DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk The Smack Shack Where are all the Steelers Fans??

Try taking a reading and comprehension class, McAndre. I am talking about you claiming the Ravens got a "crappy team" when they moved. I pointed out that the Browns were 11-5 and made the playoffs a year before the move. Try to keep up. I know you are desperate to deflect from your ignorance when people correct you, but this is sad even for you.

Hey Guys, I am really curious and need to know something, Both of our cities lost football teams due to the GREED of their respective owners right? We both also have been fortunate to have teams via moves (owners not cities <img src="/images/graemlins/naughtydevil.gif" alt="" />) or awarded (When you should have never LOST your team in the first place <img src="/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />) from the league after "careful consideration" due to a thing called GREED! What I am trying to say to everyone (especially GM, CoachB and W.C.) is this, we are talking about the PAST...There is nothing that we can do about the past now. Have you ever been to a waterfall or a Dam and watched the water go by? What happens to that water? It keeps going, it doesn't stop, it doesn't look back and reflect on it's travels, it keeps going. This, if you don't mind me saying is a "small thing" to us in our NFL Fandom. We are now arguing over PAST events that if I recall, didn't involve us DIRECTLY. What it did do to us is take away all of our hopes and weekend getaways from work and family and it allowed us all to be "MEN, MEN, MEN, MEN ,MEN". But we are re-hashing OLD WOUNDS that tore us ALL up in one way shape or form. I am here to tell you all, that when Baltimore lost it's team, the league suffered; Browns, league suffered; Los Angeles and so on and so forth. I guess what I am trying to say is that we are yelling at each other over a terrible past for both cities and what we should be doing is helping other cities (including one another <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />) That's right, one another, to make sure this doesn't happen again. 40 miles for a move in S.F. may not mean a whole lot for some who can travel, but it could mean the world to those who can't. So, in closing, I am asking you guys to kind of look at the "blessing" <img src="/images/graemlins/azzangel.gif" alt="" /> of having an NFL team in your home city, L.A. is still the longest to not have one and we could both have been in their collective shoes. <img src="/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" />........Good evening guys...... <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />

Good smack. <img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Well he does have a good point, but I hope it doesnt bring and end to the dicussions between Coach, G.M., and w.c., I'd miss the bickering <img src="/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Mike, I didn't see this when I responded to your other post. I would totally agree with you. The issue I have with McAndre, as always, is his lies and misinformation. That kind of ignorance doesn't allow things to heal, as you say. If McAndre would be as honest about the situation as you have been, there would be no issues. Sadly, McAndre is a troll that embraces lies and manipulation of the truth. Browns fans aren't going to sit by and say nothing as he rewrites history and makes things up whole cloth. As I said, you're a class guy that has never done that. McAndre isn't man enough or intelligent enough to actually admit what happened and instead invents his own little world. If McAndre were on his meds, he might post differently.

Good points mike, but I am still going to club Alicia/cramps/pinocchio around every time he asks for it.

And you also said that Baltimore in essence inherited a playoff calibur team when the Browns moved to Baltimore and that is utter BS. The Browns when they moved to Baltimore, were anything but a playoff team. Get a clue wannabe Coach.

I said when the Browns movede they were one year away from the playoffs. In 1995 the Browns were 11-5 and made the playoffs. That is what is known as a FACT, Andre. Then you try to dismiss FACTS to make your ignorant comments seem plausible. Yet you are hypocritical enough to tell someone else to "get a clue". <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Oh, and while you're flipping burgers this weekend, this "wannabe" coach will be coaching in the second round of the state playoffs. <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Hey Mike,

You raise a lot of good points. However, I will say that in discussing my point of view, I've heard testimonies from former Browns players like Rob Burnett, Matt Stover etc., who stated the same story that I've stated on this board. Basically Art Modell would have nevr left Cleveland if he got his new stadium when he asked for it. Everyone knows Municipal Stadium was a dump. Which leads to this hypothetical question. Would Modell have left Cleveland if say the new Browns stadium was built BEFORE Jacobs Field, Gund Arena, and the Rock-N-Roll HOF? I say no. No matter what offer was being thrown out there by Baltimore. Browns fans are in DENIAL. Plain, simple, end of story. They would have you believe that Modell was getting his new stadium. This may be the case. But it was too little too late. Everything was in place for the Browns to move to Baltimore. Like I said, my point is substantiated by hearing former Browns players. Coach B, GM, are going off of anger, passion, and like I said DENIAL!! And as a Ravens fan, I will defend my city and my team. Yes it is the smack shack and it is fun going back and forth with rival fans over football issues. But like I said, I will stand up for my city and team especially when Browns fans want to point fingers and scapegoat Baltimore unfairly.

