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Cleveland Browns’ secondary ranked 27th in the NFL by PFF

https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/7/18/...-the-nfl-by-pff

The analytics site churned out another positional ranking, and this time they weren’t as kind to Cleveland’s secondary.
by Chris Pokorny@DawgsByNature Jul 18, 2017, 3:54pm EDT

On Tuesday, Pro Football Focus ranked all 32 NFL teams’ secondaries. While the Cleveland Browns scored incredibly well a few weeks ago for their offensive line, the analytics website isn’t quite as high on the Browns’ secondary yet, despite several key additions this offseason.

PFF ranked the Browns at No. 27 overall and provided the following assessment:

The Browns would love to get rookie first round pick Jabrill Peppers signed and on the field as much as possible this year, but for 2017 expect recent addition Calvin Pryor to be the starting strong safety. In three years with the Jets, he successfully defended just six of 99 throws into his coverage, and missed a total of 38 tackles. Jamar Taylor and Jason McCourty should help the cornerback group, as Taylor had an overall grade of 82.0 last year with the Browns while McCourty had two picks and eight pass break-ups in Tennessee. Fans in Cleveland will also hope for an improved season from CB Joe Haden, who finished with a 46.0 overall grade, or 88th overall at the position last year.

Although we might end up seeing Jabrill Peppers is a multi-purpose role when it comes to his playing time, it’s a little surprising to see PFF almost acknowledge that he will be a reserve safety in year number one. I don’t see it, and I don’t think Calvin Pryor is good enough to convincingly win a job over him.

PFF AFC North Secondary Rankings, July 2017
Team 2017 Preseason Post-2016 Pre-2016 Ovr. Change
Ravens 7 10 24 17
Steelers 12 11 21 9
Bengals 18 16 11 -7
Browns 27 28 25 -2

Looking at the rankings heading into last year, it’s baffling to think how a secondary that projected Tracy Howard and Ibraheim Campbell to be the starting safeties even warranted being ranked as high as No. 25. The Browns’ secondary has added three promising pieces since then in Peppers, Pryor, and McCourty, yet they’ve dropped two spots to No. 27. We can’t look into that too much, as the Browns’ secondary needs to have a “we’ll prove it” mentality if they want to garner more respect.

The Ravens have seen a significant jump over the past year, now being ranked as high as No. 7 overall. A big component of that is just how well Eric Weddle turned out for Baltimore a year ago. They also signed free agent safety Tony Jefferson this offseason, giving the club the best safety combination in the NFL. Drafting Marlon Humphrey at cornerback and signing free agent cornerback Brandon Boykin also helped strengthen their secondary.

I am surprised we are not lower. I read the PFF article and apparently they don't value rookies much, as they had both the Jets and Indy behind us.

We'll see...

I'm not surprised by their rankings it's about what I expect.

I am surprised that they have Pryor over Peppers at FS I don't see that happening.

This unit could potentially finish higher IF like they say Joe Haden returns healthy and is productice.

Peppers isn't a Free Safety.

Pryor at least played it in College.

Why are you surprised?

Not trying to start anything w/either your or ed........but, I thought the article said SS rather than FS. Am I wrong about that?

I admittedly didn't read it.

I believe/assume we'll have a solid rotation of Safeties. Possibly at both positions.

I'd love to see if McCourty can covert to FS. I think he'd be a solid presence back there.

And I don't doubt that if Pryor and Peppers are both SSs that we still might see both on the field at the same time.

I just went back and looked. Here is what it said:



Might have been a typo on ed's part. I do that on occasion, especially after the glasses of wine pile up. LOL

I think both of them end up being tweener LB/S types.

I expect kindred to start at fs. Peppers as slot/will role on lots of blitz opportunity and Pryor to be more of your starting ss.

Mourg, I love you man, but Kindred absolutely sucks at FS. He is clueless back there and it was a huge upgrade from him to Reynolds last year, even though Reunolds is terrible, too.

Typo on my part.

Not surprised by their ranking of the secondary.

But I think Peppers should/will start ahead of Pryor at SS.

Hey buddy, Am I wrong in thinking that Kindred played at SS and ED played at FS last year?

I also think that if I remember right, that Ed came on in that last four games last year?

Kindred loves to hit people, which is good. not so much in coverage, which is bad.

I've mentioned Kindred starting at FS before and got the same replies.

I believe Kindred will grow and earn a few believers. He was a rookie last year, mistakes were expected, and now he can use those as a learning experience.

You are thinking of later in the year when Reynolds took over at FS and Kindred just played SS. However, earlier in the year, there were times when IC and Kindred played together and one of them would be cast in the FS role.

Both were horrid, especially when playing as the deep safety.

