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It really stinks.

It is hard to win in the NFL. We went through 1-31. We know.

Personally I have faith in Berry and Stefanski. They will solve this. Both are smart men who know all that goes on inside the team.

Whatever they decide. I will not question.

My opinion is Odell is better off not playing the rest of this year. He has shoulder issues that have to be fixed. If your labrum is tore it has to impact your ability to catch the ball.

Odell is one player. He doesn't play defense and he has had little impact on the offense.

The reality is when he didn't play. The offense was more productive. It does not matter why.


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I agree with you on one thing. If he needs off the team, then send him home or cut him.

If he's a diva and drags the locker room down then send him home or cut him. Honestly, I doubt it makes a difference to him. If the dude is as banged up and he's saying, then the super-long offseason could do him wonders. With our injury situation, I don't think it makes a ton of sense to flush a roster spot down the toilet for the rest of the year.


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I'm not in the locker room and neither are you so we don't know what's really going on with OBJ. My hunch is he reared his ugly head when the trade rumors became constant and after a sit down with Stefanski it was decided that for the betterment of the team the Browns would move forward without him. I don't believe that his Dad or Labron had much to do with the situation except that I would be willing to bet that Stefanski was critical of the problem going out to social media instead of staying in house.

That aid, I'm not blaming the Browns woes on OBJ. Has OBJ lived up to his contract or been the type of leader needed for this young team - Nope, I think he's failed miserably at that. Now any true businessman or coach would tell you that trying fix 10 things at once is a plan to fail. Picking 2-3 key areas to fix and then fixing them for good before moving on is the secret to success. So what has Stefanski fixed and what is next on the agenda?

1. Stefanski brought a revised attitude and concept of team.
2. GM and Stefanski worked together to make the best draft choices and FA signings within their capabilities.
3. Stefanski taught the team how to win
4. Stefanski has let go those players that didn't, couldn't. or wouldn't buy into his philosophy. (I think OBJ falls into this too)
5. Taught Baker to limit his mistakes on the field.
I'm sure there's more but this are the big points. So what's next to address?

1. Adjusting your run scheme to a more balanced or even a little leaning passing concept to capitalize on your franchise QB's skill set and talented WR and TE weapons.
2. Set up schemes that allows your QB to be successful. A more successful passing scheme will enhance the running game. Look if Baker is more of a threat outside the pocket then move him. Admit that what you are doing now is not consistently successful.
3. For god's sake, learn how to close out games when you're leading and making real time game scheme adjustments as needed.
4. Please start working everyday on developing a feared 2-minute offense. PRACTICE IT - PRACTICE IT - PRACTICE IT

The other stuff will have to wait but these fixes are past due and critical to the future of the Browns. Baker needs to grow but Stefanski needs to grow too because as it stands today, they are both underutilized and hurting the team.


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Despite the "opinions" of others.

Baker is the quarterback of the Browns. He will remain the quarterback until Berry and Stefanski decide otherwise.

IMO they believe they can win with Baker as their guy.

The "opinions" of people on this Board have no bearing on what they believe.

Frankly, the Baker opinions for the most part are non professional.

None of us are are part of the team. We do not have a real frame of reference. We don't attend meetings and practice everyday.

Most get their opinions from other sources or drum up slanted distorted stats.

It is not based upon daily visuals and inside knowledge of the team.


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Originally Posted by Westy15
I saw an article where Odell himself posted on IG that maybe this thing w Baker and the Browns isn’t working after all. Then apparently he quickly deleted it.
Idk if it’s 100 percent accurate.

That IG post allegedly posted by OBJ was fake. The dead give away was the guy that initially said he captured the screen shot and said OBJ took it down immediately showed the post had been up for 2 hrs. Lol. It was a bad photoshop job.

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Originally Posted by oobernoober
Originally Posted by Westy15
How can someone else’s actions (even if they are related to you) cost you your job?
There has to be more to this story….

I'd be right there with you in this case (classic example of why I hate social media). But where is Odell? He hasn't said a peep as far as I can see.

Baker also said yesterday that OBJ hadn't reached out to him at all.

