DawgTalkers.net
Posted By: RocketOptimist Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/01/20 07:22 PM
Let’s discuss this. Would like everyone to explain their reasoning why they voted.

We’ve done tough conversations here before. Let’s try them again.
I would and have said it as attaching anything after the statement actually takes away from the main point.

If we can’t say something matters without attaching something else to it, then we show it truly doesn’t matter to us.

It’s sort of like John Mulvaney and his bit about the n-word vs the word midget. Look it up.
Would I say "black lives matter", without having to add "so do cops lives, white lives, etc"

Of course.
I see it the same way as you do, but opposite. I think saying 'Black Lives Matter' takes away from the fact that we are all people, we all matter the same. Nobody should matter less and nobody should matter more.

I agree with you that saying BLM and then tacking on xLM does kinda take away from the main point.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/01/20 09:26 PM
Black lives matter.
I appreciate your honest reply and It’s good to see you’re really reflecting on it.

At one point in our country it was offensive to say “slaves should be free” but now its common place.
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Let’s discuss this. Would like everyone to explain their reasoning why they voted.

We’ve done tough conversations here before. Let’s try them again.


Question: Do you formulate your lessons this way w/your students? I hope not and I wonder if that is why you ended up in Alaska. You are severely limiting the choices, free speech, and objections of those who reply. Worst of all, you are negating the true exchanging of ideas, debate, and discussion and instead, forcing your "students" to navigate a very narrow and rigid course that does not promote learning, but instead, forces them to think the way you do.

In many ways, you remind me very much of those you despise. Controlling, rigid, limited, biased thinking that demands that we think like you do instead of promoting independent thinking and looking for real solutions to our obvious problems.

I, for one, will not vote in your rigged poll.
Educational psychology taught me to ignore such behavior as this, but I'll make one final point till you're ready to discuss the subject at hand.

You try so hard to be this:


When really:


And honestly you're just this:


And until you can compose yourself in a manner where we can discuss and it not be "follow my rules and worldview or else I'll come at you with logical fallacies based in ad hominens", read this thread in learning how to talk about complex subjects. We did this a lot while you were in exile away from DawgTalkers.
Posted By: GMdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/02/20 11:04 AM
Black lives matter. Yes I have and would, depending on the situation. I would also say at times All lives matter, or blue lives matter, once again depending on the situation. So just put me down as a YES and as a NO.
Posted By: DCDAWGFAN Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/02/20 05:13 PM
Sure. Saying "black lives matter" does no harm.. it's true, they do matter.. and saying it, without qualifiers, isn't a problem for me. Whatever somebody might INFER from that is on them, not me.

I would not have said that a couple years ago. I was opposed to it for a good while, I inferred by addition.. "... more than others" to the end of it. I was adding that in my own head, not them. I was wrong.
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?
Credit to Grateful for posting this in the other thread.

It sums up the entire argument in one nice swoop.

Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
S I was opposed to it for a good while, I inferred by addition.. "... more than others" to the end of it.


I think that's the major stumbling block for many when it comes to saying or thinking about Black Lives Matter as a statement or movement.

It's been easy for me as I'm younger, born into a generation which continually advocated for the rights of minority groups (no, not discounting your generation either), sought to learn more about others different than me from the very source of life experience, and knowledge just became power.

People are naturally afraid of what they don't know. If we took the time to learn about different causes and movements, there'd be less fear and incendiary actions.
Posted By: DCDAWGFAN Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/02/20 05:30 PM
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?

I don't think his intent was that he would add it after "BLM".. it was that in other situations, different circumstances, he would use those other sayings at appropriate times.

My own opinion... leave "Black Lives Matter" alone. It has an origin, it has a meaning..

I'm all in favor of showing love and appreciation for all people.. I'm in favor of showing love and respect for the police when appropriate.. but come up with a different phrasing.. leave BLM alone.
That's what I was thinking as well. I'm sure GM will be back.
It's hard for me to watch that style of preaching, but I did a 'huh!' when he mentioned the "blessed be the poor" part. That snippet right there really boils it down well.
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
I appreciate your honest reply and It’s good to see you’re really reflecting on it.

At one point in our country it was offensive to say “slaves should be free” but now its common place.


At one point in parts of our country it was offensive to say that slaves should be free. Never forget that many people, of all races, lost their lives fighting for the emancipation of the slaves. Literally brother fought against brother, and father against son, to free the slaves.
j/c:

I think it's pretty easy to act enlightened on a message board. I think it's easy to try and label folks if they don't agree 100 percent w/what the speaker is saying.

