DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Haslam Decision Time

Other than relief we actually didn't make that trade, no. I do not.

My sentiments, exactly.
Once I learned that we dodged that trade, I didn't care one iota for the rest of it because it doesn't matter.

I'd just about bet money that any "rift" exists more in the minds of the people in the media and those on message boards than in the rooms in Berea.... and even if I'm wrong with that, as long as Haslam has enough as an owner & leader to slap them all back into place, it doesn't matter.

Only cause i promised Willie ... the board seems to have moved on from this particular incident and we just disagree ... were not changing each other’s minds ... i promised, so here goes ...



If thats the case ... thats a problem right there ... he has no BUSINESS in that room for those discussions .. IT NEVER ENDS WELL ... the two most meddlesome owners in the nfl are Jones and Snyder ... how has that worked out for both of them? ... when jones bought the boys he let the hair do his job .. they won ... then jones thought he “learned enough” to do it on his own .. won one maybe two more under Switzer with the hairs players ... since then .. pretty sure not even a playoff win ..

HE NEEDS TO STAY OUT OF THE FOOTBALL DISCUSSIONS ...

But thats not why u made the statement ... i think the fact he knows is irrelivent .... if no one gets fired here .. its cause ... the thief has backed himself into a corner and feels he can’t fire anyone cause of his history ...

Reportedly, Hue did not care for Wentz and fell in love with RG3. Seriously? RG3...wow. Some people want to repeatedly quote Podesta for saying Wentz is not a top 20 QB. OK, from where did he get that opinion? I'm guessing JH knows.

The point about depo/Wentz is BS ... u have no clue ... your insinuating it was Hue .. i don’t think u want hue fired ... correct me if i’m wrong ... but your clearly in the FO’s side on this one .. hence why it was U insinuating it was Hue .. fact is ... U have NO CLUE ...

And Willie .. I could counter with Hue having the FO’s back on passing on Wentz and blowing smoke about getting RG3 ... ... the FO’s plan was clearly to trade down the last two years if the opportunity presented itself early in rnd 1 UNLESS THEIR WAS A SURE FIRE STUD THERE ... Wentz was no where’s near a sure fire stud ... now that he looks like one ..

And picking a QB is the hardest thing to do for a talent evaluator ... missing on them is more common than hitting on them ...

No PUNDITS were praising Phili when they moved up to get him ...

And Willie .. if we kept McCown or brought in another “never was vet” as opposed to running out a rook that had NO RIGHT STARTING and a bum named Hogan ... we’d have a few W’s now and this wouldn’t look near as bad ...

I thought Hue was a BAFOON for wanting RG3 ... we all make mistakes Willie ... but i’d be shocked if we passed on Wentz because Hue thought RG3 was the answer ... i think it was to aquire MORE PICKS and have said all along if they weren’t in love with a qb ... that was the right thing to do for this team at that time ..

Kizer sort of fell in our lap and picking him was good value. It was/is plain to see that he isn't ready. Hue himself stated that he and the FO would meet and talk about who to name as the starter. What was each sides' opinion of starting Kizer? I'm guessing JH knows.

Again JH has no right being there .. only meddlesome owners would be ... but that brings up a bigger point and a VERY SCARY one I’ve mentioned before ...

I’m not sure if Hue decided to do that on his own or its how the thief set it up .. but no one in any FO SHOULD HAVE A SAY in who the starting QB is ... THATS THE COACHES JOB ...

If Hue did that on his own I’d FIRE HIM RIGHT AWAY for that alone ... their is only one reason to do that if thats not how its set up ... TO COVER YOUR ASS ... and thats a bad way to go about your job ...

RG3 is out of football and McCown looks like a stud after being simply awful here. I'm guessing Haslam sees that.

Comparing McCown this year to last year is SIMPLY UNFAIR ... its not right Willie ... the Jets OL this year compared to ours last year is night and day ...their O doesn’t have a ton of talent .. but their not all KIDS EITHER ... their also in year two or three in the system ...

The list of why thats a BS point is endless ...

