Pats/Giants tonight ... Gordon just left with an injury

--New England's OL is trash.

--Brady might finally be approaching the end. He isn't looking very good even factoring in NE's poor OL play.

--This Mayo guy looks good for NY.

Gordon's leg was bent back quite far. He'll be out for the game, maybe a week or two. That didn't look good.

I took the Giants in the pickem this week, no way the Pats cover 16.5 against the NY.

Brady and Edelman have such good chemistry ... same with White

Edelman is true pro. Dude plays the game hard. He is very tough and puts the team first. He is so underrated.

I think White was short, but I don't think there is enough evidence to overturn it.

Damn, that is hit on my Daily Fantasy Football entry.

Did he put the team first when he got popped for PEDs?

(I don't actually care about this, I just wanted to get it in.)

Over 40.5 covered

That’s a crazy stat

...and this is why I never bet real money on sports.

I don't know. You should ask him. He may have jeopardized his future health by putting something into his body so he can perform better and help his team? But, I don't know for sure.

Heard on the radio this morning that a ticket to the Miami Zoo will cost you $23 this weekend. A ticket to the Dolphins vs Redskins game can be found for $15.

LOL.........that's sad and funny at the same time.

Lol if that isnt telling

Yeah, but the zoo has a host of different animals. The team only has Dolphins.

Yea, when is the last time you were deciding what to do on the weekend and picked attending an NFL game because it was the cheapest thing in town.

Mason Rudolph is OUT vs the Chargers. Let's see what "Duck' Devlin Hodges can do. He did OK vs the Ravens.

link

I thought he looked better than Rudlolph last game to be honest. That loss wasn't on him.

It seemed like they let him throw it deeper and took the reins off of him way more than Rudolph

Duck had a great preseason. I'm encouraged how well he played last week. Maybe the Steelers have found something here.

No offense, mom..............but I wish that Sunday Night game would have been flexed. The Chargers are ravaged by injuries and the Steelers are down to their 3rd string qb and have not been playing well.

I normally love the Sunday Night game, but this one looks like a dud.

I agree - both team are ravaged by injuries. It is likely to be a close game
, but it's interesting to me to see how "Duck" does.

I understand and I meant no offense.

All is fine! Hope the Browns beat the SeaSquawks!

watch Hodges beat the browns this season.

It could happen.

Steelers D is very good and it's the type of D Baker currently struggles with.

Oh God! I hope not! As some of you know, most of my family and friends are Steeler fans. Unlike on here where I was conservative about the Browns, I was talking a ton of trash about the Steelers and how great the Browns were this off-season. Even on Sunday, when the Steelers were playing the Ravens, I was talking a ton of smack.

If they beat us.................Oh God!

J/c

Given the Steelers defense and our current offense ... it should be a close game. Now, if we get our act together then we’ll be favored by 5-6 points.

I agree with this. Both games will be very close. Don't count the Steelers out.

Carolina with the rare free kick chance

What the Panthers are doing with Kyle Allen would be so much better for Baker IMO ... lean on Chubb (like they do CMC) and play off that. Change up our offense and Baker is still effective

I kind of even like what Oakland has done with their WRs....they have been sending them in motion on like a wheel or flare route right into the flats...Carr finds them for an easy 6-8 yards...Not a big play but hey it moves the chains...and I'm sure that is a lot easier on a QB...Which hey, we need to get Baker playing right to have any sort of success.

I agree ... just little things to get quick completions and high percentage. It’s like we’re aiming for HRs every play, and that’s not suited to our personnel

Exactly...boggles my mind that thus far the coaches have not figured this out...I just hope they take the corrections needed, instead of forcing the same nothingness to take place....As there's zero excuse for this team to only score 3 points.

lol i know it ... heck, remember the days of our offense saying “Oh, we’ll drop 40 a week!!” ... umm, 3 points in ONE GAME

As bad as Baker’s been this season, at least he’s not sucked as much as Jamis Winston.

haha that is the truth...sad when our biggest worries on this board were our FG kicker and punter...season rolls around, now its every position with the exception of FG kicker and punter lol

Yeah Winston rolls right into sacks, he can put up yards...but man turnovers must be part of his diet lol Guy constantly finds a way to give the ball to the opponent.

