DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Think You Know The Bowe Bergdahl Story?

You don't.

Neither did I. Not like this.

Let's learn the inside story together, what say?


This is where to find it.


I just finished Episode 2.
Mind = blown.
I won't miss a single installment. Fascinating, eye-opening stuff.
It comes in weekly installments. They've only released ep 1-3, so get in early.


You've been told.
Ball's in your court.

I just listened to all three.

This story never got my interest. In fact, I had to Google Bowe Bergdahl to find out who you were talking about. Being one who's not likely to ignore something you find intriguing I did check it out.

The first episode led me to directly to listen to the second. I should have paused there to let that information sink in but greedily in the mood for a good story I went on to listen to the third episode as well.

You're right. None of us know the story. We've all heard things. Some of those things turn up in the story to be true. Some of those things turn up on the story as gossip fodder. But none of us know what the big deal this missing soldier was nor do we know anything about the lifestyle in which Bergdahl was compelled to adapt.

I'm looking forward for the next episode in a week.

I can tell that I'm going to follow this program to it's finale as well as the continuing story through the future.

i listened to it.


at the end of the day, the guy left post, and soldiers died looking for this POS.

i listened to the episodes, but he's still a deserter.

Yeah no offence Clem but what Swish says sums it up perfectly for me.

Followed the case very closely ; Deserter ,end of story ..

ddub: glad you're interested. One of my pet peeves in today's media is the 'soundbyte' nature of the news. We get a 'sexy,' sensationalized headline and a couple facts... and then nothing. Nothing, except all the uninformed opinions flaming each other back & forth. It's extremely rare that we get an opportunity to learn about a story in this much depth. If we had more of this available, it might just improve the level of civil discourse.

But then again- maybe not.


No offense taken, FB.

And guys- don't think for a minute that I'm some fan of Bergdahl's. I AM a fan of intriguing stories, well-told. When we get a chance to hear the inside scoop of a story- any story- with this much research and detail... well, that's investigative journalism at its finest.

The previous season focused on a Baltimore murder trial involving a high school student who allegedly killed his girlfriend and buried her body in a nearby state park. 12 episodes. Digging deep, yo. On the strength of this reportage alone, a 15 year old murder case has been re-opened... and the convicted is getting a new trial (look up: "Serial: Adnan Syed").

I get your sentiments about desertion. I really do. I was hoping to hear from you service guys about the backstories, not just what a POS this guy was. For instance: is the portrayal of field operations an accurate one? were conditions in Afghanistan really as depicted? Things of that nature would add depth to the story I'm hearing in the podcast.

If you fellows really mean "end of story," I'll respect that, and prompt you no more. I just find stories like this really compelling, and love the detail that this one is giving us.

Can't wait to see what their next project might be. Snowden? Tamir Rice? Benghazi? **???


Thanks for your responses.

I'll make a longer post later.

But if you had been or not, imagine hiking in the Rocky Mountains or Appalachian mountains.

The terrain is like that, except with guys shooting rpg's at you.

Clem, I know you are a fan of the serial podcasts. You should checkout 'Making a Murderer'.

It's a documentary on Netflix. Absolutely captivating. I just finished the 10 episodes. If you don't have Netflix it's worth signing up for this alone.

Making a Murderer

Thanks, Milk.

I've been looking for an excuse to join Netflix. Maybe this is the nudge I needed.

No problem Clem.

You can always sign up for the 30 days free trial of Netflix too.

This documentary is just that damn riveting.

ok so hopefully somebody who's been there backs me up, cause i'm horrible describing things.

So if i had to make a comparison of Afghanistan to a state, i guess it'll be Colorado? Maybe Georgia.

i say that part of the country is straight up mountains, part of it is hilly, and the other part is flat as wood.

the problem is that a lot of the insurgents are in the mountains. Afghanistan gets really hot....and it get's bone chilling cold. like...snows in the winter cold.

unfortunately, a percentage of soldiers didn't die from the enemy. some soldiers die because their humvee went tumbling over the side of the mountain. the roads there are ridiculous. all dirt in the mountains, no barriers. don't get me started when the unit put us on those very same roads...in the snow. one mission we had was suppose to take 8 hours....it turned into about 36. thank the stars nothing bad happened. but we got stuck truck after truck, couldn't navigate out, and this was a night mission, which made everything worse.

so Arch is a hunter, right? I'mma use him just as an example of why it's so hard to fight the enemy in Afghan.

Arch said he doesn't hunt with his cousin because he goes into deep wooded areas. even with that, there are parts of the terrain or area that Arch knows like the back of his hand.

There's part of the environment that you Clem, know like the back of your hand. That Pit and Erik knows like the back of their hands.

