--Brissett looked like I thought. Pretty good, but unable to elevate others. He got rid of the ball way quicker than Baker did. Had some accurate passes. Swartz killed him. On the other hand, he doesn't have the talent to make others better.

--Bryan and Elliot were an upgrade over last week. Not great, but servicable.

--Schwartz is really bad.

--Wims shows some potentional.

--I would go w/Bell and DPG as 2 and 3.

--Dobbs is a gamer.

--York has a plus leg.

--Rosen has such a great arm and smarts........but, his confidence is shot.

--I think we have too many fans that have turned on the team. Spite is a bad character trait.

The d tackles looked much improved.

We played are starters minus
Bitonio
Cooper
Chubb
Hunt
Conklin
Garrett
Clowney
Newsome
Ward
Harrison

Delpit and Teller both left the game early.

Dobbs looked great playing against mostly guys that will be on the street. Brissett is by far the better QB

Brissett looked fine. Penalties and Schwartz derailed most of the drives

How bad are Teller's and Delpit's injuries, does anyone know? And an article I saw said three were injured, who else?

Ehhh

I hate being negative right now since so many others are, but the dude is terrible.

Odom was carted off. Stanton went out but came back after a few plays

Odom's injury looked bad.

Does Mike Harley make the team? If not why?

2. What is this teams chances in week 2 vs the Jets?

Did you make the mistake of reading the gameday thread? That thread is always doom and gloom

Schwartz has been dreadful, but on a year that is basically punted, they'll will give him another year based on draft status and potential upside (however crazy that sounds) over guys like Wims (age 27) and Mike Harley Jr. (age 24). Schwartz is only 21 years old.

Josh Dobbs. Good guy.

I said it in the gameday thread, when they invest a pick in a WR it's like an automatic 3-year tryout. I haven't seen him play, but if it was as bad as others described, then I agree he should go too, but I doubt he will.

I forgot to give props to the oline. Wills looked good and so did Hudson

Josh was saying “goodbye” . Can’t catch, can’t be here. We’ve seen enough.

- Dobbs continues to impress. He’s intriguing because of his athleticism and ability to make clutch plays.

- Brissett is milk toast. Nothing special. He’s basically Tyrod Taylor to me (we CAN win with him, I just don’t think we will)

- John Kelly has some upside to him, but unfortunately he will probably be gone (even though maybe Felton should be instead)

- I think our OL depth has improved. Our backups don’t look nearly as bad as they used to.

- Schwartz ain’t it.

- Harley might be a good PS candidate … I’d like to see him stick around

- The benefit of having a kicker like York is great, but when he misses from 55+ it leaves the other team such a short field.

- My assessment is that we won’t win 4 games with our current offense, but I hope I’m WAY wrong lol

- Glad preseason is over and I expect some roster turnover until the opener

Sorry coach. Catching is something you learn when you are 7 years old tossing the ball around with the kids in the neighborhood. If he can't do it by now, it isn't going to happen.

I feel bad for Stefanski. He knows the guy isn't any good, but also knows Berry is going to keep him. Stefanski is going to have to cut some kid who is also accountable, worked hard, and wants to get better, plus can catch the ball in order to keep a guy who can't catch and trips on his once a game end around.

Really hard to judge our potential when we played without so many starters but so far I’m not overly impressed. Without a elite HC it’s hard to punch any team above our weight class.

It is very clear to me that GM/coaching staff are in love with Schwartz, I just can’t rap my head around it. I usually don’t like using the term “track guy in a uniform” but in this case it really fits. Coming from Auburn which is not a sophisticated offense or route tree scheme, he was less than spectacular there and was dinged up. He was drafted IMO, about at least a round to early and nothing has changed. Still the same guy. Move On! Jamarcus Bradley when given the opportunity had played well. I think the other young receivers deserve more opportunities that are being wasted on Schwartz.

On a different note, Tavern Bryan and Elliot looked real last night. I watched them very close and they were excellent imo. Our DE play was hit and miss as Chicago really challenged them to set an edge and be disciplined. The youngsters learned a lot last night against Fields who was outstanding.

The rookie safety Bell is a special teams Demon, that kid flashed the whole pre season and will probably be our 4th safety over Lecount who is a good player imo.

Love me some Cade York and C Boroqueze . The best our kicking game has looked in a long time.

I am not positive what coach really thinks about Schwartz, but I am pretty confident in my thinking that he won't announce anything regarding him during a pre-season port-game presser. I get annoyed with the media and sometimes even the fans wanting to know what coaches are thinking all the time and important decisions they will be making. Why should Stefanski tell anyone outside the organization their plans for any player until it is necessary? I always hated the Banner Lombardi regime because they seemed to have loose lips. I felt I heard way too many rumors coming from the FO then that turned out to correct. I want the other teams to have no idea what we are trying to do (yes, I made the cute response from some of you easy "the Browns don't even know what they are doing").

