Can D'Ernest Johnson get 3 or 4 quarters of positive football and take the reins without fumbling?

That is the question vs the Colts, because Indianapolis has been relyinig on turnovers almost as much as the Browns.

Everybody knows the recipe for the Browns success the last 3 weeks is Pound the rock, and D'Ernest Johnson looked really good and got 95 yards in partial duty last week.

Everybody knows, Chubb protects the football and doesn't fumble, and so the question is
Because I know, Johnson can put up the good game film for 1 or 1 and a half quarters,

But can Johnson put up the game film, and be the feature back for 3 or more quarters without fumbling, which is the best recipe for the Browns to get a win vs. Indy and continue forward without a hitch.

The Recipe doesn't change.

Am I missing something? Isn't Hunt going to be the feature back?

Has he had a fumbling issue in the past? Running the ball against this defense is going to be extremely difficult. Last week they held the bears to 26 yards rushing.

We’ll see how much Johnson’s success had to do with facing a poor defense and an OL that was highly motivated. Our whole team was amped up.

Indy’s defense is probably 1 or 2 in the AFC ... and PIttsburgh is 1 or 2. So, the next 2 weeks are pretty tough sledding

I'm not concerned.. in particular with Hunt being the starter.. He runs hard.

Good rush defense, so maybe we do more passing, at least early to catch them off guard?

I would hope that one day we can reliably do that, but I think the Dallas game showed us that, for now, we will live and die by our running game.

I do have this fear of Johnson fumbling for some reason. Hope he hangs on to the ball.

But watch his presser from Monday. He's a kid you want to root for. Hoping for great things for him.

This is exactly my concern about this game (and of course our porous defense). Per the link below, we are 53% run, 47% pass.

https://www.footballdb.com/stats/play-selection.html?sort=teamname

I'm going to guess we move to 60/40 pass with a lot of play action and Baker roll outs. The Colts D is only giving up 77 rushing yards a game, we're averaging 204 rushing yards on offense...key 1 to the game is which number will be closest to reality. Key 2 will be Baker's performance. Indy is leading the league in interceptions per game and Baker hasn't had one since week 2.

I'm not so sure. I mean if we're talking about the way things look in the moment, on paper, I would agree with you. But it's still early in the season and if you stop to look at their opponents it paints a far muddier picture.

The Steelers have played the Giants, the Broncos and the Texans. None of those teams have been offensive juggernauts against any of their opponents this season. I mean you could use Houston as the exception to the rule but they have been all Bobbed up. If you look at their combined records they stink.

Let's look at Indy. The Jags actually beat them with the dynamic Gardner Minshew at the helm by scoring 27 points. The teams they've beaten? The Vikings, Jets and Bears.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it may not turn out that you're correct. I just feel that making such bold claims based on beating terrible opponents isn't a true grade of how good these two defenses are.

Every RB can fumble if the D makes a good play.

Just look at last week with Zeke coughing it up when Sendejo pried it out, and nobody thinks Sendejo is a better athlete than Zeke.

Just gotta hope he can cover that thing up in important situations.

So we are 4 games in and the Colts have played the Jags (1-3), the Vikings (1-3), Jets (0-4) and the Bears (3-1 [quite possibly the worst 3-1 team in the history of the NFL]).

All of these offenses ( with the exception of the Vikings ) are bottom 25 offenses. The Vikings ( Kirk Cousins ) played terrible against the Colts.

I think the Colts D is good but are they #1 in the league at the end of the year? Hell no.

I think the Colts D will finish around 8-10th defensively. They are good but they are not the 85 Bears.

Let's not forget that both Washington and Dallas had top 15 rushing D stats before facing us.

Just in terms of fumbling and being the #2 for a few weeks, we've got to believe he's a safer bet than Hilliard.

What pops in my eyes are the very quick feet and great balance.

Yes but Washington lost thier top 2 defensive lineman by the second quarter when playing us. I do not expect any of our running backs to eclipse 100 yards in this game let alone 80

Agreed, however i would like to see him get both arms around the ball when weaving through traffic

I thought the Browns were playing the Colts, I guess Johnson is. For your sake I hope he doesn't fumble so he beats the Colts.

