DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cavs Regular Season Continued

Lebron just isn't a top 10 player anymore bottom line, he never worked an any other part of his game. So he can't shoot or post like Jordan could, so now everything suffers. I also think Blatt don't make it till end of year if this keeps up. He's a huge part of the problem. The Thompson contract is turning out to be just what I said, an albatross. He's a very average player and can't defend rim and has no offense. He gets more than draymon that's I have to say about that. We have to make some moves to fix this team.

Name me 10 players that are better than him.

I think that's called hyperbole.

I think that Lebron is still stuck in "gotta do it all" mode from last year in the playoffs.

He, almost single-handedly, kept the team alive in the finals.

This season we have missed Kyrie, Shump, and had a laundry list of other guys with injuries. (such as Moz being less than 100% following surgery) I think that Lebron has felt that he has had to do a lot himself.

Hopefully, as we work everyone back into the lineup, he'll be able to get back into the regular flow of the offense.

Yes it's to an extent hyperbole. Meaning he's not as dominant as he once was, but he still tries to be and it hurts the offense. He needs help for sure but when you're dominating the ball 85% of the possession it doesn't allow anyone else to get going. Blatt and his rotations have a lot to do with it. He needs to settle on them quickly so people get used to playing their role.

You also were going to bet me that both Andy and Sasha would get more minutes than TT.

I think your takes on TT are absurd.

Depends. Are you talking all-time, as in for his entire career (because then I'd argue he's by far the best in the NBA) or are we talking right now today (because I can give you 10...actually 11)?

Steph Curry
Kawhi Leonard
Kevin Durant
Anthony Davis
Klay Thompson
James Harden
John Wall
Karl-Anthony Towns
Russell Westbrook
Draymond Green
Paul George

I think the first 4 on the list are no-brainer better than LBJ right now. The other 7 could be debatable, but based on how LeBron is playing right NOW I think they'd all rank above him.

Also worth noting, LeBron is by far the oldest of anybody on this list. Fact of the matter is he's on the downswing of his career, especially considering the amount of NBA minutes on his body. No shame in that, it just is what it is. He can't be the greatest forever...and he's not anymore.

Kyrie needs to quickly re-establish himself as LeBron's #2 who can become our #1 for the next 5-6 years, most likely as soon as this post-season or next year at the latest or we're in a world of trouble.

And I think yours are. i thought we moved past this..TT isn't worth his contract. sorry. I said Andy not sasha. Andy really should be but blatt has proven to be inept with his rotations. At least Andy plays Defense and can shoot. TT is horrible, can't shoot, can't hit his free throws and can't defend the rim. You start signing 80+ million dollar contracts you need to produce he hasn't..7ppg 10 rebounds padded by a couple big rebounding games when you average it out he's about 7/9. I'd take Draymond Green every single day over thompson. But TT aside, theres bigger issues on the team. It starts with the Blatt/Lebron dynamic. This is what everyone feared would happen. This team can't play together, the pieces don't fit because Blatt can't make them fit because he keeps dicking with the lineups and rotations. He needs to pick one and run it for a month and see. Now that everyone is healthy he doesn't get a pass..he needs to figure it out.

26, 6, 8 with a 26 PER and playing some of the best defense of his career and he's not a top 10 player?


I think I understand why some of you guys post on just a predominanently Cleveland fan website. You'd get laughed at on other sites with different multiple fanbases that don't overreact.

I agree with most of that list. If lebron had actually worked on learning to shoot with good form, learned to play the post, he could have been quite dominant for a few more years..now he pounds the ball and struggles to take people off the dribble.. He's not getting the calls he used to and its starting to frustrate him. The sooner he realizes he needs to evolve the sooner we can move forward. Kyrie from last year was better than lebron this year..not sure wtf happened to irving so far..lol, he really looks scared and don't trust the knee yet, i think about another month and he'll be back in form. But kyrie needs to be the first option, love the second and lebron the 3rd..both those guy have better scoring ability than lebron right now.

actually statistically he's play the worst of his career defensively, and yeah he's putting up decent numbers, but from a game impacting standpoint, he has impacted quite a bit trending negatively with his play and offense killing. Why would anyone thats a cleveland fan post on other websites...thats pretty dumb. I hate to tell you, just about every fan base overreacts. Its not overreacting when you actually watch the games and know what you're watching..sounds like you just read goespn stats and think its gospel or reflects everything about the player. Lebron has been shut down hard by quite a few people he used to pretty much have his way with. he still gets his points by being inefficient and high volume at times. He's getting old..not a big deal.. My point in the original post is he needs to evolve and let others help him. He's not doing that consistently enough...part his fault and part blatts fault for not putting the right rotations around him.

His 25.9 PER is currently 5th in the NBA and it's a country-mile behind the top 4 of Curry, Westbrook, Durant and Leonard. He's also right on par with Davis and Harden.

Win-shares/48 he's 9th.

Wish I could quickly find his RAPM ranking.

