DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Breaking: Congressman and 3 others shot at softball practice

Oh, trust me, Dawg- I agree. 100%
I just believe that this story can be about both at once.

My response to OCD was based upon his remark that 'guns are everywhere'... it was strictly in that context alone that I was posting.

The fact that this incident was also a hate crime is something I might address down the road a bit. I only just caught back up with all the posts that got dropped while I was banging out my 'eye-bleeder'....




Well, I can say this: you've been consistent in your message in these threads ;), and I've not disagreed with you even once. Not this time, either. The 'unity message' is never a waste of time/effort, and at some point, I'm sure that I'll address it in a post of mine.

This time, I wanted to keep my focus fairly narrowly targeted to gun ownership and prevalence, because that's where the conversation was, when I jumped in. I also knew the subject matter would eventually morph into the same "LibzRNewThugz v. ConzRKlanz" dialogue we've seen here a million times. I wanted to leapfrog all that, and just deal with the fact that hardcore 'wingers' from both sides have unfettered access.

Your take on this is worthy of its own thread, because it deals with a number of issues attached to Basic Human Nature (confirmation bias, 'bully' politics, the culture of victimhood, etc) that go well beyond the 'guns and politicians' theme of this thread.

If you don't start your own spin-off from this thread, I might work on your premise here in awhile. Not guaranteeing anything, because I've been mostly hanging out of these threads, of late.

Tonight, my only goal was convincing people to WIDEN their focus to understand and take ownership of the price we all pay for living in a pro-gun culture.

Clem, I don't often post in this forum. I want to, but the "sides" thing frustrates and depresses me.

I would rather look for solutions than to assign blame.

Yes, we must acknowledge injustices, but what good does it to do to just point them out and assign blame w/out fixing the problem.

Clem, what can we do to stop such hateful crimes? Where do we begin? How do we change the mindset? How do we open up our hearts and minds to be more accepting of opposing opinions, beliefs, and lifestyles? Why do we always feel the need to have a good guy and a bad guy? Why can't we try to make things better instead of hating one another?

I'm going to regress and go back to the gun issue a moment. There were not always guns. People were still murdered. Julius Caesar, Archimedes, Macbeth, Constatine I, and even Jesus Christ were killed w/out guns.

It's not about guns, bro. It's about hate and ignorance. It is my personal opinion that more effort should be placed on bridging our differences rather than widening the gap and deflecting the focus away from the real issue. I am hoping for your assistance.

I KNOW! Just glad you're not taking advantage of a tragedy to further your political views, whew, now that would be even more disgusting in a way wouldn't it. You can take the girl out of the trailer park but...

Its nice to see that you, much like perfect, would rather deflect than address the problem of violent liberals in this country.

They discovered it investigating him after this shooting. He said something about taking out Trump and Company too.

Don't put that off on just libs. Google alt-right terrorist.

Here's a sample.

http://www.newsweek.com/right-wing-terrorism-us-has-been-constant-threat-adl-report-exclusive-612492

both sides have their wingnuts, let's just leave it at that. There is no since for any of it.

So you are calling for more violence? smh, and you wonder why there is a problem between the right and left.

Whataboutism much? Isnt that what you always complain about, and now you are doing it (again, like always)

This is a thread about liberal violence, if you havent noticed.

Maybe you should get yourself a slightly broader brush and paint yourself "shameful" with it too.

Boy you really are beating your war drum in this thread huh Chief? Maybe we could take a few minutes to feel bad for those involved before we turn on each other... talk about SAD.

Not the time. We all know they are here taking advantage of this moment in time to spread hate for libs, no need to add fuel to the fire.

Trump, Ryan, Bernie and many others said the right things today. Amazing that the leadership finally seems to get it right after some crazy crap happens. A little more of this co-ownership of issues would go a long way to closing the divide.

You say "The country" like you side is 'The Country' and the libs are some kind of alien invasion. I don't think you ever think about what you are saying or how it sounds. I know I hit y'all pretty hard at times, but I would never think about hitting y'all like this after an incident like today. I know you have class, please show it.

Y'all really do depress me. Sides, sides, everywhere there are sides.

You can keep denying that liberals have a violence problem and you can stick your head in the sand. I mean your liberal celebrities are beheading trump as an attempt to be funny. It leads to episodes like this.

