DawgTalkers.net
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 01:35 PM
Russia is further behind the curve on this than even the USA. They are finally waking up. Putin must have told trump it was a hoax.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/18/fortress-russia-coronavirus-spread-covid-pandemic/
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 05:09 PM
Trump: FDA making anti-malaria drug available 'almost immediately' to tackle coronavirus

President Trump announced Thursday that the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is making experimental drugs -- including those used for treating malaria -- available as part of the ongoing effort to tackle the spread of the coronavirus.

Trump announced at a White House press briefing that chloroquine, a drug designed for use in malaria, has been FDA approved and will be made available by prescription "almost immediately." He said it was one of a number of antiviral therapies to limit the symptoms of the virus that the administration is trying to get to Americans as quickly as possible.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-fda-experimental-drugs-coronavirus

Hope.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 05:32 PM
A treatment helps to minimize the symptoms of people who have an illness. A vaccine helps stop the spread of a disease.

A treatment does nothing to "stop the spread" of anything.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 05:54 PM
A Treatment may keep the virus from killing so many people.

A Treatment may keep people from getting so sick from the virus.

A Treatment buys us time while we wait for the Vaccine.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:01 PM
That's what I said.

But what you posted said this.....

Quote:
to tackle the spread of the coronavirus.


Which it will not do. Keeping people informed of the actual facts helps everyone.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:06 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
That's what I said.

But what you posted said this.....

Quote:
to tackle the spread of the coronavirus.


Which it will not do. Keeping people informed of the actual facts helps everyone.


Based on what that guy said in the interview, it could help stop the spread. The virus was completely eliminated from the patients in the study in 6 days. That's a lot shorter than if you don't have that medicine. Shorter duration of being infectious to others = less spread of virus.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:10 PM
j/c...

Oh boy.

Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:19 PM
Once you have been diagnosed with the virus you are in quarantine. You spread the virus before you are diagnosed.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:22 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Once you have been diagnosed with the virus you are in quarantine. You spread the virus before you are diagnosed.


You're supposed to stay in quarantine. People dont always do what they are supposed to. Also, for a lot (most) of people quarantine means staying home with family.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:24 PM
If you're home with family they will catch it in six days as well.

I'm not so sure why it's so hard for people to understand about the difference between being immunized and being treated?
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:53 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
If you're home with family they will catch it in six days as well.

I'm not so sure why it's so hard for people to understand about the difference between being immunized and being treated?


I don't think people are having a tough time with that.

There IS no immunization for it. They are working on treating it in those that have it. And they are encouraging, and in some places demanding, that people stay to also help slow the spread.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 06:58 PM
I agree.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 07:08 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
A Treatment may keep the virus from killing so many people.

A Treatment may keep people from getting so sick from the virus.

A Treatment buys us time while we wait for the Vaccine.



Another treatment that isn’t available. Along with masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other shortages. This administration is failing the American public.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 07:12 PM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
If you're home with family they will catch it in six days as well.

I'm not so sure why it's so hard for people to understand about the difference between being immunized and being treated?


I don't think people are having a tough time with that.

There IS no immunization for it. They are working on treating it in those that have it. And they are encouraging, and in some places demanding, that people stay to also help slow the spread.


Hospitals are already starting to feel the pressure big time. trump has been in reaction mode the whole time. He and his czar pence are clueless.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 07:47 PM
Pretty soon now all those Spring Break kids who didn't follow Trumps Protocols will be returning home to kill their parents and grandparents.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 07:49 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Pretty soon now all those Spring Break kids who didn't follow Trumps Protocols will be returning home to kill their parents and grandparents.


What do you mean kids. Bernie supporters.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 08:56 PM
j/c...





Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 09:08 PM
Bayer just made it available to the govt today. It won’t be available for treatments for a couple weeks if at all anyways. This is like a bandaid on a limb amputation. And now using a bandanna as a mask is what the FDA is suggesting. Pfft the trump era.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 09:09 PM
Originally Posted By: Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Pretty soon now all those Spring Break kids who didn't follow Trumps Protocols will be returning home to kill their parents and grandparents.


What do you mean kids. Bernie supporters.


You just can't stop. You're a socialist now because you support Trump and he has gone full on socialist.
Posted By: Lyuokdea Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 09:10 PM
After receiving an intel report about the Coronavirus threat - Senator Burr made a statement ensuring the public that Coronavirus was not a threat to the US ... and then sold $1.6M of his personal stock

https://www.propublica.org/article/senat...us-preparedness
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 09:12 PM
Originally Posted By: Lyuokdea
After receiving an intel report about the Coronavirus threat - Senator Burr made a statement ensuring the public that Coronavirus was not a threat to the US ... and then sold $1.6M of his personal stock

https://www.propublica.org/article/senat...us-preparedness


Lol ...just watch how the rich cut and run on us.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 09:47 PM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: Lyuokdea
After receiving an intel report about the Coronavirus threat - Senator Burr made a statement ensuring the public that Coronavirus was not a threat to the US ... and then sold $1.6M of his personal stock

https://www.propublica.org/article/senat...us-preparedness


Lol ...just watch how the rich cut and run on us.


I don't know about run but he sure cut his losses. AND the piece of crap knew how bad this was going to be for weeks. smh

He should be fined at least 30% of those transactions so he can share the loss. Insider trading for him seems to be just fine.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/19/20 11:31 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Pretty soon now all those Spring Break kids who didn't follow Trumps Protocols will be returning home to kill their parents and grandparents.


What do you mean kids. Bernie supporters.


You just can't stop. You're a socialist now because you support Trump and he has gone full on socialist.


I am sorry OCD. I was just trying to be funny.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:40 AM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
A Treatment may keep the virus from killing so many people.

A Treatment may keep people from getting so sick from the virus.

A Treatment buys us time while we wait for the Vaccine.



Another treatment that isn’t available. Along with masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other shortages. This administration is failing the American public.


Sorry but even the most radical Libs know great leadership when they see it...

Ilhan Omar praises Trump's 'incredible' response to coronavirus pandemic

Minnesota Democratic Rep. Ilhan Omar unexpectedly praised President Trump's handling of the coronavirus pandemic on Wednesday night, saying it was "incredible and the right response in this critical time."

Omar, normally a staunch critic of the White House who herself has repeatedly drawn the president's ire, went on to quote Rep. Ayanna Pressley, D-Mass., as saying "unprecedented times require unprecedented leadership" -- and, Omar added, "we are seeing that in our country right now."

"Finally, we should never let politics get in the way of good policy," Omar concluded. "This is a great start and hope others will be part of a united front to push for good policies that will help us work through the economic anxiety the country is feeling right now."

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ilhan-o...avirus-pandemic
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 03:07 AM
Originally Posted By: Lyuokdea
After receiving an intel report about the Coronavirus threat - Senator Burr made a statement ensuring the public that Coronavirus was not a threat to the US ... and then sold $1.6M of his personal stock

https://www.propublica.org/article/senat...us-preparedness


Another one....

Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 05:04 AM
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 07:29 AM
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 07:49 AM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
A Treatment may keep the virus from killing so many people.

A Treatment may keep people from getting so sick from the virus.

A Treatment buys us time while we wait for the Vaccine.



Another treatment that isn’t available. Along with masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other shortages. This administration is failing the American public.


Sorry but even the most radical Libs know great leadership when they see it...

Ilhan Omar praises Trump's 'incredible' response to coronavirus pandemic

Minnesota Democratic Rep. Ilhan Omar unexpectedly praised President Trump's handling of the coronavirus pandemic on Wednesday night, saying it was "incredible and the right response in this critical time."

Omar, normally a staunch critic of the White House who herself has repeatedly drawn the president's ire, went on to quote Rep. Ayanna Pressley, D-Mass., as saying "unprecedented times require unprecedented leadership" -- and, Omar added, "we are seeing that in our country right now."

"Finally, we should never let politics get in the way of good policy," Omar concluded. "This is a great start and hope others will be part of a united front to push for good policies that will help us work through the economic anxiety the country is feeling right now."

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ilhan-o...avirus-pandemic



https://www.yahoo.com/news/virus-outbreak-cascade-warnings-went-193648556.html


Before Virus Outbreak, a Cascade of Warnings Went Unheeded
The New York Times
David E. Sanger, Eric Lipton, Eileen Sullivan and Michael Crowley
,The New York Times•March 19, 2020

WASHINGTON — The outbreak of the respiratory virus began in China and was quickly spread around the world by air travelers, who ran high fevers. In the United States, it was first detected in Chicago, and 47 days later the World Health Organization declared a pandemic. By then it was too late: 110 million Americans were expected to become ill, leading to 7.7 million hospitalized and 586,000 dead.

That scenario, code-named “Crimson Contagion,” was simulated by the Trump administration’s Department of Health and Human Services in a series of exercises that ran from last January to August.

The simulation’s sobering results — contained in a draft report dated October 2019 that has not previously been reported — drove home just how underfunded, underprepared and uncoordinated the federal government would be for a life-or-death battle with a virus for which no treatment existed.

The draft report, marked “not to be disclosed,” laid out in stark detail repeated cases of “confusion” in the exercise. Federal agencies jockeyed over who was in charge. State officials and hospitals struggled to figure out what kind of equipment was stockpiled or available. Cities and states went their own way on school closings.

Many of the potentially deadly consequences of a failure to address the shortcomings are now playing out in all-too-real fashion across the country. And it was hardly the first warning for the nation’s leaders. Three times over the past four years the U.S. government, across two administrations, had grappled in depth with what a pandemic would look like, identifying likely shortcomings and in some cases recommending specific action.

In 2016 the Obama administration produced a comprehensive report on the lessons learned by the government from battling Ebola. In January 2017 outgoing Obama administration officials ran an extensive exercise on responding to a pandemic for incoming senior officials of the Trump administration.

The full story of the Trump administration’s response to the coronavirus is still playing out. Government officials, health professionals, journalists and historians will spend years looking back on the muddled messages and missed opportunities of the past three months, as President Donald Trump moved from dismissing the coronavirus as a few cases that would soon be “under control” to his revisionist announcement Monday that he had known all along that a pandemic was on the way.

What the scenario makes clear, however, is that his own administration had already modeled a similar pandemic and understood its potential trajectory.

The White House defended its record, saying it responded to the 2019 exercise with an executive order to improve the availability and quality of flu vaccines, and that it moved early this year to increase funding for the Health and Human Service Department’s program that focuses on global pandemic threats.

But officials have declined to say why the administration was so slow to roll out broad testing, or move faster, as the simulations all indicated it should, to urge social distancing and school closings.

Asked at his news briefing Thursday about the government’s preparedness, Trump responded, “Nobody knew there would be a pandemic or epidemic of this proportion. Nobody has ever seen anything like this before.”

The work done over the past five years, however, demonstrates that the government had considerable knowledge about the risks of a pandemic and accurately predicted the very types of problems Trump is now scrambling belatedly to address.

“Crimson Contagion,” the exercise conducted last year in Washington and 12 states including New York and Illinois, showed that federal agencies under Trump continued the Obama-era effort to think ahead about a pandemic.

But the planning and thinking happened many layers down in the bureaucracy. The knowledge and sense of urgency about the peril appear never to have gotten sufficient attention at the highest level of the executive branch or from Congress, leaving the nation with funding shortfalls, equipment shortages and disorganization within and among various branches and levels of government.

The October 2019 report in particular documents that officials at the Homeland Security and Health and Human Services departments and even the White House’s National Security Council were aware of the potential for a respiratory virus outbreak originating in China to spread quickly to the U.S. and overwhelm the nation.

“Nobody ever thought of numbers like this,’’ Trump said Wednesday, at a news conference.

In fact, they had.

From Ebola, Lessons Learned

As early as the George W. Bush administration, homeland security and health officials focused on big gaps in the U.S. response to a biological attacks and the growing risk of pandemics. The first test came in April 2009, just a few months after the start of President Barack Obama’s first term. A 10-year-old California girl was diagnosed with a contagious disease that would be called swine flu or H1N1, the first flu pandemic in more than 40 years.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates that ultimately there were about 60.8 million cases in the U.S., along with 274,304 hospitalizations and 12,469 deaths associated with H1N1.

The virus turned out to be less deadly than first expected. But it was a warning shot that officials in the Obama administration said they took seriously, kicking off a planning effort that escalated in early 2014, with the outbreak of Ebola in West Africa and ensuing fear that it could spread to the U.S.

Ebola was less contagious than the flu, but far more deadly. It killed 11,000 people in Africa. But it could have been far worse. The U.S. sent nearly 3,000 troops to Africa to help keep the disease from spreading. While the containment effort was considered a success, inside the White House, officials sensed that the U.S. had gotten lucky — and that the response had revealed gaps in preparedness.

Christopher Kirchhoff, a national security aide who moved from the Pentagon to the White House to deal with the Ebola crisis, was given the job of putting together a “lessons learned” report, with input from across the government.

The weaknesses Kirchhoff identified were early warning signals of what has unfolded in the past three months.

His report concluded that the U.S. assumed more capability on the part of the World Health Organization than the agency actually had.

The U.S. had its own issues. There was no airplane in the U.S. fleet capable of evacuating an American doctor who was infected while treating patients in Liberia. The Pentagon was largely unprepared for the intervention that Obama ordered.

While the U.S. rapidly developed a way to screen air passengers coming into the U.S. — borrowing from intelligence tools developed after 9/11 to track possible terrorists — Kirchhoff found deficiencies in even measuring how fast the virus was spreading.

On the plus side, the Obama White House had created an Ebola Task Force, run by Ron Klain, Vice President Joe Biden’s former chief of staff, before a single case emerged in the U.S. Congress allocated $5.4 billion in emergency funding to pay for Ebola treatment and prevention efforts in the U.S. and West Africa.

The money helped fund a little-known agency inside the Health and Human Services Department in charge of preparing for future contagious disease outbreaks, the same office that in 2019 ran the Crimson Contagion exercise and other similar events in the years since.

After Thomas Duncan, a Liberian citizen, became the first person diagnosed with Ebola on U.S. territory in September 2014, errors resulted in the infection of two nurses and fear of a wider spread in the U.S. (Duncan died, but the two nurses recovered.)

What is striking in reading Kirchhoff’s account today, however, is how few of the major faults he found in the American response resulted in action — even though the report was filled with department-by-department recommendations.

There were deficiencies “in personal protective equipment use, disinfection” and “social services for those placed under quarantine.”

There was confusion over travel restrictions, and the need “for a smoother sliding scale of escalation of government response, from local authorities acting on their own to local authorities acting with some federal assistance” to the full activation of the federal government.

The report concluded that “a minimum planning bench mark might be an epidemic an order of magnitude or two more difficult than that presented by the outbreak of Ebola in West Africa, with much more significant domestic spread.”

But one big change did come out of the study: The creation of a dedicated office at the National Security Council to coordinate responses and raise the alarm early.

“What I learned most is that we had to stand up a global biosecurity and health directorate, and get it enshrined for the next administration,’’ said Lisa Monaco, Obama’s homeland security adviser.

Getting the Trump Team’s Attention

After Trump’s election, Monaco arranged an extensive exercise for high-level incoming officials — including Rex Tillerson, the nominee for secretary of state; John Kelly, designated to become homeland security secretary, and Rick Perry, who would become energy secretary — gaming out the response to a deadly flu outbreak.

She asked Tom Bossert, who was preparing to come in as Trump’s homeland security adviser, to run the event alongside her.

“We modeled a new strain of flu in the exercise precisely because it’s so communicable,” Monaco said. “There is no vaccine, and you would get issues like nursing homes being particularly vulnerable, shortages of ventilators.”

Monaco was impressed by how seriously Bossert, her successor, appeared to take the threat, as did many of the 30 or so Trump team members who participated in the exercise, details of which were reported by Politico.

But by the time the current crisis hit, almost all the leaders at the table — Tillerson, Kelly and Perry among them — had been fired or moved on.

In 2018, Trump’s then-national security adviser, John Bolton, ousted Bossert and eliminated the National Security Council directorate, folding it into an office dedicated to weapons of mass destruction in what Trump officials called a logical consolidation.

Asked about that shift on March 13, Trump told a reporter that it was “a nasty question,” before adding: “I don’t know anything about it.” Writing on Twitter the next day, Bolton lashed out at critics who said the shift had reflected disinterest in pandemic threats.

“Claims streamlining NSC structures impaired our nation’s bio defense are false. Global health remained a top NSC priority,” Bolton wrote.

In a statement, the National Security Council said it “has directors and staff whose full-time job it is to monitor, plan for, and respond to pandemics, including an infectious disease epidemiologist and a virologist.”

But in testimony to Congress last week, Dr. Anthony S. Fauci, director of National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, suggested that ending the stand-alone directorate was ill-advised. “It would be nice if the office was still there,” he said.

On Feb. 10, nearly three weeks after the first coronavirus case was diagnosed in the U.S., Trump submitted a 2021 budget proposal that calls for a $693.3 million reduction in funding for the Centers for Disease Control, or about 9%, although there was a modest increase for the division that combats global pandemics.

‘Crimson Contagion’

The Crimson Contagion planning exercise run last year by the Health and Human Services Department involved officials from 12 states and at least a dozen federal agencies. They included the Pentagon, the Department of Veterans Affairs and the National Security Council. Groups like the American Red Cross and American Nurses Association were invited to join, as were health insurance companies and major hospitals like the Mayo Clinic.

The war game-like exercise was overseen by Robert Kadlec, a former Air Force physician who has spent decades focused on biodefense issues. After stints on the Bush administration’s homeland security council and the staff of the Senate Intelligence Committee, he was appointed assistant secretary of Health and Human Services for Preparedness and Response.

“He recognized early that we have a big problem and we needed much bigger budgets to prepare,’’ said Richard Danzig, secretary of the Navy in the Clinton administration, who had worked with Kadlec.

The exercise played out in four separate stages, starting in January 2019.

The events were supposedly unspooling in real time, with the worst-case scenario underway as of Aug. 13, 2019, when according to the script, 12,100 cases had already been reported in the U.S., with the largest number in Chicago, which had 1,400.

The fictional outbreak involved a pandemic flu, which the Department of Health and Human Services says was “very different than the novel coronavirus.” The staged outbreak had started when a group of 35 tourists visiting China were infected and then flew home to Australia, Kuwait, Malaysia, Thailand, Britain and Spain, as well as the U.S., with some developing respiratory symptoms and fevers en route.

A 52-year-old male from Chicago, who was on the tour, had “low energy and a dry cough” upon his return home. His 17-year-old son on that same day went out to a large public event in Chicago, and the chain of illnesses in the U.S. started.

Many of the moments during the tabletop exercise are now chillingly familiar.

In the fictional pandemic, as the virus spread quickly across the U.S., the CDC issued guidelines for social distancing, and many employees were told to work from home.

But federal and state officials struggled to identify which employees were essential and what equipment was needed to effectively work from home.

There also was confusion over how to handle schoolchildren. The CDC recommended that states delay school openings — the exercise took place toward the end of summer. But some school districts decided to go ahead with the start of school while others followed the federal advice, causing the same types of confusion and discrepancies that have marked the response to the coronavirus.

The exercise from last year then went on to predict how the situation on the ground in the U.S. would worsen as the weeks passed.

Confusion emerged as state governments began to turn in large numbers to Washington for help to address shortages of antiviral medications, personal protective equipment, and ventilators. Then states started to submit requests to different branches of the federal government, leading to bureaucratic chaos.

Friction also emerged between the Federal Emergency Management Agency, which is traditionally in charge of disaster response, and the Health and Human Services Department, another scenario playing out now.

But the problems were larger than bureaucratic snags. The U.S., organizers realized, did not have the means to quickly manufacture more essential medical equipment, supplies and medicines, from antiviral medications to needles, syringes, N95 respirators and ventilators, the agency concluded.

Congress was briefed in December on some of these findings, including the inability to quickly replenish certain medical supplies, given that much of the product comes from overseas.

These concerns turned more urgent at a hearing on Capitol Hill last Thursday, as lawmakers peppered Health and Human Services Department officials with questions that sounded almost as if they had read the script from the fictional exercise, reflecting the shortage of respirators and protective gear.

Sen. Mitt Romney, R-Utah, said last week that he blamed Congress and prior administrations for not increasing stockpiles of this type of equipment.

“That is an area we ought to consider making an investment in,” Romney added, making a point, apparently unknown to him, that the administration’s own simulation had made clear five months earlier.

This article originally appeared in The New York Times.
Posted By: Dawgs4Life Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 10:24 AM
Lol is that the same dude who cured people via the TV
Posted By: BCbrownie Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 11:46 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 11:55 AM
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?


It’s against the law so Feinstein will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and the Republicans will get off Scott free or just a slap on the wrist.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 12:19 PM
Originally Posted By: Dawgs4Life
Lol is that the same dude who cured people via the TV


What are you blabbering about?
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 12:36 PM
https://www.yahoo.com/news/virus-outbreak-cascade-warnings-went-193648556.html

That was a hell of a read - thanks Jester.
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 12:45 PM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?


It’s against the law so Feinstein will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and the Republicans will get off Scott free or just a slap on the wrist.



Dianne Feinstein, 3 Senate colleagues sold off stocks before coronavirus crash: reports

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/dianne-...s-crash-reports
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 12:48 PM
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?


Yes and Yes. I have no issue calling out corrupt acts regardless of party.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 12:56 PM
I wonder if we'll find out if Trump and his crew took advantage of this knowledge to profit too. I would not be a bit surprised to find out his kids and cronies sold off stocks.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:02 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?


Yes and Yes. I have no issue calling out corrupt acts regardless of party.


I agree - I also think there is special level for those that went out publicly to tow Trump's misguided initial approach to down play the threat - but were getting a different real science perspective that they didn't share with the public, while selling off stocks to protect themselves.
Posted By: FATE Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:05 PM
Originally Posted By: Dawgs4Life
Lol is that the same dude who cured people via the TV

Yep. Same dude lol.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:05 PM
Feels borderline traitorous like some kind of political societal sabotage...
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:06 PM
Originally Posted By: FATE
Originally Posted By: Dawgs4Life
Lol is that the same dude who cured people via the TV

Yep. Same dude lol.



He has no shame.
Posted By: Tulsa Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:19 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: FATE
Originally Posted By: Dawgs4Life
Lol is that the same dude who cured people via the TV

Yep. Same dude lol.



He has no shame.


A pure slime-ball.
Posted By: BCbrownie Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 01:39 PM
All politicians are the same,corrupt.Been that way since time began.
Too much money,too much power.
Some people want to give them more of both,let them get their grimey fingers into the health care pot,it will make billionaires out of every congressperson.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 03:52 PM
So heard on the radio this morning that at least one of these politicians that dumped stock also purchased stock of video conferencing company(ies) that were likely to benefit from people being forced to work from home etc ... jail these opportunistic scum regardless of party. Expose them all.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:04 PM
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
All politicians are the same,corrupt.Been that way since time began.
Too much money,too much power.
Some people want to give them more of both,let them get their grimey fingers into the health care pot,it will make billionaires out of every congressperson.


Because for profit health care is slime ball free... rolleyes
Posted By: FloridaFan Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:26 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
All politicians are the same,corrupt.Been that way since time began.
Too much money,too much power.
Some people want to give them more of both,let them get their grimey fingers into the health care pot,it will make billionaires out of every congressperson.


Because for profit health care is slime ball free... rolleyes


No, but at least right now we have a choice of which slime ball we deal with. tongue naughtydevil superconfused
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:34 PM
Do we? Where is the socialized medicine choice for the working class?
Posted By: FloridaFan Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:37 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Do we? Where is the socialized medicine choice for the working class?


Now your reading more into my comment than I posted, you fully understand what was meant, since we were referring to slimeballs in control of healthcare, but choose to make it more if you wish, just don't try to call me out for something I never said.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:37 PM
Trump just lost his cool with another reporter and I have no idea what he asked Trump.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:42 PM
Originally Posted By: FloridaFan
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Do we? Where is the socialized medicine choice for the working class?


Now your reading more into my comment than I posted, you fully understand what was meant, since we were referring to slimeballs in control of healthcare, but choose to make it more if you wish, just don't try to call me out for something I never said.




Wasn't calling you out, just pointing out what you said was wrong in the course of this particular conversation. BCbrownie said government control of healthcare would be bad because of slime ball's greed. I said that applies to regular health care. You said at least we have a choice right now of which slime ball... No we don't.

I know what you meant by your comment, but your comment devalues the need for socialized medicine and I don't think it's accurate. That's all.
Posted By: FloridaFan Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 04:48 PM
thumbsup
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 05:59 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Trump just lost his cool with another reporter and I have no idea what he asked Trump.


Quote:
Asked by NBC News White House correspondent Peter Alexander what he’d say to Americans who are ‘scared’ over the 200 people killed and 14,000 sickened by coronavirus, Trump snapped: ‘I say that you’re a terrible reporter. ‘I think thats a very nasty question and I think it’s a very bad signal you’re putting out to the American people. ‘The American people are looking for answers and you’re looking for hope and you’re doing sensationalism. The same with NBC and (parent company) Comcast – I call it Concast.’

Trump continued: ‘That’s really bad reporting. ‘You ought to get back to reporting instead of sensationalism. ‘Let’s see if (possible coronavirus treatment hydroxychloroquine) works. ‘It might and it might not. ‘I happen to feel good about it but who knows. ‘Ive been right a lot. but lets see what happens. you ought to be ashamed of yourself.’

https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/20/donald-tr...virus-12432184/


There was nothing wrong with the question. A typical Trumpian meltdown.
Posted By: BpG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:05 PM
He's right and he's wrong at the same time. He's right, we don't need the amount of fear mongering these stations are putting out, they are literally paid to drive scared people to their news. On the other hand, you're the President of the United States, act like it.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:13 PM
For the duration of this crisis, Vice President Pence should be the face/voice of The White House.

That other dude shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a podium or microphone.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:19 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
He's right and he's wrong at the same time. He's right, we don't need the amount of fear mongering these stations are putting out, they are literally paid to drive scared people to their news. On the other hand, you're the President of the United States, act like it.


The reporter asked him what positive message he had for people who were scared. There's no way in hell you can say that his response to that question was right in any way.

He gave Trump an open opportunity to send a message out to those who were scared. Instead, Trump attacked the reporter.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:24 PM
Originally Posted By: fishtheice
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Boy those money over country republicans never fail to amaze.


Fienstien(?sp)did the same thing.
So would she be a money over country Dem?And does she amaze you also?


It’s against the law so Feinstein will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law and the Republicans will get off Scott free or just a slap on the wrist.




Dianne Feinstein, 3 Senate colleagues sold off stocks before coronavirus crash: reports

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/dianne-...s-crash-reports


Lol...and Feinstein is the only one singled out by the GOPers.. ... I’ll stick with the liberal female being prosecuted here and the GOPers will walk scenario.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:29 PM
Still can’t get a test if you want one.....even if you have the symptoms and are really sick. Oh except if you’re rich...no problemo amigos, come on in. All you others go home wash your hands.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:38 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
He's right and he's wrong at the same time. He's right, we don't need the amount of fear mongering these stations are putting out, they are literally paid to drive scared people to their news. On the other hand, you're the President of the United States, act like it.


Let Trump be Trump!

He built this economy and now is using it to defeat the Virus and save America!

Because of him we came into this war very strong.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:39 PM
Yeah, a Democratic hoax that was just going to disappear.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:44 PM
j/c

Largest daily death total reported in Italy today at 627.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:49 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Yeah, a Democratic hoax that was just going to disappear.


You guys cried WOLF over Dementia and article 25!

You guys cried WOLF over his being a Russian Traitor!

You guys cried WOLF over Collusion!

You guys cried WOLF over Mueller!

You guys cried WOLF over Ukraine and Quid Pro Quo!

Then you cried Corona and no one was listening.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 06:53 PM
More excuses for Trumps lies.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 07:34 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Originally Posted By: BpG
He's right and he's wrong at the same time. He's right, we don't need the amount of fear mongering these stations are putting out, they are literally paid to drive scared people to their news. On the other hand, you're the President of the United States, act like it.


Let Trump be Trump!

He built this economy and now it’s already gone.


Fixed it.

Like everything trump has ever touched. Usually ending in bankruptcy or was forced to shutdown. Pfft the trump era.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 07:37 PM
Feinstein is innocent because her stocks are managed by a blind trust.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/20/20 07:39 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Feinstein is innocent because her stocked are managed by a blind trust.


LOL...That won’t work for her but it will for the GOPers that sold off their stock.
Posted By: Dawg Duty Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 12:36 AM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
[quote=OldColdDawg] Feinstein is innocent because her stocked are managed by a blind trust.


LOL...That won’t work for her but it will for the GOPers that sold off their stock.

even at times like this you freaking liberals can't stop playing politics
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 12:56 AM
Quote:
even at times like this you freaking liberals can't stop playing politics


I don't know how many people can read on here. I wonder sometimes when I read the interpretations in the PFF.........but, take a look at the above quote and tell me what you see? LOL
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 01:35 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Feinstein is innocent because her stocks are managed by a blind trust.


...but her husband sold off millions of dollars worth that weren't managed by a blind trust. I'm sure she didn't tell him anything.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 01:52 AM
Originally Posted By: jfanent
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Feinstein is innocent because her stocks are managed by a blind trust.


...but her husband sold off millions of dollars worth that weren't managed by a blind trust. I'm sure she didn't tell him anything.


I didn't hear that. That's a different story then.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 02:04 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: jfanent
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Feinstein is innocent because her stocks are managed by a blind trust.


...but her husband sold off millions of dollars worth that weren't managed by a blind trust. I'm sure she didn't tell him anything.


I didn't hear that. That's a different story then.


Here's what was said:

NY Post

Quote:
Feinstein, a California Democrat, sold $500,001 to $1 million worth of stock in a company called Allogene Therapeutics on Jan. 31, less than a month before panic about the virus caused markets to plunge, Senate records show. Her husband sold $1,000,001 to $5 million worth of Allogene shares on Feb. 18, according to financial disclosures.

Feinstein spokesman Tom Mentzer said her husband made the transactions, not the senator herself.

“All of Senator Feinstein’s assets are in a blind trust, as they have been since she came to the Senate,” Mentzer said in an email. “She has no involvement in any of her husband’s financial decisions.”
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 02:07 AM
Staff member in Vice President Mike Pence's office tests positive for coronavirus

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/20/politics/staffer-vice-president-office-coronavirus/index.html
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 03:06 AM


I felt all of that, Doc.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 04:20 AM
Originally Posted By: Swish


I felt all of that, Doc.


Quote:
For the duration of this crisis, Vice President Pence should be the face/voice of The White House.

