It's this time of the year again....as some of you might know I will participate again as the Browns-mock-GM in a month long mock-draft with 31 other GMs or FOs, mostly diehards of their teams like me...this is NOT a dawgtalkers-mock, it's on another board and it will run from tonight up until right before the draft, going through all 7 rounds. I've participated in this fun contest picking for the Browns since 2005 or 06 I think. If anyone wants me to post my mocks (or entire mocks) of past year's, I will, but this thread is about this upcoming 2013 draft
I run this thread on here as sort of a draft room to collect as many respected opinions on prospects, trades/offers and ultimately picks...so I'm looking for "scouts" and I know that many on here know their stuff, so I'd appreciate any input, criticism etc.
The Browns pick will be on the clock sometime tomorrow evening or sunday morning. I will most probably try to trade down some if I get a good offer, but this draft is very unpredictable in the top 10 and usually it's harder to trade down in this mock than in the real draft, so I'll have to see who goes off the board in the top 5 first and I might be forced to pick at 6
That said, I'd like to hear your opinions, plans and top 10 lists
I believe your only hope for a trade-down scenario is if one of the following two or three players are still on the board at #6: Joekel-Fisher-Smith. I don't expect that any other player offers sufficient potential for a trade-up. If we have not addressed our CB situation by the draft, then Milliner must be the (obvious) choice. ( I know, your favorite subject!).
I actually think I have a better shot at a trade down if both Fisher and Joeckel are gone, because there are several OT needy teams right behind my pick looking to land Johnson...Cards at 7, Chargers at 11 and Phins at 12. Dolphins certainly have the ammo to move up
My hope is to get the Cards and Dolphins into a bidding and depending on what's left, I'd chose what offer to take. The Dolphins would have to pay a 2nd and some 3rd day pick or both of their 3rd rounders, the Cards would have to pay their 4th for one spot
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.... if both Fisher and Joeckel are gone
They certainly could be gone by #6. Outside of the Raiders, all teams in front of us need an OLT. You're right, slim pickings except for LJ...
I know that you don't like Jarvis Jones, but if either he or Milliner are there, that's the guy I take if I'm in charge.
Jones is a prototypical Steelers OLB, (and thus a Browns OLB, since that's the defense we're going to run) and Milliner would set up the corners nicely. If both are gone, I would try to trade down, I am not as hot on Ansah as you and some others are. He's good in the run game, but I just don't see the elite pass rush ability that I see in Jones. Ansah is more of a long term project, and we need players who can help from day 1. That being said, I do look at Ansah as a guy who might fit inside at OLB in our scheme because he does have solid quickness to go along with great size. I suppose that's something for me to think about regarding the player.
Good thought, I often thought that many tweener OLB/DE would look good at ILB. That said, Ansah is so athletic that he can line up virtually everywhere on the front 7....in some ways his rawness is working for him as he's not yet molded into a specific position. I can't even imagine what a coach like Horton will be able to do with this rough diamond, but I'm sure he likes him as much as I do
Btw, I PMed the 49ers GM if he could imagine a blockbuster deal to move up to 6. Not sure I want to trade back as deep as 31, but gotta start the chatter about that possibility now. One of our rules for this mock is that we can't trade future picks or players on the roster, as this would lead to reckless trading...but the 9ers have so many good picks, that it can be done just with this draft's picks
What would you do if he wants to move up? Rather stay at 6 or have 31+34+61+93 (+ maybe some late rounders too)? I have to say I would be tempted to do it, would give me a lot of flexibility to move around and get the guys I want
Hmm...
Milliner vs
Poyer + Cyprien + Kelce + Ellington
Woods + J. Taylor + Swearinger + Gragg
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stay at 6 or have 31+34+61+93
That would be an awfully nice haul, but on par value-wise (when using an exponential decay model) with what we gave up to move from 21 to 27 in 2011. Also similar to the value the Cowboys gave up to go from 14 to 6 last year.
Conner Barwin should be our pick... 
Seriously:
first choice: Ansah
second choice: Millner
We can be assured that 2 OTs should go ahead of us as well as One DT.
Leaving 2 picks...unfortunately both those picks could be that 1st n 2nd choice...then what?
Star DT/DE for us ? Jordan who I don't like but so many who know football like. Geno Smith...hoping he goes before us dropping our 1st or 2nd
Datone Jones or Richardson as DE - we just signed Bryant would that be over kill? Also who picks 3/4 DE in top 10?
Good luck 
do us well!
no OG in the top10. ever. please.stop.it.
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Hmm...
Milliner vs
Poyer + Cyprien + Kelce + Ellington
Woods + J. Taylor + Swearinger + Gragg
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stay at 6 or have 31+34+61+93
.
It is a risk and it's all about risk/reward. With Milliner on the board I would trade a 80% winning lottery ticket into two 50%, another 40% and a 30% ticket...anyone has the math on this? 
Here's an idea though...post your opinions of odds with regards to risk/reward, boom/bust, ceiling/floor...whatever you wanna name it, to your top targets. Here's my try:
Milliner: 80/20...explanation: 80% a good player, 20% not good (that does include AVG and less/bust, I give him a 10% bust/below AVG chance, 10% just AVG)
Ansah: 65/35...of those 35, only 15 bust chance (that will get the discussion going, lol). He has a high floor because of his mix of motor+play against the run+tackling/physicality....I really think his floor is that of Manny Lawson
Moore: 60/40...20 bust chance (that's low for any front 7 player)....he reminds me of Cam Jordan/Kruger...might take 1 or 2 years in the league to get going but considering his age (just 20yo) and a 5 year rook contract, that shouldn't be a big concern
Rhodes: 60/40...25 bust chance...size/speed is there and most of his weaknesses are correctable. Only question is his attitude. Perfect fit for our scheme, better than the other CBs
G Cooper: 85/15...only 5-10 bust chance. He's the real Warmack of this class. Versatile, can play all 3 interior positions. Safest bet there is imho
CB Banks: 65/35...20 bust chance. Really like him. He has upside left and can be moved to FS if his speed becomes a problem down the road
I'm glad you picked up what I meant, and not what I typed.
Geesh ... inside at OLB.
Obviously, as you picked up, I meant inside at ILB.
Me personally, I would target Rhodes. If I can trade down with SD or Miami and still get him woo hoo if not I like him enough to take him at 6 even over Millner.
Would love a 2nd where I could take a FS Reed, Rambo or maybe even the Honey Badger lol.
I do like Landry Jones in the 3rd. Love his skill set for this offense and for the Cleveland Weather.
4th Florida TE Jordan Reed would be a good option, maybe even come back with another corner, may not make it out of the 3rd but he is probably my favorite TE in this class.
A sleeper corner I am really high on is UConn's Blidi Wreh-Wilson I think he could end up the steal of this draft, unless his stock is going up and I havent noticed lol.
Then you still need to draft a kicker, punter FB lol I like taking those positions in the 5th and beyond because of value. The FB from Harvard looked like the real deal at the senior bowl.
The punter from Louisiana Tech has a great leg, he can boom it. Ryan Allen. Most boards has him as like the 3rd or 4th punter and he has been the best in college the last 2 or 3 years. No idea what some of these guys are thinking. BTW I dont follow punters but ESPNU had a bunch of Louisiana tech games the last couple of years and those 65 yarders tend to be remembered.
Kicker blah dont know if there is anyone worth drafting. Anyway with this draft when in doubt take defensive back. Might slip in a guard if someone falls. Would love Paul Warford but he will go to early.
Specifically...
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A sleeper corner I am really high on is UConn's Blidi Wreh-Wilson I think he could end up the steal of this draft, unless his stock is going up and I havent noticed lol.
Mayock has him as the 4th-best corner in the draft. I believe it was McShay who has him going in the first round.
As a whole, 
Last time I checked he was listed as a 6th rounder on CBS. So much for sleeper now lol but yea I liked him better than a ton of guys listed ahead of him.
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Me personally, I would target Rhodes. If I can trade down with SD or Miami and still get him woo hoo if not I like him enough to take him at 6 even over Millner.
I would agree with this. Though it would take some guts to pick RHodes if Milliner is still on the board. Lombardi would get crucified if he did this.
I was thinking more Everette Brown.
First picks are in, here they are:
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
49ers are not interested in trading up to no6, they're eyeing the mid 1st apparently
If I can't trade down, I'll grab one of Milliner or Ansah...if they both go next and I can't trade down, I'll probably go with Rhodes...
Eagles picked OT Fisher...perfect so far
That does secure me at least one of Milliner or Ansah and probably both Geno and Johnson to shop my pick
Django: Good stuff; please keep us updated! Ansah...no.
Lions picked Milliner....so it's down to Ansah or trade down if an offer comes
trade down please
Trade down if you can. Else, Warmack or Cooper?
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trade down please
Sell Geno...Jets?
Rhodes...
I got no offer and picked Ansah....and yeah, I can't believe I got no offer. I pretty much flipped the bird to the Dolphins GM for being an idiot...he will lose out on the last LT (in fact he did as the Cards just picked Johnson) and most probably won't land one of the best 4-3 DEs (Ansah to me and Werner is left, but he will be gone by pick 12), while sitting on 5 top 100 picks...I tried to make the Cards GM bite, by saying I had an offer from the Phins but he called my bluff. In the real draft Lombardi and Banner probably won't have time to even field all the calls if this were how the top5 shake out
Ansah is a luxury pick with Kruger and Bryant signed, but I was told the same last year when I mocked Claiborne for us...and which team needs a CB now? You never know, maybe Sheard doesn't pan out, maybe Bryant or Kruger (or both) don't hold up to their hype or slack it after their big contract, maybe Taylor/Rubin don't work out in Horton's scheme and maybe simply one of them gets hurt...at least one of the above is very probable to happen, so Ansah will see time behind all those names. He's the definition of hybrid and has to be Horton's fav looking at the film
But who knows, maybe it'll turn out that he is really 28yo or that he has a medical condition, but since I have no access to that kind of stuff and based of what I've seen, he's worth the 6th overall in an otherwise very unstable Top 10 filled with question mark prospects.....might as well draft the question mark guy with the highest ceiling.
Floor = Manny Lawson
Ceiling = JJ Watt/JPP/Ware
I'd happily settle for a Kruger/Barwin type....
Hate away
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE/OLB, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
Now it'll get really interesting to see what the Bills and Jets will do...one of them should take Geno I guess...I expect the Bills to go Geno, Jets are a wildcard since they need everything, could go OG if they wanna play it safe or Jones or Vaccaro or Patterson or even Rhodes...trade down makes the ost sense for them. I expect the Titans to nab Werner if the Bills don't
My plan now is wait and see of course...if a player I really like (like Banks, Eifert or Q.Patton) falls into the mid 2nd I will trade my entire draft away and call it a mock draft. Otherwise I will monitor the TE, FS and CB boards as long as we don't sign any starter FA there and maybe try to trade down from 68 to get a couple of extra 3rd day lottery tickets
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...Now it'll get really interesting to see what the Bills
The Bills could go a few ways if drafting for need...QB, WR, LB. I don't think they go Smith here, maybe Nassib in the 2nd, but at some early point, they must take a QB...I think they go Jones, LB.
I haven't heard that before 
- Patrick Swazee in ROADHOUSE
Just for the record in February of 2013 I was Pimping Warmack...
Just for the record in April of 2009 I was pimping Orakpo for our Pick.
I know you were just 
all is good
Django...believe it or not - We think alike more than we disagree.
Ansah 
Nice! I could only Wish
If we were to draft Ansah, for the first time I would be in favor of trading DQ. Kruger and Sheard on the edge with Robertson and Ansah in the middle would really take advantage of everyone's best skills. Plus it gives us weapons that can rush the interior.
Bills at 8 just picked OLB J.Jones
Mourg, while I think Ansah could handle ILB too, it's a big leap of faith to go into the season with him and Robertson as starters...2 young players who never played 34 ILB before....otoh, DQ's value is probably at its highest point right now considering his age and shown performance....we all expect him to look a little worse in 2013 and he'll be a year older next offseason and his contract will look worse, so we could go from a 2nd/3rd round value to next to no value 12 months from now....I'd hate to see DQ go like this, but if we sign Dansby or B.Jones, it would make some sense.....then again, he's one of the leaders of this locker room and I think for that reason alone they can't trade him now, value be damned
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If we were to draft Ansah, for the first time I would be in favor of trading DQ. Kruger and Sheard on the edge with Robertson and Ansah in the middle would really take advantage of everyone's best skills. Plus it gives us weapons that can rush the interior.
There will come a day that DQ will go, but right now, I think we need him..
I would have reached out to the Chargers GM before the Dolphins. Dolphins have Martin who they had at RT and moved to LT last year when Long was out and the word is he played well. Would have thought the Chargers would have wanted to move up to get Johnson before the Cards who were either taking Geno or Johnson IMHO. Could have dropped to 11 and still might have gotten Ansah or Jones or Cooper or Rhodes with a 2nd to boot. Having said that, I like Ansah and his potential to be a difference maker, not as a ILB as some poster suggested but as at OLB or DE.
Ansah in the middle seriously makes no sense whatsoever.
While I am not high on Ansah I am intrigued by his versatility. I saw him play DE, LB and NT at BYU. I would love to see what Horton could do with him. Think about this: We play a "3-3". Then take Ansah and play him at DE one play, ILB next to DQ on another (I think he could play ILb. I wouldn't do it full time because I think he would be better on the outside but he could play ILb), OLB after that ... Rush him, drop him into coverage, stunt with him ...
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Ansah in the middle seriously makes no sense whatsoever.
Yup.
Not sure why people think he can play ILB. He's clearly built to be a pass rusher.
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If we were to draft Ansah, for the first time I would be in favor of trading DQ. Kruger and Sheard on the edge with Robertson and Ansah in the middle would really take advantage of everyone's best skills. Plus it gives us weapons that can rush the interior.
There will come a day that DQ will go, but right now, I think we need him..
Agreed. This year he is safe but would be interested to see what happens in 2014. The cap hit goes up a few million dollars with a bunch of the guaranteed money already paid out to him.
Chargers GM wants to trade down from 11 and said he has too many needs to burn a 2nd for a LT...I can understand that, but I really don't get the Dolphins GM thought process....his biggest needs are OT, 43 DE and CB...best CB is gone and there are numerous in the next tier he can get in the 2nd or 3rd, but there's only 1 elite LT prospect left and the 2 top 43 DEs in Ansah and Werner...and he gambles that one of them drops to him?
