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willit & mac,



I don't like the play, wet or dry. The fact it worked once doesn't negate that. Calling this particular play in the rain is stupid, IMO. There are much higher percentage plays that could have been called, and that is the perennial problem here. We have the talent to make basic plays work, yet Freddie spends so much time on cutesy gadget plays the team keeps shooting itself in the foot. Put the second-year QB and the rest of the team in a better position to win by calling plays that protect the ball, gets the ball out of the QBs hand quickly, and gets the ball into the hands of the playmakers efficiently and most of the team's problems will in all likelihood fade away. The fact there was a turnover on that play, regardless of what caused the turnovers, makes it a stupid call by its very nature.

Right now, IMO, Baker should be concerned with handing the ball off, making quick, short passes to his playmakers, and going deep occasionally to keep the D honest. That's it. Period. Nothing more. He's a second-year QB on a team that has absolutely no chemistry. So use the KISS method. Keep it simple, stupid. The penalties and turnovers are killing us. How much of that gets diminished if they go back to basics? I'd say most of it. JMHO

According to your description, one should never run a pass play in the rain.

Statistics show the shorter the pass the higher the success rate. A shovel pass is the shortest pass there is.

Kitchens calling "cutesy" trick plays was something that irked me even last year when we were doing well. I don't mind having the plays now and then, but it's probably something that should be run once every three games or so, not something run three times a game. They work best when the other team least expects it, and when you run those plays constantly, they start looking for it, if not have it scouted out completely.

I think that's what happened against New England. Belichick knew that if they saw Landry lined up in the slot close to the line that the misdirection play was a high possibility. I get the feeling the DE was coached to crash hard through when he saw that look, and the turnover was the result.

Yeah, how'd that work out?

So you keep harping on "the one time" it didn't work out while ignoring all the times it did work out. That doesn't make sense.

Yeah, I don't mind the occasional gadget play, trick play, or surprise play. But IMHO, you save those for when a team least expects them, and you call them when your team has built a solid foundation of trust and execution. We're not even close to being there yet, and the team isn't getting the time it needs on the field to get there because they are so busy running stupid plays and causing turnovers and penalties. Again, use the KISS method.

Yes, name all those times it worked out. Then tell me how many times it worked in the rain. Tell me how this has become a staple of this offense, and how they lean on it to gain needed yards. Show me those examples and I'll bow to your expertise. I know you get my point, so stop $#!% stirring just for the sake of it.

No, I don't get your point. I will say again, according to that logic, no team should ever pass the ball in the rain. A wet ball is the same no matter who or where you pass it to.

Word. If you are going to argue a shovel pass is bad in the rain, you're really saying everything but a direct hand-off is bad. Furthermore, what did the rain have to do with a defender knifing through the line?

I'll repeat, I don't like the play wet or dry. I never said no team should ever pass in the rain, but you go on and babble about whatever it is you want to babble about.

Tony had a point. They wasted a lot of time on that drive. I see Baker's frustration coming from not having any success and he's starting to feel the heat of losing. I really wish they would get back to basics. Maybe a win Sunday helps get them calmed down and back into a better space. But they clearly need a win here.

Bad look for Baker. Something else for the media to beat him up on. Baker continues to be Baker's own worst enemy.

He woke up feeling sensative.

We have ran that play multiple times, all of which have worked. Remember the play where Baker flipped the ball to himself last year and throw a TD, that was this formation, just a wrinkle of the play. We run this play multiple times, but put a wrinkle to it. Last time we ran it, landry was going the other way and scored a TD. I recall hearing on CBD that we average 18.1 yards when we have run this formation/play.

That's the puzzling part in all of this to me. It was clearly a mix up in the blocking assignment along the OL. Someone was supposed to pull over there and block the unblocked rusher.

The weather had nothing to do with that missed blocking assignment that blew the play up.

IMO people are just frustrated and looking for things to blame. But what went wrong on that play was quite obvious and claiming that someone won't go along with something that makes no sense just to stir up trouble is overlooking the obvious here.

If you wish to talk about babbling, you're trying to blame running a short pass play in wet weather on a blown blocking assignment. That's babbling.

He should not have walked off like that, but lets be honest, that was a pretty dumb arse question "where you happy with the drive"? TG is a tool.

