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#1747612 03/29/20 08:15 PM
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Quote:
In Negotiations, Givers Are Smarter Than Takers

Generosity is a sign of intelligence, and givers are the rising tide that lifts all boats.


By Adam Grant

March 27, 2020

In 2010, a Costa Rican diplomat named Christiana Figueres set out to do something that many people saw as impossible. The United Nations had appointed her to build a global agreement to fight climate change. She needed to get 195 countries on board, and one of the biggest challenges was Saudi Arabia. Their economy was dependent on oil and gas exports, so they had every incentive to keep profiting from that rather than reducing their carbon footprint.

When the pie seems fixed, it’s common to panic and treat resources as scarce. In crisis, we often do whatever it takes to protect ourselves. That’s especially clear today: In the past few weeks, we’ve seen hoarders collect thousands of bottles of hand sanitizer, and spreaders ignore warnings to maintain physical distance to avoid infecting vulnerable groups. We’ve watched policymakers withhold emergency funds. “It’s give and take, but it’s got to be mostly take,” President Trump said in 2015, summing up his negotiation philosophy. “You got to mostly take.”

That was the art of the deal: Be a taker. But now there’s a science of the deal, with decades of evidence on what separates great negotiators from their peers. It tells a different story: Being a giver may actually be a sign of intelligence.

In one of my favorite studies, researchers tested people’s intelligence with a series of quantitative, verbal and analytical reasoning problems. Then they sent them off to negotiate. Intelligence paid off — but not in the way you might expect. The smarter people were, the better their counterparts did in the negotiation. They used their brainpower to expand the pie, finding ways to help the other side that cost them nothing.


This isn’t an isolated result. In a comprehensive analysis of 28 studies, the most successful negotiators cared as much about the other party’s success as their own. They refused to see negotiations as win-lose or the world as zero-sum. They understood that before you could claim value, you needed to create value. They didn’t declare victory until they could help everyone win.

This isn’t limited to negotiation. Economists find that the higher that Americans score on intelligence tests, the more they give to charity — even after adjusting for their wealth, income, education, age and health. Psychologists demonstrate that the smarter people are, the less likely they are to take resources for themselves — and the more likely they are to give to a group. I’ve discovered in my own research that when success is a sprint, givers may well finish last. But if it’s a marathon, the takers tend to fall behind and the givers often finish first.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/27/smart...e=pocket-newtab


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I have several different twists on this topic. I'm hoping we can have an intelligent conversation. We don't have to agree. Different perspectives are a good thing.

Here is my first twist and I can understand why some might not agree.

I think another reason why givers are more intelligent than takers is they take the time to see things from multiple perspectives. They realize that debate is good. They realize that forcing your viewpoints on others is not a good thing.

Givers tend to look at things in a broader sense. As in, how can we help society, individuals, the planet, etc. Takers tend to look at how something can help their own wants and desires. Thus, givers are much more open-minded and capable of deeper thinking that is not limited by built-in, selfish beliefs.

jfan and I do not get along. However, he said something on the COVID-19 thread in the Political forum that I agreed with 100%. I'm paraphrasing and I'll probably butcher this, but I think he was talking about how people are so one-sided in their opinions and blaming the other side, that they don't realize that the more important goal is to help one another and defeat this disease.

See, I think that is important. Givers tend to keep an open mind. Takers tend to be more narrow-minded and want to assign blame to further their opinions.

I have other twists and turns on givers and takers and the next one I will share is very close to my heart. In the meantime, I would love to hear from those who actually want to have a real conversation and not just take sides.

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This thread will probably never get going and I understand why. However, I am going to add another thought to it because I think it is important.

As some of you know, my wife is a CRNA for a hospital that is about 40-45 minutes away from us. She is 69 years old and in good health. I worry about her. Our children worry about her. She is on the front line each day. We beg her to retire. We talk about the possible dangers.

Her reply is: "this is what we signed up for." By "we," she means health care professionals. Think about that. Putting one's own safety behind the mission to help others. That's powerful stuff.

I was a teacher and still a tutor. I think that my chosen profession was all about helping people. Not all teachers are good. Not all care deeply about their students, but many of us do/did. We give. We do not take.

And I really can't say that I believe or don't believe in the meeting your maker thing, but I do firmly believe in this. When your death card comes, you are going to have a few moments of clarity of just what you did w/your life. And I hope that you land on the positive side.

