DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum RGIII Cont'd

I honestly think Josh would make the best starter this year if the goal was to win NOW. I doubt it happens since Hue will want "HIS" QB running the show. I could see Josh playing till he got hurt and RG3 coming in on fire with something to prove.

I do know one thing for certain. I mean dead certain. RG3 is very angry over reporters continuing to harp on he washington days. His voice is very calm and his face is well composed showing that he is disciplined and intelligent enough to hide it with his face but this last interview he was seething with anger. You can tell by the way he was crossing over his arms and hands and kept banging the table so much with repressed hand movements that he couldn't control. I'm actually very worried he will crack soon if the reporters don't back off his time in washington soon.

I expect this would quickly disappear if he can start "performing" for us...

Yeah Ed, but are you his Daddy?...LOL

Mistake. Decreased valuation of trades and player perception from other teams would result. ...Not metrically sound as Sashi spouts.

Some of these QB competitions were too cute with the naming, took too long and still didn't get much done, like being coy with who will start preseason games, how long, etc. I see a place for it for now. But the concern I have had with it going on too long in the past seems validated: While you are taking time, which I am OK with doing in our present situation, you also are taking a large number of needed reps from the eventual starter. More reps hopefully add up to better sharper play. I want the right choice, and not now especially, but sooner is better than later IMO.

Or you can Romeo, and "go with your gut" which didn't pan much gold for us.

j/c...IMO

The winner should be RG3 even if McGown is a better, as long as Griffin is showing improvement and promise. McG is not the future. If Josh ends up winning, it is an admission that Griffin is not, and will likely never be, the answer. Kessler should only see the field in slop time to give him 'on-field' experience. If a time comes when neither RG3 nor McG are available, then hopefully Davis or Shaw are.

Griffin has to show, by the end of the season, that he is the answer at QB. Otherwise that experiment will be a failure. He has 4 years experience in the NFL, and his leash should not be a long one.

I guess I fall into the catagory of those that don't care who starts, I just want it to be one that gives us the best chance to win.

Names mean nothing anymore.

i think we brougth in RG3 to find out if he can be salvaged. Its disturbing when you hear that he is missing wide open guys even though he has hit on some big plays. Its the stuff that got him benched in DC, he just didnt recongize and anticipate who was coming open. Even though its camp, its camp, these things wont get easier when the bullets start flying. He is acting the part but if you are missing guys that are open, he will lose the support of the players.

Josh is the best QB right now and he should be. There isnt a system he hasnt played in. if we had to play a game today, he would be our starter. Thing is, he isnt likely to get any better and he still holds the ball for an eternity. He and RG3 both are guilty of this.

Everyone sleeping on Kessler and for good reason but he is the guy staying an hour or so after practice throwing with these receivers. He is making a living in the film room and gym. Frankly the fact that he is still in the conversation after OTA's and mini's is very tellign about our QB situation. There isnt an ocean of separation between these guys.

We will see how it plays out but chances are, none of these guys are gonna be the answer but my confidence in Griff is deteriorating by the day.

Based on one report? I don't think I make myself worry about something like this yet. I mean, he's learning a new system, making mistakes in OTA's. Ok,, but isn't that where you want him to make them? I do.

Not saying he's the answer cause, I just don't have any idea. But I just can't bring myself to doubt him based on this info.

I really hate how there is always something with RGIII.

It's the 2016 OTAs...

So.. who are we drafting at QB in '17?

As long as this coaching staff and FO doesn't make a major investment at the QB position, it gives them time. As you can see by the expectation from most posters, this team isn't expected to do a great deal this year. So with that in mind, there's really nothing they can do poorly with the team record that would be considered a failing grade.

Once you use a top pick at the QB position, fans will expect you to be improving and your record to reflect that. So for now the heat is off. I believe this will allow for a grace period. But once they make that big QB investment? The heat is on!

Who are you? Griffin's mom?

For me early offseason media speculation/observation isn't worth getting disturbed over because you can't be sure about the accuracy of the comments. The majority of the reports I've heard/read seem to indicate that Griffin is playing well in camp.

And for what its worth, proly not much since I'm apparently viewed as Griffin's dad or relative, Griffin is fairly well known for his accuracy. IF he's missing wide open receiver its uncharacteristic of him. Which, of ocurse, isn't to say that he didn't/doesn't have other flaws, lol.

I'm not sure if you are looking to have a discussion on why Griffin was benched or what some of Griffin's flaws could be or not. When I read this sentence it suggests to me that their is interest on that subject on your part...but then again maybe not...If you are interested in that discussion I would be too. In my opinion Griffin was benched for several reasons, but I'm not sure I agree with your nother discussion about whether or not his benching was even warranted or whether or not being benched is a huge demerit against a QB, since many QBs get benched and still go on to play well.