I guess BB and Brady are dumb for throwing that 33 yarder in in the game? Or throwing that screen pass for 50+..cause you know, passing in the rain.....

I LOVE THIS!

Browns win 49-10.

j/c...

Thanks for the stats. I know the play has worked, and there may be times to use it. But I don't like it as a play call specifically because it hangs the ball out there in a very small space. Most pass plays are (hopefully) thrown to an open man. In this case, the receiver clearly wasn't open, and the QB had no time to decipher that. Hence the turnover. It was a great play/read by the defender. And again, me personally, I would have liked to see some other call. Handoff. Slant. Out. Screen. Anything.

I wish I knew what he meant specifically by "back to basics" but I like the notion.

We'll see what happens on Sunday. This team would probably do very well running some type of smashmouth football game plan. Baker would probably do well with a quick passing game with occasional deep balls. I want to see them play to their strengths without all the nonsense. We know penalties will happen and we know turnovers will happen, but if they can develop a rhythm and run simple plays, with the playmakers they have, the offense should do very well.

Why would he have ever gone away from it? Good grief.

Welp, never a good thing to walk out (or "storm out" if you want to be dramatic), but I get it... That was about the dumbest question you could ask. It's not even a question, it's a veiled attempt to get a negative emotional response, and it worked.

Kudos to Tony for "being Tony", we would expect nothing less. Kudos to Baker for the response on Twitter. Couldn't have said it better.

Jc

So our QB only plays well when he has to fake an imaginary chip on his shoulder?

.

The fine print in the image on the right is CLASSIC.

Reporters ask dumb questions all the time. If that were a legitimate excuse, every player would walk out of these interviews every time.

I agree with Memphis....



Except it's sensitive.

Methinks somebody had a stern talking to.

But do they ask the dumbest questions all the time, after interrupting the previous answer twice?

I do like the "woke up feeling sensitive" response though.

It was....It's gone now.

I replied with the information I did because you specifically said to pitt "its worked once". It has worked multiple times before. That was just an incorrect statement on your part.

I am going to address other points of you last post, and I don't want you to take these as snide, but I think its important to point out, because I believe you and others are completing missing the point.

Any pitch play or screen puts the ball in a very small place. Any hand off as well. So that kind defeats your argument here. Also, Jarvis is a WR, coming in motion behind the line, he should be wide open, when normally he is not going to be running a route. Also, in the NFL, WR are typically not open. There is a saying, if you draw single coverage, your open. Unless its 3-10 and your a NE RB, guys don't get open. Guys may get a little bit of separation, but that's about usually it.

I am sorry, you are way off here. 1. The entire premise of the play is for the QB to lead the defense with his eyes. So Baker is not even LOOKING the way of Landry. The play is designed for baker to get the snap, look right (away from Landry) immediately and shovel the ball to landry coming from left to right in front of baker. There is nothing to "decipher" from Baker. Its a bang bang play, with 0 thought process or thinking. He floats the ball knowing his receiver will be there to grab it. Its been done 1000X I am sure since last year and in TC. The only reason the play didn't work, was because someone on the OL didn't block the DL. The RAIN had absolutely 0 to do with the play. Nothing. This was all on whoever was supposed to block Guy.

You keep saying its a stupid play call in the rain. Do you realize a slant or screen, or out is more a risk in the rain that this play? Whats harder to do, pop the ball 2 feet in the air in front of you, or throw a dart on a slant with a wet ball? or throw a screen about 10 yards to your right with a wet ball? The RB (who I guarantee you has worse hands than JARVIS) has to catch, secure, and then run with the ball in the rain. A RB that had already fumbled, I believe twice.
Much more room for error as you are putting more force on the ball for a misthrow than lobbying it up like he did. So that makes no sense when you think about it.

Some are blaming Baker, that's just plain nonsense. Some are blaming the rain, that's just as much nonsense. Some are blaming the call, that's nonsense.

The only thing that failed here, was successful blocking by the OL. Plain. And. Simple.

That's a well thought out response. I still don't like the play. I didn't like the call. We'll never know if another play would have worked better. I'm not "blaming" anyone. Including Freddie. I wish he hadn't called it. I wish he'd concentrate on getting his team in sync. But I know it's part of his offense, and I know it was a great play/read by the defender. But I Don't. Like. The. Call.

Dorsey's now making Freddie run laps every time the team has a mental lapse.