The Good:

--Barnidge as a receiver. Very consistent. Good hands.

--McCown was pretty accurate.

--Koons hasn't missed this year.

--Whitner's heart.

--The Rams giving us 20 yards for being in the neutral zone or offside. LOL...hey, I gotta put something up here.

The Bad:

--McCown's ball security.

--Multiple turnovers.

--Numerous penalties.

--Why have Turbin in the game when we are down? Sheesh.

--Orchard on the edge. Why is he playing?

--Cooper trying to tackle Gurley.

--Desir and Poyer.

--Schwartz had a very rough game.

The Ugly:

--Our roster

--We started 7 and 4 last year. We already have more losses in 4 fewer games. The team is regressing due to numerous dumb roster decisions.

You came up with a better good list than I would have. Though I can't disagree with any of them.

The Good:

Barnidge, Coons and Lee.

The Bad:

My interest is waning.

The Ugly:

The Browns future.

I will go with your list. I add:

Offensive routes and run calls. Predictable and impotent.

Tackling. Tackling. Tackling. Tackiling.

Pressure. Again.

All bad.

Good
*2 sacks - finally
*decent pass distribution
*Zero picks by Josh

The Bad
*Only smelled the Red Zone 1 time?


The Ugly
*3/12 on third down and mostly 3 & long it seemed..
*Josh was our second leading rusher...

The Ugliest...I really have no idea where we go from here...how really do we turn this around?

The Good: next
The Bad: the tackling or total lack there of
The Ugly: offensive play calling. It was offensive. Hey coaches spreading the ball around doesn't mean just using the same 4 plays with different players.

Of all the regrets I have as a parent, teaching my kids to be diehard Browns fans, is the worst

The Ugly:

Rams driving crown of helmet into McC's chin and zero flags

The Ugly is McCown did a post game presser.

That means no concussion.

That means he's likely starting next week.

He's Pett's guy.

#bestchancetowin

The Good:

Todd Gurley

The Bad:

Anything doing with the Cleveland Browns current organization.

The Ugly:

See The Bad.

Can't really argue this.

I'll be "that guy" if nobody else will. The refs were atrocious. There was no consistency in the calls. Joe Thomas's ticky-tack holding call only to be followed up by a hold and dump on Gurley's short TD run. McCown was getting beat up by the Rams dline after the whistle. It's like Fairley was told by the refs to have at it.

The defense that the Rams have was supposed to be us. Nasty front with a couple opportunistic guys in the secondary. How many of their rushers were schemed into free shots at our QB (not including the liberties they took after the whistle/outside the rules)? Why does our defense look so toothless?

The Good
McCown hung in and took some hard shots
Barnidge sure handed as usual

The Ugly. Team had no fire or willingness to win
Joe Thomas was not at the game mentally.
He's on cruise control
According to some the best oline in the AFC North today got puked
Run defense non existing as usual

The Bad. The season is over with and Farmer needs to be held accountable for this garbage roster

There was an obvious facemask on McCown right after his last fumble that wasn't called

Perfect. I can't ever remember my interest waning in my 30 years a as a fan. This is just so depressing.

Classic post, SB!

And the announcers didn't even mention it even though they showed the play like 10 times.

The officiating as a whole for every game (not just Browns) is out of hand. They really need to do something about it or it is going to kill the game.

Barnidge and Coons are the only bright spots on this team.

The run defense was bad. I won't say horrible because they played well for a half, so they were only bad today.

McCown was bad with the turnovers and the stupidity. Was he trying to sell the late hit when he ran into that wall? The refs missed it but he clearly had time to pull up and he just kept going.

The offensive line was putrid today. Joe Thomas getting a flag that took away a huge play. Greco and Schartz getting beat, and getting penalties.

The real ugly goes to this coaching staff for just sitting on their hands today. They're horrible.

What the heck was that?

I rank that up there with Weeden getting sacked by the flag. What on earth was he doing? It's like he thought the wall was going to be padded and it ended up being concrete.

Yeah, that was one weird play. It should have been flagged but the wall thing was just strange.

Gus Frerotteish.

One thing I have noticed in a few games this year:

We are not a very physical team. Did anyone else notice how the Rams flew to the ball and tried to knock our heads off?

