DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Teaching Critical Race Theory’s taken seriously in Missouri.

Missouri lawmakers are considering new legislation aimed at prohibiting the teaching of so-called critical race theory in its public grade schools – even though the state’s largest teachers’ union says the concept is not presently a part of schools’ curricula – and requiring the state to develop a training program to teach American patriotism.

So replacing something that’s not in the curriculum with something that actually programs our children. Brilliant. Pffft.

Why don't they just teach that racism is stupid instead of teaching that racism is everywhere and everything is racist?

I'm thinking I don't really understand CRT.

CRT does not attribute racism to white people as individuals or even to entire groups of people. Simply put, critical race theory states that U.S. social institutions (e.g., the criminal justice system, education system, labor market, housing market, and healthcare system) are laced with racism embedded in laws, regulations, rules, and procedures that lead to differential outcomes by race.

Well, if that's the case, then why not teach it... Because, basically, it's true. Sounds a lot like someone wanting to change history. What was it that Kelly Ann Conway said,, OH YEAH... Alternative facts!

Let's face it, the schools have never actually taught the entire history of The United states. Instead it's always been a homogenized version of what sounds good for the most part. And when any part of it that's bad gets taught, it's also taught how we did the right thing and magically fixed what was wrong. We were never taught that we took over this nation by slaughtering and committing genocide against over 200 Native American tribes using some crazy, concocted reasoning known at the time as manifest destiny. We were taught that our enemies used propaganda to program and deceive their citizens as we were spoon fed that our own country was somehow close to perfect. This is why we have so many people in our society today who really do not understand the history of The United States. And now we have politicians and groups that not only wishing to stop our students from learning the truth, but are creating laws against it. Murica!

umm, we were definitely taught this... in-depth actually.

So was I.

We all were.

You guys must be younger than me or your school had a different curriculum approved than where I went to school. Because we were certainly never taught that where I went to school along with many other inconvenient truths about our nations history. I'm glad to see at some point in time or at least in some schools it was different.

CRT isn’t being taught presently in MO. public schools. Yet they want to replace it with a curriculum that programs children with patriotic teachings? Patriotism can be bastardized and extreme. Also can be violent when tyrants like trump use false narratives on patriotism to rile up their supporters into violent mobs to overthrow governments.

https://www.museum.state.il.us/Rive...ctions/1901/wood_20river_20massacre.html

Not taught in grade school, high school or college.

https://idahohighcountry.org/item/bear-river-massacre-site/

Not taught in grade school, high school or college.

https://nativephilanthropy.candid.org/events/chetco-village-river-massacre-oregon/

Not taught in grade school, high school or college.


https://www.oregonhistoryproject.or...nt-by-one-of-the-survivors/#.Y9A6wi9lDi0

Not taught in grade school, high school or college.


https://www.historycolorado.org/exh...nged-cheyenne-and-arapaho-people-forever

Few Colorado students learn much about the Sand Creek Massacre — the deadliest day in Colorado history — and even fewer spend several days studying the topic as part of a Native American history class.

Yet we all know what happened at Lil Big Horn to General Custer.

He was stubborn, arrogant dumbass who got himself and most of his soldiers killed?

Yes that was the consensus we all took away. Yet we never learned who was responsible for any of the hundreds of Native American massacres throughout the Western expansion. Known today as the US military.

I bet I'm older than you and I can assure you, we were taught about slavery and the wars with American Indians. Pretty disturbing stuff to be honest. We treated American Indians awfully. We were wrong to do it. Same with Slavery

Not sure how to repair that or even if it's repairable. But I was taught it.


By the way, in just a few short weeks, I'll be 71... My guess is that I got you beat... Just a guess of course. Our biggest difference is that I'm still good looking
LOL

Same... born in the 80s... 100% learned this... remember distinctly learning about the Pilgrims giving the native Americans blankets with small pox.... also learned about the civil rights movement.... rounding up of Japanese Americans during World War 2... I'm sure there were things we probably didn't learn about, but feel like I got a pretty good education on American History.

