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Its not as bad as it seems ... NOT EVEN CLOSE ...
Respectfully, it is bad. In fact, things are absurdly bad. The Browns have played 428 minutes of football this year and have only had a lead for 5:06 of the time. The Browns are 1-22 under the current regime. The Bears managed to win two games in a row this season which their QB completed only 12 passes combined in those wins. The Browns are 4-40 since changing their uniforms. Sixteen teams alone won at least four games in a row last year. The Browns are now 20-67 since the Haslam's took ownership. The ineptness has reached comical proportions at this point. We all have different coping mechanisms, however (not specifically directing that at you, Diam). With Joe Thomas out, our QBs will get absolutely pounded and I'm afraid things are going to spiral out of control at warp speed. The cracks have already started forming.
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Please stop making things up. There is no evidence that Hue didn't want Myles and/or Watson. Zero. Take them with a grain of salt, but rumors before the draft were that the front office wanted Trubisky and Hue Jackson/the coaching staff wanted Myles Garrett. As far as the Watson thing goes, the only thing we know on that front is that Hue Jackson says he did not text Watson, "Be ready." I want to make this clear. I am NOT saying who is responsible for the picks. What I AM saying is that device [and others who like his BS posts] is making things up when they say stuff like Hue wanted Trub over Myles and that he did not want Watson. I think it's great that we all have differing opinions and can debate/argue. However, I think we should be responsible and not tell deliberate lies to deceive others. I've seen this happen before. A poster makes something up, other posters repeat it, and then all of a sudden you get people saying stuff like...."I read where...." LOL...they read a lie on here. I get that many of us are passionate about the team and which direction it should take, but deliberately deceiving others w/untruths should result in suspensions from the board.
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I want to make this clear. I am NOT saying who is responsible for the picks.
What I AM saying is that device [and others who like his BS posts] is making things up when they say stuff like Hue wanted Trub over Myles and that he did not want Watson.
I think it's great that we all have differing opinions and can debate/argue. The Browns are responsible for the picks. Who has imput into the picks from the draft. Berry, Kovash, Grigson, Opara, Vega, Hue, Wiliams (if it's a defensive pick) the position coaches, the college scouts, and the anyalitics dept.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Thank you.
It's not as simple as Hue making all the good picks and Sashi making all the good picks.
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Thank you.
It's not as simple as Hue making all the good picks and Sashi making all the good picks. Your damn right it's not. It is a team effort, and any fans who don't realize that are living in a fantasy world.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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The Browns are responsible for the picks. Who has imput into the picks from the draft.
Berry, Kovash, Grigson, Opara, Vega, Hue, Wiliams (if it's a defensive pick) the position coaches, the college scouts, and the anyalitics dept.
Too many cooks spoil the soup.
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Well then the Soup in all 32 teams drafts has been ruined for years.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Your entitled to your opinion .... And if u look at it the way u laid it out ... i agree ... i’m not looking at it from when the thief took over .. i’m Not even looking at last years debacle .... This team has more talent on D (the front 7) than we’ve had on D since our return ... We need a lot of help on O ... we do have some pieces ... Duke, DeValve has some ability .... Njoku could end up between average and really really good ... Tretter and Zietler aren’t special but there not trash ... hopefully Coleman can improve, this one may be a bit optomistic ... *L* .... Kizer is not near the done deal some say he is ... Plus we have 5 picks in the first two rounds and a ton of cash .... We have some talent ... it’s YOUNG ... we have an opportunity to bring in a bunch of picks and 2 or 3 top tier FA’s if we so choose ... I’ve NEVER EVER said things like this about our team ... i’ve Always been ripped for being negative .... so this is very unusual for me ... doesn’t mean i’m Right but it feels odd ... *LOL* .. GO BROWNS ... sunny days COULD be coming ... we just need to stay patient as fans and hope WE DON’T BLOW IT ... 
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What I AM saying is that device [and others who like his BS posts] is making things up when they say stuff like Hue wanted Trub over Myles and that he did not want Watson.