We can cry about the refs, but I prefer physical play.

We got punched in the face by the Jets.

The Raiders punished us physically.

The Rams smashed our heads in.

Physical play leads to turnovers. And other than wins and losses, no stat is more important than turnovers.

Think about it, the Rams defense outscored our offense today.

yea bro.

other than the last fumble on McCown, they straight up ripped the ball from our players. it was utter dominance by the Rams defense.

Being physical comes from having an attitude. That attitude has to be established by the coaches. Another strike against this staff. The players are getting their rear ends kicked in. You would think they would be embarrassed but they are cashing their checks so I don't think they're worried too much. Losing? Getting embarrassed? Who cares? Making 6 or 7 digits a year. It's all good.

The good:

- Barnidge
- Dansby
- Duke Johnson had a nice day, especially receiving
- Coons/Lee

The bad:
- Tackling, the Rams tackle with force, especially in the secondary, we look like we hope to drag people down.
- The officiating
- McCown when he gets close to or in the red zone. His stat line looks ok but he just doesn't make many throws that make a difference.


The ugly:
- Drive killing penalties
- Turnovers and the offense giving up 10 points and putting us in a hole for the second week in a row
- Our QB getting hurt running into the stadium wall after having 20 feet to get his balance and get under control.

Regarding our pathetic defense, is it lack of talent and/or lack of execution or horrible scheme and coaching? Jim O'Neil to me is not a very good Def coordinator

It's both.

Another Ugly:

The Browns raised tickets prices on the season ticket holders. Ouch.

I've noticed this as well. The flags seem to be used as a way to control the tempo of a game.

As well as the Falcons with Kyle Shanahan and their #2 ranked rushing offense.

What does Shanahan have to do with our defense?

Are you saying that if we ran the ball better the defense wouldn't be on the field as much?

YES.

We get out-hit in every game. I'd like to see a thumper step up and set the tone for this D. Make hitting and strong tackling contageous across the roster. Make opposing teams play with worry. On O, I think Turbin could be that guy. To date, there is nobody on either side of the ball who seems willing to set that tone.

It's football. Play passively, and you'll lose more than you win.

Vers... please see my most recent post in the "Post Game Comments" thread. And note: they were made just before I came to this thread.

It's quite sad to me when 2 sacks seem like a lot.....

The good: Our punter is a real weapon. He boomed a couple....
The bad: Our coaching staff. Penalties, stupid play calling, lack of emotion, lack of in game adjustment, etc. etc. This team is poorly coached.
The ugly: Everything from the top on down. This season is lining up to be horrifically ugly. 2-5 and I can't see a win in the near future. It would be a MIRACLE for this team to beat Arizona. The Bengals game is an almost certain loss. How far does this team fall before Haslam pulls the plug? I'm seriously thinking we may see an interim head coach one of these weeks if things don't improve.

I've been a Browns fan since I was five years old. But man, it's getting REALLY hard to watch this crap every week. I wouldn't mind the losing somuch if we weren't so god awful in the process. It's hard to fathom how a team could be so historically bad. How they could miss on pick after pick after pick. GM's come and go but bad picks continue on and on.....

It is HARD damned work being a Browns fan!

Peace

Most of the entire performance was bad and ugly.

The Good

Coons placekicking. He can't consistently blast it through the endzone for touchbacks but he's perfect on the year. I like that much.
Barnidge.
McCown when you disregard holding onto the ball too long, getting sacked six times a game, the ball security, and occasional poor decision-making. Other than that he's borderline elite!
Duke Johnson receiving the ball out of the backfield.
Our defense in the first half really brought it.

The Bad
Ball security. Benji, Gabriel, and McCown. It's sad that a first quarter turnover/TD is so crushing. The game seemed like an uphill climb out of a coalmine after that.
Our run defense. Containing the run to the inside of the man blocking you isn't enough. We don't actually set the edge (Orchard).

The Ugly
The Edward Jones Dome. I know as a Browns fan it seems in poor taste to say this, but enjoy watching a team play in LA in a real stadium. Is it really a best practice or industry standard to have five feet of concrete that close to the playing field? It's like the league is so concerned about brain trauma they forget about conditions that are borderline surprise ice skating.

We're uh, building something err, real special here...