The media has always made me crazy constantly probing a coach or player to say something controversial, then immediately tweeting about the player who said it, making them out to be a attitude problem. I have seen it way too many times.

I am very concerned about coaching . All the penalties to me are a direct reflection of coaching . I just am not sure that Kevin is man enough for lack of better words to command the attention of the room or to do what needs done to correct problems . He seems more like a paul depodesta type guy that should be crunching numbers . Just my opinion , I will be curious to hear others opinion on this .

Yes he is. I guess if they don't want to cut him he could always be used as a decoy, to stretch out the field with his speed. Just don't throw him the ball anymore.

I think they love Schwartz’s analytics to impact the offense. The problem is, he can’t catch lol.

This is it. After Stefanski's first year they went back and said "what is this offense missing?" Speed! Let's draft the fastest guy in the draft.

JC...


-Shaun Jolly...I had a 5th round grade on this kid...and always thought he would come around as a solid nickel in the league once he gets acclimated in a system. He made a couple nice plays last night...which is nice, as he's been injured the past several weeks. When Troy Hill was trade, Jolly was my dark horse to being groomed as our future nickel...would be a good stash for our practice squad. PS Was Jolly the Db who came up flying on the flats who wiffed that tackle?

-Schwartz is awful...In last years draft, I stated both him and TuTu Atwell were the most overhyped prospects that draft. I know Tutu fell to 6th on the Rams depth chart last year (god awful) and then went on IR....and we see what Schwartz is amounting to here....He is Troy Williamson 2.0

-I am really hoping the Bills let WR Jamison Crowder go. With a deep core, and him sitting for a few weeks...he may be the surprise odd man out. I really wanted him in FA and with his slot skills, experience, and speed...its something this offense severely craves. I'm almost positive we will be seeing us adding someone here shortly.

-Curtis Weaver has flashed some the past 2 weeks. Safety Bell has really looked promising as well.

-I had a higher draft grade on C Brock Hoffman than Deaton (whom we drafted) I know Hoffman has been getting strong praise lately, however I didn't watch him play last night.

-Cade York most def. has a strong leg.

-I always thought Dobbs played very well in preseason games when he was with Pitt, and the same is holding true with us. I am in high hopes, if given the chance...He can shine in actual Sunday games.

Nice to read your post, Tru. You are always a voice of reason around here and keep it to football.

When they kept showing Schwartz on the sideline, I was hoping he would drop the cup he was spitting his seeds in. Dude is trash!!

And some genius will want him to field punts and/or kickoffs. I think Schwartz has been lousy. Keep somebody who catches in games. Not sure where the love is coming from from KS, where he doesn't intend to cut him. Trade him if he is that "good."

Since you asked.. All teams commit penalties. Yes, some more than others. However, this is preseason. Guys are trying to make the team, and can easily be on edge as it's their livelihood is at stake. And from the outside looking in, it would be hard to say whether or not someone can command attention in a room and that he looks like a number cruncher instead. All coaches don't have to have to spit in players like Cowher or speak obscenities like a Rex Ryan to be great.

This is NOT what I want to hang my hat on after the last pre-season game from our starting QB:

""Today was a good stepping stone," Brissett said. "Getting in and out of the huddle, calling the plays and hearing them from Kev, I thought today was good."

Was he kidding? I can almost not believe that he said that. Stepping stone? The games are for real in two weeks. Stepping stone at the end of TC is getting out of the huddle and lined up?

This is the entire cupcake mentality of what Ski brings as the HC. Then he is stupid/arrogant-enough to let the reporter/world know that Schwartz is not in danger of being cut. Why even give that in-depth of an answer?

We did good today because grown men managed to huddle up and then disperse? And because a HC called plays that could be heard? My goodness. JB seems like a great guy...but if that's the only good he saw in the game - same as many others - we are in for a long, ugly ride.

The 1st teams looked like crap on O & D. Undisciplined and not-ready. A franchise that looks at continuity like its crabgrass has manged one thing with consistency...undisciplined play and being not-ready to play.

That's really embarrassing. Game 1 will be our first real practice.

My concern as well.

If they're really going to find a place for him besides situational WR (decoy or whatever else), that's what I was thinking.

I doubt it happens.

Which means PRs will be Felton or Winston (if Winston's not a cutdown casualty)?

And Felton, Johnson or Ford on KRs?

