DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Gregg Williams part 2

Gregg Williams Puts Joe Haden, Rest Of Browns Defense On Notice
April 18, 2017 4:23 PM


BEREA (92.3 The Fan) – Gregg Williams has already made quite the first impression among his defensive players.


The status quo is no longer acceptable.


The new defensive coordinator of the Browns is already getting after his players and they haven’t even hit the practice field yet.


“It’s a shock, but that’s what we need,” cornerback Joe Haden said. “We need somebody that’s going to switch it up, change it up, tell us something, cuss us out, scream at us, let us know that we’re sorry right now and we’ve got to be better. I’m excited about having him here because I feel like it’s a new energy and, shoot, we need that.”


It’s a good thing Haden played through a pair of groin injuries last season, even if they adversely affected his performance on the field, because he wouldn’t be here, a point Williams made to the 2-time Pro Bowler when they met.


“When I first got here and I met him, I went up to his office and we talked for a while, just about my toughness and about the biggest thing he told me was, ‘If you didn’t play through your injury I would tell them to get you out of here,’” Haden said. “So he was in my face as soon as I met him.”


Haden has missed 14 games over the last 2 seasons due to injuries – 10 for concussions, 1 for a rib and finger injury and 3 because of a pair of groin injuries that he had surgery in January to repair.


Although he was named a Pro Bowl alternate last season, Haden has a lot to prove – to himself and Williams.


“Of course, I think I can be the best corner in the game still,” Haden said. “This is my eighth season, I just turned 28, I’m ready to get after it. Without the injuries, without the stuff – it’s been a lot, it’s been tough, trying to fight through it but I feel like when I’m out there healthy, can’t nobody mess with me.”


Williams’ presence is an eye opener for defensive tackle Danny Shelton who enters his third season with the Browns after being selected 12th overall in the 2015 draft.


“He is an intense coach,” Shelton said. “You can tell that he wants to change the culture around here. I think he is the perfect fit.”


Shelton’s sophomore campaign was a step up from year one but he still hasn’t come close to realizing his full potential, something he hopes will happen under Williams.


“It is exciting to come to work and know that he is going to have a challenge for you every day,” Shelton said. “It is going to be a lot of work this year.”


Last year the Browns’ defense was ranked near the bottom in just about every major statistical category – 30th in points allowed, 31st in overall defense, 31st against the run, 21st against the pass, 32nd in passing touchdowns allowed, 30th in turnovers, 27th in average plays per drive, 29th in average yards allowed per drive, and 32nd in average points per drive.


Williams is expecting to change those rankings in quick order, and it has already begun by him readjusting players attitudes, work habits and expectations.


“He definitely brings a different attitude. He’s very, very vocal, in your face and I feel like we definitely need that,” Haden said. “We need somebody that’s going to keep everybody accountable, me, Kirksey, Collins, Danny, he’s definitely going at us. Everybody’s on the same slate. He tells us we’ve been losing here for a reason and he’s here to change it. Just with his passion and the way he’s coming at us, we have no choice but to turn up.”


The Browns haven’t just been losing. They’ve turned it into an art form during a playoff drought that extends 14 seasons and included 12 double-digit loss campaigns. Cleveland is coming off the worst season in franchise history and the team hasn’t finished above .500 in a season since going 10-6 but missing the playoffs in 2007.


Since going 4-28 in his first 2 NFL seasons, Shelton is tired of the mounting losses and for that reason alone he doesn’t mind Williams’ in your face approach.


“I think we did need that,” Shelton said. “I think his mindset is what Cleveland needs in order for us to change and turn around the program.”

http://cleveland.cbslocal.com/2017/0...nse-on-notice/

Not sure the words he used but Coach Cowher often had stern words for his players on the sidelines. Spit flying and all. My guess is he wasn't talking about butterflies and rainbows.
I agree that it may get old if the only message is profanity. But if the message is accountability and the language used has profanity then I feel there is a difference.

I disagree in part.

I don't know if you played in college, or just high school. But for me, a coach getting in my face and yelling, screaming, and cussing WAS motivation. For me.

