DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Presidential Campaign, Thread 9

Weird, isn't it? Ask Buffet. Ask the Gates, ask any of the D millionaires. They all want to pay more, so they say, but none do.

In essence, they want OTHERS to pay more. If they wanted to pay more themselves, they absolutely can.

But it's weird how they don't, yet they get held up as virtuous.

Do you take every deduction you can? I bet you do. Does that make you bad? Nope.

You got a problem with the tax code, get on the people that write the code.

Why is it always the rich and the poor saying "you guys need to pay more"?

Because you keep repeating that lie. Nobody gamed the system, they paid what they legally owed, nada.

So you're okay with him not paying taxes and you're okay with it being okay that the system is okay with him not paying taxes. Okay. Just checking.

So the super rich, in the past 50 years, moving their tax bracket from a 90% tax rate to 0%, is not gaming the system? What do you think that is?

Its the law! That is what it is!

Fight to change the law because that is where your problem lies!

Don't blame people for following the law, that is just too danged Lib even for you guys!

Two things,, tax avoidance is legal, tax evasion isn't.

If he avoided taxes legally, then like you said, we gotta suck it up and accept it.

If he evaded tax, throw his butt in the brig.

As for Buffet, what he actually said is that his secretary who makes a very good living (not sure of the number but I remember it being more than 50k) paid more as a percentage than he did.

But at the same time, his personal federal tax bill was something in the area of 6 million.

At this point, I'm thinking that Donald Trump, who the other night said he made something like 692 million last year, may not have even paid 10%. Again, if he did it within legal means, I got no problem.

Personally, I think, with nothing to back it up, that he's not given to charity anywhere near what he claims to have and his tax returns would demonstrate that.


But here is the question I want answered. If he doesn't want to give us his tax returns for last year because he's under audit, fine. Give us the previous 10 years worth like Clinton and Sanders and many of the republican candidates did.

Don't run and hide Mr. Trump.. What are you afraid..

Do you feel like the Don has interest in changing these laws if he were to become president?

Who said that Portland?

If, IF, he followed the tax rules. The IRS tax rules, and he got away with paying nothing - so be it. Change the damn laws if you don't like it.

If he cheated, nail him. Not the way Rangel got nailed, not the way many in the O admin. got nailed.

Wait, yeah, actually, nail him the same way.

But if he followed the law and owed no taxes and it bothers you, take it up with congress.

In this country we call them cabinet members.

Oh crap, you asked. Ok, here it comes...

TAX REFORM THAT WILL MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN


Tax Law Changes to Make America Great Again


The Donald Trump plan will revise and update both the individual and corporate tax codes.


Individual Income Tax

Tax rates
The Trump plan will collapse the current seven tax brackets to three brackets. The rates and break points are as shown below. The tax brackets are similar to those in the House GOP tax blueprint.

Brackets & Rates for Married-Joint filers
(Brackets for single filers are ½ of these amounts)

Taxable income: Rate
Less than $75,000 12%
More than $75,000 but less than $225,000 25%
More than $225,000 33%

The Trump plan will retain the existing capital gains rate structure (maximum rate of 20 percent) with tax brackets shown above. Carried interest will be taxed as ordinary income.

The 3.8 percent Obamacare tax on investment income will be repealed, as will the alternative minimum tax.


Deductions
The Trump plan will increase the standard deduction for joint filers to $30,000, from $12,600, and the standard deduction for single filers will be $15,000. The personal exemptions will be eliminated as will the head-of-household filing status.

In addition, the Trump plan will cap itemized deductions at $200,000 for Married-Joint filers or $100,000 for Single filers.

Death Tax
The Trump plan will repeal the death tax, but capital gains held until death will be subject to tax, with the first $10 million tax-free as under current law to exempt small businesses and family farms. To prevent abuse, contributions of appreciated assets into a private charity established by the decedent or the decedent’s relatives will be disallowed.


Childcare
All but the wealthiest Americans will be able to take an above-the-line deduction for children under age 13 that will be capped at state average for age of child, and for eldercare for a dependent. The exclusion will not be available to taxpayers with total income over $500,000 Married-Joint /$250,000 Single.

The childcare exclusion would be provided to families who use stay-at-home parents or grandparents as well as those who use paid caregivers, and would be limited to 4 children per taxpayer. The eldercare exclusion would be capped at $5,000 per year. The cap would increase each year at the rate of inflation.

The Trump plan would offer spending rebates for childcare expenses to certain low-income taxpayers through the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC). The rebate would be equal to 7.65 percent of remaining eligible childcare expenses, subject to a cap of half of the payroll taxes paid by the taxpayer (based on the lower-earning parent in a two-earner household).

This rebate would be available to married joint filers earning $62,400 ($31,200 for single taxpayers) or less. Limitations on costs eligible for exclusion and the number of beneficiaries would be the same as for the basic exclusion. The ceiling would increase with inflation each year.

