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Quote:
j/c..
yall need to stop dissing my QB.. 
I like Aaron Murray though.
#gmstrong
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j/c In light of 2001 Hasselbeck trade, Holmgren’s complaints are hollow Posted by Mike Florio on March 16, 2012, 1:37 PM EDT Browns president Mike Holmgren isn’t happy that his team wasn’t selected to make a deal with the Rams for the second overall pick in the draft. “Honestly, when it didn’t happen I think there are reasons that I can’t go into right now, but there is a very close relationship between the people getting the deal done and the people who offered. And I’m not sure anything we offered would have been good enough,” Holmgren told season-ticket holders on Thursday. To the extent the fix was in, Holmgren would know. Eleven years ago, Holmgren finagled a trade with his old team and his old boss for quarterback Matthew Hasselbeck. As explained at the time by Don Banks of SI.com, the Dolphins were ready to send the 26th pick in round one to the Packers for Hasselbeck. Then, at the last minute, Holmgren’s Seahawks offered a flip-flop of first-round picks, with the Packers moving from No. 17 to No. 10 and the Seahawks sliding from No. 10 down to No. 17. “I figured if it got done today, I’d be a Miami Dolphin,” Hasselbeck told Banks. “The Packers called and said, ‘You’re traded, but it’s not quite official yet until Mike Holmgren does some paperwork.’ And I said, ‘Mike Holmgren? It’s Seattle?’” And so, thanks to his relationship with G.M. Ron Wolf, Holmgren was able to swoop in and swipe Hasselbeck, without even giving up a draft pick. Under the now-outdated draft trade chart, the flip-flop of picks No. 10 and 17 was worth 350 points. The No. 26 pick in the first round was worth twice that. So there’s yet another reason to not like Holmgren’s comments. They’re hypocritical. link
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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1) Why is Florio so worked up about this?
2) Was the Dolphins' offer switching the 17th and 26th pick? Or just giving the 26th pick?
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Quote:
2) Was the Dolphins' offer switching the 17th and 26th pick? Or just giving the 26th pick?
That's what I'm wondering. The way it's written makes it looks like the Dolphins offered 26, and the Seahawks offered #10. If that's the case, how did Holmgren screw anyone?
Florio must have been given a mean look by Holmgren at some point, and hasn't gotten over it.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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I personally love the fact Holmgren speaks his mind, appearing genuine and honest.
I personally really wish he'd learn to STFU when it comes to blabbing to the media. 
He looks like a whiner, and more-so, a hypocrite.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I'm wondering if maybe the Dolphins offered 26 straight up, not a swap. So, the Packers would have ended up with 2 first rounders. Maybe?
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Who cares? Are we really discussing something that happened 11 years ago and has nothing to do with anything that is currently going on in the NFL?
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Who cares? Are we really discussing something that happened 11 years ago and has nothing to do with anything that is currently going on in the NFL?
Some of us are. Those who don't want to really don't have to. That's the beauty of a message board!
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Quote:
Quote:
j/c..
yall need to stop dissing my QB..
I like Aaron Murray though.
I'm still a lil iffy with Murray. I like him, but sometimes he makes me scratch my head. Fortunate for him he has plenty time to grow.
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JC
I find it very interesting this is now the 2nd time that supposedly Holmgren has offered the Rams the keys to Browns future Draft picks and lost?
Heck they could have taken at least 2 first round picks from us according to him twice. Bradford and now RG3.
Something smells rotten in Denmark to me and its not a shady back door handshake deal with Washington. To bad the League didnt nix the deal then Mike would be forced to show his hand so to speak instead of saying We had just as good a deal on the table, or we tried hard to get him offering alot.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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We did offer them two huge trades, but the first was to the Spagnuolo regime and this one was to Fisher.
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the trade is what it is... could actually benefit us more that we kept our picks.. you never know the type of talent to come out each year..
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I keep thinking about this Hasslebeck thing .... and while it makes some sense, I also think that it doesn't.
How much longer is he going to play at a high level? Maybe this year? Maybe, at best, next year?
Let's say that the brass really isn't completely decided one way or the other on McCoy. I would think that they would give him one more chance, unless they can clearly upgrade the position for a long, long time. (Like they could have with Luck or RG3) I just have trouble seeing them go for a 1 year fix, unless they have a guy in place to take over in a year or 2.
Now maybe if they have decided to go Tannehill, then signing a guy like Hasselbeck makes sense. However, I have trouble seeing that kind of move if Colt McCoy is the fallback again in a year or 2.
No doubt he is no long term answer, nor even a guy I really want.
He would give a proven leader at a position lacking, and he would know how to run the O.
Now that the team didn't get it's "glitz" QB who could sustain them a few years no matter how he played, they are now in a position of pinning their careers to Colt McCoy, or something else.
