DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2015 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 10 Bengals 31 Browns preparing to start Johnny Manziel at Bengals

I think certain posters on this board should learn how to read before they start hurling out accusations.

We'll see. I am not confident, but I'm hopeful.

We aren't going to know a lot whether he plays good or bad this game. He needs to start the rest of the year and we need to see incremental improvement by the end of the season.

I just hope JT isn't pissed off at the organization and doesn't let his guard down. The rest of the OL will probably follow suit. It will be a repeat of the second Bengals game last year if that happens.

Crossing my fingers we see some positives tonight. As crazy as it sounds, Manziel may be the only one who can save this franchise from itself. If he plays well and finishes the season strong, maybe everyone gets to stay. If he plays like crap, I see the whole thing being blown up, especially if we are picking in the top 3. Haslam and Scheiner will likely want to entrust that decision to a new set of guys, IMO.

There is a lot riding on the shoulders of Two Drink Johnny.

If he does, somebody in the locker room needs to slap him across the face.

Friend, the very first sentence of the article says Josh McCown is dealing with a painful rib injury, so the team was preparing Manziel to start. Replies from others are as follows:

-Pettine must really, REALLY hate Manziel. Just, wow.

-Literally the only week of the entire season where this would be a horrible decision. Last week was the week to do it. Really dumb.

-Seems like if the Browns can make a bad decision, they do it.

-Unreal, what a horrible time for a start.

-I really think this is an ignorant move.

-The point is the team is taking every opportunity to shatter this guy's confidence before he even takes a snap.

-Making the right decision at the absolute wrong time.

-Has it crossed your mind that perhaps starting JM this week was a directive from above?

What am I to make of these comments when the first line in the article everyone was replying to says McCown is injured? I actually did read the article and the comments, so I'm not sure what you're talking about. I don't have a dog in the fight one way or another, I'm stating what I see. If that offends you, I apologize because that wasn't my intent. However, Browns fans on this board often confuse me and I have a difficult time trying to figure out their thought processes. Hence, why I said I do not understand some of the members of this board.

I guess it was because the first two threads I read this morning, you took shots at people, as if you are some type of moral authority.

You forgot to quote the parts of those posts that said that if McCown is too injured, than everything else is moot.

I don't see many posts from you. When I do, you typically are criticizing other posters. Why don't you at least mix it up a bit. Try a football post once in awhile in between all the other attacks of fellow posters?

It would be refreshing.

I don't think I've ever attacked/criticized other members, I have no interest in that kind of behavior. Even in the most contentious threads in the off-topic section, I don't hurl personal attacks at anybody while those types of comments are flying all around me. My posts in the two threads you saw this morning were my legitimate confusion on how other members think. On message boards, there is often a lot left open to interpret and misunderstand. I've posted many football thoughts during my time here and had civilized discussions with everybody involved. This is actually the first time anybody has accused me of being insensitive or critical of others. I try to be as respectful of others as possible both on this board and in life. You might have me confused with someone else, sir.

"You forgot to quote the parts of those posts that said that if McCown is too injured, than everything else is moot."

The first line of the article said McCown was injured. That means either everybody who made those comments were the ones who didn't read the article or they ignored it and were possibly trying to push some kind of agenda as I stated earlier.

Hahaha!!! I suppose I am.

I have something to say about JM starting tonight; good luck, have a great game and beat the Bengals.

I like how people are pretending that it matters if McCown is/was hurt or not. He was too hurt to play last week and still played. He was injured even further during the game last week and still played.

Manziel has to start this week on short rest because McCown is too hurt to play. The problem with that is that Manziel should have started in at least week eight (and probably earlier than that). If he had started in the previous game(s) that he should have, then him starting on a short week wouldn't be as big of a deal.

Anyone other than the cleveland doctors knew that McCown was knocked out 2 weeks ago and was still very dazed in his post game presser. this has nothing to do with Johnny. I was not happy about how the coaches and staff did not protect one of their guys. McCown is a warrior but the bottom line, Johnny is starting this week because this team (coaches and medical staff) did not protect McCown.

