DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum How Johnny Manziel failed his last great audition

In other words, just do what he did last year at this time.

Like if he said something along these lines?

"I would like to thank my family, friends, the Browns organization, my teammates and Browns fans everywhere for your patience, understanding and support during my stay at Caron," the NFL star said in a statement on Friday. "The doctors and staff have been amazing and what I've learned in the last couple of months has been tremendous. I owe private apologies to a lot of people that I disappointed but a very public one to the Browns organization and the fans that I let down. I take full responsibility for my actions and it's my intention to work very hard to regain everyone's trust and respect. I understand that will take time and will only happen through what I do and not what I say."

This is a shot I didn't want to take, out of respect, but it looks like a good way to start.

I guess it would be possible, it's possible, for a coach to screw up a quarterback worse than Mike Pettine did to Johnny -- but its not likely.

Stetson, that was a great post.

Nice return.

But it supports my case. So thanks.

Jimmy and his lieutenant minions need to figure this out.

People don't just go and break their habits because they attend rehab one time. It usually takes a while.

Not sure LeBron's marketing agency handled Johnny, and gave him the best of advice.

Mike Pettine never handled him correctly on the field. Pettine got it terribly wrong.

It's hard to deny that. Hard to argue against it.

There are different ways to handle things. Pettine handled Johnny his own way and it was a disaster.

Other coaches would have managed him a lot differently.

To some degree, The Browns owe him.

They understood when they drafted him they needed to make sure he had good people around him. That is a no-brainer.

Let's face it. When Johnny reported to the Cleveland Browns they weren't ready to know what to do. They were unprepared. They had no experience with developing a quarterback.

Mike Pettine had no idea how to handle a situation like that, especially with a quarterback. At least it looks like he had no idea what to do, or how to go about it. The way he handled it from day one in training camp, Johnny's rookie year, was hard to understand.

At least to me it was. In many ways it always appeared that Pettine was trying to gain alpha male status over a kid. A kid who was a true alpha male.

That's not how you coach a guy who is a winner. It's easy to see how Johnny would get depressed. It's easy to think about how Johnny could be alone in Cleveland and being coached like he was, managed like he was, handled like he was, and easily see how he could get depressed.

The fans are also a part of this.

Am I saying Mike Patton is responsible for what has happened with Johnny?

I'm saying to some degree yes. Pettines control of the situation has affected Johnny. And I think the results were destined to be negative based on how he was handling him.

The way the organization has handled Johnny is responsible for a large part of this mess. Johnny is ultimately responsible for all this. I understand that.

His issues have now become a problem. And it's been a convenient out that is masking a far bigger problem.

Our owner gets his ass kicked by other owners, our GM gets his ass kicked by other GM's, and our coaches get their ass kick by other coaches. That's just how it is. We had a short positive blip a year ago at the beginning of the season in the fall. Pet's first games.

All downhill since. And, it was never going to get any better.

I'm not sure hating on Manziel is really where the fans, and the organization, want to be at this point. As it appears.

It takes two to tango and we didn't manage the kid, the way the kid needed to be managed.

Back to it being Pettine's fault.

Pettine kept johnny out of the game. The thing is, i dont think johnny cares about football. He has all the money in the world to not care.

Bravo! Best take I've seen so far.

I have to disagree with this take. Pettine had to exert some authority over JF or the circus would have been out of control. Before he even took a snap, JF had the banner with him making the money sign alongside LeBron hanging on the Q. He needed to be taken down a notch or two. He was unprepared for and unmotivated to perform the work it takes to be a successful NFL quarterback last year. The Browns don't owe him anything but what the contract says...if anything, he owes the Browns for his lack of effort and preparation his rookie season. That wasn't Pettine's fault.

You are saying that because Bortles, Carr, and Teddy were all able to come into the NFL and perform on the field, while Johnny looked like a high school kid playing against the Bengals.. it was all Pettine's fault. I'm sorry.. If I'm getting paid to play football, I'm there every day, learning the offense, learning how to make myself better, asking questions, trying to be prepared to play football in the NFL. Especially when I can see every day in practice that "Gee Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas anymore." The Browns gave Manziel the opportunity, it was up to him to grab on with both hands and go for it. WHICH HE DID NOT DO. In other words.. He was given the opportunity, and did not take advantage.. He needs to go...