I'm going to watch the Browns / Colts game. More players to watch, might be more exciting, hell IDK.

j/c:

This thread has a lot of replies, but I don't get it.

Is Johnson the key to the game?

Does Johnson have a history of fumbling?

Are we not impressed by what he did last week?

Is Hunt not going to be the main back?

I want to believe I am missing something as to why this is such an important topic, but I can't figure it out.

I don't think this is much of a topic. As far as your post goes, I think Johnson will be the main back if it will work out. I think coach would love to keep Hunt in the role he is now, sprinkle him in here and there, come in and dominate in the 4th.

I expect to see Johnson early and often and if there is success he'll take the lead role. If it's an utter failure, play B will be Hunt, Hunt and more Hunt... And plan B will be instituted immediately.

Just curious, but why do you feel Johnson would be the main back, when Hunt is the second most talented back on our team?

Interesting idea. Never thought of that.

This thread is weird. It almost seems like one of those "hot takes" where sombody takes an unfounded position and argues it as if its real.

Fact #1. D'Ernest has never fumbled in the NFL. source:
D'Ernest career stat summary

Secondly, has anyone seen one single report suggesting that Johnson will start ahead of Hunt? Why would he jump over a former league rushing title champion?

Sorry, not sorry. This is absurd.

D'Ernest hasn't fumbled in the NFL, but hasn't had much of a career in the NFL, but
He has a history 4 years in my memory of pre season games and

The whole concept, the whole notion I put in the Thread title is not that Johnson Fumbles,

It's 2: It's That Chubb never fumbles!
(Chubb is out,)
and : It's that the Colts are living off turnovers same as the Browns so, EVERYBODY needs to be protecting the ball conscious this week.

So, D'Ernest looks like a good guy,

And for the question of why discuss Johnson over Hunt?

Hunt was limited from the groin injury, and in the end of the Cowboy game Johnson was being featured not Hunt,

So How healthy is Hunt? I don't know, but it's nice seeing Johnson got 95 yards last week in limited action and

We had featured a 2 back offense, Chubb and Hunt, so I've got to think we have to treat Johnson as a feature back, for at least as many times as he touches the ball next game.


I think D'Ernest can be a good feature back behind this O-line, in this offense as long as he stays healthy, in the short term, because he looked to be playing all out, and productive last game.

And whether he is 2nd or 1st is reliant on Hunts health surely, but
There was a drive in the 4th quarter, if Hunt was healthy, he wasn't on the field, Johnson was and it was surely a run out the clock drive, so, no reason to think Hunt was 100%,
Shoot, give it to em Both for 140 each!

The Colts defense? I don't think it's as good as the Bills defense, but, Run right at em,

I expect the Browns to run for a ton with their combined runners this game, same as the next.

The Recipe doesn't change.

I actually make an effort not to be an obnoxious poster so, let me say that I meant no disrespect.

If your intent was not to link Johnson and fumbling your thread title did not achieve that end. Maybe ball security for the entire team might have been a better choice. I did go take a look at some clips for the Dallas game of that contained all of the backs, Chubb, Hunt, Johnson and Hilliard. Chubb didn't routinely carry the ball with two arms thru traffic. He actually swatts at defenders often when running through trash. He did tuck the ball with both arms when a big hit was imminent. So did Johnson. Actually Hunt seemed like the back who was most likely to cover up the ball most often.

https://vimeo.com/464878207

As far as how they rotate. I think Stump will have a lot of input. Remember against the Bengals, in the 4th quarter Hunt got an extended number of carries that didn't signal any issue with Chubb. Except fresh legs

After reading my post again, let me expand on my meaning. It would also be better to say that this would be my approach.

I don't mean to say that Johnson will be RB1 and Hunt RB2.
I also don't mean to imply some kind of depth chart going forward.
I'm talking about this week's game and the game plan with the most upside...

If we go out and punch them in the face with a no-name running back, what does that say? It says "you cannot beat us where it matters most". It reinforces the juggernaut.