That other dude shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a podium or microphone.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 09:02 AM
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 10:53 AM
Originally Posted By: BCbrownie
All politicians are the same,corrupt.Been that way since time began.
Too much money,too much power.
Some people want to give them more of both,let them get their grimey fingers into the health care pot,it will make billionaires out of every congressperson.


rofl trump supporters don’t care how much power trump has.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 02:40 PM
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/...-economists-say

Damn, ouch
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 02:43 PM
https://www.thehour.com/news/article/Intelligence-officials-early-alarms-about-15147137.php
Posted By: 3rd_and_20 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 03:29 PM
j/c:

Related coronavirus news (and it's not from theonion.com):

Couple are furious when told they’re not allowed to buy 552 CANS of Mountain Dew due to coronavirus rationing at Kroger store in Kentucky

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article...w.html#comments
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 03:49 PM
Despite popular opinion in Kentucky, the FDA has not approved Mt. Dew as a treatment for the coronavirus as of yet. The evidence of its effectiveness is still anecdotal.
Posted By: 3rd_and_20 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 04:52 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Despite popular opinion in Kentucky, the FDA has not approved Mt. Dew as a treatment for the coronavirus as of yet. The evidence of its effectiveness is still anecdotal.


That's very funny, I had to read it twice though. lol
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 05:21 PM
https://www.yahoo.com/news/covid-19-symptoms-look-day-143000334.html
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 05:21 PM
Interesting video.
Stay home and stay healthy my friends
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/21/20 07:30 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Despite popular opinion in Kentucky, the FDA has not approved Mt. Dew as a treatment for the coronavirus as of yet. The evidence of its effectiveness is still anecdotal.


However, there is strong evidence that it lowers your IQ, makes you coordinate sweatpants outfits with your wife, and makes you decide to get really bad haircuts.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 03:53 PM
And sparkling water usually lends itself to making people idiots.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 03:56 PM
j/c

Coronavirus patient in Kentucky refused to quarantine, so deputies surrounded his house

https://fox59.com/news/coronavirus-patie...nded-his-house/

It seems that the problem was far more of a geographic nature than being Mountain Dew related.
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 04:58 PM
Why is trump letting private sector handle mask production. This is putting states in bidding wars for masks. Mask production needs to be government controlled and regulated.

Illinois governor says 'it's a wild west' for medical supplies because of Trump's response to states' requests

its the wild west

Cuomo pleads for federal government to nationalize effort to acquire medical supplies for coronavirus

Cuomo pleads fed
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 05:46 PM
j/c

Rand Paul just tested positive.
Posted By: SaintDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 08:06 PM
Ohio under stay at home order
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 08:15 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
j/c

Rand Paul just tested positive.


I’d like to get Rand Paul’s take on how trump and his GOPer associates handled this now. Hospitals still waiting for PPG. So even if they had the tests kits they still have to wait for protective gear. Still no news on financial aid to millions of Americans ordered by the gov’t to stay home away from work. If only trump would have stopped international travel when they all learned about this in December or January. Pffft.... the trump era. Calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Blood on GOP hands. Shame on them all.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 09:01 PM
Rand Paul is first senator to test positive for coronavirus

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/22/politics/rand-paul-coronavirus/index.html

I find it a bit disgusting that people are celebrating this on FB and Twitter. I don't like the man but I wouldn't wish this virus on a dog.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 09:14 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Rand Paul is first senator to test positive for coronavirus

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/22/politics/rand-paul-coronavirus/index.html

I find it a bit disgusting that people are celebrating this on FB and Twitter. I don't like the man but I wouldn't wish this virus on a dog.


I can't think of 3 more despicable politicians than Moscow Mitch, Noxious Nunes or Defunct Drumf ... but I wouldn't be celebrating any of them getting Covid 19. The idiots on the fringes making those comments just make it easy for the "Libs" to be labelled as hateful and make it easy for Trump to continue to be a victim.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 09:21 PM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Rand Paul is first senator to test positive for coronavirus

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/22/politics/rand-paul-coronavirus/index.html

I find it a bit disgusting that people are celebrating this on FB and Twitter. I don't like the man but I wouldn't wish this virus on a dog.


I can't think of 3 more despicable politicians than Moscow Mitch, Noxious Nunes or Defunct Drumf ... but I wouldn't be celebrating any of them getting Covid 19. The idiots on the fringes making those comments just make it easy for the "Libs" to be labelled as hateful and make it easy for Trump to continue to be a victim.


I agree, but trump and his supporters will always continue to play the victim. It’s what they do. They project all their flaws onto others.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 09:25 PM
Germany Bans Groups of More Than 2 to Stop Coronavirus as Merkel Self-Isolates

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/22/world/europe/germany-coronavirus-budget.html

Damn.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 09:44 PM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
j/c

Rand Paul just tested positive.


I’d like to get Rand Paul’s take on how trump and his GOPer associates handled this now. Hospitals still waiting for PPG. So even if they had the tests kits they still have to wait for protective gear. Still no news on financial aid to millions of Americans ordered by the gov’t to stay home away from work. If only trump would have stopped international travel when they all learned about this in December or January. Pffft.... the trump era. Calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Blood on GOP hands. Shame on them all.


Senate repubs think that they will have a bill that the senate committee could vote on this afternoon and maybe a full vote tomorrow. But, the dems and especially the house dems are pretty far apart. So far, that in fact Pelosi is going to introduce her own bill and see if maybe they could merge the house and senate bill into one workable bill.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 10:09 PM
Be careful getting supplies! Incident at Kroger:

https://www.facebook.com/toothfreak/videos/10102121221497482/
Posted By: DeisleDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/22/20 11:26 PM
CTFU !!!!!
Posted By: DCDAWGFAN Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 04:08 AM
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Along with masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other shortages. This administration is failing the American public.

"masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other things" are in short supply all over the world. You can blame Trump for a lot of things, this isn't one of them.

Want to know why N95 respirators and masks are in such short supply? Because only manufacturing facilities that were certified by the FDA were allowed to make them.. and those government restrictions limited the number of certified facilities and they couldn't produce them anywhere near fast enough to cope with this level of emergency. This restriction was lifted as of the last bill and companies like 3M and others who have the capability to make them but were prohibited from making them are bringing manufacturing on line. Better late than never.

We could have had far more masks and respirators a long time ago if industry would have been free to respond to the need.. but they weren't. government regulations...
Posted By: Dawgs4Life Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:51 AM
rofl
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 10:10 AM
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Along with masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other shortages. This administration is failing the American public.

"masks, ventilators, gloves, and a slew of other things" are in short supply all over the world. You can blame Trump for a lot of things, this isn't one of them.

Want to know why N95 respirators and masks are in such short supply? Because only manufacturing facilities that were certified by the FDA were allowed to make them.. and those government restrictions limited the number of certified facilities and they couldn't produce them anywhere near fast enough to cope with this level of emergency. This restriction was lifted as of the last bill and companies like 3M and others who have the capability to make them but were prohibited from making them are bringing manufacturing on line. Better late than never.

We could have had far more masks and respirators a long time ago if industry would have been free to respond to the need.. but they weren't. government regulations...


More lies. Stop propping up your miserable leader. He called this a Democrat hoax again until he realized it wasn’t. He’ll save himself and his billionaire friends not us tax payers. We’ll get chump change again and loose most of our life savings. Many more will die because of trump’s slow and ignorant responses Just watch.
Posted By: GMdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 12:01 PM
I don't like Trump, but has he been the one hanging out in malls, going on spring break, hording hand sanitizer, toilet paper, and cleaning supplies? Going out while he is sick? This has spread so fast because we as humans are stupid, and self centered. Including me.
Posted By: Damanshot Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 12:15 PM
Originally Posted By: northlima dawg
Originally Posted By: PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
j/c

Rand Paul just tested positive.


I’d like to get Rand Paul’s take on how trump and his GOPer associates handled this now. Hospitals still waiting for PPG. So even if they had the tests kits they still have to wait for protective gear. Still no news on financial aid to millions of Americans ordered by the gov’t to stay home away from work. If only trump would have stopped international travel when they all learned about this in December or January. Pffft.... the trump era. Calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Blood on GOP hands. Shame on them all.


Senate repubs think that they will have a bill that the senate committee could vote on this afternoon and maybe a full vote tomorrow. But, the dems and especially the house dems are pretty far apart. So far, that in fact Pelosi is going to introduce her own bill and see if maybe they could merge the house and senate bill into one workable bill.


Two Trillion with No Oversight... Yeah, that's a good idea...NOT
Posted By: FloridaFan Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 12:41 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Be careful getting supplies! Incident at Kroger:

https://www.facebook.com/toothfreak/videos/10102121221497482/


"If you show me your boobs, I will give you a cookie"

Next shot, her pointing out the windshield with a cookie in her hand. naughtydevil rofl
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 02:41 PM
Did anyone hear trumps comment on Romney being quarantined?
trump is pathetic man. He is a disgraceful president. Our county deserves so much better. Get this idiot out.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 03:44 PM
What you say is true. Yet at the same time we are all taught growing up, well at least most of us were, that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

The time to have gotten ahead of the curve on this was during the time Trump was calling it a Democratic hoax. At the time when we had 19 cases and he said they cases would actually go down. Instead he waited until it had gotten to the point it was impossible to deny.

As a result, we are in pound of cure mode.
Posted By: Damanshot Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 04:53 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Trump: FDA making anti-malaria drug available 'almost immediately' to tackle coronavirus

President Trump announced Thursday that the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is making experimental drugs -- including those used for treating malaria -- available as part of the ongoing effort to tackle the spread of the coronavirus.

Trump announced at a White House press briefing that chloroquine, a drug designed for use in malaria, has been FDA approved and will be made available by prescription "almost immediately." He said it was one of a number of antiviral therapies to limit the symptoms of the virus that the administration is trying to get to Americans as quickly as possible.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-fda-experimental-drugs-coronavirus

Hope.


Terrific,, Except there is nothing and nobody saying this is the answer., It's more BS from DT
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 04:58 PM


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/...elf/ar-BB11zYyS

Trump Says Coronavirus Cure Cannot ‘Be Worse Than the Problem Itself’
Maggie Haberman and David E. Sanger 1 hr ago

President Trump on Sunday night said that the government would reassess the recommended period for keeping businesses shut and millions of workers at home after this week, amid millions of job losses caused by the efforts to contain the spread of the novel coronavirus.

a man wearing a suit and tie: President Trump speaking Sunday at a coronavirus task force news conference in Washington.© Al Drago for The New York Times President Trump speaking Sunday at a coronavirus task force news conference in Washington.
“WE CANNOT LET THE CURE BE WORSE THAN THE PROBLEM ITSELF,” Mr. Trump tweeted in all capital letters shortly before midnight. “AT THE END OF THE 15 DAY PERIOD, WE WILL MAKE A DECISION AS TO WHICH WAY WE WANT TO GO!”



Officials have said that the initial 15-day period for social distancing — limiting close contact between people by banning gatherings, closing schools and offices, encouraging remote work and urging people to maintain a six-foot distance from one another — is vital to slowing the spread of the virus, for which more than 30,000 people in the United States have tested positive. The 15-day period would end Monday.

Dr. Anthony Fauci, an infectious diseases expert and a member of the White House coronavirus task force, has said in interviews that he believed that it would take several more weeks until people can start going about their lives in a more normal fashion. Other infectious disease experts suggest even harsher measures than social distancing are required to truly beat back the outbreaks in the United States.

But at the White House, in recent days, there has been a growing sentiment that medical experts were allowed to set policy that has hurt the economy, and there has been a push to find ways to let people start returning to work. Some Republican lawmakers have also pleaded with the White House to find ways to restart the economy, as financial markets continue to slide and job losses for April could be in the millions.

Vice President Mike Pence indicated on Sunday at a White House briefing about the virus that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention would issue new guidelines on Monday, allowing some people who have been exposed to the coronavirus to resume working outside their homes if they wear masks.

The move could set the stage for states with relatively low numbers of cases to begin to unfreeze their economies, while large states like California and New York — where there are more cases and where state officials have ordered nonessential businesses to close for the time being — could continue remaining in a holding pattern.

While some business owners are eager to end the more draconian measures that have been put in place, others would rather endure the pain at once rather than face repeated, disruptive orders to stop activities.

Mr. Trump’s tweet cast doubt on his confidence in the path to fighting the virus that he so reluctantly approved. For two months he largely dismissed the warnings that the virus would reach American shores, for fear of causing economic disruption, predicting that cases would go down from a handful to “zero” in a few days.

Only when the disruption came anyway, in the form of a historic stock market sell-off, was he convinced to act.

But there could be consequences to ending the measures too quickly. The recent rise of cases in Hong Kong, after there had been an easing of the spread of the virus, is something of an object lesson about how ending strict measures too soon can have dangerous consequences.

In a tweet on Monday morning, Thomas Bossert, the former homeland security adviser who for weeks has been vocal about the need for the U.S. government to take stricter measures, said, “Sadly, the numbers now suggest the U.S. is poised to take the lead in #coronavirus cases. It’s reasonable to plan for the US to top the list of countries with the most cases in approximately 1 week. This does NOT make social intervention futile. It makes it imperative!”

a room filled with furniture and a large window: An almost empty terminal at Baltimore-Washington International Airport on Sunday.© Anna Moneymaker/The New York Times An almost empty terminal at Baltimore-Washington International Airport on Sunday.
Whatever the president chooses to do, there will be businesses still fearful to reopen — and employees fearful of going to work — as new cases of people infected with the virus are still being diagnosed by the thousands each day.

And the president is facing potential pushback from the public health experts in his administration.

After being slow to publicly react to the spread of the virus, the Trump administration swung in the other direction at the end of February, entrusting the health experts whose counsel had not been heeded in the preceding weeks and letting them help set the policies that hundreds of millions of people would be urged to follow.

But Mr. Trump has become frustrated with Dr. Fauci’s blunt approach at the briefing lectern, which often contradicts things the president has just said, according to two people familiar with the dynamic.

Mr. Trump knows that Dr. Fauci is seen as credible with a large swath of the public and with journalists, and so he has given him more leeway to contradict him than he has other officials. But the president has also resisted portraying the virus as an existential threat in a way that the public health experts have.

In an interview with Science Magazine that was posted online on Sunday evening, Dr. Fauci responded to a question about how he had managed not to get fired by saying that, to Mr. Trump’s “credit, even though we disagree on some things, he listens.”

“He goes his own way,” Dr. Fauci continued. “He has his own style. But on substantive issues, he does listen to what I say.”

But he also said there was a limit to what he could do when Mr. Trump said things that were not true during those briefings.


“I can’t jump in front of the microphone and push him down,” Mr. Fauci said of Mr. Trump’s erroneous statements. “OK, he said it. Let’s try and get it corrected for the next time.”

In an interview with Fox Business Network, the Treasury secretary, Steven Mnuchin, stressed that the U.S. economy was still functioning.

“I’ve seen a bunch of fake news over the last couple of days about a complete shut down of the economy,” he said. “The president has not made that decision.”

But the president’s interest in potentially easing some of the social behavior guidelines met with pushback from one of his close allies, Senator Lindsey Graham, Republican of South Carolina.

“President Trump’s best decision was stopping travel from China early on,” Mr. Graham tweeted on Monday. “I hope we will not undercut that decision by suggesting we back off aggressive containment policies within the United States.”
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 05:23 PM
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 05:25 PM
Well today is day 8 of 15.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 05:27 PM
'Two $1 Trillion Coins': Rashida Tlaib Proposal Calls on US Treasury to Fund Coronavirus Recovery From US Mint

Tlaib's "Automatic BOOST Act" calls for a universal payout of $2,000 to everyone in the U.S. and $1,000 a month after that.

Progressives on Saturday welcomed news that Rep. Rashida Tlaib is calling on the U.S. Treasury to exercise its power to issue platinum coins to fund the coronavirus recovery, calling the move an example of thinking outside the box and celebrating the universality of her proposal to give everyone in America cash payments.

"I fully support the House Financial Services Committee Democrats #COVID19 economic response proposal," the Michigan Democrat tweeted Saturday. "I also want to encourage leadership to consider my truly universal relief proposal on behalf of #13thDistrictStrong."



"This is a really ambitious and creative plan from Rep. Tlaib taking advantage of ideas that financial experts began exploring during the debt crisis showdowns of the Obama years," tweeted HuffPost reporter Zach Carter.



The "Automatic BOOST to Communities Act" (pdf) would deliver a $2,000 pre-paid debit card to every American, with $1,000 being paid monthly after that until a year after the coronavirus crisis ends. Tlaib proposes to pay for the cost of the program by calling on the Treasury to use its authority under federal law to issue two trillion dollar platinum coins. The move would not add to the debt.

"Tlaib wants to take advantage of an obscure Treasury authority to issue new currency through minting platinum coins, and then give that currency to people," said Carter. "No new debt, no weird Federal Reserve programs, just cash straight to folks."

The bill also uses a broad definition of "every person," including non-citizens, children and other dependents, those in territories and protectorates, and those without bank accounts.

Under the bill, "an emergency corps will conduct a targeted outreach program to at-risk populations (homeless, elderly, etc) to ensure they receive cards, and at the same time perform a wellness check to assess whether they need additional assistance," said Modern Money Network president Rohan Grey, who helped write the bill.

"It's been a thrill to work on this proposal, but it is important to note that while emergency cash relief is critical, it is not sufficient on its own," Grey added. "We need far-reaching debt and expense relief, additional income and benefit protection and expansion, including direct payroll support, repurposing and public ownership of key industry, and direct worker support through a job guarantee that supports emergency and solidarity work, remote work, and begins planning for what the post-crisis recovery looks like."

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2020/0...und-coronavirus

As radical as it is, this makes more sense than anything I've seen out of either party.

Link to bill:

https://tlaib.house.gov/sites/tlaib.hous...es%20Act%20.pdf

posted in two threads so everybody sees it...
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 05:56 PM
There is no doubt that trumps lack of leadership will cost lives.
He makes my blood boil
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 07:28 PM
You need glasses.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 08:36 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh


Supposedly some bonehead on fox was saying about the cause being worse than the sickness, and now drumpf and kudlow are parroting.

Kudlow was on tape today saying that there are going to have to be trade offs but sooner rather than later people got to get back to work. The trade offs are will be the spike in the curve that is going to completely overwhelm the system and in turn make this a longer, deeper crisis.

And drumpf also according to two reports wants to get back on the campaign trail.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 08:43 PM
Originally Posted By: northlima dawg
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh


Supposedly some bonehead on fox was saying about the cause being worse than the sickness, and now drumpf and kudlow are parroting.

Kudlow was on tape today saying that there are going to have to be trade offs but sooner rather than later people got to get back to work. The trade offs are will be the spike in the curve that is going to completely overwhelm the system and in turn make this a longer, deeper crisis.

And drumpf also according to two reports wants to get back on the campaign trail.


trump should hold a giant MAGA rally. Then we should close the door on the place and quarantine the people inside. trump included.
Posted By: BpG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:15 PM
J/C

Both can be true, that the Dems are throwing in absolute nonsense at this relief bill knowing it won't pass and that the bill does give unchecked corporate bailouts.

The idea that dems are blocking this because Trump may see relief as a hotel owner is the kind of absolute retardation I come to expect from them.
Posted By: BpG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:17 PM
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Originally Posted By: northlima dawg
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh


Supposedly some bonehead on fox was saying about the cause being worse than the sickness, and now drumpf and kudlow are parroting.

Kudlow was on tape today saying that there are going to have to be trade offs but sooner rather than later people got to get back to work. The trade offs are will be the spike in the curve that is going to completely overwhelm the system and in turn make this a longer, deeper crisis.

And drumpf also according to two reports wants to get back on the campaign trail.


trump should hold a giant MAGA rally. Then we should close the door on the place and quarantine the people inside. trump included.


You just out here joining OCD in having TDS? This type of nonsense is expected from him.

"I disagree, therefore you should get a virus and die".
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:43 PM
Florida man with coronavirus claims anti-malarial drug saved his life

https://www.foxnews.com/health/florida-man-with-coronavirus-claims-malaria-drug-saved-life

Hope.
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:44 PM

BREITBART

Dems Block Rescue PlanCoronavirusRand PositiveSenate Stock ScandalCommunist China

Nancy Pelosi Proposes 1,400-Page Coronavirus Bill Stuffed with Special Interest Goodies


Charlie Spiering

23 Mar 2020


House Speaker Nancy Pelosi debuted a 1,120-page coronavirus rescue bill after Democrats tanked the Senate proposal on Sunday night.

The bill includes a wish list of Democrats’ pet issues including:

Increased fuel emission standards for airlines receiving funds and carbon offsets:

(1) IN GENERAL. Not later than 90 days after the enactment of this Act, the Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration shall require each air carrier receiving assistance under section 101, to fully offset the annual carbon emissions of such air carriers for domestic flights beginning in 2025.
….
(1) IN GENERAL. The Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration shall require each air carrier receiving assistance under section 101 to:(A) make and achieve a binding commitment to reduce the greenhouse gas emissions attributable to the domestic flights of such air carrier in every calendar year, beginning with 2021, on a path consistent with a 25 percent reduction in the aviation sector’s emissions from 2005 levels by 2035, and a 50 percent reduction in the sector’s emissions from 2005 levels by 2050, applying the standards, recommended practices, and guidance agreed to by the United States pursuant to the European Union Emissions Trading Scheme Prohibition Act of 2011
Payment for up to $10,000 in student loans:(1) MINIMUM STUDENT LOAN RELIEF AS A RESULT OF THE COVID–19 NATIONAL EMERGENCY. Not later than 270 days after the last day of the COVID–19 emergency period, the Secretaries concerned shall jointly carry out a program under which a qualified borrower, with respect to the covered loans and private education of loans of such qualified borrower, shall receive in accordance with paragraph (3) an amount equal to the lesser of the following:(A) The total amount of each covered loan and each private education loan of the borrower; or
(B) $10,000.
Same-day voter registration, early voting, voting by mail, ballot harvesting

The bill includes several provisions on voting laws and regulations, as Democrats argue that the crisis should force the government to revisit voting regulations to make it easier to vote, allowing same-day voter registration and voting by mail, and mailing out ballots to absentee voters. Other voting fraud watchdogs raised flags about ballot harvesting and grans for conducting risk-limiting audits of election results

PART 8—GRANTS FOR CONDUCTING RISK- LIMITING AUDITS OF RESULTS OF ELECTIONS ‘‘SEC. 298. GRANTS FOR CONDUCTING RISK-LIMITING AUDITS OF RESULTS OF ELECTIONS.

‘(a) AVAILABILITY OF GRANTS.—The Commission shall make a grant to each eligible State to conduct risk-limiting audits as described in subsection (b) with respect to the regularly scheduled general elections for Federal office held in November 2020 and each succeeding election for Federal office.
Preserving collective bargaining powers for unions

Several provisions in the bill include carveouts for big labor, including labor protections, collective bargaining, and organizing, as well as overturning President Trump’s executive orders regarding federal employee unions.
The expansion of wind and solar tax credits.Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell and other lawmakers specifically called out Democrats for trying to negotiate the expansion of wind and solar tax credits in the bill.
Requirements for federal and corporate gender and racial diversity data

The bill demands that corporate recipients of financial assistance are required to report racial and gender data regarding salaries, number of employees, supplier diversity, and membership on corporate boards. It also requires federal agencies to use businesses and financial institutions owned by minorities or women.
Post Office Bailout

UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE PAYMENT TO POSTAL SERVICE FUND

For payment to the ‘‘Postal Service Fund’’, for revenue forgone due to the coronavirus pandemic, $20,000,000,000, to remain available until September 30, 2022: Provided, That such amount is designated by the Congress as being for an emergency requirement pursuant to section 251(b)(2)(A)(i) of the Balanced Budget and Emergency Deficit Control Act of 1985.
Automatic extension of nonimmigrant visas.

Rep. Paul Gosar flagged a provision regarding the automatic extension of nonimmigrant visas.(c) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, with respect to any alien whose nonimmigrant status, status under section 244 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1254a), or employment authorization has expired within the 30 days preceding the date of the enactment of this act, or will expire not later than one year after such date, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall automatically extend such status or work authorization for the same time period as the alien’s prior status or work authorization.
Restricting colleges from providing information about citizenship status

(1) INFORMATION.—Only information requested

On the official 2020 decennial census of population form may be provided to the Bureau of the Census pursuant to this section. No institution of higher education may provide any information to the Bureau on the immigration or citizenship status of any individual.
Money for Planned Parenthood

The Hill reported that Democrats want the bill to prop up Planned Parenthood, just another reason why bipartisan efforts have failed to reach a consensus.

Read the legislation below:

Full text: Nancy Pelosi Cor… by charliespiering on Scribd


https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/...zTJPxf4Fg4S6otk
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 09:45 PM
They fiddle while America burns.

Shame!
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 10:15 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Originally Posted By: northlima dawg
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh


Supposedly some bonehead on fox was saying about the cause being worse than the sickness, and now drumpf and kudlow are parroting.

Kudlow was on tape today saying that there are going to have to be trade offs but sooner rather than later people got to get back to work. The trade offs are will be the spike in the curve that is going to completely overwhelm the system and in turn make this a longer, deeper crisis.

And drumpf also according to two reports wants to get back on the campaign trail.


trump should hold a giant MAGA rally. Then we should close the door on the place and quarantine the people inside. trump included.


You just out here joining OCD in having TDS? This type of nonsense is expected from him.

"I disagree, therefore you should get a virus and die".


Did I jerk your chain? Stop barking my name in your little rants.
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 10:50 PM
Sometimes I wonder if Trump is the Anti-Christ.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 10:58 PM
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Sometimes I wonder if Trump is the Anti-Christ.


According to the Bible the end times would be sounded in by trumpets...trump/Pence... so there’s that.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:00 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Originally Posted By: northlima dawg
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So Trump might say it's all over even though it's not close to being over just to salvage profits? Really? smh


Supposedly some bonehead on fox was saying about the cause being worse than the sickness, and now drumpf and kudlow are parroting.

Kudlow was on tape today saying that there are going to have to be trade offs but sooner rather than later people got to get back to work. The trade offs are will be the spike in the curve that is going to completely overwhelm the system and in turn make this a longer, deeper crisis.

And drumpf also according to two reports wants to get back on the campaign trail.


trump should hold a giant MAGA rally. Then we should close the door on the place and quarantine the people inside. trump included.


You just out here joining OCD in having TDS? This type of nonsense is expected from him.

"I disagree, therefore you should get a virus and die".


I never wished the virus on them. I only wish to quarantine them and their ilk away from the rest of us. If you show up at a trump rally you don’t understand social distancing. You’re dangerous to society.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:13 PM
We used to have asylums for that.
Posted By: Squires Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:22 PM
Can't keep society locked up forever. If people can't work then they have no money, eventually no food and no home. What if society were to start to unravel? How long before violence kills more than the virus? There's a reason everyone is stocking up on ammo right now.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:26 PM
Wow, this press conference is a joke. We have to let people get back to work in the name of profits and GDP... Then Trump wants to know if we will keep the social distancing in the press room with all the nasty nasty people who hate him not allowed in... what an fool we have for president, smh.

We're almost ready to hit a huge surge in cases and they are already talking about opening things back up.

What it really means is that rich people don't want to lose all their money and would prefer losing lives over profits.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:42 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Wow, this press conference is a joke. We have to let people get back to work in the name of profits and GDP... Then Trump wants to know if we will keep the social distancing in the press room with all the nasty nasty people who hate him not allowed in... what an fool we have for president, smh.

We're almost ready to hit a huge surge in cases and they are already talking about opening things back up.

What it really means is that rich people don't want to lose all their money and would prefer losing lives over profits.



I get the feeling you like this....I would rather be dead than broke. I worked and sacrificed my whole liked to build a nice amount.

I don't want to live in some dank, cold, concrete walled slum our government build for you.

You want to live in sheet, well, sounds like you are there. Me, no way. I will not live your lifestyle. I will die fighting it. To me, living off the government teet is the most humiliating thing I can think of. How worthless would that make you.
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/23/20 11:55 PM
I wouldn't put it the way you did because it's insulting and demeaning of others.

However, I know that my family went through a very tough time when I was a child due to my dad's company closing. We were so freaking poor for awhile. My parents never once asked for a handout. Never applied for governmental aide even though they would have easily qualified. My brother and I were instructed to not tell others of our financial conditions.

Instead, my parents preached about working hard. My dad would hold three jobs at a time until he finally got his break and started making good money again. We were raised to be hard-working, law-abiding, prideful...yet humble, folks.

My wife and I have instilled the same work ethic into our children. We earn what we get. We don't want handouts.

Also, I don't want to be like Europe. I enjoy living in a big house. I enjoy owning nice things. We work for them. I think giving things to people is not only a burden on families like ours, but it also helps keep the poor down. Some think...........why work when I can get this for free? It's a huge reason why generational poverty won't let it's grasp on our nation loose.

Working hard to improve one's status in life is actually a good thing. It breeds competition and we all become better as a result. Rewarding those who do nothing is a burden on hard-working folks and is a tool in keeping the poor down.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:16 AM
Originally Posted By: Ballpeen
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Wow, this press conference is a joke. We have to let people get back to work in the name of profits and GDP... Then Trump wants to know if we will keep the social distancing in the press room with all the nasty nasty people who hate him not allowed in... what an fool we have for president, smh.

We're almost ready to hit a huge surge in cases and they are already talking about opening things back up.

What it really means is that rich people don't want to lose all their money and would prefer losing lives over profits.



I get the feeling you like this....I would rather be dead than broke. I worked and sacrificed my whole liked to build a nice amount.

I don't want to live in some dank, cold, concrete walled slum our government build for you.

You want to live in sheet, well, sounds like you are there. Me, no way. I will not live your lifestyle. I will die fighting it. To me, living off the government teet is the most humiliating thing I can think of. How worthless would that make you.


You make a lot of ASSumptions. I find it hilarious that guys like you only care about yourselves. I lost a good deal in 2008/09 and had several health issues. But I've never taken a cent of government money or a handout. I'm also far from destitute and will probably die with more than most. But along the way, I learned to give a damn about others and see their lives with compassion. So I couldn't care less if you have more, I'm by far the better man.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:24 AM
I agree, but some seem to demean people who achieved, like it is their fault they studied a few hours a night rather than go to the party. Worked long hours to get better. Contributed the max to get the company 401K match, even though they could have used that few hundred dollars to blow around town. Everybody likes to do that, but some don't who have bigger plans.
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:26 AM
Never feel demeaned for working hard and providing a better life for your family.

On the other hand, no need to demean others. Lead by example and positivity.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:27 AM
Here's the thing Ballpeen, money does not make the man. I'm happy for you and yours that you've had success. But don't think I haven't had my own just because our politics differ. We just see things different. I'd even try to help you out if you were down on your luck, you can't say the same.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:41 AM


smh
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:49 AM
Did he lose track or did it malfunction?

Btw............I do not like Biden. But, it appears that the teleprompter malfunctioned. Watch his right hand.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:51 AM
There is no teleprompter.

Sad.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:52 AM
Looks like he stumbles a second or two and it got ahead of him. The hand low and to the side waving it back up... priceless.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 01:09 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Here's the thing Ballpeen, money does not make the man. I'm happy for you and yours that you've had success. But don't think I haven't had my own just because our politics differ. We just see things different. I'd even try to help you out if you were down on your luck, you can't say the same.



LOL....of course I can say the same. I won't get in to numbers, we have donated as best we can to several charities of choice.


On a random note I will share. You see the people with signs on the side of the road. I am a Veteran, or will work for food, you know what I am talking about.

