DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 9 Steelers 24 Post Game Thoughts

our run game was SO FREAKING BAD yesterday. McCown had what? 13 yards? And was our leading rusher.

For Crow to get 10 yards is a travesty. We've sunk to levels way below those 99-00-01 teams now.

We are only slightly worse than I expected at the start of the year...and that was BEFORE we lost Bionio for the year, our kicker in practice, our Center lost three separate times including a new guy lost for the season who might be the best C on the team, Pryor for a few, Coleman for a bunch, RG3 after 3/4 of the first game, McCown after one game, Kessler missing games with concussions, and even clipboard Jesus getting hurt all while playing in a new scheme with new coaches. How in the world do you coach your way through that?

At one point we were a TD and 2pt conversion away from tying a game where we were getting our butts handed to us. I don't think we had a prayer to do those two things, but that's where we were at one point late in the game.

The coaching could be better, the players could be better, the play on the field could be better. Our record could be better. We aren't much different than were my expectations at the start.

My biggest disappointment thus far:

How do we evaluate the new guys - darn near every one of them - on a team so potentially/apparently devoid of overall talent, decimated by injury, generally inexperienced, and in all new systems?

j/c:

A couple of positives:

--The OL actually gave Kessler a lot of time to throw early in the game. My wife is from Western PA and is a former Steeler season-ticket holder. She was screaming at the TV at them for giving our qb so much time. Of course, that changed later in the game. LOL

--Not sure how to spell his name, but I like that Boddy-Calhoun kid at CB. He closes pretty fast and is usually in good position. He might have a future here.

--Collins really is an incredible physical specimen. He stands out from our other players because he has a nice combo of size and speed.

--I liked that Pryor went back over the middle after he almost got broke in half. That showed toughness.

--Shelton did some good things. Played w/some toughness and attitude.

j/c...

Even Joe Thomas is starting to feel the frustration.

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5-11

Terrelle Pryor on QB hits: 'It's dangerous; whoever's giving up the blocks, they need to stop'

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ss...art_river_index

By Mary Kay Cabot, cleveland.com on November 20, 2016 at 9:20 PM, updated November 20, 2016 at 10:10 PM

CLEVELAND, Ohio - Terrelle Pryor can no longer tolerate the Browns quarterbacks getting pummeled without speaking up.

"I hate it," he said. "We have players that want to do great, but every time our quarterback drops back, Josh McCown, how much time he puts in it, and Cody Kessler), they can't keep getting hit like that. I don't care.

"They can't keep getting hit like that, and if I want to voice my opinion, I'm going to voice my opinion now, because it's going on too much. I don't care if you've got to hold these dudes. Hold them and take the damn penalty and stop getting our quarterbacks hit. I hate that. I don't like it.''

The Steelers, who were tied for last in the NFL with 13 sacks, registered eight against the Browns: four on Kessler and four on McCown. In addition, they had 14 quarterback hits and knocked Kessler out of the game on one of them, by linebacker Lawrence Timmons.

"I don't think somebody would take $10 million to sit back there and take those hits,'' said Pryor. "C'mon, some of those hits Josh took? After one of those, I came over and his chinstrap was like this over his neck. He has a cut right here. It's bullcrap. We can't keep doing this and we can't keep getting our guys hit. It's as simple as that.''

What can be done about it at that this point in the season, with only five games left?

"I don't know,'' he said. "We'll have to talk to our management and that's a question for them, but we can't keep getting these guys hit. I'm tired of our guys getting hit. I'm nobody to complain because I don't run it, but it's personal to me because I care for those guys and I don't like seeing them get hit like that. Point blank, period. Somebody's got to say it.''

A former NFL quarterback, Pryor said, "whoever's giving up the blocks, they need to stop that s—.''

He acknowledged, "it is dangerous. They're getting hit every play.''

He said Kessler was coherent after the Lawrence Timmons hit that knocked him out of the game late in the third quarter.

"I'm not really sure specifically what was wrong,'' he said. "I don't know. He was talking, though. He knew what was going on.''

After one third-quarter sack, Pryor was miffed on the sidelines. He was also frustrated about being open a few times in the end zone when the ball didn't come his way. Another time, he had the wind knocked out of him by safety Mike Mitchell, but refused to stay sidelined.

"I'm an ultimate competitor,'' he said. "A lot of people compete, but I (really) compete. I take it very seriously this game. It sometimes gets the best of me and I get talkative on the sideline. I just want to win at the end of the day. That's what it comes down to. We've got another opportunity next week here at home. I'm tired of letting our fans down for one. This thing's gotta change. I know coach Hue, he's putting us in the situation but like I said, we can't keep getting our quarterbacks hit.''

Despite the 0-11 record, Pryor still wants to extend his contract.

