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Johnny will never be a first in first out kind of guy. He is the guy that shows up late, falls asleep in film study and leaves early to go party. And you all love him for that. Do you have a link for this? You are just making crap up now because you can't stand the kid. I don't think many of us who are backing him think he is unequivocally the answer. We like what we've seen THIS YEAR - I've fully admitted he was a douche last year, but all reports say otherwise this year; I'm just willing to forgive and you are not - and want to see what he can do next year. Of course he is an unknown. I haven't seen anyone say otherwise - you're just willing to get rid of him because you you cannot stand him and do not believe in second chances apparently.
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Since Johnny is now the franchise QB we've all been waiting for..... in some posters minds at aleast.... Farmer would have to be considered the best GM we've had since the return. We MUST keep him if we keep Pettine. What has Pettine done? Name ONE way Pettine has improved this team. Is our D better now than before he was hired? Hell no. We are a LOT worse. He's not a good game day coach. Makes tons of mistakes with the clock and decisions. He's not a great teacher. He's not bringing along our young players... etc. While I'm not a fan of Farmer, I CAN point to a FEW things he HAS done. If Johnny is the franchise QB some of you claim him to be, then Farmer is the first GM since the return to provide that franchise QB. He drafted Bitonio. He drafted DUKE! Of course he also missed on way too many and I DO hope he's fired along with Pettine. But if the call is to keep Pettine, having done NOTHING at all to earn that loyalty? Then I can absolutely make the case for keeping Farmer. He's at least done a couple things right. Unlike Pettine.
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Johnny will never be a first in first out kind of guy. He is the guy that shows up late, falls asleep in film study and leaves early to go party. And you all love him for that. Do you have a link for this? You are just making crap up now because you can't stand the kid. I don't think many of us who are backing him think he is unequivocally the answer. We like what we've seen THIS YEAR - I've fully admitted he was a douche last year, but all reports say otherwise this year; I'm just willing to forgive and you are not - and want to see what he can do next year. Of course he is an unknown. I haven't seen anyone say otherwise - you're just willing to get rid of him because you you cannot stand him and do not believe in second chances apparently. SECOND CHANCES? LMMFAO That's funny. Second chances. Johnny was so out of control last season they didn't let him dress for the final game. He had a TON of chances last year. Then this year they finally hand him the job. What would most young QB's do in that situation? STUDY HIS ASS OFF during the bye. Six weeks, six teams to study film on. Not Johnny. Nope, time to PARTY!!!!! But who cares? He's Johnny. So why does the same not go for meathead? Meat needs a "second chance" right? Lets extend him with a HUGE contract.... If off field means nothing, if work ethic is of no concern? Then Johnny isn't the only player we should embrace. Meathead is AWESOME and should be the new face of the franchise. This is what will probably happen. We will commit to Johnny(of course he won't commit to us) and we will pass on taking a QB or trading for one. Why would we? We already have our franchise QB. Then one of the guys we pass on will become the next big thing. We will kick ourselves for a decade.
Last edited by Spiritbro77; 12/22/15 05:48 PM.
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With improved talent, the defense can definitely shine --- you just need a lot of talent. It's high risk, high reward. Like the Bills?
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Since Johnny is now the franchise QB we've all been waiting for..... in some posters minds at aleast.... Farmer would have to be considered the best GM we've had since the return. I've been thinking this same thing. If Manziel is our starter of the future, then there is no way Farmer should be fired. He
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I've seen improvement on the field. My only wish is he'd have taken his job seriously last year. As it is, he's a rookie this year with only a few starts.
I have high hopes for him. I'm not necessarily looking for wins in the next game, just looking for him to continue to grow. We may have something in him. I certainly wouldn't dump him and try to draft another qb, I'll say that.
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I've seen improvement on the field. My only wish is he'd have taken his job seriously last year. As it is, he's a rookie this year with only a few starts.
I have high hopes for him. I'm not necessarily looking for wins in the next game, just looking for him to continue to grow. We may have something in him. I certainly wouldn't dump him and try to draft another qb, I'll say that. Why would you have to dump him to draft or trade for another QB? You ARE allowed to have more than one. Dallas drafted Walsh AND Aikman. Nothing wrong with bringing in another young QB. MIGHT, MAYBE encourage Johnny to bust butt to keep his job. Or not. Either way you have two young QB's you can bring along and hopefully one of them is the answer. Right now Johnny is a HUGE question mark. So why NOT look at other guys?