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I know everyone says that OBJ is a great teammate. But would a great teammate have his dad merk the QB and then go radio silent?

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jc...


Odell Beckham Jr.’s dad strikes again, posting a shoutout to the producer of the video that’s hastening the end of his son’s career with the Cleveland Browns
Mary Kay Cabot, cleveland.com - 30m ago

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CLEVELAND, Ohio — Odell Beckham Jr.’s struck again on Thursday, posting a shouting on Instagram to the producer of the video he posted Tuesday that will lead to the end of his son’s Browns career.

“WHHHHAAAA....Shout out to Jdaddy Productions on Youtube.com for making this video, a week ago, which aloud me to find it post it 3days after...” Beckham Sr. posted on his verified account, which has 120,000 followers. He added a praying hands emoji and strong-arm emoji, and the hashtag #imafather1st.


On Tuesday, Beckham Sr. posted the 11-minute video produced by John Hallack, who created a montage of all the times Beckham has been apparently open this season and Baker Mayfield missed him or avoided throwing it to him.

The post created a firestorm inside Browns headquarters, and was the last straw for Beckham remaining with the team.

Beckham’s camp ask for a trade, a source told Cleveland.com, and then for his release when a trade didn’t happen.

Beckham Sr.’s shoutout to Hallack, a double-down on the original post, pretty much confirms that Beckham has played his last ball for the Cleveland Browns.

Mayfield admitted he was as surprised as anyone that Beckham Sr. would publicly call him out on social media, which included “likes’' and support of comments that supported his premise.

“Hurt? No. Surprised? Yes,’' Mayfield said. “I think there are different things that play a factor into it. I have had conversation with his dad before man to man, face to face. I was pretty surprised by the video and the intentions and the feelings behind it. I would be lying if I said otherwise. But hurt? No. I am good. I will be alright.”

Beckham has been excused from practice Thursday for the second straight day, and has likely played his last ball for the Browns.

His agent, Zeke Sandhu, is talking to Browns GM Andrew Berry about some kind of an exit plan, whether it’ s a release, a release with a settlement, keeping him on the roster and making him inactive, suspending him, placing him on IR, or something else.




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Originally Posted by Swish
I’ve seen how many times he’s open. Obviously people are gonna point to some of the drops he had, but it’s clear OBJ is open more often than not.

That being said, if baker isn’t looking his way, is that because baker doesn’t think he can get the ball that far to OBJ? Or is it Stefanski telling baker not to even try to make those throws?
I will offer my usual disclaimer that I'm far from a Xs and Os guru.... but from watching, it really appears that Bakers first reads are always short throws... so he's looking at them first, if they are open, he throws it. The only time he really even looks downfield is when everything underneath is covered up or when he is forced from the pocket early.. then you never know what he's looking at.

I've seen quite a few incidences where OBJ beats his man right off the LOS and Baker is scanning the other side of the field.... I don't know what his progressions are supposed to be, I can only assume he's going through them like he's supposed to... but our lack of even attempting deep throws is disturbing and I don't know how much of it is Baker and how much of it is Stefanski.. but it's not just OBJ, we just aren't attempting deep throws really to anybody. I have a hard time believing Baker doesn't trust OBJ or has some personal vendetta against him, even with all of the hoopla about it, he still leads the team in targets.

This also begs the question, if we aren't going to throw it deep, why did we draft a questionable WRs, whose only claim to fame is that he's lightening fast... if we aren't going to use him deep, why did we draft him? We did try to use him early in the season and Baker got crap for targeting him too much.. now he rarely gets targeted at all.

And when I say deep throws, I'm not even talking about 15 to 20 yard deep crosses.. I'm talking about the go route, down the sidelines, over the shoulder throws..

Last edited by DCDAWGFAN; 11/04/21 11:43 AM.

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Originally Posted by Swish
why are some of yall talking about OBJ as if he's toxic like the NY days?

dude has been here and hasnt caused any drama. there's more whining from Baker's wife than OBJ.


some of you posters have been trying to set up OBJ as the scapegoat since day one. crap is sad.

if yall think OBJ is washed, then it shouldnt had been an issue to just release him and let him go to another team. he wasn't gonna do anything somewhere else, right?

right?

