DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Who Goes First Jimmie?

He has played fine. He has not been bad. The culprit for our run defense woes is not Danny Shelton. It's the linebackers and safety who take horrible pursuit angles, can't hold/get to the edge, and/or don't tackle.

Jimmie, Jimmie, Jimmie
Your net worth of $1.2 billion (No.360) is based on your 21 percent interest in Pilot Flying J. What would you do if Pilot was in the same mess that the Cleveland Browns are in? You'd fire your Operations Manager, right Jimmie?
By the way, Jimmie, why are you so quite, or are you about to act?

You would probably agree that running truckstops and running a football team are very different things, right?

Can anyone imagine IF Farmer did hire the coach? Is it possible to be worse than the Browns are now? I think so. Say no to Ray Farmer going forward.

I really like the way Meder is playing. It seems to me that he was on our practice squad last year, and thus was one of the guys who is familiar with the defense.

Remember last year how the defense started playing better as the year went along, and players started being able to know what they were doing, rather than thinking about it? I suspect that will happen this year as well. face it, we have almost a whole new DL, and that is bound to cause problems.

Anyway, back to Meder .... I wonder hos many remember his story?

Student Gives Up Shot at NFL to Nurse Girlfriend with Cancer | fox8.com
http://fox8.com/2014/05/06/student-gives-up-shot-at-nfl-to-nurse-girlfriend-with-cancer/

PARMA, Ohio-- He gave up a shot at the NFL draft to stay by his girlfriend's side while she battled cancer.

Tuesday afternoon, an Ashland University lineman and Valley Forge graduate was honored for his commitment both on and off the field.

Jamie Meder, 23, received a surprise standing ovation at his alma mater, where Valley Forge coaches and administrators retired Meder's high school football jersey -- a first for the school.

"It's our chance to give back to him," said head football coach Jamie Vanek, who has a personal connection to Meder.

"His father coached me, and I've known Jamie since he was about four years old," Vanek said. "We can talk for days about every All-American title he's ever had, every record he's ever set, but he's a difference-maker. And he's a difference-maker on the field and in life."

"He's worked so hard for this. It's not come easy, that's for sure," said Meder's girlfriend of seven years, Lyndsey Koehler.

The two met in high school, and Koehler has stood by his side, just as he stood by hers when she was diagnosed with cancer two years ago.

At the time, Meder had a chance to train for the NFL draft, but instead, he put his schooling and Koehler first.

"He had practices and trainings and all that starting in the morning, and he would be home every night--drive to school every day--to come take care of me," Koehler said.

"It was a hard time," Meder told FOX 8 News reporter Autumn Ziemba on Tuesday. "But my mom had cancer before that, and I saw how my dad was a man during that, and it set the tone for me on what to do."

Meder has never looked back.

Koehler is now cancer-free, and with another draft starting Thursday, it's all about second chances.

Meder had the opportunity to attend NFL training prospect facilities this upcoming weekend, but once again put his schooling first. He has decided instead to attend his commencement ceremony at Ashland where he will graduate with a degree in criminal justice.

"He's gone and faced so much adversity, and to stay and graduate this Saturday on arguably the biggest weekend of his life, says everything," said Vanek.

"It's a very surreal feeling. I don't know how to describe it -- it's just amazing," Meder said. "It's awesome to have the community behind me and I'm glad to be part of this community."

Meder told FOX 8 he's eager to get a phone call from the NFL this weekend, but when it comes to team preference his reply was simple, with a smile.

"I just want to play football."

Why? Seems to me that it should be the other way around. The HC puts together the philosophy, the scheme, the game plan, is responsible for getting the players coached up, motivated, the assistants to help do those things... so why shouldn't the HC have a say in who the guy who is supposed to find him the talent to fit HIS game plan?

IMO whether or not the GM thinks we should run a 3-4 or a 4-3, spread offense or west coast shouldn't matter a single bit because come Game Day his only job is to enjoy the Box Seats.

Oh I would certainly agree. But many do not. I pointed out when he became our owner that when it comes to truck stops, diesel fuel is a commodity that only has to be marketed. You are given the finished product with nothing to do but to build the marketing concept to sell it.

With an NFL team, you actually have to build the product and market it. We know he has the marketing part down. New uniforms and "the fan experience" at the stadium. The "building your product" aspect? Not so much thus far.

But I was told how wrong I was by many. So good luck with that.

No coach in Mike Pettine's situation gets to make those type of decisions. Zero.

Who goes first?

Farmer

But, has anybody been calling for Pettine to break Jimmy's pocket book and bring in the best Defensive Coordinator money can buy? I realize its his friend and all, but his job may hinge on it and I'm not sure Pettine will get another Head Coach gig if he leaves this one without showing more improvement than we have at the moment.