1 reporter's observations/opinion from OTAs and minicamp aren't enough for me to start catastrophizing...its too early, for me.

come on, we are not allowed to be optimistic on this board, you will be known as someone who is clueless. You know, no QB ever misses a pass on any other team in practice, only Browns QBs.

I took "missing wide open receivers" to mean he isn't seeing them or anticipating them, doesn't know where to go with the ball, not the sees a wide-open guy but can't hit him kinda "missing".

That was my interpretation, also. Somewhat understandable in a June OTA, considering how new everything is.

I took it that way too. But I also thought both he and his WRs are learning a new offense. Some of the WRs are running routes in a pro offense for the first time, so maybe some of it is the QB and WR not being on the same page. How much the writer knows about that stuff I don't know. Maybe he does know it's the QBs fault and not the WR.

It's getting to the point where I am uncomfortable even discussing RGIII.

Whatever..........

Keep your foot on the pedal, dawg. Say your piece.

That was my meaning. thanks Prp, I didnt do a very good job of explaining that. RG3 has always shown pretty good accuracy to all levels of the field and he is a tremendous deep ball passer but you gotta see the field and know what to do when the D shifts.

LOL

Funny man!

For the record, articles, either negative or positive, hold exactly the same weight for me. Until the reports become facts, what else am I to do.. Run off the rails worrying about things that aren't real yet? LOL

For me, I can hope for Griffen or another of the QBs to emerge, but given the minimal investment in the position, I won't sweat QB all that much. It seems to me that the FO took a couple high-risk, high-reward shots and didn't put much commitment into any of them (RG3's contract, Kessler's draft spot). If they're not going all-in on the position this year, then neither am I.

I'm more interested in the Oline/running game and the defense, in that order.

Exactly. Obviously QB isn't a high priority at this point in time, so it's impossible to get excited by or be too disappointed in the success or failure of any of them. Equally, it's impossible to expect any more than average to below average play from the position in general. BUT on the positive side, a few of our fourteen draft picks should make the team.

Okay I got you now, you were talking about decision making not accuracy.
BTW-You never said where the report/opinion came from that Griffin was missing wide open receivers in OTA/minicamp. I'm curious because I haven't seen those reports. You said Dustin Fox said that McKown looked better was he also the one that made the comment about Griffin missing wide open receivers?

You believe everything those BOZOs say?
And where in that article does it even hint that rg3 is 'catching up fast'?

How can Mark Sanchez, Blaine Gabbert, RGIII revive careers?

By Bucky Brooks NFL Media analy... | 16 Comments

Robert Griffin III, Cleveland Browns

Second overall pick in 2012 NFL Draft

What went wrong in Washington?

It is hard to believe a player capable of winning the 2012 Offensive Rookie of the Year award could flame out so quickly and in such an epic fashion, but that's exactly what happened to Griffin in Washington. The one-time Pro Bowler failed to build on a spectacular rookie season that led me to believe he could revolutionize the position with his combination of athleticism, running skills and playmaking ability.

After shining in a read-option offense that allowed him to maximize his electrifying talents as a dual-threat playmaker (Griffin posted a 20:5 touchdown-to-interception ratio and rushed for 815 yards as a rookie), Griffin reportedly asked the team to eliminate the zone-read and quarterback runs in favor of a more traditional offense that features a dropback passing game. The decision was an absolutely awful move for the young quarterback, given his limitations as a passer. Griffin spent his developmental years in high school and at Baylor directing a spread offense that didn't require disciplined footwork or an advanced understanding of complex passing concepts. Thus, he asked to play in an offense that played to his weaknesses instead of his strengths as a passer and playmaker.

n addition to Griffin's self sabotage, the Redskins didn't help their young passer by bringing in a head coach who was unwilling or incapable of tweaking his system to suit the skills of the franchise quarterback. As a proponent of a traditional pro-style offense, Jay Gruden requires the quarterback to execute pure progression reads to move the ball in the passing game. The quarterback must be able to quickly diagnose coverage and work a designated side of the field based on his reads. This demands outstanding vision, awareness and disciplined footwork from the quarterback. Most importantly, he must be a quick decision maker capable of making accurate throws at short and intermediate range.

With Griffin unable to fit the job description as a passer and playmaker in a traditional offense that requires the quarterback to win with his arm, the fifth-year pro was destined to fail as a starter in Washington.

Why will he succeed in Cleveland?

Hue Jackson's reputation as one of the best quarterback developers in the NFL makes it plausible to expect Griffin to bounce back as a franchise quarterback in Cleveland. The ultra-confident coach is an imaginative schemer willing to tailor his system around the talents of his quarterback. Jackson helped Andy Dalton blossom as a playmaker in Cincinnati by implementing several concepts from a collegiate playbook that mirrored some of his young passer's favorite plays at TCU. From featuring a shotgun passing game to mixing in some zone-read plays, Jackson put Dalton in his comfort zone by crafting an offense that fit like an old glove.

