There's the QB.

Pro style QB. Will be able to pick up the playbook day one. Not physically talented. Can be a good backup for years.

I believe Kessler had five offensive coordinators in his five years at USC. I know he had at least three (Kiffin, Sark, Helton), I think there are two I'm missing.

horrible pick

First bad pick.

I'm not a big fan of this pick .... but I guess this is who Hue Jackson wanted.

We traded down for this waste of a pick? Come on.

Man, CBS has him rated as a 7th/FA.

After sharing the starting role with Max Wittek for the first two games of the 2013 season, Kessler went on to emerge as Southern Cal's replacement for Matt Barkley as a junior, ultimately passing for 2,968 yards and a solid 20 touchdowns against seven interceptions.
Those numbers jumped significantly under new coach Steve Sarkisian in 2014 (3,826 yards and 39 touchdowns against just five interceptions) and Kessler entered 2015 as a Heisman frontrunner. Injuries to his offensive line (especially at center) and a midseason firing of Sarkisian threatened to ruin the Trojans season and did impact Kessler's production, with his completion percentage (65.4%), passing yards (2,968) and touchdowns thrown (20) all slipping from his eye-popping junior season.

Lacking the size and arm strength scouts would prefer, Kessler's isn't the top-notch talent his career production (including a 88-19 touchdown to interception ratio) would seem to indicate. Physically, he failed to stand out amid a mediocre crop of quarterbacks at the Senior Bowl, likely cementing his place as a Day Three candidate.

STRENGTHS WEAKNESSES

STRENGTHS: Put up big numbers in coach Steve Sarkisian's pro-style offense, which calls for a variety of downfield throws, including NFL staples like quick slants, deep posts and outs and wheel routes. His comfort with the system and patience are clear as he often checks second and third reads before passing. Has a quick set-up and release of the football and shows great anticipation, firing passes before receivers break into their routes, along with good pocket awareness. Kessler is pretty effective at creating space in the pocket, exhibiting light feet and spatial awareness while keeping his eyes downfield. Kessler also shows impressive accuracy on the move, making him dangerous even as the pocket breaks down and on the designed roll-outs in Sarkisian's pro-style scheme. When he is forced to run, Kessler shows his competitiveness, surprising defenders with sneaky athleticism and leg drive. Beloved in the program for his intangibles, including leadership and commitment to the team. Characterized as the first person in the door by teammates. Voted a team captain.
WEAKNESSES: Simply lacks ideal size and arm strength to fit in most NFL offenses. Challenged by Sarkisian at times to be more aggressive and give his tight ends and receivers opportunities to make plays downfield. Struggles to push the ball downfield on throws longer than 15 yards, too often sailing passes over the head of his intended receivers when he overcompensates. Many of his passes are underneath routes or dump-offs to running backs, and lacks the same zip throwing to the outside unless he can fully step into the pass. Despite significant starting experience, appeared rattled at times when his protection broke down.

IN OUR VIEW: Like Matt Barkley before him, Kessler is a draftable - but not exciting - NFL prospect because of some physical limitations and the fact that the talent around him and scheme in which he's enjoyed such great success have inflated his production. He possesses the intangibles to project as a quality backup but he'd likely struggle in a starting role with NFL defenses crowding close and forcing him to beat them over the top.

3rd in the nation in accuracy. I tried telling y'all Connor cook is not good.

Not awful, not great. I don't expect much from him.

Questionable pick, after a pretty good draft? But who knows

what a terrible, terrible, TERRIBLE selection

he'd be available in the 6th round I bet ... this pick really angers me. HE SUCKS

http://www.scout.com/college/usc/story/1604835-cody-kessler-knows-adversity

A possible game manager in sort relief ... seems like there where better prospects on the board.

I just said that in the other thread.

Mike Silver reporting


Hue Jackson happiness level right now: Turnt up

This pick irritates me. Why did we trade down for a backup qb? They are a dime a dozen. We have plenty of backup qbs.

cook is a backup at best.

He hasnt heard the complaining yet.

Most QBs selected at this spot are backups at best. Might as well get the guy the head coach likes.

Ya we'll be revisiting the asshattery in the cook thread when I'm more sober.

I'd keep Connor Shaw over this guy.

Kessler is miles better than Shaw. Miles.

(Kessler is not that good. Shaw is really bad.)

Great jacoby brissett will learn under brady and be the next franchise qb. 2 picks before ours. Just watch

This. Shaw is bad, not sure why people love him so much.

Because all the other Patriot backup QBs have turned out to be great. . .

I'll do a full Kessler breakdown sometime this weekend. I haven't reviewed his film.

Funny thing, the NFL Network Profile says his ability to hit receivers with catchable throws falls off the table when forced to scramble but your quote says he's got good accuracy when on the run.

Wonder what these guys are looking at that the come to two different conclusions like that?

At least he is a QB from a Pro style offense.

Show me, Hue. Show me. Not in love. Going to need to see him not be Colt 2.0

Austin Davis or Connor Shaw just lost their job.

I really think our FO is targeting guys who "look like" other well established NFL stars.

I saw Kessler play live in the 2014 Holiday Bowl and it seemed like he had complete control of that game. This feels like Hue's pick to me.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=400610220

Comparisons I draw initially are...

Brian Hoyer
(Young unpolished) Tom Brady and
Kelly Holcomb

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/cody-kessler-1.html

Numbers are pretty staggering.

Cody could end up being a real gem as a back up. He is very accurate in passes under 25 yards. I mean like extremely accurate. Anything beyond that though and it gets bad real fast. Still he can do great in a WCO system where you stretch it wide versus vertical.

That being said we could have easily got in in the 4th or 5th round so to me it's a wasted pick.

Well, we know he's not meant to start this year. That job will most likely go to Griffin III, so he can sit and watch, perhaps get some pro level training for his arm in order to get a few more yards on his throws.

I'm intrigued by this kid...

I talked to a friend who is a huge USC fan

Says Kessler is the complete deal with everything but elite arm strength.

Says he is a smart QB who doesn't get rattled. Told me he has been through 5 head coaching changes and doesn't get rattled

When your number one pick is a speedster WR, can this pick get it down field for Coleman to run under it ?

I think I would have preferred Cardale Jones who can toss it long to the speedster...

Cardale is junk.

Wasted pick or more of a luxury pick when this team can't afford luxury picks we need players that are going to play not be 3rd or 4th string QBs... Did anyone else see the Browns draft room on NFL network right before the draft? There was 4 people in there and they even said on NFL network the Browns draft room looks like everyone already went home and their pick showed it... Good/great draft so far but this one has me scratching my head.

It's not a wasted pick and here's why...

We have the next TWO picks. Conner Cook is still on the board.

We are going to spend the next day shopping one of those two picks to the highest bidder for Conner Cook. I would be surprised if there is no trade.

We find ourselves in a position with a lot of leverage once again.

Kessler is a very smart QB, I'm just not sure he has the arm talent needed... Which is weird because that was the first thing Hue said he wants in a QB.

I think they may have gotten too cute with this trade down and missed out on their real target.

Game manager, protects the ball, accurate, somewhat mobile, knows adversity.

I watched erratic Kessler a few times...as he'd have a dynamite game...then just be horrid the following week...what a waste of a pick...I thought he'd go 6th round at earliest...makes zero sense to me

Why not take Jerell Adams or Billings at least they have the ability to contribute and possibly be starters in a year or two, Kessler will be out of the NFL in 3 years or less.

If we are obtaining picks for a gem QB next year...why take a high pick on Kessler? analytics will prolly point saying we will save $1.60 mill releasing Austin Davis....Some people will try to defend this pick...I've watched him play and he is Matt Barkley 2.0...a #3 QB at best...when we could have gotten a starter at numerous other positions

Is he a Ken Dorsey type ?

I like Jerrel Adams alot

Somewhat better...Dorsey had alot more elite talent around him...I guess Hie was right when saying their guy isn't the "norm" guy people want

Adams is a very athletic TE and we could go with two TE sets with Barnidge and Adams. We need playmakers, instead of trading the pick why not take Hooper at TE instead he went 4 pick after the 77 pick I think. You have 12 or 13 picks stop trading down and take BPA.

I have not liked a USC QB in a very long time.

However, this was almost a 4th round pick, and it is someone who Hue Jackson likes, and I am OK with the rest of the draft so far ..... so, in finishing up this long run on sentence, I guess I am OK with giving Hue the QB he wanted, even if I think it was a poor value pick.

Who knows? Maybe he becomes our Kirk Cousins. I certainly never saw him becoming anything more than a backup.

I still think that we could have taken him deeper in the draft.

Thanks, just didn't see any of Kessler.. He seems more of the shorter throw QB. That made me wonder how he could contribute to getting the ball down field for Coleman to run under.

It would be nice to find that Rothlesburger, Brady type who was expected to be a back up, then end up being a H.O.F

Both are just god awful so I think both are gone.

I agree our weapon arsenal is still pretty bare we have Corey Coleman and some scrubs...potentially Duke as a weapon... But could have created a weapon in Jerrel Adams...heck even split him wide for a fade...considering behind Barnidge we have noone...

Hitting Coleman in stride 15 yards downfield and having him go 65 yards for a TD is an ok scenario also

That sounds very good, I guess it doesn't always have to be the deep ball for a big gain... I do enjoy seeing that though...

I also hated when we traded down in round 3...could have had a CB to fill in, a FS or SS to fill in...added another WR to contribute, a TE to play behind Barnidge, an ILB, and OLB, a C to backup Erving...but we had to take a #3 or #4 QB

The Washington game better be his worst tape because those first two minutes were brutal.

Did he have some kind of lingering injury this season?

My first thought was Brandon Weeden. Terrible under pressure, but we'll see.

I know this isn't what we're doing, but if we are going to trade, I'd like for us to be looking to trade back into rounds at this point, and burn off some of those later round picks. I don't like trading back at this point.

IMO, the second, third, and fourth rounds are where you can really do some damage. I pointed out earlier about the Titans. When the dust settled, they picked 3 times in the top half of the second round. Clustering picks there, to me, is a phenomenal strategy (keep in mind, I don't know what the net was in terms of pick value that they gained/lost in order for them to pick at those spots). All I'm saying is that we're at the back end of what I consider the sweet spot of the draft. Draft value chart at this point in the draft makes it easier to trade up vs the first and even the second round, and there is still talent available. We should be maximizing our swings during rounds 2-4.

Plus, trading down probably only nets us 5th round and later picks.

I dunno.

I agree...alot of great talent in round 4...I will plug away and trade our later round picks to remain close to this talent...Walk away with Jerrel Adams, Kentrell Brothers, Jordan Howard, Jalen Mills, Jack Allen, and a SS and wrap it up...plus we already have our 6th rounder in Kessler

Considering Tom Brady was also one of the other Patriot backup quarterbacks actually yes, yes they are easily the QB factory compared to any other team.

"The guy has had a tremendous career,'' said Jackson, defending what seemed liked a questionable pick. "I understand where everyone's coming from. But Cody Kessler is the guy for us.''

Kessler (6-1, 215) started all 14 games in 2015, passing for 3,536 yards with 29 touchdowns and seven interceptions. But it was Kessler's accuracy that captured Jackson's attention.

"Accuracy (is what I'm looking for),'' said Jackson. "He has pinpoint accuracy. He can throw the ball straight to the guy he's throwing it to, and if you can't, you can't play in the NFL.''

Jackson also cited Kessler' touchdown-to-interception ratio of 88-19 and his experience in a pro-style offense.

"He's everything you look for in a quarterback,'' said Jackson. "We're bringing him in for a reason -- because he has the characteristics we're looking for. Let's give him an opportunity to compete. Hopefully he'll ascend up the ladder.''