He was on his last leg. And that he really did not try hard. All he thought about was partying it seems. Not a good team player.

Poor Johnny - I never realized he was such a victim in all this.

JM should be lauded as a poster child for our kids on how unfair life can be - and that through the tough times people shouldn't be held accountable for their decisions and actions. When the going gets tough - point the finger. Great way to build quality people and an organization.

The only problem I see with that is the distraction for the other players. The hype is overwhelming.

How dare Pettine demand that Manziel be accountable for his actions.

I really expected higher level responses than this.

Kinda discouraging.

Disagree with me, fine.

But at least make it appear you gave some effort. That you took some time and put some thought into it.

Did you really?
I've been a big supporter of Manziel since we drafted him, last year this time when the stories came out I wanted to throw him overboard. Then he rebuilt my trust in him this year with his improvement on the field, the few off field issues did concern me. Then this vegas, disguise story broke again, I was ready to have a knee jerk reaction and do it again then I stopped myself. I had to remind myself how dishonest and unprofessional the media is. Right now all we got is some guy told some local radio host who told some espn radio host and then every major news network runs with the story as fact. So I'm just going to wait till some facts come out before I let the media lead me around by the nose and jump on the bandwagon. I'm waiting on proof of when and where Manziel was last weekend and I'm really still waiting on that video of him in disguise.

I realise there was a bunch of reaction that was scornful - but I think we need to boil what you said down to base level. Forget any personalities - and look at what you suggested.

- we drafted a player.
- you imply that he should have been given preferential treatment.
- imply that the player - who acted selfishly and unprofessionally by being unprepared to commit to his full time job - doesn't own the way he acted, but rather it was the fault of his demanding manager.

You know what - I can't condense what you said without it being a poor copy. But in essence you are implying that it's not "all" Johnny's fault - or your providing excuses for him so that he doesn't have to own his actions. I think a lot of posters find that sort of culture and attitude to be a problem.

I think a whole bunch of posters including me think the only hope Johnny had or has is with tough love and for him to own every single action and choice he makes - from his girlfriend, friends, what he eats, drinks and the time he goes to bed or get up. . .

What's more - I was supremely down on Hoyer when it became obvious that the reason he was not retained was because he wasn't embracing the idea of mentoring JM -- my own opinion now is that Hoyer saw right through all of Johnny's insincerity, all his spin and double talk and wanted nothing to do with such a entitled little pr*ck. I liked Hoyer before - cooled on him because of this - but now I think I have forgiven him entirely .... by your post about Pettine, It's possible you feel that part of JM's problems are that Hoyer wasn't a better mentor? It would be the same logic.

Olskool, I agree. But maybe because of different reasons. Unless I'm just not reading this right, I see no examples of how Pettine mis-handled this. For me it was a lot more in the 2nd yr. than the 1st. The first yr. I think nobody knew what to expect, maybe they should of had a team of guys ready to run around with him and keep him in line. I don't know. But the second year, I think Pet was so upset with him that no matter what he did Pet was going to undermine him and keep him on the bench no matter what and I can see that making JM depressed. So while I agree with you in principle, its the actions that I'm basing this on. I think JM realized no matter what he tried or said he was going to be black balled by Pet. Right or Wrong they gave the kid no chance the 2nd yr.

Tab - I enjoy and agree with most of your takes. We have a similar outlook on the team and looking for the positives instead of always running around crying that the sky is falling.

On Johnny I think we disagree. I got on the JM train this year - after some time looking like his actions finally matched his rhetoric. His incident with the girlfriend I was willing to give him a pass on.... but that was really the first crack in what has since been a series of poor choice after poor choice.

While I agree with your take that JM isn't breaking NFL rules and isn't in an NFL program ... the idea that all these recent events and activities are created by or only impact the 'media bozos' is flat out wrong. He's impacting the team. He's showing his true colors and confirming that he is not fit to be an NFL starting QB - he's proving that either [1] He has a much bigger problem than he's willing to deal with. And 10 weeks in rehab isn't going to fix it - this will take years of commitment that he's obviously at this point unwilling to undertake [2] He just doesn't care to put in the effort needed [3] He wants out of Cleveland.