So even me, Ted, and FBH, trained soldiers, are gonna have a hard, probably impossible time trying to hunt you down in basically your own backyard. you'll ALWAYS have the advantage over us.

and that's why going to Afghanistan is so much harder than Iraq, IMO of course. we'll recieve mortar fire and have zero idea which direction it's coming from, especially if your deployed to what of these stupid FOBs that command decide was a good idea to place one at. IE, the bottom of the mountain. Afghani's loved hitting convoys will we were busy trying not die from a rolling over the side of the cliff, and man, the cave systems they have are some of the most genius things i've ever seen. miles and miles of man made cave systems. they pop in and out, it's just a complete cluster.

but man...the sky is beautiful at night.

I'll back you up...spent more time there then I liked and damn it does get cold there. Idk know where Id compare it to...I guess your examples work for me.

And I think your right about one thing...it was a bi..fighting there...add in you couldnt trust the ones you was there training/helping and I hope I never go back there for any reason in my life..I lost some close brothers there and is probably why I'm so jaded about the folks in that part of the world.

exactly.

and Clem, this is why it's hard to comment on what's more or less a "the other side of Bergdahl".

because it's already hard enough as it is to make it through a tour in afghanistan. this guy made it even worse, and the worst possible event for 6 soldiers, and their families they left behind.

I don't think it's so much, "the other side of Bergdahl", as it is an in-depth look at the story, something we don't get from our typical media. It's not that it's a game changing look or a mind changing account, but the in-depth quality of it makes it interesting.

If one's initial reaction is that he made a stupid mistake and surely paid the price of that mistake over his five years of being a captive this account will not change that.

If one's initial reaction is that he is a deserter who cost the military two tons of money, created a major distraction from their planned strategy as well as much lost time in their efforts to find him, and the overwhelming suffering and loss of life in that endeavor, well, this account is not going to change that either.

So far I don't see this story as being overly sympathetic toward Bergdahl. It made me see him as a soldier who, instead of simply following orders as all us who've served has done, he became disgruntled and so developed a very bad plan to do something to change the circumstances he didn't like. That stupid plan went to hell so fast he could do nothing to change it. He said himself that within 20 minutes of leaving his post he knew he made a big mistake, could do nothing to reverse it and it all tumbled downhill from there.

Part of me thinks he suffered so much tragic emotional and physical pain from this that he needs no further punishment.

The other part of me thinks he caused so much tragic emotional and physical suffering for so many other soldiers as well as disrupting the military's goal over that period of time that he should face the firing squad as closure for those who were most affected by his idiotic actions.

When he was released in that fateful trade of prisoners I'd heard who he was. I'd also heard some of the issues that painted him as more of a problem than a hero. What this story does, in it's great depth, is that it tells the whole thing in fine detail.

I don't think it's an attempt to change anyone's mind.

I've never been there but I think I can help with the description. Take the snow from the Rocky Mountains, put them on top of the jagged mountains of the Mojave desert (where I did artillery field ops back in the 80's), take the heat and flatness from Death Valley, put it in a bowl, shake it up and dump it out on a 'map' and there you have it.

I'll try to give this a listen whilst at work, but till then-Whatever excuse this guy had for sneaking off did nothing more than cost American lives, and then free 5 killers in exchange for him. Some of whom I believe are back on the battlefield now.

Clem, I tell you what...just for poo and giggles I'll listen to it again...Whoever it was that said he shouldve been put in front of the firing squad...is how I feel about.

If I hadnt served over there and have close friends get killed and the unlucky ones who got maimed and disfigured...I would be able to look at his story without feeling pure hatred for the man...pure hatred for the ones who traded for him to come home...his father I would punch square in his grill if I ever ran into him.

I hope he dies a very slow painful death...I hope he has to sit in solitary confinement 23 hours a day till he dies...and I know this will sound awful...but I hope he suffered immensely while he was in captivity.

I know thats not Godly or whatever else description someone would choose to use...But just for pure informational purposes I'll listen to it and try to see what I missed or refused to pick up because of who he is.

I normally love this kind of stuff...read a ton about Hitler and how he come into power...interesting to me. One other that comes to mind is Timothy McVeigh...read his manifesto and all the other interviews and stuff he did..so I guess if I can stomach him...I can give this a thorough listen...Just for informational purposes.

Damn, Dawgs...

This is exactly what I wanted to see from a discussion that I started.

I thank you all from the bottom of my heart-

Not because it will generate click-hits... but because it [b]strips everything bare[/b]- and asks each of you to speak from his heart about a topic that cuts to the heart of Politics, Civic Service, and Human Sacrifice.