Funny how I never said that, yet I'm the one making stuff up. Just stop the charade. Please.
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What I AM saying is that device [and others who like his BS posts] is making things up when they say stuff like Hue wanted Trub over Myles and that he did not want Watson.
Funny how I never said that, yet I'm the one making stuff up. Just stop the charade. Please. LOL.........you are making this too easy. Tell us, who said this: Hue is the one who bypassed Watson for Kizer. I also do think that perhaps Hue wanted Trubisky or Mahomes over Watson. However this might be the time when the front office overruled Hue and said we are taking Garrett. Unfortunately Trubisky and Mahomes were gone by our next pick. Hue didn't want Watson and Kizer fell in our lap. Your attacks on Hue are unwarranted and your lies are despicable. Please stop!
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sorry disagree I like garrett ,ogbah,and njoku.
like devalve as a 50 to 60 reception guy and coleman that is not bad for a 2 year haul.
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Thank you... more proof that Sashi is not the talent evaluator. so who exactly is our talent evaluator?
I bet you're wondering the samething I did, why O' why didn't I take the...blue pill
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Its not as bad as it seems ... NOT EVEN CLOSE ...
Respectfully, it is bad. In fact, things are absurdly bad. The Browns have played 428 minutes of football this year and have only had a lead for 5:06 of the time. The Browns are 1-22 under the current regime. The Bears managed to win two games in a row this season which their QB completed only 12 passes combined in those wins. The Browns are 4-40 since changing their uniforms. Sixteen teams alone won at least four games in a row last year. The Browns are now 20-67 since the Haslam's took ownership. The ineptness has reached comical proportions at this point. We all have different coping mechanisms, however (not specifically directing that at you, Diam). With Joe Thomas out, our QBs will get absolutely pounded and I'm afraid things are going to spiral out of control at warp speed. The cracks have already started forming. not to be a nay-sayer or anything...but Diam might be the last guy I would throw stats at. lol
I bet you're wondering the samething I did, why O' why didn't I take the...blue pill
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~ Legend
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PLAYER PERSONNEL Andrew Berry Vice President, Player Personnel Ken Kovash Vice President, Player Personnel Ryan Grigson Senior Personnel Executive Kevin Meers Director, Research and Strategy Chisom Opara Director, Player Personnel Bobby Vega Director, College Scouting Dan Saganey Director, Pro Scouting Mike Cetta Director, Scouting Glenn Cook Assistant Director, Scouting Andrew Healy Senior Strategist, Player Personnel Dave Giuliani Football Research Analyst Aditya Krishnan Football Research Analyst Venessa Hutchinson Coordinator, Football Operations & Personnel thanks man...much more clear to me now. lol...a lot of names there. more than enough blame to go around lol.
I bet you're wondering the samething I did, why O' why didn't I take the...blue pill
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You quoted my post and claim I said I know Hue wanted to draft Trubisky over Garrett. Yet no where did I say this and you accuse me of lying and making stuff up. Irony at its best.
Not sure why you feel the need to attack people who disagree with you.
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Wow, finally! It took one and half seasons but Andrew Berry is finally get some exposure on this board as leading the talent evaluation. I'm glad we we're all finally able to understand this and realize it isn't Sashi. Bravo! 
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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So you're posting an article where the owner says Sashi isn't the talent evaluator, but then you say that's not what he said. And then you comment about people speculating, but speculate yourself on who you think is evaluating talent and say you don't understand what the confusion is about, but you yourself seem confused.
I'm confused.
link
In the article Haslam says the following about Sashi..."He's very smart, very organized, good at systems and processes, and [is] an outstanding team player," Jimmy Haslam said. "He's also very strategic so we will use those skills, and working for him will be a GM whose primary job will be talent acquisition."
Brown has final say over the 53-man roster, the draft and the players signed and not signed in free agency. The GM will report to Brown and will focus on finding good players.