I remember when I was first diagnosed w/the tumor on my carotid artery. It's a rare thing and we were all scared. I remember processing it all and I told the fam that I was okay w/it no matter what because I believe I gave more good to the world than I took from it. I did not want to die, but when you check out.......what did you leave to the world? Did you give more than you took. Or vice versa?

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My wife's boss sent non essential staff home to work from home. They manufacture and sell vinyl fencing. The production staff has been broken up into three shifts when they used to be two. Everyone gets their temp taken before entering. Anyone not feeling well and anyone worried about working during this can stay home and not worry about losing their job. He went one step further and gave every employee a temporary $2 an hour raise until this is over or he is forced to shut the doors, whichever comes first.

We've been worried he will be forced to shut down but they fall under the category of essential businesses due to their affiliation with the big hardware stores and Amazon. So for now, unless they tighten up those guidelines, the doors are open.

His sales are off by 30%-40% since this started. So he's doing most of this out of pocket. They are making stock that may never be sold, just to keep paychecks coming.


Your feelings and opinions do not add up to facts.
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I think that article is spot on. It might not be intentional, but the Giver vs Taker labels are misleading (at least, how they're explained through the intention of the article).
The successful giver in that article isn't really giving as much as they are figuring out ways to take 'nicely'. That's not generosity, imo. I feel this article attempts to equate fair negotiations to generosity. If you want something that someone else has, and offer up something that you don't value as much, is that really generosity? IMO, no... but it is intelligent. And if the other person sees value in what you're offering, then yeah... win/win. It takes intelligence (but not generosity) to successfully negotiate like that.


There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.

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Looking at this in slightly different terms... for centuries we have operated under the model of scarcity.. if you invent something others may find valuable, you patent it, prohibit others from making it, and sell it for as much as you can for as long as you can... that's how businesses became successful and thrived. They hoped to have a monopoly before others were even allowed to catch up. If you were the only supplier, you created your own scarcity...

Some tech firms have been extremely successful operating under a model of abundance. If you create something of value, share it willingly, let others improve it, let them build on it, don't hoard it and keep it exclusive.. share it.

The scarcity model is about me.. the abundance model is about everybody.. pretty simple really.


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It is simply the difference between a short term gain versus a long term vision.

Those with vision want the pie to be larger.

As Henry Ford said, he wanted his workers to buy his cars.


There will be no playoffs. Can’t play with who we have out there and compounding it with garbage playcalling and worse execution. We don’t have good skill players on offense period. Browns 20 - Bears 17.

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Takers is a better name for a football team.

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I prefer the Forgivers. wink


Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Originally Posted By: YTownBrownsFan
I prefer the Forgivers. wink


I prefer the fore-givers. wink


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Did I take a wrong turn and end up in the Goofy thread?

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Did I take a wrong turn and end up in the Goofy thread?



We can only hope.


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You're a swell guy.

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As I learned a long time ago from Readers Digest, laughter is the best medicine.


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Anyway, I was hoping someone would have brought up this "twist" on the givers vs takers conversation.

Earlier, I talked about health care workers such as my wife being givers. When we were talking about the dangers of the job, she said: "this is what we signed up for." Other people are giving during the crisis that is COVID-19.

Others [the takers] are exploiting others by buying large amounts of essential items and then selling them for a profit during a time of crisis.

I've often wondered why people are so different in this psychological make-up. Some want to help others no matter the risk they undertake upon themselves, while others want to take whatever they can get despite the harm it does to others.

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I think whether you are a giver or a taker is an inherent quality or flaw depending on which side of the fence you fall.

People can debate about whether it is due to the way you were raised or simply a part of the set of instincts one is born with that many vary from person to person. I don't really have the answer to that.

But from my experiences through life it seems that those who are takers simply can't fathom how being a giver would be possible for them and givers can't fathom the way being a taker would be possible for them.

I guess I would boil it down to one side thinks that, only the strong survive/battle of the fittest. While the other side thinks that the strong should help those most vulnerable.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Here is the majority of an article about givers, takers, and matchers.

Quote:
Givers, takers, and matchers

What’s the difference between these types?

Takers are self-focused and put their own interests ahead of others’ needs. They try to gain as much as possible from their interactions while contributing as little as they can in return.

Matchers like to preserve an equal balance of giving and taking. Their mindset is: “If you take from me, I’ll take from you. If you give to me, I’ll give to you.”

Givers are others-focused, and tend to provide support to others with no strings attached. They ask themselves, “How can I add value for this person? What can I contribute?”