I like Turbin, on the long run he broke instead of just running out of bounds he tries to steamroll the DB coming up to make the tackle. I wish more of our team had that attitude.

Good:

Defense did their job keeping Rams offense below 20 points. Rams executed 51 plays 23 passes 26 rushing. They had 150 yards passing 158 yards rushing 24 1/2 minutes in time of possession gave up 2 sacks. Those numbers are what you expect. You would like seeing under 100 rushing, but giving up 17 points is a good accomplishment.

Browns offense executed 65 plays 37 passes 24 rushing. They had 282 passing yards 82 yards rushing 35 1/2 minutes in time of possession gave up 4 sacks. Against a good defense those numbers are good. I like seeing about 20 yards more both rushing and passing with less sacks.

Bad:

Browns offense giving up 4 sacks. I bet the "hurry" count was high too. Rams defensive line is pretty dang good.

Scoring only 2 field goals. I should put this under "ugly," but my "ugly" point factors why only 6 points.

Ugly:

Having 11 pentalities for 98 yards, way to many offside and holding calls, and 4 turnovers, one being a pick-6, blows.

That was probably due, but we did have the expectation we would build on last seasons record. I suppose that could still happen, but it isn't looking good at this point.

I figured out the whole problem with our defense, dawgs! It's Andy Lee. If he wouldn't keep punting it so far, the other teams wouldn't have as far to go, thus less yards overall. Our running defense alone would improve by 50 yards per game if it wasn't for Andy Lee! Cut him NOW!

Most of the salient points have already been addressed, but I'll add a couple of "Uglies":

- The offensive penalties were killers. This is putting McCown into a very difficult position regarding down/yardage with the resultant necessity to need extra time in the pocket, say needing to pick up 20 yards instead of only 5. And you think he holds the ball too long? Well sometimes it's because he has to! You can't fault McCown for lack of guts/effort.

- Symptomatic of our issues was Manziel on 4th down, runs for the 1st down, slides...1 yard short! I turned the game over at that point...

Well that is a unique take...

The offense was responsible for at least 10 of the 24 pts the Rams scored.

I think Farmer has hurt the talent level of the defense w/stupid roster moves. Not paying Skrine was ignorant. He let Sheard walk. He made mind-boggling moves on the d-line.

The scheme hasn't been working that well. We crash our edge guys too much and put a lot of pressure on our corners. We have not generated a lot of pressure on the qbs. I think we are misusing guys like Kruger and Mingo.

So.......I guess I am saying there are multiple things at work here.

I think Whit lays the wood on defense. He's very physical and he'll let you know about it, too. The problem is that he is the only guy like that.

I was hoping Shelton would add to that attitude, but he seems to be disappearing before our very eyes.

On offense, Duke Johnson seems to very scrappy. He is always jawing w/opposing players.

Did anyone notice when Duke was getting into it w/a few different Rams, that not one Brown came to his defense? We are so freaking passive.

Absolutely, and I've posted that! No commitment to your team/teammates...

I really like Duke's attitude.

Thomas and Haden don't appear to have those types of personalities and those are the guys the players look at to set the tone.

I agree with you. I wish we saw more of that. I like Duke for that reason although I am disappointed in his overall play. I thought, based on the way he was talked up, he would be a little more explosive with his touches.

I thought it was his shoulder that was banged up?

Yeah. I thought he had more escapability, as well.

This has always bugged me about our OL guys, going back to when James Harrison was delivering headshots to our guys regularly - Massaquoi, Cribbs, McCoy - not once did any of our big boys deliver so much as a shove at Harrison. I always read draft write-ups about O-linemen that say "has a mean streak" and I wish we had just one guy like that, but we seem to go for the cerebral, "gentle giant" types. Maybe instead of Bowe, we should have signed Incognito, LOL.

When Colt McCoy got his head taken off by James Harrison
At a Thursday night game Joe Thomas did nothing
Didn't get in Harrisons face mask or anything.
Joe is too busy trying to be a nice guy for the sport

We need to just turn this thread into the "Bad and Ugly" thread.

Bad: defense tackling. Nate Orchard. Our small, brittle little WRs who can't take a hit without coughing up the ball.