I suspect that most people, me included, think that he was in on his dads efforts. He could let his father take the heat. Therefore he could deny his involvement.. My guess is that the Browns saw through that..


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If OBJ didn't want his dad going scorched Earth on social media, my guess is it wouldn't have happened. But if his dad did go rogue, then the obvious reaction would be to deny... or at least say SOMETHING. OBJ going radio silent on social media is a pretty big indicator, IMO. Now you got the rest of the locker room coalescing around each other... and Baker since he's still there.


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its a good question.

which now i have to remind the board one thing: OBJ and jarvis both had over 1000 yards receiving in 2019. and obj played that entire year hurt as well.

at this point i dunno whats going on. but man this sucks because once again, we have all this talent and seem to be headed the wrong direction.


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and now OBJ leaks to Josina Anderson that he’ll come back if asked LOL. Whatever dude.

I think we’re trying to cut him with cause.

Problem is: we technically can’t just pay him to stay away if he wants to be here (per the CBA)


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I want this drama squelched ASAP. The quickest way to do that (IMO) is to take care of business vs the Bengals. A big big part of that will be for the passing game to magically start clicking again (w/o OBJ, it would appear).

I don't think anybody will be able to explain to me how a passing game gets better when you take a rare specimen like OBJ off the field... but I'm just 'whatever' at this point.


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it will be interesting for sure.

cause even if obj was just a pure decoy for defenses, we got rid of the decoy...


people forget obj was a good blocker as well. and atleast made defense honor the passing game.

how much more crowded will the LoS be?


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Well, it can't be much more crowded than it was throughout the second half of the Steelers game. Yeesh, that was some tough sledding for Chubb.

I don't know why, but I have a feeling the passing game is going to go off this Sunday. Probably more hope than anything....


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Originally Posted by Damanshot
Originally Posted by Swish
why are some of yall talking about OBJ as if he's toxic like the NY days?

dude has been here and hasnt caused any drama. there's more whining from Baker's wife than OBJ.


some of you posters have been trying to set up OBJ as the scapegoat since day one. crap is sad.

if yall think OBJ is washed, then it shouldnt had been an issue to just release him and let him go to another team. he wasn't gonna do anything somewhere else, right?

right?

I suspect that most people, me included, think that he was in on his dads efforts. He could let his father take the heat. Therefore he could deny his involvement.. My guess is that the Browns saw through that..
I have a hard time believing his dad found all of that aerial footage, put in the graphics, and put it to music.. maybe he did, maybe he paid somebody to do it for him... but it looked like footage that would have had to come from an inside source since you don't often see that view during the games or during replays...

I don't have anything against OBJ, he's been a good teammate since he got here, he plays hard, he blocks hard... but, and everybody can have their own version of why, it's not working.


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The video was made by some guy on YouTube and OBJ Sr. posted it on Instagram.

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Originally Posted by cfrs15
The video was made by some guy on YouTube and OBJ Sr. posted it on Instagram.
Ah, ok.


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Originally Posted by Milk Man
As a season ticket holder, the Browns give me a subscription to NFL Game Pass for free which includes access to the All 22. Surely, the rest of the league has access to the All 22 and can see OBJ running wide open all the time and Baker just holding him back. So why no serious offers for him? Salary be dammed if he'll put you over the top.
Woah... Is that for all season tix holders? I'd like to know protocol for taking advantage of that perk...


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The All-22 stuff is made available 24 hours after the broadcast ends, as opposed to the regular and condensed versions being available usually immediately (but no more than an hour) after the game ends.


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Yeah, I paid for it one year when I was in St Louis and had no real hope of watching Browns games. I'm just wondering how NFL Game Pass is free to season tix holders. Wasn't aware of this perk and have no idea how to take advantage of it. Nothing on the Browns website, I'll have to call my rep.


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After 2020 ended there was great optimism about the coming year.

The main reason behind that optimism was the second year with the same coaching staff and many returning players.
The new players on defense would upgrade that unit significantly.