Types of Reciprocity - Lemonade Blog

So what type are you? Turns out most people hover in the middle, and behave as matchers, answering option B above (I’ll introduce you to my college friend, but I need help from you).

Humans have an innate tendency to be reciprocal, and givers and takers represent two extremes.

But while givers are the most generous in our society, matchers play an important role. They make sure what goes around, comes around. They reward givers for their generous behavior, and seek revenge when they, or others, are being mistreated.
Givers, takers, and matchers at work

Guess which of these types is the most successful at work.

Turns out, givers tend to be the worst performers. They’re at a disadvantage across a wide range of occupations, because they sacrifice their own success to help others succeed, according to Grant’s research.

So that must mean takers or matchers are the top performers, right? Not exactly.

It’s the givers again.

Yeah, you read right. The worst and best performers at work are others-focused, and takers and matchers tend to land in the middle.

Givers, Takers, and Matchers at Work - The Lemonade Blog

Why is that? Since takers develop reputations for putting others last, matchers tend to return the favor and try to knock them down, research shows. That’s why takers rarely succeed in building strong relationships and networks.

On the other hand, matchers root for givers to succeed, since they tend to match good deed with good deed. Everyone loves, trusts, and supports givers, since they add value to others and enrich the success of the people around them.

In short, givers succeed because their giving leads to quality relationships, which benefit them in the long run. With such strong relationships, it’s no wonder givers are also happier people than takers.

But wait, back up. If being a giver creates stronger relationships (and even makes you happier), why are some givers at the bottom of the success ladder, while others are at the top?
Selfless givers vs. otherish givers

There are two types of givers: ‘selfless’ givers and ‘otherish’ givers.

Selfless givers, as you may guess, are the ones who drop everything to help people all the time, which means they tend to fall behind on their own work. Therefore, they usually end up at the bottom of the success ladder (though they’re still happier people than takers).

On the other hand, otherish givers are smart and strategic about their giving. While they’re just as much givers as the selfless givers, they’ve learned to successfully navigate a world with matchers and takers, so others don’t take advantage of them.

At this point, you must be asking: what steps can I take to become a successful giver? After all, being a successful giver comes with many perks: stronger relationships, increased happiness, and better performance at work.

Well, we’re glad you asked. Here are a few tricks and tools successful givers have up their sleeves to help others while avoiding burnout.
How to be a successful giver

1. 5-minute favors

What to do:

Do other people small favors that take no more than 5 minutes – like making an introduction, giving feedback, and offering advice.

Why it works:

Made famous by serial entrepreneur Adam Rifkin, 5-minute favors are those small yet impactful favors you do for others that take no more than 5 minutes. Doing these quick favors for a coworker or friend can go a long way in strengthening your relationships.

2. Ask for help

What to do:

Ask a friend or coworker for help on an issue you’re having, without taking up too much of their time.

Why it works:

While asking for help doesn’t sound like a quintessential giver move, doing so comes with some surprising benefits. It gives them the opportunity to be a giver, but also makes them feel good and smart.

According to Grant, one of the best ways to build strong relationships is to seek advice, because it creates meaningful opportunities for someone to contribute to your life, and feel fulfilled by it.

3. Give all at once

What to do:

Devote a particular day or part of a day each week to helping people out.

Why it works:

There are two ways to give: you can sprinkle random acts of kindness throughout your week, or chunk all of your giving acts into one day. Which is most effective? The chunking, research shows, because it leaves you with a bigger psychological boost of feeling appreciation and meaningfulness, which will motivate you to continue being a giver.

Give All at Once - Lemonade Blog

4. Specialize in favors

What to do:

Pick one or two ways of helping that you enjoy and excel at, rather than being jacks of all trades.

Why it works:

This way, you can help in a way that energizes you instead, of exhausts you. This trick will also allow you to gain a reputation as a person with a particular expertise you’re willing to share, rather than as a nice person who’s freely available.

Bonus? People won’t come to you for favors that don’t fit these skills.

5. Keep an eye out for takers

What to do:

Spot takers early, based on reputation and past experience, and only help them if they like you.

Why it works:

Takers like to milk givers for favors, because of givers’ reputations. To avoid this, take on the mentality of a matcher. In other words, if a taker asks for help, say “sure, I’ll help you if you agree to help me with something else in return.”
Give, give, give!

Practice these tips and tricks, and you’ll be a successful giver in no time. But the key to being a successful giver is also being an authentic giver. The less you try to give to get, the more you’ll succeed.