Ugly: game after game, the high number of penalties. We're so undisciplined, it's nothing short of a joke. The turnovers. Josh when he holds onto the ball forever. Just how this team operates and level of improvement shown, ugly.

They do not run this defense, playing to the players strengths. They boasted about that being their philosophy, but they do the complete opposite. The misuse of the talent is killing them.

I also agree that Sheard is missed. He used to push his side in pretty well. I think that's why Kruger got the sacks.

Billy Winn

The good
Duke 90 yards
benji 4 receptions
3 barnidge.
4 defense allowing only 16 points without turnovers.
Bad turnover
THE ugly browns fans I feel your pain

The browns had 10 men on the field on one of the rams scoring play.

Is that true?

Sheesh.

Second time this season something like that has happened.

https://twitter.com/nwagoner/status/658771295912390656

https://twitter.com/DustinFox37/status/658815258350493701

Yup. The second time this year that it has happened. I want to give Pet more time, but dayum, this is dumb.

Yeah.............depressing.

One guy who I haven't seen mentioned yet is Kirksey. Getting Robertson back is going to be an upgrade. I constantly see Kirk with his head in the backfield while the RB is getting outside of him (also see Flacco's scramble a few weeks back). He doesn't shed blocks well at all, and it doesn't seem to take much to take him out of a play.

I agree that Kruger and Mingo are being misused. I get that Mingo probably has the athletic ability to cover, but what he lacks in size, he sure as hell makes up for in speed. Making him run backward in to coverage negates that speed.

I will say that Starks seemed to have a good game, got some good penetration. I think though, with the Rams having a rookie RT and RG, we should have had the talent and experience to constantly blow that side of the line up. And we didn't.

I think Flip's play calling was rather stale and I kept wondering why we would run or throw a screen to Benji's side putting him in position to rum block... Benji has improved other areas of his game, but he's probably our worst run blocking WR.

That is a pretty strong post.

https://vine.co/v/eYMXLrPqUww

The Browns are 2-10 in the last twelve games. The teams they have beat: The Titans are 1-5 and the Ravens are 1-6.

The Rams game was more of the same. The Browns do not have the ability to take over a game. Not on offense, not on defense.

They were prepared game plan wise to stop Gurley. They did stop him except for a few plays. That happens when the runner is of that caliber.

Turnovers and penalties lost the game. The effort was there.

McCown is a tough guy and is playing better than expected. He is however, limited. He has a long slow release. Compound that with his tendency to hold the ball and it leads to problems.

Our running backs are very average. The OL is not as good as people believe. Run blocking is suspect.

The absence of playmakers on offense is obvious.

The defense played better against the Rams. Hard to win though when you turn the ball over like they did in this game.

The schedule from this point on looks brutal.

Haslam by seasons end will be in a melt down mode.

Change will be coming.

Us fans will go into the off season once again shell shocked.

Our days in the sun will be before the draft. We can all argue about who we should draft.

Haslam is the man in control of the team. It is in his court to make the Browns right.

If Haslam can not find someone that knows how to draft players and build a team there will be no answer to losing.

Another excellent post. Thanks bone.

I doubt many people will recognize your excellent points, but I sure appreciate what you had to say. You made a lot of great points.

I appreciate guys like you and Devil who really offer some analysis instead of one-liners that are designed to feed one's own ego.

Vers, we're in a tough spot.

The great fans of the Browns are really dependent upon their owner Mr. Jimmy Haslam.

Hard to understand anything about Haslam because all we have to go on is his limited exposure and his actions.

He strikes me as a person who is used to being a privileged person. Someone who wants things all his way. When born to wealth and power you assume power.

The NFL is a business, but it is unique. You can not buy a championship. Baseball you can almost buy a title. Football championships are won by organizations. If you build it right you can win it all.

Haslam is new to the game. The Mara's, Rooney's, and Brown's are second generation football families. Even though Haslam had exposure to the Rooney's he has much to learn.

Haslam has seen what strong football organizations look like.

He knows you have to get the right people and let them do their jobs. His problem is identifying the "right" people.

He was told by others that Farmer and Pettine would be good hires. Now he has to be questioning at least Farmer. Farmer can not hide from his results.

He hired both wanting and knowing that the team needed continuity. He is faced with a dilemma. Stick with Farmer for the sake of continuity and hope he gets things right? Or, recognize that Farmer was a mistake and look for "right" guy?