Browns wowed by versatility of Jamie Collins, will find spots to 'cut him loose'

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/arti...f8-6d7f84c09447

Back in June, on the final day of offseason workouts, the Browns held something of a lighthearted skills challenge where offensive linemen tried to field punts and linebackers tossed footballs into kicking nets.

It was all no sweat for Jamie Collins, who threaded a pass with ease and promptly celebrated with his teammates.

Shortly after that whole session, defensive coordinator Gregg Williams was asked if he was surprised by Collins — the Pro Bowler whom the Browns re-signed earlier this year — and his passing prowess. Williams shook his head and smiled.

“You all don't really get a chance to see how really good he is at lots of things,” he said.

Browns linebackers coach Blake Williams offered a similar stance. “You see that little competition we were having at the end of practice, and I think we had like 15 straight guys missed it,” he said. “He’s like, ‘Just give me the ball.’ Bam. Just drains a 30-yard throw at the net on first throw, but he just does stuff like that all the time and so it’s great to have guys like that around and he’s a great competitor.”

Collins, who landed in Cleveland last year after a midseason trade with the Patriots, is expected to help anchor a young defense that added two first-round picks in defensive end Myles Garrett and safety Jabrill Peppers. And since making the decision to stay in Cleveland despite a trying 1-15 season in 2016, the often-reserved Collins has endeared himself to the coaching staff.

“He’s gonna be mad because I’m telling you this … but he’s very intelligent,” Gregg Williams said. “He was a high school quarterback, and really would have liked to play quarterback in college.”

“I don’t want to give out all of Jamie’s secrets, but no, Jamie is a smart football player,” Blake Williams added. “Now, he has been very well coached. We all know that. We all know where he came from. He has been very well coached in New England. That’s great for us coaches to be able to coach off of that coaching.”

Gregg Williams, the 27-year veteran whom the Browns hired in January, has built five top-five defenses and a Super Bowl winner by fielding the best 11 players, regardless of position. It’s why he said every member of the defense will learn two positions. It’s also why he, half-jokingly, said Collins — who played safety at Southern Mississippi — could line up all over the field if need be.

“He’s begging me to play safety,” Gregg Williams said. “And I’m not saying he couldn't be the best one out there right now. If he wanted to play defensive end, he could play defensive end.”

“There's lots of things about his versatility,” he continued, “that it’s gonna be fun and challenging to find spots to cut him loose."


Video from Gregg Williams

How many versions have we read of the same story?

Must you complain about everything...if you've read it already pass it by.

Looking for an argument again geesh.

I asked a question. You cried about it.

Don't judge me! Focus on yourself rather than others.

Must you complain about everything...if you don't like what I have to say, pass it by.

Looking for an argument again geesh.

Cleveland Browns training camp 2017: Linebackers preview

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/07/cleveland_browns_training_camp_152.html

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Stability has been a rare thing for the Browns in regards to personnel over the years, so it was a welcome change when they were able to approach free agency and the draft with their linebacker position mostly settled.

That’s because Christian Kirksey was coming off of his best pro season and Jamie Collins didn’t hesitate to sign a new contract the week the Browns arrived in Alabama for the Senior Bowl. Kirksey signed his own extension this spring.

New defensive coordinator Gregg Williams’ calling card is pressure and, while the defensive line will be the focal point of that ability, it’s going to be the linebackers who can take it to the next level. It’s also going to look very different, now that Ray Horton’s 3-4 has been jettisoned. Emmanuel Ogbah is officially a full-time defensive end -- he essentially was last season, too. Nate Orchard has moved up to the line, too, as has Cam Johnson.

The defensive line preview is coming next week. For now, here’s a look at the back line of the front seven.

Returning players

Jamie Collins

Williams raved about the former Patriot when he met with the media at the end of the offseason program. Collins is probably the most athletic player in this group and, when he’s fully engaged and used properly, has the potential to be the most disruptive force as well. He’ll play outside in the Browns’ base defense, but he’s versatile and, wherever he plays, expect him to be on the field for close to every play.

Christian Kirksey

The leader of the defense a season ago is moving to the WILL this season. That doesn’t mean moving back inside in the base look isn’t an option. He had 148 tackles a year ago and was one of the few players on the roster who seemed to play better as the season went along. He’ll be expected to improve on his career year now that he’s entering Year 4 and is one of the key veterans on a young group.

Tank Carder

He’s made his career on special teams, but he was working with the first team at middle linebacker during the spring when the defense lined up in its 4-3 base. Will that be the case when the season opens? Will it matter if the Browns spend most of their time in nickel? When they are in base, will it be more likely that Collins or Kirksey moves inside? Time will tell.