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I've seen improvement on the field. My only wish is he'd have taken his job seriously last year. As it is, he's a rookie this year with only a few starts.
I have high hopes for him. I'm not necessarily looking for wins in the next game, just looking for him to continue to grow. We may have something in him. I certainly wouldn't dump him and try to draft another qb, I'll say that. Why would you have to dump him to draft or trade for another QB? You ARE allowed to have more than one. Dallas drafted Walsh AND Aikman. Nothing wrong with bringing in another young QB. MIGHT, MAYBE encourage Johnny to bust butt to keep his job. Or not. Either way you have two young QB's you can bring along and hopefully one of them is the answer. Right now Johnny is a HUGE question mark. So why NOT look at other guys? If I felt this draft had any quality QB's I'd have no problem with this. I just don't really like any of them all that much - they all seem like pretty big projects just as Johnny is. Now, if we get a GM in here that absolutely loves one of these guys I'd be OK with it too - I'd prefer to draft the best available talent wherever we end up, but I'd understand another route. I certainly won't discount that Johnny could end up crashing and burning due to partying as well, that is certainly a descent possibility. I'm willing to take the chance, others are not.
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I've seen improvement on the field. My only wish is he'd have taken his job seriously last year. As it is, he's a rookie this year with only a few starts.
I have high hopes for him. I'm not necessarily looking for wins in the next game, just looking for him to continue to grow. We may have something in him. I certainly wouldn't dump him and try to draft another qb, I'll say that. Why would you have to dump him to draft or trade for another QB? You ARE allowed to have more than one. Dallas drafted Walsh AND Aikman. Nothing wrong with bringing in another young QB. MIGHT, MAYBE encourage Johnny to bust butt to keep his job. Or not. Either way you have two young QB's you can bring along and hopefully one of them is the answer. Right now Johnny is a HUGE question mark. So why NOT look at other guys? Look all you want. We have many needs. I think JM might be an answer to one of them. Why waste a high pick on another unknown at the same spot? It really shouldn't be hard to figure out. Let's get some playmaking players and run with JM for 1 year, as opposed to taking a qb high, and having the exact same "who do we play" issues at qb.
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Everyone thinks I hate Johnny. I don't hate him. I hate tiny ben. I fear Johnny. He worries me. I fear we "commit" to him, passing on all others and then something happens. Either off the field or on it. Be it injury or a serious mistake off field. I see no reason why we shouldn't bring in some real competition for him. McCown is a stop gap, nothing more. Johnny knows that. Bring in a young talented QB to really compete for the job and one of two things will happen. Either Johnny will get the fact that he isn't guaranteed a spot and he better bust ass, or he shows his true colors and the other guy wins the job. Either way we are better off. If Johnny becomes the player everyone wants him to be.... we have a very good backup and perhaps trade bait at some point. If he doesn't and the other guy does? At least we didn't waste a lot of time on JUST Johnny. Hedge our bet. Don't put all our time and effort on just Johnny. Now, if we are SURE the BEST QB in this draft isn't worth anything, look to the 2nd round. Andy Dalton was a second round pick.... Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder.
Or trade for a QB you think can compete for the job. PUSH Johnny to either get his head in the game or show that he never will. Don't waste a lot of time finding out.
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Everyone thinks I hate Johnny. I don't hate him. I hate tiny ben. I fear Johnny. He worries me. I fear we "commit" to him, passing on all others and then something happens. Either off the field or on it. Be it injury or a serious mistake off field. I see no reason why we shouldn't bring in some real competition for him. McCown is a stop gap, nothing more. Johnny knows that. Bring in a young talented QB to really compete for the job and one of two things will happen. Either Johnny will get the fact that he isn't guaranteed a spot and he better bust ass, or he shows his true colors and the other guy wins the job. Either way we are better off. If Johnny becomes the player everyone wants him to be.... we have a very good backup and perhaps trade bait at some point. If he doesn't and the other guy does? At least we didn't waste a lot of time on JUST Johnny. Hedge our bet. Don't put all our time and effort on just Johnny. Now, if we are SURE the BEST QB in this draft isn't worth anything, look to the 2nd round. Andy Dalton was a second round pick.... Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder.
Or trade for a QB you think can compete for the job. PUSH Johnny to either get his head in the game or show that he never will. Don't waste a lot of time finding out. I don't disagree with anything you said there at all - much better than your continual "cocaine cowboy" references. Well thought out and I do not disagree with any of what you said. Nice post sir 
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I never ever called him a cocaine cowboy. I have called him Johnny Rehab.... 