Dane Brugler of CBS Sports ranked Kessler (6-1, 215) No. 17 among quarterbacks and projected him as a priority free agent.

Brugler wrote in his draft guide, "a three-year starter in USC's pro-style scheme, Kessler was an ideal fit for the Trojans' offense due to his understanding of timing and tempo, posting impressive production each season – was the west coast version of Aaron Murray in college.

"There is a lot to like about his football intelligence and make-up, doing an excellent job taking what the defense gives him, but panics and struggles to anticipate without a clean pocket.

"A highly productive college quarterback, Kessler has a low NFL ceiling due to his lack of physical traits, lacking the necessary arm strength to put the ball where he wants on a consistent basis – might be able to stick as a back-up similar to Murray or Chase Daniel, but won't elevate players around him.''

Kessler said he tried to ignore the mock drafts and the predictions about where he'd be drafted. One scout told draft expert Nolan Nawrocki that Kessler "can be a solid backup because he's smart.''

But Kessler knows how Jackson feels about him.

"I flew to Cleveland in March and I knew it was one of the teams I had a connection with,'' Kessler said.

He said he's used to playing the underdog role. Pegged as a backup at USC, he took it personally and ended up winning the starting job as a sophomore.

"Whether I'm backup or get a chance to compete right away, I'm going to give it 100%,'' he said.

Kessler stressed that he had five coaching changes in his three years at USC, which contributed his dropoff in production from 2014 to 2015.

"I don't know if it's a good thing, but I got use to it,'' he said.

Kessler said he's always had to work for everything he's gotten.

"I do believe I can play in this league,'' he said on a conference call.

Jackson thinks so too.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ss..._river_home_pop

The round 3 trade down didn't make a lot of sense. Why did we give back a 5? CAR came out on top even giving us the 3, 4, 5 for our pick.

Man I would much rather have packaged that 77 with 32 for Treadwell than what we did with it. Sheesh.

I think the Browns front office is focusing on "team culture". For instance, these picks - including Kessler - rank high in leadership.

Unfortunately Hue doesn't play the WCO....

Get him in the gym. Add some muscle to the kid and try to pump up his arm strength. Maybe improving his mechanics and footwork will abate some of that lack of strength. Still, a very strange pick. Hue Jackson has up to this point liked to go downfield. A QB with a very good arm would seem a requisite for this offense....

If Kessler is a solid backup we are golden. Veteran backup QBs make a pretty good amount of money. If we get four cheap years out of Kessler that is great value. If he becomes more, even better.

Kessler's ceiling is not all that high. At his best he is Teddy Bridgewater. But his floor is pretty high as well. I can't see him being any worse than Chase Daniel (a steady backup who has floated around the league for years).

Make up your mind. Where's his ceiling?

He looked like Weeden under pressure in the Washington game this season. Hopefully, he'll get better with some time in the same system. I do get the impression he'll be a backup who keeps competing.

Watching the press conference, Hue seemed really excited to have Kessler. As much as I wanted other players at 93 and wanted to bring in Hogan as QB - if Hue is that happy about bringing him in, I'll hold off on judgement for a few years on the pick.

Sorry, I meant floor when comparing to Daniels. My bad.

He does panic under pressure at times, but he also has functional knowledge of how an offense should work. That should help him minimize some mistakes. Weeden panicked and then ended up backhand flipping balls to the opposing team.

Kessler is Hogan without all the work to refine the delivery. Both are probably backups. One you have to work with a ton, the other comes in and can play day one if you need him.

+1000!!

It looked like he wanted to pull a Flipper in one of his gametapes. Luckily he has huge hands and thought better of it. I'l reserve judgement on him. I have heard some good things, and he's dealt with near Browns level dysfunction already a USC

I would say that the dysfunction at USC over the past several years has exceeded USC.

Remember how Manziel showed up intoxicated to practice? USC's head coach did that (more than once).

This is Hue's guy. I have to believe he knows what he wants and what he is doing. As Hue said, this kid is everything you look for in a QB.

He also does have huge (10 7/8") hands, so he should be able to handle winter ball. (and since everyone was so worried about this over the past few years)

Nooo... He can't handle the winter ball, he's from Bakersfield.

I'm thinking, 5 coaches in 3 years, this guy was made for Cleveland football.

Board, grade, talent, pick. Enough cliches ?

Accountability and dependency is the evaluation I want in 3 years.

It's hard to find something on YouTube that's not littered with that profanity laced rap garbage, but I did find this.

We got our 3rd round travis wilson pick. Total waste coulda got him in the 5th.

Yep. I'm all for letting Hue have his guy, but why take him here when most had him going so late? Was there a real threat of others taking him or was Hue impatient?

If he make a QB out of him, who cares. If he flops, Hue is married to him two years from now... Or is he? Maybe we are going to play the odds by getting QBs every year, and looking for that diamond in the rough.

I really don't care at this point. They can pick whoever they want, I just want them to start producing wins. We already know this season is a planned bust, and probably next season too. The third year is where the games will really start to count.

Exactly. I'm not questioning selecting him ... it's WHERE we selected him. The third round?! There are still viable starters available! Why not take him in the 6th ... he'd be there

Hmm...

I understand what Hue likes about him: dependable, smart, game manager type. Pretty good pocket feel considering limited athleticism.

BUT, I don't see the arm/accuracy every working at starter level in the NFL. More of a checkdown artist. If he's reluctant to throw it deep in College playing in California, he won't do it in the NFL in Cleveland.

High floor, very low ceiling type. Will be a backup for a long time. Maybe there's value in that? Polar opposite of Connor Cook, who I actually liked because he reminded me of Weeden

Think AJ McCarron...

I personally didn't want Cook ... BUT I'd prefer him over Kessler. At least Cook has some upside IMO. Kessler has ZERO ceiling.

Cook must have been a huge jerk

You may think that, but you don't know that. This is the guy Hue wanted, so we got him.

Since Cody was the guy we wanted, better to pick him a round early then wait a pick too late. No?

I've noticed the same. Seemingly every college marching band plays 'O Fortuna'. I'd like to see a highlight clip set to that.

Yeah, said something similar in the chat the other day. You gotta keep drafting "Weedens", especially if you can have them with mid round picks and you have multiple of them. Eventually you'll luck into one with half a brain.

Guy's like Kessler are much safer picks and will have longer careers, but you'll keep looking for a QB every year if thats all you have. Colt McCoy, McCarron, Keenum, A.Davis etc etc

I don't need volume to watch a vid.

With all the other needs the Browns have, I fail to understand why this pick was made. Surely, there was more talent available at positions of need. I look at guys like Miller and Vannett as examples (not being a Buckeye homer - just two players off of the top of my head).

Hoping he turns out to be more than a glorified clipboard holder. I suppose we will see.

Kessler is my least favorite pick would have preferred Justin Simmons or Nickel Vsnnett

This was a bad pick because at the very least, we could have taken him with one of the FOURS on Saturday. Two guards, a safety and a tight end all went after we took this guy. No one was going to select him in the third. And really, this cat could have been taken much, much later - maybe even as a free agent. So in that sense, it was a wasted pick.
I know people will say, "If it's your guy, you go get him." Yeah, no.

31 (93) Cleveland Browns: Cody Kessler | Grade: B-
(Pick acquired in trade with Carolina Panthers)

One of the most accurate quarterbacks in the class, Kessler ranked third with a 78.2 percent accuracy percentage while finishing fourth with a 68.5 percent accuracy percentage under pressure. He struggled with passes beyond 20 yards (31st in accuracy percentage at 37.5 percent) but Kessler can run the offense and move the chains at the short and intermediate level.

j/c:

This pick baffles me. He is a smart kid. He's a very hard worker. He put up big numbers. But man, he can't throw a good pass over 15 yards.

Terrible pick. Wasted pick.

It's probably outdated thinking by me at this point, but I'm still in the "never trust a USC QB" camp.

We have 8 more picks today and the first two off the clock. Spend one of them on Cook and let the two duke it out for 3rd string.

I don't think they should have drafted a qb at that spot, but I would have taken Hogan or Cardale before Kessler.

Kessler is 6'1" tall. His ball flutters on anything over 15 yards. Man!

They were bound to take a QB at some point and that spot is only 6 higher than their next two picks. That's not a whole lot of difference.

I guess I just don't understand this pick.. I was with them all the way with everyone else, but this one confuses me.

We probably could've picked him up in the 7th or as an UDFA, or not at all and been better off because we could've taken someone we actually needed. Austin Hooper, Le'Raven Clark, Kendall Fuller or even Braxton Miller would all have been better picks in positions of need.

While we may have drafted a two or three potential starters, all of them need coached up, have short comings and have potential for bust. IMHO, nothing in this draft so far warrants giving up a shot at a franchise QB, so here we are, hanging hope on a likely low first round pick next year and a couple future second round picks that are going to somehow make the trade and the trade downs miraculously valuable. Unless of course, we haven't found our superstars yet. We still have four rounds to go. Yay! Go Sashi Browns!

God no! Why would you compound a mistake with a blunder?

What QB has been successful in the league who has a weak arm? When defenses know you won't go deep, they dragggggg you!!

How did we acquire this pick?

The Philly trade? The Titan trade?

Trade down from Carolina, it was their pick. We also picked up a fourth and swapped (I believe) 5ths.

i think it was whoever we swapped with in the 3rd.

I'm not gonna try to judge this pick. However, I'm pretty confident Hue was very much a part of the decision.

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/media-center/index.html

I believe the first video shown is a conversation with Cody. Hue's comments, IMO, tell me he was high on him.

LOL............I was way off.

Thanks.

They were bound to take a QB, if not Cook or Kessler then who would not have been a blunder?

I agree. It also shows that this was our QB target. We could have had Wentz, but this is Hue's guy, the guy he wanted. Our football guy made this pick. No sense waiting a little too long and losing him.

No see, you misunderstand me. We obviously have to live with the mistake. There's just no reason to compound that with the blunder of taking Cook too. But since you're asking, if you're going to take a project who may eventually be able to play NFL football and throw deeper that 20 yards, I go with Dak Prescott or even Cardale before I'd take Cook or Kessler.

You know, because none of us can make any sense of this player at that slot there must be something we don't know or are not considering.

Maybe Kessler has a rocket arm for the ages but made it his life-long goal to not reveal that until he stepped on an NFL gridiron and Hue got wind of it, or, as the evening wore on our FO had a few too many drinks and forgot what round they were in, or, Jimmy sat silent but Dee pulled rank because she thinks Kessler's cute and wants to fix him up with her niece.

Probably none of that stuff. So what is it they were thinking. There has to be some kind of sense in it I would think. Hmmm...

Obviously our coach feels differently.

Maybe he's not done growing, and he'll get taller and stronger. I'm sure they're doing amazing things with genetics and gene therapies at USC.

Or, maybe they just made a mistake.

Obviously.

Kessler's 2014 tape seems a lot better than his 2015. He has a little Tom Brady to his game.

He really seems to have missed Agholor and Buck Allen.

I noticed the C on his chest in the 2014 Arizona State game so he was a multi-year team captain.

Maybe the arm strength can improve.

Pretty much... so they gave up pick 77 for a 4th and a QB with the high ceiling of a Hoyer / Mc carron ... urp

Maybe. Only time will tell on that one. This is the guy Hue wanted. He says to trust him. He is convinced this guy will be the real deal...I didn't want to say real McCoy .

Hue seems to think arm strength is over rated. He wants them smart and accurate. That's what he went out and got.

j/c

This is like one of those picks I mentioned somewhere where it's easy to talk yourself into liking or at least justifying the pick..... Having said that I think it's too high. And having said that ... like someone else said - if we'd taken him 6 picks later "in the 4th round" I doubt I'd bat an eye.

