Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1631776 06/11/19 12:35 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
P
PETE314 Offline OP
Dawg Talker
OP Offline
Dawg Talker
P
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
So the big news concerning replay is the ability to review pass interference. ESPN has an article concerning the apprehension for coaches being responsible for throwing a flag...and also apprehension of possible slowdowns in the final 2 minutes if the refs are calling for the replay...While an interesting topic...this isn't my concern...

My concern is how the plays will be reviewed. Slow motion replay is great for determining locations of things. Like the runner's feet on the sidelines. Did the ball cross the goal line. or when did the ball start coming out for a fumble...was the knee down before this or that...

But pass interference is a different animal...It is one of those things...like Offensive line...you can call Holding every play...And I have to wonder. Does the slow motion replay magnify what is going on, hand fighting looks like punching, a small tug on the jersey looks like he is trying to rip his jersey off...I think this can cause more problems than they solve...To try and illustrate what I mean...Boxers get punched in the face all of the time...right? but look at the slo-mo and it looks like their face explodes with each jab they take...

My thought is...for certain penalties...would it not be better (if we are going to review them with replay) to have them review at full speed??? The refs are supposed to be catching these things at full speed anyway...and replay can give them different viewpoints...and by reviewing at full speed we see a more natural call of specific penalties...like Holding and Pass Interference...

Just a thought...


I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...

What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
PETE314 #1631783 06/11/19 12:55 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 814
Likes: 8
All Pro
Offline
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 814
Likes: 8
My first instinct is that it'll do nothing but make it so defenders won't be able to play football at all. The League wants big circus numbers on offense and this will help promote that. Of course it will all depend on which team is being reviewed.


"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
PETE314 #1631792 06/11/19 01:18 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
V
Legend
Offline
Legend
V
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
I'm not positive, but I think the league has already some sort of amendment to the rule.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
P
PETE314 Offline OP
Dawg Talker
OP Offline
Dawg Talker
P
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
Yeah but isn't that amendment about who can call for the replay and not exactly how they determine PI when they are watching???


I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...

What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
PETE314 #1631805 06/11/19 01:50 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
B
Legend
Offline
Legend
B
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
Just let them play. Marginal calls shouldn't be called. It would be a better game if there were maybe 3 refs calling a game. One behind the QB to watch late hits and blatant holding. One on the LOS to catch off sides, and one in the deep secondary. Maybe 1 other on the LOS on the opposite side for ball spotting purposes.

The ones on the LOS would get about 15 yards deeper after snap to watch the middle of the field.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




[Linked Image]
PETE314 #1631808 06/11/19 02:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,882
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,882
I'm all for it and expand it even further, replay most of everything. However, shorten the time for the ref/replay official to view the play AND penalize the team 15 yards that challenged the play if they're wrong (and still take the timeout away).

If the replay official(s) get only 30 seconds, they can't watch the play 21 times to get all 14 angles. If it's obvious, it'll jump out in less than 30 seconds. If the officials can't overturn it in 30 seconds, the play stands, move on. Same goes with an officials replay in the last two minutes, they have 30 seconds and no more. And yeah, if you wasted everyone's time with a challenge, tack on 15 yards with an automatic first down.

I like how the NHL saw teams abusing the ability to challenge the offsides on a goal. They'd get a free timeout and just to make the officials look at the replay, even if it wasn't close. The following year they put in a 2 min minor if you challenge and you're wrong. The pointless challenges dropped off drastically. The same could happen in the NFL if they're smart (but they aren't).


[Linked Image]


“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
PETE314 #1631809 06/11/19 02:04 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,953
Likes: 352
Legend
Online
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,953
Likes: 352
I really would just as soon see then add 2 additional officials to the field to watch for penalties, both on offense and on defense.


Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
PETE314 #1631821 06/11/19 02:38 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398
Likes: 280
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398
Likes: 280
As to your two main concerns.. one slowing down play and two calling microscopic penalties only visible under super hi-def slo-mo...

I think PI replays should be 3 angles of the play, run one time each at full speed, consecutively.... then make a call. If you can't see anything obvious to change the call on the field from that, play on...

Should take less than 30 seconds and would result in few calls being overturned... but hey, if it's egregious (ie. - Saints) then fix it.

*Edit... I wouldn't be upset if ALL replays were conducted this way.

Last edited by DCDAWGFAN; 06/11/19 02:39 PM.

yebat' Putin
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
As to your two main concerns.. one slowing down play and two calling microscopic penalties only visible under super hi-def slo-mo...

I think PI replays should be 3 angles of the play, run one time each at full speed, consecutively.... then make a call. If you can't see anything obvious to change the call on the field from that, play on...

Should take less than 30 seconds and would result in few calls being overturned... but hey, if it's egregious (ie. - Saints) then fix it.

*Edit... I wouldn't be upset if ALL replays were conducted this way.


Yeah, I honestly agree with all of that. Replays should take about 30 seconds, and should probably be done by an extra official in a booth, who radios in the call to the head official. There should be no need for the hood, or all the extra circus around that. Just overturn the egregious stuff, and move on with the rest.