Keep putting your head in the sand. Its ok, we will wait for you to admit there is a problem. Then we will send you to liberal rehab

Here we go again... Please PM me and I'll give you directions to the board's snowflake safe space, after all y'all built it for me and the libs with taxpayer tears. Please just stop.

Both side have idiots. That doesn't mean we have to become idiots too does it?

Mighty big words since you where the one threatening republicans.

Signs? The song is signs.

You and 40 like to twist things and turn molehills into mountains. Do you want a tissue?

Really? I never knew that? LOL

I like playing on words.

I dont think this epidemic of liberal violence is a molehill, when they are shooting up congressmen.

But you Bernie supporters can use the tissue. Must be pretty big tears to make you shoot up a congressman.

Have you been drinking tonight Eve? You're not acting like you.

I am just aggravated. And this stupid political crap is the last straw for today lol

Stay strong. Those people are out of control and need to be contained.

You have no idea how much reflection I have given this. It's bad enough when mobs of dems target Republicans with eggs and food, stop their cars, and damage property.

Now they are actually hunting them down to kill them. You might need to reflect on who is turning on who here.

Well ain't that a load of horse crap

This thread is disgusting and completely disrespectful to the victims of this shooting.

wishing the congressmen and other victims a full recovery, and glad the hateful dog who did this got put down.

Personally, I think what I am seeing in America, I have seen before.
In the 70's, when for the first time, war was brought into our living rooms by the Media. It was the Vietnam war and it was the first time in history that Americans experienced war first hand.

Our society went nuts.
There was rioting and protests everywhere. There was a split, right down the middle of American opinions on what they were seeing for the first time. Some wanted the war to end while others called for supporting our troops and our government.

The fringe wanted to crush the hippies or to overthrow the establishment, they spit on returning soldiers while calling them baby killers. Others were appalled at what they were seeing and called the Left, UN-American Commies.

Today, with the advent of the Internet, I am seeing much the same thing. The internet has allowed the entire population to experience the varying political and social views of all America for the first time. A voice has been given to every American, from the Left to the Right and down the Middle. The nut, the insane, the prankster, the righteous and the evil. Everyone.

Our society has gone nuts.
There is rioting and protests everywhere. There is a split, right down the middle of American opinions on what they are seeing for the first time.

The Fringe wants to crush the other side. They spit on each others heartfelt views and violence is taking over.

To me, it is Déjà vu all over again.

#Oklahoma City bombing

No doubt!

It's not that difficult to understand what innocent until proven guilty means. Yet some wish to circumvent the entire legal process because of what they see as some special circumstances.

At that juncture, any person simply accused of anything can have their rights infringed upon. It's one of the most stupid arguments I've ever heard of.

As you have used unfounded accusation after accusation, without proof, to attack President Trump as quilty.
I agree, it is completely stupid.

That's just a blanket statement.

I live in Portland where it seems most people are democrats and exactly zero of them that I've talked to or seen FB posts from feel this way. Zero.

So you're with the prejudice group here... No surprise.

You know there are bad apples in every demographic. Blaming all democrats for these actions is the same as blaming all blacks in America for the LA riots. It's called prejudice. It's what's wrong with America IMO. Good day

Actually I haven't said that Trump is guilty of anything. But it appears the Republican led Senate, the Republican led Congress, the FBI, and even the Republican appointed Special Prosecutor all seem to feel there is enough evidence to investigate some of these accusations.

Somehow you wish to blame those that wish to see these accusations come to their conclusion through these investigations. You wish to point the fingers at those who report what's being said.

The best conclusion to all of this would be for nothing to be found. I hope that is how this all works out. I would get no joy from seeing the office of the President of the United states being guilty of anything that these investigations are looking into. It would only serve to weaken our democracy.

Unlike you, who swears there is nothing to any of this, I'm willing to let these investigation work themselves out to see what's going on. None of us know what that answer will be.

How come there wasn't this many comments from conservatives when the right winger shot up the abortion clinic, or the crazy right winger who shot up two Hindu dudes yelling "get out of my country". Or the guy who shot up the restaurant over pizza gate, and the countless other politically motivated shootings done by the right.

