DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Kaepernick refuses to stand for National Anthem

Its just lip service.

I work with a historically repressed minority, Alaskan Natives, in an extremely remote (along with often forgotten by many) and try to help them realize the educational goals they set for themselves.

I've done this since 2013, and before much of this entered the national conversation the last year and a half.

More people here on this board have done similar things.

So the Kap protest had no effect on what you do then?

Not taking away from the good you seem to always do.

Too many Blacks are working against a racially unified America.

For the past 45 years, as US citizens they have been granted special privileges in an attempt to develop a more racially representative upper-class.

Too few took advantage of opportunities such as higher educational initiatives for minorities.

Too many just want the easy way. No school, no work, no parenting, just play time.

Black racism is a sham.

Want to talk about real racism?

Only 75 years ago, one of the most educated, wealthy nations in the world systematically murdered 6,000,000 Jews.

That’s half the population of the state of Ohio. Imagine every human in Greater Cleveland being murdered. Every single one. And Akron and Toledo too. Men, women, children.

All that did was make the Jews stronger and more determined to achieve and succeed in the world.

I haven’t heard them complaining about racism.

You should read up about socioeconomics.

??

Socioeconomics is an extremely broad discipline.

With countless different (and often opposing) theories.

I'd love to spend some time reading some of the general concepts.

For instance how the field of Socioeconomics has affected society.

But any in-depth reading (and comprehending) would be beyond my interests (do mainly to the time involved).

Experts in the field have extensive doctoral degrees with incredibly deep mathematical backgrounds.

And work ethic while we're at it. Not hand outs and sympathy - work ethic.

3 of the richest men I knew graduated from 8th grade. That's it. No further "scholarly" education.

None of them were rich, or privileged growing up. That's why the dropped out of school to work.

They farmed. One dug ditches as well. Then dug graves. Scraping by.

One ended up establishing the largest RTA furniture company in the country. One ended up buying a mom and pop business and turning it into the largest scaffold company in the country. One got into farm equipment and ended up running the largest farm equipment company in Ohio.

All started out with nothing but work ethic.

None started off rich. None started off looking to be rich. The had work ethic.

You get up in the morning, you go to school, and when you're out of school (graduated), you went to work. 6 days a week? Okay.


I could also tell you about my dad. He DID have a college degree. Took him 7 years to get it.

I could tell you about my bro in law. Home schooled. Just a farm boy growing up. He still farms - for someone else, full time. And his side work makes him more than his full time job. He can fix anything.


I could list more people that are successful.

So let's talk socioeconomics, and let's throw in family unit, desire, willingness to work the low job to learn........let's talk about a lot of things.

Let's not say "we need more money for education", as the u.s. is near the top, I believe, in expenditures for education. (world wide that is)

Hey Arch....I agree.....people can get ahead if they want to try to get ahead....many in the "hood" don't try.



I am tired of the excuses......no more with me.

It's not just the hood though.

The place my wife works.........they have jobs. They hire people, and too many of those people quit in less than a month. So many, than in fact, all the employees had to under go a "STAY" interview. I don't know what the acronym stands for.

It was a "why are people leaving, especially the new hires" kind of thing.

Bottom line? 8 hours a day is a lot, and if I want to make more, I have to work 2 hours of over time."

Or, ..........ah, hell, you name it - the excuses were rampant. Bottom line? It was easier to not work, and survive, than to work, and thrive.

They even offered people that lived over 40 miles away a $50 bonus for gas money.

Health insurance after 60 days. 401K matching contribution of up to 4%.

Wife worked with a gal from Toledo. Wife said she was a good worker. Intelligent. She came in from Toledo with 2 others. That right there is $150 in gas money a week, for the equivalent of driving 500 miles a week. (between the 3 of them). $150 a week for 3 people putting 500 miles on a vehicle each week.

Girl told my wife she was going to quit, cause it took too much time.

Wife told her "just move here". Her response was "Can't. My friends are in Toledo. It's not worth my time. Unemployment pays me."

Work ethic. It'll get you far, if you have it. Problem is, it won't get you far on day 1.

Do you know what many face from day one in the inner-city, or from many impoverished rural areas?

