DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum New York Mets acquire Francisco Lindor, Carlos Carrasco from Cleveland Indians in blockbuster deal

New York Mets acquire Francisco Lindor, Carlos Carrasco from Cleveland Indians in blockbuster deal

12:37 PM ET
Associated Press

CLEVELAND -- Francisco Lindor is moving to a new city and team that is willing to meet his salary demands.

The four-time All-Star shortstop -- and one of baseball's best all-around players -- was traded Thursday by the Cleveland Indians along with pitcher Carlos Carrasco to the New York Mets, who have a new owner willing to spend at baseball's highest levels.

The cash-strapped Indians sent Lindor and Carrasco to the Mets for infielders Andres Gimenez and Amed Rosario, right-hander Josh Wolf and outfielder Isaiah Greene -- a move Cleveland hopes will keep it competitive and capable of ending baseball's longest World Series title drought.

Dealing Lindor, who is eligible for free agency after the 2021 season, was inevitable for the mid-market Indians, who are unable to compete financially with MLB's big spenders and dropped roughly $30 million in dealing two prominent players and fan favorites.

"These are people we care about, not just players, and guys that loved the organization and have great memories here," said Indians president of baseball operations Chris Antonetti, who said he was in tears when he spoke with Lindor and Carrasco. "Trades like this are really tough. But it's the right thing to do."

For the Mets, landing Lindor is a home run and another major move by hedge fund owner Steven Cohen, who bought the team on Nov. 6 from the Wilpon and Katz families and has pledged to increase spending.

Francisco Lindor is one of baseball's best all-around players, capable of winning games with his bat, glove or legs. He's a career .285 hitter and averaged 29 homers, 86 RBIs and 21 steals in his six major league seasons.

One of his next big-ticket moves figures to be signing Lindor to a long-term contract, something the Indians couldn't do.

The 27-year-old Lindor can affect the game with his bat, glove and legs. A two-time Gold Glove winner, he's a career .285 hitter and averaged 29 homers, 86 RBIs and 21 steals in his six major league seasons -- all with the Indians, who drafted him in 2011 and developed him.

He has also been the face of the Indians franchise, with an infectious smile and joy for playing that has made him one of Cleveland's most popular athletes. But he's gone now, leaving the Indians without their best player and the team's fans grumbling about owner Paul Dolan.

Carrasco is one of the game's best comeback stories, overcoming leukemia to become one of the AL's steadiest starters. The 33-year-old has an 88-73 career record with a 3.73 ERA.

With an abundance of young pitchers, including Cy Young Award winner Shane Bieber, the Indians were in position to move a player of Carrasco's caliber.

He can be replaced. Finding someone to fill Lindor's shoes will be much tougher.

Once the Indians' pandemic-shortened 2020 season ended with a loss to the New York Yankees in the wild-card round, it became a matter of when, not if, Lindor would be traded.

Cleveland had run out of options. Lindor has turned down numerous long-term contract offers from the Indians, betting on himself and knowing he could get more money from a major-market team when he becomes a free agent.

He's signed for only one more season, so the Mets will have to quickly get to work on locking up Lindor long term.

The Indians made it known that Lindor was available for the right price. And while it's never easy to trade a generational talent with perhaps his best years still ahead of him, Cleveland's financial situation was never going to make it possible to keep him.

Cohen is hoping to turn around a franchise that has not won a World Series since 1986.

Cohen hired general manager Brodie Van Wagenen, brought back former GM Sandy Alderson as team president and hired Jared Porter from Arizona as GM under Alderson.

Lindor had $6,481,481 in prorated pay from a $17.5 million salary last year, and he is eligible for free agency after the 2021 season.


Carrasco is signed at $12 million in each of the next two seasons, part of a deal that includes a $14 million team option for 2023 with a $3 million buyout. The option would become guaranteed if he pitches in 170 innings in 2022 and is found to be healthy for the 2023 season.