Millionaire players, or high school players - shouldn't matter. That millionaire makes his money playing the same game, and if he doesn't put up, he'll lose his job. They should know that.

Now, yelling and cussing and screaming is the ONLY thing the coach does, maybe you have a point.

There was a special on Bruce Arians on NFL Network and the Cardinal's owner talked about Arians being the only person he'd ever met who could use the F-Bomb as a subject, verb, and adjective in the same sentence.

I'm not really promoting it, but if it works I've got other things I'd worry about.

I'm a little unsure about this story.

In general, I think the "in-your-face" motivation tool can be effective for a coach. It could be less effective for older veterans, but we have a pretty young team, and the defense in particular is about to get even younger, it would seem, with a couple of high draft picks going towards defensive positions.
The thing is, it has to be done right. As others have mentioned, Arians and Cowher are excellent examples of being super intense in an effective manner. Further, in this situation, I think Williams is trying to set the tone and turn around a culture right out of the gate. He may be dialing up the intensity even higher than he normally would in order to wake everyone up and get them hyper focused.

The thing I don't like is telling a plus CB (I was going to say 'top CB', but I'm not sure Haden is that right now) that he would've cut him if not for the injuries. That seems like a counterproductive type of intensity. I'm sure, at some point after that part of the discussion, that Haden thought, "fine, cut me... I'll get picked up somewhere else and you'll be down another starting CB".

In general (and with some exceptions), I like the intensity as long as he doesn't get too obnoxious and dials it back to normal levels if/when the team responds.

This owner should spend some time on a tugboat, we use the f word (and most all the swear words) non-stop. In fact I have to work hard to leave that in that life. But Rarely do I use them to scold/motivate guys I'm working with. I save those for special occasions so that they count when I do use them

I think the difference (THINK) is that Williams will enforce accountability. The reason why it typically doesn't work is it is a veiled threat. A player gets yelled at over and over but keeps starting. Why would he listen. I think Williams will sit players who don't listen - JMO.

Yelling/cussing at me means crapola, sitting my butt on the bench will make me listen.

How long until we start losing draft picks due to injury policy violations?

or a de facto bounty?

Considering it's his first year, how can you tell? What other experiences have you had to say it won't have any positive results? I think it's alot better than Hortons just go out there and read the O and play what you see. Horton didn't care and I think the players knew that.

Wasn't that Haden paraphrasing? I think it might have been to the effect that Joe played poorly last season. If he'd been healthy and playing that way Williams would have gotten rid of him.

I see your point, but did you read what Haden thought about it?
Say's he needed that, that the whole Team needs it. Should say something about the "down and out" attitude about the sorry D as it is. They need some one to take a bite out of them, that was what Haden was saying....Horton flat out didn't care and they all knew it.

You ever been to basic training?

Glad Horton left. Did you see much improvement, changes, adjustments? Our D was trashy and indifferent to it or so it seemed. They need to step up. No lead was safe with that unit. Hope we have a "bounty" mentality (hard core hunters on D). I am NOT suggesting a bounty program or hurting anyone or targeting opponents in any capacity.
But we need to be a pack of dogs getting after the offense, not occasional overachievers.
And it never seemed to materialize or improve. But let us cut them loose more. Hope we draft some big hungrier and ballhawks for the D to kickstart the group. I am hopeful, at least at this point.

It can have very positive results if you are equally open with praise when it is deserved. Yelling just to yell or yelling all the time will turn folks off quick.. but if you get folks to the point where they know they will be praised when they deserve it and yelled at when they deserve it... that can have great results.

I focused on the Williams side of the story, but you're 100% right. It was a little shocking to read that players were saying that. It really speaks to the state of the defense. Don't know who that reflects on more, the players or Horton.

"Last year the Browns’ defense was ranked near the bottom in just about every major statistical category – 30th in points allowed, 31st in overall defense, 31st against the run, 21st against the pass, 32nd in passing touchdowns allowed, 30th in turnovers, 27th in average plays per drive, 29th in average yards allowed per drive, and 32nd in average points per drive."

After that you need 35 F-Bombs in the first sentence alone. Our defense needs a shaking up. Now hopefully, as you said, he'll have solutions to make it a better.