In addition, he added a handful of creative tactics (unbalanced offensive line, odd-ball formations and trick plays) that put defenders in compromising positions on the field. With Dalton adept at reading defensive fronts and coverage, the creative scheming created big-play opportunities for a quarterback pegged as a "game manager." Considering Jackson's impressive work with other quarterbacks (see: Carson Palmer, Joe Flacco, Jason Campbell and AJ McCarron), the Browns should expect Griffin to make a significant jump as a player.

Looking at the Jackson-Griffin marriage, the Browns likely will build the offense around a strong run game and a vertical aerial attack. The presence of a dominant ground game will force opponents to use more eight-man fronts, leading to one-on-one coverage on the outside. In addition, the threat of a hard-hitting running will create some opportunities for Griffin to use his legs on designed quarterback runs or zone-read concepts despite any objections from the quarterback.

In the passing game, Griffin's strong arm and athleticism will allow Jackson to feature a vertical passing attack that uses play-action (traditional play-action and bootleg passes) to lure safeties to the line of scrimmage. With second-level defenders forced to respect the running game and Griffin's athleticism, the Browns' speedy receivers (especially rookie Corey Coleman) could feast on isolated coverage on the perimeter.

If Griffin buys in to Jackson's philosophy and adheres to the tenets of the system, he could re-emerge as the dual-threat playmaker who took the NFL by storm as a young player.

He could also hear the boo-birds by Week 4.
I'm just gonna wait and see - and in the meantime, hope for the best - if he can be a good NFL QB.

It doesn't even matterm if Rg3 is any good..

We have the worst roster in the history of the NFL, our owner will probably fire our coach tomorrow, and our one good player (we only have one) will be traded the day after..

The whole top of the article where he talks about what went wrong with RG3 is all about him not doing - and not being able to do - the things that make a quarterback a quarterback, primarily read coverages and defenses.

Then, Bucky trots out Jackson's work with Dalton as an example of why RG3 will do well, but only very casually slips in that Dalton has those traits which RG3 does not... "adept at reading defensive fronts and coverage".



Basically, if you read outside the optimism-building phrasing, you can see that there likely isn't much to get excited about with RG3.

Bernie Kosar says RG3 was 'phenomenal' at the Cleveland Browns practice he watched (video) | cleveland.com
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2016/06/bernie_kosar_says_rg3_was_phen.html#incart_m-rpt-1

By Joey Morona, cleveland.com
Email the author | Follow on Twitter
on June 15, 2016 at 4:36 PM, updated June 15, 2016 at 11:18 PM
NORTHFIELD, Ohio -- Bernie Kosar liked what he saw when he was invited by head coach Hue Jackson to watch the Browns practice nearly three weeks ago in Berea.

Kosar, who was on hand Wednesday for the grand opening of a restaurant at the Hard Rock Rocksino Northfield Park, where he has a steakhouse, said he is a big fan of Jackson and the Browns' coaching staff.

"I really like the way they diversify their personnel groupings and their motions and their shifts and their sets," Kosar said. "I think that's been shown with [QB coach] Pep Hamilton when he had Andrew Luck in Indianapolis and obviously coach Jackson doing that with the Cincinnati Bengals.

"Having some of the different, creative type plays I think will add balance and a little sophistication [to the offense] and our ability to score."

Kosar noted the practice was crowded with about 90 players on the field, but said the team's depth at quarterback stood out.

"There are 4 or 5 really nice young quarterbacks that look aggressively eager to learn and I think that's one of the really important things for a young quarterback," Kosar said. "To have that ability to want to learn and Josh [McCown] definitely has it with being in the league as many years as he has. RG3 was phenomenal in his effort, his wanting to lead this team."

After practice, Kosar spoke with the players.

"It was great seeing Bernie," McCown told cleveland.com at the time. "It's obvious the genuine interest he has in our team being successful. Means a lot to me that he was able to be out there."

Kosar had been estranged from the Browns since being removed from his analyst role on preseason telecasts in 2013.

"RG3 was phenomenal in his effort, his wanting to lead this team."

I'm good with that. Hey, if he turns out to be anything close to what he was in his rookie year, I'd be delighted..

"RG3 was phenomenal in his effort, his wanting to lead this team."

It means he was trying very hard.

Always a good thing...

He missed out, Pet gave awards out last year for trying hard lol

Agreed, but it is something completely different than the misleading title of the article wants to suggest. It means that "phenomenal" applies to effort, not performance.