DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus President Trump Calls Out Sports Figures II

This also stuck out to me in your comments. Not trying to pick on you, but I hear this a lot. The ones calling for a ban, are not experts either. And like I tried to point out, none of them have an answer as to what laws, what punishments, etc need to be put in place. Its all vague nonsense. They will not answer as to what laws they want to impose, because they know they want a ban on ALL guns, not just "common sense" gun laws.

The only thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.

Unless of course the bad guy has Fort Knox in his hotel room, mods to make his rifles fully automatic, mapped out vintage points in order to shoot at concer goers, cameras to make sure nobody rolls up on his room unexpected, and at an angle that makes it impossible for anybody to shoot back at him.

Oh, and then commits suicide before anybody could take him alive.

The country is getting sick of the gun nuts talking less about ways to prevent these sort of things, and more of an instant “don’t take my guns”.

Willit, you keep talking about nobody has the answer about what laws, but you gun nuts aren’t talking about how the fact that you ALSO have no answer on how to deal with this.

You don’t want people advocating for a full gun ban or tougher restrictions, then it’s time for you gun nuts to actually join the conversation and bring up ways to prevent situations like this.

Cause nobody cares about these empty ass thoughts and prayers, when all it becomes is a way to not discuss or take action on the problems.

People are tired of mass shootings. People are tired of being told that gun laws don’t work just because you’re scared about having your weapons taken. People are tired of seeing schools, movie theaters, clubs and concerts being shot up.

And people are tired of being told a false narrative that good guys with guns can stop bad guys with guns.

You don’t want the country coming for your guns? Then you better start coming up with viable solutions, because the country is increasingly becoming deaf to the “gun restrictions don’t work” rhetoric.

Gun bans don't work. All you have to do is look at what has happened with terror attacks in Europe. In most European countries, assault rifles and similar are either illegal or extremely difficult to attain. And oddly enough, they are often used anyway. One such example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2015_Paris_attacks

Where guns are not used, bombs, trucks, and machetes are used instead-- often with similarly tragic results as what we just witnessed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_attack

The city of London is averaging more than one acid attack per day. Hard to believe but it's true... look it up.

It is a fact of life in a Free Society.
You have to be lucky to stop a lone wolf terrorist.

As far as Legislation is concerned, this guy didn't care about no stinking laws, he was on a mission and set it up over time. Much planning went into his attack.

Everybody who carries a hidden gun on the streets has broken a whole bunch of laws and it doesn't stop them.

We have laws and stiff penalties for Rape, murder, etc but it does not stop anyone from committing those crimes. The person who plans a murder first plans his attack and then plans his getaway to beat the Cops.

Laws are only effective on the law a abiding.
Laws only give us a sense of retribution after a crime is committed.

If you are looking for prevention, laws don't work. A simple solution is when you have an outdoor event like this, you have Cops on the ground and then you assign 2 or 3 of those Cops to be in positions on rooftops to observe the surrounding buildings for snipers.

He didn’t care about the laws because he didn’t break any prior to the shooting.

Everyone is a law abiding citizen, until all of a sudden, they aren’t.

Haus sorry but how many MORE gun deaths would Europe and Australia have if they were allowed to have guns?

Gun violence isn’t common in Europe, which is why when it happens it’s a big deal. There’s a reason why when Australia banned guns, the number of gun deaths plummeted.

Here in America? Just another day in the office.

Tougher punishments on the laws currently in place. I have said this before. Everyone uses the Drunk driving analogy on the left. However it wasn't until drunk driving was ENFORCED with tougher punishments that it declined.

Its discussed every time, you just don't like the end of the discussion and how it turns out.

You do realize that gun ownership has increased while violent crimes have decreased right? Mass shootings are up, while gun free zones are up right? Why are all these mass shootings at places guns are not allowed? Now this case in particular, someone with a firearm would not have done a thing against him, but at other mass shootings...... unfortunately we will never know.

there are roughly 2.5 million instances a year where a weapon is used in self defense. That is a lot of good guys stopping bad guys.

Sounds like a threat, maybe the left should come up with actual policies that would impact it. Face it my man, more people are for the 2nd amendment. I personally think there needs to be more punishments for the laws we have. but bans do nothing. come at it with a different argument.

