Looks like NFLN has promoted this game to the live game this coming Friday (game 2 was initially the only one of the 4 that was the live game).

Hey mods, perhaps this post can be kept and eventually moved to the Tampa Bay thread once it is made?

I saw the commercial advertising it as being live on NFLN as well ... i hope that’s the case.

Their offense is going to be the best we’ll see all preseason (granted that they all play), so i’m Interested to see our secondary against their playmakers.

I don’t know as much about their defense other than they lost McCoy. I’m not as worried about our offense, as long as everyone stays healhty

If he decides not to play anybody again, I’m fine with it ... they have a better grasp on where we are as a team than anyone. If they think we have gotten enough work and don’t wanna risk it ... fine by me

This is so good.

Until it isn't. LOL

Pre season is a joke and SHOULD BE ELIMINATED ASAP!

I would prefer they play.

I think 2 friendlies/preseason games is good, but 4 is ridiculous.

The main idea is obviously to see who makes the 53, but these guys are also competing to get signed by other teams. So, it's important to play to see who fits. For example....Hilliard was a guy we all expected was definitely going to make the team. All of a sudden we are now talking about D'Ernest Johnson. Let these two guys show what they have and make the decision who you keep.

I think not letting your starters get live game reps whenever you can is setting them up to fail. Its simple..work with the other coach and agree how much to play the ones, that way you don't have future grocery baggers trying to hurt key guys. Then both sides get valuable reps. I get not wanting your starters out against 2nd and 3rd team. But Theres still some questions with our 1's in some position battles.

I think Freddie's camp has been more physical than previous camps and they have been getting some good reps in. A possession or two, maybe play the entire 1st quarter of the 3rd game. But, in the end we don't need 4 preseason games. The 4th is kind of a joke as it often is those who will be cut. Some key battles may spill into the 4th, but usually everybody is looking forward to the regular season and making the dreaded cuts.

I agree ... i think the physical play of the last few weeks is escalated compared to what we’ve seen .. especially this past week. I was good with keeping them out this week at least

I hear what you are saying, and can't totally disagree. On the other hand, Freddie is running a tough camp, unlike most of our previous coaches.

When we run full contact in camp, the QB is the only one who gets the "Out of Jail" card.

I'll compromise and say 2 pre season games are enough.

But it is really bad football to watch. The starters rarely play if at all.

Unwatchable as far as I'm concerned.

Then they should call them what they are.....scrimmages. Nobody's playing to win, it's not a game. Charging full price for the tickets is a crime.

They should cut the 4th pre-season game and add a bye week, so that each team gets 2 bye-weeks 1 in the first 8 games, 1 in the second 8 games.

I agree ... I think Eventually we go to 18 total regular season weeks .. every team gets 2 bye weeks. It’s the perfect compromise: NFL gets another TV week, players get another week of rest, Safety is adhered to ... and 16 games for record sake is maintained.

Plus, the Super Bowl falls one week later: The Sunday before President’s Day, which is the preferred weekend to end

I don't get the resistance to preseason games out side of the high cost of watching basically a scrimmage.

Its a chance for the team to get out there with pads and hit somebody not on our team. There are not that many opportunities to do so. We got 80+ on the roster now. I think its a good venue to get the pads on and evaluate...especially the OL and DL.

Keep all the legs fresh and the competitive spirit alive.

So far I like the way Kitchens has ran this team. I see everybody getting an opportunity and the Veterans kept out as much as possible. But those fighting for a position whether its a starting or back up role you need those preseason games to help evaluate.

I don't want a team built on PRACTICE PLAYERS and then find out during the real games that they disappear when the real hitting starts.

so we have done away with so much hitting. That teams literally forget how to tackle.

I look at it as a 20 game season with the first 4 games not counting in the standings. Just getting the rust out.

As long as Kitchens has this team ready to roll and firing on all cylinders come Week 1, I don't care how he approaches pre-season. I'm all for him doing whatever it is he feels is necessary to have this team ready.

If they come out and lay an egg because they weren't ready, though, then there should be Hell to pay.

Yea tab...

I'm afraid pre-season is a necessary evil.

Play Baker for a drive or two then sit him please.

Yeah physical practices still aren't replacement for actual games and 4 quarters of tackling another team. Even in practice they only have certain periods where they go to the ground..So I get why people rather they sit but at the same time I think playing these games at full speed actually help prevent injuries..This is assuming your starters are playing theirs and then after that it is what it is

No way,,

Until one of our stars is lost for the season and you and others will hammer Freddie ...