"Like I said, I love playing for Hue, I love playing for the Haslams,'' he said. "They're great owners. It's one of the best facilities and they want to win. I don't believe in taking easy roads and going to teams just because a team's great just because I want to win. I'd rather start, even if I have five, six years left to play this game, I'd rather start how we are and build an empire, a top-gun franchise.

"I believe in battling. I don't believe in taking the easy way out in anything, so whatever happens in free agency when that comes up, I'd love to be here as well. I enjoy it here. I respect the people that own it. I respect coaches. I respect Coach Hue and at the end of the day it's up to them.''

Our lineman need to spend some time with Doug Dieken

Our linemen need to spend some time behind our line playing QB.

To be fair, at least half the sacks yesterday were QBs holding the ball too long. Otoh, wayyyyy too many free runners at the QB.

I still do not see why the coaching staff should take the blame. They are trying, they have literally no talent at key positions.

j/c

Kessler was the worst we've seen him. I think the hook and Hue talking about the deep ball has effed with his head. He's no longer playing loose. People are right about his range...ball floats if he's going more than 15 yards. Not saying the kid doesn't have potential but I'm all for QB in the draft.

We gave up on running the ball way too easily. It was hit or miss but we never seemed to commit to it. You could almost feel when it was going to be a run.

Cam Erving is the biggest problem on the offensive line. Simply not good enough or strong enough. Drango has room to grow but is still obviously a rookie. Greco could be upgraded but likely sticks for another year.

Parkey hasn't done enough to be a Brown next year. SHoulda kept Coons

Higgins and Payton need to see the field more to evaluate them and see if they are worth keeping next year.

Nassib is getting washed out more. He needs to pick up some strength and mass in the offseason if he's going to stay at DE.

Shelton has gotten far better.

Safety play was decent today. Clearly better having a FS and SS rather than two SS in there.

The play where Josh got decleated summed up our QB situation

The scary thing for me is that Hue said something about Erving being a long term guy, and if he doesn't work at Center, they'll try him at RT. Yikes.

I would try him on the bench, and tell him to get to work as hard as he can in building his body, and watching tape.

I find it ironic that the QB always takes the fall when things go wrong, (sometimes deservedly, but not always) and can hit the bench ..... while players like Erving hold onto their jobs. Of course, I bet that if the other Center we had for a game had stayed healthy, he would be starting and Erving would be trying to figure out how/where to play.

if Erving is a long term guy we are in TROUBLE. the dude shouldn't be anything but a backup

Luck hasn't been tearing it up because his OL has been atrocious.. which is the conundrum we are in. Go ahead, put Prescott or Mariota or Carr on this team right now, we might have 1 or 2 wins and the QB would be on IR

OL is a problem but it's not the problem. We need a QB and playcaller who knows what the hell they are doing.

OL would magically look better after that.

IDk I watched Luck play some this year. I haven't been overly impressed. He has been chucking the ball down field when there hasn't been anything there. Yesterday, was a good example of one he threw in the 3rd quarter that was picked off. He's still a top notch QB don't get me wrong.

At #1, what other position, other than QB, holds that kind of value for a team that needs one as bad as this one? Do you draft a OL at number one? That's a big mistake IMO. On D, the only position I would take at 1 would be a LB.

I'm guessing, McCown won't make it through the next game.

Calmed down a bit since yesterday ... I can only make assumptions based on comments by Hue and the FO .. I am very worried going forward .. I am not overly impressed with this years Draft class at all so far .. Who was responsible for the Kessler pick ? Anyone who thinks Erving is an answer on the OL is delusional ! just take a look at the Safety position .. We have five drfat picks in the top 80 or so picks .. Ask this before ; who here trust this Coaching & FO staff with the picks ??

I was kind of surprised he got up from that one, but that one was his own fault as much as anyone else.

Posted by a Steeler's fan/friend on my Facebook page today:

Since 2004, Ben Roethlisberger has now won more games at Browns stadium than any other quarterback of any team-including the Browns!

I trust the FO more than I trust the coaching staff as sad as that is to say.

Cam Erving appears to be worse now than he was before we drafted him. Hal Hunter doesn't seem to be bringing the best out in any of the OL, and didn't do much in Indy while he was there either. Injuries are something he's dealt with both places, but I still wonder about the coaching. It's the mental stuff that is killing us as much as anything. Some may be the practice limits, but other teams are dealing with them, too.

Kessler seems to be getting worse each game as well. Pep was Hue's first hire and I haven't been impressed. I don't know what the disconnect is, but the QBs don't seem to be getting better.

Saunders is the only O coach who I think has done a good job, though I'm not sure how much of that is just Pryor being a freak of nature.

Nunn has done a good job with Shelton on D, but the LB coaches have been pretty underwhelming. Cioffi was dealt a poor hand, but there are some signs of improvement in the secondary(They were really bad to begin with) so I'll give him a little slack.