To me, if there is a problem, it is almost always due to lack of talent and not substandard coaching.

Good players can play through poor coaching. Great coaches can't do much if there is a lack of talent.

I agree with you to an extent. I do believe good, established players can play through bad coaching.

Where we disagree I believe is that it takes good coaching to develop young players. I believe it also takes good coaching to create schemes that make the most out of the talent you are given.

How is it a good point? It sounds moronic to me.

Cutting a guy that you already had and then having to go out and use your first overall pick on a guy to replace him who isn't any better sounds moronic. Not smart or good.

Then, we let's take Buster. We don't want him anymore. We draft Gilbert w/our first overall pick the year before and then we let Skrine walk and STILL have to sign Williams in free agency. You call that smart? Good?

I think Farmer is an idiot!

Sooner or later, all of will you come around no mater how hard you are digging your heels in the sand right now.

The statement in question wasn't whether the moves were good or bad.

No doubt it takes coaching. My statement is simply bare bones. I'll take talent in the player ranks over talent in the coaching ranks.


I am a firm believer that great coaching can only win maybe 10% tops. After that, you better have good players. On the opposite end, coaches only lose 10% of the games. It's not like any of the guys aren't good at the skill of coaching. They are all good coaches. It's not like they were hired from a pool of people off a message board. All of them have had years of experience from HS, to college, to the pro's. Each has a resume of success at the various levels.

You don't skate by as a coach in college, at least at the top levels. It's not like the guys we have as coaches came here from Pee Wee Football.

it's kinda hard for me to buy into this talent thing. why is it that every other team is able to develop their draft picks? but here in browns town we expect our players to develop just because they've been here a while?

how bout maybe we just have crap coaches?

They are?

LOL.........Farmer would hire someone like Baylor's HC. He believes in this "magic formula," you see, and he would hope that he can plug in a running Spread qb that he can acquire in round 6 or 7.

He's way ahead of the rest of the NFL. Other than quite a few Brown's fans, no one else understands his genius way of thinking.

Other franchises are so freaking stupid because they want a qb who can actually read defenses and coverages and throw the ball w/accuracy. What morons those other teams are.

Shoot......let teams like Green Bay keep Rodgers. Brady--Smady! Big Ben is a dinosaur. Who wants a smart qb? That is passe. Go w/an athlete w/an IQ under 80 so we can revolutionize the game and forever be hailed as the genius who changed professional football because he found the "magic formula."

a lot, yes.

Ryan Tannehil, say what you want, but has progressed every year. this is his what? 4th year?

how long do we keep our QB's? man i'd take him over what we have right now, but i wouldn't say that 2 years ago.

there's plenty of examples of teams developing their talent to be good football players. but we seem to fail at that every year.

I explained that. Look at it this way Swish.....is it a great Commander or great Screaming Eagle boots on the ground and air that win battles?

it's both. it doesn't matter how great your soldiers are, if they have no direction, it's easy pickings for the better trained opposition.

There's exceptions to the rule. Joe Thomas was probably gonna be great anyway. look how many coaches we have gone through, but he's still the best LT in the game.

but then look at a guy like Alex smith. he was trash up until that year he started playing lights out, but got injured. look at Ryan Tannehill. Look at guys like Danny amendola and Julian Eldeman. Jeremy Maclin.

Hell, Haden got very good when Horton was here. The patriots and seahawks, while we aren't them, are great example of teams that might not have the best talent, but have the greatest of coaching.

J/C here ... but has anyone kept up on how Sheard is doing thus far in New England? It was always my opinion that he had much more potential and ability than he showed here ... so I'm interested to see if he plays better in a "better coached" place

so far he has 8 tackles and 2 sacks.

We beat the Titans 28-14 and it's rainbows and butterflies.

We lose to an improving Raiders team 27-20 and everyone wants Mike Pettine fired and the roster turned over?

I'm baffled.

This was a competitive 7-9 group last year with 4-losses by 4-points or less.

Don't get me wrong here, it was REALLY frustrating watching that garbage for three quarters last Sunday, but why is the answer to always blow things up?

Firing our 4th head coach since 2010 isn't going to make a damn thing better here in Cleveland. Our impending free agents that are already sick of turn over? They'll FOR SURE leave. Those free agents that we can't even get to answer our calls, they'll be even more turned off at the idea of Cleveland.

This organization has been nothing BUT impatient since 2008. Good lord, why not try and let the group you have grow together and improve?

Most of you said we would be 2 and 1 or 3 and 0 after the first 3 games. That was the easy part of the schedule.

We played 2 of the 3 at home and we are 1 and 2, yet you wonder why people are upset?

Really?

No, I understand the frustration. I was frustrated too...(still am).

But what frustrates me is that firing our coach is always the solution for so many.