Meanwhile, it looks like exactly THAT will happen and he'll get Werner most probably, if he wants him....the Jets pulled a shocker by selecting Barkley as the 1st QB and the Titans nabbed DT Star
1st trade of the mockdraft: Chargers trade the 11th pick to the Bucs for 13+111+126 (two 4ths)...TB selects CB Rhodes
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE/OLB, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Buccaneers (from Chargers) - Xavier Rhodes, CB, FSU
Great trade for the Chargers.
Maybe he'll take Armstead.
Jet GM obviously a Pat fan...lol 
please, don't ever apply for a job in the browns fo. unless it is for the floor sweeper on the night shift.
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please, don't ever apply for a job in the browns fo. unless it is for the floor sweeper on the night shift.
Dick, why don't you go back to polishing your bowling ball and leave the posting to someone with something useful to say.
DJ, I would rather have taken Rhodes then Ansah. I think Ansah can be a good player but i see Rhodes as just as good and at currently more of a need.
We'll see on Ansah. Huge boom or bust pick. Given his lack of overall football experience and lack of production against good competition, I think there is a tremendous amount of risk in him. If we take him in the real draft, we'll either look like geniuses or complete idiots. Given our history, I wouldn't like our chances at the former.
I hope Milliner falls to us, but this is exactly the dilemma we may face. Ugh.
Interesting pick by the Jets. Is that GM new here??
Yes, in terms of short term need Rhodes over Ansah, but 1) Jimmy himself said that "we wont go 13-3" in 2013, 2) you'll never know how Sheard, Taylor, Kruger or Bryant will look like in Horton's scheme...three of them never played in a 3-4 and Kruger can bust too, who knows (very unlikely though...I'm fearing more Bryant) and 3) this draft is deep enough at CB to find a starting caliber CB in rounds 3 or 4, not so much at DE/OLB
The question now is: how far will Geno fall? If the Chargers don't wanted him at 11 I doubt they'll pick him at 13 (though might have been a calculated risk with Bucs and Dolphins having a young QB)....Steelers at 17? doubt it...Vikings at 23or25? Whatever QB doesn't go in the top 13, will drop to the 2nd...those teams with late 1st round picks are already bumping their fists as they can probably trade down if they want extra picks
I disagree that he has much bust potential. I think he's one of the safest picks in the top 10 because of his style of play...and he's pretty much the best run defender of all front 7 DE or OLB. I get that the boom/bust thoughts pop up quickly because of his inexperience (his "lack of production" is simply unfair since he played as a NT or 34 DE...in fact his stats are impressively good for 9 startes at those positions) but if you watched him play (saw almost every 2012 snap of him), you see a player with a high floor and that was very surprising to me too as I never expected to see that...at worst I see a Manny Lawson career, who's been an AVG starter for 7 years now and just got another multi year deal this offseason
Jones, Jordan, Werner and even Moore have a higher bust chance imho...of all those he has the highest ceiling and floor, that's why it was a rather easy pick for me
I could be wrong, we will see
from cbs:
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1765317/ezekiel-ansahTaking full advantage of Ansah's ability to create mismatches, the BYU staff moved him all over the field in 2012, lining up as an stand-up rush linebacker (left, right and middle), a classic defensive end (left, right) and even as a nose guard, at times.
A creative NFL defensive coordinator will likely find Ansah's versatility, size and power similarly useful.
I think we have that in Horton...
I wonder why you see Bryant as a potential bust? He has been a very effective in the 4-3 at DT, and he looks like the perfect example of the guy who goes from 4-3 DT to 3-4 DE. Plus, he's going to be expected to attack the pocket. as opposed to just holding up the OL, so I think that he's going to do very well for us.
He's also had 9 sacks over the past 2 years as a 4-3 DT. He had 4 last year, and as far as I can tell, that was tops on the Raiders' DL. Oakland only had 25 sacks as a team overall last year. He didn't have much help around him.
What do you see that suggests he could bust?
First off, I liked the signing, although I think we bought very high on him, so that contract alone makes him a boom or bust....Bryant makes more than Rubin, so he better produce at that level at least to be worth it....that'll be hard enough
My 2nd concern is the transition to the new scheme...sure, he should transition well, but there's always a learning curve of "how" to play what Horton wants from him (responsibilities, technique etc)...I'm sure Horton envisions him as the Browns version of Calais Campbell and hope he's right
Last concern is his character....there's always risk giving a player millions of dollars after the incident he had. A smart guy (though he's from Harvard) would not have put himself in that kind of situation right before he's bound to make millions...well, we still paid him, so who knows if he has "learned" or goes out partying? We re-signed and gave millions to DQ and Rubin and we've never heard a peep from them off the field, be it pre or post contract and it hasn't affected their play, their 100% Professionals....and I just don't have that trust level with Bryant.
What I DO like about both Kruger and Bryant is that they are (or have been at least) all out, 100% motor and hustle players ON the field....so they meet the basic requirement for any front 7 player I want on the Browns...and both have upside left...it's up to them and our coaches to get there. Looking at the contracts, we bet that they'll get there...that's a projection, not a sure thing...that also explains why I am so disappointed we didn't pursue or at least up the price on Dumervil, as he's already who we hope both Kruger and Bryant (and Sheard) to be
This isn't in reply to anyone in particular.
I hated this signing because the Browns already have Winn and Hughes. Being Hughes was a third-rounder last year, I think he should already be making major contributions. In other words, I think this was an unnecessary signing for the Browns because they already had who I think are capable guys.
BUT, Bryant is a good player. I'm pretty confident he won't bust here. This defensive line is going to be really good with a great DC like Horton.
I can't look at the guys we got and downgrade them because we didn't go after someone else ... and that almost seems like what you are doing.
Plus, we have no idea whether or not we might have made a call to Dumervil and got a "thanks but no thanks" reply. There are reports that he is headed to Baltimore because he knows their LB coach well, and has a world of respect for him, and wants to play for him. (Martindale)
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I can't look at the guys we got and downgrade them because we didn't go after someone else ... and that almost seems like what you are doing.
Of course ! Do the Browns play and sign players in a vacuum? No, they are one of 32 teams trying to improve...and if you improve 10% but one of your biggets rival improved 20%, than you've actually lost ground....while still believing you've improved. It's all about how much MORE you improved than your competitors
That's actually one of the most common logical mistakes around here (and most team forums): to think that as long as your team "improves" you'll be fine. Nah, because reality is that almost all 32 teams look at themselves AFTER the offseason and say "we've improved"
With that said: would you rather have Owens and K.Davis or Dumervil? I'll leave off Barnidge, but when we signed those 2 depth guys Dumervil was either already on the market or a sure bet to be...we "invested" at least 3-4 mil of cap on those 2 players for 2013...Dumervil will count 2.5mil against the cap for 2013. Did you read that? 2.5mil...are you going to tell me we could not have found a way to add him because we liked the value of Owens and Kellen Davis better? Oh, I already hear you say that we can't mess up next year's cap...well, the Ravens are in a much tougher spot and still got it done, didn't they?
Instead of buying high on "projection" (although very good and probable to succeed ones), we should also look into buying low on actual production
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Plus, we have no idea whether or not we might have made a call to Dumervil and got a "thanks but no thanks" reply. There are reports that he is headed to Baltimore because he knows their LB coach well, and has a world of respect for him, and wants to play for him. (Martindale)
We also don't know if Banner tried to date Marilyn Monroe but settled for his neighbourhood girl or if aliens make us think, speak and act....that's not a very strong argument....my point is: there's NEVER a "thanks but no thanks" reply if you offer 1-2 mil a season more (that's 5-10mil more over 5 years)...you either get a "yes" from him for the price of Kruger and can start to look for trade partners for Sheard OR you force the Ravens to pay Kruger money at least....I prefer BOTH scenarios to what actually happened. It's nice to have a "plan" but you have to move when an opportunity presents itself....that's what Ozzie did...his "plan" was not to pay Kruger the money he got, because he couldn't afford it, so Kruger walked....but once he got a chance to make up for it, he MOVED instead of having LESS resources than us.....so, if our FO was "smart" for not going (or offering more) for Dumervil, was Ozzie stupid for doing so? There's no win-win here....
I"m kinda surprised that Barkley went and Gino Smith hasn't yet
My point is that Dumervil wasn't even on the market when they signed Bryant and Kruger. (and Groves, for that matter)
I can't look at this situation and say "Gee, we should have waited and signed Dumervil instead" ..... because he wasn't an option at the time. No one knew that he was going to be an option.
While the Browns do have cap space now, what happens if they sign yet another high dollar piece to the LB corps? I am quite certain that they have a budget for each unit that they have to stay within in order not to bust the overall budget. We already have DQ signed to a 5 year, $42 million deal, along with Kruger at 5 years, $41 million. Do we then also add Dumervil at 5 years, $35 million? How much do they allocate to the LB corps? If Sheard works out, then we'll have to resign him after 2014 as well.
Contracts have to fit the overall budget, and I would be willing to bet that a $35 million deal for another LB just did not fit. I would guess that if we sign Butler, it will be to a lesser deal than that.
Dolphins pulled a surprise at 12th overall by selectin WR Austin
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Dolphins pulled a surprise at 12th overall by selectin WR Austin
apparently, he is a fan of the former Ginn Jr. at #9 overall pick and wanted to do it all over again.
Perhaps they're being cautious, money-wise, to leave room for the Falcon CB?
Just guessing...
Would we still be able to sign both if Elvis was still available?
Drafting Tavon AFTER signing Wallace makes no sense...
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Drafting Tavon AFTER signing Wallace makes no sense...
Tavon would most likely be there slot WR. Wallace and Hartline on the ends and Tavon would fit in perfectly in the slot.
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Perhaps they're being cautious, money-wise, to leave room for the Falcon CB?
Just guessing...
Would we still be able to sign both if Elvis was still available?
Yes, this year we would have been fine as far as adding a pair of high dollar contracts.
However, a few years down the road, when we want to resign some of our own free agents, we might be out of money. (cap room)
The way the Browns seem to be managing the cap, they are being careful in structuring the contracts of premium free agents to prevent cap "explosions". (Like the one the Dolphins will have in 2014 .... IIRC .... when they will be hit with a cap number of somewhere around $14-$15 million for Mike Wallace) The Browns are looking at plugging holes, but doing so with players who can do something they need, but who are signed to small, short term deals. I would assume that a player might be offered an extension if they do well for the team ... maybe even in the current year.
Regardless, the Browns can carry forward cap room, if they wish. If we have extra cap room this season of, maybe, $20 million after the league year ends. We would then have next year's cap plus that carryover amount. We could use that for other free agents, or to resign our own players, if we wish. The Browns don't have to go sign players just for the sake of signing them. They can continue to allow players to develop, and add players as needed, if they don't go on a spending spree, just for the sake of spending.
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if they don't go on a spending spree, just for the sake of spending.
We all agree here, but I obv disagree that throwing money at Dumervil would have been "for the sake of spending"...it would have been a good move, period. 7mil annually for a proven guy like Elvis is imho AT LEAST as good a move as 8mil/year for Kruger...no?
Update 1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OT, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Missouri
The Geno-slide has begun...who will take him now?
Once more though, in 2014, we would have Kruger making $8 million, DQ making just over that, and Dumervil making $7 million for the year.That would be $23 million out of a probable $125 - $130 million cap.
Does it make sense to tie up almost 20% of your total salary cap on 3 players who play in the same position group?
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Does it make sense to tie up almost 20% of your total salary cap on 3 players who play in the same position group?
1. Who cares? You manage a roster and we're under the cap, probably because we're MUCH cheaper somewhere else (QB). Other teams have 20% tied up at QB, so what? Also, if we would have signed Dumervil, of course he would NOT have made only 2.5mil...he would have made 7+ mil THIS season and closer to those 2.5mil somewhere in 2014/15 or a flat 5-7 like the flat 8 Kruger's gonna get over the life of his contract
2. Many don't realize it yet, but this is most probably DQ's last season as a Brown. At his age and cap hit for this scheme, he is a stop gap. So he won't ever even sniff anywhere close to 8mil next season...he either takes a pay cut or gets fired. That's why I debated elsewhere that it would make sense to do a "Dolphins" move at ILB this FA...sign Dansby and/or B.Jones and dangle DQ on draft day to 4-3 teams needing a MLB. We could fetch a mid round pick THIS offseason. His value will most probably be shot 12 months from now considering his age, cap hit and expected drop off in the 3-4
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Does it make sense to tie up almost 20% of your total salary cap on 3 players who play in the same position group?
1. Who cares? You manage a roster and we're under the cap, probably because we're MUCH cheaper somewhere else (QB). Other teams have 20% tied up at QB, so what? Also, if we would have signed Dumervil, of course he would NOT have made only 2.5mil...he would have made 7+ mil THIS season and closer to those 2.5mil somewhere in 2014/15 or a flat 5-7 like the flat 8 Kruger's gonna get over the life of his contract
2. Many don't realize it yet, but this is most probably DQ's last season as a Brown. At his age and cap hit for this scheme, he is a stop gap. So he won't ever even sniff anywhere close to 8mil next season...he either takes a pay cut or gets fired. That's why I debated elsewhere that it would make sense to do a "Dolphins" move at ILB this FA...sign Dansby and/or B.Jones and dangle DQ on draft day to 4-3 teams needing a MLB. We could fetch a mid round pick THIS offseason. His value will most probably be shot 12 months from now considering his age, cap hit and expected drop off in the 3-4
I think DQ could be around longer than this year, when he sees how much better this team is getting, he might just take a pay cut to be here when we finally get to that Super Bowl ... JMHO 
speaking of Dansby, I still want him at ILB and he should be humbled enough by now (of no interest at whatever he is asking to get) to sign a cheap deal.
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2. Many don't realize it yet, but this is most probably DQ's last season as a Brown. At his age and cap hit for this scheme, he is a stop gap.
I completely agree with this and it is unfortunate because I like him as a player and his defensive leadership. But he is not a 3-4 ILB.
I hope we're wrong and he can prove his worth in this scheme.
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Does it make sense to tie up almost 20% of your total salary cap on 3 players who play in the same position group?