The trade-that-wasn't is being panned as being a good thing for the Browns. In the end, Sashi did JH a favor by standing up to him and doing the job he was given to do. I'm guessing Haslam - who is apparently influenced by the opinion of others in the league - sees that.

I don’t agree wth that Willie .. you’ll see why in a future post ... if i stick around ... i may need a break ... this isn’t fun right now ... and if i’m Not having fun no sense being here ...

Hue's back-channel BS and his freaking daughter speaking out is reminiscent of Hue's short, manipulative tenure in Oakland. I'm guessing Haslam sees that.

Please elaborate on the Oakland tenure and manipulation ... i don’t recall that at all .. doesn’t mean it didn’t happen I just didn’t hear about it ...

Gameday decision-making and declining personal foul penalties are major sins for an NFL HC. I'm guessing Haslam sees that.

Hue has WARTS ... and some are pretty glaring .. these are so obvious even the thief can see him .. and the thiefs not somewhere he don’t belong in this case .. so its OK for him to see them ... *LOL* ..

Other teams figure out how to get the most from their personnel. They figure out how to protect their young, inexperienced QBs. The dreaded O'Brein almost got a comeback win with Tom Savage. Tom Savage.

Come on bro .. whose are Hopkins .. whose are fuller ... hell, we don’t even have a Lamar Miller ...

Again ... UNFAIR BRO ... that reeks of an AGENDA POST ...

This FO made better offers to Schwartz and Pryor and they still went elsewhere. It doesn't take much research to believe/understand that we had NO SHOT at Garropolo. Thank goodness we didn't send a 2 & 3 to Cincy for AJ McCarron. AJ McCarron. Seriously.

Having no shot at JG I believe is true ... BUT IT DON’T EXCUSE THE FO FOR NOT MAKING THE TWO MINUTE CALL ON MONDAY ... i do feel better about it that they called on Friday ... but Willie .. U STILL CALL ON MONDAY ...

And i don’t agree on AJ .. and i’m no fan of his .. if i decide to take a break .. i’ll explain that one before i leave ... this post is all ready WAY TO LONG ... *L*

The offer to Pryor was also fair .. but to play the game it appears u want to play and “critique” both sides ..

This FO also signed Kenny Britt .. well Vers and I and a few others .. CALLED THAT ONE ...

Why is he still one the team Willie? ... THE FO HAS WARTS ALSO ... based on the next paragraph .. u want to ignore their warts while only pointing Hues Warts out ...

This FO cut Barnidge and Des Bryant - with much fan hand-wringing and those guys are STILL out of the league. Haden is still awful and we have younger versions of Greco on the team today. Probably should have kept McCown, but Hue would still be calling the plays...plays that no QB in 1.5 years under Hue has been able to execute...including McCown.

I think that is uNFAIR AS HELL based on the fact you have an agenda ... your being a used car salesman right now Willie .. ..

I agree with what your saying .. other than Haden ... i agree he stinks now ... he still could have helped this team and we saved pennies in cap space cutting him ... that was STUPID!!!!!!

What your doing is just BIASED AND UNFAIR due to what i said above .. u only want to point out the good things the FO has done and ignore their warts while doing the exact opposite for Hue ..

What did I forget? Remember...the QB decision(s) is/was a collaborative effort between Hue and the FO. Only JH really knows who wanted what.

The thief needs to spend more time with his family ... *L* ..

Oh...I forgot...we have (5) of the top (65) picks in the 2018 draft. Which was absolutely part of the plan.

I’ve stated many times over the past month .. THIS IS NOT NEAR AS BAD AS IT SEEMS ... and have stuck up for both sides being here ... UP TIL LAST WEEKS BS ...

Bottom line Willie .. we’ll never agree on this ...

Your the president of the LOLLIPOP CLUB and i’ll never even be a member ...

This is a great post.

I'm not Willie but I'd like to comment.

I am tired of blowing things up. And I think for once our FO has a very concrete plan. I don't want them to go. I think Hue is a great coach, but I'm not sure about him as a HC. The HC duties include far more than just being a coach. The fact Hue has had 2 seasons as a HC and is still making glaring mistakes doesn't sit well.