DPJ shouldn't be a part of it - imo.

Maybe it will be one of those revolving, game to game decisions until we hit on somebody. But, you're right - Schwartz should not be tried.

I don't know.

For all of you in a hurry to dump Schwartz, stop and think about Breshad Perriman. He started out "a bust," but had a pretty good year here. For some players it takes awhile to click. Hopefully, it clicks for Schwartz soon. He is still young (same age as Bell) and hasn't really spent much time functioning as a WR in actual games. (Auburn's O, lack of real reps due to injury here, late start in general.) Would you like him to show better? Of course, but actually doing it is probably the best way to get there. He has "upside" and honestly, most of the guys we could get to replace him aren't that great.

Look I get it, and don't love him, but it's pretty slim pickings and his speed is an element that is somewhat lacking in our offense/WR room without him. He's a lot more likely to improve with support rather than ridicule. Hopefully Carolina will take him lightly and he can catch a deep ball and get his confidence going. That's the element he hopefully will provide. He probably won't be a high volume guy, but someone you have to keep an eye on or could give up a quick strike. Probably also a jet sweep/decoy guy to help get movement in the box for Chubb/Hunt to exploit.


Communication in the secondary left a lot to be desired. It needs to be better with the starters playing. It was pretty ugly yesterday.

Ford on returns could make carrying a large number of RBs more "palatable." He looked pretty good back there.

I think he was the consolation pick.

Berry got played, but he and others didn't think it through at the time.

We traded up for JOK. Traded our 2nd and *the first* of our 3rds. No big deal because our two 3rds were only two picks apart, right?

Not until Carolina traded the pick again... to a team (Texans) that knew they had to leapfrog us (and snag what was our own pick 🤣) to grab soon-to-be allpro, 6'4" 220, fights-like-a-dawg, Nico Collins. We could have insisted they take pick #91 instead of #89 and I'm sure the deal would have still gone through. We were excited to snag JOK and thought "no big deal". Problem is, it's never a big deal until it bites you in the arse.

As much as I hate that this is true, I definitively hope that it is true... if not, we had Schwartz graded above Nico Collins, in that case we may be in bigger trouble than we know.

Edit to add: Yeah, I think you probably quoted the room verbatim. Let's be honest, we were already stocking the champagne.

Honestly - no idea how accurate the theory is, but damn if it doesn't ring true / highly plausible.

It's entirely possible to find contributing WR's - 3rd stringers or slot guys - in the 3rd round of most/many drafts. The issue seems to be we whiffed and we aren't yet ready to admit the mistake. Possibly a greater error will be not taking Pickens in this years. I've heard multiple people talk about Picken's being a P.O.S human and toxic. Can't prove that one way or another but maybe that's why he fell and maybe the Steelers have a culture where they have a better chance to straighten out a bad attitude more so than the Browns?

So is denial and a false sense of reality.

Fate...

I really agree with your conclusion. I think the Browns panicked after Nico Collins was snagged before them (And I said it multiple times-Nico was the WR to be had after all the top guys were gone...I was really high on him...and everything coming out of Texans camp, is he's been shining all summer for them) I think the Browns FO reached severely on Schwartz...who at his ceiling, had 6th round at best tape...His (Schwartz) game is just severely lacking...I think if he ran a 4.48...He probably would have went as a UDFA (theres always UDFA with solid tape and really good speed)...but with that 4.28 timed speed, someone was going to grab him.

While I can see giving him time to grow, I do not want to see Schwartz even in (4) WR sets, he just doesn't deserve to see the field yet. I have a feeling there's going to be some WR shuffling here come 53 man limits.

Anybody else tired of Stefanskis canned responses after a game?
Would be nice if he showed a little fire once in awhile.

I noticed alot of slow developing plays vs the Bears. I get that's its preseason
And things have to get worked out,but it's wake up time
The regular season is now. In a few weeks it's go time.

DPJ did nothing in the passing game. He has not shown
Any growth as a WR from 2021.
Schwartz belongs on the practice squad. I see his fan club
From 2021 can't defend him any longer

Too many penalties on offense. Kinda funny how
Last years SB teams were the least penalized in the league
Last year.

The running backs ran well. This team has too many good RBs
And not enough good WRs.

I'd bet money... Nobody denied Nico may be a work in progress (he has been), but he has all the tools. His stock dropped because of lack of current tape and time -- he opted out in 2020 because of COVID. I predict him to be a very solid contributor this season. And again, if the theory is false that means the FO had Schwartz graded higher. I sincerely hope that wasn't the case.

Thank you Vers! Good to see you again...I've kind of disappeared since the draft talk (and with us not having a lot of keen picks, it was kind of saddening for me lol) and I think you were away for a bit during that time.