You don't know what was said. Nor do I. If it was you Ahoes suck, that's one thing. If it was you Ahoes are better than that, then it makes a difference.

A new Sheriff in town. I like it. Defense is as much attitude as it is talent. You have to have both, but just a bit more attitude wins on D if it isn't equal.

It doesn't work if you have the talent but don't have the attitude. Mingo is a good example. The guy had a boatload of talent. He was just light in the heart.

I didn't see that angle. Interesting how people see different things in the same statement. I read it as an accolade on Joes' toughness playing through the injury. In other words, if you hadn't been tough, I would cut you as you don't fit my D.

Probably some of both.

Or watch the documentary on Amazon where the Arizona Cardinals were followed for an entire season. I don't think I've seen anyone cuss as much as Bruce Arians.

I hope this guy is in their face from OTA's through game 16! Someone needs to light a fire under their ass! With no real QB and a so-so running game, our D needs to step up big time if we are going to win any games at all.

I think Rex Ryan is a close second. I really don't care what it takes. If cussing them out daily for the next 10 years is what does it that is fine with me. We need to get some toughness and if this guy can make that happen give him the keys to the city!

I think there is a huge difference in how someone curses at you. Williams just seems like he is God's personal creation to a defense. Saying things like I have the most undrafted players to have ever made the pro bowl sounds like a very boastful remark. Saying I would get you out of here if you didn't play through your injury is a little too much, IMO. No one wants to go hard for a jerk.

Edit: Read it again, and I was the one that got that wrong. Nevermind.

j/c
I know the year is 2017 but the subject is still football. Men still have to impose their will on other men or be made to submitt to the will of their opponents. This is not a delicate science. As fans we have all been clamoring for a more imposing, dominate, meaner, nastier, ruthless, unflinching defense. Many on this board have been calling for a defensive oriented draft. Well now we have a defensive coordinator who HAS gotten results by cultivating this mentality among his players. The leaders on the defense seem to be embracing this change. I don't think Williams style of engaging player was changed much by the Bountygate saga. Of course he is aware of the limits he has to operate within. The front office sought him out knowing full well how he coaches his players. As an organization the Browns are buying what Gregg Williams is selling.

Tighten your chin straps people!!!

It's about time we got a hard nosed coach. The only other coach I can think of since we came back that was somewhat tough was Mangini. He held the players accountable and if I remember correctly those teams had some discipline.

I believe they should sell ear plugs for the kids who show up to watch practice in Berea this season. They will be hearing a few more choice words flying around lol

That worked out well for us. Mangini's time here set us back so far. He was so bad that he got replaced by Pat Shurmur.

I surely hope he doesn't run a bounty program.. We don't need the distraction and I doubt Hue Jackson or Sashi Brown would go for it.

I don't know this, but I bet he's being watched closely by the league

I never had a coach in my life that didn't cuss. I mean seriously if that is all people are worried about it's a non issue to me. I mean to have a coach not get in my face and chew my arse off when I slack off doesn't even seem like it's real to me.

I"m old school when it comes to motivation. Love em like a father and treat them like they are your own flesh and blood. That means love em up when they do good and chew them up when they do bad and get them to where they want the love and not the chew. Still as a player I always felt loved when I got chewed out because I knew coach cared enough about me to make me do better. The silence or patronizing pat on the back is what killed me because then I felt coach had given up on me.

Real emotion by real men playing a real sport is what love of the game is all about to me =)

Let the hand wringing begin.

oober, I thought the coach was complimenting Joe on his toughness, playing thru an injury like he did. obviously some injuries cannot be played through and i think the coach knows the difference.

I agree wholeheartedly. Very well said. It shows you are that guy. Otherwise you wouldn't have been able to put it so simple and succinctly.

I do think that method works with grown men as well. Men are, (and any woman will tell you), still boys on the inside. Everybody reading this knows it's true. We'll still respond to a father figure if his method is as you described. Of course there will be a small number who will take offense and quit but they didn't want to play football anyhow.

And I think he was saying too, "If you played like that and wasn't injured you're pretty much through."

Great post mac.