I think "acts" are a greater testament to how committed one is to a cause. And I am fairly certain that no person on this board has done as much for the black community as I have. And I'm tired of hearing crap from those who just talk the talk and don't walk the walk!

I also think that some well-meaning, but narrow-minded folks often do more harm than good when trying to promote better treatment for minorities.

Blacks are like whites. Wanna know why? It's because they are human beings. Each of us has good and bad qualities. Each race has good and bad people. Broad labels does nothing but further the divide because it "separates" us as human beings and categorizes us by something as unimportant as skin color.

I know a lot of blacks. There are a lot of good ones and bad ones, just like w/white folks, cops, religious folks, men, women, etc. I taught w/blacks. I coached w/blacks. I was a teammate w/blacks. I educated black children. I coached black athletes. I talk to black people in our community when I am doing charity work. Some of them are idiots and bad people. However, the majority are just like I am. They don't go around pointing fingers or labeling entire groups of people. They don't want handouts.

They simply want to be judged for who they are as a person. They don't need some bleeding heart making excuses for them. That's just as demeaning as not treating them fairly or equitably. Treat them as equals and hold them accountable. Most blacks are perfectly fine w/that.

Stop widening the divide and concentrate on narrowing the gap. We'll all be better off.
Quote:
I am fairly certain that no person on this board has done as much for the black community as I have


Have you done more for black Americans than the black Americans on this very forum?
Some look to divide and conquer. Others, look to unite and build. The cool part is that we have the right to choose what kind of person we are.

There is a song that keeps running through my head when I read this thread. It's called "Sheep." Here are the lyrics that play over and over as I contemplate the intent.


Lo, we shall rise up
And then we'll make the bugger's eyes water

Bleating and babbling we fell on his neck with a scream
Wave upon wave of demented avengers
March cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream

Have you heard the news?
The dogs are dead
You better stay home
And do as you're told
Get out of the road if you want to grow old


After all, sheep are wanna-be dogs. Meanwhile, the Pigs are left to their own devices as us lower class animals continue to feud w/one another.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/03/20 02:19 AM
Quote:
I don't think his intent was that he would add it after "BLM".. it was that in other situations, different circumstances, he would use those other sayings at appropriate times.


This is exactly how I read it, as well. And you know what? I'm of the same mind.

_________________________


I won't be casting a vote in this poll. My life is my vote. This is a thread for those who don't live my day-to-day.

This slogan isn't for me.
This slogan is about me.


Carry on, everyone.
Posted By: GMdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/03/20 11:31 AM
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Because it's based on the contents of the discussion.
This is us now ..... conform or be cast out. He "resigned" from one job..... but I bet he wasn't really giver the choice ... and he was fired from another. Yep, like Rush (the band) said ... conform or be cast out.

Sacramento Kings play-by-play announcer Grant Napear resigns after 'All Lives Matter' tweet
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2925...es-matter-tweet

Longtime Sacramento Kings play-by-play announcer Grant Napear has resigned after tweeting "ALL LIVES MATTER" on Sunday in response to a question about Black Lives Matter.

"I want to thank the fans for their overwhelming love and support," Napear said in a statement Tuesday. "I will always remain a part of Kings nation in my heart."

Napear, who has called games for the Kings since 1988, was answering a question from former Kings star DeMarcus Cousins, who asked Napear for his opinion on Black Lives Matter.

"Hey!!!! How are you? Thought you forgot about me," Napear responded. "Haven't heard from you in years. ALL LIVES MATTER...EVERY SINGLE ONE!!!"

Cousins posted that Napear's response was expected. Former Kings forward Matt Barnes then called Napear a closet racist.

Napear later apologized, telling The Sacramento Bee on Monday that he is "not as educated on BLM as I thought I was."

The tweet Sunday came as protests raged across the country following the death of George Floyd. Floyd, a black man, died last week in Minneapolis after Derek Chauvin, a white police officer, kneeled on his neck for more than eight minutes.

"I had no idea that when I said 'All Lives Matter' that it was counter to what BLM was trying to get across," Napear said.

He also issued an apology on Twitter, writing in response to another user, "If it came across as dumb I apologize. That was not my intent. That's how I was raised. It has been engrained in me since I can remember. I've been doing more listening than talking the past few days. I believe the past few days will change this country for the better!"