To compare, Mike Smith in ATL was terrible managing a game. ATL brought in a new coach and whoa, Super Bowl. I think Hue could still help turn this around, but I have my doubts whether he is the guy who can win us a Super Bowl.



I think the FO has been pretty adamant about Hue being here to help with the QB position. I find it plausible but unrealistic that the FO just gives Hue QBs hoping he can develop one.

I think the passing on Wentz has as much to do with Goff as it does Wentz. When we had the 2nd pick prior to any trades, I think Goff was our #1 target. I think the Rams trading up for Goff burst our bubble. At that point I think we had a decision to make. Over-draft the QB at #2 that Hue didn't really want or trade back, acquire picks and hope we can find a QB in the later rounds or the following draft. The decision at the time was easy. Plus I think we also felt we needed to build up the roster and this was the best way, hence the comments about it "not being the right time" for a QB.



I think McCown could have stayed and won a few games, but I also don't think anyone in the entire organization thought we'd be 0-8 at this point. We have talent to win games. I think when Hue and the FO discuss QBs, I believe it's more Hue telling the FO what he thinks and not the other way around. I believe it was Hue who made the decision to go with Kizer 100%. Our FO has stated several times who plays on the field is up to the coach. I never liked Kizer starting in the first place because if he fails, where do you turn? Before the start of the season Sashi was asked if they were going to sign another QB. His response, "I would be surprised if we did." It doesn't sound like the response from someone who rules with an iron fist.

Again, I'm not looking for anyone to be fired. I just hope that Hue is learning, the FO is learning and we're just going to continue to get better.

Dear Mr Diam,

After extensive review of your recent posting activity, we, a.k.a. The Lollipop Club, have come to the decision that your application for membership has been declined. While your posts were deemed 'objective', your reluctance for inclusion into "The Club" stood out. Therefore please be advised that we are unable at this time to consider you as a potential candidate.

However, should you in the future get your head out of your you-know-what, we would be pleased to reconsider our position.

Respectfully Yours,
The Lollipop Club

My continued reference to "I think Jimmy knows" is way more relevant than you are giving credit. Here's why: Both Hue and Sashi report to Jimmy. Now...that may be a stupid structure, but it is what it is. If Jimmy was NOT in the decision-making room, how would he know which of his subordinates said/believed/pushed-for which player(s)? Jimmy should stay out of personnel decisions for sure...but the people who DO make those decisions report to Jimmy. He needs to know who said what.

Did Hue want Wentz...and Sashi said no? Or vice versa? Did they BOTH say no? Only Jimmy knows that...they both report to him...he was in the room with his direct-reports. Same with Watson (who I think is ridiculously over-rated thus far).

We know that Hue went to a private workout for Wentz in a snow-storm and was one of few coaches to be at the workout. He came home with RG3 in his heart. Putting two and two together and I'd say Hue wasn't hot on Wentz. Of course I don't KNOW what went down...but of all theories thrown out there, it's revealing what happened with Wentz, that workout, and the earth-moving arrival of RG3.

Another let's not blow this up but Hue deserves to be fired post and two people liked it.

I like the post as well - even though a lot of the time I tend to be somewhat in agreement with WSU.

You've gone to a good deal of effort to explain differences of opinion in detail.... the one comment that you made that I disagree with ""if no one gets fired here .. its cause ... the thief has backed himself into a corner and feels he can’t fire anyone cause of his history ... "" ......... that's one possible scenario I'll grant you. But to be fair I think Haslam is a big enough ego maniac and football moron to completely justify firing everyone if he wants to ... and not care a bit about public perception. It's as equally plausible and possible that he doesn't fire anyone because he wants to see what consistency and giving the plan enough time to see if it succeeds - you and a few others believe we are much closer to success than our W/L record suggests. I agree. While I don't have a whole ton of regard for Haslam ... I don't dismiss the idea that he sees the same thing. To state as fact otherwise just because of a personal dislike of the man is wrong. jmo

And another great football take.

As is your post. We can play that dumb game all day long.

