DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 13 Falcons 24 Postgame Thoughts

realistically, which defenders didn't play? Haden, Hughes, ..

As the only run stopper we have, I imagine teams will just run to the other side. He may not make that much of a difference.

Remember, this IS preseason. We're showing vanilla defense against vanilla offense.

I don't think our defense is AS bad as it looks. Do I think it'll be stellar? No. Where Horton was weak in 2013 was 3rd down and red-zone. But, we weren't that bad against the run.


I just think that my recollection of the 2013 defense was that we couldn't get off the field when we needed to, and so we lost a lot of close games. 2014 and 2015 under Jim O'Neil IMO was way worse.


We don't have that much talent on the defensive end, but I don't think it's gonna be as bad as the preseason has shown us, and I do think we'll be better against the run than we were last year and 2014. Of course, 2014 and 2015 was just awful against the run

Williams at nickel. Desmond at DE. Outside that, think we had the full boat available. Which yeah, we're going to be a running backs favorite game. Cleveland Browns game are circles, starred and gives butterflies for opposing offensive lines and rbs.

In November when we face Dallas, Romo won't need to throw any passes.

Just wondering, what do you think we'll be ranked at on run defense?

30 or beyond. Bottom five without question.

I don't think we have any plans or illusions about fielding an NFL-caliber defense, or backfield, in any way.

These guys are gonna suck.

A couple of thoughts:

Nassib had a sack in every game he played in his final year at Penn State.

He has started off his Browns career with a sack in each of his 1st 2 preseason games. Yes, they are preseason games .... but it is still an exciting start.

As much as I have said that I expect us to struggle this year, and as much as I have been disappointed by Gordon, I admit that I think about putting Coleman, Pryor, Gordon, and Higgins all on the field at the same time, and wondering who the defense would be able to cover? Pryor made a really darn good CB look like an UDFA on his TD catch. I hope that we can get the OL figured out, because there is some real talent on offense.

I said that I really liked the Kindred pick once I had a chance to take a look at him. I like it even more today. He was not perfect, but man, his 2nd game as a pro and he looks like a real seek and destroy type.

Erving is at the stage where it is one step forward, and 2 back. It's going to be a major problem if he doesn't get the shotgun snaps down, because we are going to run a ton of shotgun and pistol with RG3.

I do think that RG3 is the best QB on this team, and it's really not close.

Coons had a miss. He cannot afford any in his competition with Murray.

Andy Lee is absolutely incredible. Man, if a punter can be explosive, he was explosive. He averaged 55.6 yards/punt on 3 kicks. That's a real weapon.

I thought that Taylor played fairly well as NCB.

I was not at all impressed with Poyer. Ditto with Shelton. I am so incredibly concerned/disappointed at the tackling. It was reported that the entire defense was coming in today. on their day off, to work on this. Good idea, because they stunk at trying to tackle yesterday.


If we have to play Rahim Moore Sr ..... we'll be in trouble. He looked like he was consistently out of position. I was shocked when I looked and saw that he had tackles.

I said, earlier this week, that we would have games where the offense let us down, and others were the defense will. I think that the pendulum is currently swinging towards the defense doing the majority of letting us down. I think that CB is going to be a real trouble spot for us. I hope that we will be able to get some major pressure on opposing QBs ... because we will have real problems covering receivers down the field.

This is downright scary:

Daryl Ruiter ✔ @RuiterWrongFAN
1st half stat totals through 2 games for #Browns opponents:
25 1st downs, 10/19 on 3rd down, 145 rush yds, 417 tot. yards & 79 plays

Ugh.

That's disconcerting.
Hopefully, he will at least get to where it is one step forward and one step back, because while he won't be going anywhere, at least he can do the Cha-Cha.

j/c, but love the Cha-Cha comment. LOL

A few more thoughts after reading new posts and reflecting a bit:

--Tank Carder was impressive last night.

--Mike Patrick drives me nuts. It might that his spotter sucks, but man, he named the wrong tackler on so many plays. And his praise for the inside linebackers was bizarre.

--Our ILBers are going to be a big issue. Teams will run on us.

--Hughes is okay, but teams have run the ball against the Browns w/him in the lineup in past years.

--How many throws has RGIII thrown in the intermediate range between the hashes? I think that Hue is keeping things very, very simple for him now.

--I don't think Shelton was nearly as bad as some folks are suggesting.

--Meder struggled last night.

--Orchard does not set the edge better than Kruger. Kruger did his job on that one play that was mentioned earlier. There was no pursuit.

--Bailey looks worthless.

--Drango may have started, but I think he was replaced right away by France or Franz...whatever his name is. Drango returned later w/the backups.

--Does anyone else think that Gilber is going to get cut?

The fact we took Gilbert instead of Sammy Watkins kills me daily

just watching the replay ... man oh man our screen game is bad

and they were clearly going at Gilbert whenever possible

two other things I'd like to see eliminated:

1. Mike Patrick and Wilcots ... so vanilla ... so bland ... they don't have anything invested in the team and just wanna paint it rosy

2. "IT'S THIRD DOWNNNNN"

From my memory, Drango started the first drive. Second drive came on and that guy you're referring to got hurt, and Drango went back in. I think he played more than you realize.

And that's a good thing (not realizing he was in).

I absolutely agree about the D-Linemen though, people are bashing Shelton, when he played okay, and Meder gets praised, but lastnight he looked like more of a backup with a high motor. He's just not that strong (or maybe his technique isn't that good), either way, he wasn't getting much of a push at all. I feel the same way about Xavier Cooper, except Cooper is more athletic. He just gets pushed around in the running game it seems like. That's why I think Hughes will be a starter right away

And I agree about Bailey, he looked bad in game 1 too.