The reason for concern = 6'1" and loses accuracy when on the run... and an 'average arm' ... whenever I read that I think 'noodle arm'! We'll see.

Reasons the pick might make sense = he's very football smart and I love smart QB's - accuracy from the pocket is very high - Has gone through 5 HC's and still been very productive. I think Shaw is gone for sure. . . . I think there's agood chance one more leaves too. Personally I like McCown and would keep him despite his age. I love his team mentality and selflessness.

I read where Hue said something like: "you'll just have to trust me on this one."

Why?

Wasn't Hue responsible for the Raiders trading for Carson Palmer and getting Pryor in the Supplemental Draft?

Sorry Hue...........I don't trust you on this one.

This pick kinda reeks of Hue's interference. The Browns went away from what was working for them.

This one could be a joke for a years. The Browns passed on Wentz and ended up w/Kessler.

Where is that one guy........oh, what's his name....loves Alabama? I can envision him saying:

"What's a Cody Kessler?"

we just need to pull a New England with this guy... let him sit and learn have two or three really good games in relief that overstates his value then dump him off for a high 2...

Don't count on that. Once a person gets to be 21 or so, they throw about as hard as they are ever going to throw. Now what can be coached is his ability to throw near his max on a more consistent basis by addressing mechanics.

Maybe, but the problem I have with that is that it's obvious to everyone that he lacks downfield ability. Could they not have noticed that? Are they really going to get into training camp and go, "Oh crap, this guy can't throw beyond 15 yards!" They have to have known that, but took him anyway.

Maybe Hue thinks it's footwork and he can fix that. But if that's the case I'd think a couple of you guys would have seen that as well.

It doesn't matter who they pick, they have to have some kind of reason for it. My problem is, what could their reason be for taking a guy who sorely and obviously lacks a necessary skill for the position? Maybe he's Jimmy's love child and he wanted to something nice for his baby mama.

Or maybe they see long term the guy can be a solid startr in the league. Also, maybe they feel that RGIII is our long term starter and this guy is solid insurance in a back-up role.

Al Davis was still alive when the Raiders took Pryor.

And Carson has game. A lot of it. I dont think Hue should be blamed for the pick up. Overpaid.

All that said, still in show me mode. Kessler has a lot of the same traits as Palmer now and the Bengals guys. Now it is up to Hue to prove us wrong.

Please prove us wrong Hue

You know............I praised the trade from two. I praised the trade from 8 to 15. I liked the Coleman pick. I liked the Ogbah pick. I liked the Nassib pick. I was okay w/the other Coleman pick.

But, because I don't like this pick..........I am unreasonable and am just trying to trash this FO no matter what, right?

Here's a good look at him and I like the way they made this video. It's a bit long but you don't have to watch all of it. It's a game last season between USC and Notre Dame and it's just the passing plays for USC, you get to see the good outcomes and the bad one's. And no craptastic music playing in the background. He does seem to go through his progressions and not just lock onto a particular target.

Who the hell is saying this? Stop trying to stir crap up. It's obnoxious.

You mean the inimitable SuperBrown. I saw he posted yesterday. I do miss his "different" sense of humor...

WTF!

Here I am thinking I'm expressing my dislike for this pick while trying to figure out why the hell they took him.

My entire post on him was complaining about the pick while trying to understand why they did it and you take that as me hinting that you are being unreasonable because you don't like the pick.

I can't even freaking agree with you anymore without this kind of shit!

I don't see any of that...Look, had it been me, I wouldn't have selected the guy. I couldn't have told you who he was before the pick.

But, Hue is all in with this guy. I am with you and some others, I am not convinced Hue is all that much of a QB guru, but he is our coach and one of our football guys...and don't doubt that Hue had major input on this pick.

In his presser he said something along the lines of....I understand...you're just going to have to trust me.

That pretty much sums it up for me..we are just going to have to trust him. This is Hue's guy. He owns the pick.

Style wise. But Kessler can only dream of being half as good as Palmer, IMO

They drafted him because of his hand size. He has YUGE hands ... 10-7/8!

But seriously, it seems a bit high to take a guy who most project to have a fairly low ceiling ... Gil Brandt says he'll probably be a decent career backup QB. Faint praise, if you ask me - but nobody asked me. He reminds me of Colt McCoy, when he came out of UT. I would have preferred Cook or Cardale.

First thing I thought of when I read that line as well.

This pick depresses me both because it was such a reach and because of all the possibilities it ended. We didn't want Carson Wentz. We missed on Paxton Lynch. Sp our "developmental" quarterback now is a guy who might become a competent backup game manager. Or might be Matt Barkley. Yuck.
12-gage, Cook, Prescott or someone like them would have provided hope for something more down the road. If all we are doing is drafting a backup for when RGIII goes down, what was so wrong with McCown or Davis? I can only hope I am wrong. Odds are usually good there.

Saying we missed on Lynch is misleading. Had we wanted him, we had far more ability to get him then did Denver.

Lol. And you accuse others of starting the crap around here.

I don't understand this pick at all.

Me neither. But I do have to say it was an fairly impressive draft up to this point. Maybe its a hiccup, or maybe we're off base. Maybe while I see Colt McCoy, Hue sees Drew Brees.

Fair enough, Balpeen. "Missed" was the wrong word on Lynch. We didn't want him, either. I guess we are going to roll with RGIII, and if he can be salvaged, none of this will matter. If not, we will be picking high in 2017 or 2018 and will already have our third string QB in place. Yay.

I really thought we were looking at Dak or 12-gauge. I guess we still could, grooming Kessler for backup while Dak or 12 for starter, but that seems a bit ridiculous.

Cardale must be sick about not coming out last year. I would bet the house he would have gone in the 2nd round, if not late 1st round, if he had. Its not always a good idea to go back to school.

I just went and looked at the QB'S Hue has worked with and had on teams he's been with ... And now weather u like the pick or not .... It makes sense skill set wise .... Take a look ....

You'll notice a theme of guys that were SUPPOSE to be smart, accurate and for the most part pocket passers .... A few big arms in there ...

Skins

Tony Banks, Shane Mathews, Patrick Ramsey .....

Cincinnati - Carson Palmer for 3 years ...

Falcons - Joey Harrington for 1 year

Baltimore - Flacco for 2 years

Raiders

Campbell - 1.5 years ... He got hurt and Hue went and traded for

Palmer .....

And then Dalton for the last 4 years ...

I was really shocked at that list ... Not sure what I expected but it sure wasn't almost exclusively strict drop back passers ...

Palmer, Dalton, Cambell all have the same skill sets ,,,

Accurate, smart, pocket guys ... SAME AS CODY ... And only one of them had a real strong arm ... Palmer ...

Look ... When u draft a QB in rnd. 3 your looking for lightning in a bottle ... It's a long shot on a good day .... And this guy has the skill set I LOVE in my QB'S .... Accurate, Smart, good feet, ....

Despite the fact I love his skill set ..... Very iffy at best on this pick ... The kid went through a lot in 4 years ... So he accomplished a lot and some of the inconsistency can be attributed to a lack of continuity .... Never playing in the same O in back to back years is tough as an NFL vet much less a 20 year old kid .....

The one major concern is the arm strength .... That scares me as a long term starter .... And I don't see Hue being this QB guru at all ... What he did with Cambell was AMAZING ... But that's all that stands out to me as far as him being some QB savant ...

So the fact that if your not Bill Walsh and your looking for a QB after rnd 2 your success rate is virtually zero .... And I think this kid can be a decent back up ... I have no probs with the pick ...

Now ... U guys wil know more about this than me ... VERS ....

Who was available we could have taken and why would they have been a better pick .... I have no clue ... That's why I ask ... Once u get this deep in the draft ... Every position is a crap shoot ... The odds at any position are slim .... Some are just slimmer than others ...

So what we're are other options here guys .... And why would they have been better picks ....

We will be picking high in 2017 for sure, and very likely 2018... don't sweat it.

JC,

I agree that there were better prospects to mold as your backup than Kessler. While this looks to be one of the better, "hey this actually makes sense", drafts; I would have rather gambled with a guy like Cardale Jones to develop as your backup knowing he at least has the ability to make any throw on the field. This was a weak attempt at a project QB.

Then again, we will most likely be drafting high next year and in the running for our QB of the future unless our ragtag assembled group can make some magic under Hue.

In all likelihood, a complete waste of a 3rd round pick. All I can say is it's a very good possibility we will be picking 1 overall next year and they better step up and make the pick and take the best QB!

Dare I say very Brian Hoyerisk?

*LOL* ..... Sad but true ... Oh how so true ...

Of the picks the Browns have made so far, the one I thought the Browns would ace is picking a QB, due to Hue's experience.

I seriously question the pick of Cody Kessler and believe there was better talent on the board.

BUT, I will trust that Hue made this pick and got the guy he wanted. Now we must wait to see if Kessler can become the Browns future starter.

My question...how many years do the Browns invest in developing Kessler?...and if he doesn't make the grade, when do the Browns draft another QB?

Hi Diam - nice to see you posting. First, imo, there was no urgency to go QB at all with this pick. We could have picked the TE, Vannett, who went next, because we are very thin at TE after Barnidge. Second, when you are picking QBs in the mid rounds, it seems to me that is when you should shoot for the stars because that's where you can afford the risk of a blown pick. I would have waited til the 4th round and taken Cardale Jones because of his potential upside, and told him "you are sitting for a couple years; pay attention.". To take Kessler at this spot with Cook, Cardale, and Prescott available because of Kessler viability as a backup seems like taking the low-hanging fruit to me.

Why does he have to be a future starter?

When it comes to QBs I'll defer to Hue but I feel like Kessler would have been available later. They passed on Justin Simmons and Nickel Vannett who were still on the board.

Hoyer is his ceiling, his best case

Exactly. The fact is we could have taken any QB in this draft except for Goff and we could have made a play to move up to #1 to get him. Hue and company didn't WANT any other QB. This is the young man they desired. I didn't see Hue or Sashi saying he's a back up. Hue said he is the QB they wanted. Period. So we shall see what Hue can do with the kid. He got his guy.....

Because our head coach put his name on the line. He said "trust me" this young man is IT. THE QB I HAD to have. So trust is earned. Had he been luke warm that would be one thing. Hue Jackson was like Tom Cruise on Oprah jumping up and down on the coach over Katie Holms.

Just once I wish this organization would draft a franchise QB and put this QB thing to rest. Instead, we will keep wondering for the next several years when we will get a QB of the future. This is Hue's guy, I don't seem drafting a QB in any of the next several years.

You bastardized his words a bit. He didn't say this man is IT. Or the QB I HAD TO HAVE. At least I don't recall him saying that. I do recall him saying 'trust me'. That was in regards to him being selected earlier than many people thought....not being the answer as our future starting QB.

I don't think any HC is putting his job on the line simply by drafting a 3rd round QB. It does however, if proven to be a complete dud, questions his ability to judge QB talent.

Tom Cruise jumping up and down?....c'mon, get real.

well, don't go holding your breath expecting to see anything of this kid soon.


I wouldn't plan to have any expectations of him performing before the 2018 season. He definitely was not drafted for the 2016 season, and almost definitely not 2017, either.... so develop some patience.

Amen this bs is getting old. But hey, lets all trust Hue on this one.

Please tell me that was sarcasm. I have gotten old being patient with this team.

memp...what kind of question is that?

If the new guys are simply wasting draft picks on players they do not expect to become starters, this franchise is deep trouble.

His center was injured a lot of the season, and as we saw with Mack that can affect a QB/Offense. He also had the midyear coaching change with the weird Sarkisian situation. He also had young receivers who were/are still more athletes than polished pass catchers/route runners.

He took more deep shots in 2014 and the ball seems to jump off his hand better. Placement seems better as well.