1. Who cares? You manage a roster and we're under the cap, probably because we're MUCH cheaper somewhere else (QB). Other teams have 20% tied up at QB, so what? Also, if we would have signed Dumervil, of course he would NOT have made only 2.5mil...he would have made 7+ mil THIS season and closer to those 2.5mil somewhere in 2014/15 or a flat 5-7 like the flat 8 Kruger's gonna get over the life of his contract
2. Many don't realize it yet, but this is most probably DQ's last season as a Brown. At his age and cap hit for this scheme, he is a stop gap. So he won't ever even sniff anywhere close to 8mil next season...he either takes a pay cut or gets fired. That's why I debated elsewhere that it would make sense to do a "Dolphins" move at ILB this FA...sign Dansby and/or B.Jones and dangle DQ on draft day to 4-3 teams needing a MLB. We could fetch a mid round pick THIS offseason. His value will most probably be shot 12 months from now considering his age, cap hit and expected drop off in the 3-4
I think DQ could be around longer than this year, when he sees how much better this team is getting, he might just take a pay cut to be here when we finally get to that Super Bowl ... JMHO
I think he's due a $4million roster bonus in March next year- the same time many of those things are dished out. Based on how he performs in 2013 will be a good temperature check, obviously.
99.99999999% of the browns fans could pick a better player than that.
Update:
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE/OLB, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
Steeler are otc...
Maybe Dallas takes Smith as the future replacement for Romo? I don't know They are the only team left that makes even a little bit of sense.
A comment and a question ...
I'd be surprised if the Jets went with another overrated (imo) USC QB. A PR nightmare after Sanchez, you'd think.
Is Vaccaro considered a FS or a SS? I've seen him listed both ways, but a few sites list him as SS first, FS second.
Actually, I don;t know how DQ's bonuses and guarantees are structured ... but he is guaranteed $19 million, and if those guarantees haven;t been realized yet, then they would hit the cap is we cut him at some point in the future. Maybe he gets cut, and maybe he has to stay to allow for us to have more cap room than we would have by cutting him.
Maybe we could trade him, but finding a buyer for an expensive LB might be difficult.
Again, the structure of the entire team comes into play. You bring up a QB taking up 20% of his team's cap. Why does this happen? Because you win with a great QB in the NFL. A great QB is a bargain at 20% of his team's cap.That one player impacts his team more than any other single player can.
Who do you like at #6 and why.
I kind of want to see a trade down to the mid-late 1st for a 2 this year and a 2 next year, and whatever else they could get. I like that deal every year, unless there is someone really special that stands out.
I think there's more value in getting multiple players of the top 60-90.
First off, I don't want to trade him and we won't trade him since we kept him on the roster and paid a high bonus already. I was just talking about his value as a player being at its highest. He has to deliver a Daryl Washington-like season in Horton's scheme to be worth it going forward...or maybe we "re-structure" his contract, we will see.
Also, I have him as a 10.4mil guaranteed contract over 5 years, not 19mil, not sure where you have that number from? 7mil was his signing bonus, which is the cap relevant part of it all. He signed for 5 years prior to the 2012 season. So if we opt to release him after the 2013 he will be a "cap hit" of 3x1.2mil = 3.6mil. He's slated to make 6.7mil with a 4mil roster bonus (those aren't guaranteed obv if he gets cut before or re-structures) in 2014, so a release would save just over 3mil in cap for 2014. I guess his play will dictate his future as a Brown, so he should be motivated to keep that nice contract going
Meanwhile, the Giants with a rather surprising pick
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
#17 Steelers - Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
#18 Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper, G, North Carolina
#19 Giants - Cornelius "Tank" Carradine, DE, FSU
Geno falling hard, Werner is also still around...Carradine over Werner is gutsy
Cleveland Browns re-sign LB D'Qwell Jackson to multiyear deal - ESPN
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7621132/cleveland-browns-re-sign-lb-dqwell-jackson-multiyear-dealUpdated: February 27, 2012, 8:21 PM ET
ESPN.com news services
The Browns didn't disclose financial terms but a league source told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter that Jackson agreed to a five-year, $42.5 million deal that includes $19 million in guaranteed money and roster bonuses.
good
As I said the "roster bonuses" are only "guaranteed" if he is on the roster at a certain time....his signing bonus is all that matters and will cause an accelerated cap hit and his SB was 7mil. If we cut him before we guaranteed his 2013 salary, we would have been charged with a 5.6mil cap hit and would have saved next to nothing, that's why they probably kept him, but if he gets cut next season, they can save almost 3mil....we willl see
and to be perfectly clear, I love DQ and want him to remain a Brown as long as possible
Update: 2 trades Bengals give 21ovr to the Vikings and get 23+120 and Rams trade out of pick 22 for picks 36+65 from the Lions
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
#17 Steelers - Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
#18 Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper, OG, UNC
#19 Giants - Cornelius Carradine, DE, FSU
#20 Bears - Alec Ogletree, ILB, Georgia
#21 Vikings (from Bengals) – Cordarelle Patterson, WR, Tennessee
#22 Lions (from Rams from Skins) - Björn Werner, DE, FSU
man, that is a GREAT draft for the Lions. Especially if they think Reiff can go at LT.
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man, that is a GREAT draft for the Lions. Especially if they think Reiff can go at LT.
It is. He turned his three top picks 5+36+65 into arguably two Top 10 talents of this draft in Milliner and Werner, 2 MAJOR need positions....very nicely done indeed
Goes to show that this draft is all about team preference and will be all over the place. The Bengals at 23 picked Vols WR Justin Hunter
Update:
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
#17 Steelers - Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
#18 Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper, OG, UNC
#19 Giants - Cornelius Carradine, DE, FSU
#20 Bears - Alec Ogletree, ILB, Georgia
#21 Vikings (from Bengals) – Cordarelle Patterson, WR, Tennessee
#22 Lions (from Skins via Rams) - Björn Werner, DE, FSU
#23 Bengals (from Vikings) - Justin Hunter, WR, Tennessee
#24 Colts - Keenan Allen, WR, Cal
#25 Vikings (from Seahawks) - Arthur Brown, OLB, Kansas Sate
I've set my targets for pick #68 to be (in no order) CB Gratz, CB Slay, FS Swearinger, QB Manuel, QB Bray and TE Kelce....if 3/4 or more of those make it to pick 68, I'll consider a small trade down. I'll consider an uptrade if WR Patton or CB J.Taylor fall past pick 50
Thoughts?
Surprised Eifert (sp??? ND TE) hasn't been taken yet? Kid is a stud in this growing TE miss match era.
JMHO
Visionary EO, he just went at 26 to the Packers
Still no Geno, there has been some trade chatter app²rently, but nothing has happened yet
I'd be extremely upset as a Vikings fan with this draft.
The strength of this team was our DLine. We just added more DLine in free agency.
I cannot tell you how sick it would make me to invest even more this highly in DLine.
Someday, we'll actually invest in LBers.... of course, as soon as we do, we'll change schemes and render the player moot, so it doesn't much matter.
Django...why have you not traded Sheard yet??? Are you not allowed to trade players?
Because he's trying to trade Rubin first, like I told him to!
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man, that is a GREAT draft for the Lions. Especially if they think Reiff can go at LT.
Reiff is not a LT; his arms are too short if I recall...
@EO no, we can't trade players and I would not want us to trade him even if we go with pass rusher at 6
Update....Geno is gone to the....
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
#17 Steelers - Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
#18 Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper, OG, UNC
#19 Giants - Cornelius Carradine, DE, FSU
#20 Bears - Alec Ogletree, ILB, Georgia
#21 Vikings (from Bengals) – Cordarelle Patterson, WR, Tennessee
#22 Lions (from Skins via Rams) - Björn Werner, DE, FSU
#23 Bengals (from Vikings) - Justin Hunter, WR, Tennessee
#24 Colts - Keenan Allen, WR, Cal
#25 Vikings (from Seahawks) - Arthur Brown, OLB, Kansas State
#26 Packers - Tyler Eifert, TE, Notre Dame
#27 Texans - Geno Smith, QB, West Virginia
#28 Broncos – Manti Te'o, LB, Notre Dame
#29 Patriots - DeAndre Hopkins, WR, Clemson
#30 Falcons - Jonathan Banks, CB, Mississippi State
#31 49ers - Jonathan Cyprien, FS, FIU
#32 Ravens - Kevin Minter, LB, LSU
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, NT, Alabama
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man, that is a GREAT draft for the Lions. Especially if they think Reiff can go at LT.
Reiff is not a LT; his arms are too short if I recall...
Yes, I remember hearing that. I believe the measurement was 1/4" shorter than Joe Thomas', so clearly too short to play LT.
The arm length has nothing to do with it. A friend at work was telling me he thought they were moving Reiff inside to guard. That the case? Either way, I see almost no way they pass on Fisher if he's there.
Just a head's up:
The Chargers are switching to a zone-blocking scheme this offseason, and Cooper's a much better fit for it than Warmack. So I would personally switch Warmack and Cooper between the Cowboys and Chargers.
Just a suggestion.
FYI, I just pick for the Browns...the other picks are done by other armchair-GMs
Here's an update:
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
Philly traded their #35 to the Dolphins for #42+#111+#224
You forgot to put in there 38B
Gordon WR - Salt Lake City Rehab facility.
We got a steal as long as he stays clean. 
Update:
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
### Browns pick forfeit ###
#39 49ers - Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
#40 Titans - Larry Warford, OG, Kentucky
#41 Bills - EJ Manuel, QB, FSU
#42 Eagles - Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
#43 Bucs - Kawann Short, DT, Purdue
#44 Panthers - Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State
### Saints pick forfeit ###
#45 Chargers - Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
#46 Rams - Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama
#47 Cowboys – Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State
#48 Steelers - Terrance Williams, WR, Baylor
#49 Giants - Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
Wow... Moore went at #38?? That doesn't seem like a reasonable drop, does it? I don't watch much college football and, therefore, am certainly not a draftnik by any stretch of the imagination. However, I would think some team will take a pass rusher with this guy's resume some time in the 1st. No?
Update:
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
### Browns pick forfeit ###
#39 40ers - Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
#40 Titans - Larry Warford, OG, Kentucky
#41 Bills - EJ Manuel, QB, FSU
#42 Eagles - Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
#43 Bucs - Kawann Short, DT, Purdue
#44 Panthers - Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State
### Saints pick forfeit ###
#45 Chargers - Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
#46 Rams - Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama
#47 Cowboys – Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State
#48 Steelers - Terrance Williams, WR, Baylor
#49 Giants - Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
#50 Bears - Kyle Long, OG, Oregon
#51 Jets (from Skins) - Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford
#52 Vikings - Johnathan Jenkins, DT, Georgia
#53 Bengals – Giovani Bernard, RB, UNC
QB Nassib, WR Woods, WR Patton, DE Okafor still available....I'm thinking about an uptrade for QB Nassib or WR Patton, but I feel handcuffed by our FO for not going after a DB....to be put in a "drafting for need" situation at #68 is just stupid
Bummer that Okafor could still be available when you pick.
If Woods is available, you HAVE to take him, right?
I won't have to think about it as Okafor-Woods-K.Greene and now Patton went 54 to 57...
but trading up for Nassib still looks enticing, otoh I cant really go there considering our holes at CB and FS, right?
Due to mock rules the Colt-trade won't be reflected anymore btw, so I still have only 6 picks overall, not 7, so a small trade down is still a possibility too...targets include Swearinger, Gratz, Kelce, Mathieu, Wreh-Wilson, St.Bailey, L.Jones, Gragg....if I can get two of those, I'd be pretty happy
Maybe 3 - swearinger, 4 - Webster, 5 - Gragg
you should offer your 6th to SF for the move-up pick and their 7th. they might want to reflect the real selections as well.
Just some names that i don't see picked yet. How about OT Terron Armstead? He tore up the combine and i think he would look good at LG next to Joe Thomas plus he could be Joe's backup. or OG Brian Winters? or CBs David Amerson or Logan Ryan?
yeah, Amerson and Ryan should definitely be in play at 68!
I'd be surprised if Armstead makes it past Baltimore's 2nd.
I'm not very high on Ryan...didn't like what I saw, he's a reactonary zone-CB only imho and I cringed a little when I read that we worked him out. He's smart but like Poyer he's a CB/FS tweener....and not in a good way. Lacks the coverage abilty to become a good CB and lacks either size or tackling ability to be a true FS....Amerson is in the same boat just with reversed strengths/weakness as he has the size/speed/athleticism but lacks the tackling for FS and smarts for CB
I really don't want to draft either of them
Here's the update:
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
### Browns pick forfeit ###
#39 40ers - Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
#40 Titans - Larry Warford, OG, Kentucky
#41 Bills - EJ Manuel, QB, FSU
#42 Eagles - Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
#43 Bucs - Kawann Short, DT, Purdue
#44 Panthers - Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State
### Saints pick forfeit ###
#45 Chargers - Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
#46 Rams - Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama
#47 Cowboys – Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State
#48 Steelers - Terrance Williams, WR, Baylor
#49 Giants - Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
#50 Bears - Kyle Long, OG, Oregon
#51 Jets (from Skins) - Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford
#52 Vikings - Johnathan Jenkins, DT, Georgia
#53 Bengals – Giovani Bernard, RB, UNC
#54 Dolphins (from Colts) - Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
#55 Packers - Robert Woods, WR, USC
#56 Seahawks - Khaseem Greene, OLB, Rutgers
#57 Texans - Quinton Patton, WR, LT
#58 Broncos – Sam Montgomery, DE, LSU
#59 Patriots - Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon State
#60 Falcons - Cory Lemonier, DE/OLB, Auburn
#61 Redskins (from 49ers via Jets) - B.W. Webb, CB, William & Mary
I am not a Nassib fan. I probably wouldn't take him if he fell to our spot in the 3rd. I am definitely not trading up for him.
I agree with Jester on that one. If it comes down to djs vs bww I'd take djs without question. You're more likely to get a good corner in the fourth than a free safety you like. With Ryan, Amerson, Alford, Gratz, and Webster still available, you have good options for #2 corner later, but who will you take at free safety?
Huddle up folks....the Ravens took WR S.Bailey at the end of the 2nd. Chiefs took FS E.Reid and JAX went with QB Glennon...3 more picks and then it's my turn
What do you think of DJ Hayden, CB from Houston. I don't really know much about him but I have read taht he has first round talent.
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What do you think of DJ Hayden, CB from Houston. I don't really know much about him but I have read taht he has first round talent.
Haven't seen him play to be honest, but I've read pretty good reviews from tape evaluators I respect. It's all medical with him, and we don't have that kind of information, so I have no idea how much of a risk it is to pick him
Update:
Rams at #65 took C/G Frederick and Raiders at #66 took TE Escobar...Eagles pick at 67 is left
I'm trying hard to sell OT Armstead off, but no one seems interested.....the Jets at #72 are thinking about an offer though
Alford Cb SE Louisiana or Amerson Cb NCST.