The offense in the second half of last year was cooking. The highly rated OL was returning in full strength.
The return of Odell and being in the same scheme with a full off season to practice with no covid. Well that could only mean the offense would be better.
What happened?

Injury for one thing.

Odell did not come back. Everybody said he looked great. He worked hard on his rehab. Most felt he would start the first game.

That did not happen. He practiced some. Looked ready. Then held back because he felt he was not ready.

Then he does return and here we are.

I never bought into we were better without him. Logic says you are not better when you have a great talent not playing.
My thought was we got good because we matured together and were ready to play better. That is why we were better in the second half. Not because Odell didn't play.

Well we are about to find out because Odell caused this firestorm. He cooked this up with his father. It doesn't matter at this point why or who is to blame.

It does not appear that this current situation can be resolved with Odell returning and begging forgiveness. His goal is clear. He wants out.

So Berry will have to do this asap and do it with the best interest of the team as best as possible.


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Originally Posted by DCDAWGFAN
[quote=Swish]
I've seen quite a few incidences where OBJ beats his man right off the LOS and Baker is scanning the other side of the field.... I don't know what his progressions are supposed to be, I can only assume he's going through them like he's supposed to... but our lack of even attempting deep throws is disturbing and I don't know how much of it is Baker and how much of it is Stefanski.. but it's not just OBJ, we just aren't attempting deep throws really to anybody. I have a hard time believing Baker doesn't trust OBJ or has some personal vendetta against him, even with all of the hoopla about it, he still leads the team in targets.

This also begs the question, if we aren't going to throw it deep, why did we draft a questionable WRs, whose only claim to fame is that he's lightening fast... if we aren't going to use him deep, why did we draft him? We did try to use him early in the season and Baker got crap for targeting him too much.. now he rarely gets targeted at all.

If this is the case and Baker is going through his reads as he's supposed to, why aren't their plays designed to where Obj was the first read? They know he struggles to go through his progressions and tends to lock onto his first read.

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j/c

Okay, let me get this straight. So OBJ is behind what his dad is doing on social media? Then does that also mean that Baker is behind all of the things his wife posts on social media? If so, why isn't Baker stopping it? I'm shocked why people don't understand how dumb that sounds. Actually his dad saw it posted on social media and in turn reposted it himself. Do you really think in the middle of reading and posting on social media he stopped to call OBJ and cook up some scheme with his son? That's simply foolish talk.

And someone even acted as though it was crazy that OBJ said he would come back if he were asked to. So he was told to stay home. If you were told not to show up yesterday and today, wouldn't it make sense you would have to be told or asked to return?

I realize we all now live in a world where if you can't make up a conspiracy theory it spoils any event that happens. But good Lord people, this sounds like a lot of you are seeking a job as a writer on a soap opera.

There has been nothing but rave reports of what a great teammate OBJ has been. Nothing but rave reports of how hard he has worked. I'm not sure exactly what the hell has happened but one thing has been clear for anyone who has followed the NFL for any length of time.

I keep seeing it posted how "Stefanski has kept the drama down since he's been here". That's true. But when you're winning, when you make the playoffs, that's an easy thing to do. When things start going south it becomes much harder. That goes for all 32 teams and coaches in the league. This is a natural part of losing and exactly what we saw here before when we were losing.


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How dumb it sounds?

I don't know about others, but I think there is a world of difference between Emily calling out hordes of fans and their "Baker sucks" mentality and a player's dad basically calling out one player and blaming him for his son's crappy season.

Personally, if my dad put that crap up I'd have it down in five minutes and apologize for his frustration. By saying nothing, letting it ride and basically ghosting Baker from the time it's posted, I'd say most people would assume that's an official "co-sign".


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Yeah, it seems as if he really wanted to stay here..He’d reach out to coach or Baker.
Or release a statement…
Seems as if he is wanting to move on or ego isn’t letting him apologize…
It’s difficult to read between the lines and speculate.
I’m just curious why it’s taking 2 or more days to release him.
There aren’t a lot of options now that the trade deadline has passed.
Sort of making me think they could be discussing keeping him, despite all of the reports saying he’s a goner.

