DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns acquire Sammie Coates from Steelers

Why make it black or white? It's simply good PR when you are selling a product...

I know Jim Donovan, the Brown's Broadcaster, said Haden was our third best corner, during our 3rd pre-season game. I do not know if this was his evaluation, or what he had been told by members of the coaching staff. If the evaluation came from the coaching staff, that could be the reason for the FO wanting to reduce Haden's pay.

Is it really black and white? Hue stated that Haden was doing very well. That he wanted him here. I don't believe there's two sides to that. Unless you just don't believe Hue. He also said trust me in regards to Kessler.

I mean I can understand things being black or white if ther were two sides to him comments, but there's not.

Some people expect contracts to be honored.

I understand what the front office is trying to do here, and I don't think people understand the whole money side of it.

Is Joe Haden worth his salary? No. Is having him on the roster as a third CB going to get us into the playoffs where we otherwise wouldn't? Probably not. So what benefit does having Joe on the roster give us? Another win or two in what is likely a non-playoff year>? Is that worth the extra cost?

What does not having Joe on the roster give us? Added cap space for next year and potentially a better draft pick for next year's first round. Does that help us this year? Not at all, but since we're not a playoff team to begin with, do we really want to sacrifice a token win here or there for long-term benefits?

If we turn around next year and sign Jimmy Garroppolo, Alshon Jeffery and DeAndre Hopkins in Free Agency because we actually have the cap space, then nobody is going to care that we didn't have Haden this year.

I always thought the HC and the GM were supposed to play and keep the players that give you the best chance to win. They even stated that their plan is to"win now". What you're describing is just the opposite of that.

The head coach, yes. The GM not necessarily. The GM needs to plan for the long-haul and if that means *potentially* sacrificing a few wins that makes us 5-11 instead of 7-9, but gives us much more cap flexibility down the road, then that's what we should be doing. That's a big difference from out-right trying to lose.

The goal for everyone is still to win as many games as we can anyway, and if we can do it with the younger core rather than the washed up vets, then we're much better off in the future. If anything, we get to test out the younger guys that we hope can be our core in a few years, rather than pay for an older guy that's not going to be a part of our longer term plans anyway.

You know that this goes both ways right? How many players hold out every year because they want more money, or that they "outplayed" their contract? Aaron Donald still hasn't reported the week of the first game. Does he deserve more money? Absolutely. Is he honoring his current contract? Absolutely not.

I get both sides of it, but the door swings both ways as well.

Good post, DeviceD. Don't think it rambles. Love a young and healthy Haden. Hasn't been here for quite awhile. Losing a major player will hurt you. I thought he was in a fading career.
I would have kept him as a safety, but the money was too steep for a dialed back role. He may torch us some. But he is just one more to beat.

I do not trust some of the judgment I have seen. Fingers crossed.

In an ideal world, this is true. When you have to deal with the cap, contracts, etc. things change.

Sahsi and Hue did their due diligence on this one.

They searched on Ebay for a time machine to put Haden into, but couldn't find one.

They thought they found one on Craigslist, but it did not seem up to snuff.

Craigslist Time Machine

My confusion with the narrative post CUT is if Haden was your 3rd or 4th ranked CB...why even offer him a reduced contract....7 million would still be more than your top 3 CB's combined correct?

HACK

j/c:

I think it is dumb to cut players that are better than the players who will replace you.

I keep reading about getting rid of older players, but isn't McCourty older than Joe?

All of these posts that excuse the FO for every single move they make is not a good idea. It typically ends up in the coaches getting fired.

Y'all never learn!

I think that CB will be high on our board come next april.

The time machine was to go back before he got hurt. He hasn't been the same since.

I probably would have kept him, but he was probably 3rd and maybe 4th on the roster. It's been two years of futility now and he still didn't look like the Haden of old in the preseason.

Just look at what Gronk did to him ...

It makes sense from a development standpoint to let younger guys play to see what they've got....Haden wasn't at pro bowl level....JMHO....saw him beat regularly in preseason....just like last year/s....Hue's quote on Kessler...trust me...is that statement FOREVER...like a marriage/ they breakup all the time....Hue saw Kessler expensively last year- good guy/ accurate/works his butt off....BUT NO Physical WOW factor/ he's an OK backup/maybe...trust me was BEFORE he saw and evaluated him in eight games last year....trust me is over, gone, done....note, Kizer is the next placeholder to see if he has "IT".....and lot more coaches have sung his praises than Kessler's.....would not bother me if Kessler was cut.....GO Browns!!!!

Younger guys? Like McCourty?

May I ask how he went from first to third or fourth after he was cut?

That's easy. Watch his preseason film.

I have. And I criticized him. But, the other guys suck, too.

Now, tell me I have an agenda and am a hypocrite. It never ends.

Okay, you have an agenda and you are a hypocrite and it never ends.

Thanks.

It's simple. The FO and/or the coaching staff didn't think Haden was as good as the guys they "replaced" him with. Time will tell whether that is true or not.

Haden isn't the same player he used to be. I think everyone can agree on that. He isn't worth 11 million a year either. I would have kept him given the choice, but it's not my money.

And enough with the condescending "Y'all never learn" crap. You aren't smarter than everyone else.

It's not as simple as you make it. I think it was a financial decision.

Why would you keep him on the roster at a reduced salary if he was as bad as some people are saying?

Please answer that question and stop spinning.

Furthermore, I probably am more intelligent than all of the guys I am arguing w/on these football threads. I'm probably better looking, too. More athletic for sure. Higher moral character is another area I rule in. With all that said, my most charming quality is how humble I am despite all of my greatness.

Lighten up, Francis.

I have Kizer and Duke Jr in one of my ffl. was thinking of picking up Coates/ Coleman to experiment with.

I like Coates' speed.

That would probably be a mistake, bro.

Maybe Coleman?????????????

I can't answer for others, but I would have kept him at a reduced salary. I don't think Haden is awful, but he isn't good either. He is a middle of the pack CB with a top of the pack salary. I'm sure money played a roll in cutting him to some extent, but the FO and coaching staff would be stupid to cut their best corner based on money. They obviously don't think Haden was their best corner.

The team valued the cap space we gained over Haden's potential play on the field. It's that simple. Whether you agree with that is another discussion entirely.

You did not answer my question.

I asked if he was as bad as people are saying, why would they have retained him at $7 million?

It's because you are asking a stupid question. I never said he was that bad. I can't answer for people who may have said he was terrible. You are asking me to defend a statement I didn't make.

Obviously the FO wanted to bring his salary more in line with his ability. Haden refused. End of story.

yea I settled on Coleman. this team is just a play around team for me. My other two leagues very serious stuff there. lol

but for this team I wanted to play around with Browns players...so Kizer, Coleman, Duke Jr, Devalve, Browns Def.


maybe Coates if he steps in a does good.

Good guy, good leader, liked in the locker room. They may have wanted to show loyalty and have him retire as a Brown. They had the money to spend. They could use the depth.

Just throwing a few possibilities out there.

Asking why they would have kept him at $7 million is a stupid question? LOL........whatever you say.

Come on man. Way to ignore the rest of the post.

If they didn't view Haden in their long term future, that means the contract he has wasn't worth it anymore, especially if it's true that other guys on the team were outplaying him in preseason and such.

I'm a huge Haden fan but...I get it.

Well, on things like Haden and Kessler, things change. I'm sure Hue still thinks that Kessler as the skills and temper to do the job, but Kizer fits better. That's not changing his mind on Kessler other than to say, we found a better one.,

As for Haden, I think we've all seen the decline due to injuries,, so Hue may have just been trying to build him up knowing we may want to trade him.