The deck gets stacked against many, and we need empathy to acknowledge how tough it is. Call it an excuse, but no "bootstrap" with 1000lbs of work ethic can deal with the emotional trauma many face.
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Sorry Peen, Arch, Rocky...but I vehemently disagree with your viewpoints. I've been an observer while working in the inner-city, and in a remote impoverished area. Call me naive as much as you wish, but I know what I hear and see. I wish many of you could see what I've seen.

Not sure what else I can share with all of you here. I tell the story of my experiences, but it either gets met with "Oh, young kid...hasn't seen enough of the world" or "you and your college education makes you feel superior."

Then those who dealt with these experiences first hand? You write them off, and disregard first hand accounts from a world barely any of us know.

I reach across the aisle, and all I hear are the same old "lazy people looking for excuses" argument from those who have repeated the same thing for years here.

Why are you even bothering?

He completely ignored anything lurker, Clem, or myself has said about it.

Rockyhill already said it.

We blacks are lazy, and black racism is a sham.

This is how they view black people. Just leave it alone. Seriously.

I'll repost my question to you...

"

Originally Posted By: Vambo

I have a serious question for you people, there are a lot of you that support what these players have done in protest. My question is has it had enough of an impact on you to actually go out and do something about the problem? Has it inspired you to spend time going out working in the neighborhoods and with police to try to resolve issues and educate on how to interact with others to solve the oppression problems?

"

It goes beyond just the players for me, Vambo.

My willingness to want to make a difference came from lots of little things such as the Tea Party, Occupy, different athletes taking a stand, scratching my head at Glenn Beck, wanting to try and make the world a better place one day at at time, and my willingness to open up my mind to worlds outside of my own world view.

Any gesture from a prominent individual may spark someone to critically think about the world around them.

My point was trying to find someone that saw the protest and that it actually made them go out and do something.

You do it on a daily basis and that's great , I was looking if it really inspired people to get up off their butts and do something or all just talk.

Nah. Blacks aren't any lazier than whites.

But when it's made easy, that's what people take - the easy route. White, black, any "race".

Our country has become "gimme the free stuff", and not "crap, I gotta put 40 in for low wages before I can move up."

Since the protest have you reached out to the police and try to resolve your trust issues? Has the protest inspired you to make an effort?

Your same sentiment got shared eons ago in Ancient Greece. We're suddenly not just "lazy" because it was wonderful "back in the day". Socrates basically destroyed the argument about "it was better back in the good ol days."

I've donated to my community multiple times.

I'm not trying to get searched for drugs again. Or get questioned on if my daughters are mine.

The searches stopped ever since I traded the BMW in for the truck. So sorry if I'm
Not exactly itching for more police interaction.

And judging by everything that's going on lately, I have all the reasons not to take that risk.

If I looked more Hispanic than maybe.

I"m just gonna toss this out here..........make of it what you will.

I can cite many kids - white kids, that have grown up in bad places, with only mom at home. And too many of those kids fail, in school, and life.

I can cite many black kids that were adopted. Into a home with a mom and dad, and rules and structures, and they do fantastic.

The white kids that grew up in single parent homes, often times with mom doing drugs............living in gov't subsidized housing - they don't expect much of themselves. Same for black kids I think.

Those that grew up with a mom and dad at home, in a loving environment (and I don't mean that in a cheeky way. Hell, my wife and I have disagreements and arguments) tend to do better.

Doesn't matter how much is spent on education. Kids that learn, from home, that education and work ethic is important - they do better in life.

For what it's worth.

Cool. So, you agree with me.

Aren't you leaving Alaska after this year to pursue "better" things?

So basically the Kap protest is a failure.

It failed because I'm scared of the cops?

A few things have happened, and I'm staying here. I realize I'm meant to stay here for quite some time.

I don't agree that there's a newfound laziness, nor do I agree with a lot of where you're coming from. Sorry arch, one of those times we see a lot of this in different viewpoints.

You come at it through work ethic, but you can't build work ethic without the basic fundamental building blocks. Many kids get born into a situation without these building blocks, and they suffer due to no fault of their own.