Addressing you in pieces:

My only beef right now with the FO is the inability to get a viable QB in here...and I believe that the QB evaluation leans heavily on the advice/recommendation from Hue. So they are BOTH to blame. This is what I believe...not what I know. I understand how difficult it is to find the potential FQB. I'm not down on Hue OR the FO for passing on Wentz and Watson and for moving on from McCown (who was awful here last year)...but Hue is mismanaging the snot out of Kizer. That's on Hue.

You may perceive that I'm bashing Hue and giving the FO a pass. However, we are in the middle of the season and better players aren't sitting on the grocery shelves waiting to be purchased. We have what we have for now...for better or worse. FO critique will be more meaningful when player-acquisition time starts up again.

Hue's management of the team is what is happening right now...he can do better right now....he is not. That's why he's the topic right now. You are correct in that I do not want him fired.

Here's an article addressing Hue's firing in Oakland. It's not the only one.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/hue-...-raiders-011211

Yeah but you start so many dumb posts it's not right to let you just slide by.

LOL.......okay.

The FO bashing on here is laughable most of the time. Here's why I say that:

People blame the FO for "passing" on Wentz when that appears to be no less than a collaborative decision.

People whine about the cutting of "good players". Like Barnidge, Des Bryant, and Vers' boy Karter Schult. Those guys are out of football for crying out loud. Yet the whining that the FO lets go of it's good veteran players is laughable. Haden was going to be our CB4. He might be better than Darius Hillary for depth...but Haden wasn't going to take that demotion and likely lose the captain's "C" from his jersey...not to mention that paying 11 million for a CB4 on a re-building team is simply stupid.

People will continue to say the FO let Schwartz and Pryor walk when we offered them more money than any other team...yet people keep making that claim. They basically say the offer should have been better or adjusted. Uh...well...the offers that were made were already the best ones offered.

The Kenny Britt signing was a mistake. That's on the FO. The FO took a gamble on a 4th, a 5th, and a 5th Rd WR. One guy is showing promise, one guy disappears for long stretches, one guy is out of football. Their 1st Rd guy can't stay healthy but looks promising when he is healthy. I chalk that up to "stuff happens". It's not the equivalent of declining a personal foul penalty.

Lastly:



I agree it is not as bad as it seems...so the bottom line is that we ALREADY agree. Just from different viewpoints.

I thought the lollipop club was a description of those of us who think the relationship between the HC and FO is salvageable. If that is the definition, I'm still willing to be President.

I agree with most of your post, except this portion. I don't think he would have been our CB #4. I still think, if on the squad today, he'd be the CB#1. The reason for the release now, as we're seeing is how well McCourty is playing when on the field, and let's be honest, the extension to J. Taylor probably played a role. That said, I think it was a mistake cutting him. We sure could use him.

What is ironic to me is the many posters who wanted him cut. Within that group are those that are now complaining he's no longer here. I searched the archives the other day, and they certainly exist. I think this lends itself the the general opening of your post-- where/why the bashing is taking place.

I don't want anyone fired. I've said as much. I have my doubts on Hue. I had doubts of Hue when he was hired, but everyone insisted that he was gold. We have won only once since he's been here and I think people erroneously place all that blame on Sashi Brown and the front office.

Hey - I read what you said and you stated you didn't want anyone fired. Purple text indicates sarcasm, or is meant to. My comment was because someone ignored what you said and insisted you have an agenda to get Hue fired.

No, device was talking about Hue being fired on another thread. It wasn't that hard to connect the dots. But, you keep on w/your personal vendetta. It will put you in a favorable position w/a certain crowd on here.

Yep, it's all a conspiracy against you Vers.

Oh, gotcha. Sorry. I misunderstood.

No problem. I am with you - Hue has made some bad game day decisions and to me there is a pattern there and he rightly deserves criticism. But I don't want him fired. I would like a dedicated OC so Hue is a full time HC and not part time HC/OC combo ... even if he installs an OC who basically runs/installs Hue's offense and Hue calls plays on game day.

I think a 3rd year and with a competent QB we will see really good things from a Hue Jackson coached team.

...

I’m surprised anyone read that whole thing for starters .. your post made it worth the time it took to write it ...