I see Amerson as more of a FS
I have just agreed to a deal with the Chargers at #76, but there's some confusion now as he thought he was otc, but the Eagles haven't picked yet...I guess it is a pending trade now, if the Eagles don't pick his target I will get picks #76 + #145 + #221...an extra mid 5th and mid 7th
Eagles picked OLB J.Collins and my trade with the Chargers is official
Update:
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
### Browns pick forfeit ###
#39 40ers - Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
#40 Titans - Larry Warford, OG, Kentucky
#41 Bills - EJ Manuel, QB, FSU
#42 Eagles - Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
#43 Bucs - Kawann Short, DT, Purdue
#44 Panthers - Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State
### Saints pick forfeit ###
#45 Chargers - Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
#46 Rams - Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama
#47 Cowboys – Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State
#48 Steelers - Terrance Williams, WR, Baylor
#49 Giants - Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
#50 Bears - Kyle Long, OG, Oregon
#51 Jets (from Skins) - Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford
#52 Vikings - Johnathan Jenkins, DT, Georgia
#53 Bengals – Giovani Bernard, RB, UNC
#54 Dolphins (from Colts) - Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
#55 Packers - Robert Woods, WR, USC
#56 Seahawks - Khaseem Greene, OLB, Rutgers
#57 Texans - Quinton Patton, WR, LT
#58 Broncos – Sam Montgomery, DE, LSU
#59 Patriots - Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon State
#60 Falcons - Cory Lemonier, DE/OLB, Auburn
#61 Redskins (from 49ers via Jets) - B.W. Webb, CB, William & Mary
#62 Ravens - Stedman Bailey, WR, West Virginia
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, G/C, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
Would you trade down even further or too much risk to miss out on Swearinger?
49ers expressed late interest in pick 68...I asked for picks 93+128+157+164 but their GM could not decide. The Seahawks, Texans, Falcons, Packers along with the 9ers have also a boatload of picks left to trade and not much room on their rosters, so I'll target those teams for another deal maybe...I think if M.Ball is still around at pick 76 I could squeeze something out of the Packers at 88, maybe even their 4th (#122)
Not sexy picks...but I like Thorton OG Illinois kid will be a good OG - Long was my hope in the 3rd round but see he was taken in the 2nd. Thorton might be better??? just doesn't get the press.
TE would be a key pick...I think our guys would pick Kasa in this 3rd round. Also is McDonald still available at TE??? as a possible.
Could be a spot for QB...Wilson? Not sure who has been taken...I know Emanuel n Glennon are gone.
Personally, I'd be happy with the two picks you were gifted and take your guy. 88 is a long way away, and if you really like the player, take him. I look at it this way... if he's gone, who do you take at that position?
I agree tab, I really like Thornton at OG as well. I like Mady, too.
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Personally, I'd be happy with the two picks you were gifted and take your guy. 88 is a long way away, and if you really like the player, take him. I look at it this way... if he's gone, who do you take at that position?
Well, P.Thomas is still around, Amerson and Rambo too but I'm not as high on any of them, but I'm also not that much enamoured with Swearinger that I have to have him...at 68, or even at 76 he'd be an "ok" pick...his value is greater at the end of 3rd/top4th area. He's the best pure FS imho, but I do not consider him a can't miss prospect and I'm not sure he's a day 1 starter, although I think his game translates well and quick. If I miss out on him, guess it's back to either stop gap FA or throwing morelate rounders/UDFAs against the wall
Also, thanks to only signing/filling 2 starters in FA the Browns have many other needs that have to be addressed, so I'm in BPA for need mode, but I get your point that Swearinger is the only FS I like but there are more options for the other positions
My watch list still is Swearinger, Wreh-Wilson, Gratz, Alford, Mathieu, McFadden, Kelce, Gragg, L.Jones, Nassib...those are my main targets for the 3rd/4th. One of the picks will most probably be a CB, the other either a QB, TE or Swearinger....OT/OG Dallas Thomas is also still available and looks like yummy value grab
Nassib still there? Thought he was taken in the first as most have him hitting the First round now. I got a feeling our FO/Coaching Staff would take him if available in the 3rd. All depends in the real draft how quick Geno n Barckley get taken.
Dallas Thomas...what is his injury status??? Thorton is country Strong!
JMHO
Thanks for the comments EO
I'll add Thornton to my watch list for the last 3 rounds, haven't seen or read much on him yet. As for the TE position: not a fan of Kasa or McDonald at all. I really don't get the McDonald hype, dude didn't even run routes at freaking Rice. All he did was catch screen, I'm not kidding, go watch his tape...he's incredibly raw and a pure project. There's some talent and willingness there, but you have to start from scratch with him and I don't want to be the team that invests 3 years of development into him just to see him leave as a FA...I'd rather be the one that signs him after some other team invested valuable playing and development time in him....he's basically a less athletic and even rawer version of Jordan Cameron imho
That said, not before the 5th round on both McDonald and Kasa and there will be probably other prospects I like more in the 5th
Well, the Titans just picked Swearinger at 70th overall (Pugh to the Cards at #69), they list him as a SS
...he can play both positions though
My no1 option now is to trade further down, although Nassib is very tempting and would be a value move, but I'm not sure he fits the vertical Offense
weird, since they already signed Bernard Pollard and George Wilson, both who played Strong Safety last year.
Yeah...McDonald I threw in there only cause he was rated so high n available.
Kasa actually we have been investigating him since before the combine. His Coach at college is our new TE Coach. I think he is a target of ours.
What about that kid from Arkansas State...Jones...listed as a Safety but he might have CB prospect written all over him??? Was slated around 4th n 5th round till his Pro Day...fast 40 n 41inch Vert. Leap. Your mock there nobody probably heard of him - so late round steal...lol
Need? I'd be looking at TE n DBs of course.
Just thinking out loud.
Disappointed a bit that you did not join the Board Mock draft 
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weird, since they already signed Bernard Pollard and George Wilson, both who played Strong Safety last year.
Yeah, both are stop gaps though and maybe it was just a typo...I'll ask him when he posts his comment on the pick
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Disappointed a bit that you did not join the Board Mock draft
Thought about it, but I realized today that one of those is already pretty time consuming and have lots of other stuff to do right now, so I could not guarantee to be reliable when it was my turn to pick or talk trade etc
As for Don Jones....his measurables are nice, but the fact that he only had 1 INT and only 2 passes defended is all you need to know. Probably has the "instincts" of a brick wall. I hope Lombardi doesn't still fall for the workout guy with no tape
Update:
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, C/OG, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, DE/OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
#69 Cards - Justin Pugh, OG, Syracuse
#70 Titans - D.J. Swearinger, S, South Carolina
#71 Bills - Phillip Thomas, S, Fresno State
#72 Jets - Brian Winters, OG, Kent State
#73 Bucs - Jon Bostic, ILB, Florida
#74 Jets (from Panthers via 49ers) - Chase Thomas, OLB, Stanford
#75 Saints - David Amerson, CB, NC State
#76 Packers (from Chargers via Browns) - Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern State
I traded down again with the Packers to #88 for pick #122. I was offline and sent out some "do it or leave it" deals to several teams and both the Packers and 49ers were interested, but the Packers moved first and got the deal. The 9ers would have sent me #93+#128+#164+#237....I would have probably taken this deal over the Packers' one if I were online, but I'm still happy I got a deal and none of my remaining targets are gone...Gratz, Nassib, Wreh-Wilson, Mathieu, Kelce all still available
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, C/OG, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, DE/OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
#69 Cards - Justin Pugh, OG, Syracuse
#70 Titans - D.J. Swearinger, S, South Carolina
#71 Bills - Phillip Thomas, S, Fresno State
#72 Jets - Brian Winters, OG, Kent State
#73 Bucs - Jon Bostic, ILB, Florida
#74 Jets (from Panthers via 49ers) - Chase Thomas, OLB, Stanford
#75 Saints - David Amerson, CB, NC State
#76 Packers (from Chargers via Browns) - Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern State
#77 Dolphins - Travis Kelce, TE, Cincinnati
#78 Rams - Jordan Reed, TE, Florida
#79 Steelers - Bacarri Rambo, S, Georgia
#80 Cowboys – Sio Moore, LB, UConn
#81 Giants - Josh Evans, S, Florida
#82 Dolphins (from Bears) - Jordan Poyer, CB, Oregon State
5 picks left...hmm, CB Alford, CB Wreh-Wilson, CB Gratz, QB Nassib, OT/G D.Thomas, CB Mathieu still available....my man Shamarko Thomas and RB Ball are also still around....also available but not considering here: WR Swope, WR Dobson, QB Wilson, QB L.Jones, TE V.McDonald, QB Bray, RB Randle, RB Franklin, RB Ellington, OT Bakthiari
Huddle up and list them, scouts
I picked CB Wreh-Wilson at #88, bash away. I went back to the tape on WW, Gratz, Mathieu and L.Ryan and WW's game was the most well rounded imho and best suited for an outside-CB. He adds size to a small Browns backfield...the other 3 CBs are good prospects too and I especially liked Mathieu's tape. Gratz and Ryan were beaten too often for my liking...in fact, Gratz was burned (and looked bad) for 2 TDs vs Louy and Bridgewater, meanwhile WW was a shutdown CB that game. He ALWAYS played the ball, is not a grabby CB like so many (mostly smaller) College CBs are and he blew up a sweeping OL on a run play...impressive, but watch for yourselves:
http://www.youtube.com/v/f7ko5KCYFxAHere's an update:
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, C/OG, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, DE/OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
#69 Cards - Justin Pugh, OG, Syracuse
#70 Titans - D.J. Swearinger, S, South Carolina
#71 Bills - Phillip Thomas, S, Fresno State
#72 Jets - Brian Winters, OG, Kent State
#73 Bucs - Jon Bostic, ILB, Florida
#74 Jets (from Panthers via 49ers) - Chase Thomas, OLB, Stanford
#75 Saints - David Amerson, CB, NC State
#76 Packers (from Chargers via Browns) - Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern State
#77 Dolphins - Travis Kelce, TE, Cincinnati
#78 Rams - Jordan Reed, TE, Florida
#79 Steelers - Bacarri Rambo, S, Georgia
#80 Cowboys – Sio Moore, LB, UConn
#81 Giants - Josh Evans, S, Florida
#82 Dolphins (from Bears) - Jordan Poyer, CB, Oregon State
#83 Vikings - Robert Alford, CB, SE Louisiana
#84 Bengals – Sean Porter, LB, Texas A&M
#85 Skins - Corey Fuller, WR, VT
#86 Colts - Dallas Thomas, OG, Tennessee
#87 Seahawks - Ryan Nassib, QB, Syracuse
#88 Browns (from Packers) - Blidi Wreh-Wilson, CB, UConn
Kinda glad the Seahawks picked up Nassib (somewhat shocking, but it was a BPA "value" move the GM explained), as I was close to take him and gamble on one of the CBs to drop to me at #104.
I now have 2 picks each in rounds 4, 5 and 6 and one in round 7 (#104, #122, #139, #145, #173, #175, #221). I'm in good position to grab some falling value at QB, WR, TE, OL and even RB, could also see myself draft another CB...I have no clear answers for FS and ILB, but I like some gambles later on like Commings for FS or even "project" TJ McDonald. For ILB I'm eyeing J.Knott
Thoughts?
No Bashing...I thought it was obvious that we should have picked the BEST CB...I have not studied the mid to late round guys..."Study" I like to see entire game films not reports or hilight stuff. I did not this past year. So looks to be the correct pick...your choice is -Wilson kid. Without privy of interview (we brought him here) I would be afraid of taking Mathieu cause that would have been the key.
Ziggy n -Wilson. Possibly what just might happen in theory (maybe not exact same guys)
Still out there for a future pick is OG Thorton - also just a note we have looked into Dallas Thomas kid not sure if its a visit him at his school or after Pro Day or brought him in unnoticed to Berea. No link to confirm so not on the visit thread all I do know is we have shown Interest in him.
Post deleted by Attack Dawg
Wrong thread??? 
Apparently..too tired this morning to know what i'm doing.
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Apparently..too tired this morning to know what i'm doing.
While you're here. You have a good eye for CBs. Who do you like this draft? and what do you think about Wreh-Wilson of course?
I do like Milliner but he's a bit stiff in the hips..but he's the obvious CB..
After that I do like Rhoads to a degree, he's not as fast but maybe more fluid.
Ifthe Browns traded down ,they would take him if they were eyeing a corner and they are very high on him.
Keep a eye on these guys:
U know about Trufant but he's better than what we have now. He likes to fight for the ball and is fluid but lacks top end speed. He may have the best
on the ball skills.
I really like Jonathan Banks..he's lanky, has speed, and is very smooth in his movement.
He's a ballhawk..very underrated.
The thing about these guys, they are physical and like to tackle and most importantly are instinctive..
Some mid-later rd ones I like:
Robert Alford -SE Louisiana
David Amerson NC ST *** he does get burned a lot.
Darius Slay -Miss ST
B.W Webb William & Mary
Leon McFadden SDSU
I am not in the crowd that is enamoured with Mathieu , I don't know if he'll be able to handle the bigger recievers on the outside if he's positioned as a outside corner and not a slot cover man.
One late rounder(5-7) guy to watch for that someone mentioned to me and a few others :
Sheldon Price CB UCLA..he needs to refine his techniques but he could be a good late pickup.
Wre-Wilson? I 'd slot him in the third round .Dude has 4.37 speed, if the Browns were looking for a CB with that second pick and he is there, I would take him instantly.Big corner,I wonder if he is more of a zone cover than a man cover but I think it's just a thing of him and his technique in man coverage in turning his hips and running..it's certainly not a lack of speed but just being flexible enough.
Everybody's sleeping on Kayvon Webster. I think it's a mistake. He can play. Definitely can be a starting second corner, no doubt in my mind.
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Everybody's sleeping on Kayvon Webster. I think it's a mistake. He can play. Definitely can be a starting second corner, no doubt in my mind.
Hmmm..he can play, I saw where the Bronco's interviewed him after the East-West Shrine game.
yeah, along with Hawthorne, Devin Taylor, Brandon Thurmond, Terron Armstead (who was quietly amazing in that game), Chad Bumphis (even before the busted coverage TD), and AJ Francis... these guys looked really good at the Shrine Game.
https://www.dawgtalkers.net/showflat.php?...rue#Post1006453
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Everybody's sleeping on Kayvon Webster. I think it's a mistake. He can play. Definitely can be a starting second corner, no doubt in my mind.