I think that our draft class has some talent, but like I have said all along, without any veteran "anchors", it is hard for rookies to make an impact. heck, the unit that has 2 anchors, the OL with Thomas and Greco, has major issues, How much worse is it for unit without any veteran leaders and plus level talent.

Just clicking.

My post game thoughts ....

Saw Kessler's first pass, complete to Pryor, and thought that if he threw another floater like that, it was going to be picked. Next time, it was. Almost like he wanted to prove to everyone that he could wing it deep, and ending up proving, again, that he can't.

Run defense? We don't need no run defense. At least, we don't bring one to the game.

Erving. Wow. Last year some of us, me included, mentioned that he looked weak, confused and had bad technique. We were told this was because he was out of position. Put him at center, and all would be well. Some of us, me included, wondered how a different position would improve his strength and technique. We were told not to worry, put him at his natural position and all will be well. I am revisiting this topic. What's the story now? Center is not his natural position? Because, all is not well.

Sequence at the end of the half sums up our season. We suck.

McCown owes TP one heck of an apology. Talk about hanging a guy out to dry.

My favorite was Shelton pushing Ben back down when he started to get up. Surprised that did not draw a flag, official was right there. Had that been Brady, Shelton would be behind bars on an attempted manslughter charge.

Tackle is probably his best fit physically as he simply lacks the power to play inside. I have a feeling like next year he won;t be a starter and will be the utility back-up until his rookie contract is up and then he's gonzo.

Line next year
Thomas
Bitonio
Reiter
Greco/Drango/draft pick
Pasztor/Coleman/draft pick

A little premature putting Reiter in there? Perhaps... but in his one appearance, he played better than Erving has all year and God knows we have other holes to fill.

Not precisely true.
He is tied with Derek Anderson with 10

By the end of the day Jan 1st he will have more than.

If you're getting your info from here:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/ben-ro...-qb-except-one/

It says Derek Anderson has more wins since 1999, my Steelers-fan/friend said since 2004.

P.S. I don't know if his info is correct or not, but it does hurt just as much! lol

Betting the farm on Bitonio playing a full season is a bit risky .. How many games has he played in the three seasons he has been here ..

Bitonio Game Log:

2014 - 16 games
2015 - 10 games
2016 - 5 games

It's hard for me to count on Bitonio for the future. Hope is more appropriate. The guy just can't stay healthy.

Link

Also not precisely true.
The game on January 1 is not in Cleveland.

You are right about the Jan 1st game

I didn't look at the date, I went with First Energy Stadium.

If you cherry pick dates you can say that since 2016 Tom Brady, Dak Prescott etc are tied for most wins at First Energy stadium.

Nah it's not a double standard. Our Oline and offense in general is weak and won't step up and back up our QB's if he's hit hard. They just stand there and watch while all our QB's get creamed. Any other Oline in the NFL would be pushing back hard and pulling off the defensive players who pile on. Time to shove back and stick up for our QB's big time



McCown is starting next week Hue announced it. Sure hope our oline steps up and protects him..especially after he gets creamed again.

5-11

So we won't know until next year with CK? I know now.

jc



link

I saw that snippet on NFL Network.. I'm like really dude.. what the heck are you complaining about?!!!

You know Lavauo was the last (and I think only) lineman I recall that we've had that was down to brawl. Dude was running downfield hitting people and even managed an unsportsmanlike penalty or two.

Funny thing is, I heard his name for Washington and totally forgot about him. I wish we still had him to be honest. Wasn't great, but waan't the level of bad we've had interior wise

Agreed. Kessler was closer to being down than he was to standing when he took that hit. His last concussion was due to a similar hit where he took a forearm to the head. These are some pretty vicious hits which is why I think it's not very honest when some people suggest Cody is injury prone.

I don't know how long this thread will stay up, but since you're back I wanted top ick your brain a bit about some of this O-line blocking. I certainly don't know the nuances of it, but it seems to me that our guys are getting sucked in on these double blocks. In the Ravens game when Suggs blew past Drango and smoked McCown, Drango was taking his steps outside but tried to work his way back in when he saw Suggs coming in. After the sack he turned to Erving and was like WTH?? as if he expected help to the inside. IIRC Erving had double teamed Greco's guy. Maybe that's what the protection called for, but when he did, he completely turned his back to everything on the left side of the line. I've noticed this a number of times with Erving when he double teams someone it's like he gets tunnel vision and doesn't recognize when he's going too far. And it's not just him, but the two shots McCown took from I think it was Timmons or the other dude... Greco crashes down to double team the NT with Erving and when he did, he completely turned his back on anything on the right side.

I guess my question to you is: is this normal for pass protection? I get against a 3 man rush lineman will double team after they confirm its a 3 man rush, but to immediately jump on that double team, turning your back and creating a free running lane so fast after the snap seems odd to me.

Thanks in advance for any education!