawyer isnt being a stickler..something is not right. Lawyer wants to sell for more..maybe this house needs to be sold because this trust needs to pay bills and the lawyer doesnt like his cut so to speak. It could be any number of reasons.

Sounds like stall tactics..and your lender is being thorough because they don't want to get caught up in some BS property dispute after the house is sold to you..and then you guys find out you don't even own your home and the trust wants it back.

Perform to seller is a joke but it does give you the option of getting out..I told you a lawyer in land/contract disputes couldve been much more convincing..wouldnt have cost hardly anything to do, and you could receive your costs back in court..escrow, lawyer fees all of it.

It sounds like your making a decision based off of your current living arrangement/problems..separate it from a sound business decision. This doesnt sound solid at all.

?The government form their lawyer is waiting on is an old stalling trick man...its bologna..i HOPE your going to have title insurance..I imagine your lender will demand it..just in case something screwy is going on with the deed of the property like i pointed out above and there is a dispute with the property AFTER you move in.

Your a grown man it's your decision and I'm just some idiot from the internet..but damn there is much easier situations to get a house instead of the way your going.

If it was me I would rent from somewhere you can get on a short lease month to month whatever..save my money and find the perfect/right house without all of the hiccups.

I pray it goes smooth for you but it could still haunt you even after you're moved in..that little bit of money youve spent so far will be NOTHING compared to what it costs to fight property disputes.

Good luck me thinks your going to need it.

FBHO71

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Originally Posted By: FBHO71
I told you a lawyer in land/contract disputes couldve been much more convincing..wouldnt have cost hardly anything to do, and you could receive your costs back in court..escrow, lawyer fees all of it.


So how does that work? Just get a lawyer and threaten to sue for breach of contract? We could make them pay for everything we've lost out on including lawyers fees?

We honestly haven't done anything yet. We still have the option to drop the deal because we have left the loan contingency in. Nothing has been finalized.

Quote:
It sounds like your making a decision based off of your current living arrangement/problems..separate it from a sound business decision. This doesnt sound solid at all.


We have some Plan B's in place if things fall through, it just make things more difficult/expensive. We also have title insurance and such. I just don't get how people could potentially get away with selling a house they can't sell and have no repercussions for doing it. If I can sue for breach of contract and get all the money I'm out so far, that would be great. Can I report the seller's agent to the Realtor's association? If they submit the paperwork that's needed by next Monday and the Lender has everything they need (and we have title insurance) are we in the clear?

You said I should bail and just take this as a learning experience. Although I don't know what exactly I'm learning here. Some Realtors are unethical and most Lawyers are scum? I sort of already knew that. tongue

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Originally Posted By: ExclDawg
Originally Posted By: FBHO71
I told you a lawyer in land/contract disputes couldve been much more convincing..wouldnt have cost hardly anything to do, and you could receive your costs back in court..escrow, lawyer fees all of it.


So how does that work? Just get a lawyer and threaten to sue for breach of contract? We could make them pay for everything we've lost out on including lawyers fees?

yes you sue for breach of contract..which what you describe they are doing they are in breach. you would get escrow back and unless the trust has any money it would have to be a judgement against the trust..MAYBE u could get it from the people living in the house..but 9 out 10 times they dont have it..which is why they r trying to sell..so everyone gets a piece of the pie in the trust..did I explain that ok?? Plus your state laws can vary and idk which state you in..but I've found its mostly the same all over the country. And the judgement placed against the people trying to sell and the trust...which a good lawyer would sue both..you would get the fees and such back when they are actually willing to sell it or have to sell.

We honestly haven't done anything yet. We still have the option to drop the deal because we have left the loan contingency in.

Nothing has been finalized. GOOD..and I understood that.

Quote:
It sounds like your making a decision based off of your current living arrangement/problems..separate it from a sound business decision. This doesnt sound solid at all.


We have some Plan B's in place if things fall through, it just make things more difficult/expensive. We also have title insurance and such. I just don't get how people could potentially get away with selling a house they can't sell and have no repercussions for doing it. If I can sue for breach of contract and get all the money I'm out so far, that would be great. Can I report the seller's agent to the Realtor's association? If they submit the paperwork that's needed by next Monday and the Lender has everything they need (and we have title insurance) are we in the clear?

Title insurance should pay for any defense or will just pay for your house and you still get the pleasure of moving again. But title insurance is supposed to protect you if anthing is screwy with the title AFTER PURCHASE..but Ive had to deal with screwy title comanies before also

You said I should bail and just take this as a learning experience. Although I don't know what exactly I'm learning here. Some Realtors are unethical and most Lawyers are scum? I sort of already knew that. tongue


No excel you would be learning what to WATCH OUT for in your next home buying experience..and that my friend is worth more then a couple hundered dollars:)

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One other thing you said about making complaints to RA..it's about as good as filing a complaint with the police department for being treated bad by police..not effective really but hey you feel better you did something yeah??

Being bad at their job your realtor is but I cant see where you realtor has done anything wrong other then not being very good at their job..wanting a commission. I told you in my first post your realtor has the sellers interest at heart not yours..as crazy as that sounds to you becuase well they are your realtor.

If I didnt answer clearly let me know I;ll clear it up plus I butchered the quote thing it seems..I'll figure that one out some day:)

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