DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Impeachment: Armageddon

I just don't think it's necessary to say these types of things.

But it's much much much much much easier to spin and deflect and basically grandstand and not actually say a DAMN thing --- than it is to refute the evidence and testimony. Hell - even when the President's hand picked men investigate the Trump claims for two + years they come up with NOTHING to substantiate Trump's lies. But that don't matter to the Trump faithful who put Trump before country and truth.

Listened on the radio while out grocery shopping ...

Escobar did an the Dem from NYC did an excellent job of summarizing and sticking to facts. Escobar brought it to a level most rational human beings could grasp if they were open to listening to facts.

The Rep after Escobar claiming that the request to seek an investigation into Biden and withholding funds did not meet the requirement of Bribery! Got to love it.

So the whole thing didn't start as a quid-pro-quo claim from a so-called whistelblower then?

Quid pro quo is the abuse of power. So you're claim of "no quid pro quo" is inaccurate.

I guess when a president says in public that both Ukraine and China should look into the Bidens, you must feel because he did it in public, in front of cameras, that it doesn't count. Now that's not quid pro quo. But it is asking foreign governments to interfere in our political process.

And I suppose when congress approves money for weapons for Ukraine and they want them, telling them to, "Do us a favor though" doesn't count either.

Like so many you wish to focus how and why the facts were gathered rather than address the transgressions of Trump.

HES right there was QPQ ….With the last ADMIN. you know JOE ,HUNTER AND BARRY,S

A couple of thoughts (since I'm not wasting my time listening to all this political grandstanding):

Not really sure how these proceedings help American. Feel free to help me out on this.

The Senate is controlled by the Republican party. Trump isn't going anywhere. All of this time and money simply wasted in my opinion.

Aren't there more important issues facing this country? SMH

So you are claiming that the whole circus started as an 'abuse of power' claim? And NOT quid-pro-quo as declared by the non-whistle blower? How did it START then? You know it started based on complete BS...it pivoted to bribery because QPQ wasn't working...now it's not even based on a crime. It's falling apart...as if it ever had any standing to begin with.

Asking a foreign country to make sure there is no more corruption BEFORE the POTUS gives them hundreds of millions of US taxpayer $$$ is doing his job.

No one is above the law...remember? That includes Hunter and Joe whether Joe is running for office or not.

Just because you want it to be a 'transgression' that doesn't make it one. We have the transcripts...we have the comments from the Ukranians...this thing is a joke.

It's how the libs operate. You want to know where the crime is and who is committing it? Just look at what the libs are accusing others of doing...because they are already doing it.

You want foreign election interference? Look no further than the DNC and Hillary's campaign.

You want a 'fixed' election? Call Crazy Bernie and see what he has to say about that the DNC primary.

You want QPQ and bribery? See how Hunter Biden got an $80,000 a month gig as a Board member in a country where he doesn't speak the language and has zero knowledge or experience with the company's operations. Nevermind China.

It's how they roll and the media laps it up. They hate Trump because he is exposing the BS. They are frightened about what he'll do in term #2...when he no longer has to worry about re-election. I can hardly wait.

The Senate trial will be a hoot.

I'm claiming that prid quo pro is an abuse of power. The abuse of power is an action committed. The action committed was the quid pro quo. Extortion would be considered an abuse of power. Using you power to seek political favors from a foreign government is an abuse of power.

You see, you guys keep bringing up Biden, but Biden wasn't doing it for his personal or political gain. That's where the problem is. You can certainly leverage a foreign government into doing things that are helpful for your country. Our allies as well as our own nation were trying to accomplish the goals Biden was when using leverage against Ukraine.

Trump was doing it for his own political gain. The difference is one was doing it for the betterment of everyone while one was doing it for personal gain. That's when you cross the boundary of abusing your power.

You want to see nepotism? Watch how a president appoints his own child and son in law, who have zero experience at their jobs, in high level capacity within our own government.

He will still have been impeached and congressional power of oversight preserved at a minimum. Best case however unlikely is the heat builds and GOPers do the right thing and remove him.

While I agree that the GOP will not impeach Trump in the Senate because they are weak and simply falling on their swords for Trump .... I think the issue is not impeaching Trump simply means that what he has done then becomes "OK" - and future left right or centrist Presidents have a new low bar and precedent to point to as they manipulate and trample over the constitution.

Deflection and what-about-isms aside, what Trump did / tried to do was wrong AND impeachable. The most simple to relate to summary I have heard was by of Escobar (? Spelling - female Dem) today, relating the actions to a local level. Also the male Dem from NY before her was also matter of fact and straight forward.

one more time beating my head against the wall - when Joe Biden withheld funds it was [1] Government foreign policy [2] It was in keeping with our EU allies who were also telling Ukraine the same message with the same goal [3] Had absolutely zero to do with Hunter Biden [4] The prosecutor they wanted fired was not prosecuting enough corruption (as opposed to trying to hard to prosecute Hunter).............. I posted an excellent article about the shamelessness of Barr within the last 2 days. It PERFECTLY described this Orwellian attempt by Trump & Barr to reverse the roles and spin lies to cover for what Trump did.

And finally - I keep hearing the Republicans saying we've heard the "Transcript" of the phone call. NO WE HAVE NOT ... and gosh I wonder why we have not??? .... what we have heard is the White House version of the 'gist' of the phone call that was produced by their lawyers after they secured the transcript of the call.

I also think that what Trump did was an impeachable offense. However, I also think that the House really has no intention of actually removing him from offense.

Neither Right nor Left want to start enforcing accountability. Each and every person is probably scared to death of the idea of accountability.

You are right - Hunter Biden didn't do anything illegal. But morally and ethically it was wrong. . . . but talking about Hunter is the only thing the GOP now seems to be doing, which seems a pretty pathetic deflection.

Just saw Matt Gaetz talking about Hunter's past with drugs - what a complete POS.

The problem with your line of thinking is that getting Biden out of the race early would probably help the other Democrats more than it helps Trump.

The "investigation" has probably done more to keep Biden's name in the media and, thus, the race than anything Joe's actually done or said. The longer Biden is in the race the more votes and funding he siphons from candidates who are more likely to be able to actually win an election.

As dumb as Trump looks most of the time, sometimes I wonder if he's just taking the adage of "there is no such thing as bad publicity" to extremes. If he didn't say and do so many absurd things, he wouldn't get anywhere near as much coverage.

For some Republican voters, the fact that he's doing so much to upset Democrats is interpreted as an indication that he must be doing something right. Stupid, I think. Not an entirely unexpected outcome from a system that has long been presented as only having two viable sides given as an either/or proposition.

Not that I hold a lot of stock in polls - but every single poll I have ever seen referenced regarding the Dem nominee, for the last 3-4 months maybe longer ---- has Biden the guy that beats Trump by the largest margin. Every single poll. I think your personal opinion on Biden might be clouding the facts.

We'll see how it plays out. Biden might look good on paper, but as far as actually answering questions and acting remotely normal in the limelight, (probably the most important aspects once it's down the "final two") he's the Democrat I'd be least worried about if I were on the other side.

He'd probably get the "at least he's not Trump" votes.

I'm not sure there'd be many "I'm excited about Joe Biden" votes.

There'd probably be a fair amount of "sorry, but I can't vote for creepy uncle Joe" non-votes.

There'd probably be a bunch of people dejected that their candidate didn't make it that don't bother to vote.

So because one party decides not to defend the constitution, the other should just give up?