If I stop next to them, it is my turn. Rather than look away, I give them some money. Usually $4-$5.

I see it this way, they might be a con....ok, cool. They also might be a Angel sent there to test me.

That is a test I don't like to fail. I do sometimes. If all I have are twenties I don't.
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 06:14 AM
News March 23, 2020


Doctor in Italy says he and other physicians are no longer permitted to put coronavirus patients who are over 60 on ventilators


Sarah Taylor

An Israeli doctor in Italy said that he and other physicians have been directed to avoid giving over-60 patients ventilator treatment in response to the COVID-19 outbreak.

What are the details?

According to the the Jerusalem Post, Dr. Gai Peleg said that instructions in Parma, Italy, do not allow such treatments to patients over 60.

Italy has seen at least 59,138 COVID-19 cases, and over 5,476 people in Italy have died as a result. There were 3,405 deaths as of Thursday.

The Post reported, "Peleg said that, from what he sees and hears in the hospital, the instructions are not to offer access to artificial respiratory machines to patients over 60 as such machines are limited in number."

Friday saw the distressing scene of an Italian hospital in Bergamo, which was packed full of COVID-19 patients. The video, which was first shared by Sky News, showed hospital staff furiously working to tend to gravely ill patients.

Dr. Roberto Cosentini, head of emergency care at Bergamo's Papa Giovanni XXIII hospital, said that the disease is far worse than influenza.

"It's a massive strain for every health system," he said. "We see every day 50 to 60 patients who come to our emergency department with pneumonia, and most of them are so severe they need very high volumes of oxygen. And so we had to reorganize our emergency room and our hospital — three levels of intensive care."
What about bed availability?

Lorenzo D'Antiga, director of the Pediatric Unit and Transplant Center, added, "We've saturated our bed availability, we are really in trouble, we have to send patients away to other hospitals, all the intensive care units in the regions are full so actually this is really a big big problem."

"The situation is really dramatic, the mood is really depressing," he revealed. "Relatives can't stay with patients during their admission and some others die without anyone around. It's also forbidden to have funerals, so even the last prayer can't be done properly."

On Monday, the New York Times reported that Italy has moved to stop all domestic travel.


https://www.theblaze.com/news/doctor-in-...st%20270%20days
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 07:44 AM
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 11:57 AM
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-was-...y-found-in-2019
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:47 PM


rofl We had 2 more months to prepare even more but the turd in charge called it a Democrat hoax and now blames Obama from which he inherited a poor system and then fired the CDC experts.

People are dying. There is nothing to celebrate here. A once of prevention is worth a pound of cure so guess what? We are pounds in the red. And it’s totally trumps fault that many more will have died that could have been saved.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 12:51 PM
The United States was ranked the best-prepared country in the world to handle a pandemic in late 2019 by the Nuclear Threat Initiative (NTI) and the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security (JHU) -- an assessment seemingly at odds with claims by Democrats that the Trump administration left the country vulnerable to the ongoing coronavirus outbreak.

The Global Health Security Index was was "developed with guidance from an international panel of experts from 13 countries, with research by the Economist Intelligence Unit," The Washington Post reported last year. "More than 100 researchers spent a year collecting and validating publicly available data.”

At the same time, the paper noted that the U.S. score was still not perfect, and that "factors driving down the U.S. score include the risks of social unrest and terrorism, and low public confidence in government."
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 01:12 PM
Quote:
low public confidence in government."


rofl All time low. They get tested. We pay for their tests. We can’t get tested now and when we can we’ll have to pay for it. So the us tax payer is getting screwed double. But the economy was good so we’re all good. Pfft trump
Posted By: BpG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/24/20 01:36 PM
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 02:41 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.


rofl says the guy who’ll vote for trump
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 03:06 PM
Dr. Fauci was absent from another briefing again.

Trump hit him with the “he’s a good man”.

You know what that means!
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 03:53 PM
Originally Posted By: Swish
Dr. Fauci was absent from another briefing again.

Trump hit him with the “he’s a good man”.

You know what that means!


Well he did say he couldn’t push trump away from the mic fast enough.

They were up there joking then acting like snowflakes about how horrible the nasal test that American tax payers paid for and can’t get now was for them. Like that was an excuse to not have more testing earlier or even now. Pffft trump snowflakes.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 03:59 PM
Originally Posted By: Ballpeen
I would rather be dead than broke.


As long as you and other Trump supporters don't think your opinion has the right to speak for the rest of us. I know it doesn't count in a presidential election, but please remember, those who share the same view and support Trump are the minority.

I would rather be broke with my friends and family than dead. But money is more important than family to some people.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:00 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.


You guys elected Trump so the bar has been set much lower than ever before.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:01 PM
If Trump opens things back up before this thing even peaks, doctors here will be making those same choices. Who lives and who dies.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:14 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
If Trump opens things back up before this thing even peaks, doctors here will be making those same choices. Who lives and who dies.


As usual those who CAN afford to work from home or NOT WORK AT ALL will continue to shelter in place and be safe. Only the poor and lower middle class who must return to work will be put at risk in harms way. trump and his billionaire cronies want to put the poor on the front lines with this and with as little financial aid as possible. Pffft trump
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:40 PM
[quote=Swish]Dr. Fauci was absent from another briefing again.





Dr. Anthony Fauci Shuts Down Media: Trump Hasn’t Overridden Me, ‘Not Helpful’ to Pit Us Against Each Other


24 Mar 2020


Appearing Tuesday on WMAL’s Morning on the Mall, Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, accused D.C. journalists of attempting to pit him against President Donald Trump and affirmed there is no rift between himself and the president on how to combat the Chinese coronavirus outbreak.

(Listen from 6:04)

A partial transcript is as follows:

VINCE COGLIANESE: It seems like increasingly a bunch of questions from the media are designed to create a rift between you and the President of the United States, at least, to emphasize differences of opinion that creates distances between you and the president. Are you sensing that as the media continually asks you questions about the differences you have with him?

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI: That is really unfortunate. I would wish that would stop because we have a much bigger problem here than trying to point out differences. They really, fundamentally, at the core when you look at it, there are not differences. The president has listened to what I’ve said with the other people on the task force have said. When I’ve made recommendations, he’s taken them. He’s never countered and overridden me. The idea of pitting one against the other is just not helpful and I’d wish that would stop so we can look ahead at the challenge we have together to get over this thing.

https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2020...nst-each-other/

It's the "trash-assed" liberal media causing the problem!
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:44 PM
I love how Trump says one thing then as soon as Fauci gets up there, reporters asking him questions about things Trump just said. Then he has to tell the facts and truth and shows all the lies Trump just told.

Tensions with Trump: Dr. Anthony Fauci on telling the truth

The respected scientist is now a real-time fact-checker to the president.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/tensions-trump-dr-anthony-fauci-telling-truth/story?id=69750768
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 04:59 PM
Originally Posted By: fishtheice
[quote=Swish]Dr. Fauci was absent from another briefing again.





Dr. Anthony Fauci Shuts Down Media: Trump Hasn’t Overridden Me, ‘Not Helpful’ to Pit Us Against Each Other


24 Mar 2020


Appearing Tuesday on WMAL’s Morning on the Mall, Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, accused D.C. journalists of attempting to pit him against President Donald Trump and affirmed there is no rift between himself and the president on how to combat the Chinese coronavirus outbreak.

(Listen from 6:04)

A partial transcript is as follows:

VINCE COGLIANESE: It seems like increasingly a bunch of questions from the media are designed to create a rift between you and the President of the United States, at least, to emphasize differences of opinion that creates distances between you and the president. Are you sensing that as the media continually asks you questions about the differences you have with him?

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI: That is really unfortunate. I would wish that would stop because we have a much bigger problem here than trying to point out differences. They really, fundamentally, at the core when you look at it, there are not differences. The president has listened to what I’ve said with the other people on the task force have said. When I’ve made recommendations, he’s taken them. He’s never countered and overridden me. The idea of pitting one against the other is just not helpful and I’d wish that would stop so we can look ahead at the challenge we have together to get over this thing.

https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2020...nst-each-other/

It's the "trash-assed" liberal media causing the problem!


Oh dear, looks like Pits supposed facts have bitten him on the arse once again. rolleyes
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:00 PM
In another instance, the president suggested that China's government could have shared details about a new coronavirus epidemic months earlier than it did. Fauci has publicly knocked that assertion down, which he said “doesn’t comport” with the facts, and explained the behind-the-scenes efforts to tamp down that narrative.

Fauci is part of the god-damn fake media and deep state. Screw that guy. Trump has handled this perfectly - he told all his cronies that and they are busy correcting the world now. Fauci is a traitor and should be incarcerated.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:01 PM
rofl
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:04 PM
Side note....Toilet paper shortage be damned. I just hooked up a bum gun. I purchased it after traveling to Thailand and using them there. Just never took the time to install it. Bring on the TP apocalypse. My hiney will sparkle.
... Now back to your regularly scheduled virus updates.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:11 PM
Originally Posted By: BpG
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.


There was never a better time for a socialist administration. America has a lot of things to fix so we don't have to worry about things like this pandemic killing our economy and crushing our working class.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:17 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: BpG
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.


There was never a better time for a socialist administration. America has a lot of things to fix so we don't have to worry about things like this pandemic killing our economy and crushing our working class.


To bad our one Socialist got his head handed to him by sleepy Joe and the DNC.

Better luck next time! Oh, wait, what am I saying? those guys will probable be in nursing homes by then.
Posted By: BpG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 05:36 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: BpG
I can't believe they are going to run Joe Biden, it's almost like they have not learned one damn thing since 2016.


There was never a better time for a socialist administration. America has a lot of things to fix so we don't have to worry about things like this pandemic killing our economy and crushing our working class.


Rather risk 4 more years than give Bernie the nod, very bold strategy.


Sounds like a very "no way he can win" strategy.....again.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:11 PM
Trump says he wants country 'opened up' by Easter, despite caution from health experts

Public health experts have said easing restrictions too early could put an enormous strain on hospitals and lead to even more deaths and economic damage.

WASHINGTON — President Donald Trump said Tuesday he wants to have the country getting back to business by the Easter holiday, April 12, even as the coronavirus pandemic continues to worsen.

“I would love to have the country opened up and raring to go by Easter,” Trump said during a Fox News interview.

Public health experts and local and state leaders have cautioned against easing restrictions too early, saying it could put an enormous strain on hospitals and lead to even more deaths and economic damage. But Trump said Tuesday that he believed the human toll would be greater should Americans continue to stay at home.

"This cure is worse than the problem," Trump said, adding that "in my opinion, more people are going to die if we allow this to continue."

A White House official said the president does not view Easter as a date that he begins opening things up, but a date by which the economy is speeding again. That means the loosening of restrictions would, under this scenario, start much sooner. The official says the focus now remains on how to get there, in phases, to address the challenges demographically and geographically.

Trump said people can continue to practice good hygiene and social distancing even while going back to work to try to control the virus's spread.

Trump on Tuesday expressed frustration with the economic consequences of having millions of Americans staying home and compared the coronavirus to the flu, despite public experts cautioning against the comparison.

“We lose thousands, and thousands of people a year to the flu, we don’t turn the country off every year," he said.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-h...V0IX2pl5u79bojo
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:12 PM
If Trump gets his way, thousands more will die than needed by Covid-19.

Sounds like your risk is paying off so far.
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:23 PM
TRUMP CORONAVIRUS FAILURE TIMELINE
January 30: Trump on Coronavirus, “We have it very well under control, and I think it’s going to have a very good ending. So that I can assure you!”

February 2: Trump on Coronavirus, “Well, we pretty much shut it down coming in from China, but we did shut it down!”

February 10: On Fox News Trump says without evidence that the coronavirus "dies with the hotter weather… You know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat.”

February 24: "The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA.”

February 25: Trump falsely claims “You may ask about the coronavirus, which is very well under control in our country. We have very few people with it, and the people that have it are … getting better. They’re ALL getting better!”

February 26: Trump wrongly says the coronavirus "is a flu" and that “whatever happens, we’re totally prepared.”

February 26: Trump baselessly predicts the number of US cases is "going very substantially down" to "close to zero”

February 26: Trump wrongly says the flu death rate is "much higher" than Dr. Sanjay Gupta said. Coronavirus has 10X death rate compared to flu. If 60K die from flu then 600K will die from Coronavirus!

February 27: Trump baselessly said, "It's going to disappear. One day -- it's like a miracle -- it will disappear.”

February 28: Trump said at a rally, Coronavirus is “the new Democratic Hoax.”

March 2: Trump falsely claims “nobody knew of the number of US flu deaths”.

March 2: Trump says a vaccine is coming "relatively soon”. Only Trump did not bother to mention that CDC had told him earlier that day that a vaccine was a year to a year and a half away.

March 4: Trump said he believes people infected with the novel coronavirus may get better "by sitting around and even going to work."

March 5: Trump wrongly claims the virus only hit the US "three weeks ago”. Trump was informed of a confirmed case on January 21(6 weeks prior).

March 5: World Health Organization (WHO), based on data collected around the world, stated the global mortality rate for coronavirus at 3.4%. Trump says: “I think the 3.4 % is really a false number, this is just my ‘Hunch’!”

March 6: As the number of cases and deaths in Italy rises, Trump says “I hear the numbers getting much better in Italy.”

March 6: Trump tells cameras, “Anybody who wants a test can get one.” VP Pence said the day prior that Americans could not get tested simply because they wanted to get tested. "You may not get a test unless a doctor or public health official prescribes a test."

March 6: Trump muses that "maybe the coronavirus improved US jobs numbers.”

March 6: "I like the numbers being where they are. I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship," Trump said of passengers on the Grand Princess cruise ship.

March 7: Trump said that doctors he's come across as the administration tries to get a handle on the outbreak have been surprised about how much he knows about COVID-19. "Maybe I have a natural ability," he said. "Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president."

March 11: Trump’s Address from Oval Office wrongly states Insurance companies will pay for patients Coronavirus treatment. Next day Insurance Coalition corrected Trump and said they will pay ONLY for Co-payments, NOT treatment.

March 13: Trump declares National Emergency. “As you know Europe was just designated as the hot spot right now, and we closed that border a while ago so that was lucky or through talent or through luck… call it whatever you want.” The travel ban had not even been implemented, scheduled to start that night.

March 13: Asked why his Admin previously disbanded the national pandemic office which would have significantly prepared the United States, “When you say me, I didn’t do it. We have a group of people… You say we did that, but I don’t know anything about it.” This, after Trump’s presser from Feb. 26 where it was previously brought up and discussed with Trump.

March 13: Backpedaling about whether or not he should get tested and self-isolate for Coronavirus after being in direct contact with those carrying the virus, “I asked them that same question, and they said, ‘You don’t have any symptoms whatsoever.’” You don’t have to be showing symptoms to already have the Coronavirus.

March 13: Trump interacted with several top administration officials and business leaders during the address, shaking hands and patting them.

March 13: Asked by a reporter about the federal failures to test for Coronavirus, Trump answered, “No I don’t take responsibility for that at all.” This, after he exclaimed on March 6 that tests were ready and everyone who wanted a test would be able to get a test.

Notable Trump tweet from 2013: “Leadership: Whatever happens, you’re responsible. If it doesn’t happen, you’re responsible.”

_____________

but sure, fish. somehow, its the "liberal" media's fault.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:28 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
If Trump gets his way, thousands more will die than needed by Covid-19.

Sounds like your risk is paying off so far.


It will likely be over a million, not thousands. Certain states that have very few control measures in place right now are likely in big trouble based on the model by Columbia University.

His hotels are being crushed and he's being lobbied by a few to open businesses, ignoring those in the healthcare field.

Certain Governors will ignore the order if he's willing to risk that many lives.

From an article I posted in a separate thread:

Summit County Public Health Commissioner Donna Skoda told the 250 or so attendees on the Zoom meeting call that she knows all of the measures put in place to have people stay at home are inconvenient, but necessary.

“If we’re thinking, ‘We’ll close the businesses, close the schools ... and we’ll open everything back up,’ I can assure you if we do that without adequate testing and resources, we will have more than a tsunami. It will be horrible and we will see a lot of deaths,” she said.
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:29 PM
btw, trump is still worried about his image and the economy over the welfare of the country. those who rather be dead than broke follow trump.

those who rather take care their fellow countrymen over the economy do not.

i dont know what it feels like to be such a selfish money hungry douchebag. but i also dont know what its like to support trump, either. oh well:

Trump says he will 'reopen' US in three weeks against advice of doctors who 'want to keep world shut forever'

https://www.yahoo.com/news/america-not-place-shutdown-trump-222523478.html

Donald Trump said he intends to re-open the United States from its coronavirus shutdown sooner than in three or four months, as some experts have predicted the lockdown should last, even saying he might consider such an order when a White House-mandated 15-day period to shutter much of the economy ends next week. However, it is unclear if state and local officials would even follow such presidential guidance – especially in hard-hit areas.

"Our country wasn't built to be shut down," Mr Trump said during an evening briefing at the White House. Once medical officials signal it is "okay," he added, "Let's get back to work."

Later came this presidential vow: "I'm not talking about months, I can tell you that." And even later, he appeared to mock his public health experts.

"If it were up to the doctors, they may say, 'Let's keep it shut down. Let's shut down the entire world,'" he said, sounding exasperated.

"We can't do that," Mr Trump said with his arms held straight out, for effect.

At one point, the president noted the virus outbreak is not as serious in many rural areas, naming Nebraska and Idaho because those countries are affected "not nearly to the extent of New York."

Trump administration officials have talked about, without providing clear evidence, the virus outbreak ending in late May or June. But the president's comments in the White House briefing room made clear he does not intend to allow the partial lockdown to go on that long.

And, once again, the president touted the state of the economy under his watch, saying the coronavirus undercut gains made during his term. Mr Trump had been banking on a strong economy as a basis of his re-election campaign.

The president said an announcement to that end is coming "soon," but he did not offer further details.

"We're going to open up our country to business because our country was meant to be open. ... The engine for that system is we have to have companies," Trump said, saying that likely would happen "very, very soon."

Still, he said "it's going to get bad" while also touting the flu as possibly being a bigger killer, projecting influenza might cause 50,000 deaths in America this year. So far, there are over 500 coronavirus deaths. He also continued to focus on the virus outbreak's body count.

"You look at automobile accidents. Which are far greater than any numbers we're talking about. That doesn't mean we're going to tell everybody no more driving of cars," he said.

Though Mr Trump repeatedly on Monday signalled he is growing impatient with the situation, his own government has projected in its worst case scenario model that Americans could still be getting infected in December. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, in its most gloomy projection, estimates 160 million to 210 million Americans might be infected by Christmas. That said, other models from academic and other institutions offer a range of estimates, many falling somewhere in between the CDC's worst-case projection and Mr Trump's indirect assessment that the threat is abated come summer.

Meantime, despite his own public health team urging caution, the president continued to pitch specific medications as possible solutions to treat COVID-19.

He again touted Chloroquine, used to treat malaria, saying without providing supporting data, that "there's a real chance it could have a tremendous impact."

"It would be a gift from God," he said, "and a real game changer.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:33 PM
I live in Tennessee which has fewer restrictions than most. The mayor of Nashville had enough common sense to pretty much lock things down, but on a state level it's not good.
Posted By: SaintDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 06:50 PM
He says it's for the peace of all

He's the one who must decide

Who's to live and who's to die

~~ Buffy St Marie
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:02 PM
Oh so hair on fire dramatic! rofl
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:04 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Oh so hair on fire dramatic! rofl


40, the hospitals need volunteers to help open the economy. Put your ass where you mouth is...
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:04 PM
Why hasnt the government commandeered manufacturing to produce respirators?
Why? He has the power, what could he possibly be waiting for? His ignorance will kill many, maybe me!
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:04 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I live in Tennessee which has fewer restrictions than most. The mayor of Nashville had enough common sense to pretty much lock things down, but on a state level it's not good.


No, it does not look good for Tennesse based on the overall lack of controls, but good for mayor of Nashville doing something. Here's what 'some control measures' look like vs 'severe control measures' based on the study/model done by Columbia University. I wonder if states that enacted severe control measures will start closing their borders to others?


Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:06 PM
Trump can't overrule the Governors. He didn't shut anything down, they did. Common sense will rule the day I imagine. Dewine is a GOPer, but he seems to believe in science thankfully.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:07 PM
Originally Posted By: BADdog
Why hasnt the government commandeered manufacturing to produce respirators?
Why? He has the power, what could he possibly be waiting for? His ignorance will kill many, maybe me!


Because twitter memes accused him of being a socialist and imposing government ownership of production, that's exactly why.
Posted By: SaintDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:09 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Oh so hair on fire dramatic! rofl


Let us know when your loved ones are infected.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:10 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Oh so hair on fire dramatic! rofl


Covid- 19 does not cause your hair to catch fire. But the death rate is rapidly rising. If the level of stupidity you disclose in your posts are in any way similar to how you conduct your life, I do strongly recommend you monitor yourself closely for other symptoms however.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:19 PM
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Side note....Toilet paper shortage be damned. I just hooked up a bum gun. I purchased it after traveling to Thailand and using them there. Just never took the time to install it. Bring on the TP apocalypse. My hiney will sparkle.
... Now back to your regularly scheduled virus updates.


At some point PM me how you like it. I have been thinking about buying one of those for a while but like you haven't gotten around to it. Share the brand you went with.

Thanks - From the bottom of my bottom smile
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:21 PM
Trump is reportedly getting frustrated with Dr. Fauci's 'blunt approach' during White House press conferences
Jake Lahut

Mar 23, 2020, 9:28 AM

Dr. Anthony Fauci and his tendency to set the scientific record straight have become a source of aggravation for President Donald Trump, The New York Times reported on Monday.

Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health, has become a household name during the coronavirus outbreak, often having to toe the line next to Trump during briefings.

While the doctor has usually kept his poker face, he facepalmed during a briefing last week, and his interview with Science magazine published on Sunday night made headlines.

When asked by Science how he had managed not to get fired yet, Fauci said: "Well, that's pretty interesting because to [Trump's] credit, even though we disagree on some things, he listens. He goes his own way. He has his own style. But on substantive issues, he does listen to what I say."

However, The Times reported Monday that Trump "has become frustrated with Dr. Fauci's blunt approach at the briefing lectern, which often contradicts things the president has just said, according to two people familiar with the dynamic."

Fauci's credibility has earned him some more slack with Trump, according to The Times, but his rendition of the facts of COVID-19, the disease caused by the coronavirus, is more dire than the rosy picture Trump has tried to paint.

Even Fauci acknowledged a limit to his role in the Science interview.

"I can't jump in front of the microphone and push him down," Fauci said of Trump's misstatements about the coronavirus. "OK, he said it. Let's try and get it corrected for the next time."

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-re...hqS3s6jf4pTtcGw
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:22 PM
Stop panicking.

There is coming a time when the American people must come out of hiding and return to work.

The people of London, during the Blitz, hid in their shelters while the planes flew over, dropping their bombs.

Once the planes passed and the bombs exploded, they came out.

It wasn't safe, it wasn't cushy, there were unexploded bombs, unstable buildings that could fall on you, and fires to put out.

They didn't hide in their holes till the war was over!
They came out and got back to business!
They followed the protocols in order to remain as safe as possible.

So must we.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:24 PM
Originally Posted By: Jester
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Side note....Toilet paper shortage be damned. I just hooked up a bum gun. I purchased it after traveling to Thailand and using them there. Just never took the time to install it. Bring on the TP apocalypse. My hiney will sparkle.
... Now back to your regularly scheduled virus updates.


At some point PM me how you like it. I have been thinking about buying one of those for a while but like you haven't gotten around to it. Share the brand you went with.

Thanks - From the bottom of my bottom smile


I just want to know how cold the water is.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:28 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Stop panicking.

There is coming a time when the American people must come out of hiding and return to work.

The people of London, during the Blitz, hid in their shelters while the planes flew over, dropping their bombs.

Once the planes passed and the bombs exploded, they came out.

It wasn't safe, it wasn't cushy, there were unexploded bombs, unstable buildings that could fall on you, and fires to put out.

They didn't hide in their holes till the war was over!
They came out and got back to business!
They followed the protocols in order to remain as safe as possible.

So must we.


Your ilk buying into Trump's line of crap is what got us here.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:28 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Stop panicking.


Nobody is panicking. When the decisions that Trump make start killing more people, can I tell you to be realistic? Because that's what I'm being.
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:35 PM
There is a very real possibility I could die because there is no respirator available if I end up in the hospital. I guess I shouldnt worry about that even tho it can be prevented with government leadership. Guess I should just sit back and wait for easter.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:36 PM
This isn't about Trump.
This isn't about you.

This is about having an America that is viable for our kids, our grandkids and future generations!

Keeping your scared butts save is the least of it.

We did our part and hunkered while the wave is passing, then we need to man up and get back to it.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:41 PM
Stop panicking.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:42 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
This isn't about Trump.
This isn't about you.

This is about having an America that is viable for our kids, our grandkids and future generations!

Keeping your scared butts save is the least of it.

We did our part and hunkered while the wave is passing, then we need to man up and get back to it.


Science says the wave has nowhere near passed... This could last for months and many more will die if we go back to business as normal simply for the greed of the rich.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:43 PM
I wish Fox would start selling a different brand of parrot food.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:46 PM
And Trump says we are nowhere near getting back to work but he has set a goal of Easter time.

He will evaluate the situation, with his experts, to see what can be done to get us back to work as soon as is reasonable.

If he said go back to work tomorrow, even I would be panicking like you guys.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:55 PM
The simple fact is that the virus does not care what Trump says. Look at the number of new cases per day, and the percentage of total cases that are new cases.

Those are the only statistics that really matter. Right now we are about at 10,000 new cases per day and 50,000 total cases. We are about a week into social distancing, and still increasing exponentially. If those measures begin to work, it should begin to show in a few days.

I think the 15 day timeframe is unrealistic. It’s going to be a long haul.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:56 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: Jester
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Side note....Toilet paper shortage be damned. I just hooked up a bum gun. I purchased it after traveling to Thailand and using them there. Just never took the time to install it. Bring on the TP apocalypse. My hiney will sparkle.
... Now back to your regularly scheduled virus updates.


At some point PM me how you like it. I have been thinking about buying one of those for a while but like you haven't gotten around to it. Share the brand you went with.

Thanks - From the bottom of my bottom smile


I just want to know how cold the water is.


Refreshing. Minus a couple degrees. smile You’re not bathing though. Once you learn to aim it the temp is relatively inconsequential.

Jester... I purchased mine in 2018 when I got back from Thailand. It’s been sitting on a shelf since. I finally installed it. It was far easier to install than I figured. I should have done it 2 years ago. Lol
Here’s the one I got. There’s not much to them so brand won’t matter as much as materials they’re made from. This one is stainless. It feels sturdy. I’ve yet to use it for its intended use... which I’d not go into detail about here anyway. Lol
https://www.amazon.com/Bathroom-Handheld-Transforms-Vaporizer-Stainless/dp/B07K8RTGFQ

When I first got to Thailand I was a little intimidated. They take some getting use to but I and my girlfriend both came to understand why they’re used so widespread around the world....besides plumbing infrastructure.
The added bonus in times like these is it’ll cut TP use by half to two thirds.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 07:59 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
And Trump says we are nowhere near getting back to work but he has set a goal of Easter time.

He will evaluate the situation, with his experts, to see what can be done to get us back to work as soon as is reasonable.

If he said go back to work tomorrow, even I would be panicking like you guys.
Experts? Did you mean 'Yes Men'?
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 08:00 PM
Well I was wondering if the water jet cleansed your bottom or the sudden snapping shut of the sphincter just flung the poo off... wink
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 08:40 PM
On youtube, watch Ginger Billy, about his bidet.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 11:14 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
And Trump says we are nowhere near getting back to work but he has set a goal of Easter time.


That might the single most stupid thing Trump has ever said ... the list is long and there are a lot of contenders, yes, but man the guy is blindingly ignorant. And since you echo his every thought and post this as if you think it's a possibility, you are part of the issue too.

Do you think that the graph at the bottom of this page is likely to flatten or stop ascending anytime in the next 4 weeks?

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

What would be the point of "getting back to work" or "getting back to normal" if the number of cases continue to climb at this rate or a similar rate?

You indicated that if the call was to go back to work tomorrow you would panic - well in 4 weeks, we won't have a cure, we won't have a vaccine, and the number of cases and the number of deaths are going to be exponentially higher than today .... so what would be the logic that it would be safe then?

I get that the economy and world cannot stop and cease ... but (as has been the point since the beginning) can we get people with knowledge and facts and intelligence making the decisions on what is best for the long term - instead of Trump with his false and fake words of positivity.

Posted By: bonefish Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 11:30 PM

The depth of trump's incompetence is astounding.

Posted By: Squires Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 11:32 PM
Originally Posted By: mgh888



well in 4 weeks, we won't have a cure, we won't have a vaccine, and the number of cases and the number of deaths are going to be exponentially higher than today .... so what would be the logic that it would be safe then?




Are we supposed to keep society locked up for 18 months until there is a vaccine? Trumps easter timeline is stupid. At the same time, you can't keep society locked up forever.

At some point, we need to figure out how to live with Covid19 until a vaccine is available.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 11:44 PM
Originally Posted By: Squires
Originally Posted By: mgh888


well in 4 weeks, we won't have a cure, we won't have a vaccine, and the number of cases and the number of deaths are going to be exponentially higher than today .... so what would be the logic that it would be safe then?


Are we supposed to keep society locked up for 18 months until there is a vaccine? Trumps easter timeline is stupid. At the same time, you can't keep society locked up forever.

At some point, we need to figure out how to live with Covid19 until a vaccine is available.

I don't believe we can be on lock down until there is a vaccine even if they manage to fast track one ... What I want is solid leadership that isn't flapping like a pair of grannies bloomers on the clothes line in a strong wind.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/24/20 11:54 PM
https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-says-governors-treat-us-194500496.html

Trump says governors 'have to treat us well' if they want assistance during coronavirus pandemic

Tim O'Donnell
,The Week•March 24, 2020

President Trump said Tuesday he's working well with governors across the country as both the federal government and the states battle the coronavirus pandemic.

Trump singled out his working relationship with California Gov. Gavin Newsom (D), with whom he's clashed in the past over issues like homelessness. And everyone else, it seems, remains in communication with each other and the White House as the country develops some semblance of a coordinated plan. But, there's a catch.

The president said governors can't simply tell him they want assistance and expect the administration to comply in the blink of an eye. Instead, he suggested governors should show some appreciation first.


Dan Diamond
✔
@ddiamond
FOX NEWS DOCTOR: Do you think that kind of movement where you’re the leader, and other people work with you, will help us to isolate the virus?

TRUMP: I do… we are doing very well with almost all the governors… [but] it’s a two-way street, they have to treat us well also.



2:04 PM - Mar 24, 2020

He pointed to New York in this instance. The state with the country's highest number of COVID-19 cases is trying to get more respirators, but Trump says Gov. Andrew Cuomo (D) can't blame the White House because he had a chance to order the supplies two years ago.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 03:01 AM


Mexican Trump.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 03:46 AM
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

This is a way to look at the data... What is the percentage of new cases versus total cases....