Thanks for the heads up on this guy. I watched his play by play vs FSU and EJ Manuel and came away impressed. He's somewhat raw in coverage, as he always peaks into the backfield instead of playing the ball but he LOVES to attack and is an all out player against the run, that's not a given for CBs. Very alert player and great body language
I think his style would translate very well to FS, what do you think? Def worth a draft pick...at worst a decent backup and ST player
Good catch Steve
That's a tough projection for me as all I've seen of him is the Shrine game and the Combine, but the guy plays physical and can get his hands on the ball. 13 PDs the last two years and played (IIRC) an out-and-up really well for a deflection in the Shrine game.
The combine is what it is, but he looked more natural than most of the corners in the drills. Good COD and acceleration. DB drills to me are the best indicator of success of any of the physical activity at the combine.
Update:
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, C/OG, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, DE/OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
#69 Cards - Justin Pugh, OG, Syracuse
#70 Titans - D.J. Swearinger, S, South Carolina
#71 Bills - Phillip Thomas, S, Fresno State
#72 Jets - Brian Winters, OG, Kent State
#73 Bucs - Jon Bostic, ILB, Florida
#74 Jets (from Panthers via 49ers) - Chase Thomas, OLB, Stanford
#75 Saints - David Amerson, CB, NC State
#76 Packers (from Chargers via Browns) - Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern State
#77 Dolphins - Travis Kelce, TE, Cincinnati
#78 Rams - Jordan Reed, TE, Florida
#79 Steelers - Bacarri Rambo, S, Georgia
#80 Cowboys – Sio Moore, LB, UConn
#81 Giants - Josh Evans, S, Florida
#82 Dolphins (from Bears) - Jordan Poyer, CB, Oregon State
#83 Vikings - Robert Alford, CB, SE Louisiana
#84 Bengals – Sean Porter, LB, Texas A&M
#85 Skins - Corey Fuller, WR, VT
#86 Colts - Dallas Thomas, OG, Tennessee
#87 Seahawks - Ryan Nassib, QB, Syracuse
#88 Browns (from Packers) - Blidi Wreh-Wilson, CB, UConn
#89 Texans - DJ Hayden, CB, Houston
#90 Broncos – Andre Ellington, RB, Clemson
#91 Patriots - Logan Ryan, CB, Rutgers
#92 Falcons - Kiko Alonso, ILB, Oregon
#93 49ers - Stepfan Taylor, RB, Stanford
#94 Ravens - Shamarko Thomas, S, Syracuse
comp#95 Texans - Vance McDonald, TE, Rice
comp#96 Chiefs - Cornelius Washington, OLB, Georgia
comp#97 Titans - Ryan Swope, WR, Texas A&M
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
3 picks left till my next selection. Still available: CB Gratz, CB/FS Mathieu (starting to think he could be a decent FS), QB Wilson, QB Bray, QB L.Jones, RB Ball, RB Randle, OT Bakthiari, OT Mills, OT Faulk, OT B.Williams, OT/G Quessenberry, C/G Schwenke, RB Franklin, DE Simon, S TJ McDonald, CB McFadden, TE Gragg, TE Sims, WR Harper, DT B.Logan, WR Boyce
I will also consider another trade down and 49ers and Seahawks showed some interest if their guy is still there
With Mathieu gone to the Eagles at #101 I took the deal with the 49ers, sending them #104 for picks #128+#164+#180
I now have 9 picks left and 8 to come between 122 and 180 where there will be some nice mid round value throughout imho
The only problem I have with trading down for so many mid round to later picks is this ...... how many of these players can make the Browns?
We already have a ton of that kind of player on the Browns right now. The team has young, decent, "mid-round" type talent in a number of spots.Sooner or later we need some stars to go with the pretty decent types.
Who have you drafted so far?
Ansah and BWW, right? Anyone else?
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Who have you drafted so far?
Ansah and BWW, right? Anyone else?
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122
128
139
145
164
173
175
180
221
@YTown
I think we can easily fit in 10+ rooks on this roster as of now. I would not have traded this much if we did more in FA, but we didn't. We lost more players than adding. We have room for 2-3 Front 7 players (mostly LB), at least 2 more DBs (and guys like Hagg, Gipson and Bademosi aren't guaranteed anything at this point, even Skrine) and we have room to add 1 player at each Offense position: QB, RB, FB, WR, TE, OL. I also think that the mid rounders in this class are as interchangable as ever...I really don't have specific targets at this point, more a pretty tight board that allowed me to add picks by trading down. I'll look to add one of the 3 falling QBs (Bray, Jones, Wilson). I'll also have an eye on ILB Nico Johnson, as he fills a need. He's only a 2 down run stuffing ILB, but considering our smaller, nickel-LBs on the roster he might be a good fit to rotate with them (esp.Robertson)...some falling OTs and RBs too, plenty of equal value to pick 104 will be left at the end of the 4th
Update:
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
Update:
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, NT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
8 picks left. It's as if the other GMs try hard to avoid my targets, lol There's some incredible value dropping. The Steelers will get a 2nd/3rd RB gift-wrapped to them (M.Ball, Randle, Franklin), Bray, Wilson, L.Jones and Dysert still available too. So are CBs Gratz and K.Webster....there are 3 WRs left I like: Harper, Boyce and D.Robinson is starting to intrigue me in the 5th. Not a fan of Goodwin and unconvinced by Stills. Lots of options left at TE and for backup OT....only one G/T I like remaining though in Thornton, so maybe I'll secure him in the 4th...haven't made up my mind yet
Thoughts? Would any of you just go BPA and draft Ball or Randle? I posted my remaining picks last post...what's the smartest tactic to get the best combination of players?
I am a firm believer in getting the best possible players late in the draft. That can be from a productivity standpoint, or a perceived upside, but drafting for need late in a draft is useless.
I believe that Norv has generally kept 5 backs (RB + FB) in most of his stops. Ball would be a fine addition, and could allow us to trade either Hardesty or Ogbonnaya for some value if a team loses a RB in camp.
Quality players find the field, one way or another. Scrubs remain scrubs, even if they are forced to play. I would go for a really good player at a position we have "stacked", as opposed to a lesser player who won't make a positive contribution, even though he plays a position we need help at.
Bummer missing out on Brandon Jenkins in the 4th. There's a reason FSU had him in front of Carradine before he was injured.
If you're planning on taking one of those wideouts, I'd take them next... specifically (I'm assuming Josh) Boyce or Chris Harper.
Guys I really like that would fit our team that are available late:
Brandon Sharpe, OLB Syracuse {will at least be available in 6th}
Quanterus Smith, OLB Western Kentucky {will be gone in 5th}
David Bass, OLB Missouri Western {5th/6th}
Ja'Gared Davis, OLB SMU (bonus: played OLB in a 3-4 in college) {likely available in 7th}
Walter Stewart, OLB Cincy {6th/7th... Mayock said top 10 if healthy}
Armonty Bryant, OLB East Central (put him on the left side and watch him work) {who knows? 5th to UDFA depending on how close your guys pay attention}
Jordan Campbell, ILB New Mexico Highlands (eye-popping numbers, showed strong at All-Star game vs. FBS competition, then
unreal Pro Day numbers ) {actually has a big internet following... I can tell by traffic patterns on my site... could be 5th}
Taylor Reed, ILB SMU (played ILB in 3-4 in college, along with Hunt & Davis, 3 draftable defenders) {likely UDFA}
Jonathan Stewart, ILB Texas A&M (played 3-4 in college until last year) {should be 6th}
FS Duke Williams, Nevada {maybe 5th}
Maybe JJ Wilcox can play FS... he's big but looked natural for a safety at combine {maybe 5th}
FS Cody Davis, Texas Tech (played SS in college) {7th - UDFA}
Still haven't gotten to check out NC State FS Brandan Bishop {UDFA}
Kayvon Webster, CB USF {4th}
Terry Hawthorne, CB Illinois {6th}
You've watched all the TEs, but I like Stoneburner {6th}
Lamar Mady, OG YSU (Warmack for cheap... extremely strong) {7th}
Hugh Thornton, OG Illinois {4th/5th}
Earl Watford, OG JMU {7th}
Manase Foketi, OG/OT West Texas A&M (first-team all-american Div II LT) {7th}
Josh Dworaczyk, OG/OT LSU (started at LT after Faulk's injury, played well) {7th-UDFA}
Joe Madsen, C WVU {7th - UDFA}
Braden Wilson, FB KSU {7th -- Monster blocker}
That's why I traded down twice, the value of this draft is in the mid/late rounds. It's a numbers game and you just gotta be patient and let the board come to you...
Nice list Steve...add Eric Martin, Nebraska, to the pass rusher's list
I really like both Boyce and Harper...Harper gives me some M.Sanu flashbacks
Not much left that I like at FS....maybe a 7th flyer on Boyett? Bishop? Guess we have to sign Kerry Rhodes
or roll the dice on Gipson
I haven't watched Stoneburner but read good things from draftniks I respect. TE is really deep...not sure why we elected to sign 2 depth players in FA there instead of going the draft route, oh well. I also like Griffin, UConn and Rivera, Tennessee if I miss out on Gragg
Update:
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, DT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
#114 Cowboys – JJ Wilcox, S, Georgia Southern
#115 Steelers - Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina
#116 Giants - Kenny Stills, WR, Oklahoma
#117 Bears - Josh Boyce, WR, TCU
#118 Bengals – Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin
3 picks to go...my consideration list for the next pick(s): WR Harper, QB Bray, QB Wilson, RB Randle.....I'll probably punt QB L.Jones, TE Gragg, TE Sims, CB Gratz, CB Webster, G/T Thornton, T/G Mills to the 5th for now....along with a boatload of OL falling (Bakthiari, Aboushi, Bailey, Faulk)
Thoughts?
Signing Nelson, I'd skip Harper.
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Signing Nelson, I'd skip Harper.
Thought about that as well at first, then I thought....Nelson is only on a 1year deal and not even completely healthy. He's pretty much a bonus player and not guaranteed anything at this point. I could see him open the season on PUP or not eing effective enough with less than 12 months of recovery
Hmm....maybe I'll just secure a QB first or go with Randle who imho is as safe as it gets AND has pretty good value at the end of the 4th....we will see, I think there's a pretty good chance one or two of them will be gone with the Bengals and Colts still picking in front of me. I could see them both go with a QB here, but since I'm not particularly enamoured with any of them I could "settle" for Jones or Dysert in the 5th
ouch... missed out on Duke Williams, Kevin Reddick, Brandon Jenkins, Montori Hughes (good enough to push someone off the roster, no doubt), JJ Wilcox, MArcus Lattimore, and Jsh Boyce since last trade?
Has Quanterus Smith been taken? David Bass? Maybe Brandon Sharpe?
Probably just go ahead and take Bray. At this point, he's well worth the "risk."
You're kind of in a tough spot at FS now, I think. That's what I saw when I was doing my mock... to get a FS I'm confident in starting, it will have to be in the third round.
*Edit* is John Simon still available?
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ouch... missed out on Duke Williams, Kevin Reddick, Brandon Jenkins, Montori Hughes (good enough to push someone off the roster, no doubt), JJ Wilcox, MArcus Lattimore, and Jsh Boyce since last trade?
Well, someone had to go in those picks and except for Boyce, Lattimore and maybe B.Jenkins nobody was high on my board. Ball and Randle have been pretty much sitting there at 1-2 since the end of the 3rd
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Has Quanterus Smith been taken? David Bass? Maybe Brandon Sharpe?
Probably just go ahead and take Bray. At this point, he's well worth the "risk."
You're kind of in a tough spot at FS now, I think. That's what I saw when I was doing my mock... to get a FS I'm confident in starting, it will have to be in the third round.
*Edit* is John Simon still available?
All 4 rushers are still around, even Simon, but I'm skeptic as to a conversion to 3-4 OLB with him....he's a one speed rusher that will struggle in coverage...and I already drafted Ansah at 6.....Kruger, Sheard, Groves, Ansah seems like enough quality depth to me....maybe I'll add a Bass, Q.Smith or A.Bryant to the mix later on
As for FS, yeah I miscalculated on Swearinger, which also led to the 2nd trade out of pick 104. My best case scenario was to get Swearinger at 88 and one of the CBs at 104...but again, while I see a good player in Swearinger, not one I absolutely have to have (there aren't many in this draft for me to be blunt) and 68 overall was buying high on him imho....not many sure things around in this draft. I guess I punted FS with te moves, prefer a vet anyway there while the likes of Gipson, Bademosi, Hagg battle it out behind them...adding ANOTHER young player there seems like overkill to me. FS is not an easy position nowadays, you need experience...not many high picks come in and play great. I still think the added picks will prove to be enough valueable pieces to compensate for missing on Swearinger...I still have 9 picks to go and while the board of course is getting shorter, there's still enough mid round talent to be added...I have 4 picks in the next 27 coming up
QB question: Bray or Wilson?
FYI, I picked RB J.Randle, who was a BPA pick for me at this point with still 8 picks coming up and the last RB left I ranked as a top 3 rounder. I don't trust TRich yet, both his play and health and Hardesty is in his last year of his rookie deal and I don't see him re-signing and Obi, as much as I like him, should never be guaranteed a roster spot.