And you were DEAD WRONG yet again. But thanks for playing. <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />

No one has a problem if you stand up for your team and city. It's when you lie like you just did in THIS POST that makes people call you on it and shows your ignorance. Modell AGREED TO WAIT on his stadium. How can that be ANYONE'S fault but ART MODELL'S. I have pointed this FACT out to you at least a DOZEN TIMES and you continue to ignore it. Why do you ignore the FACTS when "defending" your team, McAndre?

No one here is disputing how terrible the condition of the stadium was. What they are disputing is your FICTIONAL EVENTS that took place. Modell needed a new stadium. The city officials offered to build a baseball/football stadium. Modell declinded BUT AGREED TO WAIT UNTIL AFTER THE OTHER STADIUMS WERE BUILT TO GET THE FOOTBALL STADIUM BUILT.

Sorry, McAndre, but the ONLY one living in "denial" here is you. You refuse to accept the FACT that Modell made an agreement. You blame them for reaching an agreement with a man that showed zero integrity. Of course, you will again simply IGNORE THE FACTS and continue to spew your ignorance and false babblings and claim it's defending. It's simply called lying and spinning the truth, McAndre. It's all you've ever done.

Okay,

So tell me what happened if Modell agreed to wait, but still bolted to Baltimore?? And please don't feed me a line of BS about greed. If Modell got his new stadium, he would have been making money hand over fist when you talk about concessions, parking, t.v. revenue, luxury suites, PSLs and so forth. Something obviously went awry with this little arrangement between Modell and the city of Cleveland.

Here are the FACTS, McAndre. Modell was offered the Jake as a stadium. He declined and AGREED TO WAIT until after the Jake and Gund were built to get his new stadium. He was flat out broke. His only revenue came from the Browns (this is well documented as he had to get a loan to pay Andre Rison's signing bonus). Batlimore came along with their $50 million offer. He took it and left. Those are the facts. What is speculation and what "obviously happened" was that Modell saw a way to get $50 million and thought he wouldn't have to sell the team. So while he MAY not have left had he got his new stadium, the fact that he was broke and took the money is evidence he was stringing the city along and got his new deal.

"And you were DEAD WRONG yet again. But thanks for playing. "

Ahhh, missed this little tidbit of lies, McAndre....here you go. http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/history/results/1994.php

This is the year before the Browns moved to Baltiwhore. The team was 11-5 and went to the second round of the playoffs. The following year, the last they were in Cleveland, they went 5-11. So once again, you spew ignorance. The FACT is the Browns were one year removed from the playoffs before the move....but "thanks for playing" <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Hey Andre,
Memorial stadium was no "Palace" either but it did not have the problems that Municipal had. The reason why Memorial had to go was it's age. Personally, I never heard ANY of the players remark as such, but I am not saying that they didn't either. I remember when they moved here the outrage that the city of Cleveland had against both Modell, Baltimore (for allowing the Modell's here) and the NFL in general for not "stepping up" and saving Cleveland from this horrible travesty.
As I have stated before this hurts not only the city that is victimized, it hurt's the entire league for not being as ONE and protecting it's investments. Was I happy that we had a team? Yes, but not under these circumstances. I felt like the kid who took the other neighborhood's kids ball and laughed about it walking down their street. That is probably why I enjoy talking to the Browns fans, I feel like we have SO MUCH in common, but are so far away in letting this chapter (Browns move) and (Colt's midnight express out of Baltimore) GO. That was for both teams, YEARS AGO.....There is no need to prove or disprove who said what when why and how in 2006 !!!! What should be spoken about now is the way our respective teams are playing and what are the hopes and goals for this year and FORWARD, not last year or prior but FORWARD....Come on guys, like I said before if we continue to talk about what the unfortunate past has done to all of us in both Cleveland and Baltimore, then we will never get to enjoy the "blessings" that we have now on the field.
I'll bet that about right now someone will say that the "Browns Suck" and can't win a game or the "Rat Birds Suck" and has team full of criminals (Cincy has taken that title gladly from us now, Thanks Marvin <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />) but the ultimate bottom line is this, we both have teams, enjoy them while we can. In closing, I know that if I could get all of the "old regulars from the original board" this would have been a spirited topic and one for the ages to go on and on and on. In life we have big things and little things, this is a little thing, let it go guys (move to Baltimore and move from Baltimore "Colts"). Promise me you can talk about other things than the past. Have you ever seen the movie "Ten Commandments"? Moses ask Pharoah what can the dead people do and Pharoah responds that the "dead do nothing". This is what the conversation on moving is, NOTHING !!! Let it go.......Talk about the SB champs and how far they have come lately..... <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Hey GM,
I thought this was a thread on the Steeler fans and where they are now (MIA) and that's not Miami either....... <img src="/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> I hope they can get there act's together and take a page out of the Joey Porter book on "respecting your officials". It' s a hot item in Pittsburgh and Tennessee, ask Albert "Bigfoot" Haynesworth about it, I heard he wrote the introduction with Chris Henry...... <img src="/images/graemlins/naughtydevil.gif" alt="" />