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From the same article, here is a quiz to see if you are a giver, taker, or matcher.

Quote:
Are you a giver, taker, or matcher?

Here are a few more questions from Adam Grant’s Give and Take quiz to help you find out.

1. You and a stranger will both receive some money. You have three choices about what you and the stranger receive, and you’ll never see or meet the stranger. Which option would you choose?

a) I get $8, and the stranger gets $4

b) I get $5, and the stranger gets $7

c) I get $5, and the stranger gets $5

2. In 2006, after the devastation caused by Hurricane Katrina, a US bank executive led a team of employees on a trip to help rebuild New Orleans. Why do you think he did this?

a) He wanted to make headlines for being a generous, giving organization

b) He felt compassion for the victims and wanted to do whatever he could to help

c) He wanted to show his support for bank employees who had family members in New Orleans

3. You’re applying for a job as a manager, and a former boss writes you a glowing recommendation letter. What would you be most likely to do?

a) Go out of my way to make a good impression on my new boss, so I can line up another strong recommendation for the future

b) Offer to write a recommendation letter for one of my own former employees, so I can pay it forward

c) Look for ways to help my former boss, so I can pay it back

4. You’re working on a project with two colleagues, and there are three tasks that need to get done. As you discuss how to divide tasks, it becomes clear that all three of you are extremely interested in two of the tasks, but view the third as quite boring. What would you do?

a) Try to convince one of my colleagues to do the boring task

b) Volunteer for the boring task without asking for anything in return

c) Volunteer for the boring task and ask my colleagues for a favor later

5. A few years ago, you helped an acquaintance named Jamie find a job. You’ve been out of touch since then. All of a sudden, Jamie sends an email introducing you to a potential business partner. What’s the most likely motivation behind Jamie’s email?

a) Jamie wants to ask for help again

b) Jamie genuinely wants to help me

c) Jamie wants to pay me back



I'll post the supposed key later, but it's pretty obvious. I also bet I can identify a lot of the folks on here in regards to which category they fall into.

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This article is a bit deeper than the previous one. I have more info I can share if anyone is interested in the psychology of this topic.

Quote:

Are You a Giver or a Taker?
The answer might surprise you.


Posted Jul 24, 2015


"Work is about a search for daily meaning as well as daily bread…" —Studs Terkel

Psychologist Adam Grant divides the working world into three groups of people: Givers, Takers, and Matchers. Givers seek out ways to be helpful and give to others. Matchers play “tit for tat”—they reciprocate and expect reciprocity. Takers focus on getting as much as possible from others.

But there’s a twist. There are times when everyone—even Givers—can operate like Takers.
iStock © Victor_Tongdee
Source: iStock © Victor_Tongdee

Those of us who are not Takers run the risk of starting to operate like Takers, Grant claims, when we don’t realize why what we’re doing matters to other people.

How does he know this? One of the first studies Grant ever did was an examination of university fundraising phone-callers. (These are the people who bother you in the evening trying to get you to donate money.)

These callers face tremendous motivational challenges. The chances that the alums on the other end of the line will give are low, and when they do, the dollar amounts are small. The challenges of the job are so overwhelming that it is typical for annual turnover at a university call center to exceed 400 percent. (In other words, every three months, the entire staff might quit.)

When Grant looked at one group of callers, “They were pretty burned out,” he told a group at an Aspen Institute gathering. “We had one caller who posted a sign by his desk that said, ‘Doing a good job here is like wetting your pants in a dark suit. You get a warm feeling, but no one else notices.’”

According to Grant, executives often assume that employees will do better when incentivized for performance with money, recognition, promotions, etc. With the callers Grant was studying, all of these strategies had been tried, but nothing had improved performance.

Although the purpose of the calls was to raise money for the school, a job one might assume would appeal to Givers, “these callers were operating like Takers,” Grant maintains, “because they didn’t know how they were giving—they didn’t know where the money went.” Grant surmised that continuing to reward people in ways that assume self-interested motives might actually perpetuate self-interested behavior and create Takers out of Givers.

Believing that providing the opportunity for callers to see the positive impact of their work would inspire them and improve their effectiveness, Grant decided on the following experiment: He had leaders from the school come talk to the fundraising callers about the statistics regarding where the money was going. The callers learned how much went to faculty and staff salaries, buildings, scholarships, etc.

