DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2021 NFL Season 2021 NFL Draft Bang the Table

This being said... except for Myles, our entire DLine is hitting free agency in 2022. ALL. OF. THEM.

Billings, Richardson, Jackson, Clowney, McKinley

Literally only the 3rd stringers and Myles will still be under contract.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/2022/all/cleveland-browns/

That's why I can see DT at 26 - Christian Barmore, Levi Onwuzurike, Daviyon Nixon,I also believe we could double up at DT on day 3 ... JMO

Pretty sure I "banged the table" for Nixon in that other thread. It may be a little early to grab him at #26, but I don't think he'll last until our pick in the 2nd. We could probably trade back to the early 2nd and still get him, and snag ourselves another pick in the process.

I'm going to bang the table for a CB...the best CB at #26. We are still very thin at CB.

At DE,DT & LB we have solid starters and depth...I know it's possibly just for THIS year...I get that. But it's there.

I think we still need a starting caliber CB - and better / decent depth at CB - to really make a run for THIS year.

Consider DE, DT & LB in THIS draft? Absolutely do so. The priority though should be to come out of the draft (and remaining FA) with that other starter-level guy and decent depth at CB.

I agree. Right now we have Ward, Hill, and questions. If we add a guy who can be that starter quality outside CB, then we aren't screwed if Greedy can't come back, or if anyone gets hurt.

+2. The single biggest (and easiest) way to derail this entire season is to have problems at CB. We've already seen that Ward has durability issues and Greedy is an absolute wild card at this point. Money Mitch is gone, he took more snaps at CB last year than anyone in the NFL. That role will be filled by committee, but who is the committee?

The very qualifications you state are needed to draft a WR is the proof that you don't find WR's that fit all of those qualifications are a dime a dozen.

I mean if you wish to get down to comparing numbers let's look at CB's

27 CB's were drafted in the 2020 draft

32 in the 2019 draft.

I think you get my point. We both know that quality CB's aren't a "dime a dozen".

I agree with the qualifications needed for a productive WR. I agree that you "can" find one later in the draft. But as with most positions the best are found early in the draft by a large percentage. If WR's were actually a dime a dozen teams wouldn't need to keep drafting them every year.

In the NFL the passing game is a large portion of the offense. As such you need quality contributors at every level. I agree with you that you shouldn't build your team around the WR position.

We're not as far apart on this as you may think. I just believe you somehow feel that the very qualities you state are needed in a good WR are more rare than you do.

Where is the "ANTI like" button, jmho.

In the year Two thousand and X, the Browns traded and surrendered the pick to the Atlanta falcons who used it on a WR, who went on to have a 13 year ish career, His name had a J in it.

And in all those years, I wouldn't give a dime now, for the dozen guys the Browns unsuccessfully hoped could fill that position for that one time of chosing to pass up the opportunity to get the WR,
(because he wasn't heralded so highly, on draft day)
Who was Matt Ryans #1 opton for 10 years, including their Super Bowl appearance.

So I guess, if a team is ok to lose because of Bad Wr's for a dozen years who aren't worth a dime,
and watch Matt Ryan throw to the guy who could have been on the Browns.

Your largest number is 17, in 96 overall picks for rounds 1-3. That's only 17, that means they are hard to come by.

And more WR's wash out, than DE's . Even Solomon Scott, and what not, who weren't drafted by the Browns had productive years at DE in the past.

Now, The Elite DE is difficult, the Average DE is a dime a dozen.

Actually neither are a dime a dozen, but you can do a lot more as a team with mid level DE's than mid level Wr's.

The Browns currently have more elite DE's 2 or 3 of, 1 to 2 necessary
than elite WR's
starters, 3 are necessary, and they have 2, maybe,

You can need more WR's you can never have too many good WR's.

Other DL / DE on the Browns Roster.
Sheldon Day DT.
Cameron Malveaux- possible improver

Curtis Weaver. De, ok thoses are 3rd stringer quality

the following are Better than that, so you'll have
Myles Garret and
Joe Jackson DE and
Porter Gustin DE, and
Jordan Elliott, DT,

All of which I would consider better than that description of 3rd stringer quality.
Plus you have whomever the Browns can draft in Rounds 3-7 this year
Plus you have whomever the Browns sign all this season during the season, and all of next year's free agency, and you have next years draft picks.

That's just not to "exaggerate" the perceived need to fit an agenda that someone wants the Browns to draft more DL/DE, this year

Who won't even get to see the field probably, until next year and not be any better, because it's a rotational quality value against replacement player.

They signed Vernon, and Richardson, and now Takk McKinley, and Malik Jackson, and
Claiborne for last year, and Billings,

So, I'm saying the DL, are able to be found in the Free Agency, ( yesterday Clowney).

The Wr's, who can play, are just as hard if not Harder! to get in free agency.

And a lot of them, like in 2015-2016, were major headaches, (The Bridge car accident guy, and Josh Gordon, and the likes. )

Even if we say they Browns hit on Jarvis Landry and the huge price for OBJ, if they were hits,
what about
Duane Bess, or that guy I hate who never made a td on a drive he had a big catch,
Wr's are real hard to come by, especially, if you want one who can help you win games.