Banning guns assures the law breaker that he can kill at will.
The people of America have a RIGHT to defend themselves.

The gun in America is the equalizer for the common man that he can defend himself against the stronger.

Otherwise, like Europe or Australia, you are left to throw stones at the stronger aggressor or oppressive government.

As a gun owner (including an AR15) I'm well aware what a stock is and what it does/doesn't do. A Bump Stock is a hack that manipulates how the trigger is pulled:



You rest your trigger finger on the stock part that protrudes past the trigger, and pull the gun forward so the trigger is released by your resting finger on the stock. This is because the stock has a spring that lets you pull the gun closer to you. When the gun fires, it pulls back because of the gas blowback into your shoulder, but the spring then pushes back, repeating the process, hence full auto fire without a selective fire dial.

Gage, I know what a butt stock does. I am saying that the rate of fire form the videos I have seen/heard seem way to fast even with a mod. Which is really just an opinion, and honestly can be very difficult to tell with the echos and sounds bouncing off the buildings, 2 shots may seem like one.

There are demographic and cultural differences between the United States and other countries that make one to one comparisons problematic.

It's a moot point anyway though because a full out gun ban is a nonstarter. It won't happen, period, no sense in even debating about it.

Could less drastic measure be implemented? Perhaps, but that's really getting off-topic on this thread. Also be prepared to give something to get something. You want changes to gun laws, I want changes to the refugee/immigration system... you get the idea.

Then again, that would require compromise, something that may have a small chance of happening here on Dawgtalkers but no chance whatsoever in Washington.

Time to lock this thread and start a new one?

I'm not even sure if we need a new one. President Trump got his point across loud and clear, and most of the players who kneeled are back to standing again

I don't like how the discussions end because it always end with guys like you who don't want to do anything.

59 people are dead. And your answer is to do nothing.

j\c
Maybe they could train 50,000 ATF agents to go out to the highest gun crime areas and start rousting up all the bad guys , cause I,d rather see our taxes go to the safety of Americans instead of billions given to the illegals. That wont happen because the progressive wont let it happen cause that's to precious of a voter base, after all if worked and were all safe they wouldn't have conservatives to blame for gun problems.
Now go ahead and attack me LIBS

Not standing for the National Anthem is UnMurican!

Banning guns is also UnMurican!

Having existing gun laws and not enforcing them is UnMurican!

Illegal Aliens are UnMurican!

Then why did you insist a stock has nothing to do with the ROF?



It's ok to be wrong on something at first glance, we're still collecting a ton of data here. The authorities are wisely not elaborating too much yet as it's still super early in the investigation. He may well have used a SAW for all we know.

I stated exactly what the answers are you refuse to accept the fact that harsher punishments deter things more than just unnecessary laws.

I find it ironic you think laws against weed and the war on drugs does nothing, but want laws for guns which will do nothing. its not the law that needs added or written, its the punishment for breaking said laws.

I have yet to hear your ideas on the subject as well. which is funny, like the immigration situation most leftist will not say what they want. They want to ban guns completely and have open boarders....

my original comment I say stock, not butt stock. I was referring to that. that is my fault. still, the butt stock makes it easier, but to me it still sounds like the rate of fire was just too fast. but taking into account echos between buildings etc it could make the rate of fire seem faster when just hearing sounds.

The flaw in your argument is that weeds laws aren't comparable to gun laws.

One is smoking weed. The other involved the power to take a life. The more you post the worse you look.

nope, the more you dodge the question and have not actual ideas on the subject the worse you look. Again, ill ask which you will more than likely dodge again, what are your solutions? You point the finger saying the right wont listen, but I don't hear any words coming out of anyone's mouth on the left with details. just vague insinuations to rally their base in outrage.

The left says we need background checks - ok well we have background checks, what exactly do you mean? What type of background check, criminal or medical etc?

---no background check would have stopped this massacre, the guy had no red flags, was vetted to work for the government in various positions etc. No criminal record.

The left says we need "semi automatic bans" - well that's about just 80% of any pistol someone is carrying. So that's a ludicrous statement.

