DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Watson.... The Infection That Never seems To End

j/c:

JMO.............but talking about someone's family members should be off-limits.

Eh, I brought them up. In appropriate threads, of course. Some......well, I'll be done until larry pops up tomorrow.

How about any coach that was stuck (allegedly) in a basement in Covid @uarantine while his buddy coached the team to a playoff win?
( I honestly don't recall which week(s) of the final 3 games, week I7, then the wild card week, then the divisional round, that Stefanski was supposed to sit out.)

i said I wasn't going to respond to you anymore, but I wasn't criticizing you. It's someone else who drew my ire.

Golly, I wonder who?

Directed by ??? or Staring ???

I heard you are in the movie.

That's hilarious. You've posted about MY family more than anyone in the history or the DawgTalker board. We had multiple weeks where you referenced my kids in multiple posts.

Unreal.

I've stayed away from this thread - it's time to move on. The punishment has been handed down. Folks have their opinions. Everything has been done to death. Football is 2 weeks away.

We'll get plenty more opportunity to rehash some of this stuff in 14 weeks time when Watson is going to take his first snap for the Browns. Before then he has to complete some counselling and whoever he meets with (I believe) has to sign off in his rehabilitation or whatever the term is going to be for Watson to be green lighted to play again. And then Watson has to stay squeaky clean moving forward .... Hopefully that all happens. There is nothing to be gained by rehashing and beating heads against walls between now and week10/11/12.

I agree. There comes a point where the infection is the thread.

You're allowed to post anything. Even when they're lies or are wrong. But don't think I won't call you on them. Like I said claiming you know me is a lie. I read all the posts. Even posts from morons. Not saying you're a moron of course.

Yet here you are. Nobody is forcing anyone to read it.

Deshaun Watson Settled Without Having to Give a Sufficient Apology

Empty statements from the Browns and their quarterback are an insulting conclusion to the NFL’s disciplinary process.

Here’s the only thing that seems right to say at a moment like this, since none of the people in charge are going to say it: I’m sorry.

Sorry to the women who have come forward with accounts of Deshaun Watson’s predatory behavior, dealt with deep emotional scars and gotten branded as opportunists. Sorry to the women who bravely went through the process of having their horror stories validated by former U.S. district judge Sue L. Robinson in her initial ruling on this case, then watched as Watson thumbed his nose at her conclusions.

Sorry to people who have experienced instances of sexual violence or abuse, people who were watching this case and hoping to feel like the world can sympathize, even just a little bit, with what you went through. Sorry that this entire façade, which ended Thursday with Watson having his suspension increased to 11 games, receiving a $5 million fine and agreeing to undergo treatment, feels like nothing but an empty promise undelivered.

Sorry that your experiences were minimized as “being triggered” multiple times, which is a convenient way of making it all seem like it’s not Watson’s fault. Sorry that the people you wanted to hear a real “sorry” from took back all their apologies and are planning to move on with life.

Nowhere in the release containing information on Watson’s suspension does it say explicitly that he has to apologize, or deal with the maddeningly inconsistent messaging that has come out of Browns headquarters or out of Watson’s mouth personally. We’re not talking about the strange interview he did before the Browns’ first preseason game, which he has already contradicted. We’re not talking about the statement released Thursday by the Browns, with Watson’s name on it, that says, in part, “I apologize once again for any pain this situation has caused. I take accountability for the decisions I made.”

We have seen nothing that can counteract our impression of how we know Watson truly feels about the entire thing. Minutes after the decision came down, ESPN reporter Dianna Russini said on air, via ProFootballTalk’s Michael David Smith: “[Deshaun and his agents are] still angry about those six games, so now it’s 11, so to them this is too many games. They still stand by the fact that they’re denying all of this.” Russini added on Twitter that people around Watson maintain, “This isn’t an admission or an apology to the women involved.” It seems clear no one is going to say sorry for that specific undercurrent of defiance, which has lingered throughout.

Minutes after Watson’s statement came out via the team, he told reporters in person, “I’ve always been able to stand on my innocence and always said I never assaulted or disrespected anyone, but at the same point I have to continue to push forward with my life and career.” He added that he only apologized for “people that were triggered.” He said, at some point, that he has his side of the story to tell and that one day he’s going to tell it.

