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and we all know what this means....

more bailout money for the welfare queens in rural america!!

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/china-asks-state-firms-halt-104544960.html

BEIJING/SINGAPORE (Reuters) - China has told state-owned firms to halt purchases of soybeans and pork from the United States, two people familiar with the matter said, after Washington said it would eliminate special treatment for Hong Kong to punish Beijing.

Large volume state purchases of U.S. corn and cotton have also been put on hold, one of the sources said.

China could expand the order to include additional U.S. farm goods if Washington took further action, the people said.

"China has asked main state firms to suspend large scale purchases of major U.S. farm products like soybeans and pork, in response to U.S. reaction to Hong Kong," the source said.

"Now we will watch and see what the U.S. does next."

U.S. President Donald Trump said on Friday he was directing his administration to begin the process of eliminating special treatment for Hong Kong, ranging from extradition treatment to export controls, in response to China's plans to impose new security legislation in the territory.

China is ready to halt imports of more agriculture products from the United States if Washington takes more action on Hong Kong, the sources said.



(GRAPHIC: Value of U.S. agriculture exports to China - https://fingfx.thomsonreuters.com/gfx/ce/yzdvxdxdzvx/USAGExportstoChinaMar2020.png)



Chinese importers have cancelled 10,000 to 20,000 tonnes of American pork shipments - equivalent to roughly one week's orders in recent months - following Trump's comments on Friday, the source said.

State purchases of bulk volumes of U.S. corn and cotton have also been suspended but the details were not clear.

In a worst case scenario, if Trump continues to target China, Beijing will have to scrap the Phase 1 trade deal, a second source familiar with the government plan said.

“There's no way Beijing can buy goods from the U.S. when receiving constant attacks from Trump," the person said.

China pledged to buy an additional $32 billion worth of U.S. agriculture products over two years above a baseline based on 2017 figures, under the initial trade deal the two countries signed in January.

China has bought soybeans, corn, wheat and soyoil from the United States this year, to fulfil its commitment under the trade deal. Beijing also stepped up purchases of U.S. pork, after the deadly African swine fever decimated its pig herd.

The U.S. Department of Agriculture reported that China bought $1.028 billion worth of soybeans and $691 million of pork in the first quarter of 2020.

Private importers haven't received a government order to suspend buying of U.S. farm produce, according to a third source with a major trading house, but commercial buyers are very cautious at the moment, the person added.

"A certain scale of trade will be halted," given rising tensions between China and the U.S. in other areas, but it is not a full stop, said a fourth source familiar with government plan.

However, China would be able to find other sellers easily (of the farm products), he added.

The sources all declined to be named due to the sensitivity of the matter.

________

first off, screw china. just want to be clear on that.

but it says something that with everything thats going on, and with so much economic uncertainty, the trump administration decided to fuel the flames of a trade war again.

Herbert Hoover. history doesnt repeat itself, but it often rhymes.


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#winning?
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j/c --- you already know the pre-programmed Trumpian response right??? If you highlight how moronic Trump is with regards to his "Negotiation" with China .... it means you'll be labelled as siding and loving China more than America. If you post anything that shows Trump's failure and failings you are rooting against the country.... You are NOT allowed to hold this POTUS accountable for anything. Jeeeeeez. Get a clue.

Last edited by mgh888; 06/01/20 09:49 AM.

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Bro I don’t even want to know what the unemployment number is gonna be in Friday’s report.


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Quote:
and we all know what this means...


That the price of soy beans, corn, cotton, and Pork should be cheaper in the USA now nanner


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in light of skyrocketing meat prices, I actually welcome them not buying pork.... at least we should have one affordable meat.

I was at GFS the other day and ground freaking beef (80/20) was nearly $10/lb - in bulk!


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well apparently farmers are killing off the hogs right now.

if anybody can explain this to me, and not being snarky cause im genuinely confused.

apparently we have a meat shortage in this country but meat processors are having to kill off livestock due to lack of demand.

i dont get it.


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yea bro you got people making life decisions at the grocery store now. its ridiculous.


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I believe the story was the meat processing centers have been hit hard by the pandemic. This means quite a bit of meat can't be processed in a timely manner.