Let me answer that question...NO, for some reason, the Browns never hired a GM.
So, who is doing the talent evaluations?
The man with the final say is Sashi Brown and no one is clear on how Sashi is making his decisions.
We do know that Hue Jackson is allowed input, but he has not been given the power to select the talent.
I'm amazed that the media has not tried to get an answer from the Browns owners and management...when are the Browns going to fill the GM position?... and/or...why haven't the Browns filled the GM position?
Presently, Sashi Brown is clearly the man responsible for talent on the 53 man roster, the talent that is drafted and the talent signed or not signed in free agency. The information and/or priorities Sashi uses to make his talent decisions is unknown and not defined.
...and that is how the Browns roll !!
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Too many cooks spoil the soup.
I don't think this analogy works that well. It might actually be part of the problem. A football team isn't really "one big soup". It's more like a multiple course meal. Each unit is its own dish and for the best meals you've got to get the courses to all complement each other. You can't just go around picking all the best ingredients for different dishes and mix them in one big pot and expect it to end well. It doesn't help when you've had different "kitchens" trying to make different meals using each other's leftover ingredients. We've got to give one kitchen time to get their whole meal together and let it cook. Right now our main dish (QB) is just going into the oven. Hopefully, they don't burn it.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg) You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
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I've never thought that Sashi was our "talent evaluator." I haven't seen many people say that. I think one poster was playing games again when he made that comment.
I do think that Sashi has final say of the roster and that is what most people have claimed. Not sure how anyone can dispute that Sashi doesn't have final say over the roster????
I also wonder who made decisions to release guys like Haden and Greco if it wasn't Sashi? I would guess it was Sashi, but I'm not sure. I sure as hell don't think it was Hue.
I wonder who made the final call on guys being allowed to walk in FA? Hue? I doubt it. I'd say it was probably Sashi w/input from Depo and maybe Berry. But again, I'm not sure.
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vers...if you are responsible for the final call...you have to be able to judge talent.
There is no way around it..none!
If Sashi is not judging the talent level of each player, what is he using to make his judgements on who goes and who stays?
Last edited by mac; 10/25/17 08:36 AM.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Probably information provided to him from his personnel guys, scouts, and coaching staff. I also think [but don't know] that he runs things by Haslam. And I do believe money is a significant factor.
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I've never thought that Sashi was our "talent evaluator." I haven't seen many people say that. I think one poster was playing games again when he made that comment. No, that "one poster" wasn't.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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I'm not sure if this will make sense to anyone but me, but I think we need the iron fist to go with Hue's velvet glove. Track down someone to be the assistant-HC with a focus on discipline rather than O or D. Hue saves face (by avoiding demotion to OC.), but we get something resembling a firm hand on the rudder. 
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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The Browns are responsible for the picks. Who has imput into the picks from the draft.
Berry, Kovash, Grigson, Opara, Vega, Hue, Wiliams (if it's a defensive pick) the position coaches, the college scouts, and the anyalitics dept.
[/quote]
Here you go Mac since you missed it a few posts up.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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I'm not sure if this will make sense to anyone but me, but I think we need the iron fist to go with Hue's velvet glove. Track down someone to be the assistant-HC with a focus on discipline rather than O or D. Hue saves face (by avoiding demotion to OC.), but we get something resembling a firm hand on the rudder. Hire Mike Vrabel away from the Texans! There are a lot of good young coaches that would run circles around Hue. Get one and lets start building for the playoffs. Going no where with Hue!
Exciting football will be back in Cleveland this fall!
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I couldn’t agree with U less Tony ... but man i sure do love your spirit ... your enthuasiam can be seen through the puter screen ... *LOL* ...
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I'm not sure why this is hard to understand. Whomever has the final say isn't really relevant. I would wholeheartedly believe that our organization is a joint effort. There is not one person saying here are the players we're using now go win.