In the mean time, how many other peotential QB's will we pass up waiting to see if this kid is the one?

With all the holes this team has, why are we drafting backups?

On the plus side, I read this kid had 5 coaches in 3 years, so he should be right at home here.

Yeah, I don't get this theory that we're drafting a backup at this stage. We have a lot of needs, and we already have 3 backups on the roster, 2 of which are serviceable.

jfan...debating this isn't worth my time. No team drafts a guy not expecting him to start for them at some point...most understand that.

Maybe they drafted him to be an upgrade on one of our backups. They probably didn't draft him to be our Franchise QB for years to come.

I question them picking him at that slot in the 3rd.

j/c...

just read the first two pages and I'm going to have my say like all have had.

My Goodness. I think all should have an opinion but for the MANY who actually think they NO MORE and BETTER than Hue Jackson are amazing. One guy wanted us to use the pick to package it for a WR.

One poster complains about us moving back to make the pick...which really confused me...why it wasn't a move up it was a move back.

We got our guy with our THIRD pick of the round and picked up a 4th and 5th (what was that an exchange...I missed us giving a pick)

I would advise all before they make fools of themselves to watch the Presser with Hue talking about the pick. He goes into some specifics. Thinking back it was why even I was not sure about Cook (accuracy) - Hue came right out when asked what is the Most important virtue in a QB for you...no hesitation. ACCURACY! hey I'm all for that. Cause he's correct and I've always stated that...Accuracy and it doesn't have to be statistically its what he has seen on film as well as good decision making.

Not the greatest arm. But not a SHAW arm either good enough for the NFL.

Hey it was our 5th pick in the draft. FIFTH! People give up a 2nd rounder for a good backup. Another note, according to Hue he was in 4 systems in College. That is never easy.

I read quotes from this supposed expert...Oh he was a UDFA on my board...ummm who cares as if you make real picks.

All I know is he is a Brown...I know this: he will be better than Hoyer and better than Manziel.

Look we like his prospects but are not putting all our eggs in his basket. Ya think the Pats are putting all their eggs in the Bisset (sp) basket? No...as long as Brady is still going they will lose Garapolo probably trade him before he becomes a FA...and Bisset is the next back up flavor.

I read...first bad pick...smh
He Sucks! lol

Yeah everyone is correct cause their charts from some site state Kessler is like a 200 prospect...well it also states Cook is a 40th prospect...So that must mean all are dummies for NOT TAKING HIM I guess...lol

Well done for now will go see the 4th round of the draft.

"You will have to trust me on this one"

You are damn right we are going to have to trust you on this one!

You and PEP's honeymoon period is now officially on the clock.

We sat there through the entire second round, with a boatload of 3rd and 4th round picks in our pocket, with one elite first round grade talent after another available, that could have been tremendous for our team, all available for the picking, and didn't move up to snatch one. All to wait and throw a third at a player who lacks an NFL skill-set.

Trust is the only card you can play on this one. Unless, of course, one of these creepo's can play a "question Hue and your a racist" card. Robinson, Reed, Ragland, Bell, Spriggs, Jack, Henry, Henry, etc.... and instead we take Kessler and a player who has a recent case of a potential fatal illness. Yea Hue, trust is the only card you can play on this one.

With every snap Wentz takes, you and PEP will be on the clock.

.
.

God forbid he becomes an elite quarterback.

Hilarious.

Over a third round QB!

Glad you think its funny.

Did you actually read the post?

No. I just randomly picked you and responded.

Kessler has some serious limitations. Limited Arm, below avg height, Slow feet and poor footwork in the pocket, and you don't see him show advanced technique like making advanced reads, or manipulating safeties like Connor Cook. This pick makes no sense at all and even if you are desperate for a QB, there is no way that they can justify picking Kessler when Cook was still on the board.

New Management. Same ol' Browns.

I will check back in at the next draft to see if they decide to start being a serious NFL Franchise. Otherwise, this remains a waste of everyone's time and money.

I think it's a legitimate question.

I think many feel, unless RG3 goes back to his 2012 days, that this team will be picking rather early next year. Thus, in a position to take a QB. If RG3 does show up, there is no point, or draft position, to draft one. Either way, Kessler possibly doesn't become relevant in the future starter discussion.

This FO, or any FO for that matter, isn't drafting player ONLY to be starters. We all know that...or at least I thought so.

I'm not saying I like this pick, it 's just that we're talking about a late third round pick. Again, I don't know why he has to be a starter and not a depth pick like any other position player that could be drafted at this spot.

Over a third round pick!

I see people understanding what a poor pick this was and then as the thread goes on convincing themselves it's better than it actually is. Drafting someone this early in the draft that you could have gotten much later isn't good nor smart.

But you guys just keep convincing yourself otherwise.

I see most people not liking the pick.

Pit- Brady went in the 6th, would he have been a bad pick in the 3rd?

If the player is good, the pick is good.

(I think the problem here is that most people don't think Kessler is any good. He can be a capable backup QB, which is pretty good value in the late third round.)

I see people assuming it was a poor pick because Kessler wasn't on the list of QBs assumed to be drafted at that time based on media reports and analysts. I lean on those reports than my own opinions, but it isn't set in stone.

I don't devote time to scouting players, although I wish had time to do that, but I won't say it was a good or bad pick. I don't know enough.

I remember people making that same argument for Colt McCoy.

.

Speaking only for myself, I did not like the pick ..... but we hired Hue Jackson, in part, for his ability to develop QBs .... and he liked this kid, so I am going to trust him .... even as I wish we would have gone elsewhere.

If Colt McCoy is only a backup, then it would have been a good pick.

"Over a third round pick"

"Over a third round pick"

Don't approach the post logically. How a about a pick, coupled with another one that would have gotten us Miles Jack. Reggie Ragland. Robinson, etc....

You've been around the hijack trolls too long.

Your the west coast expert. Im not. I've lived on the West Coast for 5 decades. I've been a follower of SC for at least that amount of time. My teammate played for them. I'm familiar with Kessler dating back to his recruitment in High School. But, I will not call on you to approach my point about passing on dynamic first round talent in order to throw our picks at Kessler and another guy we could have easily gotten later with a remaining pick.

That wouldn't be consistent with the current "feelings based" agenda of the dawgatalker board hierarchy.

...but not Brady good.

Because there are so many holes that need to be filled before we should be drafting a backup qb.

What if they believe backup QB is one of the holes they need to fill?

Not sure if you were really replying to me or just clicked on my name. I say that because nothing you wrote referenced anything I said. It's ok.

general reply:

Kid doesnt have a noodle arm probably about what you have in Austin. At times he looked really good but then he would get in a funk and had trouble getting out of it. I dont like the pick but he has a chance to sit and learn and grow. We will see. I hope we are wrong on this one.

Says the guy who kept advocating we trade down over and over during the first two rounds.

None. He's a low 3rd round pick.....backup area. I also like how people bag on the McCoy pick. Colt has had a pretty decent career as a solid backup that has done well when called upon. He was a 3rd round pick as well.....lived up to expectations. We are QB starved so we want every kid to be "the guy." The Pats and Seahawks didn't draft Brady or Wilson to be the guy.....they were drafted as developmental backup guys, and they got lucky.

Now I hate the pick (haha) not because I think we passed on "the guy" but because we could have drafted another potential starter at 93. I like him better than a guy like Cook though who has no real skills to grow with....Kessler is at least accurate. I just wish we would have waited because I think he's there in the 4th.

Not sure what this means.

D Dub

No, sorry. You were the last post and I used it as the reply for my rant.

It was the direct quote attributed to Hue. At least the way it was presented in things I had read.

It is only the fact that I do trust Hue Jackson that prevented me from throwing things at the TV when that pick was made.

It's not a player I would have taken, especially not that early, but I do really like and respect Hue as a coach, so I will accept that, and hope that he is right.

Well then...he should fit right in here.

I am the guy pea brain AND I will trust Hue on this one.

What's a Versatile Dog?????????????????

This is the most solid argument on here about picking Kessler at this spot. Right here, read it!

I guess the disconnect defies analytics for me. We draft some speed and size at wideouts, and I presume that is to stretch defenses, take the top off, and go deep. But if we are calling long-field routes, why a short armed QB.

We have had this problem for years. Draft a guy and not use what he is strongest doing. Hue must be believing in YAC, that he can deliver the ball and let receivers tear it up. I still prefer the deep ball shots. But if Hue wants, Hue gets at least some of it.

I need to see it.

I was worried Hue was going to draft Dak Presscot or Cardale. Now I wish he had.

Do you realize the pick after Kessler was Nick Vannett? A TE that was supposed to be a big need. We took Kessler at pick 93 and I guess Hue didn't think he would be there at 99 or 100 which we also had.

You know what's funny... I see you and others who are professional QB evaluators, convince yourselves that you know more than Hue Jackson. But come on down on the positive guys once again or as always I guess.

I was HUH...that was my initial and I sort of like Kessler in 2014 that I saw from him and watched a couple of early games...cause I wanted to see QBs and wasn't that impressed with 2015 of course it was early on and in a new system.

So I went right to the presser's this morning to find out what was being said cause I know its a QB and the Media would be asking a lot. I "LISTENED"

Hue convinced me, my apologies for actually listening to HUE and understand the reason why that convinced me.

What I'm to have that turned around by you Vers and a bunch of other know nothings...

Oh right...It was too early, we got freaking 13+ picks. Btw around what we get in expansion.

So he has to play a game on the QB he "WANTS" - what if...just if he becomes great, and we tried to play the game and some other coach/gm saw what HUE did and took him in the 5th? So we should lose out on him.

My point is - if this is the guy HUE wanted and he explained it pretty simply for all to understand. And when I say want its in the After Runs - after the big 3 first rounders. Goff, Wentz or Lynch.

Then who cares if we took him with our FIFTH PICK! You guys are acting like its in our first two rounds.

QB is the hardest evaluation out there. Why should we not be convinced...not making it convinced but just plain convinced...

Convince yourself Bro...I tired of the amateur GMs here thinking they now better than anyone who don't piss on our picks...smh

Do you really think the evaluation was over Goff and Wentz? Our guys aren't the CIA, they actually explained their movements. We didn't trade the #2 cause the plan was to get the BEST QB in Kessler.

Can't speak for HUE. I "think" he really liked the kid from all the guys who weren't Goff, Wentz and Lynch. He thinks he can develop him into our system. Why? he said it for all to here. Accuracy.

What all have to remember its our FIFTH pick in the draft. Why risk losing him...we did one drop back and got something. We wanted him.

Thanks for your W/Coast inputs it is like another country out there
jmho

J/C Read an article after we drafted Kessler that said the Steelers were looking at him.... Wonder what Tomlin saw in him?

He's pro ready and probably better than Landry Jones.

I was wondering after reading the thread on the economics of trade value, on how much game theory impacts drafting. I mean, why shouldn't it be considered?

If DePodesta has any input, then it is.

Does DePodesta use game theory in baseball? It'd make the most sense to steal talent away from teams there. You never know in 4 years what you'll need.

don't get me wrong.. Unlike the arm chair QBs/ experts on here, I'm not down on us drafting Kessler.. I trust Hue may just know a little more than me and don't come on here after every pick and decision acting like I know more

Just clicking.

I'm not crazy about this pick, especially if he could be had in a later round.

I was just answering the question. It's always nice to have a backup that can at least run the offense.

That's my issue with the pick. It isn't the player himself, but where we chose to draft him. We bypassed guys who wouldn't have been there later (ala Vannett as you mentioned) for a guy who would have been there later.

After rounds 1/2 you are 99% sure not getting a starting caliber QB so I'm not upset we chose Kessler over ___ QB, but I am upset we took a flier on him before it was needed, and basically lost out on the ability to take a player who COULD have been a starter down the road.

