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I was not in favor of hiring Stefanski. However, I can admit when I am wrong. The guy is a very good offensive mind and he has garnered a lot of respect around the league, even if hasn't w/the Baker fan base.

I love the complexities that he has acquired from the Shannahan/Kubiak tree. Plays are designed as building blocks. Often, several plays set-up a huge play that a variance. The run blocking schemes are out of this world. The route trees are strategic. I feel very good about this offense moving forward now that they have a trigger man.

jc

Welcome back. At some point the last few days I wondered what you thought of this QB fiasco.

I don't believe that, but according to some on here, DW was all we were missing.

If you don't think DW is an upgrade over Baker from a pure football perspective, I don't know what to tell you.

It is very telling and encouraging (again, from a football perspective) that we just replaced a QB that is being talked about having to add a draft pick to get someone to trade for his contract with a QB that multiple teams were willing to give up 3 1st round picks for.

Did I say that? Here's a clue: NO, I didn't.


Here's what I said, since you're struggling with the written word: I expect DW to carry the team.

How am I supposed to take this statement, which you made in this thread: "But I read all this "he's such an upgrade......" stuff. Maybe so."

That statement, coupled with tone in your other posts, made me feel like you did not feel that DW was a definitive upgrade over Baker. Sorry if I read that wrong, but those were your words.

If that's not what you meant with that statement, then maybe you need to choose your written words better.

j/c...

Or maybe you need better comprehension.

Everything I've read from the pro DW fans is he's such an upgrade. Great. Every year I hear/read how "Oh, this is the year, we got X Y Z" Can't be stopped.

I bought in for a number of years. I'm not buying in and getting my hopes up this coming year. Does that make sense to you??

DO IT, then I'll buy in. Tired of it all. And I'm sure I'm not the only one. My hopes for this coming year? Win more than we lose.

The 'hype' people? Super Bowl.

You may be expecting too much. He never carried Houston. Houston only had two winning seasons ('18 & '19) in the five years he's been a Texan and their offense was never ranked higher than middle of the road, never even cracked the Top 10 in points or yards. In every one of the other three seasons they had only FOUR wins. Yes, they had issues, but if he can carry a team, that's probably not what it looks like.

If we don't make it to the 2nd round of the playoffs... we should probably fire Stefanski or force him to turn over playcalling duties

$230,000,000.00 Guaranteed.

He'd better carry the team.

Those expectations are fine... I've watched DW for many years... he can put a team on his shoulders..... I dunno if we're a SB contender... but we're a better team with DW on the field....

Watson will be here the duration of the contract. Plus, the annual dollars won't be that big of a deal starting next year.

If it somehow becomes an issue, they'll restructure it in two years and add years onto it.

The contract really is a non issue.

And he will carry the team. I'm just glad the team recognized you cannot win without great QB play.

We will find out.

no one knows the cap for next year

Based on that upward trajectory, the cap is expected to approach pre-pandemic expectations — perhaps $220 million to $225 million — by 2023.
that's not that much of an increase considering we are at $208.2 this year.
2021 was 182 million
2020 was 182.5
2019 was 188.2

The way I read Arch's comments is pretty straight forward - and Arch feel free to correct me if I am off base - but it seems to be Arch is simply stating that Watson needs to carry this team to wins and the play ffs and to the SB. That was the expectation for Baker. It seems he wants to be sure Watson gets critiqued the same way Baker was - so that if the defense gives up a later 4thQ score and we lose, Watson still gets the blame for not being better for the other 90% of the game. I read Arch and presume he is thinking of so many posters who have judged Baker in the harshest of lights and simply indicated that no matter what else went on in the game, Baker should have carried the team.

As for the salary and the cap and the contract - I don't think anyone cares about how much a player makes, the issue is any impact on the team and hitting the Cap ceiling and what other players / talent then has to be released in order to balance the books. Yes contracts can be reworked and the cap can be manipulated - but at some point huge contracts make an impact. There is a reason Tom Brady always had a low cap impact and team friendly contracts - [1] his wife is stupendously rich [2] it helps the team.

