DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Kevin Stefanski

Bone,

I enjoy your takes and admire your optimism...so please don't take offense to my response.

I don't think KS is a real head coach...at least from his presence on gameday. His face is stuck in the waffle house menu on offense and he's just another sideline body the rest of the time. No leadership...no fire...no control...no real presence. The comparison to Tomlin and Harbaugh are perfect examples...those two jerks have a sideline presence we've not had (possibly) in my lifetime...and we sure don't have that now. They've been that way long enough for me to conclude that they are those type guys every day of the week all year long...unfortunately....I believe that about KS as well.

The Jets and Giants each found a guy after years of changes and ineptitude. Those guys are winning with trash at QB and rosters that have been pathetic for awhile now. Washington has the most dysfunctional owner in history and are playing with a backup over an injured...well...backup caliber QB...and they just beat the almighty Eagles on Monday night...on the road...and are back to .500 ball and in the wildcard race.

Coaching matters...especially in the NFL...and we don't have a head guy there.

I feel it is important for the franchise that KS is back next year. but......

I asked this question in another thread.

Will it take DW to prove that KS is a good coach?

Has KS proved to be a good coach thus far in his tenure?

I understand the dynamics of the question as we can turn the question to-is Belichek as successful a coach w/out TB.

IMHO it should not take DW to prove KS a good coach. KS has had almost 3 seasons to show it. What if DW looks bad 5/7 games? Maybe not bad, but not 250mil great.
Does the argument now become DW will do better in a system that lets him dominate the game. Or do we blame rust? That does not bode well for keeping KS.

KS had a great first year. This year he has his team at 3-6 with many more questions than answers.
If KS were a great coach we would be looking to DW to elevate us to championship levels. At 3-6 we are many levels away from a championship. we need DW to lead us to competitiveness before we can think about championships.


I do not agree that the issues on D or ST are not the fault of KS. KS is in charge. KS is responsible especially after watching what happened in Miami. Heads should roll.

Sorry Willie, you don't understand how it works.

For the record, that is FALSE. Nothing in that video indicates anything of the sort. I think you "misheard" that.

[quoteWill it take DW to prove that KS is a good coach?[/quote]

No, he has already proven that in so far as QB can help. He helped Baker and he has made Jacoby look like a fair starter.

I don't ever want to hear people complaining about Haslam blowing things up after reading the fans in here talking about blowing things up.

Man, we're going off the rails in here with the Stefanski stuff. I've said myself he has some weaknesses in what I perceive as strong leadership, but c'mon.

Food for thought:

As many have said, your coach doesn't need to be rah-rah, he doesn't need to be 'in your face'. Tom Landry went to 10 NFC Championship Games and 5 Super Bowls; he looked like he was beamed down to the sideline from a bad episode of Twilight Zone.

Stefanski is still learning to lead. He's experiencing his first real stretch of adversity. Do you hire leaders to fire them before you see how they respond to that? Wouldn't make sense, would it?

Stefanski is gifted when it comes to offensive scheme, game management and play-calling.

Stefanski brought out the best in Baker Mayfield who looks sorely incompetent now that he's gone. He's brought out the best in Brissett and has him competing as well as the best in the game. He definitely played a big role in getting Cousins to fire on all cylinders. I'd go ahead and pull out the tacky, cliché, "quarterback whisperer". How in the world would he be not good enough to work with the talent of Deshaun Watson?? You guys have me scratching holes in my head there.

We, as fans, somehow think we know what goes on behind closed doors -- we don't.

We, as fans, somehow think the answer is to fire everyone when things get rough.

We, as fans, better thank our lucky stars that Jimmy Haslam has turned the corner and has quit acting like us!


We knew, from the beginning of this season, there was a good chance the season was lost. Ownership and FO took that gamble to land a fQB. It is what it is. It would be the most foolish thing the Browns have ever done to blow anything up before 2024. Woods is the sacrificial lamb because he has earned it. There will be some personnel changes, but mark my words... we'll have a DC that busts balls and makes players accountable next year. That will be the yin to Stefanski's yang.

Everybody take a deep breath lol.

I think that's very reasonable and very fair. Most especially about his offense and getting BM and JB playing above themselves.

With that said - we have seen the same issues with KS over 3 years without any signs of improvement. In game tendency to get away from the run. Check. In game - starts off hot with scripted plays, stalls and lacks adjustments after that initial success. Check. A tendancy to always want to outsmart the other team instead of make them stop what we do best. Check. Team coming our flat and unmotivated in key games and after byes. Check.

I think most are saying they have lost some or most of their faith in KS - not that he needs to be fired. There are certainly some who would fire him today if they could - that's a small few. . . . I feel kind of like I did when Derek Anderson was playing well for the Browns, it was fun to watch and sometimes he looked good, but in the pit of my stomach it didn't feel like he was the answer.

He proved he could coach a team to the playoffs.