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It's not lack of demand, it's lack of transport, contracts, and schools/restaurants being closed. (which would slow down demand I guess from Schools and restaurants.) The demand from people is still high. When you have more customers who want to buy the product than the stores are stocking, and farmers who can't get the product to the markets, THAT'S where the problem is IMO.


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I don't quite get it, either. I guess, for whatever reason, they reach a point where they cannot easily keep the mature animals around.

Here is an article that kinda touches on it, but doesn't feel like it really clarifies anything for me.

https://www.agriculture.com/news/livestock/as-meat-plants-slow-us-will-help-growers-kill-livestock


If I had to guess, it is that in order to be able to feed all the animals they have, and have physical room for the young ones growing up behind them, they have to maintain a constant turnover of the herd.

They can slow, but cannot outright stop breeding their herds, so there will always be new livestock that needs space and feed. In order for them to have those things, parts of the herd has to go out... one way or another.


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Oob, GM, and purp, thanks for the intel.

Obviously this issue is complicated and I guess there is no one solution that will fix the issue.

I just don’t know if ramping up a trade war is the best solution, however.


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Heard a bit on NPR about this.

Processing plants operate under strict tolerances. In his example, the person being interviewed said that hogs needed to weigh 200 lb upon arrival. A 250 lb hog can't be processed.

With no place to ship them, the farmer is stuck. Continue to feed them, and he's losing money, especially since there are younger ones coming on.

One would think there could be some failsafe that would send the processed pork to food banks, etc. The waste is so sad. There is hunger right here in the US. Someone needs to step up and turn this problem into an opportunity.


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I thought the main problem was the decreased output of the processing plants due to outbreaks.


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Raising the pork is not the problem, processing it for grocery store consumers is. All the meat plants are infested with COVID-19. That's why prices are soaring. Commercial meat packaging, like that that goes to restaurants or ships to China is in low demand and the infrastructure does not translate to getting that into consumer stores. So even though there are plenty of meat animals and commercial quantities/packaging, getting it to consumers in smaller packages is the bottle neck.


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It was not my understanding that it was a lack of demand issue but a lack of processing capacity issue. A number of major processing plants were hit hard with COVID outbreaks and had to shut down for a while yet the animals in the pipeline kept coming. Plus exports were shut down (or greatly reduced) for a few months because overseas shipments were delayed.

I know I haven't stopped eating so.....


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j/c


Yes, the biggest issue is the processing plants, due to covid, being shut down and or reduced in capacity.

Yes, demand has gone down somewhat - schools and restaurants.

Yes, hog farmers have contracts that they must honor as far as buying new hogs. Hog farmers feed pigs to get them ready for market. If the market isn't buying, due to decreased ability to process, the farmers get put in a bad situation. I.e. they signed a contract to buy. Legally, they have to buy. If they can't sell the adult hogs, but have new coming in.........what do they do?

I've spoken with numerous farmers around here - and I know that's small scale stuff - I know.

I've spoken before about a conversation I had with a gentleman that sits on A u.s. ag. committee. I was not believed, and that's fine.

But, as for china: They can't feed their citizens, and they can't grow enough food for their livestock. As well, they can't do without beans, and meat, from the u.s. Other countries will try to pick up any reduction of china buying u.s. goods........but they can't match our production. Can't replace, I should say, our production.

Remember the last time this was discussed? I said what would happen - china won't directly buy our beans. And they didn't. For a while. But our beans were sold to companies in Brazil, primarily, that processed them and sold them to china.


China is pushing the envelope here. Pushing to see how far they can go. There is no doubt the trade war has hurt them. They are doing their best to hurt us back.

But, just my opinion I guess.

What would put china in place is if people quit buying stuff made in china. Of course, that would require people here pay more for products, products that would cost more due to wage laws, etc.

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The trade war hurt us just as badly. Just look at how much we had to spend to bail out famers. And yes, no matter how hard our government tried to stop it, China was still buying grain grown in the U.S. The Chinese government doesn't care how much they hurt their own people. They don't have elections.

Let's not pretend that America produces enough goods for us to buy all America products. We do not.

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I feel perhaps you don't understand the underlying issues of what this is all about.