Napear also was fired Tuesday from Sports 1140 KHTK, where he hosts a radio show with former Kings player Doug Christie.

"The timing of Grant's tweet was particularly insensitive," Bonneville International, the media company that owns the station, said in a statement Tuesday. "After reviewing the matter carefully, we have made the difficult decision to part ways with Grant."
He got fired for saying "All lives matter?!?" Freaking extremists drive me nuts.
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/03/20 05:35 PM
This is not the first type of incident involving this announcer.
Saying all lives matter is now considered an "incident?"
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/03/20 10:42 PM
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Saying all lives matter is now considered an "incident?"


When given the context of the situation? Yes.
I disagree. And the two players who called him out have had multiple "incidents" and were not removed from their teams because of them.

In my opinion, it makes more sense to fight fairly instead of blindly and w/malice. The latter just turns off the very people you are asking to help you.

I don't expect you to agree w/that and that's fine.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/04/20 05:47 AM
Black lives matter....but I voted no.

All lives matter, and me saying black lives matter in the context of your post somehow made me feeling as if I didn't feel that before.

It's just a slogan. You have to live it.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/04/20 05:39 PM
Some people wish to impose on the free expression of others and would have been better to served to have been a dictator in mid evil times.

Either that or stop drunk posting.
Posted By: jaybird Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 01:32 AM
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
Sure. Saying "black lives matter" does no harm.. it's true, they do matter.. and saying it, without qualifiers, isn't a problem for me. Whatever somebody might INFER from that is on them, not me.

I would not have said that a couple years ago. I was opposed to it for a good while, I inferred by addition.. "... more than others" to the end of it. I was adding that in my own head, not them. I was wrong.


This is my answer... I used to be against it for the same reasons.... no longer #blm
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 05:22 PM
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Because while Black Lives matter, they aren't the only lives that matter.

Why does the fact that other lives also matter bother certain people so much?

It's not like words or empathy are finite resources. It's not like you can only care for one thing.

The implication that saying something other than only "Black Lives Matter" is somehow wrong is downright racist and part of the problem. It's silly. You're not only talking about black lives? How dare you?

Can I say that "Black Lives matter" by itself? Sure. Should there be some rule about it? Why?

It's a stupid reason for people to pick a fight with people who are trying to show care. You can't care for anyone else? Where is the logic in that?

Some people look for any excuse to be offended. It makes them feel righteous, when really it just shows their own lack of empathy.

Only wanting things to be about an individual group is an amazingly backwards way to try to bring about inclusion and equal treatment.

It's amazing that doing this over and over again hasn't done anything to abate racial tension...not. It's insane that otherwise intelligent people insist on repeating this failed methodology.

Treat our group different...but don't treat our group different. No cognitive dissonance there.

It's frustrating. I agree there are issues. Police reform should take place. Framing it as only an issue for one particular race causes more issues than it helps. Why frame it that way? As long as we frame issues as being about race, we'll have issues about race. Skin color shouldn't matter. A man was unjustly killed. I don't care what color his skin was. It shouldn't matter.

Insisting that we can only talk about one skin color reinforces the underlying (denied) assumption that skin color matters. Isn't that underlying assumption what we need to get rid of if we really want to put issues of "race" behind us?
Posted By: Rishuz Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 05:57 PM
Think about from this perspective Bull. Start with the premise that it's a given that all lives matter. But a segment of those lives are still treated unfairly. Maybe not by you but in general they are. One way to bring attention to that is to clearly identify the segment of people that are being treated unfairly and just let it stand like that. To amend the statement to all lives matter is a way to disregard what is going on. It minimizes the unfair treatment. That's all that is being said. Everyone knows all lives matter.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 06:03 PM
I liken this to other things in our society and wonder how anyone can think it makes sense.

When the Boston Marathon bombing happened, the motto was, "Boston Strong".

I didn't hear other cities in America saying, "Yeah, but we're a city in America, we are strong too."
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 07:07 PM
“Breast Cancer Awareness”

“Yeah but what about all the other cancers?”
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/06/20 09:37 PM
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
“Breast Cancer Awareness”

“Yeah but what about all the other cancers?”


But those supporting breast cancer awareness don't complain if someone mentions praying for everyone suffering from any kind of cancer. Maybe they do. Still seems pretty dumb.

People don't need to mention other cancers, but people don't feel the need to act petulant if they are mentioned.

Picking needless fights rarely makes one new friends or solves any problems.