I have always appreciated you and your input on this site...We have discussed our opinions and insight multiple times, even disagreed...But always kept it top notch and professional. Look forward to your posts!

I honestly think Stefanski's love for the guy is due to Berry's love for the guy. I think if it was up to Stefanski he would cut the guy, but Berry holds the cut/keep cards.

Yeah I really loved a lot of aspects of Nico's tape....him being physical, routes, strong hands, 50/50 ability, playing to his frame, blocking etc. I think he ran a 4.48 (can't remember) but he has some big play flair, despite not being a burner. He suffered from poor QB play (then again Schwartz QB sucked too...I think it was Bo Nix) And you knew he would take a little more time with his covid opt out. But I too expect him to put some strong games up this year, as he should get some ample playing time.

+10 Right now Wims is a better WR than Schwartz, and that's kind of sad.

I watched Baker against the Bills. Baker is looking good. He is a solid NFL QB that we could have won with. My fear is when Watson does get to play he will be a shell of what they think he will be and be very disappointing. Funny side note the announcer once called Baker "Mr I told you so".

Probably some truth to that. GMs don't want to give up on guys they drafted fairly high. It's not a Browns issue. It happens across the league. I think a certain segment of our population on this board are going to make this year hard to stomach.

I think your answer almost gives legitimacy to Vers outrageous claim which I think is 100% bullcrap.

Meh - it is what it is. As long as he's coaching well and we are winning and moving in the right direction, I couldn't really care too much about pressers. Bellichick is famous for his pressers - but we'd all be happy if he was out coach.

BB in New England has been doing that since day one. He wins so no one complains.

Yep! That was my point.

KS says the phrase “he’s done (did) a nice job” six or seven times in a presser. Maybe I read too many transcripts of his PCs lol

So Schwartz had another bad game. Not gonna pile any more on him...everybody else seems to have that covered. But the good to come from it....He apologized to Brissett on the play where he was knocked off his route. Brissett talked him up...no in your face BS....Then Deshaun took him aside and started talking to him...this is what you do next time if that happens...Then it looks like Dobbs talking to him again going into the lockeroom. To me...regardless of what happens with Schwartz on cut day....it is a sign of leadership from the QB room. As well as a team focused, "we're in it together" attitude being shown.

Too many guys I liked in that game that may not be here after Tuesday. Jordan Kunaszyk...he is always around the ball and had a nice fumble recovery...And several of these receivers won't be here...Daylen Baldwin...I don't remember any catches yesterday...but he has made tough catches in the preseason this year. Javon Wims, made some spectacular catches, but not everything...like his size and 50/50 ability. Mike Harley, and Jamarcus Bradley have done a good job and have room to grow... The TE's after Njoku and Bryant....Forristall had such a bad day yesterday...so it was nice to see him make that great catch for a TD...and then the hyphenated crew...there is potential there...But that doesn't mean there is room...We have a plethora of DB's and I don't think we will be able to hide them on the PS...D'Anthony Bell better have made this team. He has been a demon in practice and made plays in every Preseason Game...two forced fumbles!!!And he looks to be a terror as a gunner in ST.

Perrion Winfrey had a better game...I saw several times where he took his man out of the play for the LB's(in other words he did his job well on the play...lol), saw some pressure...If Jolly didn't get that sack...Winfrey was right there to get it...He did have a couple plays where he was easily taken out...But not as bad as the first two games...and I think when he gets a bit stronger and continues to clean his technique...we might have something. He definitely has the drive to apply himself.

David Bell...is as advertised...I will take his type of player any day...get open...catch the ball...Very comfortable with him.

Cade York has a Howitzer for a leg...That pregame kick was ridiculous...and boy was he ticked after missing from 58...

Looks like Jerome Ford is safe...To me that says John Kelly...a guy I really like probably won't be here...unless we can get him on the PS...I also think that Felton...who we haven't been using in the backfield and we haven't seen a lot of passes go his way....could be in trouble...just because of the numbers.

OLine is going to be a tough call this year. I have to wonder if they may go with Alex Taylor instead. Drew Forbes has been doing a good job in the pass game at LG Froholdt...needs some work...but he did decently yesterday....is it automatically Michael Dunn and Blake Hance????

Curtis Weaver and Isaac Rochell both have looked well but do you see them getting on instead of Alex Wright and Isiah Thomas? What about Winovich...a somewhat unknown this preseason.