Then, if he replaces Farmer should the new GM have the option to bring in his own head coach?

Tough decision for a guy going into his third year of ownership.

We as fans can only hope that his decisions prove to be right.

Good post, but I doubt Haslam gives a crap about continuity. It's all about PR with Farmer. He looks bad if he would have fired them last offseason and probably will still take some PR hits for it if he does this offseason.

Farmer could also reveal that it was him dictating the Manziel pick and I wouldn't doubt a second that Farmer would tell the world about the homeless guy story, after all, we're talking about GM Textgate here. How would Haslam look then?

Maybe I'm going too far with this, but I think Farmer really has something in his hands to hold against Jimmy with regards to PR. Would be so Browns, wouldn't it?

There is no doubt that Haslam will take PR shots. He is going to get them no matter what he does.

Farmer in my opinion will take the high road if he is fired. He is young man with a career ahead of him. If he becomes a whistleblower he will never get another NFL job.

If the team ends up with under seven wins (which seems almost guaranteed) somebody will be looking for work and the most likely guy is Farmer.

Just like any NFL franchise we are at the mercy of ownership. At the end of the day all we can do is hope that Haslam learns how to run a NFL team.

If he is fired, there is no way that Farmer would ever again get a GM job. He'll probably get a job, but not as a GM.

He's been way too horrible for that to happen.

If he's no good for others in the role in future, then he's no good for us now.

Wonder if it is on the cards if Haslam pulls the trigger before seasons end. How would that affect FA, and draft prep. Fun times ahead. *sigh*

I really have no idea what Haslam is going to do.

He may keep everyone.

He may fire Farmer and keep Pet.

He may fire Pet and keep Farmer.

He may fire everyone.

Of all those options, I would be most upset if Pet is the fall guy and we keep Farmer. Not saying Pet is invoking thoughts of Vince Lombardi, but you can't make chicken soup out of chicken crap.

Haslam is certainly in a tough spot. I don't know that Chud deserved to be canned after 1 season, but I DO understand him being unloaded if Haslam felt that he didn't quite fit "the plan". What compounds that loss however is that along with Chud went Horton and dang Norv Turner.

That following HC search showed that were at the bottom of the barrel. This isn't so much a commentary on the quality of Pet, but more so that it revealed a lack of interest on the part of most experienced and up and coming coaches.

AT this point Jimmy has to keep a nominal number of people around for a lengthy period of time to show that the franchise has stabilized. Until then, we'll just keep going backwards every time someone gets fired because no one of talent or quality will want to come here.

This isn't to say that I think everyone's job is secure for at least one more season. I just don't think that a whole sale blow it all up again would set us back at least a decade.

My guess at this point is that there's a 50/50 chance Farmer goes. I also think that unless this defense turns around, Oneill might be let go.

I'm pretty sure Pettine will get fired before Farmer.

Especially if any if the following is true:

--Pettine wanted Gilbert.
--Pettine wanted Whitner.
--Pettine was fine with letting Skrine walk.
--Haslam wanted Manziel.
--We have a double digit losing season.
--Run defense finishes 32nd and Pettine refuses to replace O'Neil.
--Manziel comes in, doesn't wet the bed, and plays reasonably well.

Although the first three are GM moves, Farmer can write them off as trying to make his coach happy. The last three are highly likely and Pettine has to own those. He has to explain them to Haslam. The fourth one, well it is what it is.

So if I had to make a prediction, Pettine goes before Farmer.

Both are really hard to root for. And in the absence of having any kind of long-term plan in place for anything it appears, I actually don't even care anymore. There's not much reason to watch the product these guys put on the field. They are both in over their heads and absent any kind of football person coming in and overseeing these two, it's hard to predict if they will actually get better.

That sound you just heard was the king of continuity taking a step off the train. I'm not completely off, just a bit apathetic at the moment. Keep them, blow it up. I pretty much have no hope for the future either way.

Bill Walsh wrote this:

While I respect your opinion, how in the world can you give Farmer a pass and blame it all on Pet?

Seriously man............

I'm not blaming it all on Pett.

I was making a prediction that if one of the two is fired that it would be Pett over Farmer.

Did you actually read my post?