Fact. Nick Chubb is the best RB in the NFL. As a matter
Of fact, he is HoF talent.
He isn't going anywhere. Hei is under contract.
But the reality is, this team might be better off in the long
Run trading Chubb. You could get just as much or more
For him than the Panthers received for CM.

Oh know, how this fanbase would react..."oh gosh no
He is the heart and soul of this team , he is what a Brown
Is being about....blah blah I named my son after him
I named my pet zebra after him....yadda yadda."

The fact is, this is a QB WR driven league.teams can no
Longer ride the shoulders of a RB to the SB...Ala
Ottis Anderson, Warrick Dunn, Mike Alstott, Jamal Lewis.

The Browns have the best run blocking oline in the NFL
You can put any RB in place of Chubb and get 4.0 a pop

Here's the thing. Cause of the Watson trade, this front
Needs to exhaust any avenue to acquire draft picks.
Plus Berry's drafting in The mid RDs has been porous
Where's the difference makers?

It's a passing driven league.
Does anyone thing the Falcons and Browns will be
In the SB this year?

somebody needs to cut your internet off.

LOL

Haha I see you put tremdous thought in your response.
What has this team accomplished with the best RB
In the NFL?

If the defense was playing half as good as we thought they would be, we wouldn't even be having conversations like this.

The offense given it's current roster has not been the real problem here.

I 100% support this comment

I will say... Next year will be our window year and maybe 2 more years where we can get to the SB.

After that, we are going to be in cap hell and we will truly know Berry's talents with the cap.

There is absolutely 0 chance we trade Chubb for anything besides 20 first-round draft picks.

I feel bad that we’re wasting his career here (kinda like Joe Thomas), but he’s gonna be a Brown for life. Sucks for him.

That was one of the funniest things I've ever read. LOL!!!!

I found it very funny. But as not as funny as some rather it appears to
Have Chubb here and not have a team that contends
For the playoffs. But I get it.people think with their hearts
And not there minds

Chubb is a guy that is the kind of player that a culture can be built around. He is not overrated nor is he underachieving. He's quiet...but leads with his play and effectiveness.

You wanna trade a 'valuable' asset to recoup draft picks? Trade Myles for a haul. IMO you can't pay a guy $29 MM/year who has no leadership traits and who the local radio guys call a 'snowflake' (Monday morning WKNR after the Chargers debacle). If someone would be dumb enough...trade them Ward and that albatross of a contract.

This thread should be thrown in the nether reaches of hell.

What is the culture now?

We just traded away our future for DW so we can make a run, and your logic is to now trade Chubb for what? Picks like Carolina just got for their rb? SMFH.

There is nothing wrong w/the culture here. It's just spiteful ex-fans of the team making a mountain out of a mole hill.

You been in the locker room? Is this first hand knowledge?

Are we already at the "Troll the Boards" point of the season?? I really need to start putting this on my calendar

Apparently Joel Bitonio is concerned about there being a culture of players who don't know how to act like professionals...so there's that.

I love how baker hater said "spiteful EX fans...."

Because anyone who disagrees with "I know more than anyone about football" cannot be a fan. He tries to control the board and now who's a fan and who is not.

Um, no. We don’t trade Chubb. We haven’t had Watson yet so it is pointless to make a major change like that. Personally I doubt we could just plug any back in and get what we get from Chubb. I also think Hunt might be declining but I could be wrong.

Correct. And, I'm not an ex-fan. Seems the person we are talking about puts posters he disagrees with on 'ignore', but I promise, he reads them. I'm glad he didn't teach my kids. Oh, and maybe he should realize this isn't his middle school classroom where he gets to dictate what is discussed.

Nick Chubb has the ability and opportunity to break the all time single season rushing record. I say if Ski orients this offense to achieve just that, we can still make the playoffs. I'm serious. There are ZERO questions about the Offensive effort.

The guy who left the board for months over Baker being QB talking about hateful fans?... I didn't see that coming!

Flag on the play! 15 yds for piling on. Enough guys.....