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Everyone thinks I hate Johnny. I don't hate him. I hate tiny ben. I fear Johnny. He worries me. I fear we "commit" to him, passing on all others and then something happens. Either off the field or on it. Be it injury or a serious mistake off field. I see no reason why we shouldn't bring in some real competition for him. McCown is a stop gap, nothing more. Johnny knows that. Bring in a young talented QB to really compete for the job and one of two things will happen. Either Johnny will get the fact that he isn't guaranteed a spot and he better bust ass, or he shows his true colors and the other guy wins the job. Either way we are better off. If Johnny becomes the player everyone wants him to be.... we have a very good backup and perhaps trade bait at some point. If he doesn't and the other guy does? At least we didn't waste a lot of time on JUST Johnny. Hedge our bet. Don't put all our time and effort on just Johnny. Now, if we are SURE the BEST QB in this draft isn't worth anything, look to the 2nd round. Andy Dalton was a second round pick.... Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder.
Or trade for a QB you think can compete for the job. PUSH Johnny to either get his head in the game or show that he never will. Don't waste a lot of time finding out. I don't disagree with anything you said there at all - much better than your continual "cocaine cowboy" references. Well thought out and I do not disagree with any of what you said. Nice post sir thats me. and it comes with thorough disgust that after he got demoted he missed weight training. te punk will never learn what it is to be a leader and what it takes to be a successful nfl quarterback. done with the cocaine cowboy.....
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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I never ever called him a cocaine cowboy. I have called him Johnny Rehab.... Sorry man, thought you were pblack. My bad.
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thats me. and it comes with thorough disgust that after he got demoted he missed weight training. te punk will never learn what it is to be a leader and what it takes to be a successful nfl quarterback.
done with the cocaine cowboy..... He looks like a pretty good leader on the field to me, as well as on the sidelines. The guy is a winner, I think you may end up being surprised. He loves football, there is no doubt about that - he brings a level of excitement we have not seen on the field since the 80's. I'm willing to give the guy a chance, we'll leave it at that.
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If you are "done" w/him, then maybe you will shut the hell up about him and we won't have to read your crap about him anymore. Guys, I don't like dictating what a thread should look like, but this was supposed to be about the game and the team.......not JUST Johnny. And at least Johnny is playing, unlike the thief Haden, who signed a big contract and is stealing money. LOL.........that should help change the direction of the conversation. 
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....as long as you don't start in on "false start Joe Thomas", we should be ok.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
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With improved talent, the defense can definitely shine --- you just need a lot of talent. It's high risk, high reward. Like the Bills? I think people overestimated Bills secondary. Me included. As for the Saints, you tell me where the talent is on that defense to run any type of defensive scheme. Browns played more talented teams this year than last. Obviously it exposed weaknesses. On top of that, you removed the best CB. Gipson is not playing up to last years level. Most likely hurt or not fully recovered from last year. How much different has Browns defense played compared to last several prior schemes? They struggle against short pass and run. If you watched Seattle how their safeties and corners work together, you never see it in Cleveland. Baltimore ran that defense with average to above average corners. They had pro bowl safety. It is not like Cleveland's safeties are weak. Something is not right with the secondary group. Is it reason to switch schemes bringing all new defense coaches? Again, that tune was played over and over the last ten years. Think about it all it does is get fans upset their favorite player was let go bringing in guys HC and GM think are better fits. When it doesn't work perfect, it's time to tear it down and retry. Sometimes it easier fixing then rebuilding from scratch.
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Everyone thinks I hate Johnny. I don't hate him. I hate tiny ben. I fear Johnny. He worries me. I fear we "commit" to him, passing on all others and then something happens. Either off the field or on it. Be it injury or a serious mistake off field. I see no reason why we shouldn't bring in some real competition for him. McCown is a stop gap, nothing more. Johnny knows that. Bring in a young talented QB to really compete for the job and one of two things will happen. Either Johnny will get the fact that he isn't guaranteed a spot and he better bust ass, or he shows his true colors and the other guy wins the job. Either way we are better off. If Johnny becomes the player everyone wants him to be.... we have a very good backup and perhaps trade bait at some point. If he doesn't and the other guy does? At least we didn't waste a lot of time on JUST Johnny. Hedge our bet. Don't put all our time and effort on just Johnny. Now, if we are SURE the BEST QB in this draft isn't worth anything, look to the 2nd round. Andy Dalton was a second round pick.... Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder.