You can comment on inequality without demanding that only your group get talked about. It would seem to make more sense to talk as equals if you want to be treated as equals. The toddler logic of "everyone should only be talking about my problem" is something that people used to grow out of. It seems our culture doesn't lead to people that grow up any more and think about people other than themselves. Everyone thinks they deserve a trophy for showing up and that they should be treated special. Everyone else is special, too.

It's fine thinking that you are special. Everyone is unique. Thinking/acting as if you're (your group is) the only one that is special is where things get problematic.

Everybody has problems. Insisting people should only focus on your version of the problem doesn't fix the bigger/underlying shared problem. Problems are more likely to get answered when they are seen as everyone's problem. Saying someone should focus on your problem is psychologically the same as telling them it isn't their problem.

There is a problem. Why not let people who aren't African American feel like they are/can be invested in it?

Seems counterproductive to turn people away for wanting to be included.

Ending racism by making issues about race doesn't seem to add up. It would seem to make more sense to address issues irrespective of race to end racism.

Sadly, most people can't stop thinking in terms of race.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/07/20 03:25 PM
Originally Posted By: Bull_Dawg
Ending racism by making issues about race doesn't seem to add up. It would seem to make more sense to address issues irrespective of race to end racism.


saywhat
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/07/20 04:10 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Originally Posted By: Bull_Dawg
Ending racism by making issues about race doesn't seem to add up. It would seem to make more sense to address issues irrespective of race to end racism.


saywhat


George Floyd's death should be looked at as a person being killed as much as, if not more than, a black man being killed. It shouldn't matter what color his skin was. Constantly focusing on the fact that he's black indicates that his skin color is an important distinction.

If skin color is an important distinction, then why shouldn't it be treated differently? Obviously, it should be treated the same as if it had happened to anyone else in the eyes of the law. But it's a catch-22. Don't treat African Americans differently, but you absolutely must say that it was a black life?

Putting more importance on the fact that he was black than the fact that he was a man is the underlying problem. Unfortunately that's kind of the way many people think, even about themselves. They see skin color first and it clouds their perception of everything else that follows. We need to get to a place where we see the man first and let that common ground be the starting point. It's kind of psychologically starting on the same side instead of on different teams. The idea of being on the same side or different sides shades the entire interaction. In another tragedy, African Americans and police frequently feel that they are on different sides. Frankly, I think it boils down to being because they don't think of each other as people first. It's sad that everyone's inherent humanity is often overlooked. I think it's because people have grown to love their labels, even when they don't mean something concrete.

Proud to be black. Proud to be white.... What do those even mean? It's just packaging. No action was involved in becoming those things. Yet, those are the ridiculously inherently racist things we accept as normal.

Proud to be a part of my community? Better, but still a bit problematic. Why? What's the action to take pride in?

It's these subtle ingrained patterns that we often don't stop to consider that unfortunately lead to large problems.

Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/07/20 05:01 PM
Yeah, we should all just ignore that George Floyd was black. Maybe we should ignore that Ahmaud Arbery was black. Or that the woman in central Park didn't bring up he was a "black man". Or that this guy was black....



Or this guy.....



Or... never mind, you either don't get it or don't want to.
The "I don't see race" or "I'm colorblind" argument leads to stripping people of their culture and heritage.

Be proud of who you are. Just don't use who you are to oppress other races, cultures, or creeds because you feel like you can.
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?


No comment from anyone?
Posted By: jfanent Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/07/20 09:56 PM
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
The "I don't see race" or "I'm colorblind" argument leads to stripping people of their culture and heritage.


There are very appropriate situations to say those things without stripping someone of their culture and heritage.

Quote:
Be proud of who you are. Just don't use who you are to oppress other races, cultures, or creeds because you feel like you can.


If someone here were to say they were proud to be white, male, straight, or American you'd be on the frickin' warpath.
You assume.
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?


No comment from anyone?


Anyone?
Posted By: lampdogg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/07/20 10:58 PM
ALM, rocket.


Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?


No comment from anyone?


Rocket? No comment from you on why it's apparently ok for this guy to add to 'black lives matter', but it's not ok for others to add anything?
I think we all know why Rocket is ignoring your questions. In addition to supporting blacks no matter what, he has been a long-term advocate for trans and gays. He always blames whites and Christians for all things that go wrong. So, if whites say it, they are racist and wrong. If trans, gays, or blacks say it..........they are good.

He is the same person he rails against. Just w/an opposite viewpoint.