There is a pattern of behaviour - there is a pattern of a spoilt, selfish entitled entiled attitude. It's ridiculously simple.

This one is on Manziel.

His personal demon is that he cannot separate work time from party time.

3 circumstances

1 end of season last year
2 bye week this year
3 end of season this year.

Simple fact is he goes into party mode when it is still work time, and looks like a fool when he does it.

No excuses.

Absolutely Mgh, and, if you listened to Joe Thomas' presser post Puttsburgh game, you would understand the damage he is doing to this team.

Do you need "proof" other than Haslam saying he did not show up, that Manziel did not show up for his concussion protocol last Sunday? Is that not concerning in itself, let alone the fact he was not at the game, anywhere, supporting his teammates out ther getting theri A**es whooped and fighting for the team?

Is it not a concern that upstanding players like Thomas have issues with his actions or lack thereof?

No, the media is not to blame although they hype it. Like someone else said in this thread show me your friends and I'll show you your future. At this time, Manziel's looks fairly bleak.

If Manziel was doing his due diligence to this team, what would the media story be?

mac...

Why did you not respond to the questions I asked about the claims you made regarding Haslem's odd, bizarre and skewed from normal behavior? I answered to every one of your points as you ticked them off in your post but you ignored that totally, as you often do, and focused on the one thing where you think you have a point, you don't.

Based partly on our history of discussions over the years, and in the spirit of the Browns new organizational set-up, I've used analytics to determine the likely hood that you would respond to me explaining exactly what you mean, using examples, of Haslem's odd, bizarre and abnormal behavior.

My analytics says it won't happen.

Stop!

Just playing mac's game against him. He's relentless as a badger when demanding an answer to his question to someone else. But finds it completely acceptable to ignore a simple request for the same from someone else. I've dealt with him before. It's always the same.

But I'll tell you what, part of the reason I've been doing this is because of his relentless requests for information from you knowing full well that that information was deleted long ago by board changes and "The Crash". When he was reminded of that it did't change his pushing, pushing, pushing for that which he knew couldn't be produced. All the while thinking it proved him right because you could't provide the impossible links. I thought he should be made to feel just as uncomfortable as he tries to make others, me in the past. I also have to admit that I did this partly due to my own angry state that we fired another HC and was acting it out on mac. That's just a little human honesty.

But you know what, since I've been doing this partly in defense of you and you request it to stop I will. I really don't need his answer to the questions anyway as I know his answer would be from some other planet anyway.

Now that he knows he's off the hook, he'll either remain quiet about it or he'll respond with a new found bravado. We'll see.

I never said I wasn't concerned, I just said I wasn't buying the story till I see the pictures. I know he missed his appointment sunday morning, he did the same thing last year. Maybe he got drunk at his house again and slept over. Just the whole wig and mustache thing sound outragous, maybe it's true but I need proof before I believe that.

[img]http://cdn.barstoolsports.com/wp-content...0-PM.png?969e4a[/img]

you're a riot!

Fixed it for you.

Had you for a second, didn't I.

At no point did you address the fact that you said you would need some very specific things said by Manziel in order for you to forgive him. I quoted a statement that he made with those exact things in it last year which he didn't live up to in the least. You then proceed to explain how Manziel may, just may be a little bit responsible for his actions but that the Browns and Pettine in particular didn't take care of him well enough. What, in your opinion, would have been better? Maybe have a mentor live with him to try and keep him sober and on the straight and narrow? Maybe discipline him on the field trying to wake him up? What else should they have tried to take care of our fragile little flower?

And just so I'm clear, the Browns were unprepared for Manziel because they don't know how to develope a quarterback? So most other quarterbacks have similiar issues to Manziel (I won't say all because I don't want to speak in absolutes, but that's certainly how you presented it)? Is your screen name ironic? What Old School coach would have put up with 10% of what this kid has pulled?