Randle imho is a good compliment to TRich and a good fit in Chud's Offense. He also has some chemistry going with Weeden. He scored 26 TDs in 2011 with Weeden as his QB. He can run tough, has very good speed/athleticism, is a good receiver and blocker....he's a complete 3 down RB imho, which neither Hardesty nor Obi are in case of a TRich injury
Update:
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, DT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
#114 Cowboys – JJ Wilcox, S, Georgia Southern
#115 Steelers - Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina
#116 Giants - Kenny Stills, WR, Oklahoma
#117 Bears - Josh Boyce, WR, TCU
#118 Bengals – Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin
#119 Skins - Ty Powell, OLB, Harding
#120 Bengals (from Vikings) - Leon McFadden, CB, San Diego State
#121 Colts - Jonathan Franklin, RB, UCLA
#122 Browns (from Packers) - Joseph Randle, RB, Oklahoma State
Browns-mock so far:
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122 RB Randle
128
139
145
164
173
175
180
221
Remaining targets for picks 128+139+145 are QB Wilson, QB Bray, WR Harper....nobody seems to want these QBs, they are dropping hard. Lots of players left that I like at this point of the draft: CB Gratz, CB Webster, CB W.Davis, ILB N.Johnson, QB L.Jones, OT/G Bakthiari, OT/G Mills, OT Faulk, G Bailey, G/T Thornton, TE Gragg, TE Sims, DT Logan (would have been my pick if we were still in a 4-3, not sure about him as a 5T DE, he'd be Winn-like)...some nice 5th/6th round value
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, DT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
#114 Cowboys – JJ Wilcox, S, Georgia Southern
#115 Steelers - Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina
#116 Giants - Kenny Stills, WR, Oklahoma
#117 Bears - Josh Boyce, WR, TCU
#118 Bengals – Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin
#119 Skins - Ty Powell, OLB, Harding
#120 Bengals (from Vikings) - Leon McFadden, CB, San Diego State
#121 Colts - Johnathan Franklin, RB, UCLA
#122 Browns (from Packers) - Joseph Randle, RB, OK State
#123 Seahawks - Lavar Edwards, DE, LSU
#124 Seahawks (from Texans) - Oday Aboushi, OT, Virginia
#125 Broncos – Will Davis, CB, Utah State
#126 Chargers (from Patriots via Bucs) - David Bakhtiari, OT, Colorado
#127 Falcons - Alvin Bailey, OG, Arkansas
#128 Browns (from 49ers) - Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
#129 Ravens - Bennie Logan, DT, LSU
comp#130 Ravens - Jordan Mills, OT, Louisiana Tech
comp#131 49ers
comp#132 Lions
comp#133 Falcons
As you can see, I picked Harper. He was the last WR I really liked and has great value at the end of the 4th imho. He's similar in style to G.Little and M.Sanu and thus has Boldin/Ward upside, as in tough, poss-WR. He can play both inside and outside and that flexibility was another factor as I don't see any WR left who could play both. He's a former running-QB with 2.5years of WR-experience now. He was clearly the go to guy for QB Klein, who was all over the place with his throws. Harper has improved each season and has tons of upside left.
Norwood, Cooper and a rehabbing Nelson should not be guaranteed roster spots imho. If they all have a good TC, we could opt to keep 6 WR, more and more teams do it. Since Benjamin is strictly a no4/RET guy and not tough enough for the slot, Harper could compete from day 1 for playing time there although I consider one of Norwood or Nelson to win it in his rookie year
...with that, my mock looks like this so far:
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122 RB Randle
128 WR Harper
139
145
164
173
175
180
221
QBs keep dropping but I expect a run at them soon. Since I'm not enamoured with any of them, I can live with any of Wilson, Bray, L.Jones or Dysert, but prefer Bray and Jones due to scheme fit and potential to groom.
On guy I really think you should consider at ILB is Taylor Reed from SMU. He's not a big pounder guy like Nico Johnson, but frankly I think the talent and size on our DL affords us the luxury of having versatile playmaking-type LBs inside, not having to worry about FB neutralizers. Reed is a tackling machine and has really improved his pass defense skills... three picks (including a pick-6) and 5 pass deflections last year. He's also a good interior rusher with 6.5 sacks last year. You can almost certainly get him with your last pick, which adds overall value to your draft, as for whatever reason he is so far off the radar that cbs doesn't even have them in their top 750. Their parent database NFLDraftScout has him rated 891st behind really awful players. I don't know what they're seeing.
Here are the Pro Day results in case you want to see them for Ja'Gared Davis (who played OLB in SMU's 3-4) and Taylor Reed. I still think Jordan Campbell is the best choice of all of them, but I understand if you don't want to go out on a limb for a New Mexico Highlands guy.
Quote:
Taylor Reed, LB (5-11 1/4, 240) — Reed ran the 40 in 4.75 seconds against the wind and 4.68 seconds with the wind. He had a 30 1/2-inch vertical jump and a 9-foot-9 broad jump. He did the short shuttle in 4.23 seconds and the three-cone drill in 7.22 seconds. He also threw the bar up 29 times on the bench press (225 pounds).
Ja’Gared Davis, LB (6-0, 238) — Davis ran the 40 in 4.82 seconds against the wind and 4.78 seconds with the wind. He had a 32 1/2-inch vertical jump and 9-foot-9 broad jump. He did the short shuttle in 4.42 seconds and the three-cone drill in 7.26 seconds. He also had 14 strength lifts.
http://blogs.nfl.com/2013/03/27/margus-hunt-is-worked-out-by-rex-ryan-at-pro-day/
Here are the defensive stats for SMU. You can change the year in the address bar to see previous years' stats for these guys. Davis I think is a stud LB but might be a bit undersized as a 3-4 OLB. He can play 4-3 OLB, though, and probably 3-4 ILB at a high level.
http://www.smumustangs.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2012-2013/teamcume.html#TEAM.DEF
Update, 4th round just completed:
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, DT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
#114 Cowboys – JJ Wilcox, S, Georgia Southern
#115 Steelers - Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina
#116 Giants - Kenny Stills, WR, Oklahoma
#117 Bears - Josh Boyce, WR, TCU
#118 Bengals – Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin
#119 Skins - Ty Powell, OLB, Harding
#120 Bengals (from Vikings) - Leon McFadden, CB, San Diego State
#121 Colts - Johnathan Franklin, RB, UCLA
#122 Browns (from Packers) - Joseph Randle, RB, OK State
#123 Seahawks - Lavar Edwards, DE, LSU
#124 Seahawks (from Texans) - Oday Aboushi, OT, Virginia
#125 Broncos – Will Davis, CB, Utah State
#126 Chargers (from Patriots via Bucs) - David Bakhtiari, OT, Colorado
#127 Falcons - Alvin Bailey, OG, Arkansas
#128 Browns (from 49ers) - Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
#129 Ravens - Bennie Logan, DT, LSU
comp#130 Ravens - Jordan Mills, OT, Louisiana Tech
comp#131 49ers - Dion Sims, TE, Michigan State
comp#132 Lions - Marquise Goodwin, WR, Texas
comp#133 Falcons - Terry Hawthorne, CB, Illinois
Wilson, Bray, L.Jones and Dysert sill around....after re-watching some more, I've narrowed my choice down to Bray or L.Jones as I don't see the vertical systems as good fits for the others.
Both are pure pocket QBs that need a good pass blocking OL, the Browns have that ready for them. Bray has an incredible arm and trusts it to a fault. He doesn't like to get hit and doesn't constantly step up in the pocket and gives up on plays instead, that's VERY concerning...but then flashes that arm again, it's incredible and pretty accurate on deep throws. Love how he throws it up as soon as he sees a 1on1 matchup deep, true gunslinger. Reads deep to short, but throws it away too often instead of looking longer for dump off.
L.Jones also has a good arm, but he's not the gunslinger Bray is. Good thing he stayed on for his SR season, he improved and got smarter. I like how he moves in the pocket, has some awareness there and steps up most of the time. Looks almost more like a WC QB now but flashes that arm to go deep, not as accurate deep as Bray but good enough. Moves around to fin an open target. Jones is severly over-hated, imho. He has less of a ceiling compared to Bray, but he's more advanced as a QB and thus has a higher floor
One of the QBs, Thornton, Gragg are my targets in the 5th round, but still have an eye on Gratz and Webster who are still around too
Opinions?
Quote:
One of the QBs, Thornton, Gragg are my targets in the 5th round, but still have an eye on Gratz and Webster who are still around too
Sounds good to me
stashing Bray for the year on the bench behind Weeden and Campbell is exactly what he needs. now, we've tried that before (Colt behind Jake & Seneca), but I think Bray would be worth the risk for his upside.
I thought somebody ahead of me in the 5th would relieve me from making this decision, but so far still no QB taken after 3 picks in
5th round
#134 Chiefs - A.J. Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Tamu
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
Speed and thus number of picks will pick up with the 5th round....so, 2 picks left and it's my turn again...Bray or Jones? or punt QB to pick 145 and take someone else? I'm undecided....Bray is enticing with his arm strength but Jones is more advanced and plays smarter overall. He also has better pocket awareness...otoh, I like Bray's attacking mentality to go deep often....hmm
Landry Jones never seemed football smart to me.
Take Bray. ASAP.
if we could get Bray in the 5th...
We couldn't. Cause we'd probably of taken him in the 3rd.
It's a ripple effect of our mock I guess, because Matt Scott was surprisingly taken as the 6th QB, but also goes to show that armchair GMs don't panic when it comes to a certain position and often see the player for what he is....of course, they also don't have their job on the line to make that call
As for your ILBs clevesteve, they are on no ones map, lol which means I can wait until my last couple of picks to make a decision on them, but thanks for the heads up, much appreciated
any feedback is
Quick question: can Z.Gooden play ILB in a 3-4? Not really, right?
That's not where I would put him. I wouldn't spend a pick on him hoping he gets ahead of both DQ and Robertson.
Lions and Texans ahead of me picked C K.Holmes and OLB T.Williams...
I took Bray and you guys pushed me over to him. Well done Scouts
We will see how Jones vs Bray will play out over the years, I'll follow that
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122 RB Randle
128 WR Harper
139 QB Bray
145
164
173
175
180
221
Anybody else thinks I'm killing it?
I would probably throw a party if those 5 are our ENTIRE draft in 2 weeks
Time for a Guard....
My comment may be a little trite, but, if Bray pans out, your draft is amazing. If he does nothing, I'm not impressed yet.
BW2 and Randle are kind of "meh" for me. If BW2 is as good as you say, then great! I just don't see the natural athleticism from him. Still no free safety and you're mostly out of options. I like Harper but he's a backup.
With 6 picks left you can still come away with a terrific draft, but I want to see who those picks turn into. Are you done at OLB with Ansah? Lots of good candidates left. I assume you picture him on the left side?
Also need to see who you get at ILB.
OG and TE still in play.
FS is punted, I don't see anyone worth it who could be much better than a Gipson at this point. I DO think though that WWilson could become a pretty fine FS with time, but would def try him at outside CB first...if he fails there, he has little value for the inside and I'd move him and try him out at FS. I know that Gratz out-practiced WW during SR Bowl week, but that's just practice and just a couple of days of evaluation. Remember when Travis Wilson was the most impressive SR Bowl WR? Ah the good times, lol
Please watch both Gratz' and WW's game vs Bridgewater....it's night and day. WW was clearly the better CB in that game. Gratz allowed 2 TDs, WW merely a couple of catches and came away with the game winning INT in OT in the RedZone. That game sold me on him. He's a definite 2nd or 3rd rounder and there's even some surprise 1st chatter in there....cbs pumped him up to their top 100 being a good indicator as they are probably "hearing things" too now about him
Update:
5th round
#134 Chiefs - AJ Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Texas A&M
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
#137 Lions - Khaled Holmes, C, USC
#138 Texans (from Raiders via Seahawks) - Trevardo Williams, OLB, Connecticut
#139 Browns - Tyler Bray, QB, Tennessee
#140 Cards - Le'Veon Bell, RB, Michigan State
#141 Jets - Mike Gillislee, RB, Florida
#142 Titans - Mike Catapano, DE, Princeton
2 picks left, nobody seems to like Tyler Wilson, lol...Gragg? Thornton? Gratz? Webster? John Simon? Chris Faulk?
I'm a fan of Faulk because I think he can make a good RG. His main problem (slow on the edge rush) isn't a problem on the inside.
I'd take Thornton if oyu're looking at OG. He's already a G, he's good, and doesn't have the injury history Faulk does
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122 RB Randle
128 WR Harper
139 QB Bray
145 G/T Thornton
164
173
175
180
221
Update:
5th round
#134 Chiefs - AJ Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Texas A&M
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
#137 Lions - Khaled Holmes, C, USC
#138 Texans (from Raiders via Seahawks) - Trevardo Williams, OLB, UConn
#139 Browns - Tyler Bray, QB, Tennessee
#140 Cards - LeVeon Bell, RB, Michigan State
#141 Jets - Mike Gillislee, RB, Florida
#142 Titans - Mike Catapano, DE, Princeton
#143 Bills - Ryan Otten, TE, San Diego State
#144 Saints - Jordan Hill, DT, Penn State
#145 Browns (from Chargers) - Hugh Thornton, G/OT, Illinois
#146 Dolphins - Tony Jefferson, S, Oklahoma
#147 Bucs - Tyler Wilson, QB, Arkansas
#148 Lions (from Panthers) - Zaviar Gooden, LB, Missouri
If it came to the 5th round with both Tyler Bray & Tyler Wilson on the board, I think the Browns should take Wilson instead of Bray.
For what it's worth.