Now might be a good time, in front of people trained to ask legitimate questions. In front of an audience that would get to look him in the eye. In the absence of sorry, something other than the completely disprovable statement that he’s never disrespected a single woman in his life would be preferential. We have all disrespected someone in our lifetime. (Also, let’s not minimize Watson’s actions, as he has tried to several times now, as mere “disrespect.”)

Sometimes we can stomach taking the world as it is, and not how it should be. Seeing Watson’s case come before a disciplinary system unprepared to handle a pattern of behavior this vast, then arriving at a punishment ever so slightly more befitting of a predatory action, even having the commissioner call it—publicly—a predatory action, are instances of incremental progress, even if incremental progress doesn’t feel like progress at all sometimes.

The hard part is watching Watson and the Browns simply shed this situation like a Halloween costume. Watson was initially defiant publicly, nebulously remorseful when he felt the proceedings weren’t going his way and then returned to that defiance the moment it became clear he avoided a real sledgehammer.

Browns owner Jimmy Haslam evoked cancel culture Thursday when he asked, rhetorically: “I think in this country, people deserve second chances. Is he never supposed to play again? Is he no longer supposed to be part of society?”

Of course Watson should be able to play again. Plenty of people—inside the NFL and out—have gotten more than two chances and are appreciative of every single one.

But the precursor to earning a second chance is realizing you’re getting one. If Watson continues to believe and espouse the idea he’s done nothing wrong while providing no contradictory evidence aside from a nonindictment in Texas that was legally complicated from the start, then this isn’t a second chance at all.

Seeing this play out isn’t just “triggering.” Minus some kind of detailed rebuttal, it’s dejecting and insulting. The kind of thing someone should really apologize for.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/08/18/deshaun-watson-settlement-insufficient-apology

That post wasn't lost on me bro. I lol'ed when I read it.

"Shouldn't you be spending more time with your kids??"

NFL senior advisor Rita Smith on Deshaun Watson: “I feel like he’s playing us”

In the eight days since Browns quarterback Deshaun Watson: (1) accepted an 11-game suspension and $5 million fine; (2) issued a statement accepting accountability for his decisions; and (3) promptly proclaimed his innocence at a press conference, the NFL hasn’t had much if anything to say about Watson’s lack of remorse.

On Friday, an advisor hired amid the Ray Rice fiasco spoke out, aggressively, about Watson’s attitude.

“I feel like he’s playing us,” NFL senior adviser on matters of domestic violence and sexual assault Rita Smith told Mary Kay Cabot of the Cleveland Plain Dealer. “He’s saying exactly what he thinks he needs to say to get on the field again. He’s not thinking strategically at all about. ‘Did I cause harm to other people?’ He’s not questioning any of his behaviors at all. He’s absolutely certain from that last statement: ‘I’ve done nothing wrong. This is all about people trying to get at me, and I just want to go play ball.'”

Smith believes that Watson’s refusal to accept responsibility sets the stage for ongoing misbehavior.

“That energy is not good for future reoffending,” Smith told Cabot. “That that purports to me that he’s still a danger to people, because he’s done absolutely no self-reflection that I can tell. You don’t have that many violations reported from somebody who’s not doing anything wrong. . . . He’s doing something wrong in those [massage] sessions. He’s doing something inappropriate in those [massage] sessions. So he needs to figure out what that is and how he can stop it so that nobody gets hurt in that process.”

Part of the problem, as Smith sees it, is that Watson is surrounded by agents and lawyers who blindly support him, bolstering his position that he’s done nothing wrong.

“He’s put around himself people who will carry him forward no matter what decision he makes and that’s dangerous,” Smith told Cabot. “It’s dangerous for Deshaun Watson as well. He can change, but not if there are people around him saying, ‘Yeah, she’s just after your money’ and ‘You paid all that money and it still didn’t make any difference.’ He needs to rid himself of those people, because they’re not serving him well.”

They haven’t been serving him well from the get go. An effort to settle the claims of Ashley Solis was rebuffed, setting the stage for her lawsuit and 23 others. A stubborn insistence by Watson’s camp that a potential settlement of the claims in April 2021 not include a confidentiality provision resulted in a missed opportunity to end the cases fairly quickly. Along the way, lawyer Rusty Hardin has declared that all of the Watson accusers are lying.