By way of background, Adam Grant, the highest-rated teacher at the 
Wharton School, the youngest tenured professor in the history of the University of Pennsylvania, a former advertising director,
 and even a former junior Olympian, is the author of the book, Give and Take: A Revolutionary Approach to Success.
article continues after advertisement

He was named one of
 BusinessWeek’s favorite professors, and his clients 
include Google, the United Nations, the 
U.S. Army, Navy, and Air Force. Suffice it to say, he’s a pretty smart guy, and he knows his stuff.

So did his experiment work?

“It did no good whatsoever,” Grant reports. “In fact, a lot of the callers did worse.”

What was going on? Eventually, Grant realized that rather than being inspired, the callers were skeptical that giving them information about where the money went was a ploy to try to get them to work harder. (And it was.)

So Grant invited a scholarship recipient to speak with the fundraisers. No one else was allowed—no executives, no school personnel. Only the callers and the scholarship student. The student spent about five minutes telling the callers how those phone calls made a difference in his life and how much he appreciated it.

“The callers spiked 142 percent in weekly minutes on the phone and 171 percent in weekly money raised,” Grant reports, “and that actually turned out to be a conservative estimate, because in another study, we found a more compelling scholarship student who had a more powerful story to tell, and average callers spiked more than 400 percent in weekly revenue.”

To be clear, nothing in the circumstances of making the phone calls had changed. The callers used all the same materials in the same environment with the same goal. The only thing that changed was the umwelt—the callers’ subjective world of making fundraising calls.

Your umwelt is like a lens through which you see the world, and it impacts how you interact with whatever is going on in your life. In some situations, your umwelt creates a reality in which you act effectively, and in others, you are unable to see any possibility for effective action—your umwelt is not serving you. A shift in your umwelt doesn’t change the situation you confront, but it does alter the impact that situation has on you, and the ways in which you interact with it.
article continues after advertisement

Before speaking with the scholarship student, the callers’ umwelt (the subjective world of the job) was one of trying to convince alumni to donate to the school—or more cynically, “to swindle alums into giving their hard-earned dollars away,” Grant jokes.

Their effectiveness was determined by that umwelt; the lens through which they saw everything they were doing. After meeting a real person whose life was positively impacted by their work, the callers’ umwelt shifted to one of a meaningful opportunity to make a difference.

Perhaps most intriguing is this: Although survey reports demonstrated that after meeting the scholarship student, the callers were more motivated, found their work more meaningful, and thought the job made more of a difference than they did before that 5-minute interaction, in interviews afterward, none of the callers said that their experience of the job or their effectiveness had been impacted by that visit from the scholarship student.
iStock © Rawpixel Ltd
Source: iStock © Rawpixel Ltd

“Because who is motivated by one 5-minute interaction?” Grant quizzes. “That doesn’t make any sense.” Yet clearly that 5-minute interaction created a profound umwelt shift. “It seems like that interaction—and we’ve replicated this about a dozen times in other settings—was a catalyst for starting to think about, ‘Why does my work matter and who is affected by it?’”
article continues after advertisement

Try This at Home: Consider what your umwelt is for your job. What is the lens through which you see your work? Then ask yourself, “Why does my work matter and who is affected by it?” Does it make you think about your job differently?


https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/...-giver-or-taker

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I am a giver, a taker, and a reciprocator. I've been all of these at different times under different circumstances. I would say most of us have been at least two of these. If I had to choose the one I am most based on the various criteria laid out in these articles, I would have a tough time deciding between giver and reciprocator because I feel a strong sense of obligation to help others that have helped me. And in the same respect, the previous article talks about deciding who get more money you or the total stranger... Without an identified need or backstory on the stranger, I would pick even money or advantage me every time depending on how I felt about the situation in the moment. Now if I had facts that the stranger had greater or desperate needs, then I would absolutely give them the most. I've always considered myself generous but I'm not in the habit of just calling my bank and telling them to divert incoming funds to random strangers. Maybe if I had Gates kind of money I could be that generous occasionally.


Your feelings and opinions do not add up to facts.
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How much you give, relative to others, does not really matter.

The Bible teaches; "As he looked up, Jesus saw the rich putting their gifts into the temple treasury. He also saw a poor widow put in two very small copper coins. "I tell you the truth," he said, "this poor widow has put in more than all the others. All these people gave their gifts out of their wealth; but she out of her poverty put in all she had to live on."


Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Amen.

At times, I would love to share on here what I have done, or do, for not only our church, but the community in general. I don't share, because I don't do it for kudo's, I do it because I can. What I do is between me and God, and the anonymous people that get something out of it.

DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Givers Vs Takers

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