Our defense simply has to step up more than they did last night. We can’t be asking the offense to score 45 points in December and January against good teams.
The Giants have a few things that worry me: a QB who likes to scramble for yards (even though he’s dinged up), a quick, shift RB in Gallman who has come on strong, and a few WR/TEs who can make plays: Engram, Slayton, and Shepherd.
This is not a gimme game and is probably closer to 50/50 than I’d like to think.
What can our defense do against the Giants to give us a better chance to win?
With a team like them, we simply need to replicate what other teams have had success doing. They don't have a ton of great options; we just have to take them away.
Daniel Jones is lacking pocket awareness...There was multiple times he let his Oline down as he held the ball too long, and he has perhaps the highest tendency of any QB to fumble.
Andrew Thomas has been turning the corner at LT, but he didn't look too bad minus 2-3 plays (which happens to be Wills issue too...but hey...theyre rookies) Zietler is still their best Lineman at RG...Hart at RT should have his hands full this weekend.
Alfred Morris is the best north/south back...Gallman is nice, but dances too much and had the same issues last week...But he is quick once he comes to the 2nd level, Dion Lewis has really fallen flat...Fumbled on a KR too.
Tate is past his prime, Sterling Shepherd hasn't been the same this year. Slayton has that deep speed. Engram has come some ways from a blocking standpoint, and can be a mismatch if and when the QB goes his way.
Logan Ryan dropped an interception, but really seemed to elevate this secondary. Peppers hovers all around and seems to thrive in his role. Bradberry has been a good signing...I don't know much of their LBS, but they seem to be a sound unit.
Williams, Lawerence, and Tomlinson all got some beefy bodies that can push that pocket...a fine young trio up front.
There is literally no rational reason we don't control this game from beginning to end for the W. That said, there is still the any given Sunday thing that holds so true in the NFL. Our D matches up well with them.
That's the play that had me so livid last night...when the 2 deep defenders ran into each other, I know one was Sendejo (who somehow has been taking teammates down all year) I still can't make the other player out....Thought it was redwine, but the player looks a little bigger...anyone know?
Our defensive scheme has to be better this game than it was against the Ravens. It just has to. Both that, and the players have to do what their damn jobs are. Stop playing hero ball and stay in your assignment.
Do any of us realistically expect to win many games giving up 45 points or so? This defense, everybody not named MG, needs to pound their job harder. We can do better with little stuff, one of which is getting off blocks. Our D line needs to bring the chaos. On paper, we own this game coast to coast. The reality willed to be seen.
Our defensive scheme has to be better this game than it was against the Ravens. It just has to. Both that, and the players have to do what their damn jobs are. Stop playing hero ball and stay in your assignment.
Scheme can only cover up so much poor execution. I highly doubt the scheme called for 4 defenders running into each other. Players need an injection of 'not-stupid' before they take the field again. I don't think it would be the worst thing to subtly remind them that there will be significant roster additions over the offseason, and not much time left to prove they deserve to remain.
Our defensive scheme has to be better this game than it was against the Ravens. It just has to. Both that, and the players have to do what their damn jobs are. Stop playing hero ball and stay in your assignment.
Scheme can only cover up so much poor execution. I highly doubt the scheme called for 4 defenders running into each other. Players need an injection of 'not-stupid' before they take the field again. I don't think it would be the worst thing to subtly remind them that there will be significant roster additions over the offseason, and not much time left to prove they deserve to remain.
I would venture to say they've seen that tape a few dozen times already back at Berea.
I wasn’t a fan of blitzing Lamar (we had a timeout to really discuss how to approach it). It was 4th and 6 IIRC ... so we shouldn’t have been concerned about a run play, only if Lamar would scramble. I would have wanted the DL to keep him inside and have our LBs/DBs force him to throw it outside the hash
There are many a problem with the D. Posters seem to be in a either or mind set .. Talent vers scheme .. I believe it's a combo .. This FO didn't no us any favors with their evaluations . Just look at the personal they brought in for the defensive backfield THIS season. I could list the backfield roster , but it's not pretty.. Could talk about the lack of physicality ( again ) , but I digress ..
We have all beat the LB position to death. that's on the FO and the Coaching stff..