All taxpayers would be able to establish Dependent Care Savings Accounts (DCSAs) for the benefit of specific individuals, including unborn children. Total annual contributions to a DCSA are limited to $2,000 per year from all sources, which include the account owner (parent in the case of a minor or the person establishing elder care account), immediate family members of the account owner, and the employer of the account owner. When established for children, the funds remaining in the account when the child reaches 18 can be used for education expenses, but additional contributions could not be made.

To encourage low-income families to establish DCSAs for their children, the government will provide a 50 percent match on parental contributions of up to $1,000 per year. When parents fill out their taxes they can check a box to directly deposit any portion of their EITC into their Dependent Care Savings Account. All deposits and earnings thereon will be free from taxation, and unused balances can rollover from year to year.

Business Tax

The Trump plan will lower the business tax rate from 35 percent to 15 percent, and eliminate the corporate alternative minimum tax. This rate is available to all businesses, both big and small, that that want to retain the profits within the business.

It will provide a deemed repatriation of corporate profits held offshore at a one-time tax rate of 10 percent.

It eliminates most corporate tax expenditures except for the Research and Development credit.

Firms engaged in manufacturing in the US may elect to expense capital investment and lose the deductibility of corporate interest expense. An election once made can only be revoked within the first 3 years of election; if revoked, returns for prior years would need to be amended to show revised status. After 3 years, election is irrevocable.

The annual cap for the business tax credit for on-site childcare authorized by Sec. 205 of the Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001 would be increased to $500,000 per year (up from $150,000) and recapture period would be reduced to 5 years (down from 10 years).

Businesses that pay a portion of an employee’s childcare expenses can exclude those contributions from income. Employees who are recipients of direct employer subsidies would not be able to exclude those costs from the individual income tax and the costs of direct subsidies to employees could not be used as a cost eligible for the credit.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2015/09/trumponomics
"Trump's economic plan is twaddle."

It's more of the same trickle down garbage that didn't work when dear old Ronny tried it.

Fighting Trump's presidency by highlighting the fact he's gamed the system is not trying to change the law?

Also, if history proves anything. It's people who follow dangerous laws that are the most harmful to society.

And many on the right have been calling for a complete change to the system that can't be rigged... as long as we have a 40,000 page tax code filled with loop holes and exemptions, the uber rich will find a way around it... But the left doesn't want a simplified tax system because that would take away one of the big hammers they use in every election.. the shell game. We are going to give this credit, raise that tax, implement this new tax unless you qualify for the credit... and in the end, nobody really knows how much they should expect to pay... what is wrong with just creating a simple fair system?


Yes, the left has a couple uber rich they roll out every so often who claim they should be paying more taxes.. stop acting like this is common among the rich.. if it was common, they would be paying more, because they are the ones who allegedly own the politicians.. right?


But above you said the uber rich WANTED TO PAY MORE.. now you are saying they are the ones gaming the system.. please make up your mind.

Democrats have controlled the WH for 16 of the last 24 years.. they have controlled congress at times, they have controlled the senate at times, from 2008 to 2012 the Democrats controlled every bit of it at the same time..... Did they fix it? Did they fix any of it?

So I'm curious, other than blind optimism.. what makes you think Hillary is going to fix anything this time?

Hillary wont fix it. She is a puppet of big business. But she will lie straight to your face in order to get elected.

If you learn anything from this election, besides the fact that Trump is a moron, you should learn that politicians are great at saying one thing and doing another. I hope everyone on this forum who hasn't learned this, learn that fact.

As for the rest of your post, I'll let a Democrat or a Hillary supporter answer that. I haven't voted for a Democrat in my life and I'll tell you why. When I was young, I discovered that Democrats and Republicans are two threads of the same strand. They might be different things up close, but if you look at it, you'll see it's just the same thing.

Also, I think the tax policy is stupid. I think the monetary system is stupid. As we think of feudal Europe as archaic, I think capitalism is the same way.

If you learn anything from this election, besides the fact "that Trump and Clinton are morons", you should learn that politicians are great at saying one thing and doing another. I hope everyone on this forum who hasn't

Fixed it for you

Fair enough.

Cruz Invests in Trump's Bankruptcy

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-09-28/cruz-invests-in-trump-s-bankruptcy


Senator Ted Cruz's humiliating capitulation last week to the Republican presidential nominee raises anew the question of what exactly the Republican Party is -- and what it will be after November.

Cruz had initially bet he could command the support of the party's reactionary base and ride it to the nomination. When Donald Trump claimed the base instead, Cruz withheld his support, calculating that Trump's buffoonery would make opposition to him appear principled, serious and conservative.

That gambit, too, collapsed as Trump consolidated support from previously reluctant Republican voters, and Trump supporters in Texas began undermining Cruz's own standing at home, where he is up for re-election in 2018 and looking vulnerable to a primary challenge.