WInston is such an anomaly .. he looks so good like 1 every 5 weeks

lamar jackson threw for 236, and ran for 152 and a TD.

oh look, the other QB i wanted us to draft.

Deshaun Watson beat the chiefs at arrowhead.

Cowboys offense is struggling today

They played Cincy... peewee league could beat them.

Darnold looking like the QB he was advertised to be.

he’s getting more accurate and comfortable to me as well

Cowboys just kicked a 62 yard fg.

Whaaaat.

Their kicker Has been clutch this year

The Rams offense is a shell of its old self

Gurley’s knees are shot, and he’s out, plus defenses catch up quick to new schemes and such.

They essentially did to Gurley what Houston did to Earl Campbell, but in a lesser amount of time.

you worry that Carolina might do that to CMC too

Didn't he just miss one?

After I jinxed him

Gotta give some credit to the 9ers defense, they are the real deal.

yes they are

Oh boy Matt Bryant

No! It's Freddie's fault.

Refs tried to give Dallas a chance, Gregg said, "NFW."

Fire Mcvay?

Only if we can hire him

The steelers are going to win tonight, because that's just how lucky this day goes so far.

If the playoffs were today, I think Buffalo, and New England are in, 4-1, and 6-0

Not sure who the other wild card would be but I don't think the Browns would be in the hunt, if the playoffs were today.

Seriously don't understand the love for Rivers. He is a perennial disappointment and the only time he seems to show any type of spark or field presence is when he plays us.

So the Steelers try WAY harder than us IMO ... energy is high, prepared on D, etc

i hate the steelers so much.

why do they always find ways to play at a high level.

The luckiest team in the world.

They are jacked up tonight

Even after being 1-4.

That's one thing that I hate about the Browns. Any sign of adversity and they just roll over. It could be record, in game, injuries. The Steelers are playing with a third string QB on the road and they are playing like they believe they should win the game.

I will definitely give them that.

The Browns have done this regime after regime after regime.

Yeah, it’s just a culture thing and they won’t accept losing. They might lose, but they’ll do anything to avoid it. We just ease into it

Yep, that's spot on. It definitely shows the disparity of cultures between the 2 teams.

It's also a culture thing to keep changing the FO and coaches. Just an Fyi.

I don’t know why you keep insinuating that I want to fire Kitchens? I literally never said that lol ... In fact, I said we need to figure it out together as a staff, QB, GM, etc. It’s in the postgame thread and also the thread on the main forum

The Steelers have had 3 head coaches since 1969. The Browns have had 10 head coaches since 1999. Seven fewer head coaches in 30 fewer years, but some of our fans want to fire another HC.

Man, the Chargers don't look like they want to be in LA.

Watching Rivers is painful tonight. My son played against him in high school. He's making Baker look like an all-star, lol.

Well, there are more Steeler fans there than Charger fans.

Rivers is one of the best QBs of the last 15 years. Browns fans would be building this guy a statue if he played for us. Yet people are acting like he's a scrub.

I know. It's sad for the Chargers.

Rivers was a great qb. I think he is finally showing his age. That does not diminish how good he was.

Btw...........anyone else notice how much faster the undrafted Hodges is at making reads than the number one overall pick in Cleveland?

Would you rather have Hodges than Baker?

If not, what difference does it make?

jc

so after all of this, the steelers are about to tie us for 2nd place.

Man, the Chargers didn't even show up.

Yep, and they’ve had perhaps a tougher schedule thus far

We have to face facts. We are one of the worst teams in the league until we're not.

That's just the reality of it.

Pittsburgh dismantlement of chargers by running it down their throat shows how bad our playcalling is

I think it just goes to show how good their D is. They were afraid to let Rudolph pass the ball, Cincy and Balt knew it, and they beat one and almost beat the other.

They're not going to let this Duck guy pass either.

It's the D.

It's impressive when you think about it.

Are you trying to start a fight?