Now they are basically beaten (at least psychologically) before we've even seen the 1st quarter expire.

This also keeps Hunt's role as the bogeyman... the complimentary piece that can strike at any time... and strikes fear at all times.

Now, to reiterate... Plan B is one blown up play or one bad series away, and plan B is Hunt all day!

Why not wage psychological warfare first? If he has success (and he looked great last week), we can end up running downhill with both backs for four quarters. If he doesn't foot the bill, he gets the quick hook.

Not clear here. Is Hunt out? Why the huge concern about fumbling on Johnson's part? I agree it is crucial to take care of the rock, but has he failed to do so? Chubb's out; did this guy leapfrog over Hunt who is playing like a real warrior? Something we do not know yet?

That is a question, is Hunt out, or playing, or limited. I can only go by the 4th quarter of the Cowboy game. Hunt had been questionable in the Cowboy game returning from a groin injury iirc.
In the 4th qtr. Johnson was getting carries.

Hunt IS NOT out. Hunt will get plenty of snaps. Hunt has been battling a groin, so the last thing you would want to do is feed him twenty-five snaps.

Does D'Ernest fumble? I'm not sure anyone ever answered that.

Message to D'Ernest: DON'T fumble

That was my first thought

While I do think some forget that Hunt holds a rushing title from his first season, and he was/is all that is a feature back... the groin is going to be the thing that sees more carries go to our other backs. If Hunt wasn't dinged, I highly doubt KS and co would have any hesitation letting him run wild (especially knowing we have Chubb coming back sooner than later).

Groin injury is a tricky thing. Some caution is warranted.

Someone did answer the question, me, guard dawg. See my earlier post. He has never fumbled in his NFL career.

FATE: we are often of similar minds as far as the team goes. I have to part ways with you here. Johnson should not be singled out for cautions about fumbling. There is no evidence of a problem. He has one of the best running backs coaches in the NFL. Ball security is right up there with pass protection as a prerequisite for a running back to see the field.

Bear with me on this analogy. I work with special needs individuals. If a person is completely ambulatory and you make them use a wallker, or a cane or a gait belt what message are you sending? The first law of treatment, never treat in advance of need.

Unless or until D'Ernest demonstrates that he has a fumbling problem treating his "fumbling problem" is counter productive.

There is no reason to part ways bro. I agree with you 100%. My response was because there seemed to be some mystery as to whether he was a "fumbler". Every few posts would steer back to the thread title, for no good reason, obviously. "Without fumbling" should have never been included in the title.

I don't remember seeing your post but I'm glad you're putting the issue to bed. That was actually my intent with the simple statement: Message to D'Ernest: DON'T fumble, not because I thought he would or does, because everybody kept talking about it.

I can see how reading that would sound like an indictment, it was the furthest thing from that.

With that said...

D'Ernest Johnson doesn't fumble. Leave the kid alone and give him the rock!

Didn't Chubb fumble in the Baltimore game?

<EDIT>
[video:youtube]https://youtu.be/kGKusJg6hqE?t=566[/video]

not complaining but you do realize Chubb has fumbled once this season...as per your claim Chubb never fumbles.

And D'Ernest Johnson has never fumbled in the pros. LOL...…the premise of this thread is crazy.

I remember that Chubb play, and much like the 2nd Cowboy fumble the Browns recovered was because the player was down, but not down on the ground but on another player,

I remember Chubb's knee or something, (not sure I recall), was down on another players chest or body part,

and that's when Chubb let go of the ball, so on that play,

I had totally given Chubb a pass, and figured it a learning experience,
so much so, that in my opinion/mind, Yeah, Chubb still never fumbles.

If he feels his knee go down, he has to assume his knee is on the turf/grass.

S, Happens. Now, about this week.

Bears had 16 rush attempts on the day, only 10 by their main back, and they trailed all day,
One could say the Bears gave up on the run and it's as much their fault as the crappy Colts,

I expect to see the Browns run all over them

The Recipe hasn't changed.

Check: Bears, Nick Foles 26/42 passing on the day.
FORTY TWO, pass attempts to 16 runs,
Fair to say the Bears gave up on the run that day.