Too much hate in this world. Too many folks seeking to divide our communities. Not enough focus on treating one another as individuals and evaluating proportionally.

I am going to reiterate this................I will NEVER be a part of either side that promotes hate, limited thinking, and unfair evaluations based on race, gender, religious beliefs, etc. I will continue to judge each person on their own individual merits and no amount of insults, ridicule, or labeling will deter me from my quest to be fair.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/08/20 01:01 AM
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
The "I don't see race" or "I'm colorblind" argument leads to stripping people of their culture and heritage.

Be proud of who you are. Just don't use who you are to oppress other races, cultures, or creeds because you feel like you can.


Maybe we'd be better off without all the baggage. People spend too much time looking backwards instead of towards the future. If there are things about the culture/heritage you like, embrace them. Unfortunately, people seem to embrace things because they are clinging to the way things have always been done within their "small" (self-defined/separated) group. They have a hard time looking at things critically. I'm not saying to forget the past, but it is the past, and change can be a good thing.

People seem to want everyone else to change without being willing to change themselves, nor are they even willing to look at themselves and the things they do critically. Honestly, I'm not even sure why you are twisting this into a culture/heritage issue.

I don't think the constantly shifting word use with regard to skin color/race/culture/heritage helps this problem get solved. It just distracts from the basic issue and divides people. George Floyd wasn't killed because of his culture/heritage.

You can't see culture or heritage at a glance. You might see artifacts that give an indication. Skin color by itself doesn't (perhaps shouldn't would be a better choice) define one's culture/heritage. We've kind of wrapped all those things together at times, particularly with the word "black," and maybe that's a part of the problem.

I also think you are kind of missing my point. I was never really saying we should ignore the fact that he was black. I've been saying that other things (such as the fact that he was a human being) should take precedence. In matters of crime, punishment, and policing, it (skin color) really shouldn't be a consideration at all. Making the skin color portion the apparent main focus of the movement seems to make it unnecessarily exclusive. It brings with it all the old cultural/heritage detritus of the past that really don't help address the issue of police brutality.

To me, we too often frame issues as having (opposing) sides, and then wonder why there is conflict. The whole "If you ain't with us, you against us" mentality doesn't help resolve issues.

Finding common ground solves more issues than telling people they can't be included.
I would say it for the fundamental belief.

However there's no way I would ever donate to their cause, mainly due to the propaganda on their website I've seen.
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?


No comment from anyone?


Rocket, maybe you missed this. Any comment?



Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/10/20 06:41 PM
Why is it you promote we disengage from negativity while at the same promoting people engage with those who are purposefully trying to create conflict?
Because the o.p. purposefully engaged in negativity by calling people out that said certain things. And his non response to a black person 'adding to Black lives matter" speaks loudly.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/10/20 07:04 PM
I actually suggested it be added to myself in a post on this board and he said nothing in response. I think the left has a problem with how they package their message. They already have lots of people who don't want to hear what they have to say anyway.

But you see, it's not my message to send. It's not my call to make. At first it made me rather standoffish. But unlike some I looked past the label assigned to such things and looked for the deeper message.
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Why is it you promote we disengage from negativity while at the same promoting people engage with those who are purposefully trying to create conflict?


I brought it up again because I don't think Rocket's intentions are honorable or fair. It is my opinion that he is clearly trying to divide the races and other subsets by only presenting one side of the argument.

I have fought the opposite side for years for employing that strategy. Hell, when I was a kid, the prevailing thought was that all black people were lazy. That's ridiculous and I fought against that. By the same token, the majority of whites, Christians, and straight people aren't evil, either. And not all minorities are guiltless. So sick of the labels and ignorant generalizations from people who choose "sides."

I will continue to call out those who I think are being unfair. If that draws the ire from both sides.........so be it.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/11/20 06:09 PM
It's odd how I never see you call out "the other side" when they are no less guilty, while only picking targets from the left.

Then you postulate about fairness and being even handed. It appears more as if you have developed a personal agenda and your stated reasons ring hallow due to your actions.
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/11/20 08:58 PM
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
It's odd how I never see you call out "the other side" when they are no less guilty, while only picking targets from the left.

Then you postulate about fairness and being even handed. It appears more as if you have developed a personal agenda and your stated reasons ring hallow due to your actions.


You obviously haven’t been paying close enough attention if you think Vers doesn’t bad mouth the right as well.
He's sensitive. He is also resorting to telling lies.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 06/12/20 07:43 PM
One man's ceiling is another man's floor.
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: archbolddawg
Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist
Why would you feel the need to add another statement after saying Black Lives Matter?