With that information, here is the time in days for the number of total cases to double...

25% - 3.1
20% - 3.8
15% - 5
10% - 7.3
5% - 14.2
2% - 35
1% - 70

So there are a lot of states that are above 15%, but I will suggest that it won’t be until we are below 5% until we can begin to think about returning to our past ways. There is a link to the world data on that page, and you can look at the data for yesterday as well.
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 04:24 AM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
What I want is solid leadership that isn't flapping like a pair of grannies bloomers on the clothes line in a strong wind.


Well, thank God the Democrats aren't in charge then, you just described their leadership to a "T"!
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 04:34 AM
Originally Posted By: Swish
TRUMP CORONAVIRUS FAILURE TIMELINE
January 30: Trump on Coronavirus, “We have it very well under control, and I think it’s going to have a very good ending. So that I can assure you!”

February 2: Trump on Coronavirus, “Well, we pretty much shut it down coming in from China, but we did shut it down!”

February 10: On Fox News Trump says without evidence that the coronavirus "dies with the hotter weather… You know, a lot of people think that goes away in April with the heat.”

February 24: "The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA.”

February 25: Trump falsely claims “You may ask about the coronavirus, which is very well under control in our country. We have very few people with it, and the people that have it are … getting better. They’re ALL getting better!”

February 26: Trump wrongly says the coronavirus "is a flu" and that “whatever happens, we’re totally prepared.”

February 26: Trump baselessly predicts the number of US cases is "going very substantially down" to "close to zero”

February 26: Trump wrongly says the flu death rate is "much higher" than Dr. Sanjay Gupta said. Coronavirus has 10X death rate compared to flu. If 60K die from flu then 600K will die from Coronavirus!

February 27: Trump baselessly said, "It's going to disappear. One day -- it's like a miracle -- it will disappear.”

February 28: Trump said at a rally, Coronavirus is “the new Democratic Hoax.”

March 2: Trump falsely claims “nobody knew of the number of US flu deaths”.

March 2: Trump says a vaccine is coming "relatively soon”. Only Trump did not bother to mention that CDC had told him earlier that day that a vaccine was a year to a year and a half away.

March 4: Trump said he believes people infected with the novel coronavirus may get better "by sitting around and even going to work."

March 5: Trump wrongly claims the virus only hit the US "three weeks ago”. Trump was informed of a confirmed case on January 21(6 weeks prior).

March 5: World Health Organization (WHO), based on data collected around the world, stated the global mortality rate for coronavirus at 3.4%. Trump says: “I think the 3.4 % is really a false number, this is just my ‘Hunch’!”

March 6: As the number of cases and deaths in Italy rises, Trump says “I hear the numbers getting much better in Italy.”

March 6: Trump tells cameras, “Anybody who wants a test can get one.” VP Pence said the day prior that Americans could not get tested simply because they wanted to get tested. "You may not get a test unless a doctor or public health official prescribes a test."

March 6: Trump muses that "maybe the coronavirus improved US jobs numbers.”

March 6: "I like the numbers being where they are. I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship," Trump said of passengers on the Grand Princess cruise ship.

March 7: Trump said that doctors he's come across as the administration tries to get a handle on the outbreak have been surprised about how much he knows about COVID-19. "Maybe I have a natural ability," he said. "Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president."

March 11: Trump’s Address from Oval Office wrongly states Insurance companies will pay for patients Coronavirus treatment. Next day Insurance Coalition corrected Trump and said they will pay ONLY for Co-payments, NOT treatment.

March 13: Trump declares National Emergency. “As you know Europe was just designated as the hot spot right now, and we closed that border a while ago so that was lucky or through talent or through luck… call it whatever you want.” The travel ban had not even been implemented, scheduled to start that night.

March 13: Asked why his Admin previously disbanded the national pandemic office which would have significantly prepared the United States, “When you say me, I didn’t do it. We have a group of people… You say we did that, but I don’t know anything about it.” This, after Trump’s presser from Feb. 26 where it was previously brought up and discussed with Trump.

March 13: Backpedaling about whether or not he should get tested and self-isolate for Coronavirus after being in direct contact with those carrying the virus, “I asked them that same question, and they said, ‘You don’t have any symptoms whatsoever.’” You don’t have to be showing symptoms to already have the Coronavirus.

March 13: Trump interacted with several top administration officials and business leaders during the address, shaking hands and patting them.

March 13: Asked by a reporter about the federal failures to test for Coronavirus, Trump answered, “No I don’t take responsibility for that at all.” This, after he exclaimed on March 6 that tests were ready and everyone who wanted a test would be able to get a test.

Notable Trump tweet from 2013: “Leadership: Whatever happens, you’re responsible. If it doesn’t happen, you’re responsible.”

_____________

but sure, fish. somehow, its the "liberal" media's fault.




Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 05:19 AM
j/c...

Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 05:24 AM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 03:52 PM
Bill Gates says we can’t restart the economy soon and simply “ignore that pile of bodies over in the corner”

Gates rebuked the proposal of leaders like Donald Trump.

Bill Gates rebuked proposals, floated over the last two days by leaders like Donald Trump, to reopen the global economy despite the Covid-19 coronavirus outbreak, saying that this approach would be “very irresponsible.”

Gates did not mention Trump by name, but the American president has said that he may decide to relax some of the country’s “social distancing” in order to jumpstart the country’s shut-down economy. Gates, the country’s leading philanthropist, has been among the most active tech leaders in using his resources to try and contain the virus.

“There really is no middle ground, and it’s very tough to say to people, ‘Hey, keep going to restaurants, go buy new houses, ignore that pile of bodies over in the corner. We want you to keep spending because there’s maybe a politician who thinks GDP growth is all that counts,’” Gates said in an interview with TED Tuesday. “It’s very irresponsible for somebody to suggest that we can have the best of both worlds.”

Trump has suggested that this middle ground would indeed be possible — by letting some healthy people return to work, for instance, while keeping more vulnerable workers in their homes. Experts have said that drastic and widespread social distancing is required to keep the pandemic from spreading further. Trump has said he would make a decision at the end of the month but has said that he believes the “cure” could be worse than the “problem itself.”

Asked what he would do if he were president, Gates returned to his concerns about reopening the economy.

“The economic effect of this is really dramatic. Nothing like this has ever happened to the economy in our lifetimes,” Gates said. “But bringing the economy back ... that’s more of a reversible thing than bringing people back to life. So we’re going to take the pain in the economic dimension — huge pain — in order to minimize the pain in the diseases-and-death dimension.”

The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation has put up $100 million for programs to fund testing and science around the pandemic, and he has begun using his public profile, too, to shape the coronavirus conversation. This month, Gates himself resigned from the board of Microsoft, which he founded, and is now effectively a full-time philanthropist — and the country’s most famous one.

And Gates has tried to cast himself as an optimist. He has said that the social distancing measures might need to last as little as six weeks, but said that “we have no choice,” despite the economic impacts.

“It’s disastrous for the economy,” Gates said. But “the sooner you do it in a tough way, the sooner you can undo it and go back to normal.”

https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/3/24/211...iSjGPBoYbfNi32o

Another one of those evil one percenters.
Posted By: PrplPplEater Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 04:53 PM
I'm afraid to see just how much utterly useless and pointless crap was stuffed into this thing.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 05:02 PM
Pastor again defies state order not to hold large gatherings. He says 1,000 people came to his church Sunday

Remember the Louisiana pastor who defied the governor's order not to hold gatherings larger than 50 people?
He held services again on Sunday, and he plans to do so yet again on Tuesday night.

On Sunday, Pastor Tony Spell said, his Life Tabernacle Church in Baton Rouge drew about 1,000 people to its services, in part by busing people in from across five parishes.

On Tuesday evening, the pastor plans to hold services again, despite the governor's stay-at-home orders, a petition seeking his arrest and a flood of criticism from fellow Christians.

"If they close every door in this city, then I will close my doors," Spell told CNN on Tuesday. "But you can't say the retailers are essential but the church is not. That is a persecution of the faith."

Spell has told CNN he believes the pandemic is "politically motivated."

Chief Roger Corcoran of the Central Police Department in Baton Rouge told CNN that the "matter is under investigation."

Corcoran also disputed Spell's claim last week that the police department told the pastor that the National Guard would be brought in to disperse the church assembly.

"That was never told to the pastor by my officer," Corcoran said.
Spell stands by his account. A spokesman for the Louisiana National Guard said they have not been tasked with breaking up large gatherings.

The pastor says he's heard from the White House

As the novel coronavirus spreads across the world, nearly every faith group has closed its holy sites and houses of worship. But there remain a defiant few pastors and religious leaders who refuse to close their doors, accusing the government of overreach and imposing on their religious freedom.

Earlier in March, Lousiana Governor John Bel Edwards issued an emergency order barring gatherings of larger than 50 people to stop the spread of Covid-19.

On Sunday, Edwards went even further, asking residents statewide to only leave home for essential needs like shopping for food, going to the pharmacy or caring for a family member.

Louisiana has the fastest growth rate of coronavirus cases in the world, Edwards said during a news conference on Sunday, citing a University of Louisiana Lafayette study.

The governor's office did not respond to repeated requests from CNN for comment about Spell's church services. On Sunday, Edwards told CNN affiliate WVLA that he would "would urge that faith leaders and all faith leaders to heed this directive and not necessarily engage in mass gatherings where this coronavirus can spread."

For his part, Spell said he is following social distancing guidelines, including instructions from Washington. The pastor said someone from the White House -- he declined to say who -- called him last week.

The official, according to Spell, asked him to hold services outside, make his congregation stand six feet apart and prevent non-family members from touching.

According to the Washington Post, Spell spoke with Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council and a member of President Trump's informal body of evangelical advisers. A spokesman for Perkins said the conversation took place but that Perkins was not immediately available for comment.
In a statement, the White House said, "During this public health crisis, the Trump Administration has been extremely proactive in reaching out to leaders from the faith community, hosting several calls last week with more than 1,200 inter-faith leaders.

"The White House has strongly recommended that all Americans, including pastors, follow CDC guidelines by limiting groups to 10 people and practicing social distancing. President Trump encourages Americans of all religious backgrounds to do their part to stay healthy and stop the spread."

Despite criticism, Spell remains undeterred

A video of the Sunday service, posted on Spell's Facebook page, shows his congregation singing, praying, touching and otherwise worshiping in close proximity, mostly under a tent. The 1,000 congregants were spread across the church's seven buildings, Spell said.

The pastor said he's heard a flood of criticism from fellow Christians urging him to close his doors. Many, Spell said, cite Romans 13, the passage in which the Apostle Paul urges Christians to submit to "governing authorities." Others ask him to consider the greater good.

On Monday, the influential evangelical magazine Christianity Today published an editorial asking pastors and church leaders to consider the consequences of their actions.

"We are being asked temporarily to convene remotely, not to deny our faith or to cease worshiping God," said the editorial, which was co-written with Walter Kim, president of the National Association of Evangelicals.

"It is one thing to risk your own life in order to worship together in person," the editorial continued, "it is quite another to risk the lives of countless others, when so many churches are finding creative and compelling ways to carry on in worship and community from a distance."
An online petition from "The People of Greater Baton Rouge" asks that Spell be arrested and charged with reckless endangerment.
Spell, though, remains undeterred.

The pastor told CNN that people been cured of HIV-AIDS and cancer at his worship services, which feature faith-healing, speaking in tongues and other spiritual hallmarks of Pentecostalism.

Asked what he would do if a member of his congregation contracted coronavirus, Spell shifted the blame.
"Did they contract it at Walmart or Target?" he asked. "They have more people in their parking lot than we get here in a week."

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/24/us/louisiana-pastor-spell-coronavirus/index.html
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 05:19 PM
'Imaginary clock': Governors reject Trump's virus timeline

AUSTIN, TEXAS —

Governors across the nation on Tuesday rejected President Donald Trump's new accelerated timeline for reopening the U.S. economy, as they continued to impose more restrictions on travel and public life in an attempt to curb the spread of the coronavirus.

The dismissal of Trump's mid-April timeframe for a national reopening came from Republicans and Democrats, from leaders struggling to manage hot spots of the outbreak and those still bracing for the worst. Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan, the head of the National Governors Association and a Republican, called the messaging confusing since most leaders are still focused on enforcing the restrictions, not easing them. He accused the White House of running on a schedule made of some “imaginary clock.”

The pushback suggests Trump's talk of an early reboot is unlikely to gain traction. In most cases, it's state leaders — not the federal government — who are responsible for both imposing and lifting the stay-at-home orders and other restrictions intended to stop the contagion.

But the governors' reaction also revealed the striking disconnect and growing tensions between Trump and the state leaders closer to the front lines of a crisis that threatens to overwhelm U.S. hospitals and claim thousands of lives.

The president is eager to get the U.S. back to work as the crisis takes a political toll and the economy, which had been the cornerstone of his re-election bid, begins to wobble. The economic damage could be worse than the death toll from the virus, he has said. As soon as next week, Trump wants to take another look at recommendations about business closures and self-isolation, and said Tuesday the country could reopen by Easter Sunday — less than a month away. “Our people want to return to work," he said.

But governors suggested that view had little connection to the reality they're facing. California Democratic Gov. Gavin Newsom said he and Trump are “clearly operating under a different set of assumptions." California, home to 40 million people and the world’s fifth-largest economy, reported hundreds of new known cases of COVID 19 and now has more than 2,200, according to a tally by Johns Hopkins University.

In New York, Democratic Gov. Andrew Cuomo on Tuesday said the infection rate was doubling every three days and pleaded for more federal help as the number of cases in the state surpassed 20,000.

“If you ask the American people to choose between public health and the economy, then it's no contest. No American is going to say accelerate the economy at the cost of human life," Cuomo told reporters Tuesday. "Job one has to be save lives. That has to be the priority.”

Even some of Trump’s usual allies are continuing to move ahead with tighter controls on travel, commerce and mobility, despite the president's words. In Texas, Republican Gov. Greg Abbott has endorsed stay-at-home orders that continued to spread through the biggest cities. Arizona Gov. Doug Ducey said public health needed to come first, and South Dakota Gov. Krisiti Noem is stressing limiting business activity, not relaxing them.

“This situation is not going to be over in a week," said Noem, whose state has more than two dozen cases. “We have another eight weeks until we see our peak infection rate."

The U.S. is now more than a week into an unprecedented effort to encourage all Americans to drastically scale back their public activities. The orders closing schools, restaurants and businesses have largely come from a patchwork of local and state governments — with areas hit hardest imposing the most restrictions, while other communities are still weighing tighter rules.

That means the White House is eyeing ways to ease the advisories while some areas are still ramping up their responses — a mixed message that some governors worried would lead Americans to ignore the orders of local officials.

Michigan's Gretchen Whitmer, a Democrat, told WWMT-TV/Sinclair Broadcast Group that Trump's “off-the-cuff statements are really going to undermine our ability to protect people.” Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker said Trump was “not taking into account the true damage that this will do to our country if we see truly millions of people die."

Trump has defended his handling of the outbreak and argued that his administration is doing all it can to help governors.

“They shouldn't be hitting us," he said on Fox News. “The fact is we've done a lot.”

Among the few statehouse leaders to publicly endorse Trump's view was Texas' lieutenant governor, Dan Patrick, 69, who on Monday suggested that people his age and older can “take care of ourselves " as the nation gets back to work. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says people over 65 are at higher risk for the disease.

Friction between Trump and the governors has been steady throughout the crisis. The president said last week that states should be doing more to obtain their own critically needed supplies while insisting that the federal government was not a shipping clerk. States, meanwhile, have been pressing the government to help procure necessary protective and breathing equipment.

On Tuesday, Trump suggested any shortage of ventilators was on the states.

“All they had to do was order them two years ago, but they decided not to do it. They can’t blame us for that,” he said on Fox News.

"Some of the messaging coming out of the administration doesn't match," Hogan, the Maryland governor, told CNN. “We don't think that we're going to be in any way ready to be out of this in five or six days or so, or whenever this 15 days is up from the time that they started this imaginary clock.”

For most people, the coronavirus causes only mild or moderate symptoms, such as fever and cough. For some, especially older adults and people with existing health problems, it can cause more severe illness, including pneumonia. Worldwide, more than 375,000 cases have been reported, and while most people recover in weeks, more than 16,000 have died from the virus.

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/nat...FfHwfw7Y87Fnngg
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 05:32 PM
Realistically only if test kits could be processed by us in our homes and sent to us for a few weeks for retesting each week. It’ seems hopeless now. Everyone is going to catch the trump virus sooner or later. It’s way too late. Our leadership failed us and they’re just running damage control now.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 05:37 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
'Imaginary clock': Governors reject Trump's virus timeline

AUSTIN, TEXAS —

Governors across the nation on Tuesday rejected President Donald Trump's new accelerated timeline for reopening the U.S. economy, as they continued to impose more restrictions on travel and public life in an attempt to curb the spread of the coronavirus.

They are part of the hate group and Deep State that plague our nation.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 05:38 PM
Even the Republican governors. wink
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/25/20 06:15 PM
j/c - what the neutral world sees:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52012049

There are no fresh flowers at the 9/11 Memorial any more. An American altar usually decorated with roses, carnations and postcard-sized Stars and Stripes is sequestered behind a makeshift plastic railing. Broadway, the "Great White Way", is dark. The subway system is a ghost train. Staten Island ferries keep cutting through the choppy waters of New York harbour, passing Lady Liberty on the way in and out of Lower Manhattan, but hardly any passengers are on board. Times Square, normally such a roiling mass, is almost devoid of people.

In the midst of this planetary pandemic, nobody wants to meet any more at the "Crossroads of the World". A city known for its infectious energy, a city that likes to boast it never even has to sleep, has been forced into hibernation. With more cases than any other American conurbation, this city is once again Ground Zero, a term no New Yorker ever wanted applied here again. With manic suddenness, our world has been turned upside down, just as it was on September 11th.

Nations, like individuals, reveal themselves at times of crisis. In emergencies of this immense magnitude, it soon becomes evident whether a sitting president is equal to the moment. So what have we learnt about the United States as it confronts this national and global catastrophe? Will lawmakers on Capitol Hill, who have been in a form of legislative lockdown for years now, a paralysis borne of partisanship, rise to the challenge? And what of the man who now sits behind the Resolute Desk in the Oval Office, who has cloaked himself in the mantle of "wartime president"?

Of the three questions, the last one is the least interesting, largely because Donald Trump's response has been so predictable. He has not changed. He has not grown. He has not admitted errors. He has shown little humility.

Instead, all the hallmarks of his presidency have been on agitated display. The ridiculous boasts - he has awarded himself a 10 out of 10 for his handling of the crisis. The politicisation of what should be the apolitical - he toured the Centers for Disease Control wearing a campaign cap emblazoned with the slogan "Keep America Great".

The mind-bending truth-twisting - he now claims to have fully appreciated the scale of the pandemic early on, despite dismissing and downplaying the threat for weeks. The attacks on the "fake news" media, including a particularly vicious assault on a White House reporter who asked what was his message to frightened Americans: "I tell them you are a terrible reporter." His pettiness and peevishness - mocking Senator Mitt Romney, the only Republican who voted at the end of the impeachment trial for his removal from office, for going into isolation.



His continued attacks on government institutions in the forefront of confronting the crisis - "the Deep State Department" is how he described the State Department from his presidential podium the morning after it issued its most extreme travel advisory urging Americans to refrain from all international travel. His obsession with ratings, or in this instance, confirmed case numbers - he stopped a cruise ship docking on the West Coast, noting: "I like the numbers where they are. I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship that wasn't our fault." His compulsion for hype - declaring the combination of hydroxycholoroquine and azithromycin "one of the biggest game-changers in the history of medicine," even as medical officials warn against offering false hope.

His lack of empathy. Rather than soothing words for relatives of those who have died, or words of encouragement and appreciation for those in the medical trenches, Trump's daily White House briefings commonly start with a shower of self-congratulation. After Trump has spoken, Mike Pence, his loyal deputy, usually delivers a paean of praise to the president in that Pyongyang-on-the-Potomac style he has perfected over the past three years. Trump's narcissistic hunger for adoration seems impossible to sate. Instead of a wartime president, he has sounded at times like a sun king.

Then there is the xenophobia that has always been the sine qua non of his political business model - repeatedly he describes the disease as the "Chinese virus". Just as he scapegoated China and Mexican immigrants for decimating America's industrial heartland ahead of the 2016 presidential election, he is blaming Beijing for the coronavirus outbreak in an attempt to win re-election.

Trump and the 'Chinese virus'
Why Trump is cooling on lockdown strategy
His attempt at economic stewardship has been more convincing than his mastery of public health. A lesson from financial shocks of the past, most notably the meltdown in 2008, is to "go big" early on. That he has tried to do. But here, as well, there are shades of his showman self. He seems to have rounded on the initial figure of a trillion dollars for the stimulus package because it sounds like such a gargantuan number - a fiscal eighth wonder of the world.

Trump, in common with all populists and demagogues, favours simple solutions to complex problems. He closed America's border to those who had travelled to China, a sensible move in hindsight. However, the coronavirus outbreak has required the kind of multi-pronged approach and long-term thinking that seems beyond him. This has always been a presidency of the here and now. It is not well equipped to deal with a public health and economic emergency that will dominate the rest of his presidency, whether he only gets to spend the next 10 months in the White House or another five years.

The Trump presidency has so often been about creating favourable optics even in the absence of real progress - his nuclear summitry with the North Korean despot Kim Jong-un offers a case in point. But the tricks of an illusionist, or the marketing skills of the sloganeer, do not work here. This is a national emergency, as countless others have pointed out, that can't be tweeted, nicknamed or hyped away. The facts are inescapable: the soaring numbers of the dead.

What have we learnt of the United States? First of all, we have seen the enduring goodness of this country. The Frenchman Alexis DeToqueville, whose observations in the early-19th Century did so much to demystify this rambunctious new republic, always told us: "America is great because she is good."

As with 9/11, we have marvelled at the selflessness and bravery of its first responders - the nurses, doctors, medical support staff and ambulance drivers who have turned up to the work with the same sense of public spiritedness shown by the firefighters who rushed towards the flaming Twin Towers. We've witnessed the ingenuity and creativity of schools that have transitioned to remote, online teaching without missing a beat. We've seen a can-do spirit that has kept stores open, shelves stocked and food being delivered. In other words, most Americans have shown precisely the same virtues we have seen in every country brought to a halt by the virus.

As for the American exceptionalism on display, much of it has been of the negative kind that makes it hard not to put head in hands. The lines outside gun stores. The spike in online sales of firearms - Ammo.com has seen a 70% increase in sales. The panic buying of AR-15s. Some Christian fundamentalists have rejected the epidemiology of this pandemic. To prove there was no virus, a pastor in Arkansas boasted his parishioners were prepared to lick the floor of his church.

Once again, those who live in developed nations have been left to ponder why the world's richest country does not have a system of universal healthcare. Ten years after the passage of Obamacare, more than 26 million Americans do not have health insurance.

Three reasons the US is more at risk
What can the West learn from Asia's coronavirus fight?
Rather than a coming together, the crisis has demonstrated how for decades Americans have conducted a political version of social distancing: the herd-like clustering of conservatives and liberals into like-minded communities caused by the allergic reaction to compatriots holding opposing political views. Once again, we have seen the familiar two Americas divide, the usual knee-jerk tribalism. Republicans have been twice as likely as Democrats to view coronavirus coverage as exaggerated. Three-quarters of Republicans say they trust the information coming from the president, whereas the figure among Democrats is just 8%.

As the Reverend Josh King told the Washington Post despairingly: "In your more politically conservative regions, closing is not interpreted as caring for you. It's interpreted as liberalism." Even on 13 March, when the CDC projected that up to 214 millions could be infected, Sean Davis, the co-founder of the right-wing website, The Federalist, tweeted: "Corporate political media hate you, they hate the country, and they will stop at nothing to reclaim power to rule over you. If that means destroying the economy via a panic they helped incite, all while running interference for the communist country that started it, so be it."

The latest Gallup polling shows the split: 94% of Republicans approve of his handling of the crisis, compared with 27% of Democrats. But overall, six out of ten Americans approve, pushing his approval rating up again to 49%, matching the highest score of his presidency. As with previous crises, such as 9/11, Americans tend to rally around the presidency, although Donald Trump remains a deeply polarising figure. After the attacks of September 11th, George W Bush's approval rating was over 90.


The political geography of America, with its red and blue state separatism, has even affected how voters are being physically exposed to the virus. Democrats tend to congregate in the cities, whose dense populations have made them hotspots. Republicans tend to live in more sparsely populated rural areas, which so far have not been so badly hit. Thus, the polarisation continues amidst the pandemic.

Rather than to the Trump White House, much of "Blue America" has looked for leadership to its state capitals: Democratic governors such as Andrew Cuomo in New York (who Trump tweeted should "do more"), Gavin Newsom in California (whom Trump has praised) and Jay Inslee in Washington state (whom the president called a "snake" during his visit to the CDC).

For American liberals, Dr Anthony Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, has become the subversive hero of the hour. Offering an antidote to this post-truth presidency, Fauci sticks to scientific facts. After repeatedly contradicting Donald Trump over the seriousness of the outbreak, he is on his way to being viewed with the same affection and reverence as the liberal Supreme Court jurist Ruth Bader Ginsburg.


Fauci has become a phenomenon on social media
Surely the coronavirus outbreak will eventually lead to an end momentarily to the gridlock on Capitol Hill. Legislators have no other choice but to legislate given the enormity of the economic crisis and the spectre of a 21st Century Great Depression.

However, the first two attempts to pass a stimulus package failed amidst the usual partisan acrimony and brinksmanship. Republicans and Democrats are arguing over whether to include expansions of paid leave and unemployment benefits, and what the Democrats are calling a slush fund for corporate America that could be open to abuse. Once again, Capitol Hill's dysfunction has been shown to be both systemic and endemic.

Given the scale of the public health and economic crisis, the hope would be of a return to the patriotic bipartisanship that prevailed during much of the Fifties and early Sixties, which produced some of the major post-war reforms such as the construction of the interstate highway system and the landmark civil rights acts. History, after all, shows that US politicians co-operate most effectively in the face of a common enemy, whether it was the Soviet Union during the Cold War or al-Qaeda in the initial months after 9/11.

But the early response of lawmakers on Capitol Hill is far from encouraging. And if there is cross-party co-operation - as there will surely be in the end - it will not be the product of patriotic bipartisanship but rather freak-out bipartisanship, the legislative equivalent of panic buying.

The paradox here, as lawmakers face-off, is that crises erase philosophical lines. As in 2008, ideological conservatives have overnight become operational liberals. Those who ordinarily detest government have come in this emergency to depend on it. Corporate America, which is generally phobic towards federal intervention, is now desperate for government bailouts.

Trickle-down supply siders have become Keynesian big spenders, such is their desire for government stimulus spending funded by the taxpayer. Even universal basic income, a fringe idea popularised by the Democratic presidential candidate Andrew Yang, has gone mainstream. The US government intends to give $1,200 payments to every American.

In this call to national action, we have been reminded of how the federal government has been run down over the past 40 years partly because of an anti-government onslaught that started with Ronald Reagan. In 2018, the team responsible for pandemic response on the National Security Council at the White House was disbanded. The failure to carry out adequate testing, the key to containing outbreaks early on, is linked to a funding shortfall at the Department of Health and Human Services.

As with the attacks of 11 September 2001, warnings within government were repeatedly ignored. In recent years, there have been numerous exercises to test the country's preparedness for a pandemic - one of which involved a respiratory virus originating from China - that identified exactly the areas of vulnerability now being exposed. As with Hurricane Katrina, the Federal Emergency Management Agency has struggled. As ever, there are tensions between federal agencies and the states. The institutional decline of government that led so many Americans to pin their faith in an individual, Donald Trump, is again plain to see, whether in the shortage of masks and protective gowns or the dearth of early testing.

Consequently, America's claim to global pre-eminence looks less convincing by the day. While in previous crises, the world's most powerful superpower might have mobilised a global response, nobody expects that of the United States anymore. The neo-isolationism of three years of America Firstism has created a geopolitical form of social distancing, and this crisis has reminded us of the oceanic divide that has opened up even with Washington's closest allies. Take the European travel ban, which Trump announced during his Oval Office address to the nation without warning the countries affected. The European Union complained, in an unusually robust public statement, the decision was "taken unilaterally and without consultation".

Nor has the United States offered a model for how to deal with this crisis. South Korea, with its massive testing programme, and Japan have been exemplars. China, too, has shown the advantages of its authoritarianism system in enforcing a strict lockdown, which is especially worrying when the western liberal order looks so wobbly. Hopefully, nobody will forget how officials in China tried to cover up the virus for weeks and silenced whistleblowers, showing the country's ugly autocratic side even as the outbreak was spreading. But whereas Beijing managed to build a new hospital in just 10 days, the Pentagon will take weeks to move a naval hospital ship from its port in Virginia to New York harbour.

Politically, there will be so many ramifications. It is worth remembering, for example, that the Tea Party was as much a reaction to what was called the "big government conservatism" of George W Bush in response to the financial crisis as it was to the pigmentation of Barack Obama. The official history of the Tea Party movement states it came into existence on 3 October, 2008, when Bush signed into law TARP, the Troubled Asset Relief Programme which saved the failing banks. Tea-Partiers viewed that as an unacceptable encroachment of government power.

Likewise, it is worth bearing in mind that the two major convulsions of the 21st Century, the destruction of the Twin Towers and the collapse of Lehman Brothers, both ended up having a polarising effect on US politics. The fragile bipartisan 9/11 consensus was shattered by the Bush administration's decision to invade Iraq. The financial crisis fuelled the rise of the Tea Party and further radicalised the Republican Party.

What will be the impact on the presidential election? Judging by the Lazarus-like revival of Joe Biden, the signs are that Democrats are voting for normal. Clearly, a significant majority is not in the mood for the political revolution promised by Bernie Sanders. A 78-year-old whose candidacy was almost derailed in its early stages because he was so tactile looks again like a strong candidate in these socially distant times.


Many Americans are yearning for precisely the kind of empathy and personal warmth that Biden offers. Even before the coronavirus took hold, he had made recovery his theme, a narrative in accord with his life story. Many also want a presidency they could have on in the background. A less histrionic figure in the Oval Office. Soft jazz rather than heavy metal. A return to some kind of normalcy. But who would make any predictions? Only a few weeks ago, when the chaos of the Iowa caucuses seemed like a major story, we were prophesying Biden's political demise.

Besides, normalcy is not something we can expect to see for months, maybe even for years. Rather, the coronavirus could dramatically reshape American politics, much like the other massive historical convulsions of the past 100 years.

The Great Depression led to the New Deal, and its massive extension of federal power, through welfare programmes such as Social Security. It also made the Democrats, the champions of government, politically dominant. From 1932 onwards, the party won five consecutive presidential elections. World War II, among other social changes, gave impetus to the struggle for black equality, as African-American infantrymen who fought fascism on the same battlefields as white GIs demanded the same menu of civil rights on their return home. The attacks of 11 September made many Americans more wary of mass immigration and religious pluralism. The Great Recession undermined faith in the American Dream.