I don't think he's spoken about it, but I know that it has a lot to do with some of the in game strategies some teams are doing in baseball.

Just a guess.

I'm not mad about it. Get the QB your head coach wants. I'm fine with that.

Maybe they thought someone else liked him?

I wouldnt waste a 3rd round pick on a backup qb. They are a dime a dozen.

Not cheap ones.

That's why I wrote J/C when making my comment

We have backup qb, we dont really need another one. I would rather the pick be made on a boom bust guy at a position of need. Not qb.

I agree with ya. Wasted pick IMO.

Kessler is better than both Shaw and Davis. McCown might not be on the team. Griffin is injury prone.

I disagree with that. The Steelers were able to stay afloat with the draft pick they invested in Landry Jones (4th round pick) while the Cowboys took your approach and were left with Brandon Weeden to kill a season.

Backups matter. Again the problem was the Browns could have gotten a real starting caliber player there, but we reached for a guy who would have been there in the 4th.

Maybe you should have gave your input to the the Browns decision makers before the pick... Sure they would have listened.. No way they're going to know what you want if you don't tell them

HaHa

It was definitely a reach. If they want to draft a backup qb, then do it in the 4th or 5th.

The thing is that you don't know that for fact. You think he would have been there.

I am not saying he couldn't have been, but possibly some in the FO had some information to which we aren't privy. Even if not, since this was Hue's guy, there is no sense in taking it down the the last pick possible. We took it to pick 93 of the 3rd round. Our previous pick was in the 70's of that round. I'll bet there were a bunch of nervous people sitting in the War room.

OK....MAYBE we took him early, but then again, you never know. We got the guy we targeted...what's wrong with that?

My gut reaction is it was a reach, but in my previous post, I explained why maybe it wasn't.

We got the guy we wanted. When I say we, I am not talking about me...I can't say I could have told you who he was before 24 hours ago. Our coach and FO were pretty sold on the guy, so I go with it...I expect RGIII to play well and this kid doesn't see the field anytime soon.

Casserly just made CFRS' point about the value of cheap backup quarterbacks. I wonder if New England is thinking the same thing, grooming another guy they got this year so they can let Jimmy G go.
I still say it was a reach, but I learn from you guys.

Peen,

I look at rounds 1-3 as rounds you get guys you think can start for your team either immediately or the following year. I don't think you can realistically project Kessler as a guy who can do that.....heck if you thought that you get him earlier so you KNOW he's there.

To me all of these guys (Kessler, Cook, Prescott, etc.) are flier guys that you hope can develop into a backup, and pray you catch lightening in a bottle (aka Brady, Wilson).

To me even if Kessler would have been gone at 129....so what take the next rated flier on your board. Get a guy at 93 you KNOW can impact your team.

I get what your saying Peen, but I don't like the strategy of not taking starter type guys in the top 100 picks....jmho.

eotab insulting other posters again. Who was picking on you this time?

God forbid a person gives his honest opinion around here!!!

My gut agrees with you, but I said what I said...we don't know, but this was Hue's pick. They didn't want to push it any further.

I can agree with that, Depo (presser) basically said that they got most everyone that they had targeted. So in the bigger picture ... That was the pick they had with Kessler as the target. IIRC ... Didn't we use a pick received from trading back?

Yep. We traded back and added a 4th, IIRC.

Thanx

Nothing wrong with it at all if he adds value to the team even as a backup. The tell tail of this draft as we all know will be if they missed out on a franchise QB at pick 2. That will mean a very short tenure for Sashi, Hue, ect

that is not necessarily true... if they take those picks and build team and then add the QB and that results in success then what Wentz does or does not do is immaterial to the browns

Which all depends of how much patience Haslam has in letting them "build the team". I realize the QB thing like drafting any other position is a crap shoot but I think they should up their chances a little bit. Even as bad as the Browns have been they usually win just enough games to take them out of the running for the better QB prospects so therefore when you trade out of a no. 2 spot you better be damn sure of what your doing.

agreed.

if JH does not allow this group sufficient time to implement their plan and then he is a bigger idiot than I thought.

j/c:

I am anxiously awaiting the planted rumors that someone else was about to draft Kessler and that is why the Browns had to grab them w/that pick.

Not sure why I think that........it's never happened before.

Oh, you aint seen nothing yet

What is with you people???

Hue wanted him, SO he picked him!

If our head coach likes a guy that much, I give him the benefit of the doubt!

If we cannot trust our head coach in ALL decisions, what is the point of having any trust in him at all?

I scratched my head on the pick too, but damn, I give Hue the option of picking who he wants. This is what he and the GM are paid to do.

Get a Grip!

I stopped taking his football posts seriously quite awhile back... and besides, his sentence structure is annoying and abject homers are, as well.

I'm still hesitant to come out of the shadows and post but I'll say this:

My first reaction was that this is a guy who was taken too high. I remember the last time a "QB Guru" with the Browns stepped in and clawed for his guy to be drafted in the third round. It didn't end very well for us. I thought we really reached on Kessler. I still don't think he will end up being worth the pick, but I like the guy and I hope I'm wrong.

Now that being said, I reviewed his film. I did see a guy who hit throws the likes of which Weeden, Quinn, McCoy etc. did NOT hit. I saw him hit the fades, the backshoulders, leading on nine routes, hitting the posts in stride. The other guys we had hit spots. Often stationary targets or receivers coming back toward the LoS. Except for Quinn, they were in gimmicky offenses, did not read coverages, and did not keep their eyes downfield. I saw Kessler do all those things with some success. He has a good feel for the pocket and he throws with anticipation. I don't have much hope for the kid, but I'm keeping an intrigued eye on him.

i only know him from a highlight video....but i can see a project that, really, really might pan out! the browns are obviously thinking 3 years....this is good...they drafted weapons and defenders..out of 4 wr and 5 pass catchers drafted...lets try to remember they got 2 o line, 2 maybe 3 pass rushers
its almost like they said you know what...we need talent....just get more pics and find the talent...etc...just get talent...i realize this is what all teams try to do...but the obvious result is this...in this draft
we got the most upside and doubled down....ill take my chances at dealer 16....hit me


i really think they did....its kinda like they thought of not just drafting, but treating it like recruiting....just get talent...we will coach em

Whats with us? We've been down this road too many times with experimental QB's and ALL of them failed. there is very good reason to be skeptical with this organization. If he's meant to be a backup, so be it. Then why are we drafting a backup before a franchise QB? Thats like replacing your spare tire before replacing the flat tire on your car.

I've said before I am done with blind faith in this team. If Hue wants my trust that he made the right pick, then he needs to prove he can win. Until then, I will remain skeptical in every decision this organization makes.

can't say I disagree super...clearly he was in contact with Hue and company long before the draft took place. haven't seen any vids on the kid, buy I am at the point that if Hue likes what he sees and has had an chance to study the kid and like him then why not let Hue do his thing? otherwise the Browns should just hold and a contest and draft whom ever the said winner of the contest was and draft whom he thinks is good and roll with that

so you mean, you will question every single move the Browns make until a winner is produced? that is a lot of questioning my friend

Some scouting reports from the past

"Is not what you’re looking for in terms of physical stature, strength, arm strength and mobility, but he has the intangibles and production and showed great improvement as a senior. Could make it in the right system but will not be for everyone." Tom Brady

"Weaknesses Cousins is widely considered to be a game manager type at the next level. He makes good decisions with the ball but has not shown he can make the flash plays to move the offense and win games for his team at the next level. He will need talent around him to succeed, which limits his value. " Kirk Cousins

I don't have time time to look everybody up but If I remember correctly all of these guys were said to have below average arm strength. Manning, Joe Montana, Brees, Sipe, Tarkington, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Andy Dalton, Alex Smith, Rivers.

Will Kessler end up as good as even one of these guys??? Will he be out of the league in 2 seasons??? I have no clue and won't pretend to. I prefer smart QB's who are accurate to strong armed guys who are idiots, so Kessler appears to be my type of QB BUT I don't know enough about the kid to even form a opinion about him one way or another.

j/c:

Kessler was likely to not get drafted. We missed out on a lot of good prospects, including a few qbs, by trading down w/Carolina and then taking Kessler as high as we did.

I have no clue if he would or would not have been drafted. As I have said many many times I have very little knowledge of most collage players. I would feel comfortable saying 90 percent of the folks on this board know more about the guys being drafted than me.

Can Hue be objective with His own personal pick ??

I want to see how the kid does with some solid coaching and IF we give Hue a chance to stick around some actual stability! 4 coaches in five years doesn't create an environment for a QB to thrive in. Was Sarkisian ever sober for a game plan? I'm going to do what Hue said and trust him. What else at this point is there to do?

I've been racking my brain trying to understand this pick.

I still don't understand why Kessler was taken in the 3rd round. I think taking him there was a major reach.

MAYBE part of the reason to draft an effecient pro-style QB rather then a developmental QB is to give the large class of rookie WRs a headstart on learning the offense at rookie mini-camp?

So I was originally with most of you on this been g a reach pick, but at the end of the day Hue saw something in this kid and wanted him. I say that as ringing of an endorsement as you can get.

Then I watched some highlight tapes and came away impressed. Not only does it look like he has plenty of arm, he has a great awareness of the pocket and is extremely accurate. The best part for me however was that he always finds the open man. He goes through his progressions and makes the right decision. He also shows some decent athleticism.

I have no idea how to embed video! Here is the link to the video i watched..

The video is fine but the language in the video is not allowed on this board. If you can find a video without the profanity please feel free to re-post it.

Holy cow, you're right, that tape does seem to show his arm is fine. I know it is a highlight tape, but my one (overriding) concern was the noodle arm. Everyone says he is smart, understands pro offenses, is a good guy, processes fast, etc. The concerns are height (6-1 is fine) and the arm. There are a lot of deep throws on this reel and a lot that show him rifling it in to a tight window.
I will trust in Hue.

This guy does not have a noodle arm. He is not Colt McCoy. It was said he does not have elite arm strength. Either did Joe Montana, or hell. Most of the elite QBS. Brandon Weeden has elite arm strength. I am excited about this pick after watching some tape on him. He works through his reads , finds the open guy, and hits him in stride.

You're right, his arm looks fine. He looks and plays a lot bigger than 6-1 too. He's much stronger than our Lil' Colt (who I compared him to, wrongly). The Browns say he's here to compete for the starting job, not as a designated backup. We'll have to see how he does, but I feel better after watching that video - and yes, I realize it was a highlight vid. LOL, it looked like he threw 75 TD passes last year.

I think you guys should look at every scouting report available and see how many say that his arm is fine and how many say that his arm isn't very good.

Would that be fair? Or, does one highlight video tell us for sure that he has a good arm?

We won't know anything about his true arm strength until he plays at FE Stadium on a cold, windy December afternoon.

So if he's third string, it'll probably happen this year.

His offense changed when Sark got the boot and his center got hurt. They went to a short passing, run heavy scheme. He didn't have time for longer routes to develop, so he became the guy who only threw it short. Throwing it short led to the weak armed label. He hit 55 MPH at the combine which is solid. In his 2014 tape, there are times he overthrows his receivers 40+ yards downfield (there was a flag). He had 5 coaches in 3 years and was supposedly the guy that kind of held the team together.

I'm not saying it was a great pick, but I don't think it was terrible either. He seems pretty advanced on the mental side. Cody showed an ability to look off coverage, get through progressions, and use the pump fake. The way he moves reminds me of Tom Brady.

However, he didn't always make the best decisions this year. That does worry me a bit. Hopefully it was just the mid season change in offense and a lack of comfort with it.

*LOL* ... Another entry into the sad but true column .... ..