No, it's not enough. Some dude that claims he knows more than others? Screw him. He puts those that don't see it his way on 'ignore'. His disappearance for a long time, only to re emerge once his hated player was traded, and his constant bringing up the guy that isn't on our team? C'mon. We've been told, ever since he came back, that we would be so much better with Jacoby.....................yeah, baker isn't here, yet he still brings him up in almost every post............and forget about the current players saying there's an issue. Stefanski is good, Woods is good, it's just that the rest of us are too stupid to get it. Right.

I jumped on here after reading the title.
I immediately jumped to the "reply" feature without reading a damn thang.
This is my initial response to just the title alone:


Foo-... is you crazy?

Even Art (freakking) Modell (may he roast in Hell) never considered trading away Jim Brown in his prime.

This, right here is why the NFL has:

32 General Managers
32 Head Coaches
32 OC's
32 DC's
hundreds of professional position coaches, analysts, trainers and support crew...
...and you ain't one of any of them.

The Universe still makes sense... at least on this level.

It might be essential to the internet's survival.

Respectfully disagree, Vers.

This team does still have culture issues.
Granted, they are not as messed-up as the culture we had when Crennel got fired/Savage tweeted "Go root for Buffalo"/Hue: 1-31... but we're not out of the woods yet. I'm more confident about the decision-makers we currently have in place than at any time since The Return, but I have to also say this:

I still don't trust ownership enough to ignore the loudest 'howling dawgs' in our pack. If they let things ride out, and allow the command structure they've put in place self-correct...
...THIS will be the first time (the very first time) that they give any plan more than 3 years to work itself out.

The culture is set by ownership.

Since 1999, Cleveland has been home to a culture of ineptitude, constant turnover, short attention span, knee-jerk reaction, and endless attempts at instant gratification through quick-fixes. Double-digit FOs/Admin. More starting QB's than seasons back in the league.


I'm telling you, Vers: we are right back where we always find ourselves: 3 years in, hitting all the usual NFL seasonal speed bumps... and seeing rising numbers of Battered Dawgs now howling for player benchings, play-calling changeovers, and outright coach firings.

Dawg- you know me. You already know what I'm gonna say next.


This is the watershed year for this current admin. We've never crossed this threshold since the Romeo days. And Browns fans are right on schedule for pressuring another big PurgeMove- 'cause that's what we're good at.
We have a 3-year attention span. It's the most we've ever been able to muster from ourselves. And 3 years is the base foundation of any solid structure. You can't build a culture with less than this, and you can't build a culture UNTIL you've passed this threshold.

If JimmyDee want to establish a new culture, they'll stop playing 'the tease,' and actually commit to a vision/purpose/course of action.

If the commit to that, they'll stay the course, with surgical, strategic hirings/firings at season's end.
If they're st00pit, they'll do what they've always done since 1999: scrap it all, and start all over.

I see this season as an acid test of JimmyDee's resolve:
So much on-paper talent, so far into a quality build, so invested in a FQB (at unprecedented cost) who can't yet play-
...and I still don't trust them to not s#scuttle the entire project, squandering the talent pool and FO/coaching infrastructure we've amassed.

CLE culture begins and ends with ownership.
We fans have sucked wind and struggled since the day Art Modell bought the team. Look at the pattern & frequency of firings/hirings regardless of the owners' names: no child allowed to live beyond the age of 3-4. Since the 1960's. Look it up, folks.

JimDee have a chance to break that cycle. Right now. Make a choice/stick with that decision.


I'm on the fence as to how I think they'll fall.


JimDee are the Browns, for better or worse.

just sayin'

I can't argue w/any of what you are saying, Clem. I'll even comment on some of what you said and perhaps reiterate it. My comment that you quoted is about a manufactured claim by a small group of posters. I know you don't come over here much, but they're a vindictive, spiteful group that has poisoned this forum and we have lost a lot of good posters due to the personality crap that rears its ugly head daily. Some people are secure enough to admit when they are wrong. Others are not and they lash out much like a spoiled child would.

Regarding your thoughts on the subject. I agree w/you about the FO and HC being on the same page. We've long said that it's important to have those guys working collaboratively, rather than stabbing one another in the back while trying to accumulate more power.

I also agree w/you about ownership. In the past, both Junior and Jimmy have caved in to the negative narrative spewed by the local media and the "sports radio" public. I have no idea how ownership will react this time. I think Dee is more level-headed than Jimmy. I think that having Depo, Berry, and Stefanski aligned might improve the chances of continuity than what occurred between Depo/Sashi vs Hue or Depo vs Dorsey.