Liberals may be hoping the outbreak will highlight the need for universal healthcare, a New Deal-style revival of government, the return of a more fact-based polity and a stronger response to global warming, another planetary crisis which has the potential to paralyse and overwhelm so much of the world.

Conservatives may conclude the private sector rather than government is better equipped to deal with crises, amplifying their anti-government rhetoric, that gun controls should be further relaxed so that Americans can better protect themselves, and that individual liberties should not be constrained by nanny states.

Every day on my way to work, I pass the 9/11 memorial where the Twin Towers once stood, and watch people laying their flowers and muttering their quiet prayers. Many is the time I have wondered whether I would ever cover a more world-altering event. As I look out of my window on a quiet and eerie city that feels more like Gotham than New York, I fear we may be confronting it now.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 06:50 PM
Click the link for the thread that outlines spending packages for various agencies for the stimulus bill...

Tim Mak
@timkmak
Pandemic response bill appropriates $4,300,000,000 for the Centers for Disease Control (CDC). p. 119

Thread to follow includes other tidbits as I read Division B of the bill...

https://twitter.com/timkmak/status/1242876152513007617
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 09:45 PM
G7 statement scrapped after U.S. insisted coronavirus be called "Wuhan virus"

Foreign ministers of the G7 countries failed to agree to a joint statement following a video conference Wednesday in part because the Trump administration insisted the statement refer to COVID-19 as the "Wuhan virus," Der Spiegel first reported and multiple U.S. outlets have confirmed.

Why it matters: The world's two most powerful countries are in a battle of narratives over the pandemic, with some in Beijing spreading disinformation about its origins and U.S. officials like Secretary of State Mike Pompeo increasingly blaming the Chinese government.

The phrase "Wuhan virus" has not been adopted by other countries, and G7 members considered it needlessly antagonistic.

The countries ultimately agreed on a common set of principles and actions to confront the coronavirus, and each released their own statements after the video conference.

https://www.axios.com/wuhan-virus-pompeo...mB68EstAmMowkrE

His stupidity knows no bounds.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 10:06 PM
Coronavirus: Liberty University's Jerry Falwell Jr. welcomes students back amid pandemic

One professor slammed the move in an op-ed, saying, "Falwell's lack of concern does nothing to mitigate these students likely becoming vectors of the pathogen."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/cor...s-back-n1167581

Moron.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/25/20 11:51 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Coronavirus: Liberty University's Jerry Falwell Jr. welcomes students back amid pandemic

One professor slammed the move in an op-ed, saying, "Falwell's lack of concern does nothing to mitigate these students likely becoming vectors of the pathogen."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/cor...s-back-n1167581

Moron.


Let them all on campus... then put a fence around it. Let it run its course while providing medical care for those in need.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/26/20 12:05 AM
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Coronavirus: Liberty University's Jerry Falwell Jr. welcomes students back amid pandemic

One professor slammed the move in an op-ed, saying, "Falwell's lack of concern does nothing to mitigate these students likely becoming vectors of the pathogen."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/cor...s-back-n1167581

Moron.


Let them all on campus... then put a fence around it. Let it run its course while providing medical care for those in need.


Looks like everyone is taking a class on Darwin and everyone gets an award
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/26/20 12:15 AM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
And Trump says we are nowhere near getting back to work but he has set a goal of Easter time.


That might the single most stupid thing Trump has ever said ... the list is long and there are a lot of contenders, yes, but man the guy is blindingly ignorant. And since you echo his every thought and post this as if you think it's a possibility, you are part of the issue too.

Do you think that the graph at the bottom of this page is likely to flatten or stop ascending anytime in the next 4 weeks?

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

What would be the point of "getting back to work" or "getting back to normal" if the number of cases continue to climb at this rate or a similar rate?

You indicated that if the call was to go back to work tomorrow you would panic - well in 4 weeks, we won't have a cure, we won't have a vaccine, and the number of cases and the number of deaths are going to be exponentially higher than today .... so what would be the logic that it would be safe then?

I get that the economy and world cannot stop and cease ... but (as has been the point since the beginning) can we get people with knowledge and facts and intelligence making the decisions on what is best for the long term - instead of Trump with his false and fake words of positivity.




The overlords have spoken

Coronavirus: Billionaires want people back to work, but their employees aren't so sure

of New York City, March 25, 2020.PHOTO: REUTERS
PUBLISHED7 HOURS AGO

NEW YORK (BLOOMBERG) - The billionaire Tom Golisano was smoking a Padron cigar on his patio in Florida on Tuesday afternoon (March 24). He was worried.

"The damages of keeping the economy closed as it is could be worse than losing a few more people," said Mr Golisano, founder and chairman of the payroll processor Paychex.

"I have a very large concern that if businesses keep going along the way they're going then so many of them will have to fold."


President Donald Trump says he doesn't want the cure for the Covid-19 pandemic "to be worse than the problem", and some of America's wealthiest people and executives are echoing his rallying cry.

They want to revive an economy that could face its worst quarterly drop ever - even if it means pulling back on social distancing measures that public health officials say can help stop the coronavirus.

These investors aren't prizing profits over lives, they say, they're just willing to risk some horrors to avoid others.

"You're picking the better of two evils," said Mr Golisano, who wants people to go back to their offices in states that have been relatively spared by the coronavirus, but remain at home in hot spots.

Covid-19: Don't miss the latest on the outbreak and its impact
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"You have to weigh the pros and cons."

In New York, where hospitals are at a tipping point and getting pummelled by patients, Governor Andrew Cuomo says the economy shouldn't be restarted "at the cost of human life" and that he's developing a plan that "lets younger people get back to work".

The question is when they should do it.

Mr Trump, guided by a group of hedge fund and private equity titans, wants the country up and running again by Easter, though public health officials warn that's too soon for a virus that's killed more than 18,400 and infected at least 400,000 worldwide.


Interactive: How coronavirus is spreading across the world
Only companies with less than 500 employees are required to provide paid sick leave for workers out with Covid-19.

Economists from Northwestern University calculated that keeping social distancing practices in place until cases decline could save 600,000 lives nationwide.

Mr Lloyd Blankfein, who ran Goldman Sachs Group until 2018, helped kickstart the calls to get back to work on Sunday when he tweeted that "extreme measures to flatten the virus 'curve'" were sensible "for a time" but could crush the economy: "Within a very few weeks let those with a lower risk to the disease return to work."

His longtime deputy, Mr Gary Cohn, who left the bank to become Mr Trump's top economic adviser, asked if it was time "to start discussing the need for a date when the economy can turn back on".

Without clarity, businesses "will assume the worst", he said.

Mr Tilman Fertitta, owner of Golden Nugget casinos and Bubba Gump Shrimp, is calling on authorities to let businesses reopen at limited capacity in a couple of weeks to avoid a long economic disaster.

Mr Fertitta, who also owns the Houston Rockets and is worth US$3.2 billion (S$4.63 billion), said his company is "doing basically no business".

His demand goes against a school of thought that says prematurely reopening the economy could kill more people and eventually cause more economic harm.

Billionaires and other members of the elite have the luxury of social distancing while making money.

The ones who want workers back in their jobs say they're aiming to stop millions from suffering for years and falling further into debt.

Delivery drivers face pandemic without sick pay, insurance, sanitizer

Farm-to-door deliveries increase amid coronavirus

Officials are trying to accomplish that by restricting foreclosures and allowing Americans to defer mortgage payments.

"It's outrageous," said Mr Robert Reich, who was labour secretary for President Bill Clinton and now studies public policy at the University of California, Berkeley.

"It is absolutely necessary to shut down the economy so that millions of people don't die. For the privileged among us to fail to see that and to give the economy precedence over this public health emergency is morally reprehensible."

The push to restart the economy makes a certain amount of sense to rich people, according to Mr Reich, because they have come to expect disproportionate gains as the system's top winners.

"The one flaw in their logic this time is that the coronavirus doesn't understand class," he added. "The more people are in infected, the more likely it is that Blankfein and other billionaires will become infected as well."

Mr Jim Conway was a server in an Olive Garden in Pennsylvania until it closed about two weeks ago. He's been out of work and isn't getting paid while his application for unemployment benefits gets processed.

"Being an older worker, I'm in no hurry to go back in the middle of an epidemic," Mr Conway, 63, said.

"Being a server means you're in contact with lots of different people, and puts you at bigger risk of getting infected. I'm kind of glad they closed when they did."

He wants the outbreak under control before the restaurant reopens, but worries that politicians and businesses tend to focus on their bottom line before people like him.

"They've never really had our interests at heart," he said. "And now would be a weird time to start."

One of those government officials, Texas Lieutenant-Governor Dan Patrick, said on Fox News that Americans should get back to work and let "grandparents" take care of themselves.

Mr Dick Kovacevich, who ran Wells Fargo & Co until 2007, wants to see healthy workers below about 55 or so to return to work late next month if the outbreak is under control.

"We'll gradually bring those people back and see what happens. Some of them will get sick, some may even die, I don't know," said Mr Kovacevich, who was also the bank's chairman until 2009.

"Do you want to suffer more economically or take some risk that you'll get flu-like symptoms and a flu-like experience? Do you want to take an economic risk or a health risk? You get to choose."

Mr Mark Cuban, who owns the Dallas Mavericks, wants Americans to listen to epidemiologists instead.

"Ignore anything someone like me might say," Mr Cuban wrote in an e-mail. "Lives are at stake."

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/unite...loyees-arent-so
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/26/20 12:42 AM
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/24/dhs-pandemic-coronavirus-146884

CORONAVIRUS

DHS wound down pandemic models before coronavirus struck
A vital modeling program was sidelined amid a bureaucratic battle, former officials say, leaving U.S. less prepared to face the virus.

Department of Homeland Security
From at least 2005 to 2017, an office inside DHS produced detailed analyses of what would happen to everything from transportation systems to hospitals if a pandemic hit the United States. | Alex Wong/Getty Images

By DANIEL LIPPMAN

03/24/2020 08:47 PM EDT




The Department of Homeland Security stopped updating its annual models of the havoc that pandemics would wreak on America’s critical infrastructure in 2017, according to current and former DHS officials with direct knowledge of the matter.

From at least 2005 to 2017, an office inside DHS, in tandem with analysts and supercomputers at several national laboratories, produced detailed analyses of what would happen to everything from transportation systems to hospitals if a pandemic hit the United States.



But the work abruptly stopped in 2017 amid a bureaucratic dispute over its value, two of the former officials said, leaving the department flat-footed as it seeks to stay ahead of the impact the COVID-19 outbreak is having on vast swaths of the U.S. economy. Officials at other agencies have requested some of the reports from the pandemic modeling unit at DHS in recent days, only to find the information they needed scattered or hard to find quickly.


And while department leaders dispute that, others say the confusion is just the latest example of the Trump administration’s struggle to respond to an outbreak that has sickened more than 50,000 Americans and threatens to overwhelm hospitals and other health care providers. Officials are now scrambling to secure enough masks, respirators and ventilators to meet the rapidly exploding need. Doctors and nurses are reusing their protective gear as supplies dwindle; governors are begging the administration for federal help that has been slow to arrive.

The models — primarily computer simulations that seek to anticipate the interaction of millions of Americans and U.S. infrastructure systems — were overseen by the National Infrastructure Simulation and Analysis Center, a program that has been run by a shifting alphabet soup of agencies within DHS, reflecting the continual bureaucratic reshuffling that has plagued the department since its inception in 2002.

Some of the modeling unit’s analyses looked at what would happen if a large portion of the U.S. workforce — say, 40 percent — got sick or couldn’t show up at work to maintain and operate key aspects of the national infrastructure, such as the systems that keep planes flying safely. The reports were meant to guide policymakers toward areas that would demand their attention in the event of an outbreak.



One 2015 DHS report, based partly on data produced by NISAC, warned that America’s public and private health systems might “experience significant shortages in vaccines, antivirals, pharmaceuticals needed to treat secondary infections and complications, personal protective equipment (PPE), and medical equipment, including ventilators.”

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Juliette Kayyem, a senior DHS official in the Obama administration, praised the quality of the NISAC reports she received when she was at the department, and criticized DHS for being “singularly focused on border enforcement” under Trump at the expense of properly planning for other threats, like a pandemic.

“We should not be surprised that a department that has for the last 3½ years viewed itself solely as a border enforcement agency seems ill-equipped to address a much greater threat to the homeland,” she said.

In recent days, as the government raced to address the growing demands, officials at the Department of Health and Human Services asked their counterparts at DHS to dig up some of the old reports and analyses, according to two former DHS officials. The request came from within HHS’ Office of the Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response, which works to ensure that the country has enough medical equipment and drugs to deal with public health emergencies and everyday health needs.

But Homeland Security officials initially had trouble finding some documents related to planning for a pandemic, including 2007 and 2009 pandemic reports, as well as a report produced for a 2014 exercise held by senior policymakers, according to the former officials — although some were eventually found and put in a ZIP file sent to HHS.

“Nobody even knew where any of the documents were anymore,” one of the former officials said. “It’s really just a source of frustration.”

The former DHS officials said if the pandemic models had been maintained properly, the administration might have had an earlier understanding of where shortages might occur, and acted accordingly to address them.

“A lot of what we’re doing now is shooting in the dark, and there’s going to be secondary impacts to infrastructure that are going to be felt in part because we didn’t maintain these models,” said one of the former DHS officials. “Our ability to potentially foresee where the impacts are or may manifest is a result of the fact that we don’t have the capabilities anymore.”

The pandemic models emerged as part of a broader shift in the federal government’s thinking after Hurricane Katrina, when DHS and FEMA came under heavy criticism for their response to the disaster.

With those searing lessons still fresh, DHS broadened its focus from a narrow set of issues — primarily terrorist attacks within the United States — to preventing and preparing for all types of emergency events. The department began modeling and analyzing how severe events, including a pandemic, could affect critical infrastructure and hit supply chains.

Some of the predictions in the July 2015 DHS report were eerily prescient about the kinds of issues that the U.S. has faced in recent weeks because of the coronavirus; the report said that “a severe influenza pandemic could overwhelm the Healthcare and Public Health Sector in as little as 3-6 weeks” and warned that healthcare facilities in cities could be swamped.

The report also warned that basic medical supplies for emergency services could be at risk because they’re dependent on “just-in-time” deliveries of health care supplies, and a big increase in demand during a pandemic would make it harder for them to get what they need.

Much of the blame for the switch in focus at DHS, according to two of the former officials, falls on longtime DHS employee Robert Hanson, who became division director of prioritization and modeling at the department’s Office of Cyber and Infrastructure Analysis in May 2016.



When he was elevated to that job, Hanson wanted to focus more on visualizations of events like hurricanes and “going down rabbit holes that really didn’t need to be done,” according to one of the former officials. He also wanted to focus more on elections and cybersecurity because “cyber is the magic word to attract money,” said the other former official.



“They’ve allowed a lot of capability to decay, including the pandemic models and transportation models and a whole bunch of other stuff in favor of chasing the soccer ball on different cyber things,” including trying to use machine learning and AI in work on cybersecurity, this person said.

In an interview, Hanson acknowledged reallocating some funding away from pandemic modeling to other topics of research because he had “been given direction by my leadership at the time to reprioritize a lot of the projects,” and he agreed it was necessary. He also said when he took over the modeling program, it was considered “ineffective” by DHS leadership and by executive branch overseers.

Hanson thought, too, that pandemic modeling was best done by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the former DHS officials said, although the CDC’s mandate is different and researchers there don’t focus on how a pandemic could affect infrastructure not related to health care.

After an uprising by staff last year who complained about what they called his abusive management style and lack of leadership, Hanson was removed as the assistant director of analysis at the National Risk Management Center, OCIA’s successor organization, according to the two former DHS officials. Hanson and his deputy, Carmen Zapata, were detailed elsewhere within DHS.

Explaining his departure, Hanson said he “had made such fundamental changes to the program that some of the staff were unhappy with me and were going to see me as an object of ire so I decided to leave.”

NISAC, the DHS office that oversaw the models, began as a partnership between the Los Alamos and Sandia national laboratories in 1999 but in 2003 was folded into DHS by the USA Patriot Act and in 2014 put under OCIA, which has listed analyzing “pandemic influenza” as a top priority.

The program’s costs were considerable: The government had to regularly purchase data sets to keep the models current, while also paying for coding, operations and maintenance, along with the original development costs. From six and 10 people at Los Alamos were focused on pandemics and a total of 60 to 70 people at DHS and the national labs had some role in the models, according to one of the former officials.

Beginning under the George W. Bush administration, all critical infrastructure in the U.S. was segregated into different categories, which now comprise 16 sectors. DHS was made a lead agency for 10 of them, including IT, communications, critical manufacturing and commercial facilities.

The DHS models were designed to look at the impacts of a pandemic on the different sectors within the department’s bailiwick, as well as other sectors that touched on homeland security. For instance, one report NISAC worked on for a table-top exercise looked at how to combat a hypothetical epidemic in Southeast Asia, what travel restrictions to put in place and how to design social distancing to stop the epidemic inside the United States.




The simulations the modeling unit produced also helped the department understand the impact a pandemic might have on its own workforce. More than 9,700 DHS employees are quarantined or self-monitoring because of the virus, and 73 employees were confirmed or presumed COVID-19 positive as of Monday, according to a person familiar with the numbers.


The modeling unit’s work also addressed real-life impacts to infrastructure due to smaller-scale outbreaks, including the H5N1 bird flu in 2007, H1N1 in 2009, Ebola in 2014 and the Zika virus in early 2016.

During the Ebola outbreak, the Obama White House asked the unit to support its decision-making on deliberations about banning travel from certain countries based on risk, whether to close any borders and how to spend money on airport screening, according to one of the former DHS officials.

Reports based on the models were usually emailed to DHS leadership and sometimes officials in the White House. There were also about 20,000 people on the distribution list, including a wide group of critical infrastructure owner-operators and state officials. Some of the papers ran to 150 pages.

It wouldn’t be easy for DHS to rebuild its capacity to model pandemics, given the brain drain within the department: Many of the people who worked on the models have now scattered across the government or left government service altogether, one of the former officials said.

“There’s no institutional memory whatsoever,” this person said.

NISAC was “really, really good” about studying the impacts of pandemics, a former Trump official said, but there’s been “so much turnover that people just don’t know that [their work] exists and there’s been very poor work to catalogue and keep lessons learned.”

Hanson insisted that DHS maintained the capability at Pacific Northwest National Laboratory and that the system is still being used today by DHS to inform decisions on the coronavirus across the federal government, but he couldn’t recall the full name of the PNNL staffer he said was in charge of the model now.

Meanwhile, current officials are left essentially to reinvent the wheel in the middle of a pandemic that has already claimed more than 600 American lives.

Bob Kolasky, director of the National Risk Management Center, OCIA’s successor organization within DHS’s Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency, recently told employees to write a plan for how to respond to the virus by early this week, but some employees aren’t confident that any plan they come up with will actually be used, according to one of the former DHS officials.

Asked for comment, Kolasky said his division of DHS “has been out front and actively working with partners to provide guidance as they make risk-based decisions during the COVID 19 response. The National Risk Management Center continues to use NISAC, along with other government and private sector resources, to provide valuable insight and assessments to our stakeholders.”

“I’ve heard people say it’s a black swan. It’s not a black swan,” said one of the former DHS officials. “This is the whitest of white swans. This was absolutely inevitable, and the fact is we didn’t even maintain the capacity that we had or even the records of what we had done so that information could be quickly located and turned over to people who are making the critical operations right now.”

Betsy Woodruff Swan contributed to this report.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 contin - 03/26/20 05:56 AM
[img]https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t...amp;oe=5EA1082F[/img]
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 06:27 AM
Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
I'm afraid to see just how much utterly useless and pointless crap was stuffed into this thing.



Here's one: Ballot Harvesting




Hans von Spakovsky: Pelosi’s Coronavirus Plan Would Make Election Fraud Easier


Robert Kraychik

25 Mar 2020


House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) sought to insert legislative measures into a coronavirus relief bill to “make it easier to cheat” in elections, explained Hans von Spakovsky, manager of the Heritage Foundation’s Election Law Reform Initiative and a senior legal fellow of the Meese Center for Legal and Judicial Studies, on Tuesday’s edition of SiriusXM’s Breitbart News Tonight with host Rebecca Mansour and special guest host John Hayward.

Von Spakovsky said, “It’s an attempt to use the coronavirus and the medical crisis we face to force all these changes and election laws the left has been pushing for quite a while, in fact, they took all these provisions out of H.R.1 — which is the first bill the Democrats introduced in the House after they took over when they won the 2018 election, and these rules were all intended to basically make it easier to manipulate elections, and frankly, make it easier to cheat, and they have absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with helping the country deal with the coronavirus.”


https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2020/03/...rU0-4cU1xJjCMb4
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 01:28 PM
So I was listening to the news about the US Government's (richest country in the world) one time $1200 checks being sent out help Americans during the pandemic... a canadian poster on FB was kind enough to remind me that Canada (not the richest country in the world) announced $2000 checks for 4 months two weeks ago... Is Canada the Venezuela of the north? How can they do socialized medicine and larger checks? I guess a balanced blend of capitalism and socialism (like social democrats pitch) makes for a better social safety net and pandemic response. Or maybe it's the leaders...
Posted By: Damanshot Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 01:37 PM
Originally Posted By: fishtheice
Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
I'm afraid to see just how much utterly useless and pointless crap was stuffed into this thing.



Here's one: Ballot Harvesting




Hans von Spakovsky: Pelosi’s Coronavirus Plan Would Make Election Fraud Easier


Robert Kraychik

25 Mar 2020


House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) sought to insert legislative measures into a coronavirus relief bill to “make it easier to cheat” in elections, explained Hans von Spakovsky, manager of the Heritage Foundation’s Election Law Reform Initiative and a senior legal fellow of the Meese Center for Legal and Judicial Studies, on Tuesday’s edition of SiriusXM’s Breitbart News Tonight with host Rebecca Mansour and special guest host John Hayward.

Von Spakovsky said, “It’s an attempt to use the coronavirus and the medical crisis we face to force all these changes and election laws the left has been pushing for quite a while, in fact, they took all these provisions out of H.R.1 — which is the first bill the Democrats introduced in the House after they took over when they won the 2018 election, and these rules were all intended to basically make it easier to manipulate elections, and frankly, make it easier to cheat, and they have absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with helping the country deal with the coronavirus.”


https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2020/03/...rU0-4cU1xJjCMb4


Worse than Gerrymandering? Worse than Voter suppression? Things that the Republicans are so good at.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 01:46 PM
Don't even bother talking about it. IT's pure Breitbart Trumpian alt-right BS.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 01:52 PM
Originally Posted By: Damanshot


Worse than Gerrymandering? Worse than Voter suppression? Things that the Republicans are so good at.


You know which party is the party to have ACTUALLY been caught and prosecuted for voter fraud/tampering? Yep - the one that talks about this as if it's a massive problem - the one that set up a oversight committee to investigate ... and found basically NADA.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 02:41 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Or maybe it's the leaders...


Ding, ding, ding
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:35 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
So I was listening to the news about the US Government's (richest country in the world) one time $1200 checks being sent out help Americans during the pandemic... a canadian poster on FB was kind enough to remind me that Canada (not the richest country in the world) announced $2000 checks for 4 months two weeks ago... Is Canada the Venezuela of the north? How can they do socialized medicine and larger checks? I guess a balanced blend of capitalism and socialism (like social democrats pitch) makes for a better social safety net and pandemic response. Or maybe it's the leaders...


That system does not help the rich get richer
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:42 PM
America's richest 400 families now pay a lower tax rate than the middle class

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/americas-ri...e-middle-class/

Mmmmm, hmmmm.
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:44 PM
Hey has everyone used the postcards for filing their taxes?
Great work giving tax cuts to the rich and providing simple card filing for everyone.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:47 PM
j/c

Warren County mega church still holds services

WARREN COUNTY, Ohio (WKEF/ WRGT) -- A Warren County mega church held services Wednesday night despite Ohio’s stay-at-home order banning large gatherings.

As we all work to stop the spread of COVID-19 many churches in the state are streaming their services online.

Solid Rock Church in Monroe is one of them, but unlike most churches Solid Rock is also holding service as usual.

Although the stay-at-home order doesn’t force religious organizations to close, Gov. Mike DeWine stressed that people coming together right now is dangerous.

However, many church-goers said they feel safe.

“I think that it honors God to trust him and to continue to meet and pray and trust that he's our healer, and he'll protect us,” said Jeremiah York, who has visited the church in the past.

The church released a statement on its website about continuing services.

We at Solid Rock Church share everyone’s concern to help keep people safe. The First Amendment of our Constitution guarantees freedom concerning religion, expression, and assembly. It specifically forbids congress from restricting an individual’s religious practices. Therefore, the government ban on large gatherings does not apply to religious worship.

There is no pressure from Solid Rock Church to require anyone to come to our services. We are respectful of every individual’s right to choose either to come to our service or to watch online.

We do believe that it is important for our doors to remain open for whomever to come to worship and pray during this time of great challenge in our country.

But many on social media are outraged by the church's choice.

One person wrote, “I’ll be praying you people wake up and realize you are putting everyone at risk.“

Another commented, “Read your Bible and pray from your own home."

York said he thinks the faithful thing to do is not be afraid.

“Trust God and just use wisdom,” said York.

The Warren County prosecutor made clear the church can’t face any fines because it’s exempt from the mass gathering order.

https://dayton247now.com/news/coronavirus/warren-county-mega-church-still-holds-service

Brings a whole new meaning to, "Paying my bills is killing me!"
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:50 PM
Do these people realize one of the biggest first outbreaks in the US came from a synagogue? The trump virus doesnt believe in god.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:55 PM
Originally Posted By: BADdog
Do these people realize one of the biggest first outbreaks in the US came from a synagogue? The trump virus doesnt believe in god.


The Trump virus. Shame on you! Take the side of China over our President. The virus came from China. China with held information from the rest of the world to attempt to hide the issue. Instead caused this issue to get out of hand.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 03:56 PM
Originally Posted By: Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted By: BADdog
Do these people realize one of the biggest first outbreaks in the US came from a synagogue? The trump virus doesnt believe in god.


The Trump virus. Shame on you! Take the side of China over our President. The virus came from China. China with held information from the rest of the world to attempt to hide the issue. Instead caused this issue to get out of hand.


^triggered.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 04:00 PM
j/c

I'm An ER Doctor In NYC. Trump's Coronavirus Plan Isn't Just Dangerous, It's Deadly.

Dear Mr. President,

I am an emergency medicine resident physician in one of the biggest hospital systems in New York City, the epicenter of the COVID-19 pandemic in the United States. In the past several weeks, I have taken care of countless patients with COVID-19 ― some who didn’t seem so sick and some blue in the face and gasping for air 70 times a minute. I have put my face inches from theirs and inserted breathing tubes into their trachea, putting myself and everyone else in the room at exponentially higher risk of contracting this disease.

As I’ve sat in a room full of coughing patients for 60 hours a week, I have worried about my own safety now and in the coming months as this pandemic gets worse and our completely inadequate supply of personal protective equipment rapidly disappears. There is a major shortage of face masks, along with other supplies, across the country and without them, it can be next to impossible to keep health care workers safe and working to support the increasing number of patients who are arriving at our hospital and clinic doors.

I have sent some not-so-sick patients home and I have seen some patients die right in front of my eyes. I have spoken on the phone to the sobbing mother of a young man admitted to the intensive care unit, and told her, “No, you are not allowed to enter the hospital to see your critically ill son because we are not letting family members into the hospital during this pandemic.” To say that I have experienced countless heartbreaking moments over the past several weeks would be an understatement.

In the next couple of days or weeks, we will run out of hospital beds and ventilators. The number of critically ill COVID-19 patients who come to my hospital seems to double every day. If things continue this way, I will soon be forced to make decisions about who deserves a shot at life and who I will allow to die, and that is an unthinkable thing to have to consider, much less do.

Tell me ― when there is only one ventilator available, should it go to the young nurse or the elderly woman with multiple comorbidities who has an advanced directive that says “do not intubate/do not resuscitate”? How about the single mother of three? Or the deeply respected emergency medicine attending doctor I worked with last week? How about the middle-aged man with some medical comorbidities and corny jokes who reminds me of my father ― or is my father? Or maybe the person in prison for rape? How about the person of color in jail for marijuana possession? How about a beloved and wealthy celebrity? How about the homeless person with alcohol use disorder who spits on my fellow medical professionals and me when we try to help? How about the homeless person who lives on my street corner and smiles at me every day and says “God bless you”? It’s not so easy choose, is it?

This past week, between 12-hour shifts working in the emergency department and the newly created COVID respiratory unit, I have done everything I can think of to stop that nightmare scenario from arriving. I have posted on social media begging my friends and family to stay home. I have signed countless petitions and contacted my local government pleading for more personal protective equipment and ventilators. If I learn of other things I can do, I will do those, too.

My governor, Andrew Cuomo, has tirelessly worked to obtain more personal protective equipment and ventilators. He has begged you to nationalize the effort to acquire medical supplies and you have denied him. He’s begged for citizens to stay home and, while some are listening, many are not and if they don’t, it will be disastrous. But there’s only so much the governor ― or any of us ― can do alone. At this point, there may be only so much we can do together. But we must try.

On Tuesday you told Fox News you would “ love to have the country opened up and raring to go by Easter.” You said you chose Easter because, “you will have packed churches all over our country, I think it would be a beautiful time and it is just about the timeline that I think is right.” The thought of this makes me nauseous. If we do that, exponentially more people will get this disease, our hospital system will not have the capacity to handle it, and health care professionals like me will have to let countless people die while continuing to put our own lives ― and possibly the lives of the people we love ― at risk.

When we run out of ventilators ― and we will if we lift the social distancing restrictions that are in place and this pandemic continues to spread as it already has ― I will not be ready to make these decisions about who deserves to live and who deserves to die. When those moments come, I do not know how I will be able to sleep at night. Will you? Now is not the time to let our guards down.

You have the power to be remembered as someone who did the right thing. I beg you to help me and other health care workers save countless lives ― possibly including our own ― so that we as a nation don’t have to suffer the unthinkable devastation looming on the horizon. I beg you to take this pandemic more seriously and I am begging you to do it now.

Sincerely,

Rachel Sobolev, MD

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/new-york-...-183638991.html
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 04:49 PM
j/c

Just a reminder to all of the young people complaining about staying indoors and missing their spring breaks.

People your age had something to look forward to as well from 1964 to 1973. Being drafted and sent to Vietnam.

You think you have to sacrifice? Shut the hell up!
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 04:58 PM
https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/new-york-...-183638991.html

A great read. Something that none of us can really argue with or dismiss... but no doubt the Trump faithful will try.

As for the "suffering" and to put it into perspective - Anne Frank and 7 others hid for 2 years in a 450 sq ft living space. Anyone complaining in today's day and age needs a new perspective on what a challenge is.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 05:04 PM
j/c

Texas Lt. Governor: Old People Should Volunteer to Die to Save the Economy

According to Dan Patrick “lots of grandparents” are willing to sacrifice themselves for the cause.