I ask what firing our 4th coach since 2010 would accomplish?

How do you ever create a stable and consistent environment by firing your staff every year or two?

it's hard to justify keeping a coach when our play has clearly regressed, though.

i mean if we showed potential, then sure, but man, it's hard to justify keeping him after this season IF, ONLY IF, our play doesn't improve on the field.

we've regressed so far in every phase of the game except ST.

The QB we're starting, is either as bad or worse than last years.
Our OL is not performing in the run game, not as good as last year in passing.
our TE group seems to be worse.

and Defense? Kelso, we have zero sacks in 2 of the 3 games we played.

we didn't even get 2 pressures on the QB.

we're somehow worse than last year stopping the run.


it's really hard to be like pettines doing a good job.

Well, hopefully we beat SD and get things turned around.

I don't really have any excuses, except that I do think losing Shanahan has really, really hurt our offense. Personally, I loved his system. The quicker paced, zone running attack with the play-action/bootlegs. I thought it was a blast to watch, and it was a real shame when Hoyer crapped the bed and spoiled the fun.

I don't know what's wrong with the defense, or why the effort has been inconsistent.

I just know that I'm not in favor of firing our 4th coach in six years. I don't think that does this franchise any good. I want to see what stability and patients with a group feels like, what kind of results it can bring.

I am torn. You raise great points about consistency and I have always agreed w/that. Old timers around here can tell you that I was the first guy to rip guys like Butch, but was the last to defend him. I get continuity.....

On the other hand, the new regime seems to make one bad decision after another......and I am sorry........I don't like Camp Cupcake. RAC was the only coach I did not defend when he was fired........I kinda did, but it was just lip service...........you can't win if you baby the troops.

I believe in hard work. I believe in out-working the other guy. I believe in great things happen because of preparation and not by accident. You give yourself every advantage you can. You cannot control how tall you are, how fast you are, your IQ, etc...but you can work to get stronger, smarter, quicker, tougher, etc.

The phrase......."Playing like a Brown" always struck me as odd, because the Browns have sucked for so long and have had so many players that aren't true professionals. Why the hell do we wanna play like them?

I know Pet didn't mean it like that, but if so, isn't it just another hollow phrase that loses all it's intended meanings once you get punched in the mouth?

I agree.

We went from Johnny for almost 2 weeks, back to Josh. They are different players, and the team had to have somewhat adjusted to Johnny, and then back to Josh. That had to have been difficult on the team.

The defense has almost a completely new DL. What did players say last year about the defense? It is a really complex defense. We almost completely changed over the whole unit, and there is bound to be a learning curve. (just like there was on the whole defense overall last year)

Like you, I am also frustrated so far. However, we have shown that we can win games, using the formula set forth by Pettine ..... we just need consistency. We don't get that consistency by blowing things up yet again.

Before the season we were told they were working on "graduate level" stuff for the defense.

We have three new guys in the starting eleven (Shelton, Starks, and Williams).

On the DL, which sees heavy rotation on Pettine's defense, we have Shelton, Starks, Cooper, and Meder, who did not play in it last year. (or, in Meder's case, played only a few snaps) We have a guy in Hughes, returning from injury, who played only 5 games.

That is 5 guys on the DL who did not play in this defense at all last year, or who only played very little. Bryant, our best DL last year, has been banged up.

The DL put it all together against Tennessee, and the defense shined. They struggled against the Jets and Raiders, and the defense struggled. That is usually the case on a pressure based defense, but the why is important on this team. I think that it is a growing/learning problem more than a talent problem.

I think the problems in the run game are more to do with the guys behind the defensive linemen. It seems to me like they are doing an admirable job (when compared to the turd show that's been going on).

There is no excuse for horrible performance of the defense so far. We were told that they were going to be very good and they have been very bad.

Luckily it is only week three and many things can change.

Ok lets take Buster I think Farmer was wrong for letting him and Sheard go. Both were mistakes on his part IMO I was one of the lone wolfs standing up for Buster his first few years when many, many of the posters here were calling for his head. Calling him a bust, saying he sucked, he was to small, saying he sucked. Now some of those same posters are crying because we let him get away in free agency. The same thing can be said for Sheard (although on a smaller scale) Now we got folks screaming the same things about most of our draft picks from the last two years.

They are also doing the same thing with Ray. One full season down and so many posters want to get ride of him already. hmmmm I wander how many of them were saying the same thing about Buster 3 games into his second season? Farmer deserves a lot longer to prove if he can end up a good GM, or if he will prove self to be an idiot as you keep claiming. I believe it could still go either way with him.

I remember it very well. Even talked to him about it in person. He is a great kid. I have been pulling for him since we signed him to the practice squad last year.

I can tell you he is like a kid at Christmas right now