DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum I’m a Skins fan who has watched RG3 for 4 years & analyzed the film. Here’s what you can expect.

Posts by Lyuokdea, cfrs15 and Dogs4Life respectively on August 29, 2015:


“I would grab RG3 on the cheap here too.... when you have two possible QBs you don't have any - so why not get a 3rd.”

“He needs to sit. Unfortunately he would probably end up playing here.”

“I'd take a shot on him. He'd be our best QB. It's not like our QB situation would be any worse and it's not like he'd make us any worse than we already will be”

j/c
Something that hasn't been mentioned in this unending debate about RG3 is this. Last year, at this time, somewhere in the neighborhood of half the board was excoriating Josh McCown. His past as a mediocre, QB with no winning pedigree was raised constantly as a reason he shouldn't be the starter. Quite a few posters were clamoring for Manziel.

Thanks for the clarification.

http://espn.go.com/fantasy/football/stor...ks-quarterbacks

I will take the 8th best QB any day and twice on Sunday... Brady...

Who comes up with this crap?

That's true. I was one of them. But, what is your point?

Because mentioning that he had a season that is arguably close to as good as his 2013 season while completely negating their nitpick on the number of snaps makes it harder to downplay his presence.

I mean, if you gloss over the fact that he had a 93.3 in 2015 - a better passer rating that Aaron Rodgers & Jay Cutler, roughly equal to Eli Manning and just behind Big Ben & Rivers - then you can keep everyone focused on how bad he was in the long-ago past instead of what he's done most recently.

It also allows you to avoid having it pointed out that 2 of his last 3 seasons were his best ever, and the lone outlier was on an utterly atrocious Tampa Bay team (where he was still better than his first year with the Bears).

So what your saying is that Josh played well but the teams around him weren't good enough to pull off a win.

Wait, doesn't that mean that having a Tom Brady or Payton Manning doesn't guarantee winning?

Nothing guarantees winning; however when you have a Tom Brady or Peyton Manning your odds of winning improve dramatically.

Granted.

I was just thinking out loud how fans generally want the team to give up a kings ransom to get what is considered any particular years best QB in the draft and how much of a stretch that probably is.

This past draft is one of those drafts. The top two guys that were drafted this past year were probably the best this draft had to offer, but I'm still not sure either was worthy of the 1 or 2 pick overall in the draft.

I'm convinced that if you get a good game manager who's smart and surround him with quality backs and receivers and a better than average line and a tough as nails D, you can win it all... WAIT, it's been done! LOL

For all our sakes, let's hope so.

Do you think Hue/Pep think the chance to evolve Griffin is slim?
I don't think a new HC/staff are going to gamble there 1st season on a risk they believe is a long shot.

It's a good football article that describes how a player w/ similar skillset and development as Griffin was used in an offense designed around that skillset.

Or how well prepared AJ McCarron was in that playoff game...

Everything I've read about the guy, he receives nothing but praise, especially when it comes to working with quarterbacks, and especially being able to get to young QB's.

Vers/Diam

I'll be brief. My statements on this board and thread about Griffin are easily quotable and quite direct.

I don't understand the need to make claims different then what I've actually written. Diam you can continue to leap to wild conclusion from my statements...but those conclusions aren't my issue...they're yours.

If you want to believe and spout the media rhetoric about Griffin that's fine. But, as with most media and sports media specifically; they aren't there to get it right as much as they are there to get a story OUT.

If you want to believe Griffin is/was an inaccurate, conniving, entitled bad teammate. That's your choice. But for every negative "report" there were counters reports by teammates that went on the record to defend the guy. And Diam, lol, the accuracy perception just simply isn't supported by any metric I've ever seen.

Griffin played great as rookie then suffered a bad knee injury.
His second season, he was recovering from the knee, was merely okay but decent by 2nd year QB standards especially considering the knee.
3rd season with a new HC/new scheme sustained another injury; had up and down play and was benched.
4th season lost his job in the pre-season and didn't play.

There's a lot conjecture and narrative out there but the above is about as plainly as I can state the facts surrounding Griffin.

Griffin remains one of the most physically gifted QBs in the league.

And in the end I believe that talent will out.

I stand by everything I have said regarding RGII. I'm sorry if that upsets you.

Lol, back to that again. If I'm 'upset' about anything is your choice to believe only the negative side of the Griffin narratives as fact. Nevermind the main source for those narratives is obviously biased and agenda driven; yet you discard or dismiss any opposing reports or views.

Vers - didn't take me long to figure Ed out .. But I have always been way quicker than u so that should come as no surprise .. *L* ..

The post above this one pretty much sums sit up ...

He thinks ANY NARRITIVES about Griffin matter to us ... He doesn't realize that we get the INFO we need from ACTUALLY WATCHING football and then use the NARRATIVES as examples to prove what we SAW ..

Ed on the other hand LOVES HIS STATS, METRICS and OTHER PEOPLES NARRATIVES .. Guess that means he either doesn't watch the games or if he does watch them .. He doesn't understand what he sees so he has to go look at the stats to tell him what he saw ... Reminds of DaManIsHot .. ..

And we all know STATS ARE FOR ........

And I can't believe I'm going to say this .. But I agree with Mac in that I could care less about RG3'S past .. All I care about is what he does for us .. Do I ignore his past? .. No, that's why I think he is way over rated and is a back up quality and not a starter type player .. But that don't mean squat once the ball is snapped starting soon .. If he plays consistently good for the next 2 or 3 years ... We'll like his recent past ... ...