No, Watson has not been served well. He needs someone to speak hard truths to him. Hopefully, that will happen through counseling. If he refuses to accept and heed the things he’ll hear, he shouldn’t be reinstated for Week 13 at Houston — or at any point until he stops standing on his innocence and starts embracing strategies for understanding how these issues arose, and how to avoid them in the future.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.c...shaun-watson-i-feel-like-hes-playing-us/

Deshaun Watson's accountability about-face after suspension underscores serious problem | Opinion

Opinion by Jarrett Bell, USA TODAY - Aug 19
link

There are multiple ways to decipher the mixed messages we heard from Deshaun Watson shortly after his monumental settlement with the NFL came down on Thursday. Here are a few:

Playing both ends against the middle.

Wanting to have his cake and eat it, too.

Wishy-washy.

Serious denial.

The Cleveland Browns quarterback put out a written statement expressing contrition and accountability after the punishment was announced for his violation of the NFL’s personal conduct policy stemming from sexual misconduct allegations – an 11-game suspension, $5 million fine, mandatory treatment and counseling .

The tone of the written statement was similar to the message Watson delivered on camera last Friday before his preseason debut – and while the NFL’s appeal of independent disciplinary officer Sue L. Robinson’s original six-game suspension and settlement talks ensued. He said he was sorry for "any pain this situation has caused."

In meeting with the media minutes after the written statement was released on Thursday, Watson had quite the contrasting message of defiance.

“I have always stood on my innocence and always said I’ve never assaulted anyone or disrespected anyone,” Watson told reporters during a news conference at the Browns headquarters. “I’m going to continue to stand on my innocence.”


If that’s the case, why was there a settlement at all?

Watson, 26, said something about the deal not necessarily being an admission of guilt. That’s plausible.

Yet in flipping his script, Watson pretty much overrode his own statement, leading us to conclude that his previous remarks were put out there to move along the NFL discipline portion of a case that has also included settlements of 23 civil suits brought forth from the cast of 24 women who alleged sexual misconduct during massage sessions.

The fast change in posture should turn stomachs at NFL headquarters.

Of course, Watson arrived in Cleveland expressing his innocence. When he was introduced as the recipient of a fully guaranteed five-year, $230 million contract with the Browns, he insisted that he didn’t have a “problem” and contended that there was no need for counseling.

One thing that seems obvious, given the mixed messages expressed on Thursday: Watson still needs professional help.

That is not to disparage the man who, as part of the settlement struck by the NFL and NFL Players Association, will undergo an evaluation and treatment as a component of his discipline. It’s just that the messages, wrapped in denial, further underscore the need for treatment.

If Watson didn’t see the “problem” that resulted in the mess that put his career on hold, then that’s a problem. Perhaps treatment and counseling will delve into root causes connected to the allegations and all that they suggest about violating boundaries.

Despite his contention in March that he didn’t need counseling, Watson voluntarily began therapy last spring and last Friday maintained that he wanted to continue that – which might coincide with what is now mandatory. It seemed like a positive that Watson had seemingly embraced counseling, even with the stigma that is surely attached as one of the consequences to his apparent behavior.

It looks like Watson had NFL commissioner Roger Goodell convinced. In the NFL news release outlining the discipline, Goodell maintained, “Deshaun has committed to doing the hard work on himself that is necessary.”

Well, with the manner in which Watson called an audible, it’s fair to wonder about the level of commitment from Watson for the work on himself.

This cloud could hang over Watson – and over the Browns owners, Jimmy and Dee Haslam – for the rest of his NFL career. And then some.

Still, despite the wishes of some that Watson should never step foot on an NFL field again, this shouldn't be about throwing him away.

Watson surely needs to pay a price, as he has and will in the form of his suspension, reputation and millions of dollars in a fine and the settling of civil suits.

But, as Thursday reminded us, he is also a man who needs help.

Follow USA TODAY Sports' Jarrett Bell on Twitter @JarrettBell.

The issue seems to be at this time that in order to solve a problem first you have to admit it's a problem. So far that isn't the case with watson.

It never ceases to amaze me how ignorant people are. Or, how desperate they are to attract clicks.

Watson can't admit guilt because doing so would be used against him in civil court and it could even draw the interest of the criminal courts. A reporter should know that. Hell, the public should know that, but they don't want to know it.

He'll have one helluva time ever seeing the field in an NFL game again without showing remorse for his actions. It seems like that something you don't want to see.

Watson still has one case pending. I am sure his attorney has instructed him to not admit anything.

Pretty standard procedure.

I didn't call you names. I was talking about how the hell can a reporter not know that Watson can't publicly admit to crimes. It's not that hard to understand.