I think going through progressions quickly is important. I wont get on you if you don't think it's important. I made a football observation. Sorry about that.

You made the same observation you've stated ad nauseam for the last several weeks. We know you don't think Baker goes through his progressions well. What does comparing him to the Duck do to enhance that observation other than to trash Baker?

Rivers has such an odd throwing motion

Never mind.

Man what a bad call . Down 3 tds about a min left with 4th and 3 and you kick a fg. Worse yet you miss

Chargers gonna Charger

And Browns gonna Brown.

Yep, we’ve seen that 5 of 6 weeks really

j/c:

Was it Peppers that we took instead of JJ Watt?

I've got a sinking feeling that our games against the Steelers aren't going to go as we expected.

LMAO...............the ref announces a call that favors the Chargers in LA and it is met w/a loud chorus of boos.

Can you imagine how bad it would suck to play in front of opposing fans in your home stadium?

I have said this before, but LA does not deserve one team, never mind two.

Suddenly, it looks like a split might be a good scenario

Sashi Brown did not trade Joe Haden. He cut him! Seriously!

Okay....that duck noise was funny right after Al said that Hodges was a Champion Duck Caller.

Please don't remind me of Sashi, I'm trying to forget he ever existed.

Sorry, dawg.

Minkah Fitzpatrick has really helped the Steelers D. He is doing a great job in Two-Deep. Covers a lot of ground.

Oh horsefeathers!!!!! You are not “making a football observation”. Just another of your never ending attempts to denigrate our quarterback. Started the day after we drafted him and it has continued until now. Your obsession with and hatred of our qb is really sad. I am convinced you want him to fail no matter what it means for the browns.

As an aside, they are taking applications for director of the Hodges fan club. Sign up.

j/c:

Wow, that TD pass by the Chargers was close. Ruled a TD, but his toe might have been on the line. Thoughts?

I think he was in, although like the announcers just said the line is pretty faded so it's hard to tell.... but I think he got that left foot in.

Good call. They ruled in the Chargers' favor. It was close. Good eyes.

Steeler D actually looks pretty good.

Bad move to try the onside there with all 3 timeouts.

No way were the Steelers going to put it in the air with this guy, it would have been a pretty easy predictible 3 downs to stop them.

What a punt and field.

I hate Pittsburgh so much.

Go for it? FG? Punt?

I take a delay of the game and punt.

Oh crap............sorry. I was on delay.

wow - I'm just starting to recover. What a crazy game! Thank you TJ Watt, Cam Sutton, James Conner. Yikes, but a W is a W. Too many injuries tonight. Glad we have a bye week coming up.

Steelers are still alive and their defense is very good. If their offense keeps going thru the OL then they’ll be in every game

The P guys looked tough and really took it to the Chargers. Some brutal hits and gang tackling. Compared to us, they were hungry and ambitious. We were not for the most part.

That team was taken from San Diego, with one of the most fickle fanbases out there... and is now in LA. IMO, it sucks for guys like Rivers who have been there forever.

j/c:

Jamie Collins
4.5 Sacks
30 tackles
9 tackles for loss
4 Passes defended
3 Interceptions
1 House call TD
2 Forced fumbles
1 Fumble Recovery

#NoTalent

.....We cut this guy.

Because he sucked while he was here.

He chased a paycheck here. He is chasing a championship there. Before anyone blasts the coaching staff(s) here though ..... Belichick traded him, and he doesn't trade away important pieces for a 3rd round compensatory pick. After we cut him, I think that made him appreciate whet he had in New England, and the work he needed to put in.

I don't buy that one bit. Granted he was injured quite a bit but he did not suck.

And you do if you have to choose between signing a LB to a massive contract and don't have as much cap space as the Browns, in this case Hightower or Collins. They chose Hightower and got a third rounder for Collins.

I think I heard on one of the broadcasts that Collins admitted the losing in Cleveland got to him and affected his performance.

Some guys just perform better elsewhere or with a change of scenery.

I'm sure it has for lots of players over the course of their time here. But he is clearly a talented player and we simply cut him. I have my sneaking suspicions as to why and it correlates with a lot of other players who are no longer on the team.