This board represents an American demographic that dates back to the Viet Nam War, and perhaps beyond. We are the epitome of 'The American Profile'... and I saw in this story, an opportunity to truly discuss among ourselves about who we are as Americans on a World Stage, and what America's Role should truly be.

The Bowe Bergdahl 'inside story' story is spinning out in ways that I could not have even imagined, even after just 3 episodes of this podcast. It's opening my eyes to to details that I'd never get from any other mainstream media outlet... and I'm glad that I jumped in at Ground Zero.

I want to know more about this story.
I'm hooked. And I'll follow this story as long as the producers want to follow it. I'm willing to dig as deep as these guys & gal wanna take me.

From the time I was able to think, I've always been a curious, inquisitive sort. I've always wanted to know MORE.

Swish, FB, and all: Don't ever stop bringing you 'personal takes' to this discussion: your takes are the most valuable of all, as far as I'm concerned. We need your views in this discussion. They lend a personal view to a topic that could easily de-evolve to yet another thread that features the same partisan bickering/talking points that seem to de-rail so many other politically'based threads.

That's the LAST thing that I want from this thread I started.

______________________

I can't tell you Dawgs how much it means to me that you've decided to 'sign on' to this podcast.

I love pushing myself 'outside the norms' to get a story that tells The Real Truth.... and I'm glad that You Dawgs are taking this journey with me.

Yup. There is no storyline that can or will ever put enough lipstick on this pig.

In the end, this IS what he is.

Perhaps I have a listening comprehension problem but I don't hear in the episodes where they are trying to put lipstick on a pig. I don't hear at all where they are trying to create sympathy for Bergdahl. I don't hear them making excuses for him in the least. All I hear is the story in detail. Detail that we'll never get from the media. I find it interesting.

DD, yea man i feel you, i hope you understand that.

i get yours and Clem's perspective, the story, the detail. the elements. i respect that.

So i didn't mean to derail it, i just hope you understand where me and the other posters were coming from, bro.

Swish: I know you were addressing ddub, but I hope you'll allow me to respond to your post.

I don't think you derailed the thread at all.
In fact, I expected some responses like yours when I first opened the thread. I was ready for it.

And I'll go on record here: I totally understand why you'd respond as you did. I even mentioned that I respect your position in my second post. Nobody on this board is more deserving of his own POV than you (and our other Service Dawgs) when stories like this become the topic of discussion.

@Swish: do you remember this thread from March of this year?

Spergon FTWynn started it.

________________________

This podcast is the 2nd offering from the same folks who brought you the Adnan Syed Baltimore Murder trial. Sperg & me were all over it, and when I saw you chime in, I was quite pleased. The prospect of you joining the story excited me to no end- because I got to see an example of how 'Serial' had blown UP- from sheer 'word-of-mouth' power alone.

Sarah Koenig's joint set records for podcast downloads during its run.

The 'Bowe Bergdahl Story' is their entire second season. (I hope Sperg is riding this one like he did last year's story.)


I guess my main point behind this thread was this:

It's very rare that an Adnan Syed/Ed Snowden/Bowe Bergdahl news story gets the kind of in-depth treatment that 'Serial' brings. We "news consumers" bitch on endlessly about how much is hidden from us by Mainstream Media, while in-depth reportage like this is sitting right underneath our noses.

My intent was to start a Dawg-wide conversation about something that most of us have only a passing knowledge of... and to hook other 'thinking Dawgs' to the source.


I think that "Serial' can change the way Thinking People get and process the news that shapes our daily lives.

THAT'S why I started the thread.


Because next season, they'll do just as they have in Seasons 1 and 2... pick a story to Death- and give us (the consumer) a deeper, richer story to think about.

__________________

I watched your 'selfievid' the day after you posted it. I know from that vid (...and from your many posts in EE...) that you're the kind of 'thinking person' who would be drawn to reportage like this.

I hope you sign on- and ride this season's episodes to their conclusion, along with me and d-dub. I'd look forward to your comments and observations more than almost anyone else in this thread.

Who among us is more qualified to speak on such a subject?


Think about it, My Friend.
But- no pressure, eh?

Swish, I'm a VietNam vet. So I do understand where you guys are coming from. What he did is not lost on me. While what he did didn't directly effect me because I wasn't there it does indirectly effect me precisely because I understand. Though we served ages apart you are still my Bros. I know the mind-set of a soldier. My experience was not a walk in the park either.

I hate what he did as well as how he did it. Above everything else he's an idiot. The whole premise that sent him walking away that night was ill conceived from the beginning. Worse yet, he was ill prepared to pull it off both mentally and physically.