I also think he was a good pick up .. We paid him to much but everyone is overpaid when there a free agent ... And we had a ton of cap space .. STILL DO FOR SOME F'N REASON ...

Ton of upside if U and I have to eat crow .. Witch I know we'd both love to do .. With no real downside except we spent to much money on him but we have a ton of cash so that's IRRILEVENT ..

I think it's a good pick up ..

And you know what .. I actually like Kessler .. Will be curious to see how that works out .. If Hue is any where the QB guru OTHER PEOPLES NARRATIVES make him out to be .. We may be on to something with him ..

Other than his supposed work ethic, what's got your interest in Kessler peaked?

I think better clarify where I stand on RGIII:

Positives:
--I think getting him was a good move. Low cost/high reward.

--He has ability.

--He had a good first year.

--Unlike you, I don't think his accuracy is a big problem.

--He throws a beautiful deep ball.

--He is athletic.

--He throws fairly well on the move.

--I see his potential and he could end up paying huge dividends.

Negatives:

--He has not read defenses pre-snap well in the past.

--His reading of coverages post-snap has been poor. This is my number 1 concern.

--His footwork in the pocket has been horrible. He has not mastered the 3, 5, and 7=step drops. He takes extra steps and drifts.

--He took too many needless sacks.

--He had two coaching staffs sour on him.

--He went behind their backs to complain to Snyder.

--Some teammates did not care for him.

--He has had more than his share of injuries.

--Despite so many teams needing help at the position, the Browns were the only team who went after him. That's almost hard to believe.

Conclusion:

I don't believe my evaluation of him makes me a "hater." Many others have seen the same things in RGIII. I just get tired of all the excuses and misinterpretations of the facts by some people.

That's a pretty accurate representation of RG.

It really is a simple thing, we aren't exactly taking a HUGE risk with him. No big money involved (not by QB standards that is) and if we happen to hit on him, wow, what a break.

But I have the biggest question.. What exactly was the better alternative to RGIII?

I didn't really see one.

I suppose we could have taken whichever QB was left at 2 but honestly, I didn't believe that either was worth that high of a pick, so I don't/didn't see that as a viable option. I saw that as another reach.

So either RG makes or he doesn't. Either way, I'd be hard pressed to believe this is "OUR" year anyway, so let's just build the rest of the team and find a QB later if needed.

I hear the RG3 went to Snyder argument a lot, but I'm not sure it is that simple. Snyder seemed to be a giant RG3 fanboy, and if the guy who signs your pay checks wants to talk with you, you usually go if you want to keep your job. I'm not saying RG3 is innocent, but I think there is more nuance to it than RG3 ran to "daddy" and said the big, bad coach was picking on him.

I think the not liking RG3 angle is overblown, too. When teams are losing, players often play the blame game just like everyone else. QBs are easy targets, and the position most often asked about. How often do you think players get asked about how they like a backup O-Lineman? More questions, more responses. Some will inevitably be negative as people have different personalities.

Those narratives are out there, but I think they are every story has more than one side type situations. Tearing things down seems much more popular than building things up in the media. I think that negative bias is one of the shortcomings of our society.

Other than that, I agree with you, Vers. RG3 has some work to do, but I didn't see any better risk/reward options out there.

I think it's also fair to point out that by all accounts, he stayed quiet and focused and wasn't a distraction last season while being benched for the entire year.

'Report: Robert Griffin III to be given four out of five first-team reps'

http://sportsnaut.com/2016/07/robert-griffin-iii-given-4-5-first-team-reps-browns/

3 hours ago // By Jesse Reed

If we needed any further proof that the Cleveland Browns are all-in on quarterback Robert Griffin III, we now have it.

Tony Grossi, appearing on PFT Live Tuesday morning, said the Browns plan on giving RG3 four out of five first-team snaps during training camp, presumably to get him prepared to start the regular season.

“It’s not an open competition with Josh McCown,” Grossi said.

Earlier this month, Mary Kay Cabot reported a similar bit of news when she said there would be no short leash for Griffin and that the Browns are committed to him as the starter this year.

This makes perfect sense when you consider McCown is the next best alternative for Cleveland this year. A career 59.5 percent passer who has lost more than twice as many games as he’s won, the Browns will be conceding defeat if he’s the starter. Behind McCown is Austin Davis, who is a career backup, and rookie Cody Kessler.

At least with RG3, the Browns have some potential.

While he never came close to replicating his rookie season, Griffin still has the tools that helped him win the Heisman Trophy and the NFL’s Rookie of the Year in consecutive seasons.

And now with the news that Josh Gordon has been reinstated and will potentially be available in Week 5, the Browns could finally feature a dangerous passing attack. Combined with tight end Gary Barnidge and rookie Corey Coleman, Gordon gives Cleveland a more than serviceable receiving corps.

The Browns will give Griffin every opportunity to succeed. It’s now up to him to make the best of his second lease at life in the NFL.

+1, go into any organization you have people who like you and dislike you....human nature....RGIII is fresh, he didn't play a real down last year, he CAN learn to slide, can throw it away, can be successful....time will tell, JMHO, I like having a younger, faster QB vs last yrs starter.....GO Browns!!!!

rg3 just said that there is only one qb that can run a 4.3 on the roster.....when has that ever been the case? when has that ever been needed?

I guess when you play like him and rely on your legs to be above average it matters ... sadly, many Washington fans will say that's his only attribute ... and that's why he's always hurt

Terrelle Pryor? lol

It's always surprised me that no one at the NFL level has really commented on how RG3 was almost an Olympian at the 200 or 400m hurdles.