Update:
5th round
#134 Chiefs - AJ Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Texas A&M
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
#137 Lions - Khaled Holmes, C, USC
#138 Texans (from Raiders via Seahawks) - Trevardo Williams, OLB, UConn
#139 Browns - Tyler Bray, QB, Tennessee
#140 Cards - LeVeon Bell, RB, Michigan State
#141 Jets - Mike Gillislee, RB, Florida
#142 Titans - Mike Catapano, DE, Princeton
#143 Bills - Ryan Otten, TE, San Diego State
#144 Saints - Jordan Hill, DT, Penn State
#145 Browns (from Chargers) - Hugh Thornton, OT, Illinois
#146 Dolphins - Tony Jefferson, S, Oklahoma
#147 Bucs - Tyler Wilson, QB, Arkansas
#148 Lions (from Panthers) - Zaviar Gooden, LB, Missouri
#149 Rams - Ace Sanders, WR, South Carolina
#150 Steelers - Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma
#151 Cowboys - Knile Davis, RB, Arkansas
#152 Giants - Gerald Hodges, LB, Penn State
#153 Bears - Michael Williams, TE, Alabama
#154 Skins - Reid Fragel, OT, Ohio State
#155 Vikings - Davis Bass, DE, Missouri Western State
#156 Bengals - J.C. Tretter, OG, Cornell
#157 49ers (from Colts) - Chris Faulk, OT, LSU
#158 Seahawks - Nick Kasa, TE, Colorado
#159 Raiders (from Packers) - Dwayne Gratz, CB, Connecticut
#160 Texans - Micah Hyde, CB, Iowa
#161 Broncos - DeVonte Holloman, OLB, South Carolina
#162 Skins (from Patriots) - Nico Johnson, LB, Alabama
Falcons left in front of me, praying they don't take TE Gragg as he's my target here and they haven't taken a TE yet to groom behind Gonzo
Other "names" still available include: DE/OLB Simon, DE/OLB Q.Smith, CB T.Simon, CB Webster, DT J.Hill, DE M.Goodman, DE D.Taylor, RB Barner and all of the FBs (Pryor, Juszczyk, Lane, Bohanon, B.Wilson)...how would you rank them at this point including Gragg? As I have picks 173, 175 and 180 coming up too
For the browns,iI'd say:
1: Q Smith
2: J Simon
3: K Webster
4: C Gragg
5: J Stoneburner
6: D Taylor
7: K Barner
8: B Wilson
5th round
#134 Chiefs - AJ Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Texas A&M
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
#137 Lions - Khaled Holmes, C, USC
#138 Texans (from Raiders via Seahawks) - Trevardo Williams, OLB, UConn
#139 Browns - Tyler Bray, QB, Tennessee
#140 Cards - LeVeon Bell, RB, Michigan State
#141 Jets - Mike Gillislee, RB, Florida
#142 Titans - Mike Catapano, DE, Princeton
#143 Bills - Ryan Otten, TE, San Diego State
#144 Saints - Jordan Hill, DT, Penn State
#145 Browns (from Chargers) - Hugh Thornton, OT, Illinois
#146 Dolphins - Tony Jefferson, S, Oklahoma
#147 Bucs - Tyler Wilson, QB, Arkansas
#148 Lions (from Panthers) - Zaviar Gooden, LB, Missouri
#149 Rams - Ace Sanders, WR, South Carolina
#150 Steelers - Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma
#151 Cowboys - Knile Davis, RB, Arkansas
#152 Giants - Gerald Hodges, LB, Penn State
#153 Bears - Michael Williams, TE, Alabama
#154 Skins - Reid Fragel, OT, Ohio State
#155 Vikings - Davis Bass, DE, Missouri Western State
#156 Bengals - J.C. Tretter, OG, Cornell
#157 49ers (from Colts) - Chris Faulk, OT, LSU
#158 Seahawks - Nick Kasa, TE, Colorado
#159 Raiders (from Packers) - Dwayne Gratz, CB, Connecticut
#160 Texans - Micah Hyde, CB, Iowa
#161 Broncos - DeVonte Holloman, LB, USC
#162 Skins (from Patriots) - Nico Johnson, LB, Alabama
#163 Falcons - T.J. Barnes, DT, Georgia Tech
#164 Browns (from 49ers) - Chris Gragg, TE, Arkansas
#165 Ravens - Brandon McGee, CB, Miami
comp#166 Dolphins - Xavier Nixon, OT, Florida
comp#167 Packers - Earl Wolff, S, NC State
comp#168 Ravens - Joseph Fauria, TE, UCLA
6th round
#169 Jags - Quanterus Smith, DE, Western Kentucky
#170 Chiefs - Kenjon Barner, RB, Oregon
#171 Panthers (from Lions) -
#172 Packers (from Raiders) -
#173 Browns (from Eagles) -
#174 Cards -
#175 Browns -
Lots of picks coming in today...I took Gragg as you can see, he was my last TE rated that high and imho is a perfect fit for the Chud/Norv Offense. There were several pass rushers left, but still bummed that I just missed out on Q.Smith, he would have been my 1st choice too at 173...with 2 picks to go I'm also considering DE J.Kruger...weren't you high on him too? I think he fits the hybrid style....speaking of, this Maponga kid from TCU is getting some late mid round hype, another DE/OLB....lots of options in this draft DE/OLB E.Martin also still around....no love for Tharold Simon? Also start thinking about ILB Vince Williams, but have to watch more
Not a T Simon fan, but haven't watched him a ton and he is a corner with size.
I still think Sharpe is the perfect OLB transition candidate.
V Williams seems a bit one-note to me, and with our talented front I don't think we need to pigeonhole that position as a thumper. I think we can take more of a playmaking LB to fill that spot, which is why I've cooled off on Nico J for the browns.
I liked Kruger as a 5T candidate then he lost all this weight for the combine and I don't know what I'm getting with him. If you want a high effort type why not take J Simon who is more talented?
Good stuff, thanks.
To be honest, since I've picked up Ansah, I've simply slept on the pass rushers that were projected to go in the mid rounds...and now incredibly, Simon is still on the board. I've watched some cut ups on him and you're absolutely right: high effort, high floor guy that at worst is decent backup/ST guy like Maiava was in the 4-3. He will be my pick but the Packers are still left and they haven't picked a pass rusher yet, so I'll have to sweat it out...btw, the Panthers picked up a WR I never heard of: Keenan Davis from Iowa
Btw, I also watched some Th.Simon and now I know why nobody wants him: dude can't tackle, it's hilarious. He has no clue how to tackle, pure cover-CB, decent one at that, but he's contact shy and I'm not sure he picked the right sport for that, lol
Yeah right, the Packers picked John Simon right in front of me
Update:
6th round
#169 Jags - Quanterus Smith, DE, Western Kentucky
#170 Chiefs - Kenjon Barner, RB, Oregon
#171 Panthers (from Lions) - Keenan Davis, WR, Iowa
#172 Packers (from Raiders) - John Simon, OLB, Ohio State
#173 Browns (from Eagles) - Eric Martin, OLB, Nebraska
#174 Cards - Shawn Williams, S, Georgia
#175 Browns - Joe Kruger, DE, Utah
#176 Cards (from Titans via Vikings) - Tavarres King, WR, Georgia
#177 Bills - Garrett Gilkey, G, Chadron State
#178 Jets - A.J. Francis, DE/DT, Maryland
#179 Chargers - Marquess Wilson, WR, WSU
#180 Browns (from Dolphins via 49ers) - Kayvon Webster, CB, USF
#181 Bucs - Sanders Commings, CB, Georgia
#182 Panthers - Vinston Painter, OT, VT
#183 Steelers (from Saints) - Denard Robinson, WR, Michigan
#184 Rams - Tharold Simon, CB, LSU
#185 Cowboys - Devin Taylor, DE, South Carolina
#186 Saints (from Steelers) - Zeke Motta, S, Notre Dame
#187 Giants - Earl Watford, OG, James Madison
#188 Bears - Omoregie Uzzi, OG, GT
#189 Vikings - Zac Stacy, RB, Vanderbilt
#190 Bengals - Luke Marquardt, OT, Azusa Pacific
#191 Skins - Kwame Geathers, DT, Georgia
#192 Colts - Steve Williams, CB, Cal
#193 Packers - Kyle Juszczyk, FB, Harvard
#194 Texans (from Seahawks) - Michael Mauti, LB, Penn State
#195 Texans - Tanner Hawkinson, OT, Kansas
My Browns mock is almost completed and looks like this now:
6 DE/OLB Ansah
88 CB Wreh-Wilson
122 RB Randle
128 WR Harper
139 QB Bray
145 G/T Thornton
164 TE Gragg
173 OLB E.Martin
175 DE J.Kruger
180 CB K.Webster
221
At 221 should I go best K or FB left? Hopkins, Sturgis, B.Wilson, Pryor, T.Line, Bohanon all available with 25 picks left until I'm otc again
My Browns-mock is complete now, here it is:
6 DE/OLB Ansah - BYU
88 CB Wreh-Wilson - UConn
122 RB Randle - Oklahoma State
128 WR Harper - Kansas State
139 QB Bray - Tennessee
145 G/T Thornton - Illinois
164 TE Gragg - Arkansas
173 OLB E.Martin - Nebraska
175 DE J.Kruger - Utah
180 CB K.Webster - South Florida
221 FS/SS C.Davis - Texas Tech
I was already set to pick K Sturgis with my last selection, but then we signed S.Graham yesterday. I figured there are enough FBs left that will probably go undrafted and get one or two there, but it was still a tough decision between Davis, FS B.Bishop, CB J.Adams, CB Anthony, CB N.Robey, RB K.Williams, OLB Sharpe, ILB V.Williams, G Herman, DT/DE E.Dawkins, DE Nick Williams.
I picked Davis because I liked the mix of floor and upside and experience (4year starter with 362 tackles) at a need position. At worst he should be a backup S and pretty good ST player. He's a great open field tackler but lacks deep zone instincts as of now. He has the athleticism to play man to man vs TEs though
Thoughts on the mock would be appreciated. I'm pretty happy overall adding 5 Offense and 6 D-players and a decent mix of day 1 contributors and developmental talent. I believe most of these guys can make the 53 roster. What I've learned about this draft participating in this mock is that it makes sense to grab additional mid/late round picks as the mid and late round talent are as close/interchangeable as ever imho. This class is "weak" at the top in terms of sure fire talent but incredibly deep, so I think it makes sense to hold a couple more lottery tickets in this draft....UDFA will also be pretty loaded and I hope our guys don't sleep on it
If we could get Bray with out 5th pick in the draft I'd be happy with that. I just don't want to take a QB with our 2nd or 3rd pick. I feel we have more pressing needs then a developmental QB.
I also think a developmental QB is just going to screw us in the near future. As well feel the need to find out about him instead of getting a guy that may be better in the next few years.
I'm not that big on Ansah, and I also don't know if hell be there at 6 if people keep talking about him being the next JPP.
I want a trade down in the first. Even if Milliner is there, cause I'm starting to like Rhodes as much as him, if we can drop out of the top 10 and get Rhodes I'd be ecstatic.
I would love that draft, and it seems realistic. In a worst case scenario: we can't trade down with Miami or anyone else and Dee Milliner is off the board, this would be perfect with the exception of us lacking a FS. I would really hope for a Kerry Rhodes signing after this and then we'd be set. We can always sign undrafted FBs, Ks, and Ps to compete with the players that we already have.
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My Browns-mock is complete now, here it is:
6 DE/OLB Ansah - BYU
88 CB Wreh-Wilson - UConn
122 RB Randle - Oklahoma State
128 WR Harper - Kansas State
139 QB Bray - Tennessee
145 G/T Thornton - Illinois
164 TE Gragg - Arkansas
173 OLB E.Martin - Nebraska
175 DE J.Kruger - Utah
180 CB K.Webster - South Florida
221 FS/SS C.Davis - Texas Tech
I was already set to pick K Sturgis with my last selection, but then we signed S.Graham yesterday. I figured there are enough FBs left that will probably go undrafted and get one or two there, but it was still a tough decision between Davis, FS B.Bishop, CB J.Adams, CB Anthony, CB N.Robey, RB K.Williams, OLB Sharpe, ILB V.Williams, G Herman, DT/DE E.Dawkins, DE Nick Williams.