We can preach "work ethic", but what about those who get born into the cycle of poverty?

Once I posted about Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and a good discussion came out of it. Look into that.

Well it didn't do anything to mend the divide so yeah it failed because you're still scared of cops.

Wasn't the purpose to resolve the issues so we can live together in harmony?

Again, I've donated to my community. That was before and after this protest.

So I've made action. You can't fault me for being cautious.

Kind of goes back to "fix the family, fix the country" doesn't it?

I know some hate to hear it. Sad truth is, most of the problems in this country are, at there root, founded in a lack of family. Kinda describes gangs as well, doesn't it?

Gangs are "family" for kids that don't have family.


You wanna fix some serious problems in this country? Get family back. You know, a mom and dad that care about their kid/s.

But, we can't control that, so we just say "socioeconomics" is the cause of problems. And "give more money to..........."

Nah, I'm not about that. More money does nothing but make the money takers money.

Kids need a real family - not more money.

But, unless and until that happens - lookie at society. But, 2 parent homes are totally ignored. Men should be able to screw, have a kid, and leave. That's working, right?

Hey now. I got followed through 2 miles of residential area when I drove between my Mom's house and my Dad's house two weeks ago. Didn't even go into my drive way. Just drove another half a mile to the local temple and went in. Bet they didn't expect that! Now Vambo's post has me wondering if those policemen got inspired and asked me why i didn't trust them think.emoji

Yes I can the idea was to get past those issues and in your case resolve being scared of police. There are prob millions of people doing the same thing "NOTHING" they talk a good game but when it comes down to doing the WORK they are no where to be found.

I don't know I guess that's where I'm different if I'm doing something or going somewhere I've been know to stop the officer and ask "is there a problem? Am I doing something wrong?" but then again I've not had the issues maybe you and swish have had with police.

No offense dude , but the thought of stopping a cop and asking that question, and there likely response made me LMAO

I agree. It is all sorts of people.

Are you TRYING to get Chs shot?

j/c:

I think there is "truth" on both sides of the debate. The problem occurs when neither side is willing to understand the point of view from the other side and instead, draw a line in the sand from which they can not be moved.

Planting seeds in shallow fields minimizes the crop.

What's the point of the protest and opening dialog if no one actually does anything to resolve the problems.

I guess if the people complaining the most are the ones breaking laws no wonder they are afraid and won't work with police to resolve the problems.

People are doing things to resolve the problem.

It just doesn't make any headlines.

You don't see the people marching on the streets protesting gang violence and talking with police officers in community meetings because the media isn't showing that.

Yea, I'm scared as all hell of cops. But I still find time to donate to my community and try to make it better.

Have you ever heard of the million man march. They had police chiefs and such in dialogue with blacks talking about bettering the community and doing more community outreach.

Yet I had to stream it on Facebook and YouTube because no major networks were covering it.

So people around the country are trying.

But as I'm typing this, I already know you and others are about to ignore everything I just finished saying, like normal, and act as if none of these things are happening.

What's worse vambo? This isn't the first time I've said the same exact thing to you.

But you're probably gonna ignore it again. So why bother, right?

So Kaps protest didn't inspire you to fix the problems you have with police"?

The donating you were doing was before the protest correct?

That was my question but yet you ignored it as you did the first time I asked it. So why bother, right?


Have you ever heard of the million man march.

Yes I have could you imagine if those million men had gone to those poor run down neighborhoods and clean up the place got rid of the gangs mentor young single parent children can you imagine the difference that would have made. Can you imagine the following they would have inspired by DOING rather than just preaching.

I answered your question. I said I've done it before his protest, and I did more after his protest.

See, you ignore everything I say.

If you're gonna try and make a play off my words, at least be accurate. You failed miserably.

I typically only donate once a year, however his protest made me decide to do more.

If I take actions with the cops, it will be at a major event.

What is me going up to one cop gonna do?

Especially trying it the way you'd suggested, just rolling up on a cop and asking what's the problem?

Man I'd get shot.

A community program, sure. There's one coming up that my homey wants to go to. Might join him.

And that's how you view the million man march? That's sad bro.