After doing a brief, weeklong impression of a semiresponsible human being, on Monday, Donald Trump got back to the business of being a reckless, anti-science moron, floating the idea that we should end this social-distancing business sooner rather than later in order to “save” the economy from the coronavirus. (We’re using scare quotes here because apparently the president hasn’t considered the fact that if hundreds of thousands or even millions of Americans die, the economy will be in worse shape than it is now.) Following his National Economic Council chairman’s declaration that “we’re gonna have to make some difficult trade-offs,” i.e. we’re going to have to let some people die so the stock market can live, Trump told reporters during an evening press conference that while the death toll is “bad,” and “the numbers are going to increase with time,” we’re “going to be opening our country up for business, because our country was meant to be open.“ That suggestion was obviously horrifying to people who still take the word of health experts over that of a brainless carnival barker and who understand that extreme social distancing needs to last for at least several months if not longer. One person who thought it was downright inspired? Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick, who is of the opinion that old people, i.e. those most at risk, should volunteer to die to save the economy.

Appearing on Fox News, Patrick told Tucker Carlson, “No one reached out to me and said, ‘As a senior citizen, are you willing to take a chance on your survival in exchange for keeping the America that all America loves for your children and grandchildren?’” But if they had? “If that is the exchange, I’m all in,” Patrick said. He continued: “That doesn’t make me noble or brave or anything like that. I just think there are lots of grandparents out there in this country, like me, I have six grandchildren, that what we all care about and what we love more than anything are those children. And I want to live smart and see through this, but I don’t want the whole country to be sacrificed…I’ve talked to hundreds of people, Tucker, and just in the last week, making calls all the time, and everyone says pretty much the same thing. That we can’t lose our whole country, we’re having an economic collapse. I’m also a small businessman, I understand it. And I talk with businesspeople all the time, Tucker. My heart is lifted tonight by what I heard the president say because we can do more than one thing at a time, we can do two things. So my message is let’s get back to work, let’s get back to living. Let’s be smart about it and those of us who are 70-plus, we’ll take care of ourselves. But don’t sacrifice the country, don’t do that, don’t ruin this great America.”

At this point, Tucker Carlson, who, alarmingly, could be our only hope, asked, “So you’re basically saying that this disease could take your life but that’s not the scariest thing to you, there’s something that could be worse than dying?” Put in those terms, Patrick appeared momentarily taken aback but responded, “Yeah.”

Elsewhere in sociopathic responses to the COVID-19 crisis, during last night’s press conference Trump tried a spin on his previous “the flu is so much worse” take, telling reporters, “You look at automobile accidents. Which are far greater than any numbers we’re talking about. That doesn’t mean we’re going to tell everybody no more driving of cars.” He also acknowledged that actual doctors are in disagreement with his proposal to “open up the country for business” in short order, but screw those guys.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/03/dan-patrick-coronavirus-grandparents
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 05:13 PM
Mississippi governor says state won't be a dictatorship on coronavirus

Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves (R) said in a Twitter post Wednesday that he rejects "dictatorship models like China," a day after he signed an executive order in response to the novel coronavirus.

Details: Reeves' order Tuesday aims to limit people's physical interactions, but the Jackson Free Press notes it "seems to declare that most types of businesses in Mississippi are 'essential' and thus exempt from social-distancing requirements," including public and private industries and institutions. The move caused confusion as to whether it overrides stay-at-home orders issued by local authorities, Mississippi Today reports.

What he's saying: "We're following our experts and I’ve spent many sleepless nights praying for wisdom in this unprecedented time," Reeves tweeted.

Context: Reeves made the comments in response to a segment on "The Rachel Maddow Show" Tuesday on Mississippi not enacting a stay-at-home order, and a subsequent post of a video on MSNBC's website Tuesday, headlined: "Mississippi governor untroubled by COVID crises in neighboring states." Reeves called the report a "dangerous lie."

The big picture: Mississippi had confirmed 377 cases and five deaths from the virus Wednesday, per the state health department.

21 state governors, mostly Democrats, had issued stay-at-home orders by Wednesday night.

https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-missis...YLKakiS9AjWT93c

Murica!
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 05:59 PM
It's all real...no BS!

Ballot Fraud, American-Style ... and Its Bitter Harvests
By Eric Eggers, RealClearInvestigations


December 13, 2018



America's electoral obsession isn't Russian meddling anymore. It's ballot-harvesting, a long-disputed practice implicated in fraud that's come to the fore with the nationwide embrace of absentee voting in recent years -- and especially in last month's midterms.
Absentee ballot: Source of empowerment, and mischief.
AP Photo/Alan Diaz

With ballot-harvesting, paper votes are collected by intermediaries who deliver them to polling officials, presumably increasing voter turnout but also creating opportunities for mischief.

The latter is suspected in North Carolina, where uncharacteristic Democratic charges of vote fraud prompted an investigation into whether Republican-paid political operatives illegally collected and possibly stole absentee ballots in a still-undecided congressional race. A national spotlight was shone by The New York Times, which, like Democrats, often minimizes vote fraud; it flooded the zone in this case, assigning five reporters to a single story.

In California, by contrast, Democrats exulted as they credited a quietly passed 2016 law legalizing ballot-harvesting with their recent sweep of House seats in the former Republican stronghold of Orange County, thereby helping them win control of the House.

In that case, it was Republican eyebrows that were arched. Speaker Paul Ryan said what happened in California “defies logic.”

In Orange County, an estimated 250,000 harvested ballots were reportedly dropped off on Election Day alone. County Republican Chairman Fred Whitaker claimed the 2016 law "directly caused the switch from being ahead on election night to losing two weeks later.”

One interaction caught by a Santa Clarita family’s doorbell camera suggested how harvesting can work in practice. A harvester, identifying herself as Lulu, asks for Brandi, and says she is there to collect her ballot, explaining that there is “this new service, but only to, like, people who are supporting the Democratic Party.”

However, there is no evidence that ballots were marked or discarded by those harvesting the ballots, as is alleged in North Carolina.

Election officials there have refused to certify Republican Mark Harris’s victory over Democrat Dan McReady in the state’s 9th Congressional District, and Rep. Gerry Connolly of Virginia, a Democratic member of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, is seeking an emergency hearing into possible voter fraud in that race.

"Votes have been stolen by preying on senior and minority voters, and now a cloud of doubt and suspicion hangs over this election result," Connolly said.
Leslie McCrae Dowless Jr.: North Carolina vote man.
Travis Long/The News & Observer via AP

North Carolina absentee ballots require a “witness,” or second signature, to verify the voter’s identity. In Republican-heavy Bladen County, the same people were signing as witnesses for numerous absentee ballots, a telltale sign that they were being “harvested.”

In fact, one TV station interviewed a harvester who claimed she was paid by Leslie McCrae Dowless Jr., a local political operative, between $75 and $100 a week to pick up completed absentee ballots. Dowless has worked for numerous North Carolina politicians of both political parties.

Dowless’s connection to Harris’s campaign, which paid Harris’s employer $428,000 for administrative, staff and grassroots services, is prompting a national look at ballot harvesting, which is considered election fraud because North Carolina law specifically prohibits anyone from collecting ballots.

But evidence is emerging that Dowless wasn’t the only one harvesting in the Tar Heel State.

WBTV, a Charlotte station, reviewed 796 official ballot envelopes of votes cast in Bladen County. The review identified 110 that were signed by two women who are listed as having been paid by a PAC connected to the North Carolina Democratic Party.

North Carolina is but one example of dubious ballot-harvesting nationwide. The practice is so common, harvesters even have their own region-specific names. In Florida, they’re known as “boleteros.” In Texas, they’re called "politiqueras."
Penny Hubbard (left): Delayed win overruled.
Christian Gooden/St. Louis Post-Dispatch via AP

In Missouri, Democratic state Rep. Penny Hubbard, a member of a St. Louis political dynasty known for ballot harvesting, was challenged and ultimately ousted in 2016 by progressive Bruce Franks, a protester in the Ferguson unrest. Absentee-ballot handling irregularities had handed her a delayed 90-vote win, even though Franks won 53 percent of the vote on Election Day.

In Florida, a Palm Beach Post investigation into numerous 2016 primary races uncovered significant evidence of voter fraud by Democratic candidates, who pushed back on any criticism by claiming racial discrimination.

Three Democratic candidates, County Commissioner Mack Bernard, state Rep. Al Jacquet, and a candidate for state Senate, Bobby Powell, all ordered mail ballots on behalf of constituents, in many cases without those constituents’ knowledge. Then, they either filed out the ballots for them or had them fill out the ballots while the candidates were present in their homes. All three candidates would win on the strength of massive margins in absentee votes.
Mack Bernard: Hands-on assistance.
Florida House of Representatives/Wikimedia

One Boynton Beach couple told the Post that Bernard just showed up at their door one day in August. Joseph Cerfius, a blind Haitian man, said he didn’t even know who Bernard was, or that he was a candidate for office. But Bernard produced a ballot, filled it out on Cerfius’s behalf, then actually signed Cerfius’s name.

“I couldn’t sign because I can’t see,” Cerfius said. “I gave him my voting card number. That’s all I did. He wrote my name.”

With a presidential election looming in less than two years, and with the example of California fresh in mind, expect the fight over expanded voting rights to include pushes for legalized ballot harvesting.

States like Florida and Georgia, which both endured contested elections and lawsuits over absentee ballots last month, can anticipate the push to be tinged with racial undertones. The two states’ respective Democratic gubernatorial candidates, Andrew Gillum and Stacey Abrams, were both also their state’s first African-American nominees, and regularly alleged racial discrimination in any arguments advocating the counting of contested ballots.

(Florida currently allows volunteers to collect ballots, except in Miami-Dade County, which has a localized prohibition against anyone having more than two ballots on their person at once. Georgia prohibits the practice except if the voter is disabled.)

Only 16 states regulate ballot-harvesting at all, and their rules vary.

In Colorado, one of three states to conduct all elections entirely by mail-in ballots, third-party volunteers are allowed to collect up to 10 ballots, though critics have long alleged that the practice is ripe for exploitation.

In November, Montana voters passed a state referendum banning the collection of ballots by third parties. And Arizona’s 2016 ban against the practice, which had previously been linked to voter fraud in the state, was recently upheld by a federal appeals court, despite claims that it would disproportionately impact Latino voters who relied on third parties to help navigate the voting process.

Expect arguments and legal challenges to continue. The first presidential primary ballots will be cast in 14 months.

Eric Eggers directs research at the Government Accountability Institute and is the author of “Fraud: How the Left Plans to Steal the Next Election.”

https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/...r_harvests.html
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 06:00 PM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/new-york-...-183638991.html

A great read. Something that none of us can really argue with or dismiss... but no doubt the Trump faithful will try.

As for the "suffering" and to put it into perspective - Anne Frank and 7 others hid for 2 years in a 450 sq ft living space. Anyone complaining in today's day and age needs a new perspective on what a challenge is.


I toured the Anne Frank House in Amsterdam. It’s haunting. Her handwriting is still on the walls. Her doodlings too. It’s small. Like really really small. I could only imagine what her and her family endured.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 06:09 PM
Originally Posted By: fishtheice

Eric Eggers directs research at the Government Accountability Institute and is the author of “Fraud: How the Left Plans to Steal the Next Election.”


rofl

No agenda there!
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 11:29 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
j/c

Just a reminder to all of the young people complaining about staying indoors and missing their spring breaks.

People your age had something to look forward to as well from 1964 to 1973. Being drafted and sent to Vietnam.

You think you have to sacrifice? Shut the hell up!


I shared this post w/my family. Even my kids and my daughter's fiance laughed and said......."well, it's true."

Well done, Pit! thumbsup
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/26/20 11:55 PM
Quote:
December 13, 2018


Is this posted in support of that Erik Von Whatsizass Breitbart post for a day or two ago?

Game be weak, brah.
Step up, or step off.

insert long yawn here]
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:01 AM
I lost a dear friend today a life long NYC musician Guitar player.

Born and raised in NYC, Homeboy Steve Antonakos.
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:05 AM
Sorry, dawg.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:16 AM
Originally Posted By: BADdog
I lost a dear friend today a life long NYC musician Guitar player.

Born and raised in NYC, Homeboy Steve Antonakos.


So sorry to hear this.
I will find his music and pay tribute.

all my bes, BAD.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:45 AM
Originally Posted By: BADdog
I lost a dear friend today a life long NYC musician Guitar player.

Born and raised in NYC, Homeboy Steve Antonakos.
Sorry for your loss. Have to ask if it was the virus since you posted it in here.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:07 AM
rofl
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:33 AM
Originally Posted By: Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted By: BADdog
Do these people realize one of the biggest first outbreaks in the US came from a synagogue? The trump virus doesnt believe in god.


The Trump virus. Shame on you! Take the side of China over our President. The virus came from China. China with held information from the rest of the world to attempt to hide the issue. Instead caused this issue to get out of hand.


1.We had a 4-month head start on this. Trump did nothing.

2. We had infectious disease experts IN PLACE at the end of the Obama admin. Experts who were called into service after H1N1 and Ebola. Experts who briefed the new admin. Experts who warned that a worldwide pandemic was going to happen within 2-3 years. Trump's lackeys (including CoS Spicer) napped during the meetings, blew the briefings off, laughed about it.

3. And then Trump fired the entire team, because he didn't think they were necessary. Just completely eliminated an entire department. The very department we now need. The department he's scrambling to replace as bodies are dropping daily. Here's his exact quote: "I'm a businessman. I hate to see people getting paid to do nothing."

4. Two months before this virus hit our shores, an official from the CDC tried to warn Trump of how behind we already were. Trump got pissed because the dude came to him with bad news, yelled at him- and threw him out of the Oval Office. Another lost opportunity to actually do something.

5. At the same time as that scene, he was headlining rallies, telling people it was a Dem hoax, a 'liberal plot, and making jokes about it- even though the headlines from around the world were already raising red flags.

6. He lied, and said America was ready to handle it, that there were only a few cases, and the numbers were going down.

7. He slow-walked ANY kind of official reaction, refused to invoke/enact the Defense Production Act of 1950, because he was more worried about the immediate stock market reaction than preparing his citizens to defend themselves from the worst pandemic in 100 years. A pandemic he was warned about ON HIS FIRST FKNG DAY IN OFFICE.

That's only the tip of his "Iceberg of Stupidity and Ineptitude." I could write for 30 more minutes, but don't need to. The point has been made.

So, if a certain number of Americans watch him slap nicknames on everything and anything, and decide to treat this situation exactly the same, I can understand it. And pretty much all those people would be able to do it without feeling as though they were somehow "fans of China." rolleyes

His stupidity, ineptitude and hubris has directly contributed to the depth of s# we're now in. In my opinion, it's just fine if some want to call this the TrumpVirus.

We'll just say it's a figure of speech- like Obamacare.

Fair is fair.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:36 AM
Originally Posted By: Jester
rofl


Dawg- wassup with the laugh?
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:39 AM
I would not go as far as saying it is a Trump virus. However, I will say that he has mishandled the situation. He failed as our leader.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:41 AM
Why Everyone Is Thanking Bernie Sanders Right Now — Even His Critics

Amid all the chaos brought by an accelerating coronavirus pandemic, many working families are losing incomes, people are losing jobs, or their paychecks are being drastically reduced. Congress has been tasked with passing a stimulus bill that could give Americans supplemental income to help them weather the crisis, but the majority Republican Senate has balked at providing too much monetary relief to working people. Enter Bernie Sanders, who at the end of Wednesday’s Senate discussion, took Republicans to task for their refusal to give working people the help they need. To no surprise, #ThankYouBernie began trending on Twitter shortly after his impassioned speech.

“Now I find that some of my Republican colleagues are very distressed,” Bernie said from the Senate floor. “They’re very upset that somebody who’s making 10, 12 bucks an hour might end up with a paycheck for four months, more than they received last week.”

Sanders was referring to the three Republican senators who threatened to delay passage of the stimulus bill over its temporary expansion of unemployment benefits, which they described as overly generous because they worried it would incentivize unemployment. “Meanwhile,” Sanders added, “these very same folks had no problem a couple years ago voting for a trillion dollars in tax breaks for billionaires and large profitable corporations.”



Experts are predicting that the unemployment rate could be as high as 20 percent in the next few months. This recession will disproportionately impact the working class and low-wage workers. “One month could wipe out 10 years of progress,” in the fight against inequality, Mark Muro, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, told The Atlantic. “A huge service-sector recession is coming, and we’re talking about more than 10 million jobs at risk that are often low-wage, low-benefit, or tip-based.”

The proposed $2 trillion dollar relief bill included one-time direct payments of up to $1,200 for individuals and $2,400 for couples, with $500 added for every child, and boosted unemployment insurance with an additional $600 per week for up to four months on top of what beneficiaries normally receive. Even this package pales in comparison to what a country like Denmark is doing. Denmark is freezing their economy and paying 75 percent of workers’ salaries, up to $3,288 per month, as long as companies keep them employed.

Sanders called out “some of [his] Republican friends” for having a “need to punish the poor and working people.” “When it comes to low-income workers, in the midst of a terrible crisis, maybe some of them earning or having more money than they previously made—oh my word, we gotta strip that out,” Sanders continued. “You see because poor people are down here, they don’t deserve, they don’t eat, they don’t pay rent, they don’t go to the doctor, they’re somehow inferior because they’re poor, gonna give them less.”

In the end, the stimulus bill passed unanimously — without Sen. Ben Sasse’s amendment that would punish poor people by capping unemployment at their previous wages, which was rejected. It will now go to the House for approval, though it seems Twitter users are taking matters into their own hands and thanking Bernie for making a final push to support low-income households during an unprecedented crisis.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/why-everyone-thanking-bernie-sanders-151432656.html

The kind of leadership we are going to need after the virus... Just saying.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:55 AM
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I would not go as far as saying it is a Trump virus. However, I will say that he has mishandled the situation. He failed as our leader.




You forgot to add Italy, Spain, France, and China.

And you forgot to mention that in 2015, gov. Cuomo decided to NOT listen to his people, when he had the chance to purchase 16,000 ventilators.

Can we just get rid of the politics of this situation, please? Everyone, stop blaming, start doing.

People want to blame this on Trump - not being prepared - yet ignore cuumo's asinine .........well, I'll just say he failed his state, and it shows, yet he's blaming trump.




Nah, too many people are trying to lay this on trump, while at the same time ignoring china haven known about it for months. Everyone wants to blame trump, while at the same time ignoring that Spain, Italy, Germany, etc are dealing with the same thing.


And at the same time, dem or rep, they can't pass a damn bill about ONLY this? Each side has to add in pork for what they want. Screw congress. Why should this coronavirus bail out have anything to do with voting, or plane exhaust, or any of the myriad b.s. things in it?
Posted By: Squires Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 01:59 AM
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:00 AM
I did not forget blank.

I was speaking of our country. Period.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:01 AM
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


He won't. His money is his money. The only way he would help is if he could mandate OTHERS money go to help.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:02 AM
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I did not forget blank.

I was speaking of our country. Period.


And, I should've put "j/c"


But my post still stands.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:04 AM
Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Originally Posted By: Jester
rofl


Dawg- wassup with the laugh?


I was laughing at him posting a 2 year old article as if it was from 2 days ago. Laughing with you, not at you my friend.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:01 AM
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.


Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:04 AM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


He won't. His money is his money. The only way he would help is if he could mandate OTHERS money go to help.


Didn't you just ask somebody to leave politics out of this?
Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:08 AM
Originally Posted By: Jester
Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Originally Posted By: Jester
rofl


Dawg- wassup with the laugh?


I was laughing at him posting a 2 year old article as if it was from 2 days ago. Laughing with you, not at you my friend.



The 2-year-old article was to show how long the Democrats have been ballot harvesting in NC and Calif. An item that had no business in the bill.

Two days ago, a pair of national disgraces, Pelosi and Schumer tried to sneak voting fraud (ballot harvesting) into the Coronavirus bill. People are looking for help and the Democrats are playing games...and you laugh! Shame rolleyes
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:09 AM
Oh, I stepped on the toes of your guy.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:10 AM
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


Why the hell should he do that? What an asinine question. He pays taxes just like us. BUT look at all the socialism handouts going on now that we are in an emergency that this country was not prepared for! We have a failing healthcare system, failing congress, and a failing president. But I will excuse Trump for his failings because he is not part of all that will need fixed going forward. You have people earning less than $15 an hour saving America's ass right now! They are putting their lives on the line yet they don't deserve liveable wages? many of them are paying for childcare out of pocket while they do it! Is that even remotely fair? I could go on all night... Our systems are broken and don't represent 'We the people' anymore. So we can either fix them or overthrow them, but change is coming and this pandemic is the wake up call bro.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:14 AM
Wait......you know nurses or doctors that are making less than $15 an hour?

And, what? People are having to pay for their kids care out of their own pocket? How dare that happen. YOU should be paying for their kids care. Certainly, the parents shouldn't be paying.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:14 AM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Oh, I stepped on the toes of your guy.


I'm good with you knocking dems, I just thought it was funny that you defended Trump then turned on Bernie two posts later. I hope this socialism package helps your small business/unemployment situation Arch. I don't think it will be fast, but I'm rooting for you.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:18 AM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Wait......you know nurses or doctors that are making less than $15 an hour?

And, what? People are having to pay for their kids care out of their own pocket? How dare that happen. YOU should be paying for their kids care. Certainly, the parents shouldn't be paying.


I'm talking about the service workers getting food for you and yours... but you knew that. I thanked a cashier for her service like a recognized hero Tuesday while shopping and it made her smile as if I made her day.

Yes they are paying out of the pittance that they earn and it's shameful when we are all depending on them this much.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:03 AM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.










My God.
I did not vote for this.
I voted precisely against this very thing.

Being right has never tasted so bitter.
Posted By: Squires Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:29 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


Why the hell should he do that?


Because other millionaires are donating money, Because Bernie claims to care about the middle class. I couldn't think of a better time for him to lead by example. But he doesn't. He expects everyone else to put up money so he doesn't have to. He's just another "do as I say, not as I do" politician.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:36 AM
Originally Posted By: Squires
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


Why the hell should he do that?


Because other millionaires are donating money, Because Bernie claims to care about the middle class. I couldn't think of a better time for him to lead by example. But he doesn't. He expects everyone else to put up money so he doesn't have to. He's just another "do as I say, not as I do" politician.

Yep... that's why he just raised 2 Million for the Covid-19 fight with an email to his followers. Such a lousy guy. GMAFB you just have a case of sour grapes over choosing the REAL lousy leader. President 'Let Them Eat Cake' Trump.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 10:35 AM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: Squires
When is Bernie going to give his own money to help Americans that are impacted by the virus?


He won't. His money is his money. The only way he would help is if he could mandate OTHERS money go to help.


Lol ....trump won’t even pay his owed taxes to America. Pffft. You guys crack me up. We all know who trump is.....trump is all about trump. Stop projecting trumps flaws on others.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 10:48 AM
Quote:
wants to blame trump, while at the same time ignoring that Spain, Italy, Germany, etc are dealing with the same thing.



Nobody is ignoring anything. The trump virus came from all these countries. And trump is taking Big credit for only shutting down travel from jina rofl while still allowing travel to and from europe. “trump virus”

It’s well known that the majority of “trump virus” cases we contracted in NH came from a guy who traveled from Italy.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:05 AM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.








Yeah dumbass, that’s why they are using the same masks and gowns for 3 or 4 shifts. That’s why the are splitting ventilator tubing to multiple patients. That’s why the are wearing garbage bags as protection.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:20 AM
Nobody ask for 40,000

Splitting vents. 15000 seems manageable if that’s the case. But 3000-4000 is ridiculous with the # of cases doubling every 2-3 days
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:29 AM
https://getusppe.org/
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:36 AM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.







This is beyond belief. There is no way that this man should be President of the United States of America. His money has made him wealthy and powerful, but his ethics reek of the common, petty, and ignorant. Shame!
Posted By: 1oldMutt Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:26 PM
It's obvious she's a journalist and not in supply chain management. I happen to be and what he's saying (not so eloquently) is not to order more PPE(or anything) than needed. We've had to really put the clamps on our wards and departments or they would take it all. They're NOT understanding that there are not seas of supplies at our disposal to give them to hoard. We are only allocated so much supply and when it's gone we wait until the next month if it doesn't go to a back order status. I'm seeing things from deep in the trenches and let me tell you...supplies are gold right now! Magnify that by all the hospitals scrambling to overstock across the world and that a huge amount of that got bogged down coming from China when they were at their worse. It's an issue! The president is not wrong in asking people to be frugal and respectful about their needs and usage. He may just want to let someone else Express it..Hang in there folks.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:26 PM
Maybe Trump was right.....and Mexico WILL pay for the wall? laugh

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati...ing/5085403002/

TUCSON, Ariz. — Protesters on the Mexican side of the border blocked the Mexico-bound lanes in the twin border cities of Ambos Nogales for several hours Wednesday to express their displeasure with the Mexican government's response to the coronavirus pandemic.

The protesters demanded greater controls and screenings on southbound traffic at the U.S.-Mexico border out of concern that travelers from the U.S. could import new cases of the coronavirus into Mexico.

Less than a dozen people wearing face masks and carrying signs used two of their vehicles for a blockade of the two southbound lanes at the DeConcini crossing, several hundred feet into the Mexican side of the border, video taken by Mexican media showed.

Some of the signs asked U.S. residents to "stay at home." Others called on Mexico President Andrés Manuel López Obrador to step up controls and restrictions along the U.S.-Mexico border to contain the spread of COVID-19.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 12:48 PM
Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Originally Posted By: Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted By: BADdog
Do these people realize one of the biggest first outbreaks in the US came from a synagogue? The trump virus doesnt believe in god.


The Trump virus. Shame on you! Take the side of China over our President. The virus came from China. China with held information from the rest of the world to attempt to hide the issue. Instead caused this issue to get out of hand.


1.We had a 4-month head start on this. Trump did nothing.

2. We had infectious disease experts IN PLACE at the end of the Obama admin. Experts who were called into service after H1N1 and Ebola. Experts who briefed the new admin. Experts who warned that a worldwide pandemic was going to happen within 2-3 years. Trump's lackeys (including CoS Spicer) napped during the meetings, blew the briefings off, laughed about it.

3. And then Trump fired the entire team, because he didn't think they were necessary. Just completely eliminated an entire department. The very department we now need. The department he's scrambling to replace as bodies are dropping daily. Here's his exact quote: "I'm a businessman. I hate to see people getting paid to do nothing."

4. Two months before this virus hit our shores, an official from the CDC tried to warn Trump of how behind we already were. Trump got pissed because the dude came to him with bad news, yelled at him- and threw him out of the Oval Office. Another lost opportunity to actually do something.

5. At the same time as that scene, he was headlining rallies, telling people it was a Dem hoax, a 'liberal plot, and making jokes about it- even though the headlines from around the world were already raising red flags.

6. He lied, and said America was ready to handle it, that there were only a few cases, and the numbers were going down.

7. He slow-walked ANY kind of official reaction, refused to invoke/enact the Defense Production Act of 1950, because he was more worried about the immediate stock market reaction than preparing his citizens to defend themselves from the worst pandemic in 100 years. A pandemic he was warned about ON HIS FIRST FKNG DAY IN OFFICE.

That's only the tip of his "Iceberg of Stupidity and Ineptitude." I could write for 30 more minutes, but don't need to. The point has been made.

So, if a certain number of Americans watch him slap nicknames on everything and anything, and decide to treat this situation exactly the same, I can understand it. And pretty much all those people would be able to do it without feeling as though they were somehow "fans of China." rolleyes

His stupidity, ineptitude and hubris has directly contributed to the depth of s# we're now in. In my opinion, it's just fine if some want to call this the TrumpVirus.

We'll just say it's a figure of speech- like Obamacare.

Fair is fair.


This is a post that should be locked and "stickied" to the top of any Corvid 19 discussion.

It's odd that 'Republicans' preach accountability until it puts one of their own in a shameful light - well not really, that's what they do. When Obama was in office for 8 straight years we had Fox and the right wing media do nothing but bash his every move ... it just so happened that most of the time it was over fake news about his religion, his birth certificate, his tan suit or bowing to foreign dignitaries. Trump gets in office and has a news worth scandal every 10 days gets trashed in the left wing media and they are branded the enemy of the people. Can't make this stuff up.

Covid 19 isn't political but Trump owns his response (lack of) and words downplaying this thing for 6 weeks and needs to be held accountable. That's not politicizing the issue. Neither is going after any and all politicians that dumped abnormal amounts of stock while publicly downplaying the impact of CV.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:15 PM
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 02:48 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg


God gifted us common sense. This man failed to use God’s gift.
May he Rest In Peace. May his family find peace but also learn from this.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:06 PM
Originally Posted By: 1oldMutt
It's obvious she's a journalist and not in supply chain management. I happen to be and what he's saying (not so eloquently) is not to order more PPE(or anything) than needed. We've had to really put the clamps on our wards and departments or they would take it all. They're NOT understanding that there are not seas of supplies at our disposal to give them to hoard. We are only allocated so much supply and when it's gone we wait until the next month if it doesn't go to a back order status. I'm seeing things from deep in the trenches and let me tell you...supplies are gold right now! Magnify that by all the hospitals scrambling to overstock across the world and that a huge amount of that got bogged down coming from China when they were at their worse. It's an issue! The president is not wrong in asking people to be frugal and respectful about their needs and usage. He may just want to let someone else Express it..Hang in there folks.


Yep, supplies are plentiful right now. Healthcare professionals are using, reusing and making makeshift PPE on the fly because everything is "gold."

Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:12 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg


Why do you and others, with your baloney posts being bad enough, need to add lies to the mix?

A Washington Post reporter has apologized for and deleted a tweet in which she falsely claimed President Trump called the coronavirus a "hoax" during a recent campaign rally.

"My apologies for quoting the president out of context," said Amber Phillips, a reporter for the Post's "The Fix" political blogging team. "As The Washington Post’s Fact Checker makes clear, he called Democrats politicizing coronavirus a hoax. I have deleted the incorrect tweet."
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/...onavirus-a-hoax

Let’s make this short and sweet. President Trump never called the virus a hoax. The writer is repeating a Democratic lie. Trump said some of the things the Democrats were saying about his administration’s response to the coronavirus outbreak was “their new hoax.”
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/opinion...rus-letter.html

Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:31 PM
Your post really doesn't "stand" at all. This is the political forum. This is the forum where people discuss politics. Trump has done a LOT to negatively impact our nations response to this virus.

There is a thread in Everything Else about this virus that excludes the political aspect if that's really what you're looking for. But you're coming into a forum expressly dedicated to political topics and discussions and suggesting people not talk about the political aspect of something that is engulfing our nation? Really?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:43 PM
j/c

Nurse dies in New York hospital where workers are reduced to using trash bags as protective medical gear

A nurse at Mount Sinai Hospital in New York died from COVID-19 after learning he was infected by the novel coronavirus almost two weeks ago. Protective medical gowns are in such short supply in the Mount Sinai system that some nurses have started to use Hefty-brand garbage bags instead, according to photos on social media.