Yet we finally get a lunatic liberal, and you conservatives come out the woodwork. Devil and Excel where nowhere to be found in these threads, yet now all of a sudden, y'all won't shut up. I couldn't pay you two to stop posting.

Hilarious. In a very pathetic way.

Proving once again, this will always be a conservative dominate board, and you guys look the other way when one of your own does some dumbass crap.

Yet here is OCD, PS, myself and some other liberals immediately condemning this, just like all the other incidents. Because we don't look the other way when crap like this happens.

The double standard is absolutely ridiculous. Yet y'all wonder why I go hard in the paint on y'all conservatives all the time. The only thing you're "conservative" on is refraining from criticizing your own.

Why are you singling me out?? I've made all of but three posts in this thread, and none of which was ragging on "liberals". I hardly post on any of these threads, but it's still unfortunate when a guy goes off their rocker and shoots up a a bunch of people. I have a brother-in-law that lost a number of family members in one of these "postal" incidents.

For whatever reason, people don't want to just commit suicide anymore. They want to take as many people with them in the process. Why is that? I have no idea really.

Interesting comments. Hmmm.

GOP Rep. Sanford on Va. shooting: Trump partially responsible ‘for the demons that have been unleashed’

https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-sanfo...-134425698.html

President Trump’s rhetoric is “partially” to blame ratcheting up political tensions in the U.S., Rep. Mark Sanford, R-S.C., said Thursday on MSNBC’s “Morning Joe,” connecting the commander in chief to Wednesday’s shooting at a GOP baseball practice in Northern Virginia.

“The president is at least partially — again, not any way totally, but partially — to blame for demons that have been unleashed,” Sanford said, noting that although Trump was not responsible for the shooting, his coarse rhetoric and encouragement of violence have fostered aggression and a lack of civility in the heated political climate.

“If you let these forces play out, I think we end up at a very, very bad spot,” Sanford said. “What happened yesterday was symptomatic of it.”

At Wednesday’s shooting, a gunman fired on members of Congress practicing for a baseball game, injuring five, including House Majority Whip Steve Scalise, R-La., the No. 3 House Republican, who remains in critical condition. The gunman, James T. Hodgkinson, died from his injuries after a shootout with police.


Sanford pointed to one of Trump’s comments at a 2016 campaign rally, in which he had encouraged the crowd to “knock the crap” out of protesters.

“The fact that you know, you’ve got the top guy saying, ‘Well, I wish I could hit you in the face and if not, why don’t you, and I’ll pay your legal fees,’” Sanford said. “That’s bizarre; we ought to call it as such.”

Related slideshow: Shooting at GOP baseball practice in Alexandria, Va. >>>

The congressman also referred to a recent town hall at a senior center, during which attendees exchanged profane remarks.

“Some of these people have been frankly weird and different,” Sanford said. “They’ll say, ‘Look, if the guy at the top can say anything to anybody at any time, why can’t I?’”

Rep. Chris Collins, R-N.Y., a longtime Trump ally, took time Thursday to reflect on the role that political rhetoric can play in inciting violence. Following the shooting, Collins initially put the blame on Democrats. Hodgkinson’s apparent social media posts frequently lambasted the GOP, and at least one congressman at the baseball shooting said that he believes the shooter asked him before the rampage if people on the field were Democrats or Republicans.

“I did lash out. … After, you know, the emotion of that instance wore off, an hour or two later, I looked in the mirror and said, ‘That’s not the right tone,’” Collins said on CNN’s “New Day,” adding, “I’m willing to admit that was wrong for me to say, that would actually be going in the wrong direction, and I myself am gonna try to tone down some of my rhetoric.”

Collins also criticized Trump for blasting a Washington Post report of a possible obstruction of justice investigation into Trump’s firing of FBI Director Robert Mueller. “I would have certainly not advised that that tweet go out today because we’re still very much reacting to yesterday’s shooting,” Collins said on “New Day.”

Sanford, who called for more bipartisanship in caucuses and legislation, expressed concern that people won’t take a step back and learn from the shooting.

“[We need] to say, ‘Wait a minute, this is a pause moment. What might I do a little bit differently in the way that I reach out to other members [of Congress]?” Sanford said.

Yea, now the shooting is Trumps fault.

Not Continued Liberal aggression at all!