That was funny man ... last time i laughed this hard was when Rish crapped on my spelling, grammar and tendency to use ...............

Thanks for the laugh bro ....

I’m done debating why I think everyone needs to go ... u guys think they can work together .. i don’t ... we’ll just have to agree to disagree ..

I would however like to adress the concern everyone has about “blowing it up again” ...

If the thief does decide to fire everyone .. their is no need for the new people to blow it up .... I think what Sashi did 2 years ago wasn’t really blowing much up if anything at all .. we were a 3 - 13 team wth VERY LITTLE TALENT .. most of the VERY FEW talented players we had left via FA ... the ones that were cut weren’t very talented ... a few have gone on to become talented ...

My point is .. what did they really BLOW UP ..

This is an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT TEAM ... we had NO PLAYERS ON D back then in MG’s, JC’s or Kirksey class ... NONE ... not sure if we had anyone as talented as Shelton or Ogbah either .. we have a very very good front 7 ... I’m not sure how many teams would not trade front 7’s with us right now .. and yes .. I’M DEAD SERIOUS ...

We also have some talent on O .. the OL is playing decent IMO ... there silightly above average to above average ... average at worst ...

We had no Njoku .. crow was a rook or 2nd year guy .. same with Duke ... if Gordon can stay clean .. we had no one even remotely close to him 3 years ago when they BLEW IT UP ..

My point is .. if the thief does fire anyone .. THERES NO NEED TO BLOW IT UP .. NONE ..

If he does fire them ... I will be GRATEFUL to the harvard boys for the shape they left us in .. and i was as hard on them as anyone from day 1 ... i’ve Never been known as a homer .. NOT EVEN CLOSE ...

I’ve never felt this way about where were at and what COULD BE if its done right ..

And I think for once our FO has a very concrete plan. I don't want them to go. I think Hue is a great coach, but I'm not sure about him as a HC. The HC duties include far more than just being a coach. The fact Hue has had 2 seasons as a HC and is still making glaring mistakes doesn't sit well.

I can’t argue wth that .. i wand Hue to stay if the thiefs not going to clean house ... hopefully hes learning and will improve ... if not, lets get him a time mgmt. guy and an OC .... if thats what he wants .. if not, let him sink or swim next year ...

On the same token ... WE NEED A SOLID FOOTBALL GUY to make final decisions on talent ... the FO just doesn’t have the experience .. and it shows in some of the moves they made ...

To compare, Mike Smith in ATL was terrible managing a game. ATL brought in a new coach and whoa, Super Bowl. I think Hue could still help turn this around, but I have my doubts whether he is the guy who can win us a Super Bowl.

Was that Shanny or Quinn .. cause this year minus Shanny .. they have an uphill climb to make the playoffs imo what is a weak ass division ..

Not sticking up for Hue here .. just wanted to point that out ... not sure that was the best example ...

Its not a personal dislike .. if we win a SB with him .. i’ll still think hes a thief and POS human being ..

And me thinking hes a POS human being has zero to with him owning the browns and screwing it up since day 1 up til he hired these guys .. it has everything to do with his business dealings and the fact the only reason hes not in prison is because he bought his way out of it ...

We just disagree on weather this FO can work with this Coaching staff ..

Why does it have to be my dislike of the thief as opposed to just a difference of opinion on weather they can work together moving forward ...

I don’t get that ... its like over in the political forum .. i’ve got to be at racist cause i support trump and don’t want people here illegally ... its a JOKE to make that connection ..

Its just something else we disagree on Willie .. and again ... a MORONIC STRUCTURE in my opinion ...

Go get yourself another Lollipop ...

I reply to posts as i see them .. i don’t read any further ... didn’t know u were addressing me in pieces .. prolly a smart move or your post may have taken an entire page .. *L ..

Hold off on the Lollipop for now .. i’ll Let u know if u earned another one and if so how many when i’m Done ... *L* ..

I want to recap:

• We had nothing.
• The guys that came in scrubbed it bare and have worked together to build a foundation that you like and has you excited about what it could be.
• You want them all to go because you don't think they can work together because of a bunch of noise made by media types that are impatient as a two year old.