Had he made it back that night or the next morning, (he knew 20 minutes out he'd made a mistake), it would have come to nothing. He'd have been punished for his actions and that would have been that.

But it turned into so much more. That 'so much more' is what I never knew about and am finding out through this story. I knew nothing until we traded for his release. Now I see what it was all about and why it affected you guys so deeply.



After responding to you I went back and read Clem's post above and I agree with him that you did not derail the thread topic. You brought a perspective that the topic needed. Though I explained that I understood you guys, I would not have brought that perspective myself. I was not there.

Bergdahl is a deserter and a traitor, and our government is just plain foolish to give up 5 Taliban commanders for a photo op.

Hey Swish I left something out about this..do you still have your Woobie from being in Afgan? I do and still use it to keep warm sitting on the couch sometimes...without the poncho of course..

my daughters stole my woobie from me. it's always in their room now. and apparently i'm not allowed to have it back.

the poncho...haha i actually use it to cover up my ride when i know it's about to snow. i have two of them so i just connect them with 550 cord and call it a day.

you still got your IOTV?

No...Ive bought chest armor through other sources through the years..My Woobie is old but I just cant let it go

Have a great day man I have to head out to the dr now..

I don't want to derail this thread, but I got through episode 2 last night and was sick to my stomach....

I've avoided reading anything on this story so I can take in this series first.

You watch this show, and clearly it's a documentary, and clearly it's real life, but it doesn't feel that way, because of how it has unfolded.

I'm only 2 episodes in but I reccomennd it, especially for those, like myself, that love true crime.

You gotta tell me, what's a woobie?

The liner to the poncho we was issued in the branch of service we served.I used mine to lay in my bunk many times better then the blankets I was given ...still use it to wrap up in at home...

**BUMP**

So I'm 5 episodes into this story now, and we're getting to hear about the diplomatic side of things. Munich. Bonn. Qatar. And now we get to find out the inner workings that set up the story we all thought we knew. Kinda like snapping the back off an old pocket watch to see what makes it tick. Or in this case, a better analogy: going to the processing plant to see how your sausage is made!

What a cluster! So many missed opportunities, so much wasted time...

...it's fascinating to hear how easily talks can be derailed over some of the silliest things.

Hope some of you are still following this tale.

BTW... the Adnan Syed retrial has started back up, and 'Serial' is dropping update podcasts into the stream as events unfold. Too cool. They're actually following up on a story that they put to bed a year ago.

You don't get coverage like this almost anywhere else.

I have only the last segment to go. I'll wait for that before adding additional comments. I feel a little far away from it right now to comment.

I will say, pertaining to only Bergdahl's side, that I feel he made one small mistake of which the ramifications were beyond anyone's wildest imagination.

It's what makes the story so riveting. Some call it "The Butterfly Effect."

One 'ordinary dude' decides to do something really ill-advised... and it impacts the decisions and choices of world leaders.....

...insane.

You couldn't sell a script like this to even the cheesiest of producers- and it really happened.

Well, the trial for this loser has been officially postponed until 2017. The biggest thing here is no longer will our loser POTUS be involved in this mess he's stirred up, headed up and generated in an unconstitutional like fashion, doing what he does best and avoiding Congress.

Desertion and misbehavior before the enemy could, and most importantly should, lead to life in prison.

Actually, I'll agree with The Donald here, and say he should be and should have been executed, dirty rotten traitor.

You don't leave soldiers behind, dead or alive.

No matter your personal feelings, that's how the military operates.

He's not a soldier, he's a deserter. Don't go politically correct on me here, this loser abandoned his post and all gear. That moment on imo, he's no longer a soldier.

Even if he's convicted, my understanding is he'd still have a military rank, E-1, which isn't acceptable. He doesn't deserve even the lowest of ranks. He deserves punishment.

I'm glad this thread got a new post. I'd completely forgotten about it even though I'd listened to all but the last segment. I'll do that later tonight.

another person hiding behind PC.

that's been the military stance since forever dude. there's nothing PC about it.

don't get it confused as to me thinking i support this guy. i hate him. pure hate

if he's convicted, he could very well be put to death, or at least rotting in jail forever.

but above everything else, we don't leave people behind. no matter what.

just like in combat, we give medical aid to wounded combatants like if they were fellow soldiers, because thats what makes us the good guys.

get that through your head or not, it doesn't matter. but i'm not gonna just let you trash how we operate just because of your feelings.

Great post Swish. Very well said and worded. I wasn't trashing the no man left behind, as I personally don't view Bowe as a man. He's a creature, but it's personal views. It's just sad when the no man left behind results in the killings of real soldiers over scum trash, and that's where my emotions get the better of me regardless how straight and narrow I try to contain my views.