Lots and lots to unravel and play out on this entire situation. Just like the rookie signings and other trades in past years - we won't know how this plays out for some time.

The good news, at this time we appear to still be in healthy shape cap wise - today:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/

We clearly need a DE (Clowney) Jarvis coming back would also be nice. That's going to eat into the $20M number shown here. But I think we are operating from a position of strength and flexibility. When Baker gets traded - that will help also.

I agree. Our DL is currently my biggest concern. We need Clowney, another viable DE, and at least two DTs

I will always give my honest assessment on any player, good or bad.

The issue you had was my assessment of Baker did not align with your emotional attachment to Baker. It was a trigger. You weren't the only one. At various times in Baker's career I have praised him and criticized him. Last year was mostly criticism. I'm just being honest about what I see. The only reason you thought it was harsh is because you were viewing it through an emotional lense.

It looks like the league agrees with me. I actually feel.bad for Baker at this moment though I think he did a lot of it to himself.

yall know i'm on the DW train, but Arch is correct here.

while DW doesn't have to carry a team nearly as much because of how talented our offense is, there are gonna be times where he's gotta match other QBs throw for throw. we are gonna be in situations where he has to put the team on his back and throw us to a win. our run game and o line isn't gonna be perfect week in and week out, as no offense ever is.

DW has more game winners and comebacks than Baker despite playing with OVERALL lesser talent. DW on this roster means he shouldn't have to do that as much, but 230 mill says he better perform.

obviously, people are right in bringing up that this year could possibly be a wash due to the potential suspension. but this isn't a 1 year deal. we got him for the next 5 years.

i expect atleast a couple AFC title appearances. anything less is a massive disappointment.

but all it takes (a dream, cause browns) is one SB appearance and the contract will always seem like a bargain.

I think a lot depends on how his suspension works out. Half a season of Jacoby Brissett won't be easy to overcome in a stacked AFC.

I'd keep the posts to what you think about players - because based on your posts and assumptions on other posters, you are so far wrong it's not even funny. Love your spin on "emotions" too.... I guess PFF were emotionally attached and looking through an emotional lens when they had Baker graded as the 5th best QB in the NFL from weeks 8-17 in 2020? Get out of here with your "emotional" put downs and takes.

DeShaun needs more elite WR. Cooper isn’t even close to be enough and Juice best before date was a couple of years ago. Compare to the Rams. Cinci and the Bills has a elite tandem. Mahones boy have Hill and Schuster, not to mention they have one of the best TE in the league.

Last season we were crippled with injuries, I expect a similar scenario this season. Where is the depth in our roster?

Might not sound like it, but this is a sincere question...

I thought Amari Cooper is a legit #1 WR, and he's one where his skillset and attitude fit this offense well (runs good routes, not a diva, doesn't need all the targets, etc). Am I mistaken?

It appears your emotional lens along with many others wouldn't let you see a torn labrum.

Did they ever show it on TV? Cause no, I did not see it.

And you certainly seem to act as though you didn't know it either when judging his 2021 performance. And yes, if you didn't see the shoulder harness you weren't watching. They did show that.

Well now lets see ... do we really need to rehash all of the Baker events now he is not our starting QB?

I mean Rish said I was emotionally attached and judged Baker through an emotional lens.... The implication that him trashing Baker all this time was warranted. And my very brief response was to highlight some of the elevated play he achieved. And now you want to really go and dig deeper - is that it? Or should I ask what the purpose of your post is - because as a poster you are good at posting these tweets or stats etc ... and it's left to the reader to interpret your meaning. It's sort of a cop out. A bit like having a list of 25 QB's including Mike White who you would rather have than Baker ... spam the board with it for weeks and then say it was a joke.

So forgive my trepidation when I reply to your post here.

But the really quick - cliff notes version of a response would be:

Hmmmm - was there anything different between the first half and last half of the 2020 season? Was there perhaps an underlying reason for a difference in performance? I mean quoting the "statistics" without any context might lean to thinking Baker is just streaky or got incredibly lucky for 9 games.