You pick Tomlin & McShay who are having similar seasons.
One major difference is that both those coaches have a ring.

KS has one winning season and one playoff win.

Huge difference.

And thus far there's nothing on Stefanski's Browns resume to give him that power either.

You never know. It could be just the opposite. watson may prefer a HC he can influence and manipulate into doing what he wants. He may prefer that to butting heads with a strong leader.

I don't think I said he did?

I didn't mean to insinuate that you did say that. I was simply attempting to say that Stefanski had not reached the status you described. Actually I was agreeing with you. When you have an elite QB and a HC without a very successful history and resume the QB holds the cards. Sorry for the miscommunication.

I will say in support of your post that if some of the best coaches in the NFL had been judged on their first three seasons they never would have been great HC's.

Or even their first five seasons...

Yes...but compare that to the number of head coaches fired within their first three seasons who never went on to have success anywhere in the NFL as a HC. We alone could fill up the back of a T-shirt with those guys.

BB was fired as a HC one time in his career...by the Baltimore Ravens...having never coached a game for them.

The 1990 Browns won 3 games.

Belichick took over in 1991 in the ensuing seasons the browns won
6, 7, 7, 11 games so steady improvement

In 1995, the last season before the move the browns won 5 games.
They were 4-4 or 4-5 when Modell announced the move mid-season and the team pretty much quit at that point

Stefanski took over a 6 win team.

He won 11 - which I think was contributed to by the covid lockdown. He was able to take advantage of the online stuff much better than the other coaches. Then once the NFL went back to a more traditional training camp...The browns won 8 games last year and are 3-6 so far this season. Looking like a downward trend.

Does anyone think Sean Payton would be interested if a change is made? Just for the record, I think KS should get a shot with DW. JMO

Exactly!

Another good indicator is to look at how many Browns players that have improved or regressed performance wise since 2020. If the answer is that more players have regressed instead of having a improving trend then that’s another worrying sign.

How many players do we talk about that have made significant improvements since Stefanski’s first season?

I remember reading where he said he might return but only to a team with a sound front office. I'll leave it at that for now.

I think the Haslams and especially Depo put the Browns squarely on his do not touch list.

If there is even a hint of dysfunction Payton ain't touching it, and let's face it, the Browns are about as dysfunctional as it gets.

You are correct. All 32 teams played under the same guidelines. No team was given an advantage in that situation.

The Saints own Payton's contract rights. A team wanting Payton will have trade 1st round picks to the Saints to get him. We do not have any picks to trade. No chance to land Payton if Haslam wanted to go in that direction.

Pit, you are correct that all teams had the same guidelines and limitations. But I disagree that it didn't give an advantage to the teams with the more tech savvy coaching staffs. I think guys like stefanski were able to take advantage of this while teams with old school coaches couldn't do what they wanted to do in training camp and weren't able to adjust. Once the training camps returned to normal, the old school guys were able to rev back up and surpass the browns coaching staff.

No way to prove who is right or wrong, this is all completely opinion and speculation. This is my opinion. I recognize that you and Bone disagree and respect your opinions.

You might be right. I just think stefanski and our staff were much more comfortable with the technology than many other guys and able to take advantage of that. This is both a compliment in that he could do that, and a diss that now he cannot keep up. JMO

I've seen it all. Our team benefited from Covid while having a completely new coaching staff, multiple roster moves, and having to implement new schemes on both offense and defense.

The Alternative Universe is a real place.

I went through the standings today to see how many head coaches I would take Stefanski over. I was only able to get to six names.

Covid, no covid, it don't matter, he is simply one of the worst. He's just plain bad.

I'm not sure if this should make you or I happy though...there was an insider post on the OBR today that said unless the wheels come off Stefanski is safe. So that should make you happy. However, i feel confident the Browns will finish 3-14 so there maybe hope for me yet.

I'm not so sure he's safe though. Sitting at 3-6 with the hopeful upside that a QB that hasn't played a live game in 2-years the final six games - I see the Browns finishing up at 5-12 for the season with Watson only winning 2 of the final 6 games. If that happens, I believe Stefanski immediately goes on the hot seat. One, he will be sporting a 3-year record with the Browns of 25-27 including the playoff games. Not only will he have a losing record, but the team will have regressed each year. Two, Watson's first game against his old team will be of significant value to the Texans. If the Texans beat the Browns, there is a good chance as things stand that the Texans could be looking at not only the top pick in the draft but the 2nd pick too. Beating the Browns will only enhance the value of that 1st round pick, so I expect them to be highly motivated. Three, Haslam - how comfortable will he be turning over his 230M QB to a HC with a losing record, a team that has steadily regressed each year, and the loss of a top 3 pick in a draft loaded with QB's. I think "pissed" would be an understatement.

Obviously, I'm not the only one who sees issues with Stefanski. Eight coaches who could be in jeopardy over the next two months article spells it out.


https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...mp;cvid=bab6179027a444be8e0d9487a94871b8