Does that about cover it?

U really need to get a middle finger emoji ... *L* ..

U were spot on right up til u hit the noise by the media part ..

Thanks for summing it up much more succinctly (and with much better spelling and grammar .. *L* .. i hope u know what that word was meant to mean .. ) than i could have ..

Done re-hashing that ... lets hope regardless of what the thief does ... it works out well for ALL OF US ...

Hey bro ... u want to talk football .. nows your chance ... reply only to me if u wish ...

Best discussion i’ve Seen on the board in over a week .. we seem to be debating/discussing as opposed to just flaming each other ... i believe we’ve calmed down quite a bit ..

U say u want to talk football ...

Chime in ...

I’m not as upset as most over the QB situation other than the fact (and Vers NAILED THIS ONE) we had no experience in that group .. it was assinine to go into the season with a rookie and two second year guys that had very title experience .. thats the fo’s INEXPERIENCE IMO ...

I could be wrong and Hue may have had a say in that as well .. we’ll never know .. thats my gripe about the QB’s ..

Obviously passing on Wentz was a HUGE MISTAKE .. hindsight’s 20/20 ...

I am upset with them not trying harder with Schwartz .. i don’t think they had a snowballs chance in hell to re-sign Mack, Gipson and the others ...

i have ZERO PROBLEMS with them not offering Pryor what he wanted .. if the voicemail thing is true .. well THATS ON THE HARVARD BOYS 100% and thats just INCOMPETENT AS HELL ...... upset that they let Gabriel walk (i lean towards Hue on that one .. it goes against the FO’s plan to keep an aging vet over a younger kid)

There INEXPERIENCE SHINED through letting Grecco go (did i get that right this time . *L*) .. Letting haden go and not having a vet qb on the roster ..

Thats on the harvard boys and shows their inexperience ...

Those are my MAJOR PROBLEMS with them as of now ...

Also not sure on the trade down and passing on Hooker ...

You may perceive that I'm bashing Hue and giving the FO a pass. However, we are in the middle of the season and better players aren't sitting on the grocery shelves waiting to be purchased. We have what we have for now...for better or worse. FO critique will be more meaningful when player-acquisition time starts up again.

Hue's management of the team is what is happening right now...he can do better right now....he is not. That's why he's the topic right now. You are correct in that I do not want him fired.

I agree with that ... i said that more than once over the last month or so .. Hue’s in the spotlight now and he’s handled a bunch of things HORRIBLY ...

This is taking its toll on Hue mentally and physically .. he is so competitive he can’t take the losing ... i feel really bad for the guy ... hope he’s Ok throughout the rest of the season ..

U brought up another GREAT POINT ... some are expecting some W’s over the last 8 games .. thats not realistic .. as u pointed out .. almost impossible to upgrade now .. we have some winnable games if every one stays healthy ... but it doesn’t mean we will win them ..

Thats one of the reasons I would have actually not minded the McCarron trade going through ... but thats for another thread ..

Here's an article addressing Hue's firing in Oakland. It's not the only one.

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/hue-...-raiders-011211

Thanks for the article ... i’ll Go read it later ... will get to your other piece later also ..

For now ... go get yourself one lollipop for old times sake ... *L* ...

I'm not sure I can buy into the "good discussion" part when I have posters telling me things like so many of my posts are dumb...LOL

I do think you are being objective and honest. I think you are trying very hard to be fair and see things from both perspectives, so I try and chime in, but I really don't have any answers.

I really don't know what to think at this point. As you know, I had real problems w/the plan for a few reasons, but knowing the problems that would result by excessive losing was at the top. I predicted that the blame game would begin w/the fans and w/in the ranks. Well, it's happened.

I also never understood what qualifications Sashi had to earn such responsibilities. He didn't do anything to earn such a title anywhere else. Thus, that leads me to believe that he had a lot more influence than we ever suspected during the Farmer/Pet regime. The lack of trust, backstabbing, dysfunction, pissing other teams off in trades, questionable free agent handlings, etc are awfully similar to what is occurring now.