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I know I had no control over what my dad did or said. Maybe you did. Secondly, you seem to act as though he should call his dad out in public or something? Is that how you would treat your dad if he said something you didn't approve of? OBJ has said nothing. Not about his dad or the team. That's actually the best course of action he could take. Now if he were out there blabbing things all over the place to the press? That would be a legit reason to complain.

Quote
most people would assume that's an official "co-sign".

Most people take things they want to take them. No basis for it and no reason for it other than that's what they want to take from it. I forgot that in todays society if you don't rush to call a friend about a personal business matter you have "ghosted them". As far as some of you are reaching I can't imagine how long your arms must be.


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I don’t know what has gone on, all I know is I’m bummed that OBJ didn’t bring the team the successI’d hoped he would. Note: I don’t know WHY his potential never materialized, be it him or elsewhere, but, I wanted a stud WR, and hoped he would fill that role. I don’t blame anyone, because I know jack-[censored] about what really went down.

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Pit...come on, man...you can't possibly buy into this line that it was just his daddy playing around on social media...?

I think Baker said it best when he commented on his " man to man, face to face comment ", referring to an earlier conversation he had with OBSR. last year or the year before.

I don't see anyone from the ODell camp making any effort to talk to Baker face to face or man to man...do you?

Kneecapping his QB, in interviews and on social media..it's a tactic that OBJ has used before.

link

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The LAST thing you want a player to do in this situation is speak to the press! Reach out to the coach or Baker? The coach has reached out to him two days in a row. He told him not to come to practice both days. Why should he reach out to Baker? Baker has nothing to do with him being told not to come to practice. Baker doesn't control his contract. All he would be doing is dragging Baker into the middle of all of this. Why should he do that?

If he talked to the press everyone would be on his ass for doing it. I think people would blame him for dragging Baker into it if Baker said he spoke to him. I mean if Baker said he talked to him the press would be hounding Baker to know what he said. Does Baker need that?

No matter what OBJ does he's going to get crap at this point because everyone's mind is already made up.


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Then please tell me what he said or did to "knee cap" Baker. Heck, his dad didn't even make the video.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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If you think his Dad would deliberately do anything to hurt his son if his son asked him not to do it, you're likely a little out in left field. There's no way his Dad does this - and he remains silent while his Dad doubles down on it - unless he's 100% Ok with his Dad doing what he's doing. Adding in the likes of LeBron & other celebrities chiming in, and it is nearly impossible to not clearly see it as being the coordinated effort that it is.

My guess? He and his agent want to get him to one of the L.A. teams.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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and for the record, I want him to stay. I want it all to work out. I *hate* that once again we're in mid-season drama metldown land. I want OBJ & Baker & Ski to be bosom buddies and BFFs and everyone mesh and this offense thrive.
I've avoided deriding Baker, or OBJ, or anyone else and have stayed patient and tried to see what else might be going on..... but, this one is just too much to ignore. There is enough there to see it for what it is.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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Originally Posted by FATE
Originally Posted by Milk Man
As a season ticket holder, the Browns give me a subscription to NFL Game Pass for free which includes access to the All 22. Surely, the rest of the league has access to the All 22 and can see OBJ running wide open all the time and Baker just holding him back. So why no serious offers for him? Salary be dammed if he'll put you over the top.
Woah... Is that for all season tix holders? I'd like to know protocol for taking advantage of that perk...

I would assume it's free to all season ticket holders. I've received this benefit every of being a STH. The Browns have always sent an email with the free promo code for Game Pass at the start of the season.

Call your rep if you can't dig up the old email. I'm sure they could you the promo code to use.

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In case you missed it "LeBron & other celebrities" are always on social media running their mouth.

If you would chastise your dad publicly that's up to you. I know I never would have.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Originally Posted by FATE
Personally, if my dad put that crap up I'd have it down in five minutes and apologize for his frustration.

Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Secondly, you seem to act as though he should call his dad out in public or something? Is that how you would treat your dad if he said something you didn't approve of?
Yep. rofl I said nothing of the sort, but any convo with you is par for the course.

Have a nice day Pit.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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You too.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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