Point being, he's certainly still a "top" player, but I don't think it's out of the question to say he's not a top 5 and arguably not top 10 anymore.

exactly, not like anyone's calling him ricky davis, but he's fallen off, he's shooting sub 50% and turning the ball over 4 per game..bottom line is, he can't be "the" guy 100% of the time anymore...not going to be able to ride him into the dirt and win a championship..at this point things need to transition where he's not being asked to do everything

His RAPM has him 4th fyi

After the first four on that list, it's not debateable, it's laughable.

Draymomd Green? Really? If people can't understand he's a JAG on any other team, I don't know what to tell you. And to even think he's better than LeBron is absurd. Klay Thompson? Paul George? Wow.

I get the stupidity I read daily on here on the Browns, but I don't expect to find it in the Cavs thread since it's a much smaller group of folks that I thought understood basketball, but that list is the most dumb thing I've ever seen. I'm not surprised by who posted it, but leadtheway, while a hyperbolist, at least knows about basketball. Why would you support such garbage?

I'm sorry I didn't realize I had to slob Johnny to make my opinion worth something in your eyes, but thanks though.

Anybody who can't see that the 30 year old version of LeBron is nowhere near where he used to be, and that a group (5-10) of younger players are now his equal or better than him are fooling themselves.

By the way, Draymond Green gives LeBron FITS defensively because LeBron can't drive around him nor is he strong enough to go through him. All that while almost averaging a triple-double offensively and being 5+ years younger.

Yes I think Green will end his career basically being a LeBron light. The guy outside of Curry and Davis who really flies under the radar though is Kawhi.

He'd be a shoe-in for MVP this year if it weren't for the crazy run Curry and the Warriors are on.

If you think Draymond Green is a JAG, I'd hate to see what you think of Kevin Love.

If you put Green on a different team, do you believe he would be as effective as he is now?

I know you didn't ask me but I think he would, yes.

He obviously benefits from having two shooters in Thompson and Curry who can space the floor so well for him since he doesn't have a great jump shot, but then again you can say the same thing for LeBron. LeBron needs shooters to space the floor for him to be the most successful as well.

I think Green would bring his inside/mid-range game, passing, rebounding, defense and toughness to any team though. That's why I think he'll end up a LeBron-lite because of his such well rounded and multi-dimensional skill set.

I believe if Green wasn't surrounded by athletic defensive wings, he'd be a prime better passing Brandon Bass type of player.

Bass can rebound a little and shoot from the elbow. Green can guard three positions, run the offense, rebound, pass, and make three pointers.

He also happens to be on the perfect team to compliment his abilities.

Depends on how you define JAG. Kevin Love has been the best player on his team. The team didn't go anywhere, but he was their best player.

Green is a complimentary basketball player. Do you think any GM would start and build their team around a Draymond Green? I mean can we be serious. Do you think a GM would build their team around a Klay Thompson? This would make more sense than Green but you would be talking about a perennial first round exiting team every year. There were only four guys on that list that you could build a team around and have a legit shot to win a championship. And that's the type of player that LeBron is. Still. So let's be realistic in our comparisons.

I get it that it's somewhat cool for some to always be the naysayer toward your own team's players. And it's perfectly fine to be critical...heck, I've been critical of LeBron just a few posts back. But exaggerating for a point is just dumb. It really is. It rings of a lack of intelligence or at a mimimum the need to always put someone down.

This team needs to realize it can't slack and decide to pick it up when time starts to dwindle down.

Where the heck is the heart and effort? It's hard watching any Cleveland sports team these days.

I hate these late night games. 9pm? Blah...

Phoenix lost to Philly.


This should be a blow out.

Cavs are shooting 62% and have 11 3's at half. Much better offensively tonight. Phoenix is just gunning it.

They don't bother me.

It may not show up in the box score, but JR Smith has been amazingly clutch tonight. When he plays smart, we're tough to beat.

That Irving three was intense. I thought for sure it'd be late. Such a quick shot. #clutch

That shot by JR from the very corner was NASTY! Just sick!! Irving is also looking better and better.

These t-shirt uniforms/jerseys are just stupid...

Cavs are putting on a clinic tonight. Looks like the 3 day rest did them some good.

Orlando is never going to want to play the Cavaliers ever again. lol

104-79 tonight.

111-76 last month

117-103 in their "close game", back in November.

How many 3 point shooters did Orlando foul tonight? It was insane.

If you notice GS are starting to hurt, eventhough they are still winning, Curry, Klay, are getting dinged, stay tunned

It was at least five times... I'm glad to see we were good at the foul line because yeah, Orlando kept fouling haha. Frustration was building up big time..

It was 5. Someone, I think Jefferson, missed all 3 of his shots after getting fouled on a 3.

Took my oldest to the game, our first time at a Cavs game. What a blast. Having the casino right there made driving pretty difficult.

Man I keep telling myself if we are healthy for the playoffs we beat GW...I wonder if GW even get past the Spurs

Come on playoffs just get here already...GO CAVS

As absurd as this sounds, Spurs are only 3 games behind the Warriors. Golden State really can't afford guys to be banged up.

Nope nope..... keep the season grinding along.
Let GS wear themselves down while the Cavs go smoothly through doing only what they need to in order to reach the post-season.