I think that it's okay for some of us fans to express that we want continuity. I don't think everyone has to jump on the Fire so and so train. I feel that it is in the best interests of the organization and football team to keep the principle pieces in place. If the DC or STC has to go at the end of the year, so be it. However, I think it is very important that we keep both Berry and Stefanski on board. Depo, I'm not too worried about. If there was ever a nuclear bombing, three things would crawl out from the rumble. A cockroach, a rat, and Depo. Dude is a survivor.

With all that said, you are right in that we really don't know what ownership will do. They certainly will be tested. Personally, I am sick of redos. I have a hunch you may be, as well.

Appreciate the manner in which you disagreed w/me. Reasonable debate is always welcomed.

Part of contending is having players with whom you can contend. To me it would make much more sense to trade Hunt and extend DJ a few years. Ride with a backfield of Chubb, DJ, and Ford.

Those 3 are somewhat the same type of back, so if we feel we need a 3rd down type, get one via trade, draft, or free agency. Those guys are a dime a dozen.

With the value that backs bring, we could get almost as much for Hunt as we could for Chubb.

I wouldn't trade Chubb this year but, if this team doesn't make
The playoffs this year. Then I think it's a possibility I'd explore
Next season. This roster needs to recoup as many draft picks
As it can in the next 3 years.
Chubb is the best back in the league.
But as good as he is a luxury, but not essential to this team
This team being a playoff contender.
How essential are running backs to the Chiefs,Bills success?

Are you referring to the poster who had to leave the board because he hated said player so much? Only reappeared when the player was no longer on the team, and just since spent endless hours trying to pile on hate and bile on said player no longer on the team. The same guy studiously ignoring and deflecting from actual players own words in the locker room?

As for the original post and the headline, yes, Nick chubbs trade value will never be higher because he is the best running back in the league on a team friendly contract. That much is true. However, teams generally don't trade their very best player unless they are in complete tank and rebuild mode. The idea that teams get rid of their best players for draft picks, especially ones with such questionable draft history as ours, is faulty logic.

Explain to me why Nick Chubb is so "untouchable?"
He is one player of 52 on this roster
But the Browns roster needs a serious infusion of talent
Via the Draft. And since Berry traded 3 1s , you have somehow
Replenish what he gave up.
This team has 1 playoff appearance in 5 years with Chubb as its
#1 RB. And yeah the Browns aren't making the playoffs this year

The greatest Browns player (not just RB) since Jim Brown and you think that Draft picks can replace that?



How long have you been a fan? ... we would squander those picks as we have always done too.

But we can trade him and get more than he's worth. We'll use that 2nd rounder and get a player better than Jim Brown!!

Use your head!

The OP gets the stiff arm.

Lol

Is that you Scare Crow?

I agree in general about backs. You can find good backs all over the draft. I also agree that having the best back is somewhere down the list as comparted to having the best player at some other position.

As to getting picks, we don't have to get picks for 3 years. We are missing picks the next 2 years. I would also say that as good as Chubb is, I doubt you would get what McCaffery brought.

All said and done, I doubt it happens and I have expressed my feelings so I don't have anything else to add.

you have to wonder if Hunt will be traded if we lose today. The year would be gone and we’ll lose him for nothing after this season (unless we think he’ll sign a deal worthy of a comp pick)

Yep. The Hunt clock ticks in earnest if we screw the pooch today.

Yeah, it's no problem when Myles is saying things to the press. Only when Baker did it. I guess you must be watching all the enthusiasm on the field from our D that nobody else can see.

The team is a mess. Mayfield being here wouldn’t change that.

No it wouldn't. Mayfield certainly wouldn't be the solution. My point is that the poster I addressed made huge issues out of the things Mayfield said to the press. He used it as what was wrong with the culture. As if Mayfield leaving would help solve that. Now when it's Myles doing the same thing suddenly it's not an issue.

I totally agree with you that Mayfield wouldn't help the culture. My point is that Mayfield wasn't the driving force behind the culture issue. It runs deep and now that he's left it still remains. It is the selective nature of it that I'm pointing out.