Given all of that, I would rather head in to next season with Hasselback at the helm.
The Homie and Heck show needs to worry one season at a time. They know they can't keep posting up 4-5 win seasons and expect to stick around long....
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
I personally love the fact Holmgren speaks his mind, appearing genuine and honest.
I personally really wish he'd learn to STFU when it comes to blabbing to the media.
He looks like a whiner, and more-so, a hypocrite.
Toad...why should Holmgren shut up?
Because a fan with keyboard courage types tough?... 
The Browns fans and local media were all over the Browns for not making a serious run at RGIII...and the fans and media were dead wrong!!!
The media and fans had little information to go on, so Holmgren simply filled his Browns fans in on what really went down...what is wrong with that?
What I find funny as heck...by taking the Redskins offer, the Rams now set at #6 instead of at the Browns #4 draft slot...by taking the Redskins offer, they likely lost a very good chance to make a mega deal and still get the guy they wanted in the draft...Justin Blackmon.
Maybe the Rams would like to work a trade with Holmgren for our #4, so they can draft Blackmon...
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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What I find funny as heck..
We agree here, I find heck pretty comical myself.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Toad...why should Holmgren shut up?
Because no fan of any team likes seeing the President of the entire enchilada whining, and thus giving major media outlets fuel to call him a ....wait for it.....wait...for...it....a whiner. 
I wonder where you're weird, warped sense of perspective comes from, because more often than not you just can't see the big picture.
But don't take my word for it...
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Holmgren should have remained quiet
Browns' Holmgren needed to remain quiet
March, 16, 2012
Mar 16
12:30
PM ET
Email
Print
Comments699
By Jamison Hensley
Browns president Mike Holmgren created a stir Thursday in a conference call with season-ticket holders when he said Cleveland didn't get a fair shot to trade up in the draft because of a close relationship between the Rams and Redskins.
Some are angered by the fact that the Browns were blocked at a chance to get quarterback Robert Griffin III. Others see this as sour grapes by Holmgren.
Holmgren
Whatever perspective you choose to take, the result is the same: Holmgren turned a personal frustration into a public embarrassment. Even if Holmgren felt slighted -- and my take was the Rams should have given the pick to the Browns if it was the best deal -- he needed to remain quiet. Take your lumps and move on. This is the NFL, not a fantasy football league with your buddies.
Holmgren's complaining about the Rams and Redskins leaves himself open to scrutiny for the times he benefited from personal relationships. As NFC West blogger Mike Sando pointed out, Holmgren used his connections to help the Seattle Seahawks acquire Matt Hasselbeck from Green Bay in 2001 when it looked like a deal was nearing between the Packers and Dolphins. Funny, I never heard Dave Wannstedt crying foul.
The worst fallout from all of this is what it does to the Browns' quarterback situation. His comments make it clear that RG3 was Cleveland's first choice. If the Browns thought Colt McCoy was a franchise quarterback, they wouldn't have been trying to trade multiple first-round picks to get RG3. Calling out the Redskins and Rams wasn't worth a vote of no confidence in McCoy.
The Browns can stick to Plan B and use draft picks to build up talent around McCoy. In the end, they're building around a quarterback that they didn't intend to start in 2012.
The other problem is Holmgren can't say Cleveland made "every bit the offer" as the Redskins and not reveal what the offer was. As NFC East blogger Dan Graziano explained: If you really think your offer was better, let's hear it and everyone can make a judgment.
It was a bad call for Holmgren to grumble about losing out on the trade. Let's see if his decision-making is better when it comes to finding a starting running back, a fast wide receiver and a starting right tackle.
That's two major media players stating Holmgren embarrassed himself and the organization by flapping his gums like he did. I bet they aren't the last.
If you wanna keep living back there in the old days where speaking your mind is productive, hey, it's your sand. Stick your head back down there if you like. That won't make reality what you dream it to be. 
Quote:
The Browns fans and local media were all over the Browns for not making a serious run at RGIII...and the fans and media were dead wrong!!!
What fans and local media?  Where is this "all over" the Browns that you're talking about?
Most people BELIEVED the Browns went after RG3. You didn't, even when the overwhelming mountain of evidence shoulda told you they did. But I digress. You're minority viewpoint, a few local bloggers and Youtube crazies don't really count. They sure as Hell don't represent what anyone could characterize as being "all over" the Browns.
I think I may have to find a unique language that has a fun pronunciation for the word "ostrich." That'd be a great new handle for you. 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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My biggest problem with Holmgren speaking out is it my affect future negotiations. I mean if Holmgren doesn't win is he going through my organization under the bus? Thank god the Rams have taken the high road so far about this.