Sashi, Andrew Berry, Hue, and the whole lot of them decide who stays and who goes. If there's ever a dispute on say player Z, perhaps they present two sides to Sashi and he makes a decision. Who knows. In fact, Sashi may have never even used his "final say" on a player yet because the entire organization is in agreement. ... But at least know that "final say" doesn't mean "talent evaluator."
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Him never using his final say is 1000000000000% UNREALISTIC ...
I’d be stunned if there ever in complete agreement .... maybe Hue and Sashi have been lock step ... but there’s a lot more folks with opinions other than those two ....
Sorry dude .... not a hot in hell that push ain’t come to shove yet ...
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I wouldn't say unrealistic, but like was said earlier, it's not an iron fist. It is possible, though.
I'm sure every player is talked about. Take Haden for instance, maybe Hue wanted to keep him, but after talking it through they realized he wasn't going to be much better than Taylor and he costs 3x as much. That cut was a value cut for sure.
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Him never using his final say is 1000000000000% UNREALISTIC ...
I’d be stunned if there ever in complete agreement .... maybe Hue and Sashi have been lock step ... but there’s a lot more folks with opinions other than those two ....
Sorry dude .... not a hot in hell that push ain’t come to shove yet ... really hasn't been much to argue about now, has there 
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So we have a corporate lawyer making player personal decisions and who has the final say on the 53 man roster, that's just great. Gee I wonder why the Browns aren't winning? Because we were soooo much better when Lombardi was doing it? or Savage or Butch or Holmgren or Farmer or ... We don't suck because of our current FO... we have our current FO because everybody else has sucked.
yebat' Putin
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Stay the course...time to bring up my difference makers for obtaining talent.
Most important primarily cause of the RARE SKILL SETS NEEDED.
1. QB, we still have to get that job - my only beef with this FO.
2. LT, we had that locked up but now we must make an investment even if Joe comes back for another season.
3. Edge Rushers, I can honestly say we have score on this one with Ogbah and MG...his nagging injuries will get better a long career.
4. Cover Corners...we need to invest here - lately success is gotten in mid first and beyond rounds.
These are the positions with skill sets that just don't have enough to go around in the NFL and a League built on parity if you can obtain these 4 you are ahead of the game.
Just thought I would bring this up.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I hope we stay the course. Both the front office and the coaching staff. We have the youngest team in the league, and we are only going to get younger next year. I like Coach Jackson. I want him to succeed. Give him more time and perhaps he will. Not like anyone better is going to be jumping at the chance to come here and Coach the youngest team in the league. So why not let Hue have another year? Hue gives us a better chance at having a better season than some new coach with new systems and a young team trying to learn them.
#BlackLivesMatter #StopAsianHate
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NFL Network Insider Ian Rapoport reported Sunday morning on NFL GameDay Kickoff that Jackson's job in Cleveland is safe for now.
"I'm told at this point Hue Jackson is safe, even [if there was] an ugly loss [today]," Rapoport said. "... But firing Hue Jackson now, on the plane home, as we've seen in the past, would be against everything the Browns are trying to do. Changes are expected to come at the end of the season in some form or fashion. But at this point, they are not expected to involve Hue Jackson."
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So we have a corporate lawyer making player personal decisions and who has the final say on the 53 man roster, that's just great. Gee I wonder why the Browns aren't winning? Because we were soooo much better when Lombardi was doing it? or Savage or Butch or Holmgren or Farmer or ... We don't suck because of our current FO... we have our current FO because everybody else has sucked. I wish we had Phil savage.
Find what you love and let it kill you.
-Charles Bukowski
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I’m mentally done defending any of this.
Coaching staff and front office needs to be canned after the season ends. I’m done trying to defend any of this after today’s game.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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I’m mentally done defending any of this.
Coaching staff and front office needs to be canned after the season ends. I’m done trying to defend any of this after today’s game.
Noah’s neighbors were voted more likely to succeed than the Browns leadership.
#GMSTRONG
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Anyone who defends this front office can't deal with the reality
That the process isn't working
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