I am not qualified to evaluate if he needs help or not. Neither are you. I will speak about what I do know and not play silly speculative games. Watson absolutely cannot admit guilt due to pending and possible Civil suits. Also, there is no Double Jeopardy in in regards to possible criminal complaints because Watson was never charged w/a crime. This has been covered by legal experts, so the author of the article you posted is either completely ignorant or trying to mislead people. Either is plausible.

Right. You performed psychoanalysis on Waton.

Right, but your comments are about mixed messages in public comments.

Very few know what is being said in private conversations. I also question that you know what the guy needs. I also feel that mandatory counseling is useless. Counseling only works when a person opens up to that and does so on their own terms. One only finds God when one seeks God. AA only works when a person wants to go to AA. The list goes on and on.

JMHO, Watson MIGHT benefit from a group like AA- SLAA, Sex and Love Addiction Anonymously - he learned love and sex in the hood- he might not have midwestern sex/ moral values. The NFL has mandated he get counseling - it remains to be seen if he changes his values and attitudes. Our wonderful country has millions of porn and sex addicts, some don't know the difference between fantasy and reality.

When Berry was being interviewed last night in the game he said Watson is in counseling right now.

I thought that was already known.

I feel like I've read this over and over... WTH is "he learned love and sex in the hood"? Is it just you that keeps on posting that? I could swear people in the media have as well.

Disfunction is everywhere in our society, quit blaming the hood. Love and sex is everywhere as well, most of it wholesome and "unadulterated", quit acting like "the hood" spawns some strange form of perversion. Besides all that, connecting "the hood" to trying to get your kicks on a massage table is a bit of a stretch.

Deshaun is an intelligent human and an adult. I don't care if he was raised in a rabbit pen, he's responsible for his own actions.

Edit: was responding to hitt, not Pit.

Somewhere you must have missed it. Him admitting he actually did something wrong is one of the main reasons she refuses to settle or this case would most likely be settled too.


There's more of the article at the link but this is the part relevant to your comment. The only thing he could actually be concerned with is that he knows it would open the door to even more of his victims to come forward or the possibility he might face criminal charges moving forward for his despicable actions. His refusal to accept responsibility would help settle the remaining case. It would not fare well for what is yet to come. And he knows that.

Yet he, nor watson, nor anyone else has stated that the counseling is in any way about his sexual actions or even sexually related. What watson stated was it was to make him the best person he can be. People can get counseling for about anything. There has been no accountability. There has been nothing stated that the counseling he is receiving is in any way associated with his sexually predatory behavior.

Because he is such a public figure, I guess he has no right to ANY privacy. I'm sure you'd want your medical and counseling history presented to the world publicly. I think that's against the law.

You know I hate the whole Watson deal, but TBH, since he was suspended I've reconciled that that is the way it is and I'm ready to watch football. But for some reason OTHER THAN WATSON, I feel completely deflated even thinking about this year and the team. I just feel like we were on the precipice of being on the hunt for the next several years and for now, that feeling is completely gone. All I see now is another crappy season coming.

Something that I felt was missing from the Robinson punishment and I'm glad was added to the appeal punishment was the treatment/assessment. If he truly is just going through the motions as bad as that article is stating, then he should catch a bunch of grief when he tries to get back on the field (and rightfully so).

Yeah, he should never publicly apologize and state that he's receiving treatment for the problem. The NFL will love that.

I think those who keep thinking watson will be here for a decade or more need to consider what transpired in his career before he came here. In September of 2020 watson signed a four year contract with the Texans. By January he was demanding they trade him and refused to play for them the entire 2021 season. Can you imagine how THAT would feel as a fan? In less than four calendar months Texan's fans thought they had their QB for the next four years to him throwing a tantrum and refusing to play. I doubt he'll do that with him having a 230 mil, guaranteed contract. But then there is what happens after that? And there's never been any doubt that watson is a much better QB on the field than Baker. But it seems quite obvious that better play will bring far more dire immaturity. Compared to what watson put Texans fans through, what Baker did here was a drop in the bucket.

But hey, none of that matters, right? Some sound as though they either don't know about that, want to forget about that or want to make excuses for that. But don't think watson considers any of you or that uniform he wears that Browns fans place so much loyalty into any more important than he did Texan fans and that uniform. Because he doesn't. It's just a paycheck to him. We saw what happened the last time around. Don't think you can't or won't be next.

Isn't it just a paycheck to all the players?