I could care less what Hensely or Florio think but it makes a huge difference what 31 other GMs think. He hurt the Browns with that comment. Hopefully Holmgren called and apologized to the Rams and the Redskins and will do so in the media soon.
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Here's another ESPN writer calling what Holmgren did an embarrassment:
#3 Of Mike Holmgren and sour grapes March, 15, 2012 Mar 15 6:40 PM By Dan Graziano
Here's one being polite by just saying Holmgren was wrong:
#4
ESPN's Mike Sando.
Want me to keep going? Sand feeling nice, cool, and comfy down there, isn't it, Mac...
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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On the other hand ...... maybe other organizations will take note that if they do something that could be considered underhanded, they might just find their names out there in the press.
In the end, the only people this really matters to are the high up muckity mucks ... the ones who get together once a year ...... and the ones who probably have their own little cliques .... and who will tell each other what "those other guys" do anyway. In the end, I doubt that it has much effect at all.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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The presser wasn't a big deal, he whined to the media. Umm its professional sports, everyone cries about something nonstop. It should be news when they have a presser and someone isn't bitching about something.
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He should however be embarrassed for making a trade offer equal to the redskins. Hell my opinion of the man has dropped considerably.
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Wonder how Colt feels.
I suspect that he's going on like Howard Roark would. The pain only goes far and then it stops hurting.
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Quote:
Here's another ESPN writer calling what Holmgren did an embarrassment:
#3
Of Mike Holmgren and sour grapes
March, 15, 2012
Mar 15
6:40
PM
By Dan Graziano
Here's one being polite by just saying Holmgren was wrong:
#4
ESPN's Mike Sando.
Want me to keep going? Sand feeling nice, cool, and comfy down there, isn't it, Mac...
ESPN writers? Seriously? Who gives an <expletive> what an ESPN writer thinks?!
I'm certain that Holmgren, Heckert and Shurmur don't. I'm rather certain that nearly every player in the NFL doesn't care what these morons write about them.
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there is one thing to keep in mind here Toad and that is this was not a press conferance it was a private to season ticket holders conference and they allowed the press to sit in on it.
He was talking to season ticket holders and was telling them what they wanted to hear. He acted like one would expect someone to act when addressing possibly unhappy clients, with passion and fire.
I believe we made an offer for RG3 but not to the extent he says, which I believe is alot of other peoples thoughts because otherwise he would have said what we offered. He did the same with Bradford. This is the 2nd time I heard this type of talk from him and 2nd time after nothing happened to the same team and people are mopping this stuff up. Not to mention his "DONT CALL ME FOR PLAYOFF TICKETS rant. Hes a good actor Ill give him that gets people off his back.
When the Indians were trying to keep Thome they put what they offered up for all to see he chose Philly. When the Cavs tried to keep LeBron everyone knew what the offer was he went to Miami for less money. Why is it that everyone is buying what Mike is saying without actually saying what the offer was?
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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I dare say that there isn't likely to be a trade between Cleveland and St. Louis anytime soon. I don't think the Browns would seek one and if St. Louis did, the price demanded from them would be prohibitively higher than what would be expected of other teams. St. Louis might as well be in the AFC North if they desire a trade with the Browns.
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Well ..... I don't know what the offer was, or wasn't ......
But one thing I know for certain is that Holmgren knows that you don't win without a great QB, and he had tried, and failed to obtain one 2 years in a row.
I think that he believes that the team can improve some this year, but that our upper limit will always be limited by the QB. Further, I know that a rookie QB could need a year to become acclimated to the WCO, and the longer we wait, the longer it will be until we get a great QB who is 100% acclimated to the WCO.
I think that's why he's gone hard after guys he sees as franchise guys. It wouldn't surprise me if we make an even larger offer to the Colts trying to get that top pick, and hoping against hope that they will take an offer. They won't ...... but if he comes out with some offer of 4 first round picks, and a pair of seconds ..... or something like that .... I think that Heckert might keel over, and that the Colts would, at least, have to consider it.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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The best thing the Browns can do is carry on like they have a chip on their shoulder instead of saying anything..get the best deals U can in the draft and take the best players ..thereby leaving scraps for other teams//and field a competitive team and win some games..
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You need to cut back on your pain meds. Seriously.
Re-read what you just posted.
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In the end, the upper guys have their own cliques at the meetings and such. Watch the NFL meetings news, and see who is always hanging out with whom. I'm sure that guys who are friends/allies on most issues talk about the "other" guys, and those other guys talk about them.
II think that there will definitely be an impact if the Rams were to call the Browns about a trade this year. There will probably be an impact if it happens next year. However, if the Rams have an asset that the Browns covet, they'll make a call to them.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Rams/Redskins Trade Part 2
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