I feel bad for Chubb. High character guy. Let's his play
On the field do the talking. So many great NFL RBs barely
Got to see the playoffs.
O.J Simpson. Floyd Little. Chuck Muncie. Joe Washington
Nick Chub

You forgot Barry Sanders. But trading Chubb would be foolish. You CAN get a good back in later rounds, but a back like Chubb is special. Start watching the games, he’s probably the best RB in football. Durable. And the heart of our offence.

How long have you been a Browns fan? Have you not seen what our front office usually does with a bunch of draft picks? Nothing, usually.

Sure we would probably get a nice haul for him, but the front office would waste most of the picks and you would end up with nothing in return. We've been there and done that many times with trading down in the draft, this would just be a similar result.

I truly understand how special and unique his talents are.trust me I watch
Like any other on here. But does his special skill set
Equate to wins? And when a team like Browns struggles to win
And the fanbase deals with losing week after week, you find
Any ray of light you can with players that stand out.
As great as Chubb is, he is just one player.
This roster isn't as talented as people believe
The dline has one playmaker. The LBers as a unit are bottom 5
In the NFL. Conklin can't play a full season .RT is a quiet issue.
The WR core has 1 playmaker.
Because the Browns don't have 1st RD picks for 3 years.
It's imperative that not only the front office hit on the 2nd and 3rd
And 4th RDers, they have be difference makers sooner
Than later. So how does this front acquire picks?
You deal from a position of strength and surplus.
The RB position

Okay then, I see your points, and that’s where Hunt might come into play, as a trade chip. I don’t even wanna trade Kareem but I get the business. But Nick in my mind, is off-limits.

No "one player" alone equates to a winning team. But I somehow think you are missing out on the timing of your suggestion. As much as I hate bringing watson to Cleveland for reasons I've made quite obvious elsewhere, nobody can say he isn't what is considered a franchise QB. The last thing you would want to do is trade away the best RB in the NFL at a time when you will be seeing the team get a franchise QB.

From my understanding Chubb is under contract through the 2024 season. That gives the Browns two full seasons with Chubb and watson on the roster. Trading away Chubb would make the Browns a one dimensional offense. The Browns have the ability to have the best RB in the NFL combined with a true franchise QB at the same time. A team that can beat you with the pass and the run. Something we haven't seen since the return of the team in 1999. This would be the most foolish and untimely trade I could think of at this time.

Peen brought up a point that the reason they may be using Hunt less is to help insure his health while possibly seeking a trade. While that wouldn't be my preference it makes sense and would be as far more logical move.

It would be a huge advantage having both watson and Chubb on the same roster. An advantage I think would be crazy to give up.

Agree.

Hunt is and has been our biggest trade chip for three years.

"Kareem Hunt. His trade value won't be any higher" has been true the whole time. We haven't exposed any downside because we have Chubb. His upside is basically unexplored (since leaving the Chiefs) because we have Nick Chubb.

Because teams are still enamored with the possibility of Hunt being a true #1 workhorse, the return on the trade wouldn't be much different. In fact, as I've said many times (while posters threw shade acting as if I was advocating a trade), I wouldn't accept anything less than a 2nd round pick for Hunt anyway.

If the Browns were to keep Hunt and trade Chubb, I could walk away happy; knowing I could be released from my sentence as there was absolutely no hope for this franchise.

Nick Chubb is on pace for 1787 yards this season. He has over 3.2 miles for his career. Next season, his sixth as a Brown, he will pass Mike Pruitt and Leroy Kelley to be second to only the great Jim Brown.

His trade value will be even higher and he still won't be traded.

Yea, this thread should have been a Kareem Hunt thread, not a Hall of Famer Nick Chubb thread.

I haven’t seen them all (and none of them before Metcalf), but Chubb is the 2nd best RB in our franchise’s history … and I’m confident in saying that.

He had the ability to be the best

jc

we should trade garrett too

I saw someone mentioned the possibility of trading Greedy … not sure anything we’d get (maybe like a 7th rounder) would even be worth it. He’s at least a viable athlete at the CB position

Trade them all trade 53 players all for 7th round picks in the 2090 NFL draft.

Sacrilege!!!

Trading Nick Chubb would take more Cajones than trading an entire draft class for Ricky Williams, Mike Ditka. Neither Washington or New Orleans won a Super Bowl.