The New York Post reported that Kious Kelly, an assistant nursing manager at Mount Sinai Hospital in Manhattan, died Tuesday. He was 48 years old.

His sister confirmed his death to the Post, saying that she was told he had been in the intensive-care unit but that he did not think it was serious. The Post did not specify how he contracted the virus.

"We are deeply saddened by the passing of a beloved member of our nursing staff," Renatt Brodsky, a representative for the Mount Sinai Health System, told Business Insider in a statement. Brodsky did not provide any further details.

New York state has become the epicenter for the US's coronavirus outbreak, with more than 33,000 infections and more than 360 deaths. In New York and other areas in the US with large outbreaks, healthcare workers are reporting shortages of personal protective equipment like masks, gowns, face shields, and gloves.

At Mount Sinai West, in the same hospital system where Kelly worked, nurses published a photo on social media showing them fashioning plastic trash bags into protective outfits, according to the Post.

"NO MORE GOWNS IN THE WHOLE HOSPITAL," they wrote on Facebook. "NO MORE MASKS AND REUSING THE DISPOSABLE ONES … NURSES FIGURING IT OUT DURING COVID-19 CRISIS." One nurse is seen holding a box of Hefty Strong 33-gallon bags, more commonly used for lining household trash cans.

https://www.businessinsider.com/kious-kelly-hospital-nurse-dies-trash-bags-2020-3
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:46 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg


What post did this pastor share suggesting it's a hoax? There's nothing on the website or that guy's twitter feed that I can find.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 03:49 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg


Why do you and others, with your baloney posts being bad enough, need to add lies to the mix?

A Washington Post reporter has apologized for and deleted a tweet in which she falsely claimed President Trump called the coronavirus a "hoax" during a recent campaign rally.

"My apologies for quoting the president out of context," said Amber Phillips, a reporter for the Post's "The Fix" political blogging team. "As The Washington Post’s Fact Checker makes clear, he called Democrats politicizing coronavirus a hoax. I have deleted the incorrect tweet."
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/...onavirus-a-hoax

Let’s make this short and sweet. President Trump never called the virus a hoax. The writer is repeating a Democratic lie. Trump said some of the things the Democrats were saying about his administration’s response to the coronavirus outbreak was “their new hoax.”
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/opinion...rus-letter.html

Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/



And you use someones death for pushing your political views?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:01 PM
The fact is that there are pastors, people and even governors that refuse to stop church services and take the measures needed to prevent this virus from spreading.

Our president was warned of this coming in January and blew it off.

They are CAUSING more deaths. The two things are directly related. And the only reason you posted what you did is because you are now affiliated with the party that used to claim they stood for personal responsibility and accountability. Not so much anymore.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:03 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Yeah, a Democratic hoax that was just going to disappear.


A Washington Post reporter has apologized for and deleted a tweet in which she falsely claimed President Trump called the coronavirus a "hoax" during a recent campaign rally.

"My apologies for quoting the president out of context," said Amber Phillips, a reporter for the Post's "The Fix" political blogging team. "As The Washington Post’s Fact Checker makes clear, he called Democrats politicizing coronavirus a hoax. I have deleted the incorrect tweet."
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/...onavirus-a-hoax

Let’s make this short and sweet. President Trump never called the virus a hoax. The writer is repeating a Democratic lie. Trump said some of the things the Democrats were saying about his administration’s response to the coronavirus outbreak was “their new hoax.”
https://www.lehighvalleylive.com/opinion...rus-letter.html

Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:04 PM
Quote:
Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax.


So? GOPers Calling it a Democrat hoax to politicize..is a hoax itself. Besides his clueless supporters took it that way anyways. rofl
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:09 PM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:10 PM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:12 PM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:20 PM
Trump calls for ousting GOP congressman from party ahead of coronavirus relief vote

Rep. Thomas Massie has signaled that he could hold up House passage of the stimulus measure.

President Donald Trump on Friday called for ousting from the Republican Party a GOP congressman who has signaled that he could hold up an impending House vote on the Senate's $2 trillion coronavirus emergency relief package.

"Looks like a third rate Grandstander named @RepThomasMassie, a Congressman from, unfortunately, a truly GREAT State, Kentucky, wants to vote against the new Save Our Workers Bill in Congress," Trump wrote on Twitter.

House Republican leadership has been concerned that Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.) will move to demand a recorded tally as opposed to a voice vote on the historic stimulus measure, throwing a last-minute hurdle in the legislation's path to the president's desk.

The threat has forced dozens, if not hundreds, of lawmakers to return to Washington from their home districts, navigating across interstates and through airports at a time when public health officials have urged Americans to avoid nonessential travel and large groups.

"He just wants the publicity. He can’t stop it, only delay, which is both dangerous ... & costly," Trump tweeted of Massie. "Workers & small businesses need money now in order to survive. Virus wasn’t their fault. It is 'HELL' dealing with the Dems, had to give up some stupid things in order to get the 'big picture' done. 90% GREAT! WIN BACK HOUSE, but throw Massie out of Republican Party!"

In another message, the president sought to target Massie's status as chairman of the conservative House Second Amendment Caucus, writing: "By empowering the Radical Left Democrats, do nothing Kentucky politician @RepThomasMassie is making their War on the 2nd Amendment more and more difficult to win (But don’t worry, we will win anyway!). He is a disaster for America, and for the Great State of Kentucky!"

Massie reached out to Trump, but it is not clear whether they connected, according to two sources.

POLITICO previously reported that House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) and House Minority Whip Steve Scalise (R-La.) had been in contact with Massie, and that the White House was aware of the potential obstacle he posed to the package's final passage.

Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) announced on Thursday that the House would vote Friday on the legislation, sending lawmakers scrambling back to the Capitol after they were previously told they would have at least 24 hours' notice if they needed to return.

Any single member could complicate the proceedings on Friday by objecting on the grounds that there isn't a quorum — in this case, 216 lawmakers — in the chamber, or by demanding a roll-call vote, an option opposed by Democratic and Republican congressional leadership. But even if Massie forces a recorded vote, the bill is expected to pass with broad bipartisan support.

Massie, who drove from Kentucky to be in Washington for the vote, on Thursday tweeted ominously an image of the Constitution's clause having to do with quorums in chambers of Congress. He also described the package as "not a good deal" and suggested it was the result of dubious legislative maneuvering.

"They're trying to convince us it should be a voice vote, it shouldn’t be recorded. And I'm struggling with this,” Massie told a Cincinnati radio station. As of late Thursday night, senior aides in both parties said they were unsure what he would do.

Although Massie has broken with Trump on other high-profile votes in Congress, the libertarian congressman's new feud with the president marks a major fracture in his campaign to win Trump's support amid a competitive Republican primary for his House seat in June.

When Trump visited his Mar-a-Lago resort for Super Bowl weekend last month, Massie purchased TV advertising time in South Florida on Fox News to air an attack ad branding his GOP challenger as a "Trump hater."

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/27/trump-congressman-thomas-massie-coronavirus-vote-151523
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:21 PM
I think they hit a nerve.
Run it on a loop now
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:25 PM
Lol ...trump and his supporters are so easy to trigger.

And when the relief is held off for months because a loss of 1 week GOPers will blame it on Obama and the dems. Pfft the trump era.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:26 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG


At least the Washington Post Reporter had the decency to apologize for taking the President out of context.

You have only doubled down on the "out of context" lies.

I expected nothing less.

Shame!!
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:27 PM
I know actually hearing him say the words means nothing to you.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:30 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I know nothing.


Funny how taking what people say out of context does. brownie
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:32 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I know nothing.


Funny how taking what people say out of context does. brownie


See pit...easy... Lol
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:37 PM
You didn't take anything out of context. You wrote something totally different than what I said. I gave you a clip of the words coming straight from Trump's mouth. Without changing the words around like you did. I suggest you try to look up the definition of taking things out of context.

It doesn't include the doctoring of a quote.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:38 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Wait......you know nurses or doctors that are making less than $15 an hour?

And, what? People are having to pay for their kids care out of their own pocket? How dare that happen. YOU should be paying for their kids care. Certainly, the parents shouldn't be paying.


I'm talking about the service workers getting food for you and yours... but you knew that. I thanked a cashier for her service like a recognized hero Tuesday while shopping and it made her smile as if I made her day.

Yes they are paying out of the pittance that they earn and it's shameful when we are all depending on them this much.


When I go to the grocery store, I started telling the cashier to grab a candy bar from the rack of candy and magazines that they always have by the checkout lines.

It only costs about a dollar but they really really appreciate it.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:45 PM
My hopeful thinking is trump wants out after this. He crawls back to the private sector in November where his bullying and lies can’t get pushed back into his face in such a public manner.
He’s unfit for the presidency. I know his massive ego will never allow him to see it, but he’s also ‘smart’ enough (I use that word with trepidation) to know the private sector is easier money and less stress.

One can hope, right?
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:54 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
You didn't take anything out of context. You wrote something totally different than what I said. I gave you a clip of the words coming straight from Trump's mouth. Without changing the words around like you did. I suggest you try to look up the definition of taking things out of context.

It doesn't include the doctoring of a quote.


"Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. You know that, right? Coronavirus. They're politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs, you say, 'How's President Trump doing?', 'Oh, nothing, nothing.' They have no clue, they don't have any clue. They can't even count their votes in Iowa, they can't even count. No, they can't. They can't count their votes. One of my people came up to me and said, 'Mr. President, they tried to beat you on Russia, Russia, Russia.' That didn't work out too well. They couldn't do it. They tried the impeachment hoax. That was on a perfect conversation. They tried anything, they tried it over and over, they've been doing it since he got in. It's all turning, they lost. It's all turning, think of it, think of it. And this is their new hoax. But you know we did something that's been pretty amazing. We have 15 people in this massive country and because of the fact that we went early, we went early, we could have had a lot more than that."

Just in case anyone is looking for - you know - what Trump said.... I know the faithful rely on what Trump says he said, or says he thought, or says he felt when he re-writes reality... but there's nothing like the actual "words". But like "facts" - they are optional for the faithful.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 04:55 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG


At least the Washington Post Reporter had the decency to apologize for taking the President out of context.

You have only doubled down on the "out of context" lies.

I expected nothing less.

Shame!!


It was trump saying it so you are right they are lies
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:14 PM
That's what Trump thinks facts are if they don't say what he wants them to say. A hoax.
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:15 PM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
You didn't take anything out of context. You wrote something totally different than what I said. I gave you a clip of the words coming straight from Trump's mouth. Without changing the words around like you did. I suggest you try to look up the definition of taking things out of context.

It doesn't include the doctoring of a quote.


"Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. You know that, right? Coronavirus. They're politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs, you say, 'How's President Trump doing?', 'Oh, nothing, nothing.' They have no clue, they don't have any clue. They can't even count their votes in Iowa, they can't even count. No, they can't. They can't count their votes. One of my people came up to me and said, 'Mr. President, they tried to beat you on Russia, Russia, Russia.' That didn't work out too well. They couldn't do it. They tried the impeachment hoax. That was on a perfect conversation. They tried anything, they tried it over and over, they've been doing it since he got in. It's all turning, they lost. It's all turning, think of it, think of it. And this is their new hoax. But you know we did something that's been pretty amazing. We have 15 people in this massive country and because of the fact that we went early, we went early, we could have had a lot more than that."

Just in case anyone is looking for - you know - what Trump said.... I know the faithful rely on what Trump says he said, or says he thought, or says he felt when he re-writes reality... but there's nothing like the actual "words". But like "facts" - they are optional for the faithful.


but thats not what he said he said
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:18 PM
A Washington Post reporter has apologized for and deleted a tweet in which she falsely claimed President Trump called the coronavirus a "hoax" during a recent campaign rally.

"My apologies for quoting the president out of context," said Amber Phillips, a reporter for the Post's "The Fix" political blogging team. "As The Washington Post’s Fact Checker makes clear, he called Democrats politicizing coronavirus a hoax. I have deleted the incorrect tweet."
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/...onavirus-a-hoax
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:22 PM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.








Some of you who have been around for a while know that I am a doctor. More specifically I am an Infectious Disease specialist. So when it comes to the front lines I am it. I work at a mid sized hospital in the suburbs of Charlotte NC.

I am telling right here and right now, this [censored] is real.

1, in my area we are still on the slow slope of an exponential curve. We are nothing even close to NYC, or Seattle or New Orleans. And even being so far away in the infection process from those places were are so busy that my partners and I have not taken a day off in weeks. I visit here on my lunch hour to try to keep some sense of normalcy in my life.

2, This is not just a disease of the elderly. 20% of the Covid patients in the ICU in this country are between the ages of 20 and 40. There is a 40 something otherwise healthy Covid patient in our ICU who has a 90% probability of dying in the next 24-48 hours. And people who do recover are showing significant decrease in lung capacity which means that they get short of breath just walking briskly. It is unknown if that is going to be permanent.

3, Despite what Trump says Chlorquine/hydroxychloroquine is not a game changer. It appears to mitigate the disease a little bit. The take away point is a little bit. When a patient gets started on these drugs they do not all of a sudden get miraculously better.

4, The PPE/mask shortage is a real thing. These masks are designed for single use. We get 1 mask per week and if it get soiled or wet we have to turn it in in exchange to get a new one. We have looked at various methods of sterilizing these masks but that is not easy to do without degrading the mask and compromising it's efficacy. We explored UV light sterilization but that degrades the mask. It looks like we can have the mask sit in 150 degree temperatures for 30 minutes will decontaminate without compromising it, but at this point we don't know for sure, or how many times we can do this. Again these are single use masks that we are using for a full week. And when I say single use, I don't mean for a full day. Typically you put the mask on for entering the patient room, discard it when we leave and if we need to go back in use a new mask. And that is at my hospital. I can't imagine how much worse it is at a hospital in one of the hotspots.

Have you thought about what happens if the healthcare workers start getting sick? Who will be there to take care of the sick?

5, We don't need more ventilators? Hospitals are trying to figure out what to rig the ventilators in a way that they can splice the tubing to ventilate multiple patients with a single ventilator. How is that even reasonable? How is any of what we are doing reasonable? But we do what we have to.

The federal government needs to get their heads out of their asses and commission businesses with the capabilities to start making this protective equipment and ventilators. But instead, they are holding things up unless the Governors bend down and kiss his butt. Their actions are going to be directly responsible for innumerable deaths.

Anyone who says this president is providing quality leadership either doesn't care enough to actually look at it, is a complete sucker for the propaganda, or just trying to get Swish fired up.
Posted By: PortlandDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:28 PM
Thank you Jester for all you do. I have a friend that’s an ER doctor here in town. It’s ramping up and he’s working his arse off for the community.
Stay safe. Wash your hands.

All of us in the trenches deserve a month off after all this to catch our collective breath and mentally/emotionally decompress.




Wash your hands.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:42 PM
This post should be pinned.
This is a serious discussion for serious people.
This post is the model.


Jester: You're a treasure and a hero. Please PLEASE stay safe.
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:43 PM
Great post, Jester.

Stay safe!
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:44 PM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:48 PM
Man, I know you're dong everything possible to help protect and help your patients. Please do everything you can to protect yourself as well. I would hope that people listen to people like yourself to gather the facts of what's really going on out there and how let down you all feel by our governments response and the excuses being manufactured to try and minimize their incompetence.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 05:56 PM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man


So hundreds of lawmakers were summoned to Washington D.C. Thursday night and Friday morning from coronavirus-ravaged communities in New York, California and elsewhere. This, despite strict guidelines from the Capitol physician advising lawmakers not to congregate at the Capitol and stay in their offices until needed to avoid the spread of the virus that has already infected several lawmakers.

While Massie was able to ensure many lawmakers showed up for the vote, he was not, in the end, able to force a roll-call.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:16 PM
Thank God they managed to stop that right wing Republican nut job from getting his way.
Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:23 PM
But he did get his way as he forced hundreds of low life lib Democrats to fly into Corona infested DC to yell Aye.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:38 PM
Not really. It's the idiots on the other side of the aisle that believe his foolishness. You know, those still attending church services and believe him over the health experts.

Republicans trust Trump more than the CDC for accurate info on the coronavirus, a new poll shows

https://www.businessinsider.com/republic...3ygANnTinrllYXE

Like sheep being led to slaughter.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:43 PM
The tweet says:"On March 13, Pastor Landon Spradlin shared this post suggesting #COVID19 is a hoax."

It does not say Trump called it a hoax. However, as far as I'm concerned Trump did call it a hoax because he's a dumbass and can't communicate beyond a 4th grade level. But I will accept yet another excuse for him and agree that he didn't mean it the way that is sounded.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:53 PM
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
My hopeful thinking is trump wants out after this. He crawls back to the private sector in November where his bullying and lies can’t get pushed back into his face in such a public manner.
He’s unfit for the presidency. I know his massive ego will never allow him to see it, but he’s also ‘smart’ enough (I use that word with trepidation) to know the private sector is easier money and less stress.

One can hope, right?


He probably would if he wasn't afraid he'll be prosecuted. I think he's hoping to die in office at this point.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 06:55 PM
Quote:
The tweet says:"On March 13, Pastor Landon Spradlin shared this post suggesting #COVID19 is a hoax."


What post did the pastor share? I couldn't find it anywhere. I hope there is one, otherwise making fun of someone that died of this is in very poor taste.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 07:13 PM
Originally Posted By: jfanent
Quote:
The tweet says:"On March 13, Pastor Landon Spradlin shared this post suggesting #COVID19 is a hoax."


What post did the pastor share? I couldn't find it anywhere. I hope there is one, otherwise making fun of someone that died of this is in very poor taste.


He posted/shared this meme on FB calling it 'mass hysteria' and comparing it to H1N1 under Obama as 'totally chill':

https://www.facebook.com/landon.spradlin/posts/10158051152633688
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 07:14 PM
Much respect for the job you are doing, Jester. And that was an awesome post.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 07:14 PM
I agree making fun of him would be very in poor taste. Yet at the same time, the irony would be so thick you could cut it with a knife. Sadly things similar to this are actually happening.

Nearly 3 dozen who attended Arkansas church event test positive for coronavirus

"Maybe you assumed that it couldn’t happen to you, just like I did," the church pastor wrote in a Facebook post.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/nea...sitive-n1169471

It doesn't say exactly the date of the occasion, but when pasors and churches are still, to this day, still holding services, the situation will only become even worse.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 07:46 PM
It is ironic and should be addressed if he in fact suggested this is a hoax. I just didn't see it in any of the links that were on the original OCD post. This other one is blocked out as inaccurate when I clicked on it.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 07:56 PM
You just can't make this crap up! What the hell is wrong with this administration?

After Considering $1 Billion Price Tag for Ventilators, White House Has Second Thoughts

A deal with General Motors and Ventec Life Systems to produce tens of thousands of the critical lifesaving devices seemed imminent. Then the announcement was pulled back.

WASHINGTON — The White House had been preparing to reveal on Wednesday a joint venture between General Motors and Ventec Life Systems that would allow for the production of as many as 80,000 desperately needed ventilators to respond to an escalating pandemic when word suddenly came down that the announcement was off.

The decision to cancel the announcement, government officials say, came after the Federal Emergency Management Agency said it needed more time to assess whether the estimated cost was prohibitive. That price tag was more than $1 billion, with several hundred million dollars to be paid upfront to General Motors to retool a car parts plant in Kokomo, Ind., where the ventilators would be made with Ventec’s technology.

Government officials said that the deal might still happen but that they are examining at least a dozen other proposals. And they contend that an initial promise that the joint venture could turn out 20,000 ventilators in short order had shrunk to 7,500, with even that number in doubt. Longtime emergency managers at FEMA are working with military officials to sort through the competing offers and federal procurement rules while under pressure to give President Trump something to announce.

But in an interview Thursday night with Sean Hannity, the president played down the need for ventilators.

“I don’t believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators,” he said, a reference to New York, where Gov. Andrew Cuomo has appealed for federal help in obtaining them. “You go into major hospitals sometimes, and they’ll have two ventilators. And now all of a sudden they’re saying, ‘Can we order 30,000 ventilators?’”

A General Motors spokesman said that “Project V,” as the ventilator program is known, was moving very fast, and a company official said “there’s no issue with retooling.”

A Ventec representative agreed.

“Ventec and G.M. have been working at breakneck speed to leverage our collective expertise in ventilation and manufacturing to meet the needs of the country as quickly as possible and arm medical professionals with the number of ventilators needed to save lives,” said Chris O. Brooks, Ventec’s chief strategy officer.

The only thing missing was clarity from the government about how many ventilators they needed — and who would be paid to build them.

The shortage of ventilators has emerged as one of the major criticisms of the Trump administration’s response to the coronavirus. The need to quickly equip hospitals across the country with tens of thousands more of the devices to treat those most seriously ill with the virus was not anticipated despite the Trump administration’s own projection in a simulation last year that millions of people could be hospitalized. And even now, the effort to produce them has been confused and disorganized.

At the center of the discussion about how to ramp up the production of ventilators is Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and a senior White House aide, who has told people that he was called in two weeks ago by Vice President Mike Pence to produce more coronavirus test kits and who has now turned his attention to ventilators.

He has been directing officials at FEMA in the effort. Two officials said the suggestion to wait on the General Motors offer came from Col. Patrick Work, who is working at FEMA. Some government officials expressed concern about the possibility of ordering too many ventilators, leaving them with an expensive surplus.

As the agency has sorted through offers, trying to weigh production ability and costs, hospitals in New York and elsewhere are reporting a desperate need for more ventilators, which are critical in treating respiratory problems in a fast-rising tide of severe coronavirus cases.

A spokeswoman for FEMA said Colonel Work presented information on each contract in such meetings but did not make any recommendations. A White House spokesman declined to comment.

The involvement of General Motors was first floated this month as the carmaker’s factory floor in Kokomo was grinding to a halt and workers were being sent home — partly because the market was collapsing but also because workers would otherwise risk exposure to the coronavirus.

Last week, General Motors, Ventec Life Systems and a coalition of business executives called StopTheSpread.org issued a statement saying that Ventec would “leverage G.M.’s logistics, purchasing and manufacturing expertise to build more of their critically important ventilators,” including some portable units.

By Sunday, Mr. Trump appeared to suggest on Twitter that a deal had been completed to mass-produce the ventilators, even though it was unclear who would pay to equip the General Motors plant or how long that process would take.

“Ford, General Motors and Tesla are being given the go ahead to make ventilators and other metal products, FAST! @fema,” he wrote. “Go for it auto execs, lets see how good you are?”

Not for the first time has Mr. Trump jumped the gun.

Tesla officials had in fact met with engineers from the medical device company Medtronic in a separate negotiation, but no partnership has yet been announced. And while the chief executive of General Motors, Mary T. Barra, was enthused about the ventilator idea, Mr. Trump’s own aides had not embraced the G.M.-Ventec partnership — in part because they had not seen the specifics of the proposal.

Administration officials said Thursday that they were struggling to understand just how many ventilators the new venture could make.

The initial projection, one senior administration official said, was that after three weeks of preparation it could produce an initial run of 20,000 ventilators, or about two-thirds of what Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York recently said his state alone needed to cover the influx of coronavirus patients expected in two weeks, if not sooner.

That number then shrank to 7,500 ventilators in the initial run, or maybe 5,000, an apparent recognition that auto transmissions and ventilators had very little in common. Those numbers are in flux and so are the Trump administration’s because the White House cannot decide how many ventilators it wants.

Targets have changed by the hour, officials said, as the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the Department of Health and Human Services, the Food and Drug Administration, which approves the use of medical devices, and the White House try to figure out how many ventilators to request and how much they should cost.

Those issues appeared to come to a head on Wednesday afternoon, when FEMA told the White House that it was premature to make a decision.

The $1.5 billion price tag comes to around $18,000 a ventilator. And the overall cost, by comparison, is roughly equal to buying 18 F-35s, the Pentagon’s most advanced fighter jet.

So on Wednesday, despite the president’s tweet three days earlier, FEMA was still weighing competing offers in order to make a recommendation to Mr. Kushner. And it seemed clear to several officials that the agency would have to select multiple manufacturers, in part to avoid the risk that one production line runs into technical troubles, or that its workers contract the very virus the ventilators are being built to defeat.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/us/politics/coronavirus-ventilators-trump.html

We just cut 2 Trillion dollars in payouts! Even if you contracted 10 of these deals it would only be 15 Billion! Just do it.
Posted By: willitevachange Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 08:02 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
You just can't make this crap up! What the hell is wrong with this administration?

After Considering $1 Billion Price Tag for Ventilators, White House Has Second Thoughts

A deal with General Motors and Ventec Life Systems to produce tens of thousands of the critical lifesaving devices seemed imminent. Then the announcement was pulled back.

WASHINGTON — The White House had been preparing to reveal on Wednesday a joint venture between General Motors and Ventec Life Systems that would allow for the production of as many as 80,000 desperately needed ventilators to respond to an escalating pandemic when word suddenly came down that the announcement was off.

The decision to cancel the announcement, government officials say, came after the Federal Emergency Management Agency said it needed more time to assess whether the estimated cost was prohibitive. That price tag was more than $1 billion, with several hundred million dollars to be paid upfront to General Motors to retool a car parts plant in Kokomo, Ind., where the ventilators would be made with Ventec’s technology.

Government officials said that the deal might still happen but that they are examining at least a dozen other proposals. And they contend that an initial promise that the joint venture could turn out 20,000 ventilators in short order had shrunk to 7,500, with even that number in doubt. Longtime emergency managers at FEMA are working with military officials to sort through the competing offers and federal procurement rules while under pressure to give President Trump something to announce.

But in an interview Thursday night with Sean Hannity, the president played down the need for ventilators.

“I don’t believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators,” he said, a reference to New York, where Gov. Andrew Cuomo has appealed for federal help in obtaining them. “You go into major hospitals sometimes, and they’ll have two ventilators. And now all of a sudden they’re saying, ‘Can we order 30,000 ventilators?’”

A General Motors spokesman said that “Project V,” as the ventilator program is known, was moving very fast, and a company official said “there’s no issue with retooling.”

A Ventec representative agreed.

“Ventec and G.M. have been working at breakneck speed to leverage our collective expertise in ventilation and manufacturing to meet the needs of the country as quickly as possible and arm medical professionals with the number of ventilators needed to save lives,” said Chris O. Brooks, Ventec’s chief strategy officer.

The only thing missing was clarity from the government about how many ventilators they needed — and who would be paid to build them.

The shortage of ventilators has emerged as one of the major criticisms of the Trump administration’s response to the coronavirus. The need to quickly equip hospitals across the country with tens of thousands more of the devices to treat those most seriously ill with the virus was not anticipated despite the Trump administration’s own projection in a simulation last year that millions of people could be hospitalized. And even now, the effort to produce them has been confused and disorganized.

At the center of the discussion about how to ramp up the production of ventilators is Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and a senior White House aide, who has told people that he was called in two weeks ago by Vice President Mike Pence to produce more coronavirus test kits and who has now turned his attention to ventilators.

He has been directing officials at FEMA in the effort. Two officials said the suggestion to wait on the General Motors offer came from Col. Patrick Work, who is working at FEMA. Some government officials expressed concern about the possibility of ordering too many ventilators, leaving them with an expensive surplus.

As the agency has sorted through offers, trying to weigh production ability and costs, hospitals in New York and elsewhere are reporting a desperate need for more ventilators, which are critical in treating respiratory problems in a fast-rising tide of severe coronavirus cases.

A spokeswoman for FEMA said Colonel Work presented information on each contract in such meetings but did not make any recommendations. A White House spokesman declined to comment.

The involvement of General Motors was first floated this month as the carmaker’s factory floor in Kokomo was grinding to a halt and workers were being sent home — partly because the market was collapsing but also because workers would otherwise risk exposure to the coronavirus.

Last week, General Motors, Ventec Life Systems and a coalition of business executives called StopTheSpread.org issued a statement saying that Ventec would “leverage G.M.’s logistics, purchasing and manufacturing expertise to build more of their critically important ventilators,” including some portable units.

By Sunday, Mr. Trump appeared to suggest on Twitter that a deal had been completed to mass-produce the ventilators, even though it was unclear who would pay to equip the General Motors plant or how long that process would take.

“Ford, General Motors and Tesla are being given the go ahead to make ventilators and other metal products, FAST! @fema,” he wrote. “Go for it auto execs, lets see how good you are?”

Not for the first time has Mr. Trump jumped the gun.

Tesla officials had in fact met with engineers from the medical device company Medtronic in a separate negotiation, but no partnership has yet been announced. And while the chief executive of General Motors, Mary T. Barra, was enthused about the ventilator idea, Mr. Trump’s own aides had not embraced the G.M.-Ventec partnership — in part because they had not seen the specifics of the proposal.

Administration officials said Thursday that they were struggling to understand just how many ventilators the new venture could make.

The initial projection, one senior administration official said, was that after three weeks of preparation it could produce an initial run of 20,000 ventilators, or about two-thirds of what Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York recently said his state alone needed to cover the influx of coronavirus patients expected in two weeks, if not sooner.

That number then shrank to 7,500 ventilators in the initial run, or maybe 5,000, an apparent recognition that auto transmissions and ventilators had very little in common. Those numbers are in flux and so are the Trump administration’s because the White House cannot decide how many ventilators it wants.

Targets have changed by the hour, officials said, as the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the Department of Health and Human Services, the Food and Drug Administration, which approves the use of medical devices, and the White House try to figure out how many ventilators to request and how much they should cost.

Those issues appeared to come to a head on Wednesday afternoon, when FEMA told the White House that it was premature to make a decision.

The $1.5 billion price tag comes to around $18,000 a ventilator. And the overall cost, by comparison, is roughly equal to buying 18 F-35s, the Pentagon’s most advanced fighter jet.

So on Wednesday, despite the president’s tweet three days earlier, FEMA was still weighing competing offers in order to make a recommendation to Mr. Kushner. And it seemed clear to several officials that the agency would have to select multiple manufacturers, in part to avoid the risk that one production line runs into technical troubles, or that its workers contract the very virus the ventilators are being built to defeat.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/us/politics/coronavirus-ventilators-trump.html

We just cut 2 Trillion dollars in payouts! Even if you contracted 10 of these deals it would only be 15 Billion! Just do it.
I am disappointed in all our leadership, left and right. We paid more than this to arts, humanities, kennedy center and the IRS in that bill. The money is there - things like this should have been written in and mandated. Why wasnt it?
Posted By: Milk Man Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 08:10 PM
j/c...

Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 08:45 PM
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
j/c...

So did trump. He wasted nearly two weeks enacting this.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:12 PM
I guess it depends who you believe;

Supposedly GM wanted the 1 billion for 80,000 ventilators-on average that is about 12,500 for each. From what I read, the normal going price for these was about 5-6K each. But GM wanted the tooling cost thrown in up front-which would jack up the price.

Trump said GM was dragging their feet, wouldn't commit to 80,000 by the end of this year, weren't sure they were going to make enough money-wanted to get their ducks in a row on tooling cost, overtime cost, etc.

