DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Hue Jackson

LOL you mean the rabbits that ran off and only showed up 3 times in 16 tries?

Here is one link. Let me know if you want more....

https://vine.co/v/iBII62YqXLz

Erving definitely needs to improve a great deal to be what we thought he was at #19. But, I almost blame Pettine and Defellipo for his slow development last year. It is already hard enough for a rookie offensive lineman, but then they try to play him at all 5 positions throughout the year. We have a need at center, he was drafted to play center, so have him focus solely on the center position and I honestly believe he will be vastly improved.

Agreed. We need to play him at center, and only play him at center this year. He was drafted to be Alex Mack's replacement, that's what he should work to be.

Trying to make him this versatile linemen didn't help out. We need to make him a center, hopefully the new coaching staff will show a new confidence in him, and he can realize his potential

Talk about getting blown up. The first time I looked at that I thought it was going to be a pass play and he was trying to get that kick step back in pass protection; however, after looking at it three or four times it is clear that he got blown off the ball. His leverage was never even close to being shown on that play.

In fairness though it looked like a well time blitz and he had no chance as it also seemed like that side was over loaded trying to take advantage of the rookie, which they most certainly did.

***Note looking at it again it was not a blitz, he just got busted up!!!***

unfortunately you could probably make a 5 minute tape of "blocks" just like that for Erving... ugly

In his defense, if the RB pivots takes, a false step back, spins, then jukes left, then right he has a hole.

I think that the loss of an OL coach to teach him and the fact he was expected to learn more than one position was very detrimental to his development. Hoping that with the new coaches we have better results.

Here is another one. He 3rd man in from the left. I think these links address his weak lower body. I'll find more if people want me to.

Hell I could drag out some highlights of mack getting rolled against the Jets but its ok, he is a probowler. Erving has to get better there is no argument on that but to think he is gonna be the exact same player in year 2 is just as foolish as saying he is gonna be a stud this year. Let the kid focus on one position and see how it goes.

To much freaking drama over nonsense and this was a general reply to all you drama queens. If you are offended then I did my job +

Oof, that was ugly.

In his defense, there are Vines that can make any player look awful. Here's one of Donte Whitner https://vine.co/v/e9viOh1HExH




Hopefully Irving got stung by a bee or something right before the snap. Cause that was ugly.


But I do hope this isn't the normal, cause that was awful.

I think Erving needs better coaching. Both those plays were "non-standard" I guess I would call it. It's not really run blocking and not really pass blocking. I'm not sure how often Florida State ran draws, and I don't think Mack did him any favors on that first play. I think he expected more help and was trying to sell the pass action. I'm not sure why we were running a draw on 1st and 10, definitely looked like the Steelers were playing the run the whole way.

On the FG try I'm not sure what's standard, but it looked like everyone was doing the overlapping legs and just standing there. It's hard to move your feet when you've got a teammates leg pressing against the back of yours.

I'm not sure what they were coached in those situations, but standing stationary doesn't seem a good idea. Force equals mass times acceleration (F=ma) is basic physics. If an object is not accelerating it can't exert any force.

Hopefully, Erving will benefit from a more downhill scheme and better coaching.

Both of those videos were examples of plays that happened more than once.

Yep. There are plenty of examples that Cam needs to get stronger and play w/better technique. Here are a few using words instead of pictures:

These are all from the same article. LeCharles Bentley, Doug Dieken, and Joe Thomas chime in:

Bentley's quotes:



--"I hope he turns this thing around, but whatever he does it's going to have to be a full onslaught investment from January to the time he reports back to OTAs,"

--"If he doesn't understand that and the people around him aren't preaching that then he is being set up for failure – and you can put this on record – it's going to be much worse than it is now."

--"At some point you have to take ownership of your career, of your life and decide what it is you truly want to do," Bentley said. "Do you want to listen to hangers-on? That's a choice you make. Those people, unfortunately, are not on the field when you are facing (Bengals defensive tackle) Geno Atkins."

--"You can call this year disappointing, but he's far from a bust," Bentley said. "There's a lot of talent there. It's about making a full investment and that's where the rubber meets the road for many of these guys."

--This one is not a quote, but the author says: But Bentley said Erving has physical and technical deficiencies that must be improved. Many times, he added, it comes down to the pro player's desire to commit to workouts.


[/quote]

Dieken's quotes:



Joe Thomas says:



Here is the link and there are positives in the article. No one says he is a bust. I am NOT saying he is a bust. I do think he has strength and technique issues. Having issues w/both is concerning.

I am only talking about this because I was asked for a link. Hope this enough to prove that it's not just my opinion.


Whoops........forgot the link: http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/12/cleveland_browns_rookie_camero.html

I was curious, so I looked up a scouting report about him when he was coming out of college. Here is just the Weaknesses that were posted:



There is an Overview and Strengths, too. You can read those here: http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/cameron-erving?id=2552240


Again, I don't think my opinion was out of line.