You can usually spot a pick route from the snap of the ball .. HELLO.. Some how , some way the Woods scheme leaves the middle of the field open on almost every play .. You have to see that when watching game film .. I know the opposing OC's see it and scheme foe it..
I love what Ski has done with the O ; Just hope he can transform the D in the off Season..
I wasn’t a fan of blitzing Lamar (we had a timeout to really discuss how to approach it). It was 4th and 6 IIRC ... so we shouldn’t have been concerned about a run play, only if Lamar would scramble. I would have wanted the DL to keep him inside and have our LBs/DBs force him to throw it outside the hash
This! I have no idea why you would ever blitz Lamar Jackson.
The goal against Lamar shouldn't be too sack him. The goal should be to keep him in the pocket and make him make tight-window throws against man-to-man coverage. If you play man-to-man, you CANNOT let him get out of the pocket, as you now have everyone out of position and with their backs turned to the QB!
I'm no NFL defensive coordinator, but the formula seems pretty easy to me, especially when you know they have to throw:
Man coverage across the board. Rush 4; tell your DL to maintain leverage so they can going inside or outside when they see Lamar start to run (basically, bull-rush and collapse the pocket). Maybe let MG do his thing and rush around the end, but only from the right side. Safety spy in a zone in the middle of the field (like a LB), and a single-high FS that you can play around with.
Heck, sometimes, I would just rush 3 maybe, and put 2 "spys" in the middle of the field to take it away.
Once again, the goal is to make Lamar throw the ball from the pocket to the outside against man-to-man coverage.
Our defensive scheme has to be better this game than it was against the Ravens. It just has to. Both that, and the players have to do what their damn jobs are. Stop playing hero ball and stay in your assignment.
Scheme can only cover up so much poor execution. I highly doubt the scheme called for 4 defenders running into each other. Players need an injection of 'not-stupid' before they take the field again. I don't think it would be the worst thing to subtly remind them that there will be significant roster additions over the offseason, and not much time left to prove they deserve to remain.
Yeah, I was still ticked off coming off the game when I wrote that. The number one priority is obviously the players doing their job. However, it didn't seem like we had a spy or the right coverage in place for Jackson, but I could be wrong. I was hoping for a more disciplined, pocket-collapsing style defense that we saw against HOU, but our ends and some of our DL went for more of the penetrating, "get-behind" the QB style where Jackson can really burn you. It kept happening that way, whether that was on Woods or on the players.
Yeah, it's almost a fool proof formula. You just have to have the personnel and the discipline to pull it off:
1. Receive the ball and be the first to score. 2. Don't blitz, just contain. 3. Guard the middle and bracket Andrews.
Edit ~ this is one of those scenarios where I understand people could say you could come up with a formula for any team, but I believe Baltimore is the most clear cut, notorious example of "do this and you'll win."
Haha, that's an excellent question and speaks to the talent issue.
IMHO, I think you'd have to try it with one of our safeties. I also think that Johnson has been farely successful in the times where he has rushed the passer, so he would have been an option. I do understand that the issue there is that we are already thin at that level.
Our defensive scheme has to be better this game than it was against the Ravens. It just has to. Both that, and the players have to do what their damn jobs are. Stop playing hero ball and stay in your assignment.
Scheme can only cover up so much poor execution. I highly doubt the scheme called for 4 defenders running into each other. Players need an injection of 'not-stupid' before they take the field again. I don't think it would be the worst thing to subtly remind them that there will be significant roster additions over the offseason, and not much time left to prove they deserve to remain.
Yeah, I was still ticked off coming off the game when I wrote that. The number one priority is obviously the players doing their job. However, it didn't seem like we had a spy or the right coverage in place for Jackson, but I could be wrong. I was hoping for a more disciplined, pocket-collapsing style defense that we saw against HOU, but our ends and some of our DL went for more of the penetrating, "get-behind" the QB style where Jackson can really burn you. It kept happening that way, whether that was on Woods or on the players.
Exactly...the defensive line did not play disciplined; getting too far up the field and leaving too many running lanes for Lamar. As someone else said, trying to play "hero" and get a sack instead of just doing their job and containing.
the play that upset me was a missed field goal and pat
The PAT we made up for with the 2pt conversion, but I agree about the missed XP. Parkey has been suprisingly solid all season, so I won't get on him too much
It is easy to overlook field goal kickers until they cost you a game.