The real question is actually where to set the over/under ..... 8 games or10 games? ... ..

Vers, I wasn't saying he had a good arm or a bad arm, just that the eye test seems to indicate he has enough arm to make the throws he needs.

Like I mentioned the biggest piece for me was the accuracy, pocket awareness, and ability to find the open man by going through his progressions. Granted, it is a highlight tape, but i came away feeling better than I did when we first made the pick. Also, he put up some great numbers at USC during their down years against some pretty good talent. Palmer, Sanchez, and Leinhart all had amazing OL and WR's surrounding them, Kessler really didn't.

JMO

Think he was overdrafted, but at this point, I'm okay with the pick.

Let him learn, and see what shakes. Our QB's never stay healthy for a full 16 games, so I'm sure at some point he'll get a shot to show something.

j/c

I wonder if it is a reach or not taking Cody in the third round. If Hue is being truthful, he believes this guy is our future. Do you wait?

New England, Dallas, and Baltimore use analytics extensively. All looking for a future or backup QB. Hard believing Hue/Cleveland were the only team looking.

The biggest thing I like about this kid is how he stayed consistent through several coaching changes. We see it in Cleveland what it does to players. You know it messed Cody's development.

One thing for sure Cleveland will have a room full of hungry QBs competing for a starting job. We know what McCown can do. If either RGiii or Kessler wins the starting job, one must believe they found a quality guy.

I watched some tape of Kessler earlier, and he really impressed me. To me, he has plenty of arm strength. He will never be Joe Flacco, but he can hit a guy in stride 30-40 yards down field no problem. He has a quick release, moves in the pocket well, and is crazy accurate. None of this means he will be a good QB, but he has a shot to be pretty good if he puts the work in.

Its not like I posted what I did to pimp the pick. I just wanted to amend my earlier comments, and say I have moved to the wait-and-see crowd when it comes to Kessler. I'm no scout, but his arm looks perfectly okay to me. Certainly not Bradshaw or Elway quality, but at least "average". I don't have access to real scouts' reports, but one guy I do read, Daniel Jeremiah, say he has average or adequate arm strength. Others, like Dane Brugler say its below average. My eyes say its not that big an issue for Kessler. Anyway, if his ceiling is Andy Dalton, he's a bargain at #3. If his floor is "quality backup", as Gil Brandt suggests, its probably still worth the pick. So I'm stepping away from the ledge about this pick.

Alot of what you said in your post says he has a good chance of being more than capable QB. I also read where he goes through his progressions well. With a good QB coach like Hue working with him he has a chance to be real good.

Just a thought;

When we drafted JFF, the fans and media immediately began demanding the Browns start him. There won't be as much pressure to get Kessler into the game before he has had a chance to acclimate himself to the league.

This group, and this plan, must be given AT LEAST three full seasons. As much as folks - self included - are absolutely freaking tired of having patience, this plan requires folks to just accept right now that 2016 & 2017 seasons are scrapped; we're hoping to show meaningful progress in the 2018 season.





I don't get the impression that this FO is concerned in any way with justifying their choices to the masses ('m' may be silent).

I agree that we should trust in Hue when it comes to QBs. However; I still think he was a reach in the 3rd round.

And I'm tired of fans who never mentioned the guy, didn't even have him on their radar, a guy who was a projected 6th round pick or later, suddenly change everything they believed about this QB class because the people in charge here did the complete opposite of what they believed to begin with.

They reached for the pick. He has little arm strength and you feel somehow vindicated in being a blind follower. Do ahead Tab, it's you MO. Sorry that you feel it's so wrong to question what seems to be your belief of your blind loyalty and superiority because you wish to be a follower and have been of every coaching staff and FO we've ever had.

The evidence is strongly in favor of the failed policies that have led us to where we are now. Sorry, you lose this one.

I didn't say that in an accusatory tone. It was a suggestion. A couple of us have said his arm strength is poor and a couple of you said his arm strength looked fine. Instead of arguing about it, I suggested research. That's all. I wasn't trying to be mean or critical.

"Bridgewater’s statistics in his final college season confirm the scouts' concerns. He completed 39.1 percent of his passes thrown 20 yards or farther downfield, the second-lowest percentage of the top 10 QB prospects ranked by Scouts Inc.

The issue is arm strength. As noted above, Bridgewater is one of the most accurate quarterbacks in the nation on intermediate passes, but when he has to throw it farther downfield, the ball tends to hang in the air."

http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/87939/grudens-qb-camp-teddy-bridgewater

We are talking about Kessler.

You liked Teddy with issues about arm strength but not Kessler?

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...r-starting-job/

Browns make it clear that Cody Kessler will compete for starting job

When quarterback Robert Griffin III signed with the Browns, the Browns made it clear that Griffin would be handed nothing. He won’t even be handed the edge over third-round rookie quarterback Cody Kessler.

In response to a suggestion during a Saturday press conference that Kessler won’t pose a threat to Griffin, Browns executive V.P. of football operations Sashi Brown advised caution: “I beg to differ with that,” Brown said, via Mary Kay Cabot of the Cleveland Plain Dealer. “I do think Cody is a guy that I would not want to sleep on at all if I wanted to be the starting quarterback of the Browns.

“[Kessler is] going to come in serious ready to work. Robert has four years of NFL experience, is tremendously athletic and serious about becoming a starting quarterback in this league. There’s no reason he can’t, but this is going to be a competition.”

Even if Griffin has the edge, it’s smart for the Browns to create the impression that Griffin will have to compete. He arrived in Washington with the presumption that he’d be “the guy.” Now, he’s just “a guy” — and he needs to regard himself that way.

“We truly believe in competition here,” Brown said. “We’re realistic about where our roster is at that slot and we want to find a long-term answer. It’s as critical for everything we’re going to do here. We’ll give them an opportunity to compete and the best quarterback is going to start for us period. We’ll roll the ball out and see who’s the best at throwing it.”

The candidates for the starting job are Griffin, Kessler, Josh McCown, and Connor Shaw. Which means that part of the competition will consist of determining which of the four won’t be on the team come September.

Eh, he'll "compete", but I wouldn't put much stock into him having any real chance at beating everyone out for the starter role.

His main competition will be to make the roster - he should aim for McCown & RG3, but know that his real competition is with Shaw and whomever else might be in camp throwing balls around.

Jackson said before the draft that every position is up for grabs except left tackle.

I didn't take it as accusatory, mean, or critical. Just trying to explain what I think, and why. Sorry if it came off as defensive.

He'll also be competing for a roster spot.

here is some footage of the kid...

General reply

What are the percentage chances that Cody Kessler is the future starter of the Cleveland Browns for the majority of games for a 2 or 3 year period, beginning next, next season the 2017/2018 year. Not this upcoming year.

10%

20%

50%.

They finaly had a franchise QB in Manziel, and cut him for their own ""Moral"" reasons. He didn't fail on the field.

Either way, I still feel the 50% coin flip win for the Browns is the 5th win of the year. Thinking they only have a 50/50 shot to get to that 5th win mark, and they aren't going to win 6 games this year.

Bright side!
The last two times the Browns drafted a wide receiver in the 1st round they had a winning season 2 years later. (was Edwards from 05)
Kevin Johnson, and Braylon Edwards.

Thanks for saying that. I've been wanting to post a quote I saw last night, and this seems like the perfect place to drop it in. Dawgs please note the bolded type:






http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...or-playoff-push

The same is true about Oakland.

j/c

Here are a couple pieces on Kessler.

Article Link

Video with Commentary Link

Oh I've seen footage of the kid. I still think the kid was a huge reach. I still don't believe he will ever be an NFL starter unless it's due to injury. I still think there were much better picks on the board and would have been there for us later.

But that's just what I think.

yup.

I haven't posted much in the PF and Draft threads lately, because my jury is still out regarding Haslem's willingness to see a project through. I haven't grown attached to Hue & Co. -nor will I try, until we're in our 3rd year with this regime. I've also stopped placing a heavy emotional investment in drafts/the outcome of games until I see:

1. A reasonably balanced team with some experience
2. Signs from the top that we're still committed to The Plan.

Another total tear-down/rebuild. I've finally accepted that reality, but I simply CANNOT get excited about anything until I see some commitment from JH. "Two years and punt" is no way to build a team.

Like what Jax and OAK have done. Hope we do the same.


.02

Ya know Pit I didn't have a problem with the draft till this pick. Now I may have took different guys, but at the same positions. There was what I thought were better player's available to us. Now once you get beyond the third, max your picks to try and hit on a few.


With this draft in and with all the picks next yr. I think they are trying to crame 4 drafts into two.

I expect a lot of trades next yr also to try and make 3 drafts 6. And from that point on is when they go for broke in FA and the draft. Sure hope I'm alive when they make it. I'll be 64 in a month and a half.

so...

I will say this:

There are a lot of players that dropped in the draft and there were a lot that were picked earlier.

This kid just happens to be one of them. We don't know if another team would have picked him up before we had out next pick.

What we do know is that the HC is goo goo eyes for him.

Our HC happens to be one of the best QB whisperers out there.

I'll take Hue's opinion over mine,a draft projection off some mock draft site or ESPN, non NFL scouting people or people that draft players.

j/c

Look at Goff and Kessler's 2014 stats.

Jared Goff stats from ESPN
Cody Kessler stats from ESPN

Kessler had more touchdowns, fewer INTs, and a higher yards per pass attempt average in 2014 than Goff when his situation was not a trainwreck.

Goff just went first overall.

Quarterback Ball Velocity at NFL Combine



I think the weak arm deal is misleading. Average seems more accurate. Joe Flacco had the same 55 mph in 2008.

The talent around Goff was not nearly as good. Also, Goff has three inches on Kessler and throws great on the deep routes.

Says WHO?

Where are you guys getting this "Whisperer" thing from?

And I know all about Flacco and Dalton. You're ASSuming Jacksons role in their development. Or LACK OF.

Wait. I'll call Joe and Red myself and find out.

And you're SPOT ON

No offense but I'm 42 and I know that I don't have nearly enough years left to see a winner out of the Browns. Not nearly enough even if I make it to 100!

j/c...

we should have seen this coming

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...p-of-the-draft/


Hue Jackson knows there may be better quarterbacks than the guys at the top of the draft

This is not even close to what the "article" says. This is the only quote from Hue Jackson in the link you provided:



Also, just for clarification, this article was posted a week before the draft.

The newspapers are the ones calling him that.

http://www.todayspigskin.com/afc-today/c...er-hue-jackson/

http://www.todayspigskin.com/afc-today/c...er-hue-jackson/

Jackson Is Known As A QB Whisperer

The turnaround in Andy Dalton over the last two seasons has coincided with Jackson taking over the offensive coordinator duties. In the past two seasons, Dalton’s completion percentage has gone from 61.9% in 2013 to 64.2% in 2014 and 66.1% in 2015. In 2015, Dalton also had the lowest interception rate of his career throwing just seven picks in 386 attempts in the 13 games he played.

That’s good news for the Browns who are still trying to figure out the QB spot.

He’s Coached For 29 Years, Been an NFL Coach For 15 Years

Since starting out as a graduate assistant at his alma mater Pacific in 1987, Jackson has coached consistently on the offensive side of the ball as he moved up the coaching ranks through college, the World League, and the NFL. He’s had plenty of experience and seasoning working on the offensive side of the ball at all levels.

Jackson Played QB In College

During his playing career he was a quarterback for Pacific for the 1985-86 seasons and threw for 2,544 yards and 19 TD’s during that time. So, not only has he coached quarterbacks for much of his career, he played the position as well.


He's coaches Carson Palmer, Flacco, Harrington, Jason Cambbell, and Andy Dalton

Pretty Much all of them had success while he was coaching the,

1. that was the name of the article.
2. That's why I said that we should have seen this coming

Jason Campbell played almost exactly to his career averages under Hue Jackson.