I agree we were all taught these things. But we should also acknowledge that they were taught with quite a bit of whitewashing. And when I was young, most people, adults included, were clueless about the atrocities committed during this country's founding and building. White 11-year-old me knew about slavery but was incapable of a mindset where I put myself into that world through the eyes of a black child, imagining their lives. As an adult and a white person, I can see how insensitive some of these things are to the descendants of the people whose American experience was much different than ours. Simply grasping that those historical perspectives will vary greatly depending on which party is telling the tale is something even most adults struggle with. It's that kind of disconnection that keeps us so racially charged. Same with religion, politics, and all most every other divide. We all tend to agree on about 90% of everything. But that last 10% brings out humanity's worst behaviors across the board. It's like a void between us where all attempts to communicate our truth fails.

Imagine having people as livestock, treating them as less than human in all things, and refusing them an education to dominate and control them. Also, think about having so little regard for them that giving them barely livable conditions and working them every waking hour for the entire duration of their lives is just fine by you.

OR imagine wanting to control a piece of land so badly that you would destroy everything to get it regardless of how many lives it cost. That's the US-of-A the White man gave to the Native Americans as they methodically irradiated them. And those that survived got to live like dogs.

Think about this; the US government experimented on non-white people simply because they wanted human studies, and since the POCs involved were considered less than human, on the level of a lower primate, the government was ethically okay with it. The government has used race on several occasions to commit atrocities against people of color, IMHO.

We were never taught to think about things like that in school.

I have nothing to feel guilty about I that regard. I don't care if any of my ancestor's owned slaves or killed Indians.

As far as I can tell in a pretty detailed family tree, I had no large land owners who owned slaves. As for killing any natives, I'd say maybe, or wouldn't doubt it given most were dirt farmer/ trapper types who pushed west fairly early in this nations expansion. Either way, I don't really give a flip what they may or may not have done.

There is nothing that can be done about it and I don't owe anything for what may have taken place even by any of my children yesterday let alone by some great-great-great something 150 years ago.

CRT isn't about teaching.

I think that’s fairly ignorant considering Public schools don’t even teach CRT. And maybe you should visit a Native American reservation out west and tell us some of this crap isn’t still going on.

You were taught that pilgrims gave Native American’s blankets laced with smallpox? Mmmmmm.smallpox blankets may be a popularly accepted truth in American history, except there is just one recorded case of colonists giving disease-infected blankets to Indigenous Americans. Highly unlikely that Pilgrims intentionally gave Native Americans the disease. So you were taught a fable like a lot of Americans learned growing up in puplic schools. Bias teachers make crap up. And that’s the crux of the problem. People are gullible and believe everything they read and hear from the authoritarian. And most won’t do their own research to find where that truth turns to lies.

Claiming land by invasion has been happening since the beginning of man, it was not new to the Americas. Indian tribes would fight amongst each other and take territory, and women.

While it may seem barbaric by todays "standards" it is not unique to the creation of our nation, or any nation. It's happening right now in Ukraine.

If it had not happened by the Spanish and the British, then eventually the Chinese or Japanese would have adventured here and done it.

Teach the formation of our nation and what we did in the process, but don't teach guilt as if it was something unique to the US.

This nation is the world's greatest success story, and we have people trying to put it down. While most other nations and all past world powers used their might to oppress people this nation has sacrificed lives and when I say lives millions of lives to advance freedom and liberty across the globe. No nation is perfect, and this country fought a civil war to right a wrong and did just that. So now these ignorant people want us to feel guilt and shame for our past. The first foreign war this country ever fought was against the very nation that sold slaves from Africa all over the world. I think we should teach our young people the good and the bad of our history. But we should be proud of this Country. No other Country on this Planets history has given freedom and liberty to so many people here and abroad. If this country was so bad, then why are so many people seeking asylum here. You would think we would have people seeking to leave and seek greener pastures. I guess we can only hope these college educated idiots that spread their miss information to the youth will leave.

Oh I was taught about the Indian wars and slavery, but not the actual, truthful details of wither one.

I have been to several Indian Casinos in Oklahoma and North Carolina. Does that count?

No.

The Cherokee nation thanks you. Out west most everyone heads to Vegas or other non Native American owned casinos to gamble, while Native American reservations are poverty stricken dried up desert communities barely staying alive. But no we don’t care what our ancestors did so we shall ignore the issue and let them die in the desert in poverty.

