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The other thread got locked, so I'll start back up.

https://sportsnaut.com/2019/12/report-wade-phillips-could-leave-rams-after-2019-season/amp/

I'm not saying, I'm just saying. If he gets the boot and our alleged next coaching staff picks him up, it would be amazing.

Jason LaCanfora: Urban Meyer to the Browns is a possibility

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-u...oaching-change/

All I will say is you cannot continue with Freddie and hope "time" is the magic formula. The list of negatives this year was too long and too dramatic.

They need a leader, not necessarily an Xs and Os guy.

With the roster that we have, if yet another coaching staff is going to be 1anddone, the incoming coach/staff has to be a slam dunk.

OMG IT'S HAPPENING!!!

First coach to ever die on the sidelines.

I agree. STR I recollect only two new HCs that had been HCs in the NFL before Cleveland. In both cases - Hue and Mangini - their previous HC gigs were less-than-successful...to put it mildly.

Dorsey went for the lightning in a bottle with FK. I'd say it failed. I'd prefer McCarthy or Rivera if we stir this pot again. Guys who have been-there-done-that and with proven success.

This is horrible process. At this point the coaching staff is what it is. They are either good enough or aren’t good enough. The last two games don’t change anything.

People just making stuff up?

If coaching the more talented team every week was too stressful, how is coaching for a team whose fans try to run the coach out of town after every season going to work?

Last week Urban was on Gameday or something similar and said that he didn't think that he would ever coach again. FWIW. I think he may have said something like that after he left Florida too, so there is that.

Stop raining on my parade. He's coming.

If the Browns make a change, they need to make a "real change" and that means Dorsey has to go too.

How things are done in Cleveland is all messed up. Look at the Steelers they NEVER hire expereinced coaches out the gate, yet they are successful year after year.

The Browns should be looking at two guys:

1. Nick Casrio - Patriots Director of Player Personel.

2. Omar Khan - Steelers Vice President of Football & Business Administration

You hire one of those two guys as your GM & President of Football operations. You then let that guy hire his Director of Player Personal(Chief Scout which is what Dorsey is)

then those two guys work together to hire their HC(most likely a coordinator/first time coach) and then you do it the pre-Bellichik Patriots and Steelers way, and this 1st time HC is TOLD who is coordinators are going to be(Like the Steelers told Tomlin when he was hired)The entire coaching staff is selected from the ground up by the Front Office.

The Coach can give his opinion on who he may want in Fa or the draft, but the coach focuses on coaching and the GM and DPP are the ones who fit the roster with players, its all a collaborative effort.

the Browns have been a dysfunctional mess for the better part of 20 years. Dorsey today is part of that dysfunction.

Best example is when Dorsey traded Hyde away and force Jacksaon to play Chubb. They said Jackson found out about it on ESPN at home. Even though Dorsey was right in wanting to play Chubb, that is NOT how you run a professional organization. He straight up undermined another employee of the organization, that is NOT how you do things. You don't see the Steelers, Patriots, etc doing that kinda nonsense. We shouldn't tolerated either. I don't care how good a scout Dorsey is, doing that kinda stuff is just making more dysfunction.

Dorsey could have went about things in a more professional way then how he done, and it tells me he isn't anything more than a glorified scout, and he doesn't have the skills to be the "football guy" that runs the show which is much more than just being a good scout.

If we EVER want to be successful long term, we have to get rid of the dysfunction and it starts with Dorsey. He done the same thing with Hyde/Chubb in KC with Reid by voice mailing Jeremy Maclin telling him he was cut and Reid didn't even know anything about it. Then he turned around and gave the guys he drafted like Fischer big contracts while ignoring other players who were playing much better.

(Just like he is now refusing to resign Schobert who wasn't a guy he picked, but will waste money on one of his guys Despite Schobert being a Pro Bowl LB, a top 5 MIKE in the NFL, and a guy that should go a Pro Bowl this year too)

Dorsey was canned in KC for undermining Reid and creating a toxic environment to work in, He wasn't here 8 months before he undermined Hue Jackson in an unprofessional way. When he should have just been a pro and let it play out and Jackson would have been canned of his own accord.

Dorsey doesn't play nice with others, He is a major source of dysfunction, this is why despite his good draft track record, the Hunt family got him out of their building.