Now as for Johnny. He cant do any worse than he did a year ago lol. Its not the ideal situaion but its an opportunity and those dont come along very often. He took the majority of the reps the week before preparing for the Cards. He took the reps this week. Its not perfect but its better than against the Jets with zero reps that week and being thrust into the game.

I keep hearing experts say protect johnny with the short passing attack and I say bull. Get targets deep and go for it. Stretch the field and then use Duke and Crow to run behind them as the Bengals try to contain Johnny, those plays to the backs could be HUGE!!

Also get benji in motion. When he is moving, his speed can be used to avoid that initial jam and het can get to zero to 60 in a hurry. Bengals may be the best team in football but we can give make a game out of it and we hit a couple plays who knows.

The problem is that Johnny rehab shouldn't be starting at all. He's not ready. He would have struggled even more against the Broncos defense or the Rams defense and against the Cardinals he would be in 100% pass mode playing catch-up ball with a giant target on his chest much like I think he is going to be in this game.

Now our best chance of winning is simply too hurt to play. If we did happen to wheel him out there and he happened to get a concussion on the first play, JFF is expected to be ready to step in. I think it was back in 2012 when Wheeden and McCoy were both hurt and we had to trot out 3rd stringer Thaddeus Lewis to face the Steelers in what should have been a bloodbath. We lost the game, but Lewis looked calm and had a respectable game and it was obvious he was preparing every week to start. He got compliments from the Steeler defense for his poise that game.

This is the NFL. Next man up. Save the drama for your mama.

I am not sure if this statement is a direct response to my post or just a general statement. If it is a direct response, then you are just agreeing with me or you didn't my post.

Not really the part you highlighted.

I disagree that he should have started earlier, although I do think McCown should have been pulled earlier in the game last week.

That last statement is just a general statement about the reality of football.

why do people say McCown is the best chance to win?

they have the same amount of wins this year between the two: 1.

McCown has put up solid stats just like Weeden did in Dallas. Same results.

do you make plays in the clutch? he makes critical mistakes in the clutch.

Johnny may not be ready but I still feel he gives us a better chance.

Because he is a veteran people think he has a better handle on the offense (they are probably right).

What people don't understand (or don't believe) is that Manziel is much more talented than McCown in many different ways (mobility, accuracy, release, downfield throws, etc.)

What people also don't understand is JFF has poor footwork, a poor throwing motion, doesn't make it past his second read, still struggles with pre-snap reads, and gambles too much on his throws.

Unless our head coach is lying (which is a definite possibility), Manziel has improved on all those things since we last saw him (and I am not sure where you got the part about Manziel's throwing motion being bad).

Also, how many of those things does McCown also struggle with?

All I can say is that I saw progress in JFF from last season. Weeks have passed since then. As a Browns fan, I certainly hope the progress has continued and we see an even better JFF tonight.

If Manziel loses this one, it's easy to chalk up to experience. If he manages to pull off a win, it's the shot heard around the world.

Guys please do not quote this and slow down the webpage even more.

You tell me. How does his throwing motion, read progression, and footwork look? Not much pre-snap video out there.

I think Manziel should have started last week, I don't know how good he is yet, nobody does, that's what we need to find out before the next draft because their are some very good QB's coming out next year, especially Goff, Hogan and Conner Cook, my favorite is Goff from California ... JMHO

Wow. Those Brown and Orange uniforms are really awful. We are all going to look back in ten years and wonder what happened.

Obviously Manziel has had problems reading defenses. I don't think anyone is disputing that. Same with his footwork. Our head coach, if he is to be believed, has said that he has improved.

I really don't understand your contention about his release.

His release is nice and quick, but his throwing motion is all over the place. Sometimes it's even sidearm.

Watch a little of what not to do in this video and you'll see what I mean.

Throwing Mechanics

To be fair, though, he's on the move while throwing in all of those examples. Andrew Luck has a hideous throwing motion when he's on the run too, but that doesn't mean he's got a poor throwing motion or is lesser of a QB because of it.

True, but he tends to put himself on the move more than he needs to be. You aren't going to be able to change him enough to suddenly make him become a pocket passer either. That takes multiple seasons. Luck may not always set his feet on the run, but his actual arm motion is still 1000 times better when running.