Stalworth, and Stuckey, Robiskie, or the 6th+ rounder they drafted in 2016 ish with a V in his name, that didn't make the team 2nd year,

Bad WR's are a dime a dozen, and it's harder to win with bad Wr's than it is difficult to find decent Front 7 and get what you need from them.

Now. The elite, At pass rush, No that's real hard to come by,

The point is the Browns are not in position where it helps them to draft an average to bad Front 7 Def. player, in the top 30 picks this year.

(Good news for those who hate me saying that is, I think that's what the Browns are going to do.)

And Given Andrew Berry's propensity to get players on the Browns who come, (HALF OF WHOM) come from schools you've never hear of,

Like "Weaver State" or something, that's probably what they'll do with their first round pick.

Shame this year the draft is going to be in Cleveland, and whomever they are going to pick in the first round,

Is likely going to be a no name DL or LB from some off brand school who will career wise amount to Oneil Cousins' tenure with the Browns. (Or maybe the Kaluka Maiavia, at 26 overall, version)

But go team! live and (don't learn).

J/C

Personally, I love Jaylen Waddle. Baker has a huge arm and we've never really had someone with the ability to take full advantage of it.

Waddle would compliment our QB, our running game and our strong pass blocking would help to open up the offense. Try and stack the box on Chubb when our pass blocking is excellent, Baker can throw deep with high accuracy and the chances of hanging with Waddle is pretty low.

I think he's the kind of player who is a genuine missing piece, and can make the entire offense better.

I won't ramble on but he ticks every box for me. I'm hoping he falls because seeing him projected to waste under Jared Goff or Daniel Jones, who don't have the skill set to get the most out of him, is insane. It'll just be John Ross going to Cinci all over again. Everyone wants a Tyreek Hill, but not everyone can use a Tyreek Hill. We could.

I'm hoping he drops a little further than expected - mid-to-late teens - and we could potentially move up.

There are some other names I love, but Waddle is just the guy for me. He he's a great fit, he helps save money when OBJ/Landry are due too much, and I believe in his talent.

I guess it's possible he could still be there at the Raiders pick and they already have their speed guy.

A pretty hefty move up for a WR, though. At least a 3rd this year and a good bit more.

Not sure if we would burn both our extra 3rd and 4th this year and probably a 3rd or 4th next year when we already have our #1 and #2 WR.

Sadly, (can't fix stupid),
I think the Browns are only going to give us a, less talented unproven, Sheldon Richardson replacement in the first round
after creating the hole by releasing Sheldon Richardson,

Effectively wasting their first round opportunity.


They've done it 10 times before since 1989.

Bang the drum slowly.

Get it on
Bang a gong
Get it on

Every year, there is at least one day before the draft wherein I look back fondly on some of the final years of the Browns before the move to Balt. and remember one draft

Where the Browns just about drafted DE, /today they are called Edge rushers, with every pick.
Rob Burnett, era. (it didn't turn out bad)

There is no shame in devoting one entire years draft to just that one position if it's pass rusher!

If the Ravens want Jayson Oweh at 27, (and they do), then I want Jayson Oweh for the Browns at 26!
He has the highest ceiling I believe, of all DE's and wouldn't hesitate to say he's a great pick for the pick even if #1 overall.

Sure there are 2 other offensive players I'd take but they'll be gone in the top 10,
the Browns aren't going to be able to trade up to the top 10 by this point in time so,
Fine staking the whole day 1 Thursday night on Jayson Oweh, he's going to be a fine player, and a difference maker at DE/edge for years to come.

Jayson Oweh, a team doesn't have a chance to add this to your team every day.

Another Special Athlete at Pass Rusher! Jump at the chance!

After reading Warren Sapp's butt-hurt rant on Christian Barmore, I might bang the table for him.

Seriously though
https://www.pewterreport.com/warren-sapp-alabama-christian-barmore-nfl-draft/

“I got up at 5:30 a.m. and drove to Tampa to get there by 10:30 a.m.,” Sapp said. “I threw my hat and my lovely ROKA sunglasses . . . I’ve thrown my hat and my sunglasses, and at one point I’m sitting there like, ‘Do this,’ and he’s doing something else. To the point where another person said, ‘You’re not doing that,’ and he looked at both of us like, ‘What?’ So I tried it one more time, and then when he didn’t do it that time I picked up my glasses and my visor and I walked off. I didn’t say another word to anybody. I just left.”

Sapp believes that despite Barmore’s high ranking from draft analysts, they stand alone in that evaluation while those with the responsibility of actually making the draft picks likely view him much differently.

“I guarantee you they do,” Sapp said about draft analysts ranking Barmore higher than NFL front offices. “Because what you look at as a scout is the eye test on the tape. He was in the National Championship and I thought, ‘that the kid was a baller’ myself. I couldn’t wait to get up [to Tampa to work Barmore out.]”