We need to build a more stable FO, and Dorsey isn't the guy to build that around. The one time Haslam should fire his GM is now,. I just fear, just like Jackson, we will stick with him 1-2 years too long.

I believe fully that either Caserio, or Khan can get this whole organization on the right track, but our windows to get an actual GM(not just a glorified scout) is closing.

Im tired of this internal dysfunction, especially when it easy to fix and things really don't have to be this way all the time

They need an Xs and Os guy to go with Freddie. Or at least a more detail oriented one.

We've got two guys who like going for the homerun too often. This season they are striking out more than they are connecting. We need someone better at doing the fine-tuning to complement Freddie.

Freddie at a casino, "Damn, almost hit three 7's, I know I'm getting close to a payoff".

Would Stefanski from Minnesota be in play again?

The only guy I'd be willing to roll the dice with who doesn't have a proven track record as a head coach is McDaniels. If not not McDaniels, you have to go proven head coach from college level or pro. This team needs an adult in the room in the worst way. They need a mature individual who will put the Browns before themselves and their ego. The offense doesn't need to be dramatic or dynamic, it just needs to be sound. Hiring some Xs and Os guy with no head coaching experience will be another disaster.

This team is lacking so much leadership. It was evident from Game 1 and nothing has changed.

Get a leader of men in the locker room.

I don't think it's the "leadership" we're lacking. It's meticulousness.

Gregg Williams and Freddie complemented each other.

Monken and Wilks are nothing like Williams. Monken thinks offense should "be fun."

We need someone more focused on the particulars.

A loss to the Bengals seals Kitchens fate.

It's going to happen. Not because the players want Kitchens fired...although they might...but because the Browns are one of the worst teams in the league...again.

A colossal organizational failure

The three most important people...Haslam, Freddie, and Baker...are all below average in their respective roles. The result...headed for another season of double digit losses.

His fate has been sealed. Freddie won't be here next year. A win against the hapless Bengals isn't changing hearts and minds.

Scary thought about a new coaching staff. You may not get the best candidate depending on what they think of Baker.

Freddie should be told he’s gone tomorrow.

I can’t help but feel bad for Freddie because I still like the guy. He’s not suited for this position and needs to be relieved of his duties for the good of the Browns. I feel bad for him as he’s a good person who was just thrown into the deep end of the pool before he was taught properly how to tread water.

In a way, I feel for him too, but he applied for the job and sold himself in the interview. He chose to call his own plays. He wasn't thrown into it.

Nice guy maybe, but he’s too immature for the job.

Freddie wasn't Reddie.

Mike McCarthy is a real good possibility, but he may not want to retain Dorsey, but to promote Wolf and Highsmith within.

With this roster, is there any reason to think the job wouldn’t garner serious interest from serious candidates?

man you have to think it should. i mean we had a really good coach opening campaigning for the gig last year in Arians.

but reading up on some of the links purp and others hooked me up with.....i dunno if attracting top quality candidates would be the problem. maybe the bigger problem is Dorsey wanting a guy he can influence a lot more than you're traditional style of coaches.

i dunno why man....but Dorsey kinda reminds me of Joe Banner, except a way better talent evaluator.

He’s starting to sound like it. I get the confidence and even ego that stems from being really good at what you do. But the point where your ego is placed before the organization it wrecks everything. I doubt Ozzie was ever like this when he was in Baltimore

If his fate is sealed, I agree. It would give us a 1 week head start on finding another coach. At this point Dorsey can't do much of anything other that start forming a list. Until Kitchens is released Dorsey can't begin to reach out.

Agreed. At this point we’re in competition with Carolina, Dallas, NY Giants, Washington, etc

LOL...we may not get people because they don't want Dorsey. Maybe they don't like the color orange. Maybe they like palm trees. Maybe they like money and get more elsewhere. Maybe they are looking for a state with no income tax in place.

No. No need to worry.

I agree. Rex Ryan spoke to that a few weeks ago. Basically said guys would salivate over the chance.

Listening to WDVE Pittsburgh Radio station this morning, and they just said to the Pardon My Take guy that was on the show, "All I want for xmas is Freddie Kitchens to stay the HC of the Browns, because that guy is a mess".

J/C

if matt patricia has more structure, we are doomed...the lions suck