To sum up, Haslam and his lieutenants, Lebron's marketing firm, the coaching staff, specifically Pettine, the entire Browns organization and I think you threw the fans in there at the end all mismanaged Manziel and all of those folks had just been a little more understanding on how to handle a WINNER! he wouldn't have gotten depressed and done all these self destructive things? Man, I didn't realize! And here I thought he needed to take the help that was offered and get his act together. My bad.

The Browns owe Manziel the rest of his contract and NOTHING more. This immature self absorbed spoiled punk never really put the effort into being a starting NFL QB. Best thing to do as an organization is to get what you can for this disaster and move forward. Let the distraction go ruin another locker room. He is done here if management has ANY sense.

It's time for the adults to represent the Cleveland Browns. That requires dedication and effort to becoming the best professional football player one can be. Football MUST be the #1 priority if a player and a team want to pursue success.

Johnny is a party boy concerned only with himself. So be it. Goodbye Johnny. And good riddance.

I'm still struggling with the argument that we shouldn't cut Manziel because he is evil and conniving enough to destroy this team to get to Jerry Jones and the Cowboys, but we should trust him at his word that he apologizes and says he won't do it again next year when that's what we did last year and he didn't live up to his end of the deal. And all of this is supposed to be in the best interest of the Browns? In my opinion the best interest of the Browns is "no drama".

Johnny ate dinner last night instead of giving his food to the homeless. What a selfish jerk. Cut him now!!!!

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/browns/2016/01/11/johnny-manziel-las-vegas-police/78601534/

Where’s Johnny? Concern grows for Manziel
Josh Peter, USA TODAY Sports 4:40 p.m. EST January 11, 2016
2015-12-13-johnny-manziel
(Photo: Ken Blaze, USA TODAY Sports)

AVON, Ohio — In this peaceful Cleveland suburb, there is one resident creating a national ruckus. His two-story house with three bedrooms and three and a half bathrooms blends into the upscale subdivision, but there is still evidence of who's inside.

Parked in the driveway last week was a white, two-door 2015 Nissan GT-R — the same car he was driving when police recently pulled him over for expired tags.

On the front porch sat a package from the Cleveland Browns.

The final clue came when an unshaven man answered the front door, a pint-sized dog squirmed loose and scampered down the street.

The man’s face was unfamiliar, but the dog was not. It was the dog pictured with Johnny Manziel in a photo posted on Manziel’s Instagram account Jan. 3 — about two hours after the Browns quarterback was spotted in Las Vegas the night before the team's final game of the season.


USA TODAY
Johnny Manziel spotted at Las Vegas casino on eve of season finale

The posted photo included a location tag that placed Manziel in Avon, suggesting that despite his being seen in Las Vegas, he was here. Here at this house, with the Nissan in the driveway and the package from the Browns on the porch, where on an afternoon last week he just might be …

“Johnny’s not home,’’ the man said of the quarterback who has managed to exasperate Browns fans, set social media ablaze with his off-field exploits and flip the old Tonight Show intro onto its head. Instead of “Heeere’s Johnny,’’ it’s “Wheeere’s Johnny?"

Drinking champagne in Austin again? Wearing a blond wig and sporting a mustache at a Las Vegas casino again? Anywhere but the Browns facility where he was supposed to meet with the medical staff after being diagnosed with a concussion?

“Am I concerned for him? Yes," Mark Smith, who coached Manziel at Kerrville Tivy (Texas) High, told USA TODAY Sports. “He’s a great kid and I really think he can do some great things. He’s got to figure that out on his own."

Smith's concern has been shared by many in the past week, including LeBron James, the Cleveland Cavaliers star who said the off-field hijinks are a "distraction," and then later in day dropped Manziel from his marketing agency.


USA TODAY
LeBron James' marketing agency cuts ties with Johnny Manziel

In addition to Manziel's whereabouts, the question facing the quarterback is whether he will be in Cleveland much longer. The Browns fired general manager Ray Farmer and coach Mike Pettine hours after the final game of a 3-13 season and are embarking on another rebuilding process, one many fans would like to see without Manziel.