Or Freddie may not play them in pre season.

Then if they come out and aren't ready the first couple of games people will hammer Freddie.

...

I'll be one of them and Freddie would deserve it.

This team has a ton of new moving parts. Playing the guys for the first half would make sense in the so-called "dress rehearsal" game.

Would you like to let me in on the joke? You don't think we have a lot of new players? You don't think timing and learning the nuances of your teammates at full game speed is important? What's so funny? Seriously.

I will be at the bar on Friday.
And the Browns and Atlanta United will be playing at the same time.
I might have a sports overdose.

As would I.

I won't criticise him for playing or not playing players in preseason, but I *will* criticise him if this team isn't ready to roll Week 1 right out of the gate. That's his job.

If he feels that not playing the starters is the best way to ensure they are ready Week 1, I'm all for it - if it works.

Diam, what are you laughing at?

Pre-season games?

For the most part it is about who will make the roster.

Teams are very secretive and do want to show much.

I don't know what is right as far as playing starters. You sure as hell do not want guys getting injured.

Veterans who you know need to be ready. They know how to get ready. Bubble players want film so they can catch on somewhere.

Plenty will never play in the NFL.

So I don't know what good it does playing some guys?

In the end it is all about game one and being ready for that game. So whatever they decide all is quickly forgotten once the real games begin.

I think there is some confusion here, bone.

Typically, the starters only play one series in game one. They might play two or three in game two. They might not play a single down in game four. However, they typically play a half and maybe one more series in the third quarter in the third game.

That is not news.

I really don't get why Diam is laughing at me and others unless he is simply going to make fun of anyone who dares question Freddie. That's unfortunate. And the crazy thing is that Freddie might end up playing our starters in game three. Wonder if he will laugh then?

It's all about the dollar bills. Exhibition games are money grabs for the NFL.

Vers, I don't have an answer.

There is so much we don't see. Freddie has had these guys in pads a lot. I hear he does a bunch of situational football.

They had two days of practice against the Colts. I heard Donavan say at one time the offense ran 16 straight plays.

Maybe he saw what he wanted to see from the starters during the week?

We all know the fourth game is a waste.

Game three? Yes in the past it has been starters play a half. What will Freddie do? I would bet Odell does not play. And he is not hurt. Bitonio some of the other vets?

Maybe for Freddie it is about seeing the depth? His call.

I for one see no reason for 4 pre-season games.

But hell I guess we are all itching for the season to get going?

Sports Overdose. Not alcohol overdose.

Learn to read.

Both sitting and not sitting players works.

Andy Reid plays his guys a lot in the preseason, here is week three from the 2018 preseason for the Chiefs:

https://tinyurl.com/y6plonac

Most of their top players played a significant portion of the game.

Here is week three from the 2018 preseason for the Rams:

https://tinyurl.com/y2c4gouy

Not one player of significance even took one snap.

The lovely MKC mentioned to the fans at TC today that she doubts players, like Baker, Chubb, Jarvis, OBJ, Myles, Ward etc... will play in this (3rd) preseason game.

The bottomline is this -- know your team.

Of course. No need to follow the status quo.

Yep ... I always view coaching as being a jockey. Every horse is different and nobody knows the horse like the jockey. If you have to ease up for best results you do it .. or vice versa.

Freddies with these guys everyday ... he knows what he’s doing and he knows what HIS TEAM NEEDS ... I trust Freddie and am not going to second guess him over the amount of time he plays his starters in this or any other pre-season game ....

They’ve had a tough physical camp .. Freddies put them in tough situations throughout to prepare then as best they can ... he PREPARED them for the last 3 weeks ... IF playing a half this weeks gonna make or break how we come out in week 1 ... Freddie has not done his job ....

No one knows this team better than Freddie ... and i mean NO ONE ...

FREDDIE IS READY ...

Nobody likes injuries. But we are in a different era. In my era if you were hurting it was "SUCK IT UP" and if you didn't you were considered a Ussy of some sort. I remember playing the last half of a season (LG on O and ILB on D) in HS with 3 ribs. They cut out the foam from a dummy and covered my ribs with that along with a lot of tape. Played the rest of the season like that. I did not go to the doctors possibly one or more were Fractured??? Didn't go cause if I went I would not be able to play until I would get the Doctor's consent.

But that was HS but in yesteryears even with the NFL players it was much the same. Now basically only the OL plays hurt. Coaches are more diligent to look after the player as many players would not want to come out either for the love of the game or fear of losing their position.