I tell you....Going to be VERY interesting the next couple of days seeing who made this team and who we pick up afterwards...who we are able to keep on PS...do we trade from one of our strengths???Exciting week ahead...lol

There has not been a head coach, yet, that this hasn't been said about on here. I don't know what you were expecting, or thinking you were going to get, but canned answers and answers that say nothing is standard fare for EVERY head coach with more than one season under their belt.

There are simply questions they are not going to answer, but they're still expected to say something, so they give the canned answers to placate and give a sound bite.

I promise I won't do that to you Vers, we've already established DW is rapey as fact and he has been punished. I accept that and that he will be part of the Browns for the foreseeable future. But you can't throw a hissy fit or keep calling those who are not over it out in every other post, OR YOU ARE THE ONE THAT WILL BE RUINING IT FOR YOURSELF AND MANY OTHERS. You've already made PF unreadable with comments like this to people who are true fans but are pissed about the whole situation. So maybe reflect a little or something before game one. Pit should do the same because everyone else has a right to not be harassed for doing what we all come here to do and that's be Browns fans. Nobody has to root for DW, but at last count, there are 52 other players plus a practice squad on this team.

EDIT: To all, I also think KS and the FO, especially Haslam are not all that and a bag of chips. I loved Baker as our QB, but admit he wasn't the greatest by a long shot. However, I thought he could get it done even after those like Vers turned on him. He's gone now, so we'll never know. I'm still and always will be a fan of 6, will watch him with the panthers when I can, but I've been a Browns fan for 50+ years now, I don't see that changing. And should anyone decide to question my fandom, or get nasty because they don't like what I say, well they can kick rocks.

Haha yeah exactly. Every coach has their default sayings and way to answer questions.

I think the most annoying we have had is either Shurmur or Hue when it comes to that.

Nice post. That was an enjoyable read.

Hjalte Froholdt is going to be a starter in the NFL...I hope it's with the Browns..!

Lol ….yeah, and he learned that from being a head coach in Cleveland. Win and keep thy mouth on track or else.

For those of you who were unable to watch the game because you live outside of Cleveland, it will be televised on the NFL Network today at 3:00 P.M. Eastern Time and 2:00 P.M Central Time.

I’d suggest not watching the first half

I watched every down when the Browns went 0-16 in 2017. I highly doubt anything in a preseason game could duplicate that.

The sad thing is there were times during the 0-16 year that we played decent (for an 0-16 team lol). I actually wasn’t as downtrodden as one would think

Just stick to the PeeWee Ball during Half Time to see the best play.

#webattled

(I actually agree though)

“I have to take a look at the tape”

And then... "Again, I have to take a look at the tape”. Two questions later: "Again, I have to take a look at the tape”.

Just plead the 5th and call it a day lol.

Just watched the first half.

A couple things I noticed. Jordan Elliott played well. He held his ground and fought his way to the ball. He played stronger.

Njoku has grown to manhood. He is a bigger stronger guy than he used to be. Much improved in all aspects of his game. In a earlier thread I listed David as "Surprise player." He is going to show why he got that money.

Wills gave a good effort. He still can get beat on some moves but he mostly stuck his blocks.

Jacoby was good enough. The offense never got into a rhythm so he looked choppy.

The interior DL with Elliott and Brian was a welcome sight. Adding Myles and Clowney will make things much better.

Bell is as advertised. Gets open. Catches the ball.

I like Emerson. Hard nosed player.

Pre-season games have really turned into mostly junk. I don't think many conclusions can be drawn from the games. Especially with a veteran roster it has become a tryout for players to make the roster. Most will not so the play is not good. Very basic stuff.

I was so aggravated from reading the GameDay thread the other night, I probably didn't even mention these two guys.

#49--Jolly and #37--Bell. Those two guys were making plays.

Yes they did, I hope we can find a roster spot for both.

I know that Newsome has been used inside at NCB this training camp, but outside of him I think that Jolly looks to be very at home there too.

If you look back in the Archives you will find that I chose Jolly as a possible UDFA to make the final 53. It's still probably a long shot, but I would hate to see us let him get away.

Bell would be more of a surprise if he didn't make the final cuts at this point.

Another player who caught my eye was 64 NT Roderick Perry, he kept the play bottled up and held his ground vs double teams allowing others to make plays vs the run. Would like to see him make our PS, with tempered excitement, because most of the players he was battling with where not starting OL men.

I liked some plays Bell made and that LB (51 or 52) was always around the ball. Don’t know if he’ll stick, maybe a STer?

And the receiver named Bell? He will be a QB’s best friend.

I could have definitely searched for positive signs if that were my goal. I was trying to look at it from the perspective of an overview. It wasn't pleasant. But there were a lot of starters missing and I've never looked at the preseason as some indicator of the regular season.