The Recipe hasn't Changed! Browns, take it to em!

Has he ever fumbled in a pre-season game, there are 3 or 4 backs that conglomerate together in my memory as big parts of preseasons past.

You need to look at the teams they both played.

The Bears are actually ranked below the Bengals in Rushing Yards per Game, so they may not exactly be a very good measure of the Colts Run D.

We're not likely to ring up 300 yards like we did on Dallas, but I think we'll at least be able to do enough to keep their D honest, and maybe even make them sweat a little.

The Vikings O is more comparable to what we're doing and how we're performing, and it appears that the Colts handled that fairly well. THAT is troubling. Not only is their offense fairly comparable statistically, but so is their defense.

Dalvin Cook got pretty much nothing all day. As a team, they only got 80 yards total.

Three giveaways by Minnesota certainly didn't help them, but they still got trounced. The Colts offense only punted twice; they converted all other drives into at least three points.


This is not going to be easy.
Hopefully, Stefanski has been watching a lot of tape and looking to see what they are susceptible to, or where Minny went wrong, or finding ways to counter how they stopped Minny.

Hopefully we hang a bundle of points and yards on them and our D can get some stops and get off the field. Be aware of stats, but play ball. We are bringing more O than they have seen yet.

Play smart! Just win , baby! Unleash The Elf!

FATE, thanks for clarifying. I better understand your point. Getting a poster's true meaning from their post can be tricky at times.

Purple, I understand the schemes are similar between the Vikes and the Browns. Might there be a difference in the OL talent? Hopefully that's true in favor of the good guys.

Could be the biggest opportunity of D'Ernest Johnson's young career, make the most of it.

While on the surface you are correct, when one looks a little deeper it paints a somewhat different picture. They only ran Cook 14 times. He averaged 4.5 yards per carry. Their backup, Mattison only rushed 3 times for 13 yards. Just over 4 yards per carry. Ham ran once for four yards.

So all of their RB's averaged 4 yards or more per carry but they only rushed the ball a total of 18 times. I haven't looked at that match up closely enough to see if the score was so lopsided they were forced to abandon the run or not, but they certainly did.

Their pass game was putrid that day. Cousins was 11/26 for 113 yards with 3 int's. I propose if you wish to look at why Minnesota looked so bad in that game it was due to Cousins and had little to do with their run game.

If I were to bet, I'd say we will rush the ball a lot more than 18 times.

I had this in the matchup thread





Ind (20) Vs Jax (27)
Jax Rushed 23 times For 91 yds (3.95) (5 for 19 by Minshew)
14 of those including 3 for 19 by Minshew were in the 1st half.
Jax down by 3 at the half, tied end of 3rd


Min (11) vs Ind (28)
Min rushed 18 times for 80 yds (4.44)
10 for 43 1st half
Min Down by 12 at the half and 15 at end of 3rd qtr

NYJ (7) vs Ind (36)
NYJ rushed 29 times for 109 yds (3.75) (5 for 20 by Darnold)
17 for 69 1st half (3 for 10 by Darnold)
NYJ Down by 10 at the half, 24 end of 3rd

Ind (19) vs Chi (11)
Chi rushed 16 for 28yds (1.75) (2 for -1 by Foles)
11 for 17 1st half (2 for -1 by Foles)
Chi down 10 at the half, 13 end of 3rd, 16 with just under 4 min left

Seems their opponents are going away from the run in the second half, even Jax who was not behind or out of the game).

Aside from Chicago, seems teams have run decently on them, then gave up the run.

Thanks Florida. That gives a much better overall picture than I did.

That is a great post, Florida. Thanks.

We need to avoid some of the lousy Ratbird approach, and go with what works. Our offense has to hurt them more than Darnold did. More running for us is less time on the field for them. And keeping our secondary might be a valid key to victory. The Cows gave us some insight and measured us; this game possibly even mores.

Get your popcorn ready!

I think it is obvious we have already abandoned the plan used in the Ravens game.

Stefanski has said he has changed his play calling based on what we could and couldn't do.