As for this game: Yeah I went ahead in my guide and saw that coverage I think started at 7pm for our Game making it LIVE. But being that it is at TAMPA that means we or I not in the Cleveland TV area will have to stomach the incompetent call of the game by TAMPA Announcers. Preseason expecially as we got 80+ players and I don't know all the numbers. When a play is made I need the announcers to at least recognize what Browns made the tackle...instead they Yap n Yap about their players ignoring anything the Browns do. Hopefully NFL Network gives them directions to call the game attentive to both teams not just Tampa!

So you are going to ridicule anyone who dares to question Freddie because you know he is ready.

Look, I am not saying that this will be a mistake. I am saying it could be a mistake. I don't think anyone is making a big deal about it, but it is worth discussing w/out you acting like we are clueless.

Btw----------can you provide some examples that show successful examples of Freddie preparing his team for the season while be the head coach of that team?

Heck my point was much simpler than any of that. We both know the HC ends up being the fall guy for anything and everything that can or does possibly goes wrong.

My point is that it's a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation.

If you play your starters for the first half or a little longer and you have injuries occur to your starters, many fans will be like, "Why the hell did he have them out there!?"

If you don't play them in game three and they don't come out firing on all cylinders many fans will be like, "Why the hell didn't he play them in game three!? We have so many new players they should have gotten more work together!"

We've seen it far too often around here.

I didn't know that was funny. But the previous poster had brought up one of the scenarios and I simply brought up the other one where Freddie may end up taking flack no matter which decision he makes.

In our first game we will be facing the titans defense. That's no joke.

Well, that was just silly...

That said, I'm also a little curious that Freddie doesn't feel the need to get his starters in a truer game environment. There's lots of new people, and more importantly, there are new coordinators and systems (I'm talking more about the D than the O, here). In the end, Freddie has the best feel for how the team is coming along...

Also, maybe the offense gelling is just something that would take longer than the duration of TC and preseason, so he's just kinda like, "screw it, might as well prevent injuries and work on this during the season, since it'll take that long anyway". I dunno. I gotta just trust in Freddie, because that's who Dorsey picked to coach the team.

The last line pretty much is where I'm at.

I don't think it was silly. It's not as silly as claiming folks can't judge his moves because "Freddie is Ready" and is a guaranteed great coach.

Look, I'm NOT saying that resting all the starters is a bad idea. I'm saying that we have a lot of new pieces and that the speed of game-action is never matched in NFL practices. Dudes are almost always going 3/4 speed or less and most of the time, guys are not tackling guys to the ground, thus they ease up even in pass defense. Timing is critical to a team's success.

We might not miss a beat and come out firing. However, if the team gets off to a shaky start and some of the guys are not on the same page, then Freddie will be questioned.

I don't think that is absurd. I don't think it's silly. I don't think it's hilarious. It's just football talk.

You asked for examples of a guy making a certain decision as a head coach that's never been a HC before. There are no examples, simply because he's never been a HC. That IS silly. If you did that unintentionally, then it was unintentionally silly.

Aside from that, I actually completely agree with you. The only potential explanation I can come up with was my guess that the gelling process was going to stretch into the regular season regardless... and he's chosen to take his lumps in the interest of getting all his players to week 1 healthy.

I am going to reply to you one last time to say what I said was not silly if you take it in the intended context.

Diam is acting/saying like Freddie can't be questioned. He is acting like he is already a great HC. Do you comprehend that?

Thus, I brought up the point that the dude has no HC experience, so it is "silly" to pretend that he is a great HC and can't be questioned.

Get it?

If not.........LOL........I'm done either way. Y'all blow my mind more often than not.

Eh, I think Freddie is acting like he IS the head coach, which, coincidentally, he is.

I really have no idea how your quote relates to what I was saying. Seriously. I don't.

Of course he is the HC. Of course, he has the right to choose how he approaches things. It's his team.

I am simply saying that he has not been a HC before, thus I think Diam is off-base when he acts like Freddie can't be questioned regarding his strategy.

Hell, I am not even saying it is the wrong strategy. Things get so turned around on this board. I AM SAYING that if the team gets off to a slow start that he will be questioned. That isn't a hysterically stupid statement. I yi yi yi.

All right, bro. I see the game you are playing. Just remember, you started it.

Anyone remember this headline?



I don't know.......but one might read that and think that they are not on the same page at this point in time. Yet, some think that it is hysterically funny to wonder if them playing about a half in a preseason game is a good idea.