Since Cohen's takeover, New York has kept pitcher Marcus Stroman for an $18.9 million qualifying offer, signed right-hander Trevor May to a two-year, $15.5 million contract and signed catcher James McCann to a four-year, $40.6 million deal. New York also signed injured right-hander Noah Syndergaard to a one-year, $9.7 million deal.

Rosario is eligible for arbitration for the first time after earning $225,474, prorated from a $608,780 salary.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/3066...eveland-indians

I will miss Lindor. Good luck to the new Indians. Sad to see these two go. Anybody able to rate the newbies?

Lindor will always be an Indian to me. I dont like this trade.

Why is there any reason to follow the Indians at this juncture? Dolans are a bunch of bums!

ESPN has a long article on it - clearly the Mets win and there was some questioning the Indians getting back 2 prospects not rated in the top 150, but only one person was overly negative.

Those BUMS as you call them lost tens of millions MORE than expected last year. Yes that's tens of millions more than they had expected to. This is a MLB problem not a Cleveland Indians problem. Until MLB gets a salary cap the small cities can not spend anywhere close to what the teams from large cities can.

Cool, so the Indians will go into 2021 with almost no proven talent and a minor league-esque payroll. Should be fun...

$35M is a small payroll, but I heard the GM (Antonetti) say that is as low as it will go and they will add to it with a free agent signing or two before opening day. The Tampa Rays went to the WS with a payroll in the mid $50M range. As far as the talent - yes, we took some hits this off season, but we still have the Cy Young Winner (Bieber) along with a pretty good starting staff, and we still have a finalist for AL MVP in Jose Ramirez.

J/C

Indians biggest needs for 2021:

• Salary Floor
• Salary Cap
• Dolan learning how to retain homegrown talent
• Actually try to contend for more than a year

Don't forget, we also got a donation to the human fund in our name!

I will never understand players siding with owners over players when it comes to spending money.

Because they are my team and I like baseball.

A deal was going to happen. I don't like it, but there was nothing we or even the team could do about it.

You can pound on the Dolans all you want. Big money owners aren't going to spend big dollars unless they expect a return on the money spent.

I don't care what Dolan, Antonetti, or the Indians press put out, nothing suffices. The only thing that does is a World Series victory. I don't care about anything else, talk is cheap.

Show me. I mean, seriously, compared to Lindor and the people we got back in the trade, my first automatic response is, "who in the hell are these guys? Really? What a joke."

We need to protest Dolan and force him to sell the team!!!

The Lindor/Carrasco Trade Cements Paul Dolan as MLB’s Worst Owner

News broke Thursday morning that talks between the Cleveland Indians and the New York Mets involving star SS Francisco Lindor were heating up. The trade was made official shortly after with the Indians sending Lindor and RHP Carlos Carrasco to New York. In return, the Indians receive middle infielders Andres Gimenez and Amed Rosario, RHP Josh Wolf and OF Isaiah Greene.

Lindor, entering his seventh Major League season in 2021, is a four-time All-Star, two-time Gold Glove winner and two-time Silver Slugger winner. He quickly rose through the Indians’ farm system and, after his rookie season in 2015, was immediately established as one of the MLB’s greatest young talents. Throughout his career, the switch-hitter has amassed a .284 BA/.346 OBP/.488 SLG with 138 home runs paired with near-perfect defense at the shortstop position.

The veteran Carlos Carrasco is entering his 12th season, all of which had been with the Indians. After a rough start to his career, Carrasco established himself as a solid contributor in the Indians pitching rotation with a career ERA of 3.77 and a 88-73 win/loss record both as a starter and out of the bullpen. He had four-straight seasons of 10+ wins from 2015-2018 and led the league in wins (18) in 2017. He missed much of the 2019 season due to his diagnosis with leukemia and received the AL Comeback Player of the Year Award upon his return. Carrasco is known for being very active in the community both domestically and overseas for which he received the Roberto Clemente Award in 2019 as well.

Overall, this trade is comical.