"True, but he tends to put himself on the move more than he needs to be."

Also true. I think the Browns should run a decent number of rollout passing plays for him since he's comfortable on the move and is really short in the pocket. It might make him comfortable when throwing the ball and simply make it easier for him to see the field. Tonight should be interesting and give us a good taste of just how much he's evolved over the past year. Whether it's good or bad, I'm looking forward to watching it to have some kind of answer to that question.

Pogo, I believe stated, " We have met the enemy and they is us." True tonight, and sometimes here on the board. Place your aggression where it belongs as needed. Not aiming at Vers or anyone here.

But self-mastery is crucial and it is vital on the field. Mental toughness is focus. It is also flags, drops, tackles good AND bad, and coaching. Not paid for timid.

JFF wanted to wreck the league; tonight would be a good time to start on someone else.

Good luck. I like readings which are posted and not at the expense of some other poster. Disagree all you want, but always respect your opponent by not underestimating anything done by him.

How upset are we all going to be if Manziel lights it up over the eight games?

(There is about a .05% of this happening, just curious.)

Upset? I might have a party.

Right. But that would just mean he probably should have been starting all along.

Although there will be some who said this was all a part of the "plan," as if McCown wouldn't be starting if he was healthy.

Uhmm the other half was from the Jets game last month.

So let's see...

You put the odds that he should have been starting all along at 0.05% and the odds he shouldn't at 99.95%. That sounds about right to me.

Browns QB Johnny Manziel says his start Thursday vs. Bengals 'can’t go as bad' as it did last year
By NATE ULRICH Published: November 5, 2015


Quarterback Johnny Manziel will make his fourth NFL start when the Browns (2-6) face the Cincinnati Bengals (7-0) beginning at 8:25 p.m. Thursday at Paul Brown Stadium. Last year, the Bengals humiliated Manziel in his first professional start and crushed the Browns 30-0. Manziel spoke to NFL Network, which will televise the game, a couple of hours before kickoff. Below is a transcript from Manziel's interview with the network.

On how different of a quarterback he is this year than he was when he faced the Bengals last season: “I think obviously the year has made a big difference. I feel a lot more confident this year than going into last year. Obviously that’s a game that we struggled mightily in and that’s one thing I’ve told myself a lot today is it can’t go as bad as that Sunday did last year. Really the main thing today is just go out, try to block all of this out, block everything out that is going on, have fun and at the end of the day this is still a game. Blessed to be in this position fighting with these guys so just go out on a Thursday night in front of everybody and have some fun.”

On how difficult it was to prepare on a short week: “It was a quick week but I think once a year everybody in the league deals with that so you have to handle it accordingly. It’s a little bit different, squeezing things together. You make it a little bit tighter throughout the week but at the same time we knew what we had and I think coach [Mike] Pettine and the rest of the guys got us prepared. We’ll see tonight.”

On how much he looks at tonight as an opportunity to prove himself: “I think this is a good opportunity just for our entire team. We’ve been struggling a little bit lately and we want to come out and try to make a little bit of a statement. What better stage than tonight and this atmosphere right now? So at the end of the day, go out and have some fun. Looking forward to playing with these guys.”

http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-brow...t-year-1.638269

Barney, you are working way too hard to make one guy look bad. How many posts have you made about JM on this forum and the Pure Football forum? Can you count that high?

You post vids of him from last year and throwing on the run to say his motion is bad. Not everyone on here is stupid.

Personally, I don't think Manziel is going to make it, but man, the hate you have for a guy who has barely played is kinda creepy.

sorry. the first 3 last year? 2 was a perfect example of leaving the pocket to early and trying to throw on the run. and the other had nothing to do with throwing motion, read progression, and footwork, just a bad read and being late on the pass. as far as the jets? pfft the guy couldnt even practice for 3 weeks before the game. i really dont think the kid is a nfl QB but those you put up do nothing for me.

to tell the truth i think no matter what.. even if he plays lights out and wins every game from here on out.. have to look for the long term answer because he can not be trusted. JMO