Cruz not only endorsed Trump. He also dutifully stated Tuesday that Trump had maintained "the upper hand" throughout his hapless debate performance the prior night. An excellent debater himself, Cruz pledged to help with the next debate if Trump called on him.

What does it mean that a shrewd, ruthless tactician such as Cruz is clinging to Trump? In a seemingly sincere moment in May, after Trump had crudely insulted Cruz's wife and broadcast lies about his father, Cruz called Trump a "pathological liar" who "cannot tell the truth" and "combines it with being a narcissist." Cruz even called Trump on his most consistent psychological tic, projection. (Trump relentlessly accuses others of whatever he himself is most guilty of.)

Neither Trump nor Cruz has changed. Only the political calculation has.

"Cruz wants be able to say he did all he could, if only to avoid the inevitable recriminations that he undermined the nominee at a key time," said GOP strategist Liam Donovan, via e-mail. "And even if the Trump primary base isn't made up of the ideological fellow travelers he thought they were, Cruz world probably still views them as rightfully his in a post-Trump environment."

Cruz bows before the party when he bows before Trump. In an interview with Byron York, Senator Jeff Sessions, an early Trump backer with a strong anti-immigrant streak, called for a similar ritual from the recalcitrant leaders of the Bush family.

"I think they should remember the loyalty they were given by millions of Americans," Sessions said of the Bushes. "They should objectively analyze who is likely to advance best the agenda they favor and the agenda the Republicans who supported them favored. And that's clearly Donald Trump."
The Bushes don't share Cruz's ideology, or even like him, but they surely share his view of Trump as a moral, intellectual and psychological wreck. Sessions, by contrast, isn't interested in Trump's missing brake and fenders, his dangling tailpipe or his errant steering wheel. Trump is of the tribe. That's all that matters.

Henry Adams famously called politics the systematic organization of hatreds. It's that and more, of course. But for Republicans circa 2016, not a great deal more. The threads that unify them are support for supply-side tax cuts for the wealthiest and their uneasy membership on the same team, aligned against Democrats. The first position isn't remotely popular (except among rich donors). That leaves the second.

If Jeb Bush failed to summon a tribal scream when he needed it in the Republican primaries, Cruz and Trump suffered no such shortcoming. Cruz has now determined that he cannot inherit Trump's sizable piece of the action -- or perhaps even keep his seat -- without genuflecting before the party's new idol, ratifying its collective wisdom.

Trump's inadvertent service to Republicans was clarifying that a party seemingly riven in two bitter factions actually contains three: Cruz's cultural/ideological reactionaries, Trump's cultural/populist reactionaries and the increasingly marginalized, once mainstream, business conservatism represented by Bush.

It wasn't the only lesson. Bush learned that decency is for suckers. Cruz learned that ideology, in a party that ostensibly worships it, turns out to be dispensable. And Trump? Trump learned that he possesses the perfect flaws that, in service of their current array of hatreds, many Republican voters find dangerously exciting.

This fact surely hasn't escaped Cruz's probing eye. He'll never be a petulant, slapdash, ignorant adolescent himself. But for the sake of his shaken ambition, it's not too late to endorse one.

And you should have learned that Bloomberg is pro Hillary in the extreme. Stop with the propaganda already.

coming from somebody who's used breibart, please be quiet.

Heck, Mike Bloomberg wanted to run against Trump but was rejected by the Dems.

Smell that? Yep, its coffee!

i dont drink coffee.

I know, you are a Koolaid man!

the worst thing Purp has allowed to happen on this board is people liking their own post.

but it was that good!

it was weak

so add more powder to the koolaid.

i don't drink koolaid.

Country time lemonade.

if you really wanna open that can of worms again with questioning sources, be prepared.

It's not Iced T?

sweetened.

southern style. like they make in GA

Not once? Ever?

I have.

I have a feeling you're not telling it straight.

Well, I've voted for both when it comes to local government like judge, treasurer and whatever else we elect. But never at a National or State level. I mean, if you want to see how both parties are the same, just watch Rob Portman and Ted Strickland call each other "China's inside man".

Why would I want to add into that cesspool many of you consider an answer?

Because, in the debate he actually said he was "smart" for not paying federal taxes.

How do you know? He wont release his returns and he is being audited.

If he pays no federal taxes OR he pays considerably lower percentage than your average middle class citizen then it is disgusting AND it should bother everybody.

How do you know? Nobody has seen his tax returns.

You mean a bit like "hanging chads" in Florida? Remember that one?

That was just stupid people voting. They couldn't even do that right.

I believe the Fact Checkers proved that Trump lied/embellished details far more in the debate.

So, the "she is a liar" arguement holds no weight and is getting old.

Oh, ok.

But, when Clinton wins the conspiracy theories will be rampant. Trump will no doubt get the ball rolling on them.