Owner Paul Dolan and the Indians are shipping away two fan-favorite players (one of which is arguably the face of the entire LEAGUE) and major contributors for four virtually no-name players; only one of which has even played a single full season in the pros. Along with dumping the two fan-favorites, Dolan cut an astonishing $44 million off of his payroll. This leaves the Indians dead last in baseball in payroll at just under $23M, nearly half of the Baltimore Orioles who are the next lowest team and, might I add, have been one of the MLB’s most pathetic franchises for over a decade. Paul Dolan uses the “small market” excuse to slash his payroll year after year, trading away big-name talent or just letting the players walk entirely, all due to his flat out refusal to offer the level of contracts required to compete in the MLB today. Since 2016, the Indians have lost SP Corey Kluber, SP Mike Clevinger, SP Trevor Bauer, LF Michael Brantley, 1B Carlos Santana (twice), RP Andrew Miller, LF Josh Donaldson, RF Yasiel Puig, 2B Jason Kipnis and now Francisco Lindor and Carlos Carrasco.

Am I forgetting any?

Probably, because the Cleveland Indians are just one glorified farm team with a bad logo and a poor fan base who has to deal with an owner who thinks losing in the first round of the playoffs once every three seasons is enough to continuously coerce fans into buying season tickets and jerseys while he gets to keep saving more and more money at the expense of our happiness. You might as well kiss 3B Jose Ramirez, SP Shane Bieber and SP Zach Plesac goodbye, too, because we all know that, come their contract year, they will most likely get shipped off to a higher bidder in return for some minor league bargain player whose name you’ve never even heard of but the beat writers try and defend as being “MLB-level talent”.

As the contracts’ big-name players earn continue to soar above $400 and $500 million dollars year after year, Paul Dolan’s belligerence will continue to sink the Indians’ franchise more and more until they are completely washed out of the competitive picture once and for all. Starting a “rebuild” for a team that has made the playoffs four of the past five seasons is embarrassing and provides more and more proof to the fact that Paul Dolan doesn’t care about winning in the slightest; he cares about his wallet, and his wallet alone and will continue to screw over the city of Cleveland year after year as long as he can squeeze just a little more profit out of the franchise. Throw in a Wild Card berth or an ALDS loss once every few years to keep the seats filled and Pauly D thinks that is just dandy.

I mean, what else could the fans really ask for?

Long-term success? Preposterous!

You know what is a great way to earn money? Selling the team! Preferably to someone who is competent enough to actually pay their star players, but how could anyone possibly be worse than the clown in our front office right now?

Goodbye. I am tired.

(Stats via baseball-reference.com.)

(Photo via Fox.)

https://clesportstalk.com/the-lindor-carrasco-trade-cements-paul-dolan-as-mlbs-worst-owner/

Bingo.

I will never understand a fan's concern for a billionaire owner not making enough money.

What I’m hearing about the Francisco Lindor deal with the Mets – Terry’s Talkin’ Tribe
Updated 5:59 AM; Today 5:59 AM
By Terry Pluto, The Plain Dealer

ABOUT THE FRANCISCO LINDOR TRADE

1. The Indians are done cutting payroll. They will save at least $30 million on the trade that sent Francisco Lindor and Carlos Carrasco to the Mets. Team president Chris Antonetti said the trade “gives us the financial flexibility to reinvest in the team that will make us more competitive.”

2. The Indians are not going to use all of the $30 million from the deal for players, but some of it. I hear one of their top targets is free-agent second baseman Cesar Hernandez, who played so well for the Tribe in 2020. The 30-year-old batted .283 (.763 OPS) with 3 HR and 20 RBI. He led the American League with 20 doubles last season.

3. I’ll throw this out there: It’s a long shot, but what about Michael Brantley? He is a free agent. I hear the Indians plan to talk to him. Since leaving the Tribe, he’s played two seasons in Houston. As usual, Brantley has batted .300 ... it’s .309 (.867 OPS) to be exact. Brantley is 33. My guess is some team will offer him a lucrative multiyear deal. The Indians may end up looking at free agents such as Eddie Rosario or Jackie Bradley.