Historically, college education courses in Social Studies warned of teaching context that include too much detail or elaborations of traumatic historic events, so as not to traumatize students. That has been what teachers were taught about teaching history. Individual teachers will pick and choose what and how they will teach, but they are still required to turn in their lesson plans and they are still observed by peers and supervisors many of whom are conservatives, yep, conservatives are teachers too, to ensure that state standards and benchmarks are met.

The idea that there is wide spread exploration of kindergartners' sexual expression or wide spread encouragement of minorities to join a Chinese communist Marxist antifa BLM sleeper cell is classic John Birch Society dogmatic bovine excretion.

Yes we know. Also CRT is not currently a curriculum in the Mo. public school system. Yet conservatives in Mo. want to replace a curriculum that doesn’t even exist at all with a behavioral curriculum in patriotic teachings in their public schools. Seems authoritarian to me. But whatever.

And for the record, by GG grandmother was a full blood Blackfeet Indian. They are a tribe from the upper plains. I have enough blood that I could legally join the tribe if I applied. I never have, but several of my cousins have. I never knew her, but my GG Gmother lived until I was around 23...she was half blooded.

I certainly understand the issues, but again, I don't feel any guilt.

I don't know why any of us would or should feel guilty about it. I think the entire purpose of this thread centers around whether the details of such history should be fully taught to the nations children or not. Much like other atrocities around the globe, if we do not learn from history we are doomed to repeat it. And that's where the topic gets muddied. The very reason used by many of those who oppose such things being taught claim it will cause their children to feel guilty and ashamed of their race. What I believe the reality is actually it's because they wish to paint a false sense of reality to their children and wish to insulate them from any truth that doesn't scream how great this nation is. As with all nations and races we too have made our share of mistakes and the most important thing any of us can do, including our children, is to face them, be honest about them and learn from them so we do better moving forward.

I don't know. For what purpose? In HS my teachers didn't gloss over the treatment of natives and they peacefully went off to reservations to run casinos.


I think I would rather see schools teaching Civics. Most people don't have a clue about how our government works. That is more important than spending hours reading about Andrew Jackson, the father of the democratic party was a noted leader responsible for the killings of tens of thousands of Natives.

So yes, it is all about guilt. Quit kidding yourself.

I hate to say it but.... after they got their land, and were able to govern themselves... they continue to put their people into poverty.

last thing on American Indians...

People keep trying to blame Columbus like he personally killed tons of American Indians himself. Columbus didn't even colonize the USA... He found it.

Britain, France, Spain, and the Netherlands colonized it. What they did to American Indians was pretty brutal. Quite frankly, Spanish conquistadors wiped out a large majority of the American Indian population prior to our country becoming a country in 1776.

After 1776, only something like 40-80,000 American Indians died before the end of the war.

I don't feel guilty.. in fact I"m not guilty...

But I don't want history ignored just because people are uncomfortable.

Teach history accurately. let kids decide for themselves

Of course not. I never thought you killed Indians or owned a slave.

What about history isn't accurate?

I do know that taught history isn't always complete. There are almost always two side to history. My undergrad was in history. You can deep dive in to nearly any historical event and hear Paul Harvey say, "And now you know the rest of the story". I suppose my point is you could deep dive any event and take up half a year or more.

What is it that you want taught?

I don't know who this "We" is your talking about.

Let me ask you some things. Who are these "We"? Does it include the descendants of slaves? Does it include a 1st generation Asian-American?
You obviously think it includes yourself. What makes you a member of the "We"?

There is not a nation in existence today that was the native people to that nation. War happens and to the victor goes the spoils. I am glad we live in a country like the USA. Did hard decisions have to be made, yes. And we are all better off now because of it. Some things that happened in our past was not pleasant but was necessary. I for one am grateful for our ancestors and what they achieved. They made mistakes along the way. But they created the greatest nation in human history.

Truth, not one person or group of persons Idea of truth..

We - used by a speaker to refer to himself or herself and one or more other people considered together.

And the entire context of this conversation is about the American education system. We as in accuracy being taught in the public school system. I hope that helps clear things up for you.

Yeah, that's exactly how The Trail of Tears went.


God forbid they do both. This isn't an either or proposition.


As per usual, the typical excuse not to tell the truth.