Just saw this: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/justice-smith-comes-queer-voices-172305807.html


Why would he feel the need to add anything to "Black Lives Matter."?


No comment from anyone?


Rocketoptimist, you have been asked 5 times in this thread on why it's okay for a black person to add to 'black lives matter', yet not okay for others to say 'all lives matter', and you've not responded.

Yet in a different thread, you try calling out someone that didn't respond to your question.

You wanna push the envelope with others? Maybe open your envelope first.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/12/20 10:58 AM
Originally Posted By: HotBYoungTurk





Maybe because most people couldn't read for much of the time except the last 60 years?
I think that is a very good point. I was born in 1957 and racism was horrible when I was a kid.

I am not an expert on this, but I think there are three things at play since the Civil Rights movement of the '60s.

1. We have come a long way since that time in regards to providing minorities better opportunities in education and the work place.

2. We still have a ways to go in both places, especially fair hiring practices.

3. Along w/the increased awareness, we sometimes go too far in dealing w/what is acceptable behavior. One's race should never be an excuse for poor behavior.

With that said, I think your gif or whatever it is made a very solid point that made me stop and think.
I've said it, and I'll say it again: Black Lives Matter

I heard something that really stuck with me when discussing this: Jesus didn't say "All sheep matter." He left the 99 sheep to find the one that needed saved. Same rules apply here.

That being said, I definitely do not support BLM - the organization. Do not get the 2 confused.
This is where I am at. I support black people who are hard-working, honest folks who just want a fair shake. I do not support the BLM movement. I think they are off the charts w/their demands.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/14/20 05:46 PM
Yes, trying to stop police brutality against black people is so outrageous of a request.
I will start a BLM thread that will contain their demands just for you, Pit.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/15/20 05:50 PM
I guess the question becomes who is they? The actual organization itself or some far leaning faction of the group?
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I guess the question becomes who is they? The actual organization itself or some far leaning faction of the group?


This. I find people get extremely caught up in the organization, when within the black community the organization is so irrelevant.
Originally Posted By: HotBYoungTurk
Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
I guess the question becomes who is they? The actual organization itself or some far leaning faction of the group?


This. I find people get extremely caught up in the organization, when within the black community the organization is so irrelevant.


Like I said, I have supported the black community for decades. I will continue to support them. But, I have a right to make a distinction between the individuals and the organization.

Turk, you and I have always been good. Don't let Pit mislead you. We're on the same side and we have talked about it in PMs. I think very highly of you. Don't let guys like Pit divide us. He puts words into my mouth that are not true. It's an ongoing thing.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/16/20 04:27 PM
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Don't let Pit mislead you.


No, let Vers do that.

Quote:
We're on the same side and we have talked about it in PMs. I think very highly of you. Don't let guys like Pit divide us.


Your personal agenda has gotten quite obvious. I'm not the one out here trying to recruit people. If they're dumb enough to listen to you, that's on them. Maybe you should let Turk speak for himself?

Nah, allowing others to express themselves openly isn't a "Vers thing".

Quote:
He puts words into my mouth that are not true. It's an ongoing thing.


Speaking of not true...
Where did I say that Turk couldn't speak for himself? I didn't. So yet again, you put words into my mouth.

And it's funny about you--of all people--talking about an agenda.

Most people are on to you BS. You constant attacks on anyone who doesn't agree w/you are over the top.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/16/20 05:51 PM
It seems you consider Turk some feeble minded person who can't think for himself. I mean if he weren't I couldn't mislead him or divide him, right?

You are hilarious! Poor Turk is going to go down the road of sin being led by Pit.

rofl
I have a lot of respect for Turk. I don't think he is feeble-minded at all. I think he intelligent and fair.

You? Not so much.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/16/20 06:24 PM
Well he should be happy that you warned him of "the evil's of Pit" so he didn't fall pray to my web. Without you how would he have possibly have known any better? You don't even hear yourself do you?

notallthere
What? "He didn't fall pray to my web?"

LOL..........you're a trip.
Posted By: jaybird Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/17/20 02:09 PM
Originally Posted By: OrangeCrush
I've said it, and I'll say it again: Black Lives Matter

I heard something that really stuck with me when discussing this: Jesus didn't say "All sheep matter." He left the 99 sheep to find the one that needed saved. Same rules apply here.