You need good players to win. Chubb is a great player, and probably in the top 20 in the league. Legitimate MVP candidate.

It’s a terrible idea borderline trolling.

I'd feel better about the whole thing if I thought it was just trolling. Sadly, I don't think it is.

To each his own, I guess.

Package deal? Think of the possibilities!!!

I just reviewed this thread.
"After further review...
...I really think we could have closed this thread after this post."




Bro- maybe you don't understand what football is all about.
This .gif represents what football is all about.

You actually WANT this on your team.
You want as much of this on your team as you can get.
Trust me.

No crap. Look at that punk bounce off the field.

#concussionprototcol.
#outfor3weex.

Thank You, SuperBrown for this MicDrop.

Chubb isn't going anywhere nor should he be going anywhere. However, as a FO, there's an elephant in the room that has to be on the mind of the FO. Ignoring the elephant and the history of the elephant could be disastrous for the Browns.

Chubb will turn 27 in December; Hunt is already 27 and Johnson turns 27 in February.

Running Back is still by far the least durable position in the NFL.

The average NFL career span of players by position, Running Backs — 2.57 years. That trend in itself means the Browns are on borrowed time.

The production of the running back usually starts to trend down when we see these players hit the age of 28.

Workload and the number of touches can play a factor in longevity. Chubb is on pace for 337 touches in 2022 which would be the most touches he's ever had in a season.

On average, running backs with 300 to 369 touches who do not play in the postseason will see total yards drop by 15 percent the following year, and yards per touch by two percent or more.

History shows that players (any age) who get above 369 touches [370 to 389 touches] average a 27 percent drop in total yards, and a 10 percent drop in yards per touch the following year. It becomes important that the Browns control the amount of Chubb usage going forward.
.
Back in the year 2000, Doug Driner (then of Pro-Football-Reference.com) did a little data mining. For all running backs in the NFL from 1998 on, Diner looked at what percentage of running backs tended to improve statistically from one year to the next. He found that backs mostly improve up to age 27 - then as many improve as decline during their age 27 year - from age 28 on, they mostly decline.

It's too bad that by the time most backs are (age 27), their skills are about to start to evaporate.

The Browns RB room is heading into the decline zone - thus the elephant in the room.

That's right up there with Kevin Mack knocking out Greg Lloyd
Big Mack Attack

Well, both just traded for running backs because theirs' suck. And for both teams, their weakness is the lack of a running game. In Buffalo, Josh Allen is the running game, and he WILL get hurt at some point if that continues. Watch that team completely crater if he does. Having Chubb makes the passing game better, whoever the QB may be. And being able to grind out games late is amazingly helpful. Chubb has won us several games this year, that the defense turned around and gave away.

How do you think the team reacts if we trade a player universally loved, and who does nothing but show up, play hard, and score TDs?

If he did that study in 2000 with a data pool from 1998 on, isn't that a rather small snapshot? You also have to figure in the number of rb's that just don't cut it in the NFL and only last a season or 2. I think Chubb and Hunt are in their prime.

I think that the RB room is in great shape.

Chubb is 26. Hunt is 27, but will probably be gone next year. DEJ is 26 and Ford is 23.

Additionally, people on here b**** about Chubb not being used enough, but I think the Browns have been smart to ensure that they have at least two backs to share the load. Chubb gets plenty of carries, but we aren't running him into the ground like Dallas did w/Zeke when he came into the league.

I honestly feel the team wants Chubb here beyond his current contract and are managing his carries with an eye toward the future. That doesn't mean you should sacrifice wins today, but I believe they are being smart with him for that reason.

That's my hope anyway.

QFT.

And as far as Steve and the "elephant in the room". I understand the data points, but will choose to trust the organization with an analytics dept the size of the pentagon. j/s

An interesting variable is the increase in RBs used regularly in a team's backfield and how snaps have become more diversified. And this is just a few years time. Not many teams use RBs like the did 10, 20 years ago, imo...Or at least not as often.

Little early for this trade after all we are going to win 6 games this year with Deshaun at QB.

Little early for this trade after all we are going to win 6 games this year with Deshaun at QB.

I think you have a twin.

Sorry somethings need to be repeated.

LOL

And he's still a Dawg!