- Wonder if his 4th HC in 3 years was a factor?
- 4th OC in 3 years a factor?
- A new play book a factor?
- A new QB coach changing his footwork and mechanics a factor?
- I wonder if the 3 bad weather games were a factor ... one of those bad weather games was essentially the same conditions as the game this year where Belichick asked his QB to throw the ball 3 times the entire game ... Baker went something like 8-24
- Personally I wonder if - after throwing a boat ton of interceptions the previous year, Stefanski was really putting pressure on Baker to not throw any risky throws?

Maybe? And maybe after 8 weeks things started to click? I guess it's possible. I think it probably makes more logical sense than Baker is trash and somehow got incredibly lucky, including 21 passes in a row.

That's a fair assessment.

Why do you think Dallas was so eager to let Cooper go for what they did? Most people focus on the cap money and that seems to be the focal point. However, Cooper was also expendable because 1) he wasn't the teams #1 WR anymore - Lamb is the #1 WR - 2) resigning Gallup and Wilson as the #2 and #3 WR's too long-term deals and being 2-years younger with higher upsides is a more strategic move for the long-term plans of the Cowboys. Though the Browns went out and traded for Cooper as a #1 WR, he had actually lost that spot to Lamb. Wilson and Gallup actually had as much or more yards per reception than Cooper. In fact, Cooper was 4th on the team among WR's for average yards per reception. The Browns went out and got Cooper for their #1 WR spot and hopefully it works out but truthfully, he wasn't the Cowboys #1 WR anymore even if he is planned to be the Browns top WR.

That was Dallas, he is #1 for us ... and Wilson signed a 3 year deal to play for Miami.

They Drafted Lamb after signing Cooper to his contract, but yes, having a #1 WR on a rookie contract allowed Dallas to move on from Cooper's.

Lamb had 1 catch, 0 TDs in the Cowboys playoff game. Cooper had 6 catches and a TD.

Juju looked great as a number 2 receiver. He was lousy as a number 1.

It's easy to say that Lamb was the number one. Let's see how he performs with defenses focusing on him in the passing game.

When you have receivers that primarily run deep routes, their yards per catch will be higher than a guy who runs all the routes. Cooper led the Cowboys receivers with 8 TDs. Ultimately the game's about scoring points.

Honestly, I'm not sure why the Cowboys traded Cooper. Lots of Cowboys fans seem annoyed with Dallas' off-season so far.

We'll see how it works out.

Dallas is/was in cap hell, and their WR room is an embarrassment of riches.

They were in cap hall because of the Ezekiel Elliott contract too. They had to off load Lael Collins too.

Didn't they suspent Collins for some games last year for being lazy, or something similar?

His struggles weeks 1-6 couldn't have had anything to do with the fact that Baker had a new HC and had to learn a new offense with hardly any real practice time due to Covid? No that makes to much sense.

We made it to the second round of the playoffs with a healthy Baker. Do you mean to tell me that after spending 230M on Watson that your expectations are that he will do as well as a healthy Baker did without a #1 WR on the field? That would seem like a massive investment into a player whose expectations are no higher than what was achieved from the former QB on his 4th head coach in 3 years without a #1 WR. I suppose if you set the bar low enough the trade can be justified even after you sacrifice the integrity of the franchise. At a minimum, anything less than the AFC Championship would be considered a failure and injuries cannot be a factor at all. The Browns set that bar level by their actions considering everything that transpired in 2021. Ignoring everything that occurred in 2021, the main cause of the Browns failure has been directly placed on the QB play of an injured player - PERIOD. Since that is the case, the supposed massive upgrade at the position is basically saying that all things considered, 2021 would have been a deep playoff run if the Browns had Watson at the helm instead of Mayfield. As others have pointed out, Watson is expected to carry this team without excuse. If it wasn't a good enough reason for Mayfield's regression in play, then why would it be acceptable for the consensus massive upgrade at the position? If you're going to pay said player significantly more than a Rodgers, Mahomes, or Allen - then nothing less than equal or better results should be expected no matter the circumstances that play out.