Because they didn't play well?

Nope.

If you're alluding to the fact he didn't have a Dorsey connection, I have to disagree.

Every GM wants their own guys. But I don't think that's the case with Collins. My guess is they didn't think he was performing up to his contract.

I wouldn't compare anything to the Patriots. They are an anomaly in every way imaginable. They are a real life example that the bizarro world exists. Player not playing good? Put him on the Patriots and watch him tear it up. Player not behaving? Put him on the Patriots and they are a saint. Sixth round QBs don't make it? Put them on the Patriots.

Went off on a tangent there. Sorry. I marvel at how much of a statistical anomaly they are. Kind of the same way I marvel at how much of a statistical anomaly we are. We truly are.

They almost certainly would have gotten a 3rd round as a compensatory pick if they had kept him, and would have had him for the whole year.

He was a problem child in New England, and was asking for stupid crazy money. In his final game in New England, he only played about half the snaps, because that's what Belichick chose. He chose to play a different player there, and dumped Collins .... as he so often does when a player doesn't do what he wants/expects.

Collins was pain as one of the highest, if not the highest paid players on our defense. Can anyone truly say that he was performing at that level? I can't.

He was playing less and less the season before he was cut. He wasn't even starting at the end.

He wasn't playing well. He never sucked, he has all the talent in the world. He was consistently not playing well.

And there were games where there was an obvious lack of effort.

Jc

Tonight is Detroit at GB ... that division is a tough one. I expect a good game tonight

And that was for stretches of games.

Green Bay sucks.

Start a Sashi thread. This is an "Other Games" thread.

So, back to the topic......

Stafford and the Lions are quietly having a nice season. Stafford's wife had that brain tumor and he was a great source of support. He has been a risk-taking, gun-slinger his entire career and I think it is hard to win big w/guys like that, but he is playing a lot smarter this year. I wonder if his wife's situation actually helped him become more responsible on the field.

The Lions have beat some good teams this year and are playing tough. Like us, they have been bad for a long time. It would be nice to see them do well.

I dont consider winning 2 games "having a nice season"

Lions have been very impressive so far this year

Man, Jimmy Graham has digressed.

13-7 Lions and it should be worse

When people are calling for Freddie's head I want them to think about this.

Patricia had a rocky first year including several locker room problems and guys not wanting to play for him.

Change is hard. Giving up is easy.

Refs trying to decide games again. Got to make sure GB has every chance to win.

His knee wasnt down?

And of course the Packers get TD off bad call.

The officiating is a serious problem.

Another criminal call favoring an nfl darling. They have facemasks...get rid of hands to the face. Don’t want wants to your face? Learn how to use yours

j/c...

It's disgusting how poor and/or intended officiating is destroying the credibility of the NFL.

Pathetic.

Garbage referees in the mnf game. Absolutely determined the game.

Despite the awful officiating I hope Freddie was watching how Green Bay managed the clock at the end of the game. Could have scored the sucker TD allowing Detroit to get the ball back. They didn't. That's coaching. Put your ego away Freddie. Admit your mistakes. Learn. Become a winner. Always being aggressive (as you said in your presser) is NOT a winning recipe in the NFL. Sometimes it's OK to grind it out, keep the ball away from the other team and still score more points. That equals a victory. That's SMART football.

From the guy who simply handed the ball to the officials after scoring a TD....

Thank goodness! That allowed DET to cover the +4.5.

Man, that was another game partially (if not totally) decided by BAD officiating

Sometimes, I wonder if the poor officiating is tied to how many subjective rules the NFL has added to the game?

The NFL doesn't want the Lions to be more relevant than the Packers.

Bingo.

And for anyone who thinks the refs don't want to shut the Browns big mouths up...I don't know know what to say.

THIS is the root of all evils we're watching. They're supposed to interpret clear-cut rules, NOT craft circumstances into a fine wine. We expect refs to determine what proportion of a player's body-weight lands on another... and whether he did it on purpose. C'mon!