--do you want to ban certain mods to weapons? I can get on board with that. But I want to know what mods you are talking about. Some mods to weapons do have very practical uses, you can just ban all weapon mods. and you can ban them, but most are pretty easy to forge yourself regardless.

The left says we need "automatic bans" - we already have those. they are still out there. banning them has done nothing.

Any that I missed? I am sure you will deflect again.

Banning freedom of speech and peaceful protests is UnMurican but you're all for that. Hypocrite

Fake News. Not true.




So does 70% of all republicans.

Oh by the way I watched a law enforcement agent using a bump stock he was firing off rounds timed up to nearly 800 per minute. A factory AR fully auto fires up to 900 per minute max per specs usually more like 800 per minute.

And part of the problem is that when somebody with the background and the research to be called an expert speaks out.. if they agree with a persons view, they flaunt that opinion.. if they do not agree, then they discredit and try to invalidate it.. rather than considering ALL of the opinions of folks with the background to be considered an "expert"..


I don't know if they are being targeted because they are known gun free or if it's because they are just very high profile and easy soft targets any way.


Most of the time the person who uses the gun in a mass shooting is expecting to die (and does die) during the commission of the crime... so I don't see the death penalty for the shooter as a major deterrent. Increase the penalty for those who sold him the kit to make it a full auto? I don't know.


That's why I haven't used any of those words which are always used incorrectly. But what is equally troubling is the response you frequently see from the right regarding violent crime NOT involving a gun.. some guy stabs his wife and it gets "maybe we should outlaw all knives".. or a guy in Japan beats somebody to death with a hammer "I guess we should outlaw all hammers"... those are just moronic responses that contribute NOTHING to the dialogue... and I appreciate that you haven't gone there...

But for those that do go there, I'll tell you what.. the first time somebody kills 58 innocent people, from a hotel room 1500 feet away, with a knife or a hammer.. I promise you that I'll entertain that line of thinking.

Fake News!

Lies. But not surprising from you.

Referring to the United States of America as "Murica" is unAmerican.

HAhaha, that one is a real stretch.

Yeah...Thor and his hammer would have trouble accomplishing that. But he's a good guy so no need to worry.

When you guys try to defend your families from home invaders with just a knife, I will listen.

What lies? Your crew speaks for themselves. You all want to ban freedom of speech and peaceful protest.

Well, I'm not one calling for a ban.. so there is that.


Why is the gun community sitting back waiting for others to throw out ideas when all they are going to do is shoot them all down? (pun fully intended)

Why doesn't the right have any ideas? Those who buy guns, sell guns, deal in guns.. aren't they the ones who might have the best ideas? Yet they are content to stay on the sidelines and wait for everybody else to throw out ideas and laws.. that's why I said what I said before, it makes the gun owning community look very cold-hearted.. people are dying, innocent people.. at a rate WAY higher than almost every other developed first world nation... and the response from the gun community is "We have laws, not much else we can do here"...

Fake News!
I have no crew.
You said I was against those things.

Lies, continued lies.

Banning freedom of speech and peaceful protests is UnMurican but you're all for that. Hypocrite

40 says we are. He's always right.

Once again you lie.
I am for free Speech and protesting is a Murican as Racism uh Apple pie!

I have explained it to you a bunch of times but you just want to push your lie. It is too obvious.

Fake News!

You are now the CNN of DT!

So you want new laws and new guidelines for municipalities and law enforcement but are ok with the gun laws on the books. Man you crack me up.

You’re correct in this case. You being “always right” IS fake news.

Fake News!

Read what I said in your quote! Where do I call for new laws on municipalities?

It will take new laws and guidelines for municipalities and law enforcement to put men/swat teams on the roofs or in private buildings that have no affiliation to the outdoor event. Many building owners probably don't want these events near them anyways now.

Fake News!
It only takes the Chief of Police to station a few Cops on Rooftops. I never said snipers, or Swat Teams. I only said station 2 or 3 cops on rooftops to watch the buildings.

Sheeze, you stretch like MSNBC and Lie like CNN

Pretty sure the police at the Vegas event were armed protecting families. Guess what 40, people still died and all the firearms available at the event couldn't do a thing or get off a single shot.