I picked Davis because I liked the mix of floor and upside and experience (4year starter with 362 tackles) at a need position. At worst he should be a backup S and pretty good ST player. He's a great open field tackler but lacks deep zone instincts as of now. He has the athleticism to play man to man vs TEs though
Thoughts on the mock would be appreciated. I'm pretty happy overall adding 5 Offense and 6 D-players and a decent mix of day 1 contributors and developmental talent. I believe most of these guys can make the 53 roster. What I've learned about this draft participating in this mock is that it makes sense to grab additional mid/late round picks as the mid and late round talent are as close/interchangeable as ever imho. This class is "weak" at the top in terms of sure fire talent but incredibly deep, so I think it makes sense to hold a couple more lottery tickets in this draft....UDFA will also be pretty loaded and I hope our guys don't sleep on it
Here's the complete mock draft:
1st round:
#1 Chiefs – Luke Joeckel, OT, Texas A&M
#2 Jags – Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon
#3 Raiders – Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida
#4 Eagles – Eric Fisher, OT, CMU
#5 Lions – Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama
#6 Browns – Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU
#7 Cards – Lane Johnson, OT, Oklahoma
#8 Bills – Jarvis Jones, DE/OLB, Georgia
#9 Jets – Matt Barkley, QB, USC
#10 Titans – Star Lotulelei, DT, Utah
#11 Bucs (fom Chargers) – Xavier Rhodes, CB, Florida State
#12 Dolphins – Tavon Austin, WR, West Virginia
#13 Chargers (from Bucs) – Chance Warmack, OG, Alabama
#14 Panthers – Sheldon Richardson, DT, Mizzou
#15 Saints – Barkevious Mingo, DE, LSU
#16 Rams - Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas
#17 Steelers - Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington
#18 Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper, OG, UNC
#19 Giants - Cornelius Carradine, DE, FSU
#20 Bears - Alec Ogletree, ILB, Georgia
#21 Vikings (from Bengals) – Cordarelle Patterson, WR, Tennessee
#22 Lions (from Skins via Rams) - Björn Werner, DE, FSU
#23 Bengals (from Vikings) - Justin Hunter, WR, Tennessee
#24 Colts - Keenan Allen, WR, Cal
#25 Vikings (from Seahawks) - Arthur Brown, OLB, Kansas State
#26 Packers - Tyler Eifert, TE, Notre Dame
#27 Texans - Geno Smith, QB, West Virginia
#28 Broncos – Manti Te'o, LB, Notre Dame
#29 Patriots - DeAndre Hopkins, WR, Clemson
#30 Falcons - Johnthan Banks, CB, Mississippi State
#31 49ers - Jonathan Cyprien, S, FIU
#32 Ravens - Kevin Minter, LB, LSU
2nd round:
#33 Jags - DJ Fluker, OT, Alabama
#34 49ers (from Chiefs) - Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama
#35 Dolphins (from Eagles) - Menelik Watson, OT, FSU
#36 Rams (from Lions) - Barrett Jones, OC, Alabama
#37 Bengals (from Raiders) – Matt Elam, S, Florida
#38 Cards - Damontre Moore, DE, Texas A&M
### Browns pick forfeit ###
#39 40ers - Datone Jones, DE, UCLA
#40 Titans - Larry Warford, OG, Kentucky
#41 Bills - EJ Manuel, QB, FSU
#42 Eagles - Margus Hunt, DE, SMU
#43 Bucs - Kawann Short, DT, Purdue
#44 Panthers - Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State
### Saints pick forfeit ###
#45 Chargers - Jamar Taylor, CB, Boise State
#46 Rams - Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama
#47 Cowboys – Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State
#48 Steelers - Terrance Williams, WR, Baylor
#49 Giants - Sylvester Williams, DT, UNC
#50 Bears - Kyle Long, OG, Oregon
#51 Jets (from Skins) - Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford
#52 Vikings - Johnathan Jenkins, DT, Georgia
#53 Bengals – Giovani Bernard, RB, UNC
#54 Dolphins (from Colts) - Alex Okafor, DE, Texas
#55 Packers - Robert Woods, WR, USC
#56 Seahawks - Khaseem Greene, OLB, Rutgers
#57 Texans - Quinton Patton, WR, LT
#58 Broncos – Sam Montgomery, DE, LSU
#59 Patriots - Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon State
#60 Falcons - Cory Lemonier, DE/OLB, Auburn
#61 Redskins (from 49ers via Jets) - B.W. Webb, CB, William & Mary
#62 Ravens - Stedman Bailey, WR, West Virginia
3rd round:
#63 Chiefs - Eric Reid, S, LSU
#64 Jags - Mike Glennon, QB, NC State
#65 Rams (from Lions) - Travis Frederick, C/OG, Wisconsin
#66 Raiders - Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State
#67 Eagles - Jamie Collins, DE/OLB, Southern Miss
#68 Chargers (from Browns) - Terron Armstead, OT, Arkansas Pine Bluff
#69 Cards - Justin Pugh, OG, Syracuse
#70 Titans - D.J. Swearinger, S, South Carolina
#71 Bills - Phillip Thomas, S, Fresno State
#72 Jets - Brian Winters, OG, Kent State
#73 Bucs - Jon Bostic, ILB, Florida
#74 Jets (from Panthers via 49ers) - Chase Thomas, OLB, Stanford
#75 Saints - David Amerson, CB, NC State
#76 Packers (from Chargers via Browns) - Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern State
#77 Dolphins - Travis Kelce, TE, Cincinnati
#78 Rams - Jordan Reed, TE, Florida
#79 Steelers - Bacarri Rambo, S, Georgia
#80 Cowboys – Sio Moore, LB, UConn
#81 Giants - Josh Evans, S, Florida
#82 Dolphins (from Bears) - Jordan Poyer, CB, Oregon State
#83 Vikings - Robert Alford, CB, SE Louisiana
#84 Bengals – Sean Porter, LB, Texas A&M
#85 Skins - Corey Fuller, WR, VT
#86 Colts - Dallas Thomas, OG, Tennessee
#87 Seahawks - Ryan Nassib, QB, Syracuse
#88 Browns (from Packers) - Blidi Wreh-Wilson, CB, UConn
#89 Texans - DJ Hayden, CB, Houston
#90 Broncos – Andre Ellington, RB, Clemson
#91 Patriots - Logan Ryan, CB, Rutgers
#92 Falcons - Kiko Alonso, ILB, Oregon
#93 49ers - Stepfan Taylor, RB, Stanford
#94 Ravens - Shamarko Thomas, S, Syracuse
comp#95 Texans - Vance McDonald, TE, Rice
comp#96 Chiefs - Cornelius Washington, OLB, Georgia
comp#97 Titans - Ryan Swope, WR, Texas A&M
4th round:
#98 Jags - Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
#99 Chiefs - Aaron Dobson, WR, Marshall
#100 Raiders - William Gholston, DE, Michigan State
#101 Eagles - Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU
#102 Vikings (from Lions) - David Quessenberry, OT/OG, San Jose State
#103 Cards - T.J. McDonald, S, USC
#104 49ers (from Browns) - Michael Buchanan, OLB, Illinois
#105 Bills - Cobi Hamilton, WR, Arkansas
#106 Skins (from Jets) - Brian Schwenke, C, Cal
#107 Titans - Kevin Reddick, LB, UNC
#108 Panthers - Duke Williams, S, Nevada
#109 Saints - Brennan Williams, OT, North Carolina
#110 Chargers - Brandon Jenkins, OLB, Florida State
#111 Eagles (from Dolphins) - Matt Scott, QB, Arizona
#112 Chargers (from Bucs) - Montori Hughes, DT, Tennessee-Martin
#113 Rams - Jelani Jenkins, OLB, Florida
#114 Cowboys – JJ Wilcox, S, Georgia Southern
#115 Steelers - Marcus Lattimore, RB, South Carolina
#116 Giants - Kenny Stills, WR, Oklahoma
#117 Bears - Josh Boyce, WR, TCU
#118 Bengals – Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin
#119 Skins - Ty Powell, OLB, Harding
#120 Bengals (from Vikings) - Leon McFadden, CB, San Diego State
#121 Colts - Johnathan Franklin, RB, UCLA
#122 Browns (from Packers) - Joseph Randle, RB, OK State
#123 Seahawks - Lavar Edwards, DE, LSU
#124 Seahawks (from Texans) - Oday Aboushi, OT, Virginia
#125 Broncos – Will Davis, CB, Utah State
#126 Chargers (from Patriots via Bucs) - David Bakhtiari, OT, Colorado
#127 Falcons - Alvin Bailey, OG, Arkansas
#128 Browns (from 49ers) - Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
#129 Ravens - Bennie Logan, DT, LSU
comp#130 Ravens - Jordan Mills, OT, Louisiana Tech
comp#131 49ers - Dion Sims, TE, Michigan State
comp#132 Lions - Marquise Goodwin, WR, Texas
comp#133 Falcons - Terry Hawthorne, CB, Illinois
5th round
#134 Chiefs - AJ Klein, LB, Iowa State
#135 Jags - Christine Michael, RB, Texas A&M
#136 Eagles - Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
#137 Lions - Khaled Holmes, C, USC
#138 Texans (from Raiders via Seahawks) - Trevardo Williams, OLB, UConn
#139 Browns - Tyler Bray, QB, Tennessee
#140 Cards - LeVeon Bell, RB, Michigan State
#141 Jets - Mike Gillislee, RB, Florida
#142 Titans - Mike Catapano, DE, Princeton
#143 Bills - Ryan Otten, TE, San Diego State
#144 Saints - Jordan Hill, DT, Penn State
#145 Browns (from Chargers) - Hugh Thornton, OT, Illinois
#146 Dolphins - Tony Jefferson, S, Oklahoma
#147 Bucs - Tyler Wilson, QB, Arkansas
#148 Lions (from Panthers) - Zaviar Gooden, LB, Missouri
#149 Rams - Ace Sanders, WR, South Carolina
#150 Steelers - Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma
#151 Cowboys - Knile Davis, RB, Arkansas
#152 Giants - Gerald Hodges, LB, Penn State
#153 Bears - Michael Williams, TE, Alabama
#154 Skins - Reid Fragel, OT, Ohio State
#155 Vikings - David Bass, DE, Missouri Western State
#156 Bengals - J.C. Tretter, OG, Cornell
#157 49ers (from Colts) - Chris Faulk, OT, LSU
#158 Seahawks - Nick Kasa, TE, Colorado
#159 Raiders (from Packers) - Dwayne Gratz, CB, Connecticut
#160 Texans - Micah Hyde, CB, Iowa
#161 Broncos - DeVonte Holloman, LB, USC
#162 Skins (from Patriots) - Nico Johnson, LB, Alabama
#163 Falcons - T.J. Barnes, DT, Georgia Tech
#164 Browns (from 49ers) - Chris Gragg, TE, Arkansas
#165 Ravens - Brandon McGee, CB, Miami
comp#166 Dolphins - Xavier Nixon, OT, Florida
comp#167 Packers - Earl Wolff, S, NC State
comp#168 Ravens - Joseph Fauria, TE, UCLA
6th round
#169 Jags - Quanterus Smith, DE, Western Kentucky
#170 Chiefs - Kenjon Barner, RB, Oregon
#171 Panthers (from Lions) - Keenan Davis, WR, Iowa
#172 Packers (from Raiders) - John Simon, OLB, Ohio State
#173 Browns (from Eagles) - Eric Martin, OLB, Nebraska
#174 Cards - Shawn Williams, S, Georgia
#175 Browns - Joe Kruger, DE, Utah
#176 Cards (from Titans via Vikings) - Tavarres King, WR, Georgia
#177 Bills - Garrett Gilkey, G, Chadron State
#178 Jets - A.J. Francis, DE/DT, Maryland
#179 Chargers - Marquess Wilson, WR, WSU
#180 Browns (from Dolphins via 49ers) - Kayvon Webster, CB, USF
#181 Bucs - Sanders Commings, CB, Georgia
#182 Panthers - Vinston Painter, OT, VT
#183 Steelers (from Saints) - Denard Robinson, WR, Michigan
#184 Rams - Tharold Simon, CB, LSU
#185 Cowboys - Devin Taylor, DE, South Carolina
#186 Saints (from Steelers) - Zeke Motta, S, Notre Dame
#187 Giants - Earl Watford, OG, James Madison
#188 Bears - Omoregie Uzzi, OG, GT
#189 Vikings - Zac Stacy, RB, Vanderbilt
#190 Bengals - Luke Marquardt, OT, Azusa Pacific
#191 Skins - Kwame Geathers, DT, Georgia
#192 Colts - Steve Williams, CB, Cal
#193 Packers - Kyle Juszczyk, FB, Harvard
#194 Texans (from Seahawks) - Michael Mauti, LB, Penn State
#195 Texans - Tanner Hawkinson, OT, Kansas
#196 Bucs (from Broncos via Eagles) - Jawan Jamison, RB, Rutgers
#197 Bengals (from Patriots) - Keith Pough, LB, Howard
#198 Falcons - Jake Stoneburner, TE, Ohio State
#199 Ravens (from 49ers) - Braxston Cave, C, Notre Dame
#200 Ravens - Conner Vernon, WR, Duke
comp#201 Texans - Brandon Moore, DT, Texas
comp#202 Titans - Aaron Hester, CB, UCLA
comp#203 Ravens - Robert Lester, S, Alabama
comp#204 Chiefs - Edmund Kugbila, OG, Valdosta State
comp#205 Raiders - Zac Dysert, QB, Miami (OH)
comp#206 Steelers - Malliciah Goodman, DE, Clemson
7th round
#207 Chiefs - Steve Beauharnais, LB, Rutgers
#208 Jags - Levine Toilolo, TE, Stanford
#209 Raiders - Latavius Murray, RB, UCF
#210 Eagles - Etienne Sabino, OLB, Ohio State
#211 Panthers (from Lions) - Rex Burkhead, RB, Nebraska
#212 Eagles (from Browns) - Marcus Cromartie, CB, Wisconsin
#213 Vikings (from Cards) - Jasper Collins, WR, Mount Union
#214 Vikings (from Bills via Seahawks) - Rod Sweeting, CB, GT
#215 Redskins (from Jets) - Kemal Ishmael, S, UCF
#216 Titans - Cooper Taylor, SS, Richmond
#217 Dolphins - Robbie Rouse, RB, Fresno State
#218 Patriots (from Bucs) - Josh Boyd, DT, Mississippi State
#219 Packers (from Raiders via Panthers) - Jamaal Johnson-Webb, OT, Alabama A&M
#220 Seahawks (from Saints) - Rodney Smith, FSU
#221 Browns (from Chargers) - Cody Davis, S, TTU
#222 Rams - Philip Lutzenkirchen, TE, Auburn
#223 Saints (from Steelers) - T.J. Moe, WR, Mizzou
#224 Eagles (from Cowboys via Dolphins) - Matt Furstenburg, TE, Maryland
#225 Giants - Ray Graham, RB, Pittsburgh
#226 Eagles (from Bears via Bucs) - Khalid Wooten, CB, Nevada
#227 49ers (from Bengals) - Sean Renfree, QB, Duke
#228 Skins - Michael Hill, RB, MWSU
#229 Vikings - Chris Jones, DT, BGSU
#230 Eagles (from Colts) - Jamoris Slaughter, S, Notre Dame
#231 Seahawks - Caleb Sturgis, K, Florida
#232 Packers - Nick Williams, DT, Samford
#233 Texans - Walter Stewart, OLB, Cincinnati
#234 Broncos - Travis Chappelear, DE, Northwest Missouri State
#235 Patriots - Lerentee McCray, DE, Florida
#236 Falcons - John Boyett, S, Oregon
#237 49ers - Ricky Wagner, OT, Wisconsin
#238 Ravens - Cameron Lawrence, OLB, Mississippi State
comp #239 Eagles - Jeff Locke, P, UCLA
comp #240 Bengals - Aaron Mellette, WR, ELon
comp #241 Seahawks - Nickell Robey, CB, USC
comp #242 Seahawks - Benny Cunningham, Middle Tennessee State
comp #243 Falcons - Chad Bumphis, WR, Mississippi State
comp #244 Falcons - Lucas Reed, TE, New Mexico
comp #245 Lions - Brad Wing, P, LSU
comp #246 49ers - Rashaan Melvin, CB, NIU
comp #247 Ravens - Cierre Wood, RB, Notre Dame
comp #248 Titans - Lawrence Okoye, Project, No college
comp #249 Falcons - Jayson DiManche, LB, Southern Illinois
comp #250 Dolphins - Mark Harrison, WR, Rutgers
comp #251 Bengals - Rufus Johnson, DE, Tarleton State
comp #252 49ers - Zach Sudfeld, TE, Nevada
comp #253 Giants - Jake Knott, LB, Iowa State
comp #254 Colts - Steven Means, OLB, Buffalo
Browns mock:
6 DE/OLB Ansah - BYU
88 CB Wreh-Wilson - UConn
122 RB Randle - Oklahoma State
128 WR Harper - Kansas State
139 QB Bray - Tennessee
145 G/T Thornton - Illinois
164 TE Gragg - Arkansas
173 OLB E.Martin - Nebraska
175 DE J.Kruger - Utah
180 CB K.Webster - South Florida
221 FS/SS C.Davis - Texas Tech
Do your hindsight mocks if you like to
Actually, I'd be pretty happy about that draft.
I'm a bit hesitant on Ansah, but I've come back around on BWW mostly... he just looked bad at the senior bowl and combine. He did play well against Louisville (in addition to Temple, Rutgers). Getting both BWW and Webster I think really strengthens the CB position.
I like Bray a bunch. I really do. I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised if he goes in the second a week from today, so that's a great get IMO.
I like Cody Davis. He's not a difference maker but he's fast and a solid tackler and that's probably good enough... at least it should be an improvement over Young.
Man, putting Harper on this team of wideouts... we have some seriously jacked receivers. Who wants to tackle these guys?
I like Thornton a lot... one of my favorite guards in the draft. Definitely is behind Warford, Warmack, Cooper for me but he's a good athlete from the position.
Bummer that Franklin went one pick ahead of Randle. I'd have taken Michael, Le'Veon Bell, maybe even Gillislee. I don't know, Randle does some good things, I just can't think of anything he does great, you know?
Gragg is a bit of a cheap gamble, we can definitely use competition at the position.
I'll have to take your word for it on Martin. I haven't watched him.
Kruger goes 6'6", 269#. I think he envisions himself as an OLB like his brother.