DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Why aren’t we calling the Oregon occupiers ‘terrorists?’

more grouping, and labeling...imagine my surprise

Obviously all people that are the same race think the same, right. You call out others for doing it, yet you yourself do it almost everyday on this board.

1. I'm going to throw out the use of the word "stormed", lol! That is so much made-up drama, it's ridiculous. It's the media throwing an exciting slant on things. I'd bet money that they simply drove up and casually parked and then got out of their vehicles and walked up to what was a completely empty building. So, we're throwing out the theatrics.

2. Permits for what cattle... they brought cattle with them to Oregon and have illegal bovine? The permit issues in Nevada have no bearing on this... try to keep focus.

3. This is the one and ONLY point of contention... however, as your own text directs, please see subsection (d), specifically item subsection (d)(3).

"(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes."

They are in an Open-carry state, thus carrying their firearms is a lawful purpose.


So, again.... what laws are they breaking RIGHT NOW by being there and doing what they are doing?

I don't think that there always has to be violence to be terrorism.

Imagine a group, God forbid, blows up a school somewhere. Then they call in bomb threats, or otherwise threaten 30 schools the next day. Are those 30 incidents "terrorism"?

I think so.

That said, I don't know if this case rises to the level of terrorism. They took over a building, but I haven't seen where they threatened to kill innocent persons. I think that what they are doing is criminal, but I don't think that it rises to terror.

Even if they hold hostages, do we automatically label a group in the Middle East that takes hostages as "terrorists"? I don't believe that most people do. I think that there has to be a mass threat against people in order for it to be terror.

Has this group done this? If so, I haven't heard it.

I think you might be trying to combine 2 separate issues?

They are somewhat related, but they are also different.

Being on Fed. property is one issue.

Cattle permits that aren't paid for is a separate issue.

Just my take here.

I liken this whole thing to that church of whackos and their protesting of, well... pretty much everything, that pretty much everyone hates and wants to bump off....


Nobody likes them, nobody likes what they do... BUT, they are careful to do it legally. Until they actually break the law, you just sit back and let them have their moment and hope the news stops giving them their 15 minutes of fame.

None which is what I asked from the beginning...and you summed up my points I was going to make very well.

And 1 thing to remember Swish...this also a civil issue even if your not recognizing it as one....and they are absolutely doing their patriotic duty.

I'll support any American who isnt breaking the law hell maybe even if they do..but push back against the government taking more and more control.

Also I said this earlier in the thread...you keep talking about ...they said they'll fight to the death...and I asked you what else would they say?? gee we are going to fold at the first sign of pressure?? We are going to fold like a cheap tent?? well that language and position wont help when they are involved in the next dispute now will it.

I dont think anyones dying but stranger things have happened.
and people are getting sick of the government over reaching power and I believe we will see more serious situations because of that.

They have broken the law, watched video of one of them admitting it last night. He was worried about federal warrants that were rumored to have been issued for their arrest.

Show the video or could you direct it to me please...being worried about the feds trumping up some bullcrap warrants and admitting on tv or video of breaking the laws are very different things.

You would have to be a certain kind of stupid to admit to breaking the law on video...not saying your wrong I'd like to see it with my own eyes/ears.

Was just doing a little checking. Actually the group Oath Keepers do not support this action. Thought you may like to know. Here's the title and the link........

Oath Keepers, sheriff denounce militia occupation

http://www.capitalpress.com/Oregon/20160104/oath-keepers-sheriff-denounce-militia-occupation

Thanks Pit..you saved me a phone call..to get answers directly from the horses mouth...I didnt believe they was breaking the law for 1 second.

Again Thanks Pit.

i just wanna see the responses, specifically from posters that i've been battling in this thread with.

so they aren't terrorist right? ok.just gonna use the parameters you guys have put forth in this thread, btw.

scenario time:

i was in the military. me and my friends decide to start training in the back woods somewhere, and we now call ourselves a militia.

some unarmed guy gets shot. doesn't matter the color. we are tired of cops shooting unarmed people who didn't actively threaten their lives. for the sake of fairness, which in real life happens to everybody, we will call the guy who got killed white. so this isn't race baiting.

me and my friends decide that enough is enough, we are tired of the cops shooting people.

we storm the courthouse.....nevermind, we storm the federal building in downtown cleveland on East 9th armed with assault rifles and shotguns, we kick everybody out, nobody gets hurt, but we tell the news that we will fight, if need be, to the death.

we send a list of demands to the feds, demanding so and so gets done.

my militia? we are muslims, and i then make an announcement saying allah told me to do this mission.

so, two part question:

do you consider us terrorist?

and, be realistic too, what would the majority of the country and media be calling us?

Eve has tried and tried to be patient and teach you but anything short of her beating you with a stick apparently won't work.

so you gonna answer or continue dodging like you do everything else, putin supporter?