Yep, a lot of the newer rules are so subjective. They are also hard to interpret due to the speed of the game. I wonder if the officials are thinking too much?

I don't think the NFL favoring some teams over others is the reason for poor officiating. Too much money is involved to purposely taint games.

I know some will not want to believe it, but it's very real that the NFL plays favorites.

When I'm in a rational mindset, this is exactly where I'm at...

... but I no longer hold anything against the conspiracy theorists that say refs are rigging games. Hard to think otherwise with some of these calls we're seeing.

Im not necessarily saying the refs are rigging games, but it is true that the NFL wants certain teams to succeed and sometimes they will help said teams to succeed. They can't control everything.

The NFL is trying to force the hand of all calls being made from a central location, but need to make it so the fans are crying for it.
Then the NFL saves face by saying "We are listening to you."

I didn't mean to say you were. I was just making a general comment. Some of these calls... it becomes tough to rationally explain them away.

What was he talking about before?

Just because you own the joint doesn't mean you get to be so regressive.

I know I already said this, but I do think all the new rules that have added to officials making so many subjective calls and also having more rules to enforce is the biggest problem. Also, there has been a significant turnover in the officiating ranks recently.

I just can't get behind the idea of the NFL telling officials to favor or punish certain teams. The NFL is making tons of money and can you imagine what that kind of information would do to the league if it ever got out. And let's face it....it would get out. People talk. Especially those who have lost their jobs or retired.

Reason #1 why Baltimore's approach is not sustainable:

Lamar Jackson (460) currently has more Rushing Yards than Mark Ingram (424).

I thought I heard that their plan was to not do that? Then again, running is the one thing he does well.

My biggest problem with a lot of the newer rules is the simple fact that they expect grown men, playing a violent game, moving at full speed... to basically defy the laws of physics.

If you are a defensive end and get past your blocker and have a free rush at the QB... you can:

- Remain upright and go in high, odds are your helmet hits their helmet.. flag
- Drop your helmet to avoid helmet to helmet, that's spearing.. flag
- Drop your head to the side and go shoulder square into them, driving them to the ground with you on top of them.. flag
- Go low from the waist down.. flag
- Grab them from behind and pull them down.. flag

And all of that is predicated on the fact that whatever you decide to do.... the QB isn't going to move a fraction of a second before you initiate contact because if he does... flag.


And I will not say that the NFL picks winners and losers by officiating.. but it sure does seem like they give benefit of the doubt to teams that are down to make games close.. makes for better viewing and more excitement.. sometimes that other team just happens to win.

I don't know about bias. I try to be a reasonable man and believe that kind of garbage couldn't infiltrate games, but sometimes it seems too unbelievable to not hold some water. Sometimes, I seriously think we will always be a black-sheep to the fraternity of refs because of the snowballs and batteries.

I think the subjectivity that Vers mentioned goes deeper into what we're seeing than people may think. We're asking for deep analysis of things that happen too fast for a human to compute. The actual task at hand suffers at a result.

I also think all the whining from the players adds another layer of junk on top of an already difficult job. Example, player A complains of a block from Jarvis... official sees another that may be marginal but doesn't throw a flag... Then he sees a player "flail" after a good block but his mind was already made up because he's in "correction mode". The result - an egregious call on a textbook block. NOT the way the game is supposed to be officiated.

One of my biggest complaints is the result of plays that are reviewed. If you choose to cross the line past the human element and use technology, we're all now seeing the same thing, i.e... you can no longer blame the speed of the game. At that point it seems like the powers-that-be are more concerned with stepping on toes than getting the call right. It's infuriating.

Also, just because it has had me pulling my hair out... Why, when there is a spot-of-ball review, is the result "the player did not cross the line to gain", and then the ball is returned to a place that can be up to a yard short of what the freaking replay revealed? You may argue that Landry didn't cross the goal line (if you're blind), but shouldn't the ball be placed at the six-inch line and not between the 1 and 2 yard line?? Drives me batty.

Kudos to you for doing a great job of using the written word to make your point. That was an exceptional post!!!

I just saw this a little bit ago.