Joe Schobert

He won a starting outside linebacker job last season, but that role evaporated quickly and Horton’s 3-4 is gone. Schobert is one of the few outside linebackers from last year not moving to the defensive line and his best bet to earn a spot on the 53-man roster might be on special teams, especially since Kirksey and Collins both offer versatility at the position and rookie safety Jabrill Peppers could move up into the box in certain situations.

Dominique Alexander

Signed as an undrafted free agent last season, Alexander was used mostly as a special teamer and that’s his most likely home this season as well.

James Burgess

He bounced around practice squads last season before landing with the Browns practice squad in December.
(Photo by John Kuntz, cleveland.com)

Deon King

The Browns signed King in June. He appeared in six games last season, four with the Colts and two with the Chargers.
The rookies

B.J. Bello

The Browns signed Bello as an undrafted free agent out of Illinois State. Bello transferred from Illinois in 2016. He started 11 of 12 games last season, finishing with 67 tackles, six sacks and two forced fumbles.

Ladell Fleming

He played 47 games and started 13 at Northern Illinois. The undrafted free agent collected 104 career tackles, 7.5 sacks and two forced fumbles.

Kenneth Olugbode

Another undrafted free agent, the Colorado product notched 299 career tackles, 10 passes defensed, five fumble recoveries and three INTs in 41 games in college.

Projected starters

It’s Kirksey and Collins and then everyone else. The secondary is intriguing, especially at safety, but mostly because of how unsettled it all is. This position is intriguing because there are some real opportunities for Williams to do some damage built around his two key cogs.

I was really expecting to hear more about Schobert having a chance to start.. not Carder..

I think its probably just talk...but it would be cool and useful to see Collins get to rush the passer more...even as a true edge rusher with either Ogbah or Garret kicked inside in known pass rush situations.

Based on what, his play at the Univ. of Michigan; or is Calvin Pryor that bad in your eyes?

I think when the regular season games start, other teams are going to exploit the Browns "over rushing" of the passer, and the area the Browns will be weak in is controlling the edge on defense.

I don't know....i'm not sure what you mean by "over rushing"...and not sure how/if it relates to my post about Collins.*shrugs*

I feel Peppers is a much better prospect then Pryor.
Pryor has proven to be a poor tackler and Peppers enters the league as a good tackler.
In man coverage Pryor can't dream of covering as well as Peppers.
Peppers is bigger, faster, quicker....you name it.

In my view the only positive Pryor has over Peppers is experience.

In my view, neither one has demonstrated the ability to cover effectively.

Yea was gonna say, Pryor aint much in coverage but damn I saw Peppers miss on jams more than stevie wonder making a PB&J sandwich.

That's fair because Peppers in college didn't play the same position or role he's projected to play in the NFL.
In college played LB, CB and NB. In the NFL he's projected to play SS.

Imo watching him on film in man coverage he clearly shows the ability to match/mirror and trail to an extent that Pryor has never shown. Even in college you wouldn't have Pryor lined up at CB.

Do you think Pryor is better in coverage then Peppers will be?

browns defense 15th overall
browns offense 8th in rushing 23rd overall

Both suck in coverage. Technique wise Peppers is about as raw as you get but he does have loose hips to work with. Now Pryor cant cover much either and imho is a true zone safety. I wouldn't say one is better than the other right now but Peppers could improve in this area if he really focuses on learning proper hand technique to gowith some decent feet and hips.

Although I don't agree; jumping up to 15th overall on defense would be awesome.

May I ask what makes you so bullish?

Slow time before the season.

Updated offense productivity predictions From Football Outsiders:

2017
Overall Offense----->22nd up from 28th
Passing Offense----->23rd up from 26th
Rushing Offense----->8th up from 13th

1. The last 3 times any team has had 3 first round picks they made the playoffs.


2. The last 3 times the Browns drafted a WR with their first pick ,(Corey Coleman), they made the playoffs 2 years later.


Browns use offensive explosion to win 7 of their first 8 games, start out 8-1

Finish up 10-6 beating Green Bay and Baltimore down the stretch.

,If they can get into the playoffs,
I think the Browns can win a playoff game this year.

I'll bet that the Browns will not be ranked as high as 22nd in overall offense. I can't see it.

I can see it, but only if Crowell and Johnson both go nuts. Not likely.

I think the running game is going to be one of the best in the league.

DK will add his own rush yards + the threat he provides to the backside pursuit/contain + the vertical passing game threat all in conjunction to an improved OL, re-newed commitment to the run game and a incrementally improved defense.

The receiving lost Pryor but they replaced him with Britt and Coleman should (barring injury) continue the progression of a year 2 receiver.

It might be a but bullish but the weapons compare favorable to Flaccos rookie year Ravens.