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I certainly do. I also understand there will be ramifications suffered on both sides.


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Even some of the more liberal folks that I read admitted that the first round of the trade fight with China was a long term success for America... any trade war is going to have short term discomfort...

I'm just not sure I see the benefit of going after round 2 right now...


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Yes, ramifications on both sides, no doubt. China has been owning the u.s. for too long. Pain on both sides. Better terms at some point in the future.

DC - it does not appear to me that the u.s. started round 2.

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Well, we're not the ones that are firing the shots here.

China is threatening the pseudo-autonomy of Hong Kong. We simply said that if they do that, we're removing their special status.

China then retaliates with this, which violates part of the brand new trade agreement.



It seems that they want to play games.


edit: personally, this is where TwitterMan is useful. He can just let fly with a Tweet saying that if they want to put a stop to buying from US, we can just put an export ban on those products that applies to ANY country selling or directly shipping those products to China. At best, they then have to add another intermediary country to bypass that... which adds time and cost to the products. We'll still end up selling it, and they'll still end up receiving it, and a few other intermediary countries will end up profiting from it.... but, we call their bluff and beat them on it.


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Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
Well, we're not the ones that are firing the shots here.

China is threatening the pseudo-autonomy of Hong Kong. We simply said that if they do that, we're removing their special status.

China then retaliates with this, which violates part of the brand new trade agreement.



It seems that they want to play games.


edit: personally, this is where TwitterMan is useful. He can just let fly with a Tweet saying that if they want to put a stop to buying from US, we can just put an export ban on those products that applies to ANY country selling or directly shipping those products to China. At best, they then have to add another intermediary country to bypass that... which adds time and cost to the products. We'll still end up selling it, and they'll still end up receiving it, and a few other intermediary countries will end up profiting from it.... but, we call their bluff and beat them on it.


Damn, I am glad this is so damn easy and we are winning by so damn much.


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Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
I feel perhaps you don't understand the underlying issues of what this is all about.


Pit - you heard the man. This is grown up stuff and you need to sit in the corner and just say yes sir and no sir when asked. Got it?


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Originally Posted By: mgh888
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
I feel perhaps you don't understand the underlying issues of what this is all about.


Pit - you heard the man. This is grown up stuff and you need to sit in the corner and just say yes sir and no sir when asked. Got it?


Did I say that? No. Thanks for realizing that. But, I do have to wonder if YOU have a clue about what's going on with the trade war.



But, you're much smarter than me.

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Quote:
I just don’t know if ramping up a trade war is the best solution, however.


I would much rather be in a trade war with China than to be in a Trade slaughter with them like we have been for years. Even after the tariffs we put on them last year we still had a 345.6 BILLION dollar trade deficit with China last year, which was a 17.6 percent drop from 2018.


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Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
Even some of the more liberal folks that I read admitted that the first round of the trade fight with China was a long term success for America... any trade war is going to have short term discomfort...

I'm just not sure I see the benefit of going after round 2 right now...


Unlike our Feckless leader, I don't see how Trade wars EVER work in anyones favor.


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Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
It seems that they want to play games.


I think people need to make their minds up one way or another. Mine is already made up and has been for many years.

On the one hand people will tell you that you obviously can't trust China. You can't trust what they're doing and you can't trust them to honor their agreements. That's the side I take.

On the other hand you have most of those same people tell you that you can't trust them to keep a deal, bragging about making a deal with them.

Making a deal with a nation that has never been known to keep the deals they have made isn't worth the paper it's written on. I mean I guess that doesn't mean you shouldn't try, but then to claim victory before they honor such a deal is very premature.

But then let's not pretend that Trump hasn't broken many deals our nation has made because he wasn't the president who made them. It doesn't make us any better in that regard.


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Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
Even some of the more liberal folks that I read admitted that the first round of the trade fight with China was a long term success for America... any trade war is going to have short term discomfort...


I'll reiterate the point from my post above. Let's wait until China actually lives up to the deal before we claim victory. I've never trusted China to keep their deals or not find a way around doing so. Thus far we've only won on paper.


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I looked for the victory in my wallet, but all I found were prices going up.


Your feelings and opinions do not add up to facts.
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