DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Farmer/Pettine fired

I'm not defending any of them...FO..Coaches..or players. To be quite honest Haslem created this mess by mismatching a HC/GM that had never worked together because he had a panic attack over Banner/Lombardi. I defend none of them, and (again if any of the stuff that is being said is true) think they all acted quite unprofessionally....including Bowe, Manziel, and Gilbert.

A complete reboot was probably a neccessity because the Con-Man screwed up the way he went about canning Chud, Banner, and Lombardi. Personal preference aside (I would have kept all of them), but who fires the HC lets the FO pick new HC, and then fires the FO and picks a new GM without HC involved in the process??? This was doomed from the start. Individually Pettine or Farmer might have been good people, but collectively it was toxic and that's on the Con-Man.

The funny part is look at how he is setting it up now, and it is just like the Banner/Lombardi/Chud setup. So the good news is he realizes he screwed up. The bad news is he set us back years by not just letting Banner/Lombardi/Chud do there jobs in the first place.

Btw...I'm not arguing on the validiity of the reports on Pet. I understand those that think these guys got a bad rap. My opinion is that the organization was so toxic (caused by the Con-Man essentially) that these guys had to go.....but that's just my opinion.

That's the solution right there. You said it better than I could have. Somebody on here named about 4 legendary head coaches who started out with worse records than Pettine. I remember Laundry, Noll and Jimmy Johnson, forget the other one. Noll started winning at one point. Then he had a couple of real bad years. They stuck with him and he started winning again.

Totally agree with your first statement above. Totally understand the second one.

Wrong choice of words ddub. I should have said the believability is up to the individual. Again, the two guys I mention (Adkins and Rueter) are two guys I trust, but they are wrong at times as well. So whether Pettine didn't play players out of spite is something I'm not comfortable saying, bu I do agree with those guys that the relationship between Farmer/Pettine was so toxic and unprofessional that both had to go

Their relationship was obviously a bad one. I'm seeing the blow-up as necessary as well. I just so much hate to see it that it pisses me off.

Same, but I'm now past the point of even remotely caring.
I was ambivalent about it two regime changes ago. This last one I merely had a doubter's wait-&-see viewpoint.

Now?
I simply don't care what they do, or who they hire. I can reason and understand my way through all of it, but I am absolutely detached, devoid of any emotion or self-investment in it. It's more a thing of curiosity than anything at this stage.... like watching a fly squirm and wriggle in a spider web.

Damn Ive been trying to think of the words of why I'm still following whats going on...and you just gave them to me thanks.

I agree. We will never be any good resetting every 3 years.

Mike Pettine in Person = classy guy. Say what you want to about him as a Head Coach but as a person he is wonderful.

A rather depressing day. Haslam cleans house so he could put a lawyer in charger of the roster. Then I have to go to work and listen to all the Broncos fans being happy about clinching the #1 seed.

Oh well, I guess the bright side is my Sundays will be free next football seasons. I'm not paying to watch the crap Jimmy is putting on the field. I'll catch the one or 2 games that hit the local stations.

Well, we have the "fail a LOT" part down.

I am going to say this again.

If the reports by these media guys are true, why did Pet play Shelton, Orchard, Erving, Starks, Meder, Crow, Duke, Bitonio, Hartline, Barnidge, Cooper, Desir, Gaines, McCown, etc, etc????

Gilber has issues. Manziel has issues. Bowe has issues. Who the hell can deny that?

The notion of Pet trying to spite Farmer by not playing Farmer's guys is preposterous. There is absolutely no proof of it. There is not any real evidence of it. And I don't give a rat's butt who the hell said it.........they are either clueless, lying, or trying to stir things up.

The truth is obvious. Pet played the guys he thought were buying into the system, working the hardest, and performing when called upon. He may have made some mistakes, but anyone saying he was trying to spite Farmer is full of crap!

Yeah, I have to agree with you. Pettine played the guys he thought were working the hardest, and gave us the best chance to win games.

[img:left]https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hph...amp;oe=570CAD7D[/img]

As I said above, I don't believe that Pettine didn't play certain guys out of spite. I was just pointing out some reporters had alluded that he had. I do agree with those guys that the organization had become so dysfunctional and toxic that everyone had to go. Brown fired the top heads of scouting today to pretty much complete the cleanup.

I'm most upset that we are going back to a setup that JH3 had in place three years ago but blew up because he was stupid....had really quality people in those roles as well imo.

I think that Pettine did not play them because they were not any better than the other options.

Why the Cleveland Browns are firing Mike Pettine
233

By Conor Orr
Around The NFL Writer
Published: Jan. 3, 2016 at 08:25 a.m.
Updated: Jan. 3, 2016 at 08:28 p.m.



Why the Cleveland Browns are firing Mike Pettine
233

By Conor Orr
Around The NFL Writer
Published: Jan. 3, 2016 at 08:25 a.m.
Updated: Jan. 3, 2016 at 08:28 p.m.