Or trade for a QB you think can compete for the job. PUSH Johnny to either get his head in the game or show that he never will. Don't waste a lot of time finding out. Agreed. Bring in someone to compete with Johnny (not necessarily with the first round pick since we need talent). Tell him specifically that he either wins the job or will be 3rd string. He either gets his ass in gear or he doesn't. Do what you need to do to get some talent for this guy (or whoever) to work with.
After 55 years, I'm walking away from this dumpster fire. Good luck to everyone who continues to hang on. You'll need it.
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The problem with the defense is that we're outsmarting ourselves. So are the Bills, their players are complaining about the scheme as well. We're playing way too slow and allowing offenses to pick us alive. I know our corners are playing like crap, but we do need to start applying more pressure. The scheme has gone rotten for now.
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Don't want more QB drama by drafting one high. Go into 2016 with Johnny as the clear-cut no.1 (presuming he doesn't screw up mightily in the offseason.) and let's roll with it.
If he is terrible we will draft one on 2017.
REF PLEASE DELETE. WRONG THREAD , CAN NOT DELETE sorry
Last edited by lampdogg; 12/22/15 10:44 PM.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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The problem with the defense is that we're outsmarting ourselves. So are the Bills, their players are complaining about the scheme as well. We're playing way too slow and allowing offenses to pick us alive. I know our corners are playing like crap, but we do need to start applying more pressure. The scheme has gone rotten for now. Hard getting pressure when QB has 3 seconds to complete a 5-10 yard pass. Complaining players obviously don't fit the scheme. Reason they need replacing. It's not saying they're bad. Simply they don't feel comfortable and can't make the team successful.
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault.
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault. The Bills had the 4th defense in points and yards last season. This season they are 17th in points and 21st in yards.
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault. Understand. But, you hire a coach for his expertise. Why waste it making him do something different? Interesting question. Hire a coach to fit the players or players to fit the coach? Which option creates most success in the long run?
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~ Legend
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They stopped running a hyperaggressive 4-3. Most importantly they stopped blitzing their best pass rusher, opting to drop him into coverage. That kinda sounds familiar, but I'm not sure from where...
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault. The Bills had the 4th defense in points and yards last season. This season they are 17th in points and 21st in yards. Remember Marrone quit. Bills ownership forced to change.
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault. The Bills had the 4th defense in points and yards last season. This season they are 17th in points and 21st in yards. Remember Marrone quit. Bills ownership forced to change. Marrone didn't run the defense. Schwartz did.
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Actually during camp there was an article stating how Manziel was the first in the house (car in lot) and the last to leave. So you are making stuff up from incidents in 2014.
Your post describing posters and their opinions is again nothing what they have opined here n the board. But it makes your opinion seem to be better in your eyes of course. Some of these posters are unfamiliar with your posting style. I tolerate it as long as you don't make up stuff that you will state is my opinion. But don't expect love from all even though it Christmas time...lol 
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Everyone thinks I hate Johnny. I don't hate him. I hate tiny ben. I fear Johnny. He worries me. I fear we "commit" to him, passing on all others and then something happens. Either off the field or on it. Be it injury or a serious mistake off field. I see no reason why we shouldn't bring in some real competition for him. McCown is a stop gap, nothing more. Johnny knows that. Bring in a young talented QB to really compete for the job and one of two things will happen. Either Johnny will get the fact that he isn't guaranteed a spot and he better bust ass, or he shows his true colors and the other guy wins the job. Either way we are better off. If Johnny becomes the player everyone wants him to be.... we have a very good backup and perhaps trade bait at some point. If he doesn't and the other guy does? At least we didn't waste a lot of time on JUST Johnny. Hedge our bet. Don't put all our time and effort on just Johnny. Now, if we are SURE the BEST QB in this draft isn't worth anything, look to the 2nd round. Andy Dalton was a second round pick.... Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder.
Or trade for a QB you think can compete for the job. PUSH Johnny to either get his head in the game or show that he never will. Don't waste a lot of time finding out.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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The best coaches work with their players, not against them. If they can't win with Mario Williams and Marcell Dareus then it's the coach's fault. The Bills had the 4th defense in points and yards last season. This season they are 17th in points and 21st in yards. Remember Marrone quit. Bills ownership forced to change. Marrone didn't run the defense. Schwartz did. I wonder how Bills parted with Schwartz? When you answer that question, you'll know why Bills are changing personal to fit a new defensive scheme. Because of the transition, it is why the defense went from 4th to 17th.
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Forums The Archives 2015 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 13 Seahawks
30 Re: The Good, The Bad, and The
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