His technique was indeed atrocious on those plays. My question is how often did he practice those plays at that(those) position(s)? I don't think his strength is spectacular, but I think it is a lot better than it looked on those plays. I wish he had stuck at one position and gotten more reps. I feel like he played that draw like a center would, I'm not sure if he'd ran it before at guard. Against Cam Heyward is not a good spot to be doing something when you're still learning it.

Hopefully having an O-Line coach for the whole year and a set position will help him get the reps he needs to establish proper technique on the plays he'll be running.

Uhmmmm, I think I provided a few links, including comments from Joe T, Bentley, and Dieken.




Probably nothing. You think I am attacking you when I use articles and other sources to back-up my points. My apologies....

The obvious Tab, the obvious. His play last year pointed out the obvious weaknesses in his game that Vers has pointed out. I really don't see how you can deny those things.

I remember that story, mostly because Bently was involved.

Is there a difference in footwork between tackle, guard and center. It seems to me there would be a lot of difference in technique. I heard, read, saw somewhere that guards have to be quicker initially with their feet because their opponent is closer to them than a tackle's opponent, forcing the guard to react quicker at the snap.

Yes, there are differences. However, there are universal techniques. Read Joe T's take on things. It's educational.

Exactly. I'm no OL expert but he got flattened a lot, considering the number of snaps he took. And no I don't have a link showing the percentage of times he was steamrolled, I'm just going on a general impression that I got.

Cam Erving got straight out steamrolled last year...gracious he was like a ghost out there. The defense just ran right through him like he was not even there...was so mad when he was on the field. he killed so many drives I cannot remember the count. if he is our center this year the QB will have a long year.

You still defending that crap, ddub?

I don't believe anyone said that there's not a possibility that he won't get better. That's an unknown quantity. Which is why I was so puzzled by your post. You do know OL and that's why I was in a quandary about your lack of agreement as to what we saw from Erving last season. Vers did point out his lack of strength. That his technique left him too high and defenders could get underneath him which accounts for very poor leverage.

He got manhandled often. Is that some guarantee of what's to be expected moving forward? No, it's not, but what it does provide is evidence of just how much work needs to be done of he's expected to be even close to the C Mack has been.

I do believe you have a clue Tab. And while I don't claim to know as much as you, I have a pretty good grasp of what I saw in Erving last year. I understand basic techniques, leverage, footwork and strength. The kid needs a lot of work. And I'm not basing this on some link or clip, but on an entire seasons worth of work.

You do make a good point about the former coaching staff moving him around instead of focusing on one position. It did nothing to help him mature at any one position. Yet, even with that considered, I don't believe anyone would have believed he would get reps at C last year with Mack still here.

So no matter, he would still be a newbie this year at the NFL C position. Now I know people say, "Well his natural position is C". But how true is that really? How many games did he play C in the NCAA?

While I'm not trying to discredit you, I saw a raw kid with a lot of holes in his game. That'd doesn't mean he won't improve. That doesn't mean he can't or won't get better. What it does mean is we can only base our opinions on what we've seen to date. And based on what I've seen to date, the kid has a long way to go and I don't think you'll see him as a prime time player this coming season.

mac posted a link and alluded to potential back injuries in Erving. That could be potentially illuminating in that back pain/injury could help explain poor technique/leverage. Coupled with a strength deficiency common for rookies, that could help explain his hilariously bad performance last year.

Reading some of these posts reminds me an OL from a few years back... not strong, not quick, bad technique ( all of which I agree with BTW)...

can never get better... wasted pick ( which I do not agree with, yet).

I think his name was Schwartz.

Schwartz was never as bad as Erving was last year (he was also never bad).

Kid was so bad last year, i have doubts if he will ever get it but lets face it, he could not have walked into a worse situation. OL coach goes nuts. We have a first time OC trying to install his new scheme while mixing in some of the old. WEhad him taking reps and what 3 different positions.

I hope he gets it but he will have a very difficult time beating out Grecco. Grecco is our nastiest linemen. Bitonio, Grecco and Bailey is a very formidable interior. Maybe the meanest, most aggressive interior we have had in many years.

RT however is one big nasty hole.

Posters keep saying strength is a big issue. I haven't seen evidence of that. Could it be, yes, but I don't have his weight room numbers. Technique was obviously an issue. He could be able to bench/leg press a million pounds and still get rag dolled without leverage/ with poor technique. Each position is rather specialized. The foot work is different for each position. I think he spent the least amount of time at LG because we thought we had a long term answer there in Bitonio.

I'm in wait and see mode.

They were wrong.

That is what we as fans can do or you could complain moan groan who's fault it is.

Most posters last season wanted change now you got it give it a chance and see what is put on the field.

I thought you weren't reading my posts?

You asked for a link. I gave you several. You then say that you aren't reading my posts because I insulted you.

You're priceless.

I think that guys like Bentley, Joe T, and Dieken know more about it than you do.

And stop w/all this footwork talk. A lot of it is identical. Stop making things up.

Come on, tex. That isn't true.