While I always questioned the plan and the qualifications of the people Haslam put in place, I maintained that they should stick w/the plan once they adopted it. I even had it in my sig. It was something about no more firings for at least 3 years.

Now, I'm not so sure. I hate the thought of more firings and different schemes, strategies, roster moves, etc......but I have huge concerns if these guys can work together. I don't know that they can't, but man, things got pretty crazy and I think it is almost impossible to overcome things when different facets of the organization don't trust one another, especially when they have to work together as much as they do in a football organization.

I have a feeling that Hue will be the fall guy. Of course, I believe that would be a mistake. He has way more respect in NFL circles than Sashi does and would be much harder to replace. Part of that might just be me expecting the worst from this organization, because they have always made the moves I least agreed w/over the years.

Anyway..........the bottom line is I am not sure what they should do moving forward. I just have a feeling it isn't going to turn out well.

Actually, there is an upgrade that I expect to happen, but it isn't a player acquisition. It's simply experience and guys really getting settled in. We are crazy-young roster, and one that is exceptionally green. How many of these guys were drafted last year or this year.... like half the roster?? That's just nuts, but it also means that things will get better once we get past some of the early growing pains.

Also, I won't underestimate the potential of having both Coleman and Gordon on the field together along with the defense getting healthy again... all upgrades to what we've had for much of the season thus far.

Given those things, I feel that we could steal - easily - as many as three games in the second half of the season. With our secondary, I think anything more than that is a bit too much to even dream of, but I'd take three right now, for sure.

I am not being argumentative, but I do not see Gordon and Coleman making a huge difference this year.

Oh goodness......a thought just occurred to me. Hue will get blasted [not by you] for not properly utilizing Gordon and Coleman. LOL...it never ends.

OK - I get 100% your take on Haslam as the business owner of Flying J ... and I have a hunch you are probably right but have no factual basis to call him a thief or pass judgement. If he bought his way out of a mess and illegal activity - it's nothing that anyone super wealthy would do if they could.

That said - we can put aside that and focus on the football operations and Jimmy ... you made a comment that the ONLY reason Jimmy would keep the FO and HC here next year was ""if no one gets fired here .. its cause ... the thief has backed himself into a corner and feels he can’t fire anyone cause of his history ... "" .... maybe I shouldn't have brought into play your apparent dislike of the man in the previous post because it made my point get lost ... so I'll re-phrase that and say that I think it's perfectly reasonable to suggest Jimmy thinks the team has progressed better than the record indicates and keeps Hue and the FO because he wants to give the plan a chance to succeed.

Personally I don't think Haslam would be bothered one bit about public perception & if he thought the right decision was to fire everyone, he would. jmo.

Your post is fair, but.......



I can't buy that one.

I asked the other day if 3 wins out of the final 8 games would change everyone's perspective - and I said that because it's possible. I don't think it's easy or probable though. I think without unforeseen injury - we could win a couple of games and that might be down to injuries on other teams (like Green Bay looking pretty bad without Rogers) but I'll take a W any way we can get it!

j/c....kinda/sorta:

Speaking of Green Bay and a team's record, has anyone considered how much of an impact our qb situation has on our record?

Yeah, I know we've all thought about it and talked about it a bit, but man, look at the Packers. Many were saying they were the Super Bowl favorites in the NFC w/Rodgers. Without him, they are one of the very worst teams in the entire NFL.

Think about that.

And is Hundley worse than Kizer?

This is exactly why the plan has been a failure. Passing on multiple opportunities to get a franchise QB was a mistake. Even if they all survive and manage to get one this upcoming year, the plan is not a good one.

Maybe, maybe not. It depends on if he does, or doesn't, but it mostly depends on if Flattop can scan the field and deliver the ball.

Your counterpoint to mine he feels he can’t fire them is a valid theory ... i just don’t happen to agree with it ... based on history of pulling the trigger in less than a heartbeat is why ...

Like i said .. u and i will just have to disagree ....

Just like we disagree on weather they can work together ...

I’m with vers on this one ... no way they trust each other .. NONE ...

And both sides did things that should get them fired ... IMO ..

We just have to agree to disagree ...