I'm indifferent about seeing the true starters play in Game 3. I'd love to see them play just for the sake of it, as it of course would give us some indication of how the offense is coming along in real time. However, if they don't play, I don't think its gonna be a deal breaker as to any additional chemistry it may create as we start the regular season.

I'm on the side of playing it more safe than sorry, which also gives me a chance to say I don't think the NFL needs 4 preseason games. Max 3, but 2 is ideal. It'll suck for the guys on the bubble, but it is what it is.

I would say 3 is good.. first one the proposed starters get a series or two then the backups play the rest of the game to try to earn more time... second one starters get more of the first half and anybody who is rising gets some reps with the 1s... by the third one your top 40+ spots are set so starters rest and everybody agrees it's just back-ups who are fighting for spots on the team (or another team)..

As far as charging full price for any of these games.. c'mon man...

I have to admit though, I hope the starters play a while in this game since I'm going...

George Halas wasn't a head coach, until he was

Bill Belichick wasn't a head coach, until he was

Paul Brown wasn't a head coach, until he was

Hue Jackson wasn't a head coach,until he was

Point being, it's virtually impossible to say who will shine and who will fade.

Yes, that was my point.

There seems to be an echo in here. Is the lovely MKC invited to the Island? I think MG is sick? They all sit according to her. Quite a list.

If she’s a dawg ... she’s invited ... ALL DAWGS WELCOME ...

In 1955, the Browns played 6 preseason games.

Browns lost 5 of them. They went 1-5 in the preseason.

Then won the 1955 NFL Championship.

6 preseason games seems a bit much lol

Yeah, no kiddin'.

That was half as long as the regular season. (the regular season back then was only 12 games - The Browns went 9-2-1)

Well, Freddie said the starters are going to play against Tampa Bay and not play in the final preseason game.

I said i’d trust whatever he did ... yet for some reason your claiming victory ...

but what should i expect from u at this point ... you’ve put words in my mouth the entire thread ... and that was just from reading your replies to others .. this is the first reply you’ve made directly to me i’ve read .. can’t imagine how classy u were in your replies to me ...

good job ...

No Diam. You started this. Laughing hysterically because some of us said Freddie might get questioned. Pretending that Freddie can't be questioned. You replied to me w/your hysterical laughing emoji. Multiple times. Now, you are playing victim.

I thought it was excellent preparation for our Number one offense to simulate a 2 minute drill even though it was just our first series. This way all knowing that they were only going to be together for one series they were able to get a good scrimmage feedback of a 2 minute drill. That was very BB like and I think Kitchens has kept hitting at its fullest and will have our team ready for that first game.

For a first time HC Kitchens is showing that he absorbed a lot from some very good coaches and has a good account of what he wants within the parameters given to the NFL.

And as Diam says, he has excellent knowledge of all our players and what we don't see is the coaches meetings assessing their specific positional battles. I'm also SURE that Kitchens is spending a lot of time watching film of practice and these preseason scrimmages called GAMES by the NFL.

jmho

What kind of response do you expect from several of these..... ... as your only reply to others?

That is a lot, but in those days players camp to camp after leaving the job of driving cabs or working in a car lot.

They did need the training and practice.

I liked purp’s the best ... it made me ...

and his 2nd one was even better ...

I was just saying that when it appears that you're openly mocking others without offering any actual input, you have to expect some snarky responses.

You've been around long enough to know that. I don't care how you post or what you post. I don't try to be the board police that way. You're a lot like me to the point that you really don't give a damn what other people think about what you post.

I'm just sayin'

jc....

There comes a point where some don't have anything to complain about...and maybe this ( ) is the best response.

New coach with maybe a different approach toward preseason games and playing starters...what is there to debate?

Until we see something that gives us reason to debate the issue, why pound a keyboard just to discuss hypothetical situations that might not materialize.

Fred's the HC...I'm happy...

Truth.

There isn't much to debate with it. I only care that we come out ready to play Week 1; I do not care at all what it takes for that to happen.

Yes, I want to see what this team looks like and full strength and I'm tired of waiting for that, but I don't need to see it... but, I do need them to be fully up to speed Week 1.

Freddie Kitchens tells Jim Donovan Baker Mayfield will start tonight, then they'll feel it out from there.

https://twitter.com/KenCarman/status/1164987377733029888

Why pound a keyboard just to diss those who speak of hypothetical situations that may or may not materialize?

Btw mac, how many Front Office threads did you create? What was the last one?

The Browns Front Office xxxvii.

How many players lawyers did mac call?

That's the question I want answered.