Joey Harrington was normal, terrible Joey Harrington under Hue Jackson.

Carson Palmer was just about the same as he ever was (and probably a little worse) under Hue Jackson.

Jackson's QB whisperer resume is built on the back of the work he did with Andy Dalton and Joe Flacco. Anything else is a major reach.

I know that was the name of the article. It is totally misleading.

Seen what coming? Drafting a QB later in the draft? We all knew that was coming.

jc

The great Mike Holmgren was supposed to be the ultimate QB whisperer...ummm what did that get us? Wallace, Delhomme, McCoy and Weeden! lol

j/c:

This talk of Hue being a QB Whisperer is being greatly exaggerated.

I am NOT dissing him. I am not saying he sucks. I am saying some people read a couple of things, they get repeated over and over on the board, and they become "truth."

Dalton actually regressed his first year under Hue. He had his best year last year under Hue, but it wasn't a significant gain. It was more like he is maturing as a qb. Natural progression.

The Flacco stuff makes no sense to me. Palmer? He didn't do too well in Oakland. Jason Campbell? Really? What did Hue do w/Pryor as a rookie? LOL

I know it is coming across like I am knocking Hue, but that is not my intent. My intent is that I think some people should do some research and see that perhaps Hue isn't this great QB Whisperer that some people are trying to make us believe.

Oh...........and Grimm posted another Kessler highlight reel. Some of you should check out RGIII's "highlight" reels from college. See how they compare. LOL

Jackson said before the draft that he really wanted to keep Alex Mack.

Let me edit this..............there are a lot of things said "before the draft."

Grimm-

Cook only threw 50 mph? That's more of a reason from him to slip imho then that other mumbo.

Maybe his shoulder is still messed up.

I'm just saying that it is not a groundbreaking statement to say that Kessler will compete for the starting job.

Remember, Holmgren never coached the Browns. Just because Shurmur couldn't develop a Qb doesn't mean that Holmy couldn't have had he been HC.

Also, I think Colt never fully recovered from that shoulder injury in the bowl game. I think he lost a lot of velocity because of that injury that he was never able to raegain.

Kessler may be a career backup. But he may be the career backup the team needs.

Accuracy and good decision making and playing within a structure of an offense can go a long way for a career.

Who knows if he can overcome his physical limitations? Even if he can't, I would say a 3rd round pick on a reliable backup QB is draft capital well spent.

For comparison's sake: Kessler and Hoyer have similar physical abilities, but Kessler is far, far more accurate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9m6VaOcPf3Q

Watch the last touchdown in this clip. I think this is what Hue Jackson means by uncanny accuracy. The ball was slipped between 3 defenders to the tight end in a window of maybe 2 feet.

Hmmm...

I've watched a few of these clips, and I'm no expert by any means, but his arm looks to be plenty good enough to play at this level.

I'm not looking at Charlie Frye or Ken Dorsey here.

When I read some scouting reports after we drafted him, I got a sense he had a weak arm, but after "further review", as in watching some clips, maybe this kid ain't so bad.
But why wasn't he hyped more, pre-draft?

Because, he didn't come with the fancy packaging ... The physical things one can measure. Add that to coming from a program that has been on life support due to sanctions and lack of stability due to consistent changes in the Coaching staff. Sound familar?

Nice.....I saw where Russell Wilson also threw 55.

Kesslers arm is fine.

Absolutely. Even backup QB is a hole that needs to be filled. A third round pick which plugs a hole is a good pick indeed...

Time will tell. I hope these analytic guys get it right.

Each and every year, Brown's fans convince themselves that players that got a low grade are actually great players. They start making things up about why their guy wasn't as highly rated as some others. Who can forget the hype on this board for Timid, Frye, BQ, Colt, Weeden, and Manziel?

Fancy packaging? Kessler put up extremely gaudy numbers in college.

A program on life support? USC was ranked 13th in the country in ESPN's preseason poll.

USC ALWAYS has talent, but their coaching staff while Kessler was the starter was god awful. Lane Kiffin was the worst head coach I have ever seen, and Sark was literally drunk on the sidelines.

Does not make up for the fact that Kessler has limited physical abilities.

He's 6'1, isn’t extremely athletic and doesn't have a big arm.

He is extremely accurate.
Has very good footwork.
Throws well on the run.
He has big hands 10+ at the combine.
He can run a pro-style offense.


I am big proponent of completion percentage (system dependent) and footwork. Kessler has high marks for both.


It's definitely a "trust me" pick byt Hue Jackson, we'll see.

First post here so...

I'm not sure how I feel about this one. I dislike the pick, but then Hue says to trust him and in terms of quarterback development, I actually do trust him.

He's accurate with the ball. Better arm than Shaw. Can scramble when truly needed. Heck, even watched him take snaps from center.

Hue got what he wanted, so for me, I guess I'm okay with this selection on really that standpoint alone.

I was really scratching my head on this pick, didn't like it, didn't like where he was taken especially. I don't like USC and can't remember their last QB that had success in the NFL. I DID NOT want Cook, so I thought Prescott would be the next best logical choice, since they didn't go up to get Lynch. But after watching more throws, this is what I see:

I think the knock on his arm comes from several deep balls where the WR had to slow down, or even stop to catch the ball. They're not all like that, and in fact throws plenty of accurate deep balls where the WR runs under to catch them, but there are a few.

I tend to discount throws where the receivers are wide open, I think anyone should be able to make those and he does. He does, however, seem to thread the needle well, throwing accurately into double and triple coverage without getting his WR killed. His ball placement tends to stand out, throwing his WRs open and allowing them to get YAC. You can see why Hue is high on his accuracy. Especially since NFL windows are so tight.

I don't normally like shorter QBs, but Wilson was sort of a game changer in that arena. Kessler seems to see the field well and finds the open guy, or at least the guy he can get the ball to. He also seems to have a certain "escapability" and throws well on the run, moving to his right. I don't know about moving to his left. He seems to prefer to throw instead of run, but can run, and seems to run to get open to throw if there's a man open.

This is a good sampling of work:



And while it is a highlight reel, there's plenty to see. Also, it's very hard to argue with a 67.5 completion percentage, or an 88 to 19 TD to INT ratio.

Bottom line, I'm not saying he's the future, or even a future starter, but he's worth keeping an eye on, and I'm suddenly much more interested in the QB competition.

I sure hope he has the chance to sit and learn for a yr or so. Our worse nightmare is he's thrown to the wolves because of injuries.

If he beats out McCown, count on it. Besides, of all the QB's taken in the first three rounds, he may actually be the most ready. He's played in a pro-style offense, and he goes through his progressions. The question marks lie in his ability to read defenses, and his ability to step up in the pocket and throw under presser. The other question mark is, if he has to step in due to injury, did it happen because the line can't protect the QB, or because the QB won't stay in the pocket. If it's the latter, it may not be not a problem. If it's the former, no one will succeed.

I watched some videos of this kid..

his release is a little wide but man, he can spin the ball just fine and place it where he wants it.

He is really starting to grow on me.

i'll be interested to see how he translates in the NFL.

I haven't had a chance to really pay attention, and honestly, I'm not sure I'd fully trust my own assessment, but... how quick is his release?

Does he get rid of the ball quick, or does he have a long, slow wind-up?

I don't think I'd run the same offense for Kessler as I would RG3. It would not be a vertical offense. It would be more like the offense that we ran last year with McCown.

And while his escapability is good, I don't think that he throws on the run very well.

Not the end of the world, but I'm still surprised this is Hue's guy.

Also, thought this was an interesting report. Mentions some of the things I see, and has a major red flag: regression in 2015. Also, I just read that he only completed 16 of 56 over 20 yards, that is concerning. I like reading about his smarts, and according to this, he has an ability to read coverages. I also read that he's a "first in, last to leave" kind of guy. The big knocks seem to be size (which we've seen overcome by the likes of Wilson) arm strength on deep balls, and poise under pressure. He definitely has some issues to overcome if he's going to be successful, but it sounds as if he may be willing to work hard to get there.

PFF Scouting Report:

Position fit: Backup QB. Will need to prove he can overcome physical limitations.

Stats to know: +39.4 passing grade in 2014 was second in the nation, behind only Marcus Mariota. 2015 grade was only good enough for 20th.

What he does best:
• Accuracy. Had an accuracy percentage of 78.2, third-highest in the draft class, and higher than any of the top prospects.
• Executes from a clean pocket extremely well. Over past two seasons has thrown just seven interceptions on 635 passing attempts with no pressure, completing 73.5 percent of his passes.
• He is smart. Able to diagnose coverage, throw with anticipation and get the ball where it needs to go at the right time.
• Throws deep. For a player with an average arm at best, Kessler threw just one pick on deep passes this past season and had a 7:1 TD:INT ratio on deep (20+ air yards) passes.

Biggest concern:
• Arm strength. If Carson Wentz is at the high end of the arm-talent spectrum this season, Kessler is towards the other end of the scale. He doesn’t have an outright noodle, but his game needs to be more about anticipation and smarts than arm strength.
• 2015 regression. Kessler’s 2014 grade was the best of this draft class, and right up there with Marcus Mariota. Had he improved this season he would have had a grade rivaling Goff, but instead he took a major step backwards and looked markedly worse for USC. That raises a big red flag and is something of a worry.
• Inconsistent under pressure. At times, Kessler can navigate a cluttered pocket and look very good. At others the blinkers come down and he gets spooked, taking off to space and failing to slide away from the traffic and stay within the pocket.
• Average measurables at best. Standing 6-foot-1 and weighing 220 pounds at the combine, and won’t get plus points for his athleticism.

Bottom line: Cody Kessler showed a lot of promise in 2014, but the drop in his play this season is a concern. He doesn’t fit the ideal measurable profile teams look for, but has shown the ability to overcome his relative lack of arm talent with high-level pocket passing ability. He is an accurate passer with the ability to throw with anticipation and reliability, but other aspects of his game have been more hit and miss. If he is going to succeed at the NFL level he needs to be able to succeed in the face of pressure consistently rather than sporadically, and eliminate the lows in his game, because he won’t receive the same chances as a higher-rated prospect.

Link

Looks like Hue really looks for accuracy in QB's. Doesn't seem to be too blown away with arm size. Judging from the off season.

I'm not going to wallow in the mud over a slight reach for a backup qb/prospect. It is what it is. A 3rd rd pick who many had going in late rd's. The Browns where going to take a QB this draft and Hue pulled the trigger on Cody.

*Trusting Hue*

The regression from 2014 to 2015 doesn't worry me at all. Instead, it makes me ask two questions:

1. In what way(s) did he regress? Is it him, or just statistically?

2. Why did he have that regression? Was it a change in offense with having yet another new coach?


Answer those questions satisfactorily, then you can have an idea of whether or not the regression is actually something to worry about, or if it is perhaps the Red Herring that allowed him to fall to where we picked him.... because if he was rated with Goff after 2014, then he *should* have (conceivably) been picked Top 10.

I agree, maybe in 2015 the team around him just wasn't as good.

I don't understand why so many act like the QB plays in a bubble, Football is the ultimate team sport

I was hoping to find an answer to this question but didn't have any luck.

Well, he played three years and had four coaches. Probably three different offenses. It's the kind of thing the Browns have done to QBs. It doesn't help them much.

Then why the speedster WR over Treadwell?

Just when I think I have Hue figured out he does the opposite like Costanza.

Yeah, I'm sure that had a lot to do with it. The "fall off" is interesting when you look at the stats:

2014 - 3826yds @ 315 for 452, 69.7% completions & 39 TDs & 5 INTs

-vs-

2015 - 3536yds $ 298 for 446, 66.8% completions & 29 TDs & 7 INTs

I'd take a "fall off" year like that from any of our QBs any time.