Do me a favor... take your list of actions and compare it to what they've done, taking into consideration location and laws and go down your list of proposed actions and list the differences.

I can absolutely do this for you, but I want you to show me that you understand why what they are doing is not illegal (yet), and why what you are proposing IS illegal.

you didn't answer the question.

are we terrorist or not?

You'd absolutely be considered terrorists.

and why is that

Because you announced you are Muslim on a mission from Allah

but the guys in oregon announced they are on a mission from god.

that just makes them the Blues Brothers.


And yes, the act of taking a building by force makes you criminals. I don't know if I'd slap the "terrorist" label on that - I think that label gets thrown around WAY too freely these days, but it definitely makes you criminal.

does anyone actually feel terror from this event? I've heard snickering and scenes heads shaking as to question the waste of effort.

Still they haven't made anyone scared or terrified. To me that alone means they are not terrorists.

No one has been harmed that I know of either during the occupation of an abandoned/unused building.

I think at worst you can call them overzealous protestors but more people have gotten hurt at gay rights parades by gays than anything these guys are doing so no I don't think they are terrorists at least no more so than our founding fathers thought was ok to be:


“What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance. Let them take arms.” -Thomas Jefferson to James Madison

“Firearms stand next in importance to the constitution itself. They are the American people’s liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... from the hour the Pilgrims landed to the present day, events, occurrences and tendencies prove that to ensure peace security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable ... the very atmosphere of firearms anywhere restrains evil interference — they deserve a place of honor with all that’s good.” - George Washington

“To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them.” - Richard Henry Lee American Statesman, 1788

Well said Razor and I love the quotes you posted, very American!

But some will say they are outdated

Like you and me Bud, old and true are never outdated.

I consider the guys in Oregon domestic terrorists. They are holding federal land hostage at gun point threatening violence while taking the law into their own hands.

Of course you do.

Your hero Putin would have dusted them by now.

You and Swish are like two peas in a pod.

Because White Americans aren't terrorists.

Everyone knows terrorists are from the middle east.

This is the most sense you've ever made, friend.

Yes, we can let White people slide on this one since it was them that gave us nearly everything we have. A Nation, a Constitution, most of our laws, on and on.

Mesopotamia says hi.

The White American Boston Bombers weren't terrorists?

I either missed the joke...or its crap like this and throw long's comment as to why race issues in this country may never get fixed

If I missed the joke forgive the post...if not here is another

There are plenty of people who can claim America as their home either by birth or by naturalization... but their allegiance is somewhere else. These Chechens were not Americans.

Regardless of your complaint, they had American citizenship. That makes them Americans.

For anyone interested..

http://news.yahoo.com/militia-groups-meet-leaders-oregon-occupation-pledge-support-001804102.html

General Reply:

I almost can't believe Swish said that if these guys popped the cops if they went in, that the cops would be innocent! Can never tell if he's high or sober when he posts! Just messin' with ya Swish.

But I have to admit Swish has a point on this. I'm not so sure how much the racial component plays in to it, but in terms of their statements, I don't know that it would be a far distance for them to be labeled as "terrorists".

To answer your question though Swish, I think the reason why they haven't been labeled as such to a great degree is because they have occupied a place that no one really gives a damn about and their presence has no actual impact on anyone. They aren't blocking a highway, they aren't taking over a mall, they aren't over running local police precincts.

If #BLM held a protest in the parking lot of an abandoned amusement park, no one would care. By taking over an unoccupied building in the middle of the wilderness, they've essentially made themselves irrelevant.

Now if these guys block a highway, or try to over run a police station... I don't think #BLM would mind if the MRAPs and such all came out lol

Purpl... in regards to your point about We The People and the property being owned by them (us) so there is really no crime being committed... When people take that tact, it reminds me of when people say "Well I pay your salary". Yes, your taxes contribute to my paycheck, but that doesn't somehow make you my employer and there for give you the ability to just tell me I have to do something and I should be compelled to do it. If that were the case, only stupid people would get arrested because by that logic they can tell me not to arrest them. Yes, public buildings are built/maintained by We The People... but even so, you don't just get to wander around any military base, or police station, or court house 24/7. If there are posted hours that the building is open for use, than anyone on that property outside those hours is trespassing. Depending when and how they got in, it could also be breaking and entering. In either case, I don't think it merits a felony level charge if anyone is charged.

FBHO- Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the Oath Keepers primarily made up of current and/or retired law enforcement and other first responders? If also recall correctly, a number of them went to Ferguson and stood armed guard over several businesses during the riots.

One important line that these people haven't crossed that doesn't get them labeled terrorists is that they haven't killed anyone. Terrorists kill without warning.

So you call people out inferring racism, then you use the term "rednecks" and give a link about "hillbillies"

Kinda hypocritical if you ask me.