4. The Indians did receive infielders Andres Gimenez and Amed Rosario as part of the Lindor deal. The Tribe could go with Gimenez at short and Rosario at second. Rosario has been a career shortstop, but the Indians believe he can easily adapt to second.

5. The Tribe thinks the 22-year-old Gimenez can be their starting shortstop for a long time. They love his glove, considering it elite. Gimenez started 22 games at short for the Mets. He also played 19 games at second and 10 at third base. But short is his prime position.

6. The Tribe also believes Gimenez was rushed to the majors. He jumped from Class AA to the big leagues. Gimenez batted a respectable .263 (.732 OPS) with 3 HR and 12 RBI in 118 at bats. He was 8-of-9 in stolen bases. The Indians think he can be a big-time base stealer. The Indians aren’t saying it, but I believe they consider Gimenez to be the key player in the trade.

7. If the Indians sign Hernandez, they could send Gimenez to Class AAA to play regularly. They could open with Rosario at short and Hernandez at second. Then they could bring up Gimenez early in the 2021 season. The Indians tend to be patient with their top prospects.

8. Rosario was ranked as the No. 8 prospect in all of baseball by Baseball America in 2017. ESPN ranked him No. 3 on its prospect list. The 25 year old has the athleticism to be a good regular player. In 2019, he batted .287 (.755 OPS) with 15 HR and 72 RBI.

9. But in 2020, Rosario batted .252 (.643 OPS) and by the end of the season, Gimenez was playing more shortstop. Rosario doesn’t walk much, only four times in 147 plate appearances in 2020. He is 50-of-75 in stolen bases, only 67%. You want to be at least over 80%. The Indians believe he has a lot of natural ability and needs time to put it together. At the very least, he is a respectable big league middle infielder.

10. Why did the Indians put Carlos Carrasco in the deal? First, the Mets wanted the right-hander. While it’s expected the Mets under new ownership will make Lindor a massive offer to sign a contract extension, he still could play out the season and hit the open market. Signed for two more seasons plus an option for 2023, Carrasco is tied to the Mets even if they lose Lindor after 2021.

11. I heard the Indians talked to several teams about Carrasco. While he was wanted, the demand was not high. Teams were concerned because Carrasco will be 34 on March 21. He is a leukemia survivor. The disease knocked him out of most of the 2019 season.

12. Around baseball, there also is a sense to be careful when the Indians trade a veteran starting pitcher. Yes, Trevor Bauer was outstanding in 2020 for the Reds. But he pitched poorly in Cincinnati after being traded at the 2019 deadline. Corey Kluber pitched one game after being dealt to Texas. Mike Clevinger made four starts for San Diego, then hurt his elbow and will miss 2021 because of Tommy John elbow surgery.

13. The Indians were willing to deal Carrasco not only to move the two-year deal worth $27 million, but also because of their wealth of starting pitching. They will probably open the season with a rotation led by Cy Young winner Shane Bieber. Then come Aaron Civale and Zach Plesac. Those are the big three. They probably will fill in the final two spots from this list: Triston McKenzie, Cal Quantrill and Adam Plutko.

14. The Indians also have several young starters who could be a factor at some point in 2021: Scott Moss, Logan Allen, Sam Hentges and Eli Morgan. Let’s add Joey Cantillo to the list. He was acquired in the Clevinger deal with San Diego. The 21-year-old lefty has a 13-7 record and 2.51 ERA in the minors. He’s not pitched above Class A, but he could develop quickly.

15. Of the second group of starter possibilities, my favorite is Moss. He’s a 26-year-old lefty who was a star pitcher at the University of Florida. He was drafted in 2016. His career minor-league record is 41-17 with a 3.28 ERA. He had a 1.93 ERA in four starts for Class AAA Columbus in 2019.