I get a kick out of you's guys talking your selves into this with all the rationalization ! Lol

In 2014, the OC was Clay Helton, the guy who became the HC in 2015 and is a first-time HC. The 2014 WR coach became the 2015 OC while holding onto WR Coaching duties. They had a new OL Coach for 2015, and Clay Helton brought in his brother Tyson Helton from Western Kentucky Univ. to be the new QB coach for 2015.



That's quite enough for me to think that there is a reasonable chance that the regression (yet unquantified) wasn't him. Also, if you look at his stats, you can see a regression, but it is minimal. He threw fewer TD's, and a few more INT's... completions were down, as were YPA, but all of those things could EASILY be scheme, blocking, WR's/drops.... or any and all of the above.

The kid will be interesting to watch; see who the real Kessler is.

Weapon for McCown, or RG3. You don't pick a 1st rd WR to groom with a QB prospect. BTW Kessler throws deep with accuracy.

I don't see it as talking ourselves into it; I see it as trying to see what they saw - to look beyond the simplistic of simply following what the sheep herders at ESPN and the draft sites tell everyone is the proper thing to think.

For me it's more about accepting the things I cannot change. He's here, Wentz is in Philly, ain't $#!% I can do about it. And that doesn't change the fact that Kessler has some intriguing things to watch out for. Besides, what else do we have to do with our time? I have the feeling the kid will either surprise the hell out of everyone, or fail under NFL defensive pressure. It'll be interesting to watch either way.

Not at 16 for 56 over 20yds, he doesn't.

With a stat like that, this is almost guaranteed to be true, but, again, that depends upon the WHY.

Were a lot of those deep balls actually throwaways?
How many were drops?
How many were passes defended?

Stats only show a meaningless measurement with zero context. You have to give it context for it to have meaning.

J/C

LA Times story from Nov 2015

http://www.latimes.com/sports/usc/la-sp-usc-football-20151110-story.html

I look at the list of players we could have had by staying at 77 insted of going down to 93 and kinda scratch my head ..



13 76 Cleveland
(from Los Angeles through Tennessee) Shon Coleman T Jr Auburn
14 77 Carolina
(from Detroit through Philadelphia,Cleveland) Daryl Worley CB Jr West Virginia
15 78 New England
(from New Orleans) Joe Thuney G Sr North Carolina State
16 79 Philadelphia Isaac Seumalo G Jr Oregon State
17 80 Buffalo Adolphus Washington DT Sr Ohio State
18 81 Atlanta Austin Hooper TE So Stanford
19 82 Indianapolis Le'Raven Clark T Sr Texas Tech
20 83 NY Jets Jordan Jenkins LB Sr Georgia
21 84 Washington Kendall Fuller CB Jr Virginia Tech
22 85 Houston Braxton Miller WR Sr Ohio State
23 86 Miami
(from Minnesota) Leonte Carroo WR Sr Rutgers
24 87 Cincinnati Nick Vigil LB Jr Utah State
25 88 Green Bay Kyler Fackrell LB Sr Utah State
26 89 Pittsburgh Javon Hargrave DT Sr South Carolina State
27 90 Seattle C.J. Prosise RB Sr Notre Dame
28 Kansas City Choice Forfeited - Violation of anti-tampering rules (Jeremy Maclin)
29 91 New England Jacoby Brissett QB Sr North Carolina State
30 92 Arizona Brandon Williams CB Sr Texas A&M
31 93 Cleveland
(from Carolina) Cody Kessler QB Sr USC

That Ju Ju Shchuster looks like an absolute stud on film.

Why?
It's just a bunch of names.

3rd round pick for a backup QB prospect shouldn't be a cause for dissent. This pick is barley a reach. If he doesn't work out nobody will remember Kessler around here after a couple years.

I've seen him throw nice deep balls, it's just that the numbers don't back up the statement that he's an accurate deep ball thrower.

Purp, I get your point, but 56 passes are a decent sampling. I'm sure the numbers reflect drops, inaccuracies, pressures and passes defended, but he has such a high degree of accuracy overall that the deep ball numbers seem more that just an anomaly, or a skewed stat due to circumstance.

Worst pick in recent memory, including JFF and Gilbert.

No dissent, argument or stand taking. Just a discussion.

A little early to make that statement. Try it again in a couple years when he's sitting alone in a bar in Columbus drinking a beer and watching the draft while Tweeting about how he's always done it that way.

well, at least we're not easily given to hyperbole... so we've all got that going for us.

The JFF and Gilbert picks were better than the Kessler pick. Manziel and Gilbert had a high grades on draft day (many, if not most teams were wrong).

I can't believe teams had a third round grade on Kessler.

LOL!

So, because a bunch of nobodies graded them higher, they were better picks, despite the fact that they are both complete and utter busts - and anyone that looked at their character could (and did) predict it?

We clearly had at least a 3rd round grade on him... that's all that matters.

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

Food for thought.







2016





2015





2014




2013





2012






2011










http://blogs.ourlads.com/2016/03/02/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

Because QB's can be accurate deep without having a cannon? And just because a WR is a speedster doesn't mean he only runs fly routes.

j/c:

The sheep are out in full force on this thread. Convincing themselves that this guy is the real deal because their sheep herder said to trust him.

It's funny, because w/all the qb conversations that dominated the discussion on this board, I don't remember you guys talking about Kessler at all. Not even in the last couple of rounds. There was one guy who brought him up, but he was quickly shot down. LOL

They'll remember him as the backup to the guy we draft with the first pick in the 2017 draft.

Eh, it's hard to get to all of the players, especially late round guys. Even more so when you're predicted to take one of the top guys. That's typically where all of the concentration goes when you're predicted to take a 1st round QB.


His physical tools are definitely underwhelming. He looks like a good college QB and an extremely productive one under adverse circumstances. That doesn't mean he will be anything in the NFL.

How does it matter, at all, in any way, whether or not anyone brought him up pre-draft? Unless you're driven by some insane brownie point system where you think folks are actually keeping score and care - it doesn't.

He's here now, so we discuss him now.... and that means trying to figure out why he went where he did; why he was valued so low by the pundits, and why he was valued higher by the Browns.

If you're not interested in understanding any of that, that's fine, that's your deal, but don't project your issues onto other people.

Point out one post where anyone said he was the "real deal." You always want everyone to prove it, and to not state their opinions as fact, so please, enlighten me where anyone said he is the "real deal." People think he can be a decent QB. Sure, he was drafted earlier than what most people thought he should be. So was Blake Bortles and now a lot of people see him as a franchise QB. Different situations, but so what if he was "overdrafted." We didn't take him early. He was our 5th selection of the draft.

The "we could have got him later" crowd is hilarious.

We don't know what any NFL team draft board looked like.

The Patriots have built a dynasty on picks that don't fit Mel Kiper projections.

If Hue identified this as his guy, don't try to get cute and try to get him later. If he's truly your guy, reach on him and make sure you get him.

We can have our opinions on the pick, but I'm just happy we went into the draft with a plan and executed it.

This wasn't the circus of years past where we got caught with our pants down and just took the guy "experts" had raged highest -- That's how you end up with Manziel and Weeden lol.

We had our board and we stuck with our board and said to hell with what Anyone thought about it -- And THAT is what I'm happy with.

Careful!

If that's your thing, go for it man, but I have to remind you, this is not a dating site.

It's not that he has a slow release per say...

To me it like he is using a lot of his shoulder in his throw. The start of his throw comes out a little wider/further away from the body than normal or what I would like to see. Instead of going straight back and up, it's around and up.

It appears the mechanics are only a little wide/loose at the beginning of his throw. His arm tends to go further away from his body when he brings the ball back from his hand instead of keeping everything tight and compact.

The kid steps into his throws with good front knee bend.

I will be interested to see if the coaches make adjustments to his throw or not. Sometimes, the way a person throws, is the way they throw.

I'm going through a similar issue right now with my son. He changed the way he brings the ball back and tried to add more height to his release point and his accuracy took a major nose dive.

Vers,

I'm coming to the conclusion that Hue's plan isn't what I thought it was. I thought we were going to be throwing lots of deep balls. Now I'm not so sure. Pretty much all the receivers we drafted are guys with good run after the catch. I think we're going to be trying to misdirect opponents and get the ball out quickly and let playmakers make things happen. This could take some pressure off the O-Line in pass protection. The O-lineman we drafted is primarily a run blocker as is Bailey who we picked up in FA. I'm expecting lots of running, play action off that along with screens, and quick passes. It looks like we're going more horizontal stretch than vertical, but we did add some quick strike ability to keep teams relatively honest.

Yeah, I'm not worried about How he throws, especially if he's accurate... but, I'm wondering more about release time. Like, from teh time he decides to throw, how long does it take for him to get the ball out, that sort of thing. Folks used to talk about how Weededn had this huge wind-up that gave defenders plenty of time to get a hand in his face and bat the ball down. QB's with a quicker release tend to do better... so, I'm wondering where this kid stacks up.

LOL...........that was pretty funny.

his release time is quick and efficient.

again... I'm more worried about players smacking the ball away with the way he brings the ball up to throw it. The rest of his mechanics are pretty solid.

j/c

Here's another link, you can safely skip the first minute (ads)

Football Gameplan Cody Kessler Scouting Report Video

Some highlights:

They had him projected as QB #4 and a 3rd rounder back in February. Gave Andy Dalton as his pro comparison.

I don't think its all or none.
You can throw the ball deep a lot and also throw quick.
They brought in receivers that are good after the catch in Coleman, Louis and Payton. But, those same guys all run 4.4.

I think Hue and staff are going to build a complete offense which should contain all the elements you mentioned.

But, from watching Hue's offenses both in Cinci and Oakland especially I know 2 things: (1) Hue is gonna run the ball (2) Hue will throw it downfield off play-action.

Reading some 2015 articles on the Pac-10 QB's, and seems like Goff and Kessler were always mentioned together as 1-2, respectively.

Interesting to know that a Kessler led USC team was 3-0 vs. a Goff led Cal team.

Just more hope that maybe we got a good one. lol.

USC's talent is still ridiculous. Cal's is. . . not ridiculous.

Where do you think Kessler would have been picked if he was 6'3 or taller?

I like Emory Hunt, I disagree with him often. It's funny because I didn't agree with him on Carson Wentz. He said he was a 4th round pick and I thought he was a 2nd rounder.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=me8kI_yYqzc

Same.

We will never know for sure. He will never be 6'3".

I will say this ... In retrospect we can say for certain that Russell Wilson's height played a role in dropping to the 3rd round of the 2012 draft.

Heck, I think MY life would have been different had I been 3-inches taller.

That and a 4.5 40

ewwwwwwwwwwwwwe LMAO

Just looked at some Kessler highlight films. I think his "arm strength" is fine. I put that in quotes because that evaluation come from throws where he, for one reason or another, had to make an arm throw. Those throws where all the velocity is generated from the arm not the body. On those throws, he actually gets pretty good velocity.

So why the criticism on arm strength? I believe it comes from a flaw in his throwing motion. Not sure I can adequately explain without demonstrating but I think he is inconsistent with his weight shift. Because of that, he ends up restricting his arm movement, artificially throwing across his body. I say artificially because he isn't throwing across his body but he creates the same effect. This results is significant loss of velocity. Watch the video that Grimm posted with this in mind and see if you can understand what I am trying to say.

The good thing about this is that it can easily be corrected. The bad thing is that this is so engrained at this point of his development that he will have a tendency to fall back into the bad habit. The maybe is, maybe this adds a lot of velocity to his throw, maybe it adds only a little.

Mine to. I would have been able to look over the steering wheel instead of under it