That being said, I definitely do not support BLM - the organization. Do not get the 2 confused.


Totally agree... I feel BLM the organization is going too far in many instances... but appreciate the BLM movement.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/17/20 02:40 PM
Ah, the teacher with his grammar lessons. I'm glad you are trying to protect Turk. What would he do without it?
Posted By: BpG Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 07/23/20 03:06 PM
I believe that Black Lives Matter.

I do not believe in the Black Lives Matter political movement.
Thank you for calling it a political movement, that's what it is.

Don't know if this has brought up yet, but many of the founders of the BLM movement are self professed marxists. I don't support anyone like that in any capacity.
You got links to that info, I'd like to see it.
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/08/20 03:26 PM
Originally Posted By: tastybrownies
Thank you for calling it a political movement, that's what it is.

Don't know if this has brought up yet, but many of the founders of the BLM movement are self professed marxists. I don't support anyone like that in any capacity.


Are those founders still with the organization?
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/08/20 10:21 PM
Last I heard they are still running it. I am one who will say “Black lives mater” but will not support the BLM organization.
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/09/20 07:35 PM
Originally Posted By: Pdawg
Last I heard they are still running it. I am one who will say “Black lives mater” but will not support the BLM organization.


When was the last you heard?
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/09/20 08:35 PM
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: Pdawg
Last I heard they are still running it. I am one who will say “Black lives mater” but will not support the BLM organization.


When was the last you heard?


Read it and their mission statement online today.
Posted By: cfrs15 Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/09/20 09:05 PM
Originally Posted By: Pdawg
Originally Posted By: cfrs15
Originally Posted By: Pdawg
Last I heard they are still running it. I am one who will say “Black lives mater” but will not support the BLM organization.


When was the last you heard?


Read it and their mission statement online today.


Can you post it?
Posted By: Dave Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 08/09/20 11:35 PM
Its pretty easy to find, if you have a computer, a browser, and a connection ...

https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/

What We Believe

Four years ago, what is now known as the Black Lives Matter Global Network began to organize. It started out as a chapter-based, member-led organization whose mission was to build local power and to intervene when violence was inflicted on Black communities by the state and vigilantes.

In the years since, we’ve committed to struggling together and to imagining and creating a world free of anti-Blackness, where every Black person has the social, economic, and political power to thrive.

Black Lives Matter began as a call to action in response to state-sanctioned violence and anti-Black racism. Our intention from the very beginning was to connect Black people from all over the world who have a shared desire for justice to act together in their communities. The impetus for that commitment was, and still is, the rampant and deliberate violence inflicted on us by the state.

Enraged by the death of Trayvon Martin and the subsequent acquittal of his killer, George Zimmerman, and inspired by the 31-day takeover of the Florida State Capitol by POWER U and the Dream Defenders, we took to the streets. A year later, we set out together on the Black Lives Matter Freedom Ride to Ferguson, in search of justice for Mike Brown and all of those who have been torn apart by state-sanctioned violence and anti-Black racism. Forever changed, we returned home and began building the infrastructure for the Black Lives Matter Global Network, which, even in its infancy, has become a political home for many.

Ferguson helped to catalyze a movement to which we’ve all helped give life. Organizers who call this network home have ousted anti-Black politicians, won critical legislation to benefit Black lives, and changed the terms of the debate on Blackness around the world. Through movement and relationship building, we have also helped catalyze other movements and shifted culture with an eye toward the dangerous impacts of anti-Blackness.

These are the results of our collective efforts.

The Black Lives Matter Global Network is as powerful as it is because of our membership, our partners, our supporters, our staff, and you. Our continued commitment to liberation for all Black people means we are continuing the work of our ancestors and fighting for our collective freedom because it is our duty.

Every day, we recommit to healing ourselves and each other, and to co-creating alongside comrades, allies, and family a culture where each person feels seen, heard, and supported.

We acknowledge, respect, and celebrate differences and commonalities.

We work vigorously for freedom and justice for Black people and, by extension, all people.

We intentionally build and nurture a beloved community that is bonded together through a beautiful struggle that is restorative, not depleting.

We are unapologetically Black in our positioning. In affirming that Black Lives Matter, we need not qualify our position. To love and desire freedom and justice for ourselves is a prerequisite for wanting the same for others.

We see ourselves as part of the global Black family, and we are aware of the different ways we are impacted or privileged as Black people who exist in different parts of the world.

We are guided by the fact that all Black lives matter, regardless of actual or perceived sexual identity, gender identity, gender expression, economic status, ability, disability, religious beliefs or disbeliefs, immigration status, or location.

We make space for transgender brothers and sisters to participate and lead.

We are self-reflexive and do the work required to dismantle cisgender privilege and uplift Black trans folk, especially Black trans women who continue to be disproportionately impacted by trans-antagonistic violence.

We build a space that affirms Black women and is free from sexism, misogyny, and environments in which men are centered.

We practice empathy. We engage comrades with the intent to learn about and connect with their contexts.

We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work “double shifts” so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.

We disrupt the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure requirement by supporting each other as extended families and “villages” that collectively care for one another, especially our children, to the degree that mothers, parents, and children are comfortable.

We foster a queer‐affirming network. When we gather, we do so with the intention of freeing ourselves from the tight grip of heteronormative thinking, or rather, the belief that all in the world are heterosexual (unless s/he or they disclose otherwise).

We cultivate an intergenerational and communal network free from ageism. We believe that all people, regardless of age, show up with the capacity to lead and learn.

We embody and practice justice, liberation, and peace in our engagements with one another.

************

While it does not directly espouse Marxist theory, the statement is littered with Marxist rhetoric ... the collective, the community, communal network, the village, the collective struggle, economic inequality, globalism, etc.

The only thing missing is "From each, according to their abilities; to each, according to their needs.".

Of course, that's just my take on it.
A lot of what you lost as concerns in your closing statements are actually calls to actions that Christ asked of Christians.
Posted By: DiamDawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 09/13/20 11:15 AM
BLUE LIVES MATTER!
No such thing as ‘blue lives’. You’re absurd. No one is born blue. People put on a uniform they can take off at the end of the day. It’s a job, not a race.
Black Lives Matter.
Posted By: GMdawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 09/13/20 01:38 PM
There is only one race that matters.


The human race. laugh
Posted By: DiamDawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 09/13/20 04:16 PM
I’m absurd ... rofl ....

BLUE LIVES are under attack for no other reason than the color of the uniform they wear ...

Wake up and pay attention or get some perspective ...
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
No such thing as ‘blue lives’. You’re absurd. No one is born blue. People put on a uniform they can take off at the end of the day. It’s a job, not a race.
Black Lives Matter.


Look, I grit my teeth just the same as you when BluLM is a response to BLM, but the reasons you state are over-simplified/misleading, IMO.
Posted By: DiamDawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 09/15/20 12:24 AM
Originally Posted By: oobernoober
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
No such thing as ‘blue lives’. You’re absurd. No one is born blue. People put on a uniform they can take off at the end of the day. It’s a job, not a race.
Black Lives Matter.


Look, I grit my teeth just the same as you when BluLM is a response to BLM, but the reasons you state are over-simplified/misleading, IMO.


BLUE LIVES MATTER

Grit Away ...
You using Blue Lives Matter as a reply/rebuttal to BLM is only an indicator that you're unable to have an adult conversation on the topic.

... then you used all caps... then you bolded it.


My younger sister is an OC Sheriff. The training and rigor she went through to earn her badge was pretty insane. I mean, I knew it was tough, but was still surprised on how tough it was (and this was just me hearing it from her). I also have a bunch of buddies that are officers in different parts of the country. I have more than a healthy respect for what police officers do for us, so when I hear one of them talking about their experiences, I listen and try to learn. It's no different than when a friend that's a minority is talking. Just active listening.
Posted By: DiamDawg Re: Would you say it?: Black Lives Matter - 09/15/20 02:27 PM
U have no clue why I posted this here ... NONE ...

I believe all lives matter and as black lives are a subset of that I believe they matter as much as anyone else’s ... no more, no less ...

Look at the time I posted it and what happened the night before and see if that helps u figure out why i posted it ...

If you’d like to have an adult convo about it .. PM me, I’ll be more than happy to have one ...

Thank your sister for her service please ... thumbsup
Originally Posted By: DiamDawg
Originally Posted By: oobernoober
Originally Posted By: PortlandDawg
No such thing as ‘blue lives’. You’re absurd. No one is born blue. People put on a uniform they can take off at the end of the day. It’s a job, not a race.
Black Lives Matter.


Look, I grit my teeth just the same as you when BluLM is a response to BLM, but the reasons you state are over-simplified/misleading, IMO.


BLUE LIVES MATTER

Grit Away ...




© DawgTalkers.net