In the past, he had the help of a mentor. Julius Scott, the offensive coordinator when Manziel played at Kerrville Tivy, moved to Avon from Texas last spring to provide Manziel guidance. Scott lived with Manziel for about three months after Manizel finished a 10-week stay in rehab for an undisclosed substance abuse issue.

Now Manziel lives with Bryan Chase, a high school teammate from Texas who answers the front door. He declined to answer questions about Manziel’s trip to Las Vegas. But last week, after Manziel was seen playing pool one night at a nearby Dave & Buster's restaurant, Chase grinned and said, “It was a good time.’’

Visible through the open front door of Manziel’s house was a box from the winery “KLINKER BRICK,’’ the same box pictured in photos TMZ published last week showing Manziel buying the case of wine. It was something that might have unsettled Scott, the offensive coordinator-turned-mentor.

In September, Scott predicted Manziel would have “a great recovery.’’ But in October, Scott said he was worried after learning Manziel had started drinking again.

Scott discovered as much when police released a report in October stating Manziel had acknowledged drinking alcohol before an argument with his girlfriend. The argument led police to pull over the car in which Manziel was driving and his distressed girlfriend was in the front passenger seat. Now Scott said he is unavailable for comment, but others offered their thoughts on Manziel and his escapades.


Cheryl Houston, a manager at Heinen’s Grocery Store where Manziel bought the case of Klinker Brick wine, confirmed that Manziel shops there and sounded understanding.

“He’s still a child,’’ she said. “How old is he, 21, 22?”

Manziel is now 23, and next season will be his third since the Browns took him with the 22nd pick of the 2014 NFL draft and signed him to a four-year, $8.25 million contract. The dividends:

In two seasons, he has played in 14 games, has started eight games — in which the team went 2-6 — has completed 57% of his passes (147-of-258 for 1,675 yards) and has thrown for seven touchdowns (rushed for another) and seven interceptions. He also has staged a circus that has kept TMZ and news media outlets busy.

But Browns fans appear to view Manziel less as the circus ringmaster than a clown.

“It’s a joke,’’ said John “Big Dawg’’ Thompson, the famed Browns fan. “Nobody even wants him in Cleveland.’’


USA TODAY
Browns' QB Johnny Manziel cited for expired license plates

As much Manziel’s trip to Vegas appeared to incense Browns fans, what compounded the anger is Manziel — inactive for the regular-season finale because he’d been placed on the league’s concussion protocol — skipped the team’s last game and failed to meet with medical personnel that morning.

Mark Wyman, an electrician in suburban Cleveland, struck a common sentiment last week when he and two friends bought Powerball tickets and he said they’d already agreed what to do with the winnings.

“We’re going to buy the Browns and immediately release Johnny Manziel,’’ he said with a smirk.

Michael Dean Perry, a star defensive tackle with the Browns from 1989 to 1994, said he doesn’t think the Powerball plan is necessary. Perry said it it appears it’s time for the Browns to acknowledge Manziel will never fulfill their hopes, never meet their expectations and take the job seriously as long as he’s playing in Cleveland.

“It looks like they’ve exhausted every option,’’ Perry told USA TODAY Sports. “It may take the Cleveland Browns to say, “Hey, you know what, we’re cutting ties with you.’ And maybe that’s what he wants.’’

What does Manziel want? It’s hard to get that question answered before answering the first one: “Wheeere’s Johnny?’’

Later in the week, five newspapers in plastic sleeves were piled on his front lawn as if to give the appearance he was out of town. Closer inspection revealed all of the newspapers were the same Jan. 8 edition.

Manziel’s high school buddy answered the door, said he would ask Manziel if he was willing to talk and later reemerged.

“It’s just not something that he’s prepared to do at the time,’’ he said.

Thompson, the rabid Browns fan who wore a dog mask to games for 25 years, said his own struggles with alcohol give him a unique perspective.

"It’s sickness,’’ Thompson said, suggesting no matter where Johnny Manziel might actually be— Las Vegas, Cleveland, points unknown — the polarizing quarterback is lost.



Just throwing that out for those of you that don't believe he would go as far a fake an Instagram photo or wear a wig and hoodie in a casino.