Browns head coach Mike Pettine will be removed of his duties following Sunday's finale against the Steelers, according to NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport.

But the why -- Pettine was believed by some to be safe just a few weeks ago -- is almost as jarring.

Per Rapoport, Pettine told players in a Saturday night speech before playing the Bengals on Sunday, Dec. 6, that he was likely going to be fired, and that his players did not do their part in the matter.

Another example? With his team down at halftime against Kansas City last weekend, Pettine told the players in the locker room that he guaranteed they would come back and win the game. Most simply rolled their eyes and the Browns lost, 17-13.

Sadly, stories like these are the genesis behind yet another Browns hiring cycle. Pettine replaced one-year head coach Rob Chudzinski who replaced two-year head coach Pat Shurmur. Shurmur replaced two-year head coach Eric Mangini.

By the time Pettine went into Browns owner Jimmy Haslam's office on Friday to ask if he was safe, Haslam had already started the process of looking for a new coach, Rapoport said. Haslam did not tell Pettine whether or not he was safe.

Cleveland has not had a coach finish his tenure with a winning record since Marty Schottenheimer back in 1988. They have not had a candidate last more than 65 games since Bill Belichick in 1995. If Pettine's firing also means the ouster of general manager Ray Farmer as reports suggest, Farmer will leave having only made two of his four first-round draft picks over two years. As Rapoport mentioned,

Johnny Manziel was a Haslam decision and cornerback Justin Gilbert was a hand-picked prospect by Pettine.

The four picks represented a chance for the organization to start over and dull a bit of the fan unrest over the last two decades of football in Cleveland. Instead, it just contributed to another regime change.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...ng-mike-pettine

I believe they weren't played due to the issues that Vers mentioned. I find it hard to believe an awake Gilbert (good grief) that was motivated to get better isn't better than Bademosi. The guy had the physical abilities to at least be better than that, but football isn't important to him and he's a screw up....same goes with Johnny and Bowe...meatheads. The common theme with those three is that they loved other things more than football.

In my opinion Pettine is a coach who wanted guys to earn time in practice and the meeting rooms....those three were busy doing other things. I blame Pettine for his part in this mess (and believe he needed firing) but I don't blame him for these three I blame the players.

Unfortunately we are going to have to gut a lot of people out of this organization to fix it.....including those already gone and players such as "Billy" to clean up this mess.

wow..that hurts

What hurts more is that we fired a coach after a 10-6 season...

Pettine said it's a game of numbers.
How or why he couldn't get the W's can and will be debated here forever.
Like Win Ugly and Lost w/ Heart it's still obviously W-L that tell the tale. Pettine didn't have enough W's. Pettine goes...he knew it.
Farmer picked some horrible talent.... Farmer fought w/ Pettine... made the Owner and Organization look bad....not enough W's ......Farmer goes.

It looks like this time, HOPEFULLY, Haslam is attempting to do things a bit more logically. I don't know if working w/ Brown first is the best course but you have to start from some point and work out.
Start w/ someone Haslam can work w/ and trusts and build a group that is, and MAN I hate this term, "On the Same Page".
Each is responsible for a defined area of operations.
The defined part is crucial. This HAS to be Stated VERY Clearly.

Here's a Sashi Brown article.
After 26 pages of comments I can't remember if I saw this link here or not.

http://chronicle.northcoastnow.com/2016/...nfl-experience/

I thought I remembered reading that the deal will be we will hire a HC then they get to help in the GM search and hiring.
This confirms it IF this is or is quoting a good source.

BTW I have been a Fan since the 60's.
And yes now I am in my 60's....lol!
I saw Jim Brown play at my first game.

Am I sick of this Sh..... YES!
Will I leave them.... NO!
But Sunday's are not my focus any more.
I tape the Games and pretty much fast forward through them.
I find College Ball a Whole lot more fun to watch these days.
I Hate That!

The head-hunter Haslem hired to help pick the coach calls it "alignment". I like that better than "On the Same Page".

Alignment being everyone of a common philosophy with well defined roles.

Agreed.

More indications that Pettine wanted Gilbert and Farmer needed the testicular fortitude to own the draft room and go with what his personnel team identified as the best players.

Sad.

Who is the person making those quotes? Someone who is employed by the Browns?

Good information. Who are these quotes from?

Reading this it's sad to think what we could have had instead of what we now have. What's worse is that we had the these players like Mack and Watkins evaluated correctly. As a Browns fan it's frustrating and it hurts.

It's sad if they are true. I don't see any person's name attached to those quotes.

Your right Vers but I just took the position that they are true. Imagine, we would have a guy on D we could build around who may become our D leader as well as a stud WR AND we wouldn't have all this drama with Gilbert and JM. Sad and frustrating.

I agree that both were bad picks. I just don't know if I believe if we were set to make those moves.

One other thing I noticed while researching the other day. The Vikings took Anthony Barr one pick after we took Gilber. I think he certainly would have helped us even if we still had the trade down.