It seems like on GM's side they gave their number to do this work in this time frame and the administration was trying to beat the price down and was trying to get competing offers.

Thought something was up this morning when trump tweeted about why GM isn't using Lordstown plant for ventilators. Guess he forgot that GM doesn't even own the plant anymore. I mean, he was the one who announced the deal where GM sold the plant
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:26 PM
Originally Posted By: jfanent
It is ironic and should be addressed if he in fact suggested this is a hoax. I just didn't see it in any of the links that were on the original OCD post. This other one is blocked out as inaccurate when I clicked on it.


I have cut and paste Trump's exact words. It is there.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:30 PM
Originally Posted By: Jester
Originally Posted By: Milk Man
Unreal. I feel for everyone on the front lines.








Some of you who have been around for a while know that I am a doctor. More specifically I am an Infectious Disease specialist. So when it comes to the front lines I am it. I work at a mid sized hospital in the suburbs of Charlotte NC.

I am telling right here and right now, this [censored] is real.

1, in my area we are still on the slow slope of an exponential curve. We are nothing even close to NYC, or Seattle or New Orleans. And even being so far away in the infection process from those places were are so busy that my partners and I have not taken a day off in weeks. I visit here on my lunch hour to try to keep some sense of normalcy in my life.

2, This is not just a disease of the elderly. 20% of the Covid patients in the ICU in this country are between the ages of 20 and 40. There is a 40 something otherwise healthy Covid patient in our ICU who has a 90% probability of dying in the next 24-48 hours. And people who do recover are showing significant decrease in lung capacity which means that they get short of breath just walking briskly. It is unknown if that is going to be permanent.

3, Despite what Trump says Chlorquine/hydroxychloroquine is not a game changer. It appears to mitigate the disease a little bit. The take away point is a little bit. When a patient gets started on these drugs they do not all of a sudden get miraculously better.

4, The PPE/mask shortage is a real thing. These masks are designed for single use. We get 1 mask per week and if it get soiled or wet we have to turn it in in exchange to get a new one. We have looked at various methods of sterilizing these masks but that is not easy to do without degrading the mask and compromising it's efficacy. We explored UV light sterilization but that degrades the mask. It looks like we can have the mask sit in 150 degree temperatures for 30 minutes will decontaminate without compromising it, but at this point we don't know for sure, or how many times we can do this. Again these are single use masks that we are using for a full week. And when I say single use, I don't mean for a full day. Typically you put the mask on for entering the patient room, discard it when we leave and if we need to go back in use a new mask. And that is at my hospital. I can't imagine how much worse it is at a hospital in one of the hotspots.

Have you thought about what happens if the healthcare workers start getting sick? Who will be there to take care of the sick?

5, We don't need more ventilators? Hospitals are trying to figure out what to rig the ventilators in a way that they can splice the tubing to ventilate multiple patients with a single ventilator. How is that even reasonable? How is any of what we are doing reasonable? But we do what we have to.

The federal government needs to get their heads out of their asses and commission businesses with the capabilities to start making this protective equipment and ventilators. But instead, they are holding things up unless the Governors bend down and kiss his butt. Their actions are going to be directly responsible for innumerable deaths.

Anyone who says this president is providing quality leadership either doesn't care enough to actually look at it, is a complete sucker for the propaganda, or just trying to get Swish fired up.


I think this should be quoted as the first post in a new thread to continue this discussion. I'd like to see and hear people try to defend how this whole crisis has been mismanaged after this and Clem's post .... and again, to emphasize the point that this administration had the alarm bells going off back in JANUARY but Trump didn't want to pay attention and deliberately ignored the experts and re-wrote the agenda/narrative.

I'd do it myself but don't know if that is considered improper board etiquette.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:31 PM
Originally Posted By: mgh888
Originally Posted By: jfanent
It is ironic and should be addressed if he in fact suggested this is a hoax. I just didn't see it in any of the links that were on the original OCD post. This other one is blocked out as inaccurate when I clicked on it.


I have cut and paste Trump's exact words. It is there.


Not Trump, the pastor.
Posted By: PrplPplEater Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:47 PM
Originally Posted By: 1oldMutt
It's obvious she's a journalist and not in supply chain management. I happen to be and what he's saying (not so eloquently) is not to order more PPE(or anything) than needed. We've had to really put the clamps on our wards and departments or they would take it all. They're NOT understanding that there are not seas of supplies at our disposal to give them to hoard. We are only allocated so much supply and when it's gone we wait until the next month if it doesn't go to a back order status. I'm seeing things from deep in the trenches and let me tell you...supplies are gold right now! Magnify that by all the hospitals scrambling to overstock across the world and that a huge amount of that got bogged down coming from China when they were at their worse. It's an issue! The president is not wrong in asking people to be frugal and respectful about their needs and usage. He may just want to let someone else Express it..Hang in there folks.


Not to mention that the shortage of ventilators and PPE isn't just the US... it is a chronic GLOBAL shortage of all types of equipment. There pretty much isn't a nation on Earth that isn't struggling with this right now, and we are all stuck with the same supply chains.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 09:53 PM
Correct. Still doesn't stop some people from blaming Trump..........yet they ignore what, say, Cuomo DIDN'T do.

This IS the political forum, right?
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 10:36 PM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Correct. Still doesn't stop some people from blaming Trump..........yet they ignore what, say, Cuomo DIDN'T do.

This IS the political forum, right?

I'm not following Cuomo or NYC .... I read something you posted (I think) saying he made a decision 2 years ago about something or other? Is that correct? Verified independently? .... Was Cuomo warned at the time (as Trump was) an impending pandemic was likely? Did Cuomo make a different decision than experts and make public statements contrary to, or override decisions that experts advised? Did he yell at any experts bearing bad news and tell them to get out of his office because the news wasn't rosy? .... Another angle/bottom line, did Cuomo make any decisions differently than other Governors ?? I don't know the answers but I doubt the decisions and situations are really comparable and more likely Trump/Breigbart/Fox fake news and deflection.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 10:54 PM
No. Or yes. Too many questions.

Verified, yes. In 2015 despite a need for ventilators, he spent money elsewhere. You can read about it by searching "cuomo didn't buy ventilators". You'll find many credible sources.


And this just in: https://www.yahoo.com/news/the-mistakes-...-090040375.html

From the article:
Quote:
The threat of the coronavirus was looming over New York City, but Mayor Bill de Blasio was not especially worried. “I’m encouraging New Yorkers to go on with your lives + get out on the town despite Coronavirus,” he tweeted on March 2. There was an Italian film playing at Lincoln Center. He urged people to see it.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:30 PM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg




If most Americans have only $400 in savings, we have country of Dumb ass people.


I believe her in once sense, but don't believe her that people couldn't do better. They just have to try.

The "give it to me" crowd is getting far larger than this country needs.

Face it, it you are a 30 something and stuck in a minimum wage job for the long haul, you drag down this country. If you started as a pimple faced kid and stay at pretty much the same wage, you are a lazy loser. I mean come on.

Nobody owes you anything. In real life, you have to earn your way. 150 years ago you would have starved or been shot as a thief looking for food.
Posted By: Versatile Dog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:37 PM
j/c:

Did anyone see this? He reminds me of an angry, insecure child.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-lashes-journalist-during-white-230200034.html
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/27/20 11:49 PM
Why are they releasing all the inmates? They dont have jobs or necessarily places to live. They are just gonna do crime.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 12:18 AM
Originally Posted By: Ballpeen
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg




If most Americans have only $400 in savings, we have country of Dumb ass people.


I believe her in once sense, but don't believe her that people couldn't do better. They just have to try.

The "give it to me" crowd is getting far larger than this country needs.

Face it, it you are a 30 something and stuck in a minimum wage job for the long haul, you drag down this country. If you started as a pimple faced kid and stay at pretty much the same wage, you are a lazy loser. I mean come on.

Nobody owes you anything. In real life, you have to earn your way. 150 years ago you would have starved or been shot as a thief looking for food.


Posted By: fishtheice Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 12:28 AM
Wow...

Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 12:44 AM
Wow is right!

Reminds me of Pits panicked posts!
Posted By: Riley01 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 02:12 AM
To bad that scumbag como was worried more about the scumbag illegals and bail for convicted felons while the covid was growing in their schools, hes the culprit of the spread of the virus in NY screw him and his minions.
Posted By: DevilDawg2847 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 02:13 AM
Originally Posted By: willitevachange


We just cut 2 Trillion dollars in payouts! Even if you contracted 10 of these deals it would only be 15 Billion! Just do it.
I am disappointed in all our leadership, left and right. We paid more than this to arts, humanities, kennedy center and the IRS in that bill. The money is there - things like this should have been written in and mandated. Why wasnt it? [/quote]


Administration officials said Thursday that they were struggling to understand just how many ventilators the new venture could make.

The initial projection, one senior administration official said, was that after three weeks of preparation it could produce an initial run of 20,000 ventilators, or about two-thirds of what Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York recently said his state alone needed to cover the influx of coronavirus patients expected in two weeks, if not sooner.

That number then shrank to 7,500 ventilators in the initial run, or maybe 5,000, an apparent recognition that auto transmissions and ventilators had very little in common. Those numbers are in flux and so are the Trump administration’s because the White House cannot decide how many ventilators it wants.



This is why the deal fell through... upon digging in to the details it looked more and more like GM wasn't able to provide a firm commitment as to what it actually could produce... claiming 20k then saying,, well maybe 7,500.. well, maybe more like 5,000....

If GM couldn't give a reasonable, confident estimate, then Trump was right to pull the deal. If you believe the hype which clearly most of you do, but you at least believe insensible solutions then there is no reason we should be wasting time or resources on people or companies who can't deliver on what we need.
Posted By: Riley01 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 02:22 AM
Actually the ploy by the crazy PELOSI was to give money to the Kennedy center was to able the Lying Jarret (Barrys girl) to funnel money to Barry and PELOSI. Thank god Trump appointed his guys to that board to watch them IMO
Posted By: Riley01 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 02:23 AM
My post was to devil.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:15 AM
Quote:
My post was to devil.


I think the board will start taking you a bit more seriously when you finally learn how to press the correct buttons. After that, you can graduate to advanced concepts like words and sentences.

In the meantime, stay indoors. Wash your hands.
And consider this: your keyboard just might already harbor the coronavirus. Probably best for your health (and Dawgtalkers reputation) to simply stop typing.

If nothing else, your self isolation from this board will make it it healthier for the rest of us.
Posted By: DevilDawg2847 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:18 AM
We're not going to make any real progress getting past this until they start cutting away the hype, and the panic and we stop giving legitimacy to those trying to exploit the situation.

About 70% of all this is legit, the other 30% is hype and attempts to induce panic. I understand there are times that people needed to be spurred to action quick, fast and in a hurry. But the problem is we've implemented some very serious measures based more on panic than on factual information, the consequences of which aren't being given consideration.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 04:31 AM
Originally Posted By: DevilDawg2847
We're not going to make any real progress getting past this until they start cutting away the hype, and the panic and we stop giving legitimacy to those trying to exploit the situation.

About 70% of all this is legit, the other 30% is hype and attempts to induce panic. I understand there are times that people needed to be spurred to action quick, fast and in a hurry. But the problem is we've implemented some very serious measures based more on panic than on factual information, the consequences of which aren't being given consideration.




Under normal circumstances, I would say yes. But with Trump as the President there is no chance of that as he has to flame anyone who does not kiss his butt.. He would rather spend his time lying and denying, in order to make us forget his bull crap statements that have illustrate that he is anything but a stable genius...
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 04:37 AM
my biggest sticking point with Trump in all of this is that the governors have to make nice to him to get aid. That's BS.

I expected the lies, exaggerations, lack of knowledge, and pitiful leadership because he's Trump. But making them suck up for funds to help their states is too much, way too much.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 04:41 AM
You have not seen Pence, then.

All he does is kiss butt.
Posted By: BADdog Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 04:58 AM
Originally Posted By: Riley01
To bad that scumbag como was worried more about the scumbag illegals and bail for convicted felons while the covid was growing in their schools, hes the culprit of the spread of the virus in NY screw him and his minions.


notallthere
Posted By: DevilDawg2847 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 06:08 AM
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
my biggest sticking point with Trump in all of this is that the governors have to make nice to him to get aid. That's BS.

I expected the lies, exaggerations, lack of knowledge, and pitiful leadership because he's Trump. But making them suck up for funds to help their states is too much, way too much.


LOL you guys wouldn't know leadership if it bit you in the ass

He hasn't made anyone suck up for funds. What is required is an effective partnership between the two levels of gov't. That can't occur if Newsom or Cuomo were acting like, say someone like you or any of the others around here then turning around and demanding things be done.

It's abundantly clear that most of you guys have little to no experience with the responsibility of having to resolve an emergency. Sure, emergencies and crises pop up in our lives, but those are typically contained to a close friend or family member, and much of the solution is farmed out to others.

But you guys don't know anything about identifying multiple victims or causes, identifying and taking control of environmental factors to help contain a situation, identifying resources and coordinating the logistics. You guys have no real understanding of the importance of helping people find a psychological equilibrium if you will, a measure of calm where they can think and act rationally and be directed. Or the importance of putting small goals in front of people to help them endure.

All of that stuff is irrelevant for you guys. If it were relevant, your criticism would be different i.e. constructive. But it isn't because saving lives isn't as important to most of you as you pompously claim it is. Its' like, 3rd on your list of priorities.

1st: is the satisfaction of your own ego.

2nd: is exploiting the situation for political benefit

(1st and 2nd have this incestual relationship that feeds in on itself.

3rd... then maybe lives.

We get it. You guys don't think highly of Trump. That's fine. It's not required. But you guys put that dislike so far first and foremost that you can't even be objectively critical. Is it you can't, or you choose not to?

Will you guys at least be honest about your bias and hypocrisy? Bash Trump for not doing things sooner. Ok... you do know that the only way to have gotten these "lock downs" in effect on such a scale right out of the gate would to have done it as a Federal order. You guys would have called him a fascist Nazi for implementing it without just cause.

And look at it this way: I think we can all agree that generally speaking the US wasn't as prepared as it could have been to tackle a global pandemic. If we look back there's plenty of blame to go around politically. But even if you don't want to mess with that and just start with we weren't prepared...

how much sense does it make to call for and implement measures you aren't able to put in effect at that time?

WE HAD A NATIONAL RUN ON FRIGGIN TOILET PAPER and NO ONE knows why.. all in response to the prospect of going on a 2 week lock down.

If the Trump admin has been as incompetent as you claim and the virus is as deadly as it is binge reported to be then the death count should be much higher than it is. Much higher. We've been dealing with it long enough. And when you look at how far apart and unrelated the higher profile people who tested positive have been, it would suggest the transmission rates are much higher than being given credit for.

Unless you really think that the Brazilian prime minister, several high ranking Iranians, an NBA player, and Tom Hanks were all hanging out at the same food truck around the same time...
Posted By: DevilDawg2847 Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 06:14 AM
Originally Posted By: ChargerDawg
Originally Posted By: DevilDawg2847
We're not going to make any real progress getting past this until they start cutting away the hype, and the panic and we stop giving legitimacy to those trying to exploit the situation.

About 70% of all this is legit, the other 30% is hype and attempts to induce panic. I understand there are times that people needed to be spurred to action quick, fast and in a hurry. But the problem is we've implemented some very serious measures based more on panic than on factual information, the consequences of which aren't being given consideration.




Under normal circumstances, I would say yes. But with Trump as the President there is no chance of that as he has to flame anyone who does not kiss his butt.. He would rather spend his time lying and denying, in order to make us forget his bull crap statements that have illustrate that he is anything but a stable genius...


I don't know what you'd consider normal circumstances.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 06:58 AM
Amen.


While this is a pandemic, apparently, some are making this so anti trump it's pathetic.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 10:28 AM
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Amen.


While this is a pandemic, apparently, some are making this so anti trump it's pathetic.


Get a clue. Nobody is making this anti trump. trump opens his mouth and stupid crap flys out. And you all defend his stupid crap like a flock of sheep. Keep shining that turd bro. Pffft trump. You call it hate. We hate trump the man right? We’ll you’re all wrong we hate what he says. We hate how he projects his flaws onto others. And most of all we hate how he tries to lead from his bully pulpit. He’s failed miserably with his trump virus in the USA
Posted By: mac Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 10:32 AM
jc...


Ford Hospital's letter outlining coronavirus protocols was to plan for 'extreme emergency'


Kristen Jordan Shamus and Phoebe Wall Howard, Detroit Free Press Published 6:00 a.m. ET March 28, 2020
L

A document that drew an outcry on social media this week outlining the guidelines Henry Ford Health System would use to decide who gets life-saving treatment and who does not in the surging coronavirus pandemic was drafted for planning purposes only, hospital officials said Friday.

It was part of a 50-page plan, a protocol for what to do in the event that the hospital system is overwhelmed with critically ill patients in an "extreme emergency" in the absolute worst-case scenario, said Dr. Adnan Munkarah, Henry Ford's executive president and chief clinical officer.

"Given the pandemic of the nature that we are seeing at the present time, we must all be prepared. We'd be foolish if we are not prepared," Munkara said Friday.

The instructions outlined in the guidelines have "not been activated at Henry Ford Health System. We've not initiated that protocol. We have no immediate plan and hopefully we'll never have to activate such a document or such processes," he said.

The document was initially posted to Twitter on Thursday by Nicholas Bagley, a University of Michigan law professor, and the outcry on social media was swift.

Some were shocked, others saddened, and still others challenged the authenticity of the document, which appeared to be on Henry Ford Health System letterhead.

The letter
"To our patients, families and community:

Please know that we care deeply about you and your family's health and are doing our best to protect and serve you and our community. We currently have a public health emergency that is making our supply of some medical resources hard to find. Because of shortages, we will need to be careful with resources. Patients who have the best chance of getting better are our first priority. Patients will be evaluated for the best plan of care and dying patients will be provided comfort care.

What this means for you and your family:

1. Alert staff during triage of any current medical conditions or if you have a Do Not Resuscitate (DNR)/Do Not Attempt Resuscitation (DNAR) or other important medical information.

2. If you (or a family member) becomes ill and your medical doctor believes that you need extra care in an Intensive Care Unit (ICU) or Mechanical Ventilation (breathing machine) you will be assessed for eligibility based only on your specific condition.

3. Some patients will be extremely sick and very unlikely to survive their illness even with critical treatment. Treating these patients would take away resources for patients who might survive.

4. Patients who are not eligible for ICU or ventilator care will receive treatment for pain control and comfort measures. Some conditions that are likely (to) make you not eligible include:

Severe heart, lung, kidney or liver failure
Terminal cancers
Severe trauma or burns
5. Patients who have ventilator or ICU care withdrawn will receive pain control and comfort measures:

6. Patients who are treated with a ventilator or ICU care may have these treatments stopped if they do not improve over time. If they do not improve this means that the patient has a poor chance of surviving the illness — even if the care was continued. This decision will be based on medical condition and likelihood of getting better. It will not be based on other reasons such as race, gender, health insurance status, ability to pay for care, sexual orientation, employment status or immigration status. All patients are evaluated for survival using the same measures.

7. If the treatment team has determined that you or your family members does not meet criteria to receive critical care or that ICU treatments will be stopped, talk to your doctor. Your doctor can ask for a review by a team of medical experts (a Clinical Review Committee evaluation.)"

The health system responded to Bagley's Twitter post at 11:22 p.m. Thursday, writing in a Twitter post: "With a pandemic, we must be prepared for worst case. With collective wisdom from our industry, we crafted a policy to provide guidance for making difficult patient care decisions. We hope never to have to apply them. We will always utilize every resource to care for our patients."

The health system hosted a virtual press conference Friday to further explain it.

Munkara told journalists that the document was developed by Henry Ford Health System's ethics committee, "and has been reviewed by our specialists and experts in critical care medicine, pulmonary care, our hospitalist group, our chief medical officers, nursing leaders ... over 50 people have looked at that."

He said health systems around the country have similar plans at the ready for pandemic response.

"These sorts of guidelines are not new to large health care institutions," he said. "And in fact, there's been ongoing conversations among us across the nation, looking at numerous different guidelines. They've been shared widely amongst us professionally, and our teams and work together to develop which ones we thought would work best for our system."


Tyler Joshua
@tylerjoshua80
· Mar 26, 2020
Replying to @HenryFordNews
Are you abandoning your patients? What does @HFHS_WLassiter3 think about this?

View image on Twitter

Henry Ford News
✔
@HenryFordNews
With a pandemic, we must be prepared for worst case. With collective wisdom from our industry, we crafted a policy to provide guidance for making difficult patient care decisions. We hope never to have to apply them. We will always utilize every resource to care for our patients.

77
12:30 AM - Mar 27, 2020
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57 people are talking about this
By Friday afternoon, Michigan had 3,657 confirmed cases of the novel coronavirus and 92 deaths, according to the state Department of Health and Human Services.

In recent days, the CEO of Beaumont Health described the current crisis as "our worst nightmare" and the novel coronavirus health crisis as a "biological tsunami." He warned the public of limited supplies and the need to stay at home to limit the spread. Gov. Gretchen Whitmer issued an executive order on March 23 requiring residents to stay in place until April 13.

On Thursday, President Trump discussed providing medical aid with military assistance in New York.

Munkara said like other health systems in the region, Henry Ford also is seeing a surge in hospitalizations of about 100 new COVID-19 patients a day, and for now, he said, the health system is managing.

"There has been some concern regarding our capacities in our hospitals," he said. "Yes, we are busy in our hospitals. We are busy for regular times, but these are not regular times. And this is why we develop emergency plans."

The hospital system already has converted part of its Fairlane Medical Center in Dearborn into a 16-bed inpatient unit for non-coronavirus patients.

DIG DEEPER
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More than 20 patients may have coronavirus at nursing home in Roseville
Trump attacks GM and Ford on Twitter, demands they make ventilators now
Coronavirus pollution: Gloves, masks, wipes carelessly discarded amid pandemic
Henry Ford Health officials confirm letter outlining life and death protocols for COVID-19
President Trump slams Gov. Whitmer as he weighs disaster request for Michigan

Henry Ford Macomb Hospital converted eight operating rooms into intensive care beds, and Henry Ford Wyandotte Hospital is converting its surgical units to a dedicated COVID-19 unit.

All non-time sensitive procedures, surgeries and clinic appointments are postponed. Complex neurosurgery, advanced ophthalmology and cancer procedures are being performed temporarily at Henry Ford West Bloomfield Hospital instead of Henry Ford Hospital.

It is also looking at ways to maximize the supplies it has, Munkara said. Henry Ford plans to convert some anesthesia machines into ventilators. In same cases, he said, it will be able to share a single ventilator among two patients

"We have all the equipment that we need to be able to share and continue at double or triple the capacity that we have at the present time," he said.

More: Michigan seeking field hospital locations to treat coronavirus, TCF might be among them

And if there comes a time when the coronavirus surge overwhelms Henry Ford, and its hospitals cannot handle the load, patients will be transferred to other hospitals in the state with more open beds before the protocols described in the letter would take effect.

"Our over-arching goals throughout our hospitals is to make sure that in case of extreme emergency and extreme crisis, we are providing the highest rate of survival during that pandemic," he said, "and at the same time, being transparent to our patients and to their families, about our health care in how we are making decisions. Our clinical decisions are always governed by objective medical evidence. This is how we have built these ... guidelines."
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 10:36 AM
Quote:
LOL you guys wouldn't know leadership if it bit you in the ass


rofl Says the guys who voted for trump. rofl Real leaders don’t bite or even show their teeth.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 10:47 AM
Originally Posted By: DevilDawg2847
Originally Posted By: OldColdDawg
my biggest sticking point with Trump in all of this is that the governors have to make nice to him to get aid. That's BS.

I expected the lies, exaggerations, lack of knowledge, and pitiful leadership because he's Trump. But making them suck up for funds to help their states is too much, way too much.


LOL you guys wouldn't know leadership if it bit you in the ass

He hasn't made anyone suck up for funds. What is required is an effective partnership between the two levels of gov't. That can't occur if Newsom or Cuomo were acting like, say someone like you or any of the others around here then turning around and demanding things be done.

It's abundantly clear that most of you guys have little to no experience with the responsibility of having to resolve an emergency. Sure, emergencies and crises pop up in our lives, but those are typically contained to a close friend or family member, and much of the solution is farmed out to others.

But you guys don't know anything about identifying multiple victims or causes, identifying and taking control of environmental factors to help contain a situation, identifying resources and coordinating the logistics. You guys have no real understanding of the importance of helping people find a psychological equilibrium if you will, a measure of calm where they can think and act rationally and be directed. Or the importance of putting small goals in front of people to help them endure.

All of that stuff is irrelevant for you guys. If it were relevant, your criticism would be different i.e. constructive. But it isn't because saving lives isn't as important to most of you as you pompously claim it is. Its' like, 3rd on your list of priorities.

1st: is the satisfaction of your own ego.

2nd: is exploiting the situation for political benefit

(1st and 2nd have this incestual relationship that feeds in on itself.

3rd... then maybe lives.

We get it. You guys don't think highly of Trump. That's fine. It's not required. But you guys put that dislike so far first and foremost that you can't even be objectively critical. Is it you can't, or you choose not to?

Will you guys at least be honest about your bias and hypocrisy? Bash Trump for not doing things sooner. Ok... you do know that the only way to have gotten these "lock downs" in effect on such a scale right out of the gate would to have done it as a Federal order. You guys would have called him a fascist Nazi for implementing it without just cause.

And look at it this way: I think we can all agree that generally speaking the US wasn't as prepared as it could have been to tackle a global pandemic. If we look back there's plenty of blame to go around politically. But even if you don't want to mess with that and just start with we weren't prepared...

how much sense does it make to call for and implement measures you aren't able to put in effect at that time?

WE HAD A NATIONAL RUN ON FRIGGIN TOILET PAPER and NO ONE knows why.. all in response to the prospect of going on a 2 week lock down.

If the Trump admin has been as incompetent as you claim and the virus is as deadly as it is binge reported to be then the death count should be much higher than it is. Much higher. We've been dealing with it long enough. And when you look at how far apart and unrelated the higher profile people who tested positive have been, it would suggest the transmission rates are much higher than being given credit for.

Unless you really think that the Brazilian prime minister, several high ranking Iranians, an NBA player, and Tom Hanks were all hanging out at the same food truck around the same time...






All that blah blah and not one bit of defense of him making governors kiss up to him. Do you think any of the dem governors respect him in the slightest? GMAFB He holds the power of the office and they want him to use that to help them, as for the man, they all know he's a jackass and a fool. You have grown ass people around him every day just trying to put out the fires he starts by running his mouth on crap that he has no clue about! That's leadership? lmao If Obama had acted this way y'all would have revolted. Your whole rant was BS, you are just triggered because everyone can see he's a blithering idiot. The whole world knows it, but 30% of America refuses to believe it just like they deny science. Show me anybody complementing Trump's leadership and I will show you a clueless fool or an ass kisser, sometimes both.

And the death rate is still climbing exponentially, so be careful about following what your leader tells you... Packed churches on Easter would be a huge mistake. I can't believe you are making light of the seriousness of this virus. I don't think it's on the scale of the meteor that took out the dinosaurs but it's damn sure on the scale of 'if not handled properly' we could suffer losses in the 100s of thousands, maybe more maybe less but all we have to go on is predictions made from incomplete data. Either way, we are better off erring on the side of caution even if that means drastically overreacting.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 11:12 AM
I’m afraid just telling people to self quarantine isn’t working at all. Cases are doubling every two days now. trump wasted so much time getting mobilized for the trump virus war. Martial law is coming folks. All elections will be called off. Mark it down. Long live the king.
Posted By: Jester Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 12:52 PM
Thanks for the love guys. Stay healthy my friends.
Posted By: DiamDawg Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 01:36 PM
God Bless & Good Luck ... thumbsup
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 01:55 PM
This post would make a lot of sense.......

If it weren’t for the fact that the US is now #1 in corona virus cases.

Also, I know what good leadership is.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 02:33 PM
Originally Posted By: Swish
This post would make a lot of sense.......

If it weren’t for the fact that the US is now #1 in corona virus cases.

Also, I know what good leadership is.


It will interesting to see which countries come to our aid or not.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:09 PM
Originally Posted By: 40YEARSWAITING
Wow is right!

Reminds me of Pits panicked posts!


You keep making excuses for inept leadership at the top. Deplorable.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:17 PM
Originally Posted By: DevilDawg2847
We're not going to make any real progress getting past this until they start cutting away the hype, and the panic and we stop giving legitimacy to those trying to exploit the situation.

About 70% of all this is legit, the other 30% is hype and attempts to induce panic. I understand there are times that people needed to be spurred to action quick, fast and in a hurry. But the problem is we've implemented some very serious measures based more on panic than on factual information, the consequences of which aren't being given consideration.


Why don't you explain the difference to us since you seem to know all about it?

Is the hype when they show us interviews of health care professionals who do not have equipment in the hospitals? Is it showing us the victims of this virus in the ICU's? Is the hype when they show a doctor sleeping in a tent in their garage due to the fear of spreading it to his family?

Maybe it's the model of what to expect moving forward from the experts that have studied such things?

That kind of hype?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:26 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Originally Posted By: DevilDawg2847
We're not going to make any real progress getting past this until they start cutting away the hype, and the panic and we stop giving legitimacy to those trying to exploit the situation.

About 70% of all this is legit, the other 30% is hype and attempts to induce panic. I understand there are times that people needed to be spurred to action quick, fast and in a hurry. But the problem is we've implemented some very serious measures based more on panic than on factual information, the consequences of which aren't being given consideration.


Why don't you explain the difference to us since you seem to know all about it?

Is the hype when they show us interviews of health care professionals who do not have equipment in the hospitals? Is it showing us the victims of this virus in the ICU's? Is the hype when they show a doctor sleeping in a tent in their garage due to the fear of spreading it to his family?

Maybe it's the model of what to expect moving forward from the experts that have studied such things?

That kind of hype?
GOPers call reporting the truth,........ sensationalism, and fear mongering .............that kind of hype. Pffft
Posted By: Swish Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:33 PM
Trump Says He Told Pence to Ignore Governors in Hard-Hit Areas If They Are ‘Not Appreciative’

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-says-told-pence-ignore-233921228.html

It’s funny how devil gets mad at us over elected officials. If this is devils idea of leadership, then I have to seriously question if he knows what leadership is himself.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Covid-19 continues. - 03/28/20 03:39 PM
All you have to do is look at the timing of Trump's daily press conferences. He has them right during your local news and the national network news time slots.

Often times these are the only time slots people have in their schedule to watch daily news and is a habit of so many in our nation.

This way instead of getting the facts of what is actually going on in this nation, he preempts that with his propaganda/ditch the democrats/disinformation/campaign speech rhetoric to keep people from knowing what the hell is really going on.

Even then he says so much stupid crap he isn't doing himself any favors.

I watch our local CBS affiliate for my local news and watch their national coverage. They were letting him get away with it for a while. Finally this week they just started cutting him off and showing our local and national news in its normal time slot.

But if anyone thought it was some accident that he chose the time slot to stop network national news from being televised, they aren't a thinking person.
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