16. The two other players the Tribe received in the deal are Josh Wolf and Isaiah Greene. Both are several years away from the majors. Both were ranked among the Mets’ top 10 prospects by several rating systems. Greene hasn’t played any pro ball. He was a second-round pick by the Mets in 2020. Wolf was the Mets’ second-round pick in 2019. Both were high school players when drafted.

17. The 6-foot-3 Wolf was so prized by the Mets, they gave him a $2.1 million signing bonus – that was $800,000 more than “slotted” for a second-round pick. He was heading to Texas A&M until the Mets showed him the money. Wolf’s average fastball is about 93 mph, and has hit 96. Remember, he’s only 20 and still adding strength. His pro career consists of 12 strikeouts in eight innings in rookie ball in 2019. His best pitch is said to be his slider.

18. Greene was the 69th pick in 2020 draft, an athletic outfielder out of Corona High in California. He’s a 6-foot-1, left-handed hitter. The Indians had low first-round/high second-round grades on Wolf and Greene. They settled for younger prospects because they thought they would be of more value than the so-so prospects they were offered as alternatives.


https://www.cleveland.com/tribe/2021/01/...lkin-tribe.html

Look, I know it's like arguing about who has the stinkier bowl of poo, but there is no one... no one worse than Bob Nutting of the Pittsburgh Pirates.

People complain about Dolan, year after year, yet his team wins more than more MLB teams do, year after year.

He is not going to take in $X, and spend $2X. Last year's champs didn't outspend everyone in MLB. Not even close to it. Smaller market teams have to be smart about their finances. The Indians have done that.

Well if talk is so cheap why don't you put up a few hundred million from your pocket to cover payroll?

They have pushed me so far away from both the team and the sport overall. This model makes it so hard to be invested as a fan. There's no doubt the Indians will field a competitive team back up, but it will take years. When that time comes, you have a window of maybe 2 years before ownership doesn't want to extend players. All for a chance to get strong-armed in the playoffs by a team with a bigger payroll.

These young players coming up get paid a pretty crappy salary when compared to what veteran guys are making, so I don't blame any of these guys for skipping town and getting that huge pay raise. Look at what Lindor made in years with Cleveland, and look at what he will end up getting in New York.

I will always have a soft spot for the Indians, or whatever they will end up being called, but I just don't care about them as much as I do the Browns, Cavs, or even OSU football.

There's always the debate of whether it's the league or whether it's the Dolans. Why can't both be faulted? This model sucks for smaller and mid-market teams. On the other hand, there's no doubt that the Dolans over the years have used this to probably spend less than they could have.

The Dolans should be thanking their lucky stars that they have good people in the scouting and development departments, because otherwise, this could be one of the worst run organizations in the league. Instead, they are regarded as a well run organization by most baseball media. That can also be true alongside the Dolans being blamed.

I do think the Dolans should sell the team. They aren't fit to compete, they've made a lot of money over the years, and they will make out like bandits on a sale. They need new money injected into the team. The TV Deal expires in a few years and that would be an obvious selling point on any new potential suitor.

I do think new ownership could really help out with attendance. They might be able to get the numbers trending back upward. I don't think you will ever see a run like they had in the 90s where the season was sold out by Thanksgiving, but there is a ton of room for improvement. Having your season sold out before it starts is obviously great, but I think the cool thing about baseball is being able to decide on short notice to head down tot he park and see a game.

The current state of the team is not great though, their payroll is 40 million. Gerritt Cole of the Yankees is set to make 36 million in 2021. Yikes. They are projected to end the year at 86 million, but this is not a good look at all.

Dolans don't have the mindset to be MLB owners they are 8x richer than Jacobs was..when the other deal fell through and he bought the royals instead its obvious the Dolans are in preservation mode right now.. This might be the worst trade in indians history. You trade not one, but two players in the top 5 of their position for some late draft prospects.. atleast with the other trades we got some legit prospects. Only thing that keeps this team competitive is the coaching. Tito wins despite having a trash owner group. MLB you have to spend money to make money

Way early to say that. Let's examine again in a few seasons.

I am sure if they could have made a better deal, they would have.