And while Sapp argues that he wasn’t at the facility to coach Barmore up, but simply to help him round out parts of his game, the Hall of Famer wasn’t able to get through to the young defensive tackle despite his best efforts.

“I’m not coaching you up,” Sapp said of his time with Barmore. “I’m just watching what you’re doing to see if I can shave a little corner for you because I’ve watched the position. These eyes aren’t going to lie to me four feet down.”

Cook followed up Sapp’s statement with a question, does Barmore’s issue lie in the fact that he wasn’t willing to take his directions or that he couldn’t follow the directions? Sapp responded bluntly.

“Both,” Sapp said. “If I tell you to swing your left arm and you move your right, I’ve got a real issue – and that’s just one example. Trust me. For me to throw my visor and throw my $300 glasses, I’m telling you. I’m like, ‘Is there something wrong with me?'”

While Sapp has his opinions and is rarely shy to share them, he’s been wrong about prospects before.

“I don’t see it from this kid,” Sapp said about defensive end Myles Garrett years ago before his first overall selection in 2017. “I see the splash plays, everybody gets those. Where’s the game he took over? Where? Any defensive lineman who’s the No. 1 pick, you turn it up and you say, ‘There it is!’ This kid, no, I don’t. I’m a pretty plain and frank guy and I watch the tape and he disappears. I watch the tape and he absolutely disappears.”

So whether Sapp is right or wrong on his evaluation about Barmore – and he’s even put one whole year of talking on social media on the line behind it – he’s made his opinion of Barmore crystal clear: he isn’t close to a first-round pick in his eyes.





He didn't move the way you wanted for a couple reps and you threw your glasses like a child...hahaha. How dare he swing an arm you didn't want him to swing. Poor little Sappy-poo. Aww...

I'm more likely to take Sapp's word and understanding of the situation regardless of how much I like or dislike him as an individual. Dude was exceptional in the NFL for a 3 or 4 year spell.

Who was it that used to have the catch phrase,
'

" Kick Me the next time I draft a stupid player "

"
Let some other team draft him.

Why does it seem the Browns HATE OFFENSE SO MUCH!!!

Bang!!

We waited around for you to draft all of your, your,
Delpit, and Phillips, and Greedy, and about a Dozen linebackers, and
YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR.

Act like Back end defenders are Gold, and then can't even get ones to help out,

They finally have maybe the best quarterback in the entire league, for the first time in 30 years, and what do they surround him with.



GUESS WHAT! They don't want to hear the Truth! And I don't want to hear their arguments!

(Ehh, we got the best two rb's in football,)
(Ehh, he's got super star top two wrs' from free agency)
( Ehh he's got the best OL in 27 years of Browns OL's)

I DON'T CARE, BECAUSE TO A MAN!, To Every individual one of those players on offense,
(pay attention..)

Each and every single one of them, had to wait on the Browns to screw around adding a ton of defensive players to replace more defensive players, before they finally got around,

Finally got around to having to fill a hole on the offense, .

And the team Still hasn't put offense first. And Except for Myles Garrett, what has it gotten you?

Browns.
Where Offense has to play 3rd fiddle

after defense that plays bad option one
and other defense that plays bad option two.

(Even if I'm wrong and they're right, they overdo it.)

I don't believe what I just said could be true, wait a second "me" what are you saying, hold on, lets take a look at this, ...

What about Baker he was taken #1 overall? Ya but he had to wait around until a year after the team used the #1 overall on a Pass rusher on defense, so ya, it was a 2nd move to get Baker.

https://www.dawgnation.com/football/azeez-ojulari-nfl-kirby-smart

Azeez Ojulari DE, UGA.

He is not getting enough Love around DTMB, may be even worth trading up a couple spots for.

If the Browns have to go Defense, at least they could improve the pass rushers.

Browns have needs everywhere, one just has to be creative in looking for them.

I feel like there is a growing tendency around here to overdraft DE/EDGE out of a feeling of need to get someone at the position.

ANY and EVERY draft eval has to begin with grades on the players as they pertain to what we are doing... if you have two players graded the same, but one doesn't do well with what we're doing, then you skip him. Given that, I think that a LOT of these DE's, like most of them, simply don't belong in CLE, and definitely not as a 1st round selection.

As for drafting offense... yes, we hate offense so much that we built it first.

I think we can get an Edge with good qualities, and questions, in the 2nd or 3 rounds.

I think we'll go either DB or ..... WR in the 1st.

Ithink DB or DT. Maybe edge.

Caleb Farley
Greg Newsome
Assante Samuel
Tyson Campbell

JOK ---> Raiders
Jamin Davis???

We need only look back to previous years, we've seen this in the past, the ole' Wait and get a great guy in the 2nd-3rd round line of thinking.

Turn around and when your pick comes up, all of them are gone, and now you are stuck trying to over hype 4th and 5th round guys when you got zilch but a reach
so far of the guys you picked in the first.

Reach for Db's chase your tail, like the 2005 draft.

One more Corner, just one more cornerback.