The difference in this game was the kickers. Justin Tucker is the best in the game. Parkey is not.
Many, many, games are won and lost by kickers.
Tucker is close to automatic from 55 yards. Everybody else is measured at 40 yards. 40 yards and below unless the weather is extreme should be automatic.
When your defense gives up over 40 points, it rings rather hollow to blame the loss on your kicker missing a FG.
Agreed. With DC as well. Blaming anything other than the D for this loss makes no sense to me.
While I blame neither the kicker or Baker for the loss ... if we're going to blame the kicker for those 4 points why not blame Baker for 7? That pick was a horrible throw, and while not technically a pick-6 for all intents and purposes it was.
Can't seem to stay on the field. I will be happy to take whatever Ward gives for as long as he can. We need everybody to do their assigned job. Take away at least a few folks. Pressure could ice it for us.
FYI, I didn’t pay too much attention to the D lineup during the game. More just watching and hoping we could contain Jackson. I have been seeing a lot of criticism on Woods for sticking with a man scheme all game. Thoughts?
When your defense gives up over 40 points, it rings rather hollow to blame the loss on your kicker missing a FG.
Agreed. With DC as well. Blaming anything other than the D for this loss makes no sense to me.
While I blame neither the kicker or Baker for the loss ... if we're going to blame the kicker for those 4 points why not blame Baker for 7? That pick was a horrible throw, and while not technically a pick-6 for all intents and purposes it was.
Here's my take. The kicker missed a FG.. Baker threw an INT.. there was a busted coverage on 4th and 5 that led to a TD... those are 1 bad play. Everybody is entitled to make 1 bad play once in a while, they are human and it happens.
The defense couldn't stop Lamar and the Ravens for the entire 60 minutes. It wasn't a case of "Oops, we screwed that one up", it was more than half of their possessions...
DC, I think I can address your last point with your earlier point. L
Safety was obviously just a fluke play. So they scored 45 on us. So did Dak, but that's beside my point. Take away the 1 busted coverage you mention, it's 38 points. Take away Baker's pick 6ish, and it's 31 points. And isn't that right on with what our defense has done all year? I mean, it ain't good, and the L is on them. But I'm not convinced they played worse than any other game...just played an MVP-level Lamar.
I think it's a little more than that. I think there's a little bit of Jekyl-and-Hyde to our defense. They're bad, but we've seen them scrape together effective games before (Titans being the most recent example... neutralizing Henry is no small feat). Yes, opponent's specific strengths do play a factor... and Lamar can pose problems for just about any defense, but we've been able to put together (barely) winning efforts on that side of the ball a couple times so far.
add: I think our defense lives and dies by turnovers. They're not going to stonewall anybody, but they can take the ball away a couple times/game.
I think a LOT of our defensive success/failure has to do with how well the other team’s OL plays. If we can get to the QB (or at least have that threat) we are usually in decent shape. If a team can negate our DL (think about the Raiders, Steelers, and Ravens) we’re in trouble
OK, PIT. I'd love to see the point differential between what other teams put up on us vs. average, though. I'm guessing we are giving up ~10 more than the average (excluding November weather games, which are uninterpretable on both O and D).
There's probably some of that. But calling it jekyll & hyde is not much different than putting it on gameflow. How many hundreds of games have we seen where the game takes on a totally different flow in the second half or the 4th quarter. That's just kind of how it goes. I mean, I certainly would not expect us to drop 42 on the Ravens every game, even with some DB injuries. Same thing.
4LIFE, I agree with that to a point. Thing is, we were doing that in the first half. The TD we gave up at the end was bad, and foreshadowing of the second half, but we were about to go into half giving up 14...not worse than what we've seen all year.
Forgot to mention we WERE sacking Lamar, and holding the edge most of the time early on. So to your point, WHEN our DL held its own, so did our D overall.
Which is why I guess my main point was that I tend to dismiss the "just played an MVP-level Lamar" part of your post. The fact he destroyed our defense is no measure of the level at which he is playing. Last year? Sure. But this is 2020 and his play this year doesn't rise to that level. That's why I posted their average points per game.
Had we have had a defense that could have even remotely contained Lamar, that game was ours for the taking.
You're right. He absolutely hadn't been. But their backs were against the wall, and will continue to be this month. It will be interesting to see if he/they revert, or if a switch has been flipped.