And Tank Carder was impressive. He plays hard. Looks like a vet out there. And I get the feeling he's the special teams leader. I think he'll make the team no matter what

Okay, maybe we can make some sort of friendly wager on that then. Some sort of signature bet or something, we've got time to think it up.

But I would definitely be willing to bet our run defense is 27 or better.


I don't think Ray Horton is a hero or anything, but he's a long-time D-Coordinator. And while he doesn't have the greatest ingredients to work with, I think a guy, coming from Dick LeBeau's Steeler style defense, won't allow us to be that lousy vs the run. I just don't see it

IMO it's easier for a D-Coordinator to coach up a defense than an O-Coordinator to coach up an offense.

I think that's a very fair bet. You're on. I'm down with a signature bet. I just don't see us stopping it and teams alone like Dallas and Pittsburgh will have above stellar days.

Kinda weird, but I hope I lose. It's the type of crow I don't really mind eating lol. Don't see it happening though. Unless he sells out for the run 75% of the calls and opens up play action attack/passing attack.

He had a bad year in 2014 vs the run, but other than that, Ray Horton's defenses haven't been as bad as you're saying we're going to be.

My theory continues to be that it is preseason. Preseason shows us what we have to work on. Clearly this is something that we will have to work on.


We didn't see Ray lastnight because he's in the booth. That's where he calls his plays. But I guarantee you, it's being discussed now and is a big part of the agenda. Not just the missed tackles, but how the D-Line and LBs aren't engaging these guys close enough to the LOS



I've got faith. It'll be improved. How much? I dunno. But it'll get better

It's not Ray, it's the pieces he has to work with. Having no legit NT. OLB unable to set the edge on a consistent bases. Cooper isn't a run stopper. Our best DE against the run wants an injury settlement.

Idk, I just don't see it. Horton can't make chicken salad outta chicken crap.

Sure he can, just you wait........

I'm already thinking up the signature for you, and regular season hasn't even started yet =p

If we're higher than 25 overall defense I'd be shocked

How can Gilbert but cut... hes supposed to have a breakout season
Acording to Eotab.....
Wait that was last season he proclaimed
Such...
Yeah Gilbert should be cut
The Browns are better off signing Antonio Cromartie or Cortez Allen and cutting Gilbert

Hortons last stop in Cleveland his defense wasn't that good. Porous in the red zone..3rd down....very few take aways
And That was with Shread and Ward in the lineup.

That sounds weird.

If I'm not mistaken, Gilbert's contract is fully guaranteed for the final two years. My guess is he'll get every chance to make this team (even if that means KR) before he is cut.

However, this is a new regime, and as we all know, their players (no matter the path) tend to get preference.

Oh and one better...Phil Taylor over Julio Jones. That's our beloved Cleveland Browns for ya. We love our worthless fat guys. Who needs talent right?

Actually, we could have had either Bridgewater or Carr AND Odell Beckham Jr. in the Gilber/Manziel draft.

Man we all know teams miss in the first round. Hell even the Steelers and Patriots miss bad sometimes, but how is it even possible to miss almost always?

Yeah, it's almost uncanny.

I meant to be cut...I was using sarcasm cause Gilbert was predicted to have a breakout season last yr.

Voice to text:

I don't know whether or not they should play 3-4 or 4-3 that's almost semantics to me. Butt comma the personnel they play in those formations will determine the success of the defense. There aren't very many solid Run Deep In Defenders in our front. Meter comma Cooper comma Shelton should be the front three The Edge Defenders outside linebackers in my opinion should be opa and Krueger. I think those make a decent run stopping front 5. The fronts in the second and third unit that have open acid as part of a three-man front get gassed because those guys are not 5 techniques.

I'm actually impressed by the way Double D and Kirksey have been playing in the Run game they get downhill stack and shed more than I thought they could so for me that's a welcome revelation.

Disappointed with the corners and safeties thus far. Especially the corners they haven't been bringing any type of physicality to their tackling I'm hoping to see Jamar Taylor with the starting unit as opposed to Gilbert who seems to be playing very tentative. Or I should exclude from the list of underwhelming performers in the secondary. I have high hopes for IC but he has to show it.

Schematically I'm not a big fan of Horton's defense but they can still execute better. I hate when the corners are playing soft and all that's not their strength I feel these do should be playing press and run all day long. And if they're going to do that in the regular season then they got to start doing it now.

On offense I'm pretty satisfied with the way it's going. I like how the running game is moving the ball I like the long ball thus far from Griffin. My one expectation that hasn't been reached thus far is to see Griffin have more passing attempts that focus on the intermediate passing game. But I can understand what he was doing building Griffin's confidence.

You claim voice-to-text, but I'm thinking you really just wanted to find a way to use the phrase "Butt comma" in a sentence.

Too bad the owner wanted Manziel, the coach wanted Gilbert, and we had a GM with no balls to say "no".

I think our biggest problem with the run D is our D-Lineman seem almost passive at the snap. They don't seem to be firing forward at the snap. They seem to more pop straight up and get driven back in the initial surge before re-anchoring. Almost every running play one of them would let a guy get under him. They've got to play with better leverage and not be so stinking passive. You can knock your man backwards and still play two gaps.

So if we were to trade JT to a contender, you think we would be good at LT?

Go slap yourself. Right meow.
Just do it. Repeat until sanity returns.