PETE314 #1631858 06/11/19 04:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,162
Likes: 102
F
Dawg Talker
Offline
Dawg Talker
F
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,162
Likes: 102
Rather than instant replay I wish they would incorporate a change I have suggested for years.

I think the PI penalty should be 2 types like the running into/ roughing the kicker penalties.

If it is blatant make it spot of the foul, if inadvertent, then maybe 15 yards. Awarding a team the hall at the 2 yard line for a 40-50 yard pass when there is a slight accidental bump is a ludicrous.

I don't know how to determine what the criteria is for each level of the penalty and maybe if it would turn out like the league's definition of a catch, my idea would be terrible.

Last edited by FORTBROWNFAN; 06/11/19 04:59 PM.
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 1,190
Likes: 89
A
Dawg Talker
Offline
Dawg Talker
A
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 1,190
Likes: 89
j/c -

I'm not sue how I feel about it other than, like others have said, I hope it doesn't slow down the game even more. Pretty soon, we'll be at baseball game length. And if you're watching it on live TV with commercials on Mountain or West Coast time, when do I take my afternoon nap?

Pretty soon, DBs (like pass rushers) will have to learn a whole new way to play their position to avoid overzealous call reversals.

PETE314 #1631863 06/11/19 05:37 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,089
Likes: 293
Hall of Famer
Offline
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,089
Likes: 293
This just makes me want to get season tickets for Woman's Beach Volley Ball more and more.. I hope they offer behind the net seats ..

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398
Likes: 280
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398
Likes: 280
Quote:
If it is blatant make it spot of the foul, if inadvertent, then maybe 15 yards. Awarding a team the hall at the 2 yard line for a 40-50 yard pass when there is a slight accidental bump is a ludicrous.

I don't know how to determine what the criteria is for each level of the penalty and maybe if it would turn out like the league's definition of a catch, my idea would be terrible.

I love this idea but, like you, I'm not sure how to implement it. Almost like the NBAs clear-path foul rule.. if you know you are beat and just flagrantly tackle the guy, give them the ball right there.. but if it's just two guys making legit plays and you call a foul, 15 yards should be the max.


yebat' Putin
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 11,239
Likes: 1821
Legend
Offline
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 11,239
Likes: 1821
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
As to your two main concerns.. one slowing down play and two calling microscopic penalties only visible under super hi-def slo-mo...

I think PI replays should be 3 angles of the play, run one time each at full speed, consecutively.... then make a call. If you can't see anything obvious to change the call on the field from that, play on...

Should take less than 30 seconds and would result in few calls being overturned... but hey, if it's egregious (ie. - Saints) then fix it.

*Edit... I wouldn't be upset if ALL replays were conducted this way.

Couldn't agree more. Super-slo-mo ruins the spirit of the sport.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
FATE #1631873 06/11/19 06:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
V
Legend
Offline
Legend
V
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
j/c:

I think there are already too many rules and that it slows the game down. The media and fans pounce on every missed call and we keep getting more and more subjective rules and decisions that slow down the game.

QBs make bad throws. RBs choose the wrong hole. Receivers drop passes. Defenders miss tackles. Kickers miss kicks. Coaches make dumb decisions. Refs make bad calls. It's part of the freaking game.

Every so often, you get a call that is so egregious that people get up in arms. The non-PI call in the Rams/Saints playoff game is one such call. But, those are rare.

I tune in to watch the action and not a dozen replay angles of a questionable call, 4 commercials while it is under review, and then some dude in a striped shirt explaining to me what I already knew.

I am for more action and less officiating.

PETE314 #1631887 06/11/19 07:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Likes: 83
T
Legend
Offline
Legend
T
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Likes: 83
Ya I know! I feel like the only person in the world Adamant that that was a good no call in the mentioned Rams Saints playoff game.

Didya ever walk into another person unintentionally like stepping out from two sides of the corner of a wall? That's what I see happened in that game, on that play,
Two individual players both tracking the ball one on offense, one on defense, they bump into each other in a very abrupt collision, and the ball flies over em,
pass interferenece is when you interfere, one can't interfere if he is out of position to/ He was out of position to interfere,
I see an unintentional collision as much offensive, as defensive PI, a "no call" would be correct,

There has to be other people somewhere that see that play the way I do, I can't be the only sane person in a crazy football universe.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
B
Legend
Offline
Legend
B
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
Originally Posted By: YTownBrownsFan
I really would just as soon see then add 2 additional officials to the field to watch for penalties, both on offense and on defense.


What? That would only mess things up further. Just like Cops who don't write enough tickets, refs who don't throw flags on par with the league average are scrutinized.

I don't know that for a fact, but I am sure that is the case.

Fewer officials would result in less ticky tack calls. We all want real penalties called, but I would rather see a real penalty missed then for contact beyond 5 yards, off play, called.

Are you crazy? 1/3 of the game time is spent listening to some chump official talking about illegal contact. If it doesn't impact the play or put players in danger, pick up the flag and play on.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




[Linked Image]
PETE314 #1631889 06/11/19 07:15 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
Offline
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Everything should be reviewable. Refs have proven time and again they can't get it right on the field in real time at a consistent level to the point where it affects the outcomes of games and seasons. There is no shame in admitting the refs need help getting it right. Baseball did it, and it works just fine. Time to bring NFL officiating into the 21st century. Make everything reviewable, add an extra challenge per half, watch the games with the peace of mind knowing a potential screw up, regardless of what it is, could get overturned. Don't know what they're waiting for.


[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski

"Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield

#gmstrong
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
V
Legend
Offline
Legend
V
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Likes: 906
Yeah, one of the most frustrating calls is when they call illegal contact on the other side of the field after the qb never even looked that way. Instead of a big play by the defense, the offense gets a first down.

I get that we all have different opinions on officiating as evidenced by Cal's last post, but I don't like watching the refs. I like watching the game.

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
B
Legend
Offline
Legend
B
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
Quote:
If it is blatant make it spot of the foul, if inadvertent, then maybe 15 yards. Awarding a team the hall at the 2 yard line for a 40-50 yard pass when there is a slight accidental bump is a ludicrous.

I don't know how to determine what the criteria is for each level of the penalty and maybe if it would turn out like the league's definition of a catch, my idea would be terrible.

I love this idea but, like you, I'm not sure how to implement it. Almost like the NBAs clear-path foul rule.. if you know you are beat and just flagrantly tackle the guy, give them the ball right there.. but if it's just two guys making legit plays and you call a foul, 15 yards should be the max.



Like college more or less. Sure, if a DB simply tackles a guy once he is beat, make it a spot foul. If it is just a player trying to make a play and they bump....then no foul.

I don't like how the rules have hurt defensive players.

Then, I am a old guy. I get really excited watching a 1-0 or 2-1 baseball game late in the game. I get excited watching a goalie and his defensemen protect a 1-0 lead in the 3rd.

Other than maybe golf and tennis, major sports should embrace solid defensive play. No wonder our new DC might want to employ a zone D as a major part. You don't take as many calls against in a zone as you do man to man.

This is why I liked playing hockey and why I like it now. Those refs let them play. Hockey is largely a PLAYER ref'd game. They just pull them apart when the fight is over and then send players to the box.

You go after my best player, our goons are going to take a toll. First after the player who broke the code. Then, if it keeps up, your guy is going to feel the pain.

Ask what Marty McSorley and Dave Semenko meant to Gretzky...even if he was kind of a wimp. Bobby Orr or Gordie Howe didn't need anybody to fight their fights. You wouldn't go at it in a corner with those guys more than once.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




[Linked Image]
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
B
Legend
Offline
Legend
B
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 38,514
Likes: 808
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Yeah, one of the most frustrating calls is when they call illegal contact on the other side of the field after the qb never even looked that way. Instead of a big play by the defense, the offense gets a first down.

I get that we all have different opinions on officiating as evidenced by Cal's last post, but I don't like watching the refs. I like watching the game.


I agree. I don't think either one of us support dirty play, but dang, we can't allow the game to be a defender trying to make a tackle after a catch very play. Being able to break up a pass should be allowed and when you do that, you might touch the receivers.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




[Linked Image]
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
P
PETE314 Offline OP
Dawg Talker
OP Offline
Dawg Talker
P
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
As to your two main concerns.. one slowing down play and two calling microscopic penalties only visible under super hi-def slo-mo...

I think PI replays should be 3 angles of the play, run one time each at full speed, consecutively.... then make a call. If you can't see anything obvious to change the call on the field from that, play on...

Should take less than 30 seconds and would result in few calls being overturned... but hey, if it's egregious (ie. - Saints) then fix it.

*Edit... I wouldn't be upset if ALL replays were conducted this way.
I can always count on you to have a similar notion...LOL I like your idea. I would not be beholden to the 3 angles...but I wouldn't object to that limitation either...

If we are to review SUBJECTIVE penalties...I guess I want to see them categorize between subjective and objective reviews. Ball location, knee down first, etc. These are objective and slo-mo helps make a good decision. Pass Interference, Holding (not currently reviewed) these are subjective to a good degree and I certainly feel any review should be done at full speed.


I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...

What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
P
PETE314 Offline OP
Dawg Talker
OP Offline
Dawg Talker
P
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,667
Likes: 53
Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog

Every so often, you get a call that is so egregious that people get up in arms. The non-PI call in the Rams/Saints playoff game is one such call. But, those are rare.


What team have you been watching the last 20 years??? poke catfight rofl brownie


I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...

What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
PETE314 #1632628 06/14/19 08:53 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Likes: 136
E
Legend
Offline
Legend
E
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Likes: 136
I'm thinking/hoping that it will only be to over turn the way Obvious